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irishjayhawk
02-18-2010, 03:03 PM
No, no, the hardware isn't faulty and I absolutely love the device itself.

My problem is the recent (by that, let's go with 1 week) ebook prices have gone and are going up across the board. You can read the article below.

Now, I'm all for letting the author get his money just as I sided with the Writers in the writer's strike. But let's be real. How can an ebook be more expensive than a dead tree version? It doesn't make any sense. The bandwidth and storage capacity comes no where close to the paper and binding it takes to produce a dead tree version. And it amazes me that media sectors cannot see the gross failure that was the music industry and their insistence on their old business model. It makes my brain bleed to think about it.

On top of that, what's the incentive to fork out $259 for a reader when one isn't getting a deal on the content it displays. The B&N forums are exploding with this recent sneaky price increase and I'm hoping a boycott ensues. Amazon has yet to go across the board with their increases.

Now, it could be that this blows over as only MacMillon or as someone coined MacMillion would raise their prices and the other publishers decide to see how their guinea pig fares. On the flip side, this could be an across the board price increase no matter where you shop. As an early adopter who's had his ereader a grand total of two days, this drama is a bit disconcerting.

Do you think I should weather the storm or return it and wait for the storm to blow over before diving in?

Also, I am more than happy to pay the $9.99 price point.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/11/technology/11reader.html

In the battle over the pricing of electronic books, publishers appear to have won the first round. The price of many new releases and best sellers is about to go up, to as much as $14.99 from $9.99.



Brian Tietz for The New York Times
“As far as I'm concerned, Amazon has committed to the $9.99 price,” said Wilma Sanders, in Florida with her friend Harold Roth.
Related
Publishers Win a Bout in E-Book Price Fight (February 9, 2010)

But there may be an insurgency waiting to pounce: e-book buyers.

Over the last year, the most voracious readers of e-books have shown a reflexive hostility to prices higher than the $9.99 set by Amazon.com and other online retailers for popular titles.

When digital editions have cost more, or have been delayed until after the release of hardcover versions, these raucous readers have organized impromptu boycotts and gone to the Web sites of Amazon and Barnes & Noble to leave one-star ratings and negative comments for those books and their authors.

“This book has been on the shelves for three weeks and is already in the remainder bins,” wrote Wayne Fogel of The Villages, Fla., when he left a one-star review of Catherine Coulter’s book “KnockOut” on Amazon. “$14.82 for the Kindle version is unbelievable. Some listings Amazon should refuse when the authors are trying to rip off Amazon’s customers.”

The angry commenters on Amazon and online message boards could just be a vocal minority. But now, with e-books scheduled to cost $12.99 to $14.99 under new deals that publishers negotiated with Apple and Amazon, a broader swath of customers may resist the new pricing. The higher prices will go into effect within the next few months.

Predicting the behavior of consumers is always tricky. In the case of e-books, publishers are hoping that a vast majority of people who have not yet tried e-reading devices will not have any expectation of the low pricing now available from Amazon and others, including Barnes & Noble and Sony. They argue that new e-book shoppers will welcome the chance to buy digital editions at a level significantly lower than the typical price tag on a hardcover book.

“With the iPad, the whole notion of e-book reading is probably going to become way more mainstream than it ever has,” said Harvey Chute, who runs KindleBoards, a popular discussion forum for readers of electronic books. “And a majority of people may be coming to it new, and may only see that they are getting $7 off the price they would see at a bookstore.”

But some e-book buyers say that since publishers do not have to pay to print, store or distribute e-books, they should be much cheaper than print books.

“I just don’t want to be extorted,” said Joshua Levitsky, a computer technician and Kindle owner in New York. “I want to pay what it’s worth. If it costs them nothing to print the paper book, which I can’t believe, then they should be the same price. But I just don’t see how it can be the same price.”

Just what e-books are worth is a matter of debate. Publishers argue that printing and distribution represents a small proportion of the total cost of making a book.

“There are people who don’t always understand what goes into an author writing and an editor editing and a publishing house with hundreds of men and women working on these books,” said Mark Gompertz, executive vice president of digital publishing at Simon & Schuster. “If you want something that has no quality to it, fine, but we’re out to bring out things of quality, regardless of what type of book it is.”

To consumers who do not pay much attention to the economics of publishing, though, such arguments are trumped by the fact that e-books have been available for $9.99 for more than a year.

