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View Full Version : Environment BP is underestimating the size of the oil leak


Cave Johnson
05-25-2010, 03:04 PM
to save money (and litigation/liability costs, no doubt).

"If BP's leak estimates were correct, then it'd be facing something like a $140 million fine so far. But if the high-end estimates are right, well, the oil giant could be facing penalties in the billions. Yesterday, Interior Secretary Ken Salazar said the government would make its own independent assessment of the numbers, though it's unclear why this wasn't done earlier.

If one believed BP's original estimate, there would only be 1.4 million gallons of oil in the gulf so far. If you believe the adjusted figure from NOAA and BP, 6.9 million gallons of oil have already hemorrhaged into the Gulf. But if outside experts are right, the figure is likely closer to 131.6 million gallons or nearly 13 Exxon Valdez spills."

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2010/05/the-size-of-the-spill.html

memyselfI
05-25-2010, 03:15 PM
So is BO.

Donger
05-25-2010, 03:17 PM
It's funny that people seem to think that Exxon Valdez was one of the biggest spills ever. It isn't even close.

raybec 4
05-25-2010, 03:18 PM
It's funny that people seem to think that Exxon Valdez was one of the biggest spills ever. It isn't even close.

It may just be the one most people can identify.

BucEyedPea
05-25-2010, 03:19 PM
It's funny that people seem to think that Exxon Valdez was one of the biggest spills ever. It isn't even close.

What people think that? List them?

What oil spills were bigger?

Donger
05-25-2010, 03:22 PM
to save money (and litigation/liability costs, no doubt).

"If BP's leak estimates were correct, then it'd be facing something like a $140 million fine so far. But if the high-end estimates are right, well, the oil giant could be facing penalties in the billions. Yesterday, Interior Secretary Ken Salazar said the government would make its own independent assessment of the numbers, though it's unclear why this wasn't done earlier.

If one believed BP's original estimate, there would only be 1.4 million gallons of oil in the gulf so far. If you believe the adjusted figure from NOAA and BP, 6.9 million gallons of oil have already hemorrhaged into the Gulf. But if outside experts are right, the figure is likely closer to 131.6 million gallons or nearly 13 Exxon Valdez spills."

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2010/05/the-size-of-the-spill.html

I'd like to see how this fine is quantified.

KC Dan
05-25-2010, 03:22 PM
What people think that? List them?

What oil spills were bigger?
Here's a list

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2010/04/30/the_biggest_oil_spills_in_history

Donger
05-25-2010, 03:24 PM
What people think that? List them?

What oil spills were bigger?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_oil_spills

Donger
05-25-2010, 03:25 PM
It may just be the one most people can identify.

Yeah, I guess so. Had lots of pictures of oil-coated birds, too.

BucEyedPea
05-25-2010, 03:25 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_oil_spills

I don't want a cut n' paste job. Why can't you just say out of your own head? Why? Whatsomatta with you?

BucEyedPea
05-25-2010, 03:26 PM
Here's a list

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2010/04/30/the_biggest_oil_spills_in_history

Thank you.

redsurfer11
05-25-2010, 03:31 PM
All is Well. Obama......

HonestChieffan
05-25-2010, 03:35 PM
BP cannot come out no matter what. Like some guy in some think tank who has never been to the gulf and has zero knowledge of a well this deep can estimate it and BP cannot? If I was BP I would just accept the highest number from here forward, each new number if its more hold a presser and recognize the new number as brilliant science.

Lay down be a whipping post and grovel at the feet of all begging for forgiveness.

Chiefshrink
05-25-2010, 04:10 PM
If B.O. would have called in the best and brightest(Our Oil Cos.) from the get go and followed their own EPA rules of having everything in place prior this would have been stopped along time ago.

BUT HEY! AS Rahm said, "NEVER LET A GOOD CRISIS GO TO WASTE" pardon the pun there. HELL, JUST EXTEND IT !!!!!!

penchief
05-25-2010, 04:16 PM
If B.O. would have called in the best and brightest(Our Oil Cos.) from the get go and followed their own EPA rules of having everything in place prior this would have been stopped along time ago.

BUT HEY! AS Rahm said, "NEVER LET A GOOD CRISIS GO TO WASTE" pardon the pun there. HELL, JUST EXTEND IT !!!!!!

If the Our Oil Cos. are the best and the brightest why did this happen in the first place? And where is their sense of duty and responsibility? Why do they need to have the president call them to action? Why didn't they volunteer and mobilize to put a stop to this a long time ago? If not for our country's sake, at least for their own? Your theory doesn't wash.

