PDA

View Full Version : Computers WWDC 2010


The Rick
06-07-2010, 11:36 AM
Since there are at least a few Apple guys here (AustinChief not included :) ), I thought I'd start a thread to discuss today's keynote speech.

Today is the start of Apple's annual developer conference and the keynote by Steve Jobs kicks off at noon CDT. Lots of rumored announcements such as a new iPhone, more details on iPhone OS 4.0, big Safari browser upgrade, possible cloud-based iTunes streaming, etc.

I'm hopeful for some great announcements...

NewChief
06-07-2010, 11:40 AM
I'm holding off on an iPhone until I find out what's coming down the pipe. I'll either be getting a discounted 3GS or a new one, depending on what we find out.

DMAC
06-07-2010, 11:40 AM
There better be naked dancing girls.

NewChief
06-07-2010, 12:45 PM
Evidently the network crashed during Steve's demo, and he's pissed.

ROFL

Phone looks sweet, though.

The Rick
06-07-2010, 12:48 PM
Netflix app coming to iPhone was mentioned earlier...

NewChief
06-07-2010, 12:48 PM
Netflix app coming to iPhone was mentioned earlier...

Display is sick. Super sick.

The Rick
06-07-2010, 12:49 PM
New iPhone display has 960x640 resolution with 326 ppi (the human eye can only see up to 300 ppi). Also 800:1 contrast ratio.

The Rick
06-07-2010, 12:49 PM
Display is sick. Super sick.

Yup. :clap:

The Rick
06-07-2010, 12:50 PM
New Apple A4 processor. Small, so bigger battery.

"40% more talk time. 7 hours talk time. 6 hours of 3G browsing, 10 hours of WiFi browsing, 10 hours of video. 40 hours of music. 300 hours of standby."

NewChief
06-07-2010, 12:54 PM
Gyroscope. Schweet.

NewChief
06-07-2010, 12:55 PM
About to detail the "new" camera system.

The Rick
06-07-2010, 12:55 PM
5 megapixel camera with flash

DMAC
06-07-2010, 12:55 PM
This thing is crazy.

The Rick
06-07-2010, 12:55 PM
5x digital zoom in camera app and tap to focus with LED flash.

NewChief
06-07-2010, 12:56 PM
Heh. Suck it haters.

The Rick
06-07-2010, 12:56 PM
Camera records HD video!

The Rick
06-07-2010, 12:57 PM
720p at 30fps.

KCFalcon59
06-07-2010, 12:57 PM
So far I like it. And my contract is up and I can upgrade!!!!!

HC_Chief
06-07-2010, 12:57 PM
Increased battery life, LED flash, 5Mp camera w/ HD vid = best items so far

The Rick
06-07-2010, 12:58 PM
iMovie for iPhone

NewChief
06-07-2010, 12:58 PM
iMovie for the iPhone. WTF?

Param
06-07-2010, 12:58 PM
Increased battery life, LED flash, 5Mp camera w/ HD vid = best items so far

wifi-n

SOLD!

The Rick
06-07-2010, 12:59 PM
So far I like it. And my contract is up and I can upgrade!!!!!

Me too. Definitely going to upgrade...and they haven't even talked about the front facing video camera for videoconferencing yet! :)

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:00 PM
iMovie for the iPhone. WTF?

I'm a little skeptical, but I'll reserve judgement for now...

NewChief
06-07-2010, 01:01 PM
I'm a little skeptical, but I'll reserve judgement for now...

This is going to be the citizen journalist's best friend if it works worth a shit.

Param
06-07-2010, 01:03 PM
i want I want IIII WANNNNNTTTT....!!!!! And yes, eligible for an upgrade!

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:03 PM
This is going to be the citizen journalist's best friend if it works worth a shit.
So far, everyone seems to be saying "impressive".

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:04 PM
HA!

"Isn't that awesome?" iMovie for iPhone will be available for $4.99 "If we approve it," quips Steve.

KCFalcon59
06-07-2010, 01:06 PM
I am seriously impressed. Getting excited. Tell me when it will be available!!!

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:06 PM
I am seriously impressed. Getting excited. Tell me when it will be available!!!
Some have rumored that it will be available...today!

My guess is end of this month though.

KCFalcon59
06-07-2010, 01:08 PM
Some have rumored that it will be available...today!

My guess is end of this month though.

That is what I expect. That's fine though.

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:10 PM
For what it's worth, iPhone OS has been renamed to iOS. Makes sense given i-P-a-d and the rumored new Apple TV.

Buck
06-07-2010, 01:12 PM
Is this the same phone that was found in a bar a few months ago?

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:13 PM
Is this the same phone that was found in a bar a few months ago?
Yes, looks like it.

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:15 PM
Microsoft's Bing now added as a 3rd search engine (Google and Yahoo are the others). Kind of interesting...

KCFalcon59
06-07-2010, 01:16 PM
Microsoft's Bing now added as a 3rd search engine (Google and Yahoo are the others). Kind of interesting...

Even a compliment to microsoft. wow.

KCFalcon59
06-07-2010, 01:18 PM
Is number 8 Verizon???

NewChief
06-07-2010, 01:21 PM
If you can share notes in the .pdf viewer.... that would be huge for education.

Param
06-07-2010, 01:22 PM
Microsoft's Bing now added as a 3rd search engine (Google and Yahoo are the others). Kind of interesting...

porn and bing travel. I like!:clap:

KCFalcon59
06-07-2010, 01:23 PM
Is number 8 Verizon???

nope. fucking ads. last thing I want on my phone. oh well.