“As far as I’m concerned, Amazon has committed to the $9.99 price,” said Wilma Sanders, a 70-year-old retiree who has homes in Plymouth, Mass., and Marco Island, Fla. She said that if e-book prices rose, she would stop buying. “I’m still a library-goer. There are enough good books out there that I don’t need to pay more than I want to. I already can’t keep up with what I have.”

Authors have been taken aback by some of the vehemence of the reader protests.

“The sense of entitlement of the American consumer is absolutely astonishing,” said Douglas Preston, whose novel “Impact” reached as high as No. 4 on The New York Times’s hardcover fiction best-seller list earlier this month. “It’s the Wal-Mart mentality, which in my view is very unhealthy for our country. It’s this notion of not wanting to pay the real price of something.”

Amazon commenters attacked Mr. Preston after his publisher delayed the e-book version of his novel by four months to protect hardcover sales. Mr. Preston said he was not sure whether the protests were denting his sales. But, he said, “It gives me pause when I get 50 e-mails saying ‘I’m never buying one of your books ever again. I’m moving on, you greedy, greedy author.”‘

One reason consumers may be sensitive to pricing is that they have so many other types of entertainment to occupy their time.

“Entertainment and media companies keep forgetting that consumers have a choice. They can decide not to buy the book at all,” said David Pakman, a venture capitalist and former chief executive of the digital music store eMusic. “They can play a video game, use an iPod Touch.” He added: “If you don’t get the price tag right and make it convenient, they just go elsewhere.”

John Wagoner, a 63-year-old accountant and Kindle owner in Plano, Tex., said that if e-book prices went much higher than $13 he would simply commit his time and dollars to other activities.

“They’re just books,” said Mr. Wagoner, who left an angry one-star review on the Amazon page for Mr. Preston’s novel. “I do other things other than reading.”

Some analysts say that if consumers balk at price increases, piracy could grow rapidly.

Joel Waldfogel, a professor of business and public policy at the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania, saw a comparison with movies, a business where he has studied digital piracy rates. With movies, he said, piracy tends to displace paid consumption. “The real cost of consuming a movie is the two hours of undivided attention you spend,” Mr. Waldfogel said. “If people are able to steal a bunch more, they will purchase less, simply because there isn’t time to do all of it.”

Similarly, with books, he said, “I would be scared to death about a culture of piracy taking hold. I wouldn’t mess around with price increases.”

Publishers say price levels are not settled by any means and that now, having reached agreements where publishers — rather than retailers — set consumer prices, they have an opportunity to test different situations.

“We may introduce a book at $14.95 for a year and then move the book to $9.99 when we would have put out the trade paperback edition,” said Dominique Raccah, chief executive of Sourcebooks, an independent publisher. “I suspect you’re going to see a fair amount of experimentation.”

Some e-book buyers are not interested in experiments. Mr. Fogel, who left the one-star review of the Kindle edition of Ms. Coulter’s novel, said he would not pay more than $9.99 for a book.

“There are too many very, very good books I haven’t gotten around to reading yet,” said Mr. Fogel, a 68-year-old retired management consultant. He added that publishers were likely to see “supply and demand turn back on them.”

“I think there’s going to be a general resentment” of higher prices, he said.

L.A. Chieffan
02-18-2010, 03:06 PM
I still jerk off manually.

OnTheWarpath58
02-18-2010, 03:16 PM
Can someone explain to me the fascination with spending $250+ on a reader, and then spending another $10-$15 for the content?

Between my B/N membership, and the constant coupons they send via e-mail and snail mail, I rarely if ever spend more than $15 on the real thing.

Buck
02-18-2010, 03:18 PM
I thought this was "The Future of Reading"

Just kidding man....Take it back, no E-Reader is worth that money.

Books are better. Plus I just cant trust all my stuff to a hard drive. The HDD fails, you have nothing.

irishjayhawk
02-18-2010, 03:20 PM
Can someone explain to me the fascination with spending $250+ on a reader, and then spending another $10-$15 for the content?

Between my B/N membership, and the constant coupons they send via e-mail and snail mail, I rarely if ever spend more than $15 on the real thing.

Well, there are three main reasons.

1) With the now extinct (or soon to be) $9.99 price point, it was half the cost of a new release which saves you money after a bit.

2) Convenience - automatic bookmarking, note taking, etc etc.

3) Space - it saves it all on your device. No bookshelves full of books that collect dust (of course, this can also be used against the device...)

I'm sure others would suggest more, but those were my three - in order.

