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Tribal Warfare
06-04-2010, 03:23 PM
Half-Time For On-Field Work … Friday Cup O’Chiefs (http://www.bobgretz.com/chiefs-football/half-time-for-on-field-work-%E2%80%A6-friday-cup-o%E2%80%99chiefs.html)
June 4, 2010 - Bob Gretz |

From the Truman Sports Complex

On Thursday, the Chiefs had their ninth OTA practice session. Ahead of them are five more OTAs and a three-day mini-camp. In essence, the franchise hits the coming weekend at half-time of their on-field off-season work.

What seemed like a long series of workouts, now doesn’t seem so long for the players and the coaches, including the top dog, Todd Haley.

“it’s very important that we’re getting everything out of it that we can, both physically and mentally for the entire group because time’s going fast right now and before too long these guys are going to be heading home,” Haley said after Thursday’s practice. “We’re trying to use the time as efficiently as possible to get as much done.

“This week I felt like we had a really good work week overall. I feel like the guys got better.”

Six of the nine OTA sessions have been open to the media. That’s 90 minutes each or about nine hours of football that we’ve seen. Plus, it’s not really football, since there are no pads, no tackling, no blocking and no line play.

From what we’ve seen here are some evaluations at the halfway point:

OFFENSE

There have been days when QB Matt Cassel has looked bad throwing the ball. There have been days when Cassel has looked good. Right now, the good days outnumber the bad days and that’s a big improvement over last year at this time.

The first signs of problems in the passing game last year were visible in the OTA sessions. It wasn’t a surprise that there was an adjustment problem for Cassel and the offense, given the trigger man was as new as the offense. But last year in the OTAs there was no visible improvement from the first practice to the last.

The team has a new offensive system and a new coordinator in Charlie Weis, but there are not a lot of new faces in the passing game. WR Jerheme Urban is new and he’s had the toughest time holding onto the ball. Urban’s best day of catching came on Thursday. Chris Chambers has looked good and Dwayne Bowe has been his normal inconsistent self, although in the last week he’s been sure-handed and improved.

Not to play Dr. Freud here, but I think here’s a direct correlation between two of Bowe’s problems. One is the inability to keep focus on the football, trying to run before securing the catch and dropping the ball. The other is engaging brain before mouth and dribbling out words that are ill-timed or inappropriate. Consistency and maturity is what the Chiefs seek in all areas from Bowe.

A tight end the situation is muddled because of the injury situation involving Brad Cottam and draft choice Tony Moeaki. It’s unlikely Cottam will be given the go ahead to practice until training camp, if then. He’s neck fracture is nothing to fool with; he’s confident that he’ll play football again, but this decision will be up to specialists. Moeaki’s problem is a bit more mysterious, since it does not involve an injury, or at least that’s what he says. But Moeaki said he expects to be practicing soon.

That’s left the tight end field open to Leonard Pope, Jake O’Connell and the find of the year so far, waiver-claim Leroy Banks. Pope is a known commodity, a blocker more than a catcher. O’Connell continues to be very inconsistent with his hands. Released by the Falcons, Banks was added before the start of OTAs and has been impressive in his athletic ability and his pass catching. At 6-3, 243 pounds he’s a tweener, but if keeps showing off the ability to get separation and catches the ball, there’s going to be a place for him on this roster.

Line play is impossible to tell at this point, and the same holds true with the running game. There are few physical specimens like Thomas Jones, but he will be 32 in August. Jamaal Charles hasn’t practiced yet, recovering from his shoulder injury; that shouldn’t be a problem. Rookie Dexter McCluster is getting moved around all over the place and that figures to be the way his season will go from wide receiver to running back. One guy that’s flashed a time or two is Kestahn Moore, who was signed late last season to the practice squad. The former University of Florida back has a nice wiggle and burst.

DEFENSE

There is no way to discount the value to the Chiefs and the team’s defense with the presence of veteran OLB Mike Vrabel at all nine of the OTA sessions.

It’s not just his 13 seasons in the league and history of productive play for a Super Bowl champion. It’s that Vrabel knows the Romeo Crennel (right) defense forwards, backwards and sideways. It is exactly the scheme that Crennel ran with the Patriots and Vrabel was part of the unit.

Throughout the practices, Vrabel’s voice can be heard making adjustments, positioning players, reminding teammates of a key or what to look for on the coming snap. During a game, that type of conversation can’t be heard. But on the practice field, it’s constant and it’s made a difference.

The defense should be ahead of the offense at this point, and that’s the case with the Chiefs. Again, it’s impossible to make any type of educated guesses on what’s going on with the defensive line. Glenn Dorsey looks to be in very good shape and Tyson Jackson has worked hard and made some changes to his body. Wallace Gilberry is consistent play from being a factor for more plays than in just the nickel defense.

At linebacker there’s far more athletic ability visible from this unit than at the same time last year. Vrabel is Vrabel; on the final leg of his NFL career, who gets by with brains. On the other side Tamba Hali is starting to look like an outside linebacker, rather than a defensive end switched to the position. In Thursday’s OTA he was working on pass coverage drops and did things smoothly.

Haley says there is no depth chart at this time of the year, and any changes should not be taken as gospel for the 2010 season. But the elevation of Derrick Johnson and Jovan Belcher to the first team at inside linebacker was necessary, as both of those players bring greater athleticism, speed and quickness inside. Belcher’s inexperience must be overcome.

The depth at linebacker is looking better as well, with Andy Studebaker and Pierre Walters on the outside, along with rookies Cameron Sheffield and Justin Cole also working outside.

The secondary is the group that Haley pointed out this week was providing the biggest surprise in how competitive the battle is for roster spots. It hasn’t helped that CB Brandon Flowers has not practiced because of his recovery from shoulder surgery; but he’s a known commodity. His absence has given Maurice Leggett a chance for extended playing time and Brandon Carr on the other side has looked good. First-year man Jackie Bates is starting to show up at times with his play on the second defense. Rookie Javier Arenas continues to look like one of those defensive backs that always has him in the neighborhood of the football.

At safety, Eric Berry is still getting his feet under him but he’s coming fast. He’s flashed his athletic skills at times, but the off-season work for him is about picking up the defense and being able to stand on that back line and make sure everyone is lined up in the right positions. Third-year man DaJuan Morgan has put himself in good coverage positions and that gives him the chance to extend his career. Veteran Jon McGraw is a known commodity.

Donald Washington has been moved to safety, a pretty good indication that the staff doesn’t feel he could handle the corner. Whether or not he has the ability to play on the back line remains to be seen; he’s athletic enough, the question will be handling the mental part of the game. Draft choice Kendrick Lewis and first-year man Ricky Price have had some good plays.

Overall, there’s a lot more athletic ability among the defensive backs than the position group had last year.

SPECIAL TEAMS

Unfortunately, the OTAs do not provide much of an opportunity to see the kicking game. The Chiefs are solid with K Ryan Succop and P Dustin Colquitt. Both seem to be kicking the ball well, and in good physical shape.

The return game is wide open, but Arenas figures to be a big factor there. McCluster might be as well, but that will depend on how many snaps Haley wants to take away from the rookie’s offensive opportunities.

Improved speed and athletic ability at linebacker and the secondary should provide for improved production in coverage and blocking.

But until the pads go on and the Chiefs are in St. Joe, everyone will have to wait for those answers.

WARNER AN OTA VISITOR, NOT A QB CANDIDATE

There are very strict rules around the Chiefs about who can watch practices at the team’s facilities. Club employees outside of the football operation are not allowed to attend. The media gets some access, but it’s very controlled.

But when you are a former NFL MVP and Super Bowl winning quarterback, and the head coach happens to be a friend, then watching an OTA session is no big deal. On Wednesday, Kurt Warner and several of his children were on the practice field at the Chiefs facility watching the practice.

“Our families kind of became close over our time in Arizona,” Haley said. They spent two years together with the Cardinals, including that Super Bowl season in 2008. “I’ve asked him multiple times and let him know our training camp dates and off-season dates and said if he could fit us into his busy schedule, meaning us the Haleys, that’d be great.

“He’s on a caravan trip across the country with his family. It worked out where he was able to come through here. He was gracious enough to speak to the fellas and I just thought it was great and really nice of him to come out and do that for us.”

What did Warner have to say?

“He spoke to the team about greatness and the importance of it,” QB Matt Cassel told FOXSports.com. “Too many times there are players in this league who don’t want to be good enough. He hit the nail right on the head when he talked about to be great, you have to be something special and work toward it. The message was crystal clear. It was great to hear from him.”

Haley was asked what his players could learn from Warner?

“What can’t they get?” Warner said. “Someone that speaks like him is able to relate to a lot of things that they are going through. I think they can get a lot.”

NFL PERSONNEL FILE/THURSDAY, JUNE 3


BENGALS – LB Rey Maualuga had recent surgery to repair a problem with his fibula and will be out three to four weeks. The problem was related to the ankle injury that landed him on injured reserve last year.
BILLS – signed 6th-round draft choice OLB Danny Batten to a 4-year, $1,890,000 contract – he’s coming out of South Dakota State as a DE making the switch to OLB in Buffalo’s new 3-4 scheme.
BROWNS – signed WR James Robinson – the 28-year old has spent time on the practice squads of the Dolphins, Browns and Redskins and was released by Washington in early May. He also has played in the Arena League and in Canada and played his college ball at Butler County C.C. in Kansas; released WR Dion Morton – an undrafted college free agent out of Colorado State; Hall of Fame WR Paul Warfield resigned his position in the team’s front office as the senior advisor to the general manager.
CHARGERS – signed TE Randy McMichael – veteran who started all 16 games last season for the Rams. He came into the league as a former fourth-round choice of the Dolphins. McMichael provides a veteran backup for Antonio Gates, replacing Brandon Manumaleuna who signed as a free agent with the Bears.
COLTS – WR Reggie Wayne released a statement on Thursday saying he will not attend the team’s weekend mini-camp because he’s unhappy with his contract. Wayne said “we are in disagreement on my contract situation.” Indy management can fine Wayne for missing the mandatory camp, since he’s under contract.
EAGLES – agreed to terms with 7th-round S Kurt Coleman to a 4-year, $1,883,000 contract – Coleman has missed Philly’s off-season work because Ohio State has not yet finished its spring semester. This was the same problem that pushed back the activity and development last year of Chiefs DB Donald Washington. Coleman was a first-team All-Big 10 selection.
FALCONS – the NFL suspended OL Quinn Ojinnaka for one-game on a violation of the league’s personal conduct policy. Last year, Ojinnaka was arrested after physically removing his wife from their house. He was charged with battery.
SAINTS – TE Jeremy Shockey has been cleared by medical personnel to return to practice in New Orleans. This comes after he suffered a seizure in the team’s weight room. Shockey will participate in the team’s mini-camp this weekend.
STEELERS – K Jeff Reed admitted Thursday that he had gone through a series of psychological evaluations similar to what Pittsburgh QB Ben Roethlisberger recently completed. Like Big Ben, the kicker’s evaluations were mandated to him by NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell.