Taco John
05-25-2010, 04:31 PM
If the Our Oil Cos. are the best and the brightest why did this happen in the first place? And where is their sense of duty and responsibility? Why do they need to have the president call them to action? Why didn't they volunteer and mobilize to put a stop to this a long time ago? If not for our country's sake, at least for their own? Your theory doesn't wash.

They did.

I'm not here to defend them, but let's be reasonable. It's not like they just turned around and went back to business.

Cave Johnson
05-25-2010, 04:31 PM
If B.O. would have called in the best and brightest(Our Oil Cos.) from the get go and followed their own EPA rules of having everything in place prior this would have been stopped along time ago.

BUT HEY! AS Rahm said, "NEVER LET A GOOD CRISIS GO TO WASTE" pardon the pun there. HELL, JUST EXTEND IT !!!!!!

It's hard to argue with this kind of stupid, but assuming you're referring to the EPA not having enough oil booms in place to contain the spill, that does nothing to plug the leak.

But blame the boogeyman if it makes you feel better.

Cave Johnson
05-25-2010, 04:49 PM
So the leak is the result of the EPA, not the callous company that produced this memo?

http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2010-05-25/shocking-bp-memo-and-the-oil-spill-in-the-gulf/

BucEyedPea
05-25-2010, 04:57 PM
So the leak is the result of the EPA, not the callous company that produced this memo?

http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2010-05-25/shocking-bp-memo-and-the-oil-spill-in-the-gulf/

Is that silly thing really a BP memo?

Cave Johnson
05-25-2010, 05:00 PM
Is that silly thing really a BP memo?

Yup. Came out in discovery related to the Texas City explosion.

The Mad Crapper
05-25-2010, 05:49 PM
It's hard to argue with this kind of stupid

You know, for a guy who is little more than a shill for the democrat party, you really need to tone down the namecalling.

penchief
05-25-2010, 06:36 PM
They did.

I'm not here to defend them, but let's be reasonable. It's not like they just turned around and went back to business.

Well I guess that puts a damper on Sport's claim about the "best and brightest" being the answer. And about Obama being at fault for not calling them together.

HonestChieffan
05-25-2010, 06:42 PM
If the Our Oil Cos. are the best and the brightest why did this happen in the first place? And where is their sense of duty and responsibility? Why do they need to have the president call them to action? Why didn't they volunteer and mobilize to put a stop to this a long time ago? If not for our country's sake, at least for their own? Your theory doesn't wash.


Yesterday I was working making a buck running my equipment. Wouldn't you know it, the coupler that hooks the motor to the spray pump just broke.

Why? I dunno.

It has been on said shaft for 60 hours of run time, it was installed right, it was not loose. I check it after ever 5 hours of run time.

It just broke. Its the industry standard. Made for extreme use.

But dang it if it didn't break.

Now I suppose its my fault. I bought it from Lovejoy, they made it. Do you think they knew they sold me something that would fail? And fail at the most critical time of the year in my business? Maybe they knew. Dirty buggers. But if BP is a lesson, its my fault. I bought the part and it was mine when it failed.

True story...apply to the oil leak.

Do you for a minute thing BP invested the millions they spent to punch that well and knowingly installed a backflow preventer that they knew was not functioning? Do you believe they would do something so ignorant as to risk not only the investment but harm the environment willfully?

We are so quick to blame someone for everything ignoring the simple fact that mechanical stuff is never 100%, there is always the possibility that a piece of machinery will fail. No one caused it, its not by design, as they say sometimes shit happens. even with the best pre installation test that said it was working fine and the best installers putting it in place, it failed.

Im not downplaying the impact or impact on people, environment, and the owners, shareholders and employees of all the oil business that will happen as we react and overreact.

But the fact will always remain, parts and pieces break. It cannot be legislated that parts don't fail.

penchief
05-25-2010, 07:22 PM
Yesterday I was working making a buck running my equipment. Wouldn't you know it, the coupler that hooks the motor to the spray pump just broke.

Why? I dunno.

It has been on said shaft for 60 hours of run time, it was installed right, it was not loose. I check it after ever 5 hours of run time.

It just broke. Its the industry standard. Made for extreme use.

But dang it if it didn't break.

Now I suppose its my fault. I bought it from Lovejoy, they made it. Do you think they knew they sold me something that would fail? And fail at the most critical time of the year in my business? Maybe they knew. Dirty buggers. But if BP is a lesson, its my fault. I bought the part and it was mine when it failed.

True story...apply to the oil leak.

Do you for a minute thing BP invested the millions they spent to punch that well and knowingly installed a backflow preventer that they knew was not functioning? Do you believe they would do something so ignorant as to risk not only the investment but harm the environment willfully?

We are so quick to blame someone for everything ignoring the simple fact that mechanical stuff is never 100%, there is always the possibility that a piece of machinery will fail. No one caused it, its not by design, as they say sometimes shit happens. even with the best pre installation test that said it was working fine and the best installers putting it in place, it failed.