'Hamas' Jenkins
02-18-2010, 03:21 PM
IJH:

Half.com

a Bic pen.

Automatic note-taking

OnTheWarpath58
02-18-2010, 03:25 PM
Well, there are three main reasons.

1) With the now extinct (or soon to be) $9.99 price point, it was half the cost of a new release which saves you money after a bit.

2) Convenience - automatic bookmarking, note taking, etc etc.

3) Space - it saves it all on your device. No bookshelves full of books that collect dust (of course, this can also be used against the device...)

I'm sure others would suggest more, but those were my three - in order.

Thanks. And FTR, I'm not attacking you, or the hardware. Just asking.

irishjayhawk
02-18-2010, 03:26 PM
I thought this was "The Future of Reading"

I still stand by that.


Just kidding man....Take it back, no E-Reader is worth that money.

I'd disagree if the pricing was 9.99 per new release and down from there.


Books are better. Plus I just cant trust all my stuff to a hard drive. The HDD fails, you have nothing.

Luckily, I believe most let you re download ones if that happens.

PunkinDrublic
02-18-2010, 03:27 PM
Well, there are three main reasons.

1) With the now extinct (or soon to be) $9.99 price point, it was half the cost of a new release which saves you money after a bit.

You can buy a new release book on amazon for super cheap.

2) Convenience - automatic bookmarking, note taking, etc etc.

All problems solved with pieces of paper

3) Space - it saves it all on your device. No bookshelves full of books that collect dust (of course, this can also be used against the device...)

You can always sell your books back used at a used book store if it gets to the point where they take up new space.

I'm sure others would suggest more, but those were my three - in order.

My rebuttal.

Reaper16
02-18-2010, 03:27 PM
IJH:

Half.com

a Bic pen.

Automatic note-taking
For reals.

DaFace
02-18-2010, 03:28 PM
Can someone explain to me the fascination with spending $250+ on a reader, and then spending another $10-$15 for the content?

Between my B/N membership, and the constant coupons they send via e-mail and snail mail, I rarely if ever spend more than $15 on the real thing.

Why do people like mp3's over CD's (ignoring the fact that it's easy to steal mp3's)? People like the convenience of having an entire bookshelf in one place in a nice, consistent, compact little gizmo. And, despite the article, most books are still at least a little cheaper electronically than they are for a hard copy.

It's certainly not for everyone (myself included), but I can see why some people like them.

irishjayhawk
02-18-2010, 03:29 PM
Well, it appears most on here are against ereaders in general. So I'm not sure I've gotten an answer yet. :p

irishjayhawk
02-18-2010, 03:30 PM
IJH:

Half.com

a Bic pen.

Automatic note-taking

Eh, I wasn't ever really going to take notes. :)

Buck
02-18-2010, 03:35 PM
I'd disagree if the pricing was 9.99 per new release and down from there.

Luckily, I believe most let you re download ones if that happens.

Yeah, but you can't re-download a ruined $260 machine.

Regarding the pricing of each book. Lets say I want to purchase a 25 year old book, is the pricing still lower than the hard copy?

I just bought Sirens of Titan for $15 + tax. How much would that cost you on your Nook? Do you have to pay tax on there?

Mr. Laz
02-18-2010, 03:36 PM
should of waited to buy in the first place :p

Buck
02-18-2010, 03:37 PM
Why do people like mp3's over CD's (ignoring the fact that it's easy to steal mp3's)? People like the convenience of having an entire bookshelf in one place in a nice, consistent, compact little gizmo. And, despite the article, most books are still at least a little cheaper electronically than they are for a hard copy.

It's certainly not for everyone (myself included), but I can see why some people like them.

Its different though.

I can buy a CD, rip the music to my computer and make an MP3 while still having a legit hard-copy backup automatically in my hands.

Mr. Laz
02-18-2010, 03:40 PM
Its different though.

I can buy a CD, rip the music to my computer and make an MP3 while still having a legit hard-copy backup automatically in my hands.
actually that's illegal, isn't it?

Buck
02-18-2010, 03:41 PM
actually that's illegal, isn't it?

I dont think so. I'm not distributing the music.

Edit: I guess according to the RIAA it is. Come arrest me, I guess.

irishjayhawk
02-18-2010, 03:42 PM
Yeah, but you can't re-download a ruined $260 machine.

Regarding the pricing of each book. Lets say I want to purchase a 25 year old book, is the pricing still lower than the hard copy?