KCUnited
06-04-2010, 03:31 PM
Tell us about everyone but the Oline, thanks.

Detoxing
06-04-2010, 03:37 PM
Tell us about everyone but the Oline, thanks.

I was just thinking about that yesterday. It would be nice to get some updates on Albert

KCUnited
06-04-2010, 03:43 PM
I was just thinking about that yesterday. It would be nice to get some updates on Albert
Or who's getting time at both guard positions and RT. But instead we get LeSeanRoy BanksRyan updates.

Huffman83
06-04-2010, 03:47 PM
I will say that the overall tone of the articles are much better than last year!

AZChief
06-04-2010, 04:00 PM
it's next to impossible to grade lineman in t-shirts and shorts...

Detoxing
06-04-2010, 04:02 PM
it's next to impossible to grade lineman in t-shirts and shorts...

yeah, but we could at least see how they're lining up our how much quicker/slower they look.

Fish
06-04-2010, 04:15 PM
So... Cassel only totally sucks half the time... and that's improvement....

Glorious.....

Mr. Laz
06-04-2010, 04:30 PM
Tell us about everyone but the Oline, thanks.
He can't tell you about the Oline/Dline because without full contact it's pretty much impossible to tell what the lines are going to do.

Mr. Laz
06-04-2010, 04:31 PM
So... Cassel only totally sucks half the time... and that's improvement....

Glorious.....
that's not what he said, dumbass

Cassel struggled enough without you retards making bad shit up

Marcellus
06-04-2010, 04:40 PM
that's not what he said, dumbass

Cassel struggled enough without you retards making bad shit up

I imagine he didn't even really read the article. If he did he has a reading comprehension problem.

On a side note they are talking about Cassel right now on ESPN radio and Steve Sarkisian (QB Coach at USC during Cassel's time there) is talking him up a bit.

The best part was Doug Gottlieb said Cassel has already had a better pro career than Lienart. Ouch.

Fish
06-04-2010, 04:51 PM
that's not what he said, dumbass

Cassel struggled enough without you retards making bad shit up

Yet you admit that Cassel struggled enough?

There have been days when QB Matt Cassel has looked bad throwing the ball. There have been days when Cassel has looked good. Right now, the good days outnumber the bad days and that’s a big improvement over last year at this time.

The first signs of problems in the passing game last year were visible in the OTA sessions. It wasn’t a surprise that there was an adjustment problem for Cassel and the offense, given the trigger man was as new as the offense. But last year in the OTAs there was no visible improvement from the first practice to the last.

So there was no visible improvement from Cassel last year during OTAs. This year, there are good days, and bad days. And that's a "big improvement".

I stand corrected, that's a surefire ringing endorsement for a franchise QB...

JASONSAUTO
06-04-2010, 04:57 PM
So... Cassel only totally sucks half the time... and that's improvement....

Glorious.....

wow, the article actually said (which you actually quoted a couple of posts before this one) that the good days have OUTNUMBERED the bad, yet right here you say he only sucks HALF the time. How did you get that out of the article?

Marcellus
06-04-2010, 04:59 PM
Yet you admit that Cassel struggled enough?



So there was no visible improvement from Cassel last year during OTAs. This year, there are good days, and bad days. And that's a "big improvement".

I stand corrected, that's a surefire ringing endorsement for a franchise QB...

So your statement he sucks half the time is correct? You understand 50% right?

Now go back and read the part about the good days outnumber the bad this year. It is simple math.

I make no qualms about Cassel's struggles last year but I am looking forward to a big improvement. It is irritating people bashing him when the there is no reason to bash him according to what was written.

He needs to improve. He looks better so far.

Have fun being negative all the time.

Marcellus
06-04-2010, 05:02 PM
And before you respond about close to half , more than half, or less than half not making a difference....

Imagine if a Dr. told you he needs to amputate half your balls but ended up taking more than half. :shrug:

Fish
06-04-2010, 05:35 PM
LMAO... Cassel kids...

Multiple reports in the last few weeks have described Cassel's struggles already this year.

And speaking of simple math... Gretz says this year, the good days outnumber the bad days. They've had 9 OTAs.. So giving him the utmost benefit of the doubt, Cassel may have only sucked 2 days out of 9. That's 22% of his performance in OTAs. So at best, he only sucks 22% of the time. And that's being generous. From the OTA reports it sounds worse than that.

But hey, let's all raise our glasses in celebration of this incredible achievement.... ROFL

LaChapelle
06-04-2010, 05:43 PM
Cardinals Steelers
Colts Saints
Chiefs Seahawks

Sweet Daddy Hate
06-04-2010, 05:50 PM
Vrabel is Vrabel; on the final leg of his NFL career


Please God let this be "it".

BossChief
06-04-2010, 06:18 PM
Im gonna be critical of Cassel until he does ANYTHING in real games to prove he deserves anything more than that.

Ill be damned if I sit here and read that he had a good day in practice and wash his ball (haha) for it. He had good days in practice last year too and then was total junk when he hit the real games.

Matt Cassel doesnt strike fear into any defensive coordinator in the NFL.

Fruit Ninja
06-04-2010, 06:29 PM
Yet you admit that Cassel struggled enough?



So there was no visible improvement from Cassel last year during OTAs. This year, there are good days, and bad days. And that's a "big improvement".

I stand corrected, that's a surefire ringing endorsement for a franchise QB... Didnt he also say the good days are more then the bad days now? its a fucking start. we know Cassel isnt a franchise QB. you can say whatever you want and you can bring up a contract that can be terminated after this year, but he's NOT our franchise QB. He's someone thats there until they can draft one they want. After 40 fucking years, i can be patient for a few more.

BossChief
06-04-2010, 06:35 PM
Didnt he also say the good days are more then the bad days now? its a fucking start. we know Cassel isnt a franchise QB. you can say whatever you want and you can bring up a contract that can be terminated after this year, but he's NOT our franchise QB. He's someone thats there until they can draft one they want. After 40 fucking years, i can be patient for a few more.

At least we have the Lakers!

Fish
06-04-2010, 06:40 PM
Didnt he also say the good days are more then the bad days now? its a fucking start. we know Cassel isnt a franchise QB. you can say whatever you want and you can bring up a contract that can be terminated after this year, but he's NOT our franchise QB. He's someone thats there until they can draft one they want. After 40 fucking years, i can be patient for a few more.

That's a painful mindset to have for the franchise you love. Thinking that the most important position on the field is being held by a guy you know isn't a franchise piece.

And 40 fucking years. Seriously. When is it OK to finally lose patience? 50? 60 years? :banghead:

All I want is a franchise QB...

Count Alex's Losses
06-04-2010, 06:40 PM
he's NOT our franchise QB. He's someone thats there until they can draft one they want.

Hamas has addressed this before.

This isn't the Royals. The Chiefs can cut ties with Matt Cassel and not be devastated from a financial or cap (obviously) standpoint.

The problem is Pioli. He hitched his wagon to Cassel.

I said this at the time of the draft, but all the dumb monkeys were too involved in a blowbang of Pioli to listen.

Passing on Clausen in a vacuum is not a problem. Passing on Clausen when he represents such high reward for such little risk, knowing that his college coach, who is our OC, recruited him and sang incredibly high praises to other teams is a problem.

Why? Because you aren't going to find someone that late in the draft with that much upside that you are that comfortable with who you don't have to play right away (because he's making 1/8th what top 5 QBs do).

If we didn't draft Clausen, we aren't drafting Gabbert, Luck, Locker, Mallet, or Unitas reincarnate.

Matt Cassel will be the QB of this team for the next 5 years, barring injury.

salame
06-04-2010, 07:01 PM
A tight end the situation is muddled because of the injury situation involving Brad Cottam and draft choice Tony Moeaki. It’s unlikely Cottam will be given the go ahead to practice until training camp, if then. He’s neck fracture is nothing to fool with; he’s confident that he’ll play football again, but this decision will be up to specialists. Moeaki’s problem is a bit more mysterious, since it does not involve an injury, or at least that’s what he says. But Moeaki said he expects to be practicing soon.


I hate this fucker already

JASONSAUTO
06-04-2010, 07:22 PM
Hamas has addressed this before.

sorry but hamas , as much as i like that cat, cant tell the future. and im sure that pioli hasnt called him and gave him any insight
Posted via Mobile Device

Count Alex's Losses
06-04-2010, 07:24 PM
It's common sense at this point, Sauto.

There will not be a more perfectly set up situation for us to draft a franchise QB in the next five years. And we passed.

Because Cassel is the great white hope.

-King-
06-04-2010, 07:44 PM
Hamas has addressed this before.

He also addressed why Pioli would never draft playmakers and how he would never draft a safety early.
Posted via Mobile Device

Count Alex's Losses
06-04-2010, 07:44 PM
He also addressed why Pioli would never draft playmakers and how he would never draft a safety early.
Posted via Mobile Device

Link?

-King-
06-04-2010, 07:47 PM
Link?

On my phone; too much work.



Posted via Mobile Device

Hydrae
06-04-2010, 08:07 PM
Half-Time For On-Field Work … Friday Cup O’Chiefs (http://www.bobgretz.com/chiefs-football/half-time-for-on-field-work-%E2%80%A6-friday-cup-o%E2%80%99chiefs.html)
June 4, 2010 - Bob Gretz |

From the Truman Sports Complex

On Thursday, the Chiefs had their ninth OTA practice session. Ahead of them are five more OTAs and a three-day mini-camp. In essence, the franchise hits the coming weekend at half-time of their on-field off-season work.