NewChief
06-07-2010, 01:23 PM
iAds.... NooooOooooOooooo

Spam has come to the iPhone. heh.

NewChief
06-07-2010, 01:24 PM
nope. ****ing ads. last thing I want on my phone. oh well.

I agree, but it actually may help developers monetize their products and also offer more free products that would, instead, be supported with ads vs. buying them.

KCFalcon59
06-07-2010, 01:24 PM
iAds.... NooooOooooOooooo

Spam has come to the iPhone. heh.

iSpam!

Param
06-07-2010, 01:24 PM
Is number 8 Verizon???

I'm gonna guess ichat?

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:24 PM
iAds.... NooooOooooOooooo

Spam has come to the iPhone. heh.
If they're non intrusive, and keep the cost of apps down, it's OK I suppose.

Param
06-07-2010, 01:25 PM
nope. fucking ads. last thing I want on my phone. oh well.

that suxs, would've liked to hear about the forward facing camera

NewChief
06-07-2010, 01:25 PM
If they're non intrusive, and keep the cost of apps down, it's OK I suppose.

Yeah. Post #42, I said the same more or less, heh.

KCFalcon59
06-07-2010, 01:25 PM
I agree, but it actually may help developers monetize their products and also offer more free products that would, instead, be supported with ads vs. buying them.


I understand. Makes sense. i can live with it. I just hate ads.

NewChief
06-07-2010, 01:25 PM
Is this Apple trying to get into the google game through selling of ads?

Competing with adsense?

Param
06-07-2010, 01:27 PM
Is this Apple trying to get into the google game through selling of ads?

New revenue stream and more control over their devices. So, yes...

NewChief
06-07-2010, 01:27 PM
ROFL.

I'm sure Nissan was real hesitant to have you advertise their new electric car for them at WWDC.

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:28 PM
that suxs, would've liked to hear about the forward facing camera
Surely they're going to address it, right? I mean, they already briefly mentioned it when talking about the new iPhone hardware...

Buck
06-07-2010, 01:31 PM
So no verizon?

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:32 PM
Sweet...Steve's classic "one more thing" is coming!

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:32 PM
Here it is...video conferencing!

Cave Johnson
06-07-2010, 01:34 PM
I want a release date, dammit.

NewChief
06-07-2010, 01:34 PM
Boom. There it is.

88TG88
06-07-2010, 01:34 PM
oh snap

Param
06-07-2010, 01:34 PM
Surely they're going to address it, right? I mean, they already briefly mentioned it when talking about the new iPhone hardware...



I hope so, I'm ready to phone cyber. imovie and HD video camera is gonna rock! amature pron making movies FTW!

NewChief
06-07-2010, 01:35 PM
Haha. Froze up during videoconferencing.

KCFalcon59
06-07-2010, 01:35 PM
Boobies in real time!!!!!!

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:36 PM
Good take by Jason Snell of Macworld:

Here's Apple in a nutshell. The Sprint EVO Android phone ships with a front-facing camera but I believe there's no software for it yet. Apple doesn't do stuff like that. If there's a front-facing camera, there's software to use it.

Buck
06-07-2010, 01:36 PM
Is this on TV?

Param
06-07-2010, 01:37 PM
http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2010/06/apple-wwdc-2010-348-rm-eng.jpg

The future is now!!!!!

88TG88
06-07-2010, 01:37 PM
Boobies in real time!!!!!!

I hadn't even thought of that. I can see tittays anytime w00t.

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:37 PM
So video chat is called "FaceTime". Wi-Fi only for now...they're working with cell companies. iPhone 4 to iPhone 4 only too.

KCFalcon59
06-07-2010, 01:39 PM
Coooooooooooooooooooooooooooool

Param
06-07-2010, 01:39 PM
So video chat is called "FaceTime". Wi-Fi only for now...they're working with cell companies. iPhone 4 to iPhone 4 only too.

I think this is why AT&T chopped up their data plans from unlimited.

NewChief
06-07-2010, 01:40 PM
Damn... can flip the image to the rear camera while in a call. Bad fucking ass.

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:40 PM
I think this is why AT&T chopped up their data plans from unlimited.

Probably a good guess!

NewChief
06-07-2010, 01:40 PM
I want to see this commercial for Facetime. Evidently it's pretty powerful and intense.

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:40 PM
The best thing about FaceTime..."Apple is going to try to make it an open standard so that other devicemakers can build it in as well".

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:41 PM
iPhone 4 comes in black and white. With the normal qualifications, two year contract, $199 16GB, same price as 3GS, $299 for the 32GB.

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:41 PM
AT&T is going to make "an incredibly generous upgrade offer." If your contract expires any time in 2010, you're immediately eligible for that pricing, for up to 6 months early eligbility.

KCFalcon59
06-07-2010, 01:41 PM
How much will data usage go up with this phone? Will iAds be exempt from data usage?

NewChief
06-07-2010, 01:42 PM
$199 for 16gb
$299 for 32gb

KCFalcon59
06-07-2010, 01:42 PM
AT&T is going to make "an incredibly generous upgrade offer." If your contract expires any time in 2010, you're immediately eligible for that pricing, for up to 6 months early eligbility.

Shit. Time to get in line.

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:42 PM
On sale June 24.

KCFalcon59
06-07-2010, 01:45 PM
pre-order June 15th. Yes.

Cave Johnson
06-07-2010, 01:45 PM
AT&T is going to make "an incredibly generous upgrade offer." If your contract expires any time in 2010, you're immediately eligible for that pricing, for up to 6 months early eligbility.