I just bought Sirens of Titan for $15 + tax. How much would that cost you on your Nook? Do you have to pay tax on there?

11.14 on Bn.com
7.19 on kindle
8.54 on Sony's ebook store


I can buy from Sony and it'l work with my nook. Sony removed DRM. Now, Kindle I can't because their DRM is, thus far, not cracked.

irishjayhawk
02-18-2010, 03:43 PM
Its different though.

I can buy a CD, rip the music to my computer and make an MP3 while still having a legit hard-copy backup automatically in my hands.

I don't see the advantage of this. I mean if I can redownload my files whenever, why would I need a hard copy.

Buck
02-18-2010, 03:44 PM
11.14 on Bn.com
7.19 on kindle
8.54 on Sony's ebook store


I can buy from Sony and it'l work with my nook. Sony removed DRM. Now, Kindle I can't because their DRM is, thus far, not cracked.

Thats pretty good.

Does the Nook or Kindle or Sony Reader have the option to make the words bigger? I am already going blind.

What kind of warranty is offered?

Mr. Laz
02-18-2010, 03:46 PM
I dont think so. I'm not distributing the music.
the industry maintains that it is illegal for someone who has legally purchased a CD to transfer that music into his computer.

"I couldn't believe it when I read that," says Ray Beckerman, a New York lawyer who represents six clients who have been sued by the RIAA. "The basic principle in the law is that you have to distribute actual physical copies to be guilty of violating copyright. But recently, the industry has been going around saying that even a personal copy on your computer is a violation."

RIAA's hard-line position seems clear. Its Web site says: "If you make unauthorized copies of copyrighted music recordings, you're stealing. You're breaking the law and you could be held legally liable for thousands of dollars in damages."

They're not kidding. In October, after a trial in Minnesota -- the first time the industry has made its case before a federal jury -- Jammie Thomas was ordered to pay $220,000 to the big record companies. That's $9,250 for each of 24 songs she was accused of sharing online.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/12/28/AR2007122800693.html

Buck
02-18-2010, 03:50 PM
I don't see the advantage of this. I mean if I can redownload my files whenever, why would I need a hard copy.

What if you drop your Nook and it breaks?

What if I drop my Book? A dented / bent cover or spine?

irishjayhawk
02-18-2010, 03:53 PM
Thats pretty good.

Does the Nook or Kindle or Sony Reader have the option to make the words bigger? I am already going blind.

What kind of warranty is offered?

I bought the extended warranty because I wanted accidents covered. Like Starbucks coffee (:p) spilling on it or something.

All ereaders have font adjustments.

irishjayhawk
02-18-2010, 03:54 PM
What if you drop your Nook and it breaks?

What if I drop my Book? A dented / bent cover or spine?

But you compared it to a CD. A CD could get scratched. So you backed it up on the computer. My ebooks are backed up.

What happens when you drop your DVD player? Don't you have to get a new one?

You're making two different arguments or one apples to oranges argument, depending on your view.

irishjayhawk
02-18-2010, 03:55 PM
the industry maintains that it is illegal for someone who has legally purchased a CD to transfer that music into his computer.

"I couldn't believe it when I read that," says Ray Beckerman, a New York lawyer who represents six clients who have been sued by the RIAA. "The basic principle in the law is that you have to distribute actual physical copies to be guilty of violating copyright. But recently, the industry has been going around saying that even a personal copy on your computer is a violation."

RIAA's hard-line position seems clear. Its Web site says: "If you make unauthorized copies of copyrighted music recordings, you're stealing. You're breaking the law and you could be held legally liable for thousands of dollars in damages."

They're not kidding. In October, after a trial in Minnesota -- the first time the industry has made its case before a federal jury -- Jammie Thomas was ordered to pay $220,000 to the big record companies. That's $9,250 for each of 24 songs she was accused of sharing online.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/12/28/AR2007122800693.html

Fortunately, that's been tried in court and it failed. You have the right to back it up. And there's absolutely no way for them to ever find you as long as you aren't sharing them with the interwebz.

Buck
02-18-2010, 03:58 PM
But you compared it to a CD. A CD could get scratched. So you backed it up on the computer. My ebooks are backed up.

What happens when you drop your DVD player? Don't you have to get a new one?

You're making two different arguments or one apples to oranges argument, depending on your view.

http://blogs.warwick.ac.uk/images/lblackwell/2006/02/13/stfu_noob.jpg

Oh, and I wasn't comparing it, DaFace was.