What seemed like a long series of workouts, now doesn’t seem so long for the players and the coaches, including the top dog, Todd Haley.

“it’s very important that we’re getting everything out of it that we can, both physically and mentally for the entire group because time’s going fast right now and before too long these guys are going to be heading home,” Haley said after Thursday’s practice. “We’re trying to use the time as efficiently as possible to get as much done.

“This week I felt like we had a really good work week overall. I feel like the guys got better.”

Six of the nine OTA sessions have been open to the media. That’s 90 minutes each or about nine hours of football that we’ve seen. Plus, it’s not really football, since there are no pads, no tackling, no blocking and no line play.

From what we’ve seen here are some evaluations at the halfway point:

OFFENSE

There have been days when QB Matt Cassel has looked bad throwing the ball. There have been days when Cassel has looked good. Right now, the good days outnumber the bad days and that’s a big improvement over last year at this time.

The first signs of problems in the passing game last year were visible in the OTA sessions. It wasn’t a surprise that there was an adjustment problem for Cassel and the offense, given the trigger man was as new as the offense. But last year in the OTAs there was no visible improvement from the first practice to the last.

The team has a new offensive system and a new coordinator in Charlie Weis, but there are not a lot of new faces in the passing game. WR Jerheme Urban is new and he’s had the toughest time holding onto the ball. Urban’s best day of catching came on Thursday. Chris Chambers has looked good and Dwayne Bowe has been his normal inconsistent self, although in the last week he’s been sure-handed and improved.

Not to play Dr. Freud here, but I think here’s a direct correlation between two of Bowe’s problems. One is the inability to keep focus on the football, trying to run before securing the catch and dropping the ball. The other is engaging brain before mouth and dribbling out words that are ill-timed or inappropriate. Consistency and maturity is what the Chiefs seek in all areas from Bowe.

At tight end the situation is muddled because of the injury situation involving Brad Cottam and draft choice Tony Moeaki. It’s unlikely Cottam will be given the go ahead to practice until training camp, if then. He’sHis neck fracture is nothing to fool with; he’s confident that he’ll play football again, but this decision will be up to specialists. Moeaki’s problem is a bit more mysterious, since it does not involve an injury, or at least that’s what he says. But Moeaki said he expects to be practicing soon.

That’s left the tight end field open to Leonard Pope, Jake O’Connell and the find of the year so far, waiver-claim Leroy Banks. Pope is a known commodity, a blocker more than a catcher. O’Connell continues to be very inconsistent with his hands. Released by the Falcons, Banks was added before the start of OTAs and has been impressive in his athletic ability and his pass catching. At 6-3, 243 pounds he’s a tweener, but if he keeps showing off the ability to get separation and catches the ball, there’s going to be a place for him on this roster.

Line play is impossible to tell at this point, and the same holds true with the running game. There are few physical specimens like Thomas Jones, but he will be 32 in August. Jamaal Charles hasn’t practiced yet, recovering from his shoulder injury; that shouldn’t be a problem. Rookie Dexter McCluster is getting moved around all over the place and that figures to be the way his season will go from wide receiver to running back. One guy that’s flashed a time or two is Kestahn Moore, who was signed late last season to the practice squad. The former University of Florida back has a nice wiggle and burst.

DEFENSE

There is no way to discount the value to the Chiefs and the team’s defense with the presence of veteran OLB Mike Vrabel at all nine of the OTA sessions.

It’s not just his 13 seasons in the league and history of productive play for a Super Bowl champion. It’s that Vrabel knows the Romeo Crennel (right) defense forwards, backwards and sideways. It is exactly the scheme that Crennel ran with the Patriots and Vrabel was part of the unit.

Throughout the practices, Vrabel’s voice can be heard making adjustments, positioning players, reminding teammates of a key or what to look for on the coming snap. During a game, that type of conversation can’t be heard. But on the practice field, it’s constant and it’s made a difference.

The defense should be ahead of the offense at this point, and that’s the case with the Chiefs. Again, it’s impossible to make any type of educated guesses on what’s going on with the defensive line. Glenn Dorsey looks to be in very good shape and Tyson Jackson has worked hard and made some changes to his body. Wallace Gilberry is consistent play from being a factor for more plays than in just the nickel defense. :spock:

At linebacker there’s far more athletic ability visible from this unit than at the same time last year. Vrabel is Vrabel; on the final leg of his NFL career, who gets by with brains. On the other side Tamba Hali is starting to look like an outside linebacker, rather than a defensive end switched to the position. In Thursday’s OTA he was working on pass coverage drops and did things smoothly.

Haley says there is no depth chart at this time of the year, and any changes should not be taken as gospel for the 2010 season. But the elevation of Derrick Johnson and Jovan Belcher to the first team at inside linebacker was necessary, as both of those players bring greater athleticism, speed and quickness inside. Belcher’s inexperience must be overcome.

The depth at linebacker is looking better as well, with Andy Studebaker and Pierre Walters on the outside, along with rookies Cameron Sheffield and Justin Cole also working outside.

The secondary is the group that Haley pointed out this week was providing the biggest surprise in how competitive the battle is for roster spots. It hasn’t helped that CB Brandon Flowers has not practiced because of his recovery from shoulder surgery; but he’s a known commodity. His absence has given Maurice Leggett a chance for extended playing time and Brandon Carr on the other side has looked good. First-year man Jackie Bates is starting to show up at times with his play on the second defense. Rookie Javier Arenas continues to look like one of those defensive backs that always has himself in the neighborhood of the football.

At safety, Eric Berry is still getting his feet under him but he’s coming fast. He’s flashed his athletic skills at times, but the off-season work for him is about picking up the defense and being able to stand on that back line and make sure everyone is lined up in the right positions. Third-year man DaJuan Morgan has put himself in good coverage positions and that gives him the chance to extend his career. Veteran Jon McGraw is a known commodity.

Donald Washington has been moved to safety, a pretty good indication that the staff doesn’t feel he could handle the corner. Whether or not he has the ability to play on the back line remains to be seen; he’s athletic enough, the question will be handling the mental part of the game. Draft choice Kendrick Lewis and first-year man Ricky Price have had some good plays.

Overall, there’s a lot more athletic ability among the defensive backs than the position group had last year.

SPECIAL TEAMS

Unfortunately, the OTAs do not provide much of an opportunity to see the kicking game. The Chiefs are solid with K Ryan Succop and P Dustin Colquitt. Both seem to be kicking the ball well, and in good physical shape.

The return game is wide open, but Arenas figures to be a big factor there. McCluster might be as well, but that will depend on how many snaps Haley wants to take away from the rookie’s offensive opportunities.

Improved speed and athletic ability at linebacker and the secondary should provide for improved production in coverage and blocking.

But until the pads go on and the Chiefs are in St. Joe, everyone will have to wait for those answers.

WARNER AN OTA VISITOR, NOT A QB CANDIDATE

There are very strict rules around the Chiefs about who can watch practices at the team’s facilities. Club employees outside of the football operation are not allowed to attend. The media gets some access, but it’s very controlled.

But when you are a former NFL MVP and Super Bowl winning quarterback, and the head coach happens to be a friend, then watching an OTA session is no big deal. On Wednesday, Kurt Warner and several of his children were on the practice field at the Chiefs facility watching the practice.

“Our families kind of became close over our time in Arizona,” Haley said. They spent two years together with the Cardinals, including that Super Bowl season in 2008. “I’ve asked him multiple times and let him know our training camp dates and off-season dates and said if he could fit us into his busy schedule, meaning us the Haleys, that’d be great.

“He’s on a caravan trip across the country with his family. It worked out where he was able to come through here. He was gracious enough to speak to the fellas and I just thought it was great and really nice of him to come out and do that for us.”

What did Warner have to say?

“He spoke to the team about greatness and the importance of it,” QB Matt Cassel told FOXSports.com. “Too many times there are players in this league who don’t want to be good enough. He hit the nail right on the head when he talked about to be great, you have to be something special and work toward it. The message was crystal clear. It was great to hear from him.”

Haley was asked what his players could learn from Warner?

“What can’t they get?” WarnerHaley said. “Someone that speaks like him is able to relate to a lot of things that they are going through. I think they can get a lot.”

NFL PERSONNEL FILE/THURSDAY, JUNE 3


BENGALS – LB Rey Maualuga had recent surgery to repair a problem with his fibula and will be out three to four weeks. The problem was related to the ankle injury that landed him on injured reserve last year.
BILLS – signed 6th-round draft choice OLB Danny Batten to a 4-year, $1,890,000 contract – he’s coming out of South Dakota State as a DE making the switch to OLB in Buffalo’s new 3-4 scheme.
BROWNS – signed WR James Robinson – the 28-year old has spent time on the practice squads of the Dolphins, Browns and Redskins and was released by Washington in early May. He also has played in the Arena League and in Canada and played his college ball at Butler County C.C. in Kansas; released WR Dion Morton – an undrafted college free agent out of Colorado State; Hall of Fame WR Paul Warfield resigned his position in the team’s front office as the senior advisor to the general manager.
CHARGERS – signed TE Randy McMichael – veteran who started all 16 games last season for the Rams. He came into the league as a former fourth-round choice of the Dolphins. McMichael provides a veteran backup for Antonio Gates, replacing Brandon Manumaleuna who signed as a free agent with the Bears.
COLTS – WR Reggie Wayne released a statement on Thursday saying he will not attend the team’s weekend mini-camp because he’s unhappy with his contract. Wayne said “we are in disagreement on my contract situation.” Indy management can fine Wayne for missing the mandatory camp, since he’s under contract.
EAGLES – agreed to terms with 7th-round S Kurt Coleman to a 4-year, $1,883,000 contract – Coleman has missed Philly’s off-season work because Ohio State has not yet finished its spring semester. This was the same problem that pushed back the activity and development last year of Chiefs DB Donald Washington. Coleman was a first-team All-Big 10 selection.
FALCONS – the NFL suspended OL Quinn Ojinnaka for one-game on a violation of the league’s personal conduct policy. Last year, Ojinnaka was arrested after physically removing his wife from their house. He was charged with battery.
SAINTS – TE Jeremy Shockey has been cleared by medical personnel to return to practice in New Orleans. This comes after he suffered a seizure in the team’s weight room. Shockey will participate in the team’s mini-camp this weekend.
STEELERS – K Jeff Reed admitted Thursday that he had gone through a series of psychological evaluations similar to what Pittsburgh QB Ben Roethlisberger recently completed. Like Big Ben, the kicker’s evaluations were mandated to him by NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell.