Im not downplaying the impact or impact on people, environment, and the owners, shareholders and employees of all the oil business that will happen as we react and overreact.

But the fact will always remain, parts and pieces break. It cannot be legislated that parts don't fail.

The best and brightest are not going to be caught flat-footed and left helpless in the face of a problem that anyone with forsight would have been able to imagine. The best and brightest would have had an emergency plan to attack such a possibility occuring 5000 feet below the surface of the sea instead of scrambling for a solution while millions upon millions of gallons of crude spewed into the ocean.

You said it yourself. Parts break and parts fail. Which is all the more reason for a company like BP to anticipate such failures. Considering the catastrophic consequences of a potential failure at the bottom of the sea and the magnitude of the damage it can cause, it only makes sense that the best and brightest would have employed additional preventive measures as well as having a contingency plan for the worst case scenario.

Chiefshrink
05-25-2010, 08:48 PM
It's hard to argue with this kind of stupid, but assuming you're referring to the EPA not having enough oil booms in place to contain the spill, that does nothing to plug the leak.

But blame the boogeyman if it makes you feel better.

Hey Tittsie !!

Why can't Jindal get a response from "O" for persmission to dredge the Ocean floor in order to prevent at least the oil from coming into the marshlands?

Understand that Jindal has been asking since May F'n 11th:cuss: as a preventive measure that would've at least held the oil at bay until a fix occurred!!!

This is what I am talking about!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No leadership or support!!!

Totally UNACCEPTABLE!!!

Chiefshrink
05-25-2010, 08:54 PM
Well I guess that puts a damper on Sport's claim about the "best and brightest" being the answer. And about Obama being at fault for not calling them together.

If the "best and brightest" phrase came out of Ken Salazar's mouth I wouldn't buy that for a second. That SOB is from Colorado and I know allllllllllllllll about Ken!:rolleyes: He and Janet are poster children for incompetence!!!:shake:

Cave Johnson
05-26-2010, 09:30 AM
Why can't Jindal get a response from "O" for persmission to dredge the Ocean floor in order to prevent at least the oil from coming into the marshlands?

Understand that Jindal has been asking since May F'n 11th:cuss: as a preventive measure that would've at least held the oil at bay until a fix occurred!!!

This is what I am talking about!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No leadership or support!!!

Totally UNACCEPTABLE!!!

Apparently the holdup is the Corps of Engineers (you know, there's probably a process they have to go through), but blame the President if you'd like.

http://www.nola.com/news/gulf-oil-spill/index.ssf/2010/05/artificial_barrier_island_plan.html

HonestChieffan
05-26-2010, 09:50 AM
Is he not Commander in Chief? Perhaps he is not aware the Corpse of Engineers are part of the Army

patteeu
05-26-2010, 10:03 AM
If the Our Oil Cos. are the best and the brightest why did this happen in the first place? And where is their sense of duty and responsibility? Why do they need to have the president call them to action? Why didn't they volunteer and mobilize to put a stop to this a long time ago? If not for our country's sake, at least for their own? Your theory doesn't wash.

What are you talking about, penchief? BP has been there from the beginning. That's several days before the government was calling anyone to action.

patteeu
05-26-2010, 10:05 AM
So the leak is the result of the EPA, not the callous company that produced this memo?

http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2010-05-25/shocking-bp-memo-and-the-oil-spill-in-the-gulf/

What's wrong with that "memo"?

BucEyedPea
05-26-2010, 10:34 AM
Apparently the holdup is the Corps of Engineers (you know, there's probably a process they have to go through), but blame the President if you'd like.

http://www.nola.com/news/gulf-oil-spill/index.ssf/2010/05/artificial_barrier_island_plan.html

Is this the same Army Corps of Engineers who were responsible for the damage in the sea walls that broke during Katrina due to their mismanagment?

I read the Obammunists wanted a study done first when local govt wanted permission to build up sand bars to protect his state from the oil spill. They said the Army Corps of Engineers had to conduct an ecological “study” of the effects of sand bars first. Meanwhile, there was one scientist from New Orleans who already had knowledge on the effects of that. But a study still had to be done....by the same people responsible for the sea walls breaking damaging N'awlins in Katrina.

penchief
05-26-2010, 05:15 PM
What are you talking about, penchief? BP has been there from the beginning. That's several days before the government was calling anyone to action.

I was responding to shrink's claim that Obama should have immediately called together the top minds from all the oil companies to fix this thing a long time ago.

vailpass
05-26-2010, 05:45 PM
The earth will fix whatever pollution occurs in the blink of a geological eye.
I no longer hold any BP stock.
In short, BFD.