This has been out , unofficially, for a while..... I checked my upgrade availability a couple weeks ago and was eligible even though my contract expires in December.

Cave Johnson
06-07-2010, 01:45 PM
pre-order June 15th. Yes.

Marked on my calendar.

Param
06-07-2010, 01:46 PM
pre-order June 15th. Yes.

To get in line or wait for shipping....

Cave Johnson
06-07-2010, 01:47 PM
To get in line or wait for shipping....

Preorder at AT&T stores, most likely.

Param
06-07-2010, 01:47 PM
iPhone 4 to iPhone 4 only too.

That part does piss me off.:mad:

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:49 PM
That part does piss me off.:mad:

Yeah, I mean, obviously older iPhones don't have the front facing camera, but iPhone to iMac/MacBook would have been nice.

Buck
06-07-2010, 01:50 PM
AT&T is going to make "an incredibly generous upgrade offer." If your contract expires any time in 2010, you're immediately eligible for that pricing, for up to 6 months early eligbility.

LOL at "Generous." If this didn't benefit them financially they wouldn't do it. Imagine all the $200 and $300 phones they are about to sell.

MoreLemonPledge
06-07-2010, 01:56 PM
I was pretty sold on getting a phone with the new Microsoft OS, but this looks bad ass. I need to see when the contract on my current iPhone expires...

One thing I did notice. Facetime could get people in a lot of trouble.

(At the strip club)

Wife: Where are you?
Man: I told you I'm at Dale's house.
Wife: Oh, OK. How about you go to video chat and prove it?
Man: FFFFUUUUUUUUU

The Rick
06-07-2010, 01:58 PM
I was pretty sold on getting a phone with the new Microsoft OS, but this looks bad ass. I need to see when the contract on my current iPhone expires...

One thing I did notice. Facetime could get people in a lot of trouble.

(At the strip club)

Wife: Where are you?
Man: I told you I'm at Dale's house.
Wife: Oh, OK. How about you go to video chat and prove it?
Man: FFFFUUUUUUUUU
If it expires any time in 2010, you're golden. AT&T is letting anyone with a contract expiring this year upgrade right away.

Stanley Nickels
06-07-2010, 02:02 PM
"DALES WIFI IS BROKKENNNNNN!!"

DMAC
06-07-2010, 02:02 PM
I am really getting tired of all applications and companies and whatever else being named with 2 words but forgetting to space out those words. It's time for that to end.

FaceTime, ChiefsPlanet, etc

MoreLemonPledge
06-07-2010, 02:03 PM
I am really getting tired of all applications and companies and whatever else being named with 2 words but forgetting to space out those words. It's time for that to end.

FaceTime, ChiefsPlanet, etc

Me, too. Take MoreLemonPledge for instance.

3 words is where it's at.

DMAC
06-07-2010, 02:08 PM
Me, too. Take MoreLemonPledge for instance.

3 words is where it's at.

ROFL

Param
06-07-2010, 02:09 PM
If it expires any time in 2010, you're golden. AT&T is letting anyone with a contract expiring this year upgrade right away.

Mine expires next year, yet i'm eligible for an upgrade now

Call *639# from your iphone and it will tell ya.

MoreLemonPledge
06-07-2010, 02:12 PM
Mine expires next year, yet i'm eligible for an upgrade now

Call *639# from your iphone and it will tell ya.

I didn't know about that trick. The website is down. Thanks!

My contract doesn't expire until 9/5/11. They say they can offer a discounted iPhone upgrade at a higher price.

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h170/mflissinger/sadpanda.gif

phillip
06-07-2010, 02:18 PM
I was pretty sold on getting a phone with the new Microsoft OS, but this looks bad ass. I need to see when the contract on my current iPhone expires...

One thing I did notice. Facetime could get people in a lot of trouble.

(At the strip club)

Wife: Where are you?
Man: I told you I'm at Dale's house.
Wife: Oh, OK. How about you go to video chat and prove it?
Man: FFFFUUUUUUUUU

I doubt it. It only works over wifi and your wife probably wouldn't expect you to bother to connect to Dale's wireless network.

With an Evo in 4g you might be in trouble.

The new iphone has some great features, but I'm still going to get the Evo. I think overall I'd rather have the 4g phone.

Stanley Nickels
06-07-2010, 02:18 PM
If it helps you, that *639# is also *NEW# on the keyboard..

DMAC
06-07-2010, 02:35 PM
If it helps you, that *639# is also *NEW# on the keyboard..

Ohhhhh, I was confoosed!!! Dank ooo!!

:facepalm:

QuikSsurfer
06-07-2010, 03:05 PM
If it helps you, that *639# is also *NEW# on the keyboard..

"As a valued customer, we can offer you an upgrade with a new 2-yr commitment and an $18 upgrade fee."

$18?

Either way. I guess i'll bite and say goodbye to my 3GS.

Cave Johnson
06-07-2010, 03:39 PM
"As a valued customer, we can offer you an upgrade with a new 2-yr commitment and an $18 upgrade fee."

$18?

Or, think of it as $9 per camera.

QuikSsurfer
06-07-2010, 03:51 PM
Or, think of it as $9 per camera.

My contract doesn't expire until 5/2011. I'll pay that $18.

Silock
06-07-2010, 04:01 PM
Love the iPhone 4.

Will not be buying. Fuck AT&T and their capped data plans. That's some bullshit. I won't be able to use the network for what I want, which is streaming my movies from my home computer to my phone. Fuck that noise.