FBGP

I know it is essentially a blog but I really do expect better editing from Gretz.

-King-
06-04-2010, 08:11 PM
FBGP

I know it is essentially a blog but I really do expect better editing from Gretz.

Holy fuck, thanks for quoting the entire fucking post. I would have no idea what you were replying to without the quote....
Posted via Mobile Device

OnTheWarpath58
06-04-2010, 08:16 PM
Im gonna be critical of Cassel until he does ANYTHING in real games to prove he deserves anything more than that.

Ill be damned if I sit here and read that he had a good day in practice and wash his ball (haha) for it. He had good days in practice last year too and then was total junk when he hit the real games.

Matt Cassel doesnt strike fear into any defensive coordinator in the NFL.

This.

We're so desperate to think we have a franchise qb that people are creaming their pants because it is being reported that he has 50/50 good days/bad days - in fucking SHORTS.

JASONSAUTO
06-04-2010, 08:47 PM
It's common sense at this point, Sauto.

There will not be a more perfectly set up situation for us to draft a franchise QB in the next five years. And we passed.

Because Cassel is the great white hope.

no its not, many other teams passed just like we did. maybe that should say more about the player than our gm
Posted via Mobile Device

JASONSAUTO
06-04-2010, 08:48 PM
It's common sense at this point, Sauto.

There will not be a more perfectly set up situation for us to draft a franchise QB in the next five years. And we passed.

Because Cassel is the great white hope.

no its not, many other teams passed just like we did. maybe that should say more about the player than our gm. MAYBE they didnt believe that clausen WAS franchise material
Posted via Mobile Device

JASONSAUTO
06-04-2010, 08:51 PM
This.

We're so desperate to think we have a franchise qb that people are creaming their pants because it is being reported that he has 50/50 good days/bad days - in fucking SHORTS.

funny, thats NOT what was said. what was said was that the GOOD OUTNUMBERS THE BAD. Where are you guys getting 50-50 from that?
Posted via Mobile Device

BossChief
06-04-2010, 08:53 PM
no its not, many other teams passed just like we did. maybe that should say more about the player than our gm
Posted via Mobile Device

Jason, passing on Clausen had everything to do with "the Cassel situation" and very little to do with Clausen.

Its a shame, but it is true.

If we drafted Clausen (even in the second round) it would be sign that Cassel was a mistake and that would give Clark an early message that Pioli isnt managing HIS money very well.

I don't think we are married to him for another 4 years, but they obviously weren't gonna admit defeat after one year.

JASONSAUTO
06-04-2010, 09:02 PM
Jason, passing on Clausen had everything to do with "the Cassel situation" and very little to do with Clausen.

Its a shame, but it is true.

If we drafted Clausen (even in the second round) it would be sign that Cassel was a mistake and that would give Clark an early message that Pioli isnt managing HIS money very well.

I don't think we are married to him for another 4 years, but they obviously weren't gonna admit defeat after one year.

no offense but could send me a tape of pioli telling you that?



otherwise you are assuming.


clausen had MANY question marks.

size
hands
could be a douche

i was on record saying i would have been cool with him even at 5 due to weis' familiarity with him. BUT passing also IMO had to do with weis' familiarity with him.
Posted via Mobile Device

OnTheWarpath58
06-04-2010, 09:09 PM
funny, thats NOT what was said. what was said was that the GOOD OUTNUMBERS THE BAD. Where are you guys getting 50-50 from that?
Posted via Mobile Device

Jesus fuck.

There's been 9 OTA's, and from what I recall, the general consensus is that he struggled most of, if not the entire first week.

So fine.

60-fucking-40.

I feel SO much better now, and last I checked, the POS is STILL doing it in fucking shorts in 7-on-7 drills, sans contact.

I don't give a flying fuck if he's been PERFECT over 9 OTA's, the point BossChief makes, still stands.

Until he does it when it matters, and IMO, do it when it matters CONSISTENTLY, he doesn't deserve the benefit of the doubt.

But feel free to keep picking any nit you can find.

DeezNutz
06-04-2010, 09:11 PM
no offense but could send me a tape of pioli telling you that?


Sure. Here's the link:

www.casselsucksdogshit.com

BossChief
06-04-2010, 09:16 PM
no offense but could send me a tape of pioli telling you that?



otherwise you are assuming.


clausen had MANY question marks.

size
hands
could be a douche

i was on record saying i would have been cool with him even at 5 due to weis' familiarity with him. BUT passing also IMO had to do with weis' familiarity with him.
Posted via Mobile Device
I made an educated guess, thats for sure.

I cant say that Pioli has said that directly to me, but I can find a link for when Gretz (our best source for Chiefs info so far since the changeover) said that he wasnt even on our board before the draft if you like (or someone else surely can, it was a bit of a big deal at the time iirc). I can also tell you that the Chiefs have said multiple times on Chiefs live that there will be no competitions for the starting qb job this training camp because "Matt Cassel is the starter". Same as last year (even though we were told otherwise according to coach speak.

What does that tell you?

It tells me that as soon as "the trade" was made that starting quarterback was crossed off THEIR list of team needs as soon as "the trade" was made. That means in my "educated assumption" Clausen wasnt ever a realistic option and if he was, he would have been selected in the second round where we could get him for very very cheap financially.

JASONSAUTO
06-04-2010, 09:25 PM
Jesus fuck.

There's been 9 OTA's, and from what I recall, the general consensus is that he struggled most of, if not the entire first week.

So fine.

60-fucking-40.

I feel SO much better now, and last I checked, the POS is STILL doing it in fucking shorts in 7-on-7 drills, sans contact.

I don't give a flying fuck if he's been PERFECT over 9 OTA's, the point BossChief makes, still stands.

Until he does it when it matters, and IMO, do it when it matters CONSISTENTLY, he doesn't deserve the benefit of the doubt.

But feel free to keep picking any nit you can find.

see theres NO reason for such hostility. none whatsoever. we can discuss this without all that. the article staes that the good outnumbers the bad, thats all we really have to go on right now.
Posted via Mobile Device

JASONSAUTO
06-04-2010, 09:27 PM
I made an educated guess, thats for sure.

I cant say that Pioli has said that directly to me, but I can find a link for when Gretz (our best source for Chiefs info so far since the changeover) said that he wasnt even on our board before the draft if you like (or someone else surely can, it was a bit of a big deal at the time iirc). I can also tell you that the Chiefs have said multiple times on Chiefs live that there will be no competitions for the starting qb job this training camp because "Matt Cassel is the starter". Same as last year (even though we were told otherwise according to coach speak.

What does that tell you?

It tells me that as soon as "the trade" was made that starting quarterback was crossed off THEIR list of team needs as soon as "the trade" was made. That means in my "educated assumption" Clausen wasnt ever a realistic option and if he was, he would have been selected in the second round where we could get him for very very cheap financially.

funny that all the haters assume that everything you said has NOTHING to do with how weis feels about clausen
Posted via Mobile Device

BossChief
06-04-2010, 09:28 PM
Here is our golden boys reports from training camp last year...we all know how that worked out.

I fucking hate kool aid.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/trainingcamp09/columns/story?columnist=clayton_john&id=4385892

I dont want to hear a fucking word about practices, I want to see him move the ball in real games and win close ones with his arm before I start supporting him and stop feeling like we are fucking ourselves for not continuing to look for our guy.

BossChief
06-04-2010, 09:34 PM
funny that all the haters assume that everything you said has NOTHING to do with how weis feels about clausen
Posted via Mobile Device

you know about all the connections between Carolina and Weis right? It wasnt a mistake he was drafted into a system that is the exact same as our current one and the one Jimmy ran in college.

I cant see that happening if Weis didn't speak up for him.

Just Passin' By
06-04-2010, 09:43 PM
funny, thats NOT what was said. what was said was that the GOOD OUTNUMBERS THE BAD. Where are you guys getting 50-50 from that?
Posted via Mobile Device

You're wasting your time.

BossChief
06-04-2010, 09:53 PM
Do I like hearing that he is doing well in practice? yes, of course I do.

Do I think him doing well in practices in June means a damn thing in relation to how he will play once the bullets start flying? nope

read that report I linked from "practice" last year if you want a feel good story that didnt end well.

milkman
06-04-2010, 09:53 PM
I read this argument over 50/50,/ he said the good days outnumber the bad and laugh.

I mean (in my best Allen Iverson imitation), we talking about practice.

OnTheWarpath58
06-04-2010, 10:19 PM
You're wasting your time.

There's not a knife in the world sharp enough to cut through the irony in this post.

He's wasting HIS time?

You don't even have a vested interest here, you don't root for the team, you could give a shit other than to troll. You have no reason at all to even BE here.

2500 posts here for no reason whatsoever other than to troll would appear that you're a bit of a hypocrite telling ANY Chiefs fan they are wasting their time on this board.

You're not only wasting YOUR time, you're wasting OUR fucking time by having to sort past your pointless fucking posts.

OnTheWarpath58
06-04-2010, 10:23 PM
I read this argument over 50/50,/ he said the good days outnumber the bad and laugh.

I mean (in my best Allen Iverson imitation), we talking about practice.

Most of the reason I've had Sauto on ignore in the past.

Instead of debating that actual point, he grasps for fucking straws.

IT CAN'T BE 50%! THERE'S BEEN NINE PRACTICES! IT'S STATISTICALLY IMPOSSIBLE! WHERE ARE YOU GUYS GETTING THIS FROM???!!!one!111ELEvenTY!111ONE

He must be 3'2", because the point went right the fuck over his head.

-King-
06-05-2010, 12:51 AM
Funny thing is that it was a Cassel hater that started this whole discussion.


Either way, we're talking about practice... not a game, not a game...practice. :shake:


Till real game starts, Cassel is still the dog shit to me that he was during last season.