Anyong Bluth
02-18-2010, 04:23 PM
How long do you have to return it? I'm a tech junkie & if I drop some coin on a new toy & find myself having doubts / on the fence after a week, I'd return it within the store's return time policy.

But, it sounds to me like you like the reader, but don't know if it's going to be the perceived value you envisioned when getting it & the risk of higher rates for ebooks.

I find it funny that Apple, who fought tooth and nail to charge a basic flat fee for songs, no matter what song it was when they launched the iTunes store is now doing an about face and pushing a varied fee rate for books! Of course this was more of a tactic to try to cause tension between publishers & Amazon, who could use the iPad & it's expected consumer base as leverage as a way to bring Amazon back to the table regarding the 9.99 pricepoint.

You might want to check out the Notion Ink Adam. It has 2 display modes, backlit LCD for doing more traditional tablet / computer / web browsing, & Pixel QI that is similar to E-ink. The whole point being is why the F()ck would you want to try to read a book on an LCD screen when it will strain your eyes and people reading books def. don't want that. (don't tell that to the iPad)

http://gizmodo.com/5471559/notion-ink-adam-tablet-caught-on-video-specs-finalized

http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/4/2010/02/500x_notionink.jpg


To me that sounds like a much more interesting device!

Another possible device is Microsoft's Courier. It hasn't been confirmed yet for production, but after MS has been on a roll lately with Windows 7 putting Vista's nightmare to rest & their recent unveiling of Windows Mobile 7 series pretty much blowing everyone away, I'd say this looks right up their alley as a device that builds on the companies refound innovation.

http://gizmodo.com/5365299/courier-first-details-of-microsofts-secret-tablet

Make sure to watch the video!!! God I want one of these BAD!!!!

http://cache.g4tv.com/ImageDb3/177127_S/Microsoft-Courier-Revealed.jpg


<object width="560" height="340"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/pFQWc79TYcU&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/pFQWc79TYcU&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="560" height="340"></embed></object>

irishjayhawk
02-18-2010, 04:31 PM
How long do you have to return it? I'm a tech junkie & if I drop some coin on a new toy & find myself having doubts / on the fence after a week, I'd return it within the store's return time policy.

But, it sounds to me like you like the reader, but don't know if it's going to be the perceived value you envisioned when getting it & the risk of higher rates for ebooks.

I find it funny that Apple, who fought tooth and nail to charge a basic flat fee for songs, no matter what song it was when they launched the iTunes store is now doing an about face and pushing a varied fee rate for books! Of course this was more of a tactic to try to cause tension between publishers & Amazon, who could use the iPad & it's expected consumer base as leverage as a way to bring Amazon back to the table regarding the 9.99 pricepoint.

That's precisely what happens when you're the first player in the market. The reason Amazon can't keep the $10 is because they don't have a device like the iPod that's really caught fire. They don't have much leverage. Apple does.

And I'm hating Apple for this.


You might want to check out the Notion Ink Adam. It has 2 display modes, backlit LCD for doing more traditional tablet / computer / web browsing, & Pixel QI that is similar to E-ink. The whole point being is why the F()ck would you want to try to read a book on an LCD screen when it will strain your eyes and people reading books def. don't want that. (don't tell that to the iPad)

http://gizmodo.com/5471559/notion-ink-adam-tablet-caught-on-video-specs-finalized

http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/4/2010/02/500x_notionink.jpg

If you constantly wait for what's coming, you'll never buy.


To me that sounds like a much more interesting device!

Another possible device is Microsoft's Courier. It hasn't been confirmed yet for production, but after MS has been on a roll lately with Windows 7 putting Vista's nightmare to rest & their recent unveiling of Windows Mobile 7 series pretty much blowing everyone away, I'd say this looks right up their alley as a device that builds on the companies refound innovation.

http://gizmodo.com/5365299/courier-first-details-of-microsofts-secret-tablet

Make sure to watch the video!!! God I want one of these BAD!!!!

Courier is VAPORWARE. Everyone keeps bringing it up but Microsoft puts out videos and things all the time of things they're thinking of. Almost 90% of it doesn't happen.

Windows 7 phone (gay name, by the way) is about as close to shipping as anything they have and it's a friggin year away.

I don't trust anything Microsoft until it's out.

irishjayhawk
02-18-2010, 06:37 PM
Bah, I don't know what to do. Kinda pisses me off I have to decide this after just getting the damn thing.