Looks like I'll be buying an Android device.

AustinChief
06-07-2010, 04:26 PM
Love the iPhone 4.

Will not be buying. Fuck AT&T and their capped data plans. That's some bullshit. I won't be able to use the network for what I want, which is streaming my movies from my home computer to my phone. Fuck that noise.

Looks like I'll be buying an Android device.
Come to the dark side with me! I'm upgrading my Pre to an EVO in the next few days...

iPhone4 did a GREAT job on hardware upgrades but other than the screen (which looks to blow EVERYTHING away)... they still didn't catch up to the specs on the EVO .. except possibly the processor... will need to see benchmarks on that.. I'd bet they are neck and neck.

Either way... a great job of upgrading... but with the EVO having 4g and great specs .. I'm going that route. And you are right, ATT is gonna piss alot of people off over the next few years... as Sprint and Verizon master the 4g airwaves... ATT and Tmobile are gonna look like 2nd class citizens if they don't get their asses in gear.

Guru
06-07-2010, 04:32 PM
So when will they put all this in the Touch?

Cave Johnson
06-07-2010, 04:34 PM
Come to the dark side with me! I'm upgrading my Pre to an EVO in the next few days...

iPhone4 did a GREAT job on hardware upgrades but other than the screen (which looks to blow EVERYTHING away)... they still didn't catch up to the specs on the EVO .. except possibly the processor... will need to see benchmarks on that.. I'd bet they are neck and neck.

Either way... a great job of upgrading... but with the EVO having 4g and great specs .. I'm going that route. And you are right, ATT is gonna piss alot of people off over the next few years... as Sprint and Verizon master the 4g airwaves... ATT and Tmobile are gonna look like 2nd class citizens if they don't get their asses in gear.

FWIW, commentators, including the guy from Gizmodo on NPR this morning, expect the other carriers to follow AT&T's example of axing unlimited bandwidth. His point was the other networks aren't quite as strained as AT&T but will catch up soon.

AustinChief
06-07-2010, 04:37 PM
Good take by Jason Snell of Macworld:

Here's Apple in a nutshell. The Sprint EVO Android phone ships with a front-facing camera but I believe there's no software for it yet. Apple doesn't do stuff like that. If there's a front-facing camera, there's software to use it.
Jason needs to shut his ignorant pie hole and do his research first...

EVO has qik which is preloaded but only works with other qik users.. just like facetime and fring which you have to download BUT blows qik and facetime OUT OF THE WATER since it uses multiple networks (Skype®, MSN® Messenger, Google Talk™, ICQ, SIP, Twitter, Yahoo!™, AIM®) and allows for FREE voip calls and video chatting with damn near anyone.

Guru
06-07-2010, 04:38 PM
Cool, 4.0 software will be free for the Touch according to the Apple website.

AustinChief
06-07-2010, 04:39 PM
FWIW, commentators, including the guy from Gizmondo on NPR this morning, expect the other carriers to follow AT&T's example of axing unlimited bandwidth. His point was the other networks aren't quite as strained as AT&T but will catch up soon.

I doubt Sprint goes that route anytime soon.. possibly so with verizon and t-mobile... We will see.. but as of right now... ATT is easily the worst deal and the worst data network.

AustinChief
06-07-2010, 04:43 PM
Jason needs to shut his ignorant pie hole and do his research first...

EVO has qik which is preloaded but only works with other qik users.. just like facetime and fring which you have to download BUT blows qik and facetime OUT OF THE WATER since it uses multiple networks (Skype®, MSN® Messenger, Google Talk™, ICQ, SIP, Twitter, Yahoo!™, AIM®) and allows for FREE voip calls and video chatting with damn near anyone.

AND works on 3g (crappy) 4g(I have heard works great) and wifi... I just hate that people go crazy and act like facetime is revolutionary when it's a few steps behind something that has been out for android for months.

On a side not... the new display is getting rave reviews... did the screen size itself change or is the basic form factor the same?

Cave Johnson
06-07-2010, 04:47 PM
Love the iPhone 4.

Will not be buying. **** AT&T and their capped data plans. That's some bullshit. I won't be able to use the network for what I want, which is streaming my movies from my home computer to my phone. **** that noise.

Looks like I'll be buying an Android device.

a) I'm sure there will be a jailbroken app for that, and

b) the new Netflix app will, presumably, stream video.

Cave Johnson
06-07-2010, 04:48 PM
AND works on 3g (crappy) 4g(I have heard works great) and wifi... I just hate that people go crazy and act like facetime is revolutionary when it's a few steps behind something that has been out for android for months.

On a side not... the new display is getting rave reviews... did the screen size itself change or is the basic form factor the same?

Same, but 33% thinner (only 9.3mm).

AustinChief
06-07-2010, 04:50 PM
a) I'm sure there will be a jailbroken app for that, and

b) the new Netflix app will, presumably, stream video.um, you can't jailbreak a network. I think he is complaining that with capped data plans... streaming video becomes impossible due to the amount of transfer involved.

AustinChief
06-07-2010, 04:53 PM
Same, but 33% thinner (only 9.3mm).

yeah, I like the extra screen size on the EVO... but does look kinda big... may have to break out the parachute pants to carry it!

Silock
06-07-2010, 04:55 PM
a) I'm sure there will be a jailbroken app for that, and

b) the new Netflix app will, presumably, stream video.

I don't need a jail broken app. There's already one on the app store called Air Video. But with a 2gb cap, that's like 1-2 movies streamed from home per month and no room for other data transfer.