Even though I think he sucks, I don't think Hamas is right in saying that we're married to cassel for 5 years much less after this year.

bigbucks24
06-05-2010, 01:42 AM
funny, thats NOT what was said. what was said was that the GOOD OUTNUMBERS THE BAD. Where are you guys getting 50-50 from that?
Posted via Mobile Device

Are you really arguing about the difference between 50/50 and 44/56? Really? That's your argument? It's not 50/50, its 44/56?

Just Passin' By
06-05-2010, 02:59 AM
There's not a knife in the world sharp enough to cut through the irony in this post.

He's wasting HIS time?

You don't even have a vested interest here, you don't root for the team, you could give a shit other than to troll. You have no reason at all to even BE here.

2500 posts here for no reason whatsoever other than to troll would appear that you're a bit of a hypocrite telling ANY Chiefs fan they are wasting their time on this board.

You're not only wasting YOUR time, you're wasting OUR ****ing time by having to sort past your pointless ****ing posts.

Disagreeing with morons such as yourself is not trolling. Then again, trying to make you grasp even the simplest of concepts has, indeed, been a waste of my time.

BarrySPAMAID
06-05-2010, 08:23 AM
I'm surprised that Donald Washington has moved to Safety. But that's what good about these articles for Chiefs fans. It gives us some perspective on all of the players on the team, and not just a few.

Not a bad piece by the Gretz I guess. Although, I'm not sure where he was headed with the Cottam comments. At one point I read his injury was career threatening. But that was at the end of the season last year. I thought he was coming back for camp, but Bob indicates he wont get clearance with out the approval of specialist.

I still like Brad Cottam if the guy can just stay healthy. But, now one wonders if he is ever going to make it back on the field.

JASONSAUTO
06-05-2010, 10:26 AM
Are you really arguing about the difference between 50/50 and 44/56? Really? That's your argument? It's not 50/50, its 44/56?

thats NOT my point.


people get what they want to get out of the article. some just get it wrong. say who gives a fuck about practice, say that the guy will suck in games, say anything, but dont make shit up. if the good days outnumber the bad thats what it is. how do you know the actual percentage? i dont either. BUT this article says the good outnumbers the bad so it CANT be 50-50

JASONSAUTO
06-05-2010, 10:35 AM
Most of the reason I've had Sauto on ignore in the past.

Instead of debating that actual point, he grasps for fucking straws.

IT CAN'T BE 50%! THERE'S BEEN NINE PRACTICES! IT'S STATISTICALLY IMPOSSIBLE! WHERE ARE YOU GUYS GETTING THIS FROM???!!!one!111ELEvenTY!111ONE

He must be 3'2", because the point went right the fuck over his head.

what IS the actual point? that it doesnt matter what happens now in shorts? ok fine. thats your opinion and you are entitled to it.


I, on the other hand, think that what is going on now DOES matter when it comes to chemistry with the receivers, something that didnt get to happen last year for various reasons.


BTW i wasnt "grasping for straws" here i just think people should at least be honest in their criticisms of the guy. i just started out correcting fish when he said that cassel sucks half of the time and thats NOT what the article said

JASONSAUTO
06-05-2010, 10:36 AM
I'm surprised that Donald Washington has moved to Safety. .

I'm not. i called either washington or carr to safety right after the draft

Mr. Laz
06-05-2010, 10:38 AM
Im gonna be critical of Cassel until he does ANYTHING in real games to prove he deserves anything more than that.

Ill be damned if I sit here and read that he had a good day in practice and wash his ball (haha) for it. He had good days in practice last year too and then was total junk when he hit the real games.

Matt Cassel doesnt strike fear into any defensive coordinator in the NFL.
but you will sure as hell jump on anything that said he had a bad day in practice

milkman
06-05-2010, 10:47 AM
what IS the actual point? that it doesnt matter what happens now in shorts? ok fine. thats your opinion and you are entitled to it.


I, on the other hand, think that what is going on now DOES matter when it comes to chemistry with the receivers, something that didnt get to happen last year for various reasons.


BTW i wasnt "grasping for straws" here i just think people should at least be honest in their criticisms of the guy. i just started out correcting fish when he said that cassel sucks half of the time and thats NOT what the article said

The problem is that there really isn't any reason to call him out on it.

I mean, in the big picture, what the hell does it matter?

It's practice.

OnTheWarpath58
06-05-2010, 10:49 AM
The problem is that there really isn't any reason to call him out on it.

I mean, in the big picture, what the hell does it matter?

It's practice.

Exactly.

It had absolutely nothing to do with the point he made.

JASONSAUTO
06-05-2010, 10:50 AM
The problem is that there really isn't any reason to call him out on it.

I mean, in the big picture, what the hell does it matter?

It's practice.


why practice if it doesnt matter?

and i guarantee that if I said something the other way like that fish and otwp would god damn sure call me on it. and they have many times before.

JASONSAUTO
06-05-2010, 10:52 AM
Exactly.

It had absolutely nothing to do with the point he made.

really? huh. he says "great our qb only sucks half the time" why make up shit to cry about?



i hope that him and the wrs bond and things continue to get better.

OnTheWarpath58
06-05-2010, 10:56 AM
Jesus Christ.

Now I know I made a mistake in taking you off of ignore.

You still would rather argue the poster rather than the post.

That, or you just REALLY struggle to understand the points being made in arguments because this is a regular thing with you - you missing the point and arguing something inconsequential is like breathing to you.

Later.

milkman
06-05-2010, 11:00 AM
why practice if it doesnt matter?

and i guarantee that if I said something the other way like that fish and otwp would god damn sure call me on it. and they have many times before.

Practice does matter.

Reaction to it doesn't.

JASONSAUTO
06-05-2010, 11:05 AM
Jesus Christ.

Now I know I made a mistake in taking you off of ignore.

You still would rather argue the poster rather than the post.

That, or you just REALLY struggle to understand the points being made in arguments because this is a regular thing with you - you missing the point and arguing something inconsequential is like breathing to you.

Later.

funny. ok what was the point? looked like it was just some bitching about something that wasnt even written to me

OnTheWarpath58
06-05-2010, 11:06 AM
Practice does matter.

Reaction to it doesn't.

C'mon, man. We need to know how these guys are performing in t-shirts and shorts so we can have some idea of how they'll play come September, in full pads, at full speed and against real competition, under real pressure.

September 13th cannot get here soon enough.

JASONSAUTO
06-05-2010, 11:08 AM
Practice does matter.

Reaction to it doesn't.

hey right now thats all we have got. and to me its nice that there seems to be some positives coming out of the practices.

so why do the usual suspects have to try to shit on every positive thing said about the guy. Its true that we wont know ANYTHING for sure until the bullets start flying BUT positive is positive, why try to put a negative spin on an article that was OBVIOUSLY written from a positive viewpoint?

JASONSAUTO
06-05-2010, 11:09 AM
C'mon, man. We need to know how these guys are performing in t-shirts and shorts so we can have some idea of how they'll play come September, in full pads, at full speed and against real competition, under real pressure.

September 13th cannot get here soon enough.

i agree about sept 13th, but if you feel that way about the articles the why did you even click on the thread to READ it?

milkman
06-05-2010, 11:53 AM
hey right now thats all we have got. and to me its nice that there seems to be some positives coming out of the practices.

so why do the usual suspects have to try to shit on every positive thing said about the guy. Its true that we wont know ANYTHING for sure until the bullets start flying BUT positive is positive, why try to put a negative spin on an article that was OBVIOUSLY written from a positive viewpoint?

Because we all look at things from own perspective.

Some are more negative, others are more positive.

The fact is, it is just practice, in shorts, with no physical contact.
He should have more good days than bad, and the fact that he's had enough bad days to even make this a discussion should be cause for concern.

But in the end, what matters is what happens when things get real.

mcaj22
06-05-2010, 12:21 PM
hey right now thats all we have got. and to me its nice that there seems to be some positives coming out of the practices.

so why do the usual suspects have to try to shit on every positive thing said about the guy. Its true that we wont know ANYTHING for sure until the bullets start flying BUT positive is positive, why try to put a negative spin on an article that was OBVIOUSLY written from a positive viewpoint?

Because a "usual suspect" can look at the body of work already presented by any player for the team they cheer for. You act like this kind of discussion only happens from Kansas City Chiefs fans. This happens from every realistic fan that cheers for a team that struggles to improve, constructional criticism will come down and fans will be hard on player(s) until said players improve, are gone, or replaced. Unless your team is a proven winning franchise every year and your only worry is how you will fare in the playoffs, but this team is far from that, and it can start with the QB, a very easy target to criticize for many examples. To be a homer at this point and try to defend or hype this guy because of a couple OTA reports in shorts and pads is just pure stupid.

Talk to me if this guy is still making crisp throws on Sundays when an actual defense is coming at him full speed and he shits his pants and holds onto the ball for too long. Until I see that, I don't blame anyone for calling it like it is when it comes to what this Chiefs roster has shown us for the most part. And let's be real, this team is going to be the same shell of guys and starters that we had for last season, there might less than 8 positions that MAYBE will have a different starter at it come this season. But for the most part we are riding the same players with the hope they improve, their was/is no roster turnover, these are the same guys that have had terrible losing seasons together. Your only homer argument at this point is "We got better coaching they can turn these guys around!" Until any fan sees these losers turn into winners, and is basically inviting this team to make them eat crow and put their foots in their mouths so they can enjoy wins on Sundays has yet to be seen. I'm sure everyone would like to be proven wrong. But to homer about OTA reports and think that this team has turned into world beaters in shorts and helmets is ****ing stupid.

BossChief
06-05-2010, 04:13 PM
but you will sure as hell jump on anything that said he had a bad day in practice BS, you just dont like me because I have been objective on this issue (since months before the trade even took place) and the truth hurts. You have been arguing the poster (in my case) for months now, most of the time ignoring entire posts to try to spin things...its whatever. I get it. You don't like me and that's ok.

I can guarantee you that if Cassel starts playing well in real action I will be the first to eat a heaping plate of crow smothered in Gates.

I just dont see that happening.

I hope to god Im wrong on this topic more so than ANY TOPIC IN CHIEFS HISTORY that Ive discussed.

If you think I am "a hater" then how do you explain my longtime stance on other players like Hali, DJ, Pollard, Dorsey, TJ, Studabaker...etc? I am much more optimistic about those guys because I have seen flashes that I havent seen from MC.

Because we all look at things from own perspective.

Some are more negative, others are more positive.

The fact is, it is just practice, in shorts, with no physical contact.
He should have more good days than bad, and the fact that he's had enough bad days to even make this a discussion should be cause for concern.

But in the end, what matters is what happens when things get real.

couldn't have said it better myself.

FUCK KOOL AID!

When there is NO PRESSURE WHATSOEVER and no chance of getting hit, he is still having days where "passes arent even close" and "another pass hits the ground" this should be the time of the year when he is showing pinpoint accuracy (if he had it) and not just occasionally looking "crisp"

Reerun_KC
06-05-2010, 04:26 PM
Im gonna be critical of Cassel until he does ANYTHING in real games to prove he deserves anything more than that.

Ill be damned if I sit here and read that he had a good day in practice and wash his ball (haha) for it. He had good days in practice last year too and then was total junk when he hit the real games.

Matt Cassel doesnt strike fear into any defensive coordinator in the NFL.

Neither does any other player on this team, Nor the Defense or the Offense as a whole...

Nothing about the Chiefs strikes fear into anyone.. Nobody fears Arrowhead or the Crowd....

what is there to be scared about? A Draftabulator?

OnTheWarpath58
06-05-2010, 04:34 PM
Neither does any other player on this team, Nor the Defense or the Offense as a whole...

Nothing about the Chiefs strikes fear into anyone.. Nobody fears Arrowhead or the Crowd....

what is there to be scared about? A Draftabulator?

I'd argue that teams are going to be "concerned" about Jamaal Charles coming into this year, and same with Bowe considering his first 2 seasons in the league.

I'd also argue for Flowers, who according to Pro Football Focus, was the 5th best CB in the league last year, and was "thrown at" 93 times, which is only 27 behind the league leader.

So basically, teams threw at him, and he did the job. I'm betting the league noticed.

If Hali could learn to play the run better than an old man in a Rascal Scooter, he'd be under consideration as well.

But yes, I get the point, and agree. There's not much on this roster that scares the opposition, and nothing that scares anyone but us at the most important position.

Marcellus
06-05-2010, 04:36 PM
Amazing. Nobody was washing Cassel's balls over the report he looks better than last year.

People are offended that you can't say things are looking up without someon bashing you over the head with the CAssel sucks mantra.

Basically it's OK to bash him and if you aren't bashing him you are washing his balls.

Most people I would venture to say know he needs to play better, want him to play better, and will be pissed if he doesn't play better this year, much better in fact. Yet most people aren't going to spend ALL their time bitching about him unless there is reason right now to be doing so.

The real division is whether a person believes he can play well enough to a playoff and SB contending QB or not.

I can say I don't know, I think it is possible and I will hope and pray like hell he does.

Why bitch incessantly about something you cannot control and will have to deal with at least until he sinks or swims at the start of this season?

Marcellus
06-05-2010, 04:41 PM
I'd argue that teams are going to be "concerned" about Jamaal Charles coming into this year, and same with Bowe considering his first 2 seasons in the league.

I'd also argue for Flowers, who according to Pro Football Focus, was the 5th best CB in the league last year, and was "thrown at" 93 times, which is only 27 behind the league leader.

So basically, teams threw at him, and he did the job. I'm betting the league noticed.

If Hali could learn to play the run better than an old man in a Rascal Scooter, he'd be under consideration as well.

But yes, I get the point, and agree. There's not much on this roster that scares the opposition, and nothing that scares anyone but us at the most important position.

I would argue out of 32 teams there are only a handful of QB's that give DC's nightmares.

Most teams cause issues with overall talent. Very few QB's carry their teams anymore even though it is a passing league now.

BossChief
06-05-2010, 04:50 PM
I would argue out of 32 teams there are only a handful of QB's that give DC's nightmares.

Most teams cause issues with overall talent. Very few QB's carry their teams anymore even though it is a passing league now.

Sorry man, but about half the qbs in the league fit that description.

Favre
Rivers
Rodgers
Romo
McNabb
Flacco
Brady
Shaub
Manning
Manning
Young
Rothlisberger
Brees
Palmer

I dont think there is a single part of Matts game that a opposing DC has to game plan to try to take away because it can beat them.

I think Cassel may very well be our worst offensive starter to open the year in 2010 (right tackle and center are close though)

"The most important position in pro sports"

I may be wrong, but I think this could be a playoff team with any of those quarterbacks on our roster.

Marcellus
06-05-2010, 04:56 PM
Sorry man, but about half the qbs in the league fit that description.

Favre
Rivers
Rodgers
Romo
McNabb
Flacco
Brady
Shaub
Manning
Manning
Young
Rothlisberger
Brees
Palmer

I dont think there is a single part of Matts game that a opposing DC has to game plan to try to take away because it can beat them.

I think Cassel may very well be our worst offensive starter to open the year in 2010 (right tackle and center are close though)

"The most important position in pro sports"

I may be wrong, but I think this could be a playoff team with any of those quarterbacks on our roster.

BS. Flacco? Give me a break. Palmer? Not the last few years, not even close.
Shaub keeps DC's up all night?

McNabb is such a threat they traded him within the division. I would actually put him on the list of guys who can carry a team though I guess we will see this year.

Your list includes alot of good and even really good QB's, there are only a few great ones on that list than can carry a team. You take Whitten off Dallas and see what Romo plays like.

You are taking into account the offensive weapons those QB's have, not just teh QB's pure talent.

OnTheWarpath58
06-05-2010, 04:57 PM
Sorry man, but about half the qbs in the league fit that description.

Favre
Rivers
Rodgers
Romo
McNabb
Flacco
Brady
Shaub
Manning
Manning
Young
Rothlisberger
Brees
Palmer

I dont think there is a single part of Matts game that a opposing DC has to game plan to try to take away because it can beat them.

I think Cassel may very well be our worst offensive starter to open the year in 2010 (right tackle and center are close though)

"The most important position in pro sports"

I may be wrong, but I think this could be a playoff team with any of those quarterbacks on our roster.

I'd probably take VY off that list until he has one full, solid year - and I'd have to pull Carson Palmer until he shows that knee injury is behind him.

Otherwise, I think you're pretty dead on that those guys give DC's fits when it comes to game-planning. They all have natural talent, leadership abilities and know how to take advantage of coverages.

And I agree with everything else in that post as well.

Marcellus
06-05-2010, 04:59 PM
I'd probably take VY off that list until he has one full, solid year - and I'd have to pull Carson Palmer until he shows that knee injury is behind him.

Otherwise, I think you're pretty dead on that those guys give DC's fits when it comes to game-planning. They all have natural talent, leadership abilities and know how to take advantage of coverages.

And I agree with everything else in that post as well.

You think we are a potential playoff team with a different QB?

BossChief
06-05-2010, 05:06 PM
I'd probably take VY off that list until he has one full, solid year - and I'd have to pull Carson Palmer until he shows that knee injury is behind him.

Otherwise, I think you're pretty dead on that those guys give DC's fits when it comes to game-planning. They all have natural talent, leadership abilities and know how to take advantage of coverages.

And I agree with everything else in that post as well.
Young is very very underrated on this board.

He single handedly has won games in the clutch with his god given ability more so than about any other qb on that list IMO. The Titans are a losing franchise without him since he has been drafted and he is still learning. that team wasnt about to win a damn thing and looked completely lost, then Vince got on the field and they couldn't be beat. He did the same thing his rookie year...the kid has "it" and is a winner.

I threw in Palmer because of how he played last year once healthy. If it werent for the injuries, he might be looked at in the same light as Peyton...or at least a more talented Shaub. I wonder how he would have done if he was drafted onto a good team.

OnTheWarpath58
06-05-2010, 05:21 PM
You think we are a potential playoff team with a different QB?

With this schedule, potentially, and honestly, likely - depending on the QB.

We'd be a one-and-done at best, IMO but I think we could get there.

Hell, even WITH that shitbucket we have at QB, there's no reason not to win 7 or 8 games this year. The schedule is THAT easy.

OnTheWarpath58
06-05-2010, 05:24 PM
Young is very very underrated on this board.

He single handedly has won games in the clutch with his god given ability more so than about any other qb on that list IMO. The Titans are a losing franchise without him since he has been drafted and he is still learning. that team wasnt about to win a damn thing and looked completely lost, then Vince got on the field and they couldn't be beat. He did the same thing his rookie year...the kid has "it" and is a winner.

I threw in Palmer because of how he played last year once healthy. If it werent for the injuries, he might be looked at in the same light as Peyton...or at least a more talented Shaub. I wonder how he would have done if he was drafted onto a good team.

I'm in the minority when it comes to people saying VY had a good rookie year, awards and all be damned.

They won games that year on defense alone.

I remember a game against Jacksonville where Tennessee actually won, even though they had something like 90 total yards. The defense had like 2 pick-sixes and possibly a kick or punt return for a TD.

There were a lot of games like that, but it was overlooked, because VY was a high pick, people thought he was the shit in college (1st read or run, anyone) and they won 8 games. (IIRC)

BossChief
06-05-2010, 05:31 PM
We have two 1000 yard receivers, an electric slot guy, an electric running back, a good goal line back, a much improved line and (if they can get healthy) a good tight end corps. That offense could be pretty good if we had the guy to put it all together from the quarterback position.

We would still struggle to stop the run, but our pass defense has a chance at being pretty damn good and take the ball away a lot.

I think we would be in the playoff hunt toward the end of the year with about any of those guys I listed and would find a way to get in.

As OTW said though, without the ability to consistently stop the running attack of opposing teams, we would be embarrassed once there.

JASONSAUTO
06-05-2010, 05:34 PM
i wonder if anyone was bashing cassel in the threads about him not looking so good the first couple of otas. i cant find posts on my phone, but if so was any of these same people telling them it was ONLY practice and didnt matter? otwp? bosschief? anyone??
Posted via Mobile Device

OnTheWarpath58
06-05-2010, 05:37 PM
I'm in the minority when it comes to people saying VY had a good rookie year, awards and all be damned.

They won games that year on defense alone.

I remember a game against Jacksonville where Tennessee actually won, even though they had something like 90 total yards. The defense had like 2 pick-sixes and possibly a kick or punt return for a TD.