Cave Johnson
06-07-2010, 04:56 PM
um, you can't jailbreak a network. I think he is complaining that with capped data plans... streaming video becomes impossible due to the amount of transfer involved.

Oh yeah, people will be royally f'd. The same Gizmodo guy said that 98% of current iPhone users use less than 2 gigs/month. Throw in the "HD" screen, video capabilities, netflix, etc and that's undoubtedly going to increase.

Silock
06-07-2010, 04:57 PM
Come to the dark side with me! I'm upgrading my Pre to an EVO in the next few days...

iPhone4 did a GREAT job on hardware upgrades but other than the screen (which looks to blow EVERYTHING away)... they still didn't catch up to the specs on the EVO .. except possibly the processor... will need to see benchmarks on that.. I'd bet they are neck and neck.

Either way... a great job of upgrading... but with the EVO having 4g and great specs .. I'm going that route. And you are right, ATT is gonna piss alot of people off over the next few years... as Sprint and Verizon master the 4g airwaves... ATT and Tmobile are gonna look like 2nd class citizens if they don't get their asses in gear.

I might. Just depends on how much money switching to a new sprint plan will cost.

AustinChief
06-07-2010, 05:05 PM
I might. Just depends on how much money switching to a new sprint plan will cost.

You on ATT now?

Silock
06-07-2010, 05:08 PM
No, I'm on Sprint, but I have an old school plan employee referral offer plan. Unlimited data, text, 500 anytime, unlimited everything else for $35/mo. If I switch to a new phone, I'll have to get a new plan because they won't let me keep this one.

NewChief
06-07-2010, 05:26 PM
Oh yeah, people will be royally f'd. The same Gizmondo guy said that 98% of current iPhone users use less than 2 gigs/month. Throw in the "HD" screen, video capabilities, netflix, etc and that's undoubtedly going to increase.

Yeah, the whole... you can edit sweet movies on your iphone using imovie now isn't so sweet when you start trying to share those sweet movies and running into your data cap and costing yourself $10 extra a month.

Silock
06-07-2010, 05:28 PM
$10 extra a month.

Per GB.

AustinChief
06-07-2010, 05:29 PM
No, I'm on Sprint, but I have an old school plan employee referral offer plan. Unlimited data, text, 500 anytime, unlimited everything else for $35/mo. If I switch to a new phone, I'll have to get a new plan because they won't let me keep this one.

Oh yeah, to get simliar service AND 4g.. it'll cost ya $80 .. 450 minutes (free after 7pm and free to ANY other mobile) and the rest is unlimited text and data.

But yeah, more than doubles your bill.. ouch.

Silock
06-07-2010, 05:31 PM
Yeah, I might just stick with what I've got for now until my phone completely craps out on me.

AustinChief
06-07-2010, 05:40 PM
Yeah, I might just stick with what I've got for now until my phone completely craps out on me.

yup, smartest move... hopefully by then Android 3 will be out and their apps will have caught up with apple. I'd bet good money that HTC and others will continue to outpace them in hardware now that they have the slight lead.

irishjayhawk
06-07-2010, 09:33 PM
AND works on 3g (crappy) 4g(I have heard works great) and wifi... I just hate that people go crazy and act like facetime is revolutionary when it's a few steps behind something that has been out for android for months.

On a side not... the new display is getting rave reviews... did the screen size itself change or is the basic form factor the same?

Not true, since the EVO, to my knowledge, is the first Android phone to have a front facing camera.

Also, I'm fairly confident facetime on 3G and 4G is ready to go from Apple but, as usual, ATT sucks balls.

Come to the dark side with me! I'm upgrading my Pre to an EVO in the next few days...

iPhone4 did a GREAT job on hardware upgrades but other than the screen (which looks to blow EVERYTHING away)... they still didn't catch up to the specs on the EVO .. except possibly the processor... will need to see benchmarks on that.. I'd bet they are neck and neck.

Either way... a great job of upgrading... but with the EVO having 4g and great specs .. I'm going that route. And you are right, ATT is gonna piss alot of people off over the next few years... as Sprint and Verizon master the 4g airwaves... ATT and Tmobile are gonna look like 2nd class citizens if they don't get their asses in gear.

I'm betting the iPhone will run faster than EVO so it'll come down the "bells and whistles" people supposedly want. Personally, I don't really care for HDMI out, though it'd be cool.

As for 4G, as much as I've read, 4G is super sweet speed wise but battery wise it blows. ATT and Tmobile will look like 2nd class citizens but I'm more curious as to how they start billing for data. That's the bigger picture. if they continue with unlimited, ATT looks like an idiot and therefore 2nd class. If, however, they adopt an ATT like plan, I don't think we're going to see the blow out your predicting. I mean, after all, what's the point of faster speeds if all it does is mean you reach your cap faster. :)

yup, smartest move... hopefully by then Android 3 will be out and their apps will have caught up with apple. I'd bet good money that HTC and others will continue to outpace them in hardware now that they have the slight lead.

Again, it depends on what you define as outpacing in hardware. Windows machines can outpace Macs (hardware wise) but that's not why people buy Macs. Same concept here.

irishjayhawk
06-07-2010, 09:35 PM
As for me personally, I'm on T-Mobile and the only thing really even making me question picking the new one up is ATT.

I'm an early adopter at heart but haven't jumped at anything yet because of money and my grandfathered in superb plan.

But damn this is going to be tough to turn down. If I hadn't had such a bad 2G experience with Sprint, I'd go back to them, if only for their nicely priced plans.

irishjayhawk
06-07-2010, 09:36 PM
Oh, and I forgot:

Safari 5 is out. I have been using instapaper but their new built-in reader feature is pretty awesome. Also, safari extensions? FIIIIIIINNNNNNNNNAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLYYYYYYY

Silock
06-07-2010, 10:23 PM
As for 4G, as much as I've read, 4G is super sweet speed wise but battery wise it blows. ATT and Tmobile will look like 2nd class citizens but I'm more curious as to how they start billing for data. That's the bigger picture. if they continue with unlimited, ATT looks like an idiot and therefore 2nd class. If, however, they adopt an ATT like plan, I don't think we're going to see the blow out your predicting. I mean, after all, what's the point of faster speeds if all it does is mean you reach your cap faster. :)

I agree, but right now, AT&T look like clowns for not even OFFERING an unlimited plan. So fucking lame. Sprint is by far a better option than AT&T right now, and that's saying something.

MoreLemonPledge
06-07-2010, 10:25 PM
I agree, but right now, AT&T look like clowns for not even OFFERING an unlimited plan. So fucking lame. Sprint is by far a better option than AT&T right now, and that's saying something.

My understanding is that you can keep your current unlimited plan at $30/month or whatever you're paying. The new data pricing is for new customers and existing customers who want to change it.

Silock
06-07-2010, 10:27 PM
My understanding is that you can keep your current unlimited plan at $30/month or whatever you're paying. The new data pricing is for new customers and existing customers who want to change it.

Yes, so for me, they don't offer an unlimited plan. Thus, they still look like fucking clowns. Not everyone has an iPhone already.

MoreLemonPledge
06-07-2010, 10:36 PM
Yes, so for me, they don't offer an unlimited plan. Thus, they still look like fucking clowns. Not everyone has an iPhone already.

Ah, I didn't see earlier that you said you had Sprint. Yeah, I wouldn't be willing to switch to AT&T just because of the iPhone. It's a decent device, but it's not that much better than what's out there already.

Silock
06-07-2010, 10:37 PM
Which really sucks, because I like the iPhone 4 a lot.

irishjayhawk
06-07-2010, 11:03 PM
Which really sucks, because I like the iPhone 4 a lot.

I'm weighing the option of buying an no contract iPhone 4 and going pre-paid OR jailbreaking for T-Mobile's sweet plans.

Anyone here done jailbreaking? Worth it?

I'm more worried that if I jailbreak it I won't be able to get stuff from the app store nor that I'll be able to upgrade to new versions of the software.

Param
06-07-2010, 11:04 PM
Love the iPhone 4.

Will not be buying. Fuck AT&T and their capped data plans. That's some bullshit. I won't be able to use the network for what I want, which is streaming my movies from my home computer to my phone. Fuck that noise.

Looks like I'll be buying an Android device.

You do realize that is for new customers. Existing customers can keep their plan.

irishjayhawk
06-07-2010, 11:05 PM
You do realize that is for new customers. Existing customers can keep their plan.

He's new, I believe.

irishjayhawk
06-07-2010, 11:05 PM
Also, silock, many tech writers are claiming there's a good chance you won't hit 2GB per month and therefore will end up saving money.

Param
06-07-2010, 11:09 PM
Come to the dark side with me! I'm upgrading my Pre to an EVO in the next few days...

iPhone4 did a GREAT job on hardware upgrades but other than the screen (which looks to blow EVERYTHING away)... they still didn't catch up to the specs on the EVO .. except possibly the processor... will need to see benchmarks on that.. I'd bet they are neck and neck.

Either way... a great job of upgrading... but with the EVO having 4g and great specs .. I'm going that route. And you are right, ATT is gonna piss alot of people off over the next few years... as Sprint and Verizon master the 4g airwaves... ATT and Tmobile are gonna look like 2nd class citizens if they don't get their asses in gear.

Well, Sprint is trying to avoiding bankruptcy and hemorrhaging customers, I doubt AT&T is worried.

Param
06-07-2010, 11:10 PM
He's new, I believe.

I missed the part he was on Sprint. Existing att customers can keep their plan.

Silock
06-07-2010, 11:10 PM
You do realize that is for new customers. Existing customers can keep their plan.

<- not an existing customer

Silock
06-07-2010, 11:11 PM
Also, silock, many tech writers are claiming there's a good chance you won't hit 2GB per month and therefore will end up saving money.

Which is fine for normal people, but I'm not a normal user.

QuikSsurfer
06-07-2010, 11:15 PM
Anyone here done jailbreaking? Worth it?

I'm more worried that if I jailbreak it I won't be able to get stuff from the app store nor that I'll be able to upgrade to new versions of the software.

Don't worry about that. You can still purchase things from the app store and keep them updated like you normally do.
My 3GS is jailbroken with 3.1.3 firmware.
And is it worth it? Uh yes

Param
06-07-2010, 11:15 PM
Which is fine for normal people, but I'm not a normal user.

I agree it sucks, but everyone else will join the at&t bandwagon. Just because they are the only ones doing it now, doesn't mean the other providers will not consider it.

Aside from America, it's pay as you go everywhere else. This will unfortunately eventually be the norm.

irishjayhawk
06-07-2010, 11:20 PM
Which is fine for normal people, but I'm not a normal user.

Same here.

Except i consider ArsTech writers to be more power users than I. And David Pogue loves to roast him a telecom and would be considered a power user but both sets of writers are saying this is a good move.

I'm honestly curious what you're usage (and mine) would be.

I agree it sucks, but everyone else will join the at&t bandwagon. Just because they are the only ones doing it now, doesn't mean the other providers will not consider it.

Aside from America, it's pay as you go everywhere else. This will unfortunately eventually be the norm.

That's my question. Will they follow suit?

They can make ATT be the bad guy and hope Apple jumps ship after 5 years is up. People would flock to unlimited vs capped.

On the other hand, if this is like any other industry, they'll all follow suit and we'll have capped internet. Which is what I want to avoid in all sectors of the internet, cable/landline specifically.

Don't worry about that. You can still purchase things from the app store and keep them updated like you normally do.
My 3GS is jailbroken with 3.1.3 firmware.
And is it worth it? Uh yes

Hmmm, then I'm going to have to look into this jailbreak and whether t-mobile has micro-sims.

irishjayhawk
06-07-2010, 11:23 PM
Don't worry about that. You can still purchase things from the app store and keep them updated like you normally do.
My 3GS is jailbroken with 3.1.3 firmware.
And is it worth it? Uh yes

It voids warranties though too, right?


Though, I guess if I'm going to T-Mobile anyway, I've kinda ditched the whole warranty aspect.

OnTheWarpath58
06-07-2010, 11:33 PM
"As a valued customer, we can offer you an upgrade with a new 2-yr commitment and an $18 upgrade fee."

$18?

Either way. I guess i'll bite and say goodbye to my 3GS.

I got the same message, but it said nothing about phone pricing.

If I can upgrade for $199, I'm in.

OnTheWarpath58
06-07-2010, 11:42 PM
Re: Data Usage.

Just looked at my usage through the MyWireless app, and I'm at .2 GB 24 days into my billing cycle.

And I thought I used it a lot. LMAO

(though I'm sure I'm down significantly this month due to knee surgery)

I'll be grandfathered in unlimited anyway. Don't see a downside yet, other than spending another $200 less than 18 months after just spending $200 on the 3gs.

QuikSsurfer
06-07-2010, 11:49 PM
It voids warranties though too, right?


Though, I guess if I'm going to T-Mobile anyway, I've kinda ditched the whole warranty aspect.

If you absolutely have to take it to an Apple store for repair - just restore a official firmware release onto the phone before taking it in. You can backup your data beforehand, of course.

OnTheWarpath58
06-07-2010, 11:58 PM
I'm pretty sure the answer is no, but has there been any change/advancement in the ability to use a 3Gs and connect to a Blackberry Server?

My wife HATES her BB, but it looks like because her company is on a BB server, she's tied to a BB.

I'm not very, if at all tech-savvy, so keep responses dummy-approved.

The Rick
06-08-2010, 12:36 AM
Just installed iOS 4 on my iPhone 3GS. Haven't played with it too much yet, but it looks pretty sweet so far. Multitasking works much better than I expected. It feels snappier overall too.

AustinChief
06-08-2010, 04:21 AM
Not true, since the EVO, to my knowledge, is the first Android phone to have a front facing camera.

Also, I'm fairly confident facetime on 3G and 4G is ready to go from Apple but, as usual, ATT sucks balls.


Doesn't matter... look at the context... some ignorant Apple fanboy tried to misrepresent the EVO by saying they didn't have software to support video chat.. yet the software was out MONTHS before the hardware.... typical of the Apple crowd to wait for an app to be spoon fed from daddy Jobs before they know a better one existed before it.



I'm betting the iPhone will run faster than EVO so it'll come down the "bells and whistles" people supposedly want. Personally, I don't really care for HDMI out, though it'd be cool.

As for 4G, as much as I've read, 4G is super sweet speed wise but battery wise it blows. ATT and Tmobile will look like 2nd class citizens but I'm more curious as to how they start billing for data. That's the bigger picture. if they continue with unlimited, ATT looks like an idiot and therefore 2nd class. If, however, they adopt an ATT like plan, I don't think we're going to see the blow out your predicting. I mean, after all, what's the point of faster speeds if all it does is mean you reach your cap faster. :)

Again, it depends on what you define as outpacing in hardware. Windows machines can outpace Macs (hardware wise) but that's not why people buy Macs. Same concept here.

I will give you battery life... if I turn EVERYTHING USEFUL OFF on my phone .. the battery life is AMAZING!!!! Jesus dude... don't be retarded.. of course features cost battery life... call me stupid but I'd like to have the option instead of daddy tell me what's best...

And if you truly believe that Apple (other than display) has caught up to HTC in hardware than you are beyond help... you have drank the cool-aid and refuse to look at FACTS.

AustinChief
06-08-2010, 04:24 AM
Not true, since the EVO, to my knowledge, is the first Android phone to have a front facing camera.

Also, I'm fairly confident facetime on 3G and 4G is ready to go from Apple but, as usual, ATT sucks balls.

AND PLEASE explain to me how facetime is anywhere in the fucking same league as fring??? Facetime works with how many clients out of the box... I'll even give you the assumption it works with ALL iPhone users (regardless of the fact that it doesn't)... it still is a SPECK compared to how many clients can use fring.

Keep drinking that cool aid.

JD10367
06-08-2010, 06:29 AM
Oh yeah, people will be royally f'd. The same Gizmondo guy said that 98% of current iPhone users use less than 2 gigs/month. Throw in the "HD" screen, video capabilities, netflix, etc and that's undoubtedly going to increase.

Hence the reason I think capped data plans are in the future for all carriers. It just makes sense for them. "Midair" networks just don't have the carrying capacity of hard-wired networks. It makes the most sense to charge you by how much you download (just like they do with the broadband "sticks" that you can plug into your laptop).

And it's fair. If User X uses 2G per month, and User Y uses 100G per month, why should User X help foot the bill to pay for User Y's consumption?

irishjayhawk
06-08-2010, 08:28 AM
Doesn't matter... look at the context... some ignorant Apple fanboy tried to misrepresent the EVO by saying they didn't have software to support video chat.. yet the software was out MONTHS before the hardware.... typical of the Apple crowd to wait for an app to be spoon fed from daddy Jobs before they know a better one existed before it.


Actually, they aren't necessarily wrong in that assertion. Google has no software in their OS to support it. If we're going to say third party apps are in the running for things devices "support", the iPhone has a lot more features than people are claiming. As does Android.


I will give you battery life... if I turn EVERYTHING USEFUL OFF on my phone .. the battery life is AMAZING!!!! Jesus dude... don't be retarded.. of course features cost battery life... call me stupid but I'd like to have the option instead of daddy tell me what's best...

That's not even close to what I'm saying. I'm saying 4G v 3G is not all about speed. You also have to factor in battery life and 4G drains the battery MUCH MUCH faster. So, it's not such a cut and dry decision.


And if you truly believe that Apple (other than display) has caught up to HTC in hardware than you are beyond help... you have drank the cool-aid and refuse to look at FACTS.

That's not what I said. You seem to think hardware is the main factor for people deciding what to purchase. For, you perhaps. For everyone else, I'm not so sure. Again, Windows machines can outstrip Macs hardware wise, but that's not why people buy them.

Interestingly, I'm reading an awful lot of comments on sites that say roughly the following:

"iPhone will be outdated a month from now" & "Android will leapfrog, given Apple's 1yr release cycle."

What baffles me is, unless you're made of money, you won't be upgrading your phone within a year, either. Let alone 1-2 months. And the EVO, which most reference, will be outdated next month too. So I'm not sure the argument is valid.

irishjayhawk
06-08-2010, 08:30 AM
AND PLEASE explain to me how facetime is anywhere in the ****ing same league as fring??? Facetime works with how many clients out of the box... I'll even give you the assumption it works with ALL iPhone users (regardless of the fact that it doesn't)... it still is a SPECK compared to how many clients can use fring.

Keep drinking that cool aid.

Did I mention anything about third party apps? Seriously...

What I said was I'm sure FT is ready to go wirelessly but that ATT can't handle it.

irishjayhawk
06-08-2010, 08:31 AM
Hence the reason I think capped data plans are in the future for all carriers. It just makes sense for them. "Midair" networks just don't have the carrying capacity of hard-wired networks. It makes the most sense to charge you by how much you download (just like they do with the broadband "sticks" that you can plug into your laptop).

And it's fair. If User X uses 2G per month, and User Y uses 100G per month, why should User X help foot the bill to pay for User Y's consumption?

Conversely, it makes zero sense because User X COULD be using 100G a month, but isn't. Why should User Y be penalized for taking advantage of what is offered.

I'm an ardent opponent of bandwidth caps. Mobile devices are more of a grey area than cable landlines but still.

Great Expectations
06-08-2010, 09:10 AM
With this phone could you download a movie from netflix via WiFi and then watch it later w/out using up your data plan?

Shag
06-08-2010, 09:15 AM
Conversely, it makes zero sense because User X COULD be using 100G a month, but isn't. Why should User Y be penalized for taking advantage of what is offered.

I'm an ardent opponent of bandwidth caps. Mobile devices are more of a grey area than cable landlines but still.

My guess is that things like Netflix and AirVideo coming available to iPhone were big factors in AT&T's decision. Widespread, unmetered use of those apps would kill their network even more than it already is. Unfortunately, the customers are having to pay for AT&T's poor network.

I agree that the change sucks, but I'm guessing they're just the first carrier to do it, and others will follow close behind. Fortunately, I'm grandfathered in to the unlimited plan, assuming I stick with the iPhone platform (which I'm still undecided on)...

The Rick
06-08-2010, 09:17 AM
Doesn't matter... look at the context... some ignorant Apple fanboy tried to misrepresent the EVO by saying they didn't have software to support video chat.. yet the software was out MONTHS before the hardware.... typical of the Apple crowd to wait for an app to be spoon fed from daddy Jobs before they know a better one existed before it.
Are you calling me an ignorant Apple fanboy?

Fish
06-08-2010, 10:36 AM
Which is fine for normal people, but I'm not a normal user.

I really really doubt you would hit that 2GB cap like you think you would. It's very difficult to use your phone enough to hit that. Remember that your transfers over WiFi don't count against that 2GB cap. Only what you transfer over 3G. So streaming over WiFi from your home computer wouldn't count against the cap.

I'm not sure what phone you're currently using, but look to see if it tells you how much data you transfer per month that actually counts as carrier data. Most phones do. I'm not saying I don't believe you, but averaging anywhere close to 2GB a month is incredibly rare. You would drain the battery twice a day if you really used that much data.

OnTheWarpath58
06-08-2010, 10:50 AM
I'm pretty sure the answer is no, but has there been any change/advancement in the ability to use a 3Gs and connect to a Blackberry Server?

My wife HATES her BB, but it looks like because her company is on a BB server, she's tied to a BB.

I'm not very, if at all tech-savvy, so keep responses dummy-approved.

I guess that either the answer is no, or that the post was overlooked in all the bickering that followed it.

Anyone?

Fish
06-08-2010, 11:10 AM
I guess that either the answer is no, or that the post was overlooked in all the bickering that followed it.