There were a lot of games like that, but it was overlooked, because VY was a high pick, people thought he was the shit in college (1st read or run, anyone) and they won 8 games. (IIRC)

I just looked up his rookie stats:

He was Offensive Rookie of the Year completing 51% of his passes, throwing for 146 yards per game, throwing 12 TD's and 13 INT's and had a QB rating of 66.

Basically, he was named Rookie of the Year for having Matt Cassel's 2009 stats.

He was given a pass because he ran for 500 yards and scored 7 rushing TD's - because he can't read a defense.

He's yet to prove he can be a QB in this league, all he's proven is that he can be a gimmick. Just like college, if the first read isn't there, pull the ball down and run. Nevermind the kid has fumbled 32 times in 45 games.

If you look at his QB stats the following 3 years, he's not gotten even marginally better, with the exception of passing yardage per game. And that's even a small increase. EDIT: The only legit improvement he's made is in completion percentage, which has yet to fall under 58% since his rookie year.

He's going to have to continue to do better, because teams aren't letting him run like they did in 2006. His rushing yardage for his other three years combined is not much higher than his total for 2006.

OnTheWarpath58
06-05-2010, 05:42 PM
i wonder if anyone was bashing cassel in the threads about him not looking so good the first couple of otas. i cant find posts on my phone, but if so was any of these same people telling them it was ONLY practice and didnt matter? otwp? bosschief? anyone??
Posted via Mobile Device

I've mostly held this stance my entire time on this board, if you've paid any attention.

Anyway, from this thread, about a QB that everyone knew I wanted to draft:

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=228789

Depth charts mean nothing at this point.

And I'd say the same if he were "starting."

And I've made the same point before.

Make sure you read the OP to understand the context. I think it's fair to say that Clausen played well in Carolina's OTA's for them to move him up to #2.

My point? It doesn't matter if he played well NOW.

I'm sure you'll find a way to miss the point entirely, once again.

Please, PLEASE surprise me for once.

OnTheWarpath58
06-05-2010, 05:49 PM
We have two 1000 yard receivers, an electric slot guy, an electric running back, a good goal line back, a much improved line and (if they can get healthy) a good tight end corps. That offense could be pretty good if we had the guy to put it all together from the quarterback position.

Hold on.

Two 1000 yard WR's? Check.

Electric slot guy? You HOPE we do.

Electric RB? You HOPE we do. IMO, he will prove to be, but I'm a bit concerned that he did what he did against 5 run defenses ranked 26th and lower. He's not a sure thing, but he's kind of in that "hope" basket as well.

Good goal line back? Again, you HOPE so. He ran behind one of, if not the best OL in the NFL last year. I hope he works out as well, but he's got to have some blocking, which leads to...

A much improved line. Again, HOPE. Weigmann is old and undersized and Lilja is not a very good run blocker. Add in that someone is going to play out of position (Lilja and Waters are LG's, Asomoah is a natural RG) and I don't think we can be sure of anything regarding the OL.

Good TE corp? Cottam and Moeaki have talent, but again, you have to HOPE they realize it, which mean you have to HOPE they stay healthy.

So basically, we have two 1000 yard WR's, and a lot of positions we HOPE are improved over last year.

BossChief
06-05-2010, 05:50 PM
OTW, you have to watch the games (no offense) to know that he won about half of his rookie games on runs in the last 2 minutes of the game and took his team on his back in those games and won them and brought his team to the playoffs.

The statement that they won on defense alone is not at all right.

Stats dont mean shit in some cases, in his you should look at the teams win loss record with/without him playing. Its not a coincidence that the team wins games (which is the most important stat for a qb) when he plays and struggles mightily when he doesn't (outside of a short stretch when Collins played well).

People forget how bad that Titans team was before the owner demanded Young starts.

JASONSAUTO
06-05-2010, 05:58 PM
I've mostly held this stance my entire time on this board, if you've paid any attention.

Anyway, from this thread, about a QB that everyone knew I wanted to draft:

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=228789



Make sure you read the OP to understand the context. I think it's fair to say that Clausen played well in Carolina's OTA's for them to move him up to #2.

My point? It doesn't matter if he played well NOW.

I'm sure you'll find a way to miss the point entirely, once again.

Please, PLEASE surprise me for once.

ok i saw that thread before. BUT you missed my point. again in the threads where the article said cassel was practicing badly did you tell the bashers it didnt mean much because it was practice? im betting not
Posted via Mobile Device

BossChief
06-05-2010, 06:06 PM
How can someone say Vince hasnt gotten better when his passing numbers last year were very respectable for a qb that is as mobile as Vince is?

09

8-2 as starter
83 passer rating
10td/7int
2.7 int rate
Probowler after only 10 starts

Career win loss 26-13

OnTheWarpath58
06-05-2010, 06:08 PM
ok i saw that thread before. BUT you missed my point. again in the threads where the article said cassel was practicing badly did you tell the bashers it didnt mean much because it was practice? im betting not
Posted via Mobile Device

Why mention it at all?

One, it's practice.

Two, it's the expected result.

We've come full-circle to the original point being made by Boss:

There's no reason to defend the guy until he proves he can do it when the bullets are flying for real.

Doing this:

did you tell the bashers it didnt mean much because it was practice? im betting not

I'm pretty sure that would qualify as defending him.

salame
06-05-2010, 06:08 PM
A good tight end corps?

ottam college stats
Brad Cottam #87 TE

CAREER STATS
RECEPTIONS YDS TOUCHDOWNS
21 341 1


Moeaki
Tony Moeaki #81 TE
CAREER STATS
RECEPTIONS YDS TOUCHDOWNS
76 953 11


why is everyone so excited about these guys again?

OnTheWarpath58
06-05-2010, 06:10 PM
How can someone say Vince hasnt gotten better when his passing numbers last year were very respectable for a qb that is as mobile as Vince is?

09

8-2 as starter
83 passer rating
10td/7int
2.7 int rate
Probowler after only 10 starts

Career win loss 26-13

I mis-read his stat-line for last year and stand corrected. My mistake.

Still not great, but improved. And he made the PB because something like 7 guys backed out.

BossChief
06-05-2010, 06:17 PM
A good tight end corps?

ottam college stats
Brad Cottam #87 TE

CAREER STATS
RECEPTIONS YDS TOUCHDOWNS
21 341 1


Moeaki
Tony Moeaki #81 TE
CAREER STATS
RECEPTIONS YDS TOUCHDOWNS
76 953 11


why is everyone so excited about these guys again?

Im not gonna speak for Cottam, I think his career is likely over and have said so for quite awhile. I think that is the real reason we continue to look for tight ends. If he plays again, I would be shocked if that is during the upcoming season...I smell pup and ir.

Moeaki is a player that does everything good (when healthy).

He finds to open spot in zones with perfection
He blocks very well and can seal the edge
He gets open and makes the catch in clutch situations
He hugs the sideline and keeps his feet in bounds to make the catch count
He plays best in the biggest games.
he uses his body to his advantage to shield defenders from the ball
Tony Moeaki is a guy that was born to be a football player and more specifically a tight end in this system in which it seems his strengths fit what will be asked of him to a tee.

I just hope the kid finds a way to stay on the field at one point.

BossChief
06-05-2010, 06:24 PM
I mis-read his stat-line for last year and stand corrected. My mistake.

Still not great, but improved. And he made the PB because something like 7 guys backed out.

The better the kid gets as a passer, the more his elusiveness/speed on the run will become lethal.

The kid is a winner and is past the part of his career where he had to adjust (mentally, physically and emotionally) for having to deal with all the pressure that position and the money it brings. I think he showed last year that he is improving as a passer and the more that is the case, the more of a chance this kid is gonna have to become a superstar IMO.

JASONSAUTO
06-05-2010, 06:29 PM
Why mention it at all?

One, it's practice.

Two, it's the expected result.

We've come full-circle to the original point being made by Boss:

There's no reason to defend the guy until he proves he can do it when the bullets are flying for real.

Doing this:



I'm pretty sure that would qualify as defending him.

ok so its ok to bash him over practice but not to be happy over practice. got it. ill remember that.
Posted via Mobile Device

salame
06-05-2010, 06:30 PM
Im not gonna speak for Cottam, I think his career is likely over and have said so for quite awhile. I think that is the real reason we continue to look for tight ends. If he plays again, I would be shocked if that is during the upcoming season...I smell pup and ir.

Moeaki is a player that does everything good (when healthy).

He finds to open spot in zones with perfection
He blocks very well and can seal the edge
He gets open and makes the catch in clutch situations
He hugs the sideline and keeps his feet in bounds to make the catch count
He plays best in the biggest games.
he uses his body to his advantage to shield defenders from the ball
Tony Moeaki is a guy that was born to be a football player and more specifically a tight end in this system in which it seems his strengths fit what will be asked of him to a tee.

I just hope the kid finds a way to stay on the field at one point.

There were better tight ends in the draft taken after him

BossChief
06-05-2010, 06:33 PM
ok so its ok to bash him over practice but not to be happy over practice. got it. ill remember that.
Posted via Mobile Device

I dont think ANYONE is saying they arent happy to hear he is having some good practices...its just that we heard the EXACT SAME THING last year....then the games started and he turned back into junk.

Seriously, read some camp reports from last year...he was all world till the games started.

I like ya man, its good to try to have a positive outlook, but not at the expense of objectivity.

BossChief
06-05-2010, 06:36 PM
There were better tight ends in the draft taken after him

No, there weren't.

Just for the sake of conversation though, who are these "better tight ends" you speak of?

Keep in mind what this scheme asks of its tight ends before you continue.

mcaj22
06-05-2010, 06:38 PM
Im not gonna speak for Cottam, I think his career is likely over and have said so for quite awhile. I think that is the real reason we continue to look for tight ends. If he plays again, I would be shocked if that is during the upcoming season...I smell pup and ir.

Moeaki is a player that does everything good (when healthy).

He finds to open spot in zones with perfection
He blocks very well and can seal the edge
He gets open and makes the catch in clutch situations
He hugs the sideline and keeps his feet in bounds to make the catch count
He plays best in the biggest games.
he uses his body to his advantage to shield defenders from the ball
Tony Moeaki is a guy that was born to be a football player and more specifically a tight end in this system in which it seems his strengths fit what will be asked of him to a tee.

I just hope the kid finds a way to stay on the field at one point.

This dude is so overrated and hyped on this board and he hasn't even seen the field yet. He is so injury prone that he is out with an injury that nobody even has a clue what or why he is not practicing, but we do for everyone else that is rehabbing on the roster. Imagine that.

People act like this guy was our first round pick this year.

salame
06-05-2010, 06:44 PM
I dont think ANYONE is saying they arent happy to hear he is having some good practices...its just that we heard the EXACT SAME THING last year....then the games started and he turned back into junk.

Seriously, read some camp reports from last year...he was all world till the games started.

I like ya man, its good to try to have a positive outlook, but not at the expense of objectivity.


I like you man but you are a HUGE homer
I know your man love for Moeaki stems from Iowa and that's cool. I love Jamaal Charles and Vince Young Ricky Williams etc from being a Texas fan, and I too am prone to homerisms, but not to the extent of saying our TE's are great because we added someone who is ALWAYS hurt and isn't even practicing because of a mystery injury.
As to what TE's would fit our scheme that are better and drafted later than moeaki
Dennis Pitta, Aaron Hernandez, Anthony McCoy,

OnTheWarpath58
06-05-2010, 06:53 PM
ok so its ok to bash him over practice but not to be happy over practice. got it. ill remember that.
Posted via Mobile Device

:facepalm:

Someone else PLEASE step in here.

Am I doing a poor job of explaining this, or is Sauto just a fucking dolt?

salame
06-05-2010, 06:56 PM
:facepalm:

Someone else PLEASE step in here.

Am I doing a poor job of explaining this, or is Sauto just a ****ing dolt?

I'll let AI explain it




<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/frsId3goYYE&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/frsId3goYYE&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

BossChief
06-05-2010, 06:59 PM
I like you man but you are a HUGE homer
I know your man love for Moeaki stems from Iowa and that's cool. I love Jamaal Charles and Vince Young Ricky Williams etc from being a Texas fan, and I too am prone to homerisms, but not to the extent of saying our TE's are great because we added someone who is ALWAYS hurt and isn't even practicing because of a mystery injury.
As to what TE's would fit our scheme that are better and drafted later than moeaki
Dennis Pitta, Aaron Hernandez, Anthony McCoy,
I never said our tight ends are great. Not once. Ever.

"a much improved line and (if they can get healthy) a good tight end corps."

...is what I actually said.

Not very good
Not great

good

And IMO none of those three you listed are as good as Moeaki. Ive said it before and Ill say it again...Kirk Ferentz has said that Moeaki is the best tight end he has coached and that is pretty high praise for a guy that coached Dallas Clark.

I just fear his only detractor (injury history of keeping him off the field) going into the draft doesnt continue to effect his pro career because if it doesnt, he can be a weapon in the run game and pass game.

If that statement makes me a HUGE homer, so be it.

JASONSAUTO
06-05-2010, 07:01 PM
:facepalm:

Someone else PLEASE step in here.

Am I doing a poor job of explaining this, or is Sauto just a fucking dolt?

im starting to believe that you dont comprehend things nearly as good as you think you do.

ok here it is again


he has bad practices. people bash. no otwp to remind them its "just practice in shorts and means nothing"

good, positive article? people are happy and here comes otwp to make sure everyone knows that its only practice wait for the games.


ok got it.
Posted via Mobile Device

JASONSAUTO
06-05-2010, 07:03 PM
I dont think ANYONE is saying they arent happy to hear he is having some good practices...its just that we heard the EXACT SAME THING last year....then the games started and he turned back into junk.

Seriously, read some camp reports from last year...he was all world till the games started.

I like ya man, its good to try to have a positive outlook, but not at the expense of objectivity.

sorry but this article says that it was more bad than good last year
Posted via Mobile Device

BossChief
06-05-2010, 07:03 PM
im starting to believe that you dont comprehend things nearly as good as you think you do.

ok here it is again


he has bad practices. people bash. no otwp to remind them its "just practice in shorts and means nothing"

good, positive article? people are happy and here comes otwp to make sure everyone knows that its only practice wait for the games.


ok got it.
Posted via Mobile Device
I was the one that said that.

Am I about to be called a hater and homer within minutes in the same thread?

salame
06-05-2010, 07:05 PM
I never said our tight ends are great. Not once. Ever.

"a much improved line and (if they can get healthy) a good tight end corps."

...is what I actually said.

Not very good
Not great

good

And IMO none of those three you listed are as good as Moeaki. Ive said it before and Ill say it again...Kirk Ferentz has said that Moeaki is the best tight end he has coached and that is pretty high praise for a guy that coached Dallas Clark.

I just fear his only detractor (injury history of keeping him off the field) going into the draft doesnt continue to effect his pro career because if it doesnt, he can be a weapon in the run game and pass game.

If that statement makes me a HUGE homer, so be it.

I hope you're right

BossChief
06-05-2010, 07:07 PM
I hope you're right

Me2

:toast:

milkman
06-05-2010, 07:22 PM
No, there weren't.

Just for the sake of conversation though, who are these "better tight ends" you speak of?

Keep in mind what this scheme asks of its tight ends before you continue.

An athletic TE with good, even great hands can be taught to block.

You only have to look at TG to see that.

Any TE that fits that descriprtion is a better TE for this team than one that can't stay on the field.

milkman
06-05-2010, 07:24 PM
ok i saw that thread before. BUT you missed my point. again in the threads where the article said cassel was practicing badly did you tell the bashers it didnt mean much because it was practice? im betting not
Posted via Mobile Device

He wasn't bashing Cassel.

He was bashing people who are making a big deal out of the reports that Cassel is having more good days than bad.

BossChief
06-05-2010, 07:28 PM
An athletic TE with good, even great hands can be taught to block.

You only have to look at TG to see that.

Any TE that fits that descriprtion is a better TE for this team than one that can't stay on the field.
I agree, its not even a discussion (as long as said player has a good enough work ethic that allows him to work in the weight room and field long enough to improve) but at this point Moeaki hasnt missed any games...if he does, thats a different story.

He comes in as a good blocker with good hands, so he can only improve (again, if he can get and stay healthy.)

Just listen to AI after he missed a practice or two...

milkman
06-05-2010, 07:32 PM
I agree, its not even a discussion (as long as said player has a good enough work ethic that allows him to work in the weight room and field long enough to improve) but at this point Moeaki hasnt missed any games...if he does, thats a different story.

He comes in as a good blocker with good hands, so he can only improve (again, if he can get and stay healthy.)

Just listen to AI after he missed a practice or two...

It was a stupid pick.
It was made even more stupid by the fact that we traded up to take him.

He hasn't ever proven he can stay on the field.

You're an Iowa homer, so you can't see it.
But that's what it is.

-King-
06-05-2010, 07:34 PM
To reiterate Milkman's post <object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/eGDBR2L5kzI&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/eGDBR2L5kzI&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

BossChief
06-05-2010, 07:37 PM
It was a stupid pick.
It was made even more stupid by the fact that we traded up to take him.

He hasn't ever proven he can stay on the field.

You're an Iowa homer, so you can't see it.
But that's what it is.

Im glad we got him, but being an Iowa homer doesnt mean I throw out everything to back an Iowa player. I took Moeaki in the mock CP draft as a compensatory 5th rounder (for Atlanta to play behind Tony and learn to prepare his body for the NFL) so I think that shows where I think the value lies in the player.

Ive also said a few times how I think we spent too much to get him, but am ok with it as long as he is used properly.

I hope he proves you (and many others) wrong.

salame
06-05-2010, 07:49 PM
To reiterate Milkman's post <object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/eGDBR2L5kzI&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/eGDBR2L5kzI&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

I posted this 1 page earlier lol

-King-
06-05-2010, 07:56 PM
I posted this 1 page earlier lol

Oh fuck me! :cuss::cuss:

Sweet Daddy Hate
06-06-2010, 06:24 PM
That's a painful mindset to have for the franchise you love. Thinking that the most important position on the field is being held by a guy you know isn't a franchise piece.

And 40 fucking years. Seriously. When is it OK to finally lose patience? 50? 60 years? :banghead:

All I want is a franchise QB...

Rep.

no its not, many other teams passed just like we did. maybe that should say more about the player than our gm
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I hope you're right, Sauto. I really do.

BS. Flacco? Give me a break.

Proof-positive that you are a QB Moran, and should not discuss this topic.

salame
06-06-2010, 06:35 PM
No Flacco love?

Sweet Daddy Hate
06-06-2010, 06:41 PM
No Flacco love?

If she's good with her mouth, it's usually not a problem.

BossChief
06-06-2010, 07:03 PM
I think Flacco is gonna knock it out of the park this year with the skill position players he had at his disposal.

salame
06-06-2010, 07:05 PM
I think Flacco is gonna knock it out of the park this year with the skill position players he had at his disposal.

Boldin will make him look great

BossChief
06-06-2010, 07:14 PM
Boldin will make him look great

Dont forget about Stallworth...and Oher starting out as the left tackle...the TEs going to them in the draft...progression of Flacco...Solid running game...defense that should be playing with a sense of urgency all year because of age/window of players like Lewis, Reed, Gregg, Pryce and a few of the offensive guys approaching that time too like Birk, Mason and Heap. If they can make players out of the Fridge 2 and Kindle, they can really do some things this year.

salame
06-07-2010, 07:36 AM
Dont forget about Stallworth...and Oher starting out as the left tackle...the TEs going to them in the draft...progression of Flacco...Solid running game...defense that should be playing with a sense of urgency all year because of age/window of players like Lewis, Reed, Gregg, Pryce and a few of the offensive guys approaching that time too like Birk, Mason and Heap. If they can make players out of the Fridge 2 and Kindle, they can really do some things this year.

Stallworth always ALWAYS disappoints every team he is on. I refuse to acknowledge his existence. Plus he killed a guy and payed off his family. I hate him now but I used to like him.

BossChief
06-07-2010, 12:59 PM
Stallworth always ALWAYS disappoints every team he is on. I refuse to acknowledge his existence. Plus he killed a guy and payed off his family. I hate him now but I used to like him.

I think he kills it (no pun intended, but one was made none the less) out of the slot this year with Derrick Mason and Boldin taking the better coverage guys from opposing teams and him getting good matchups...thats if everyone stays healthy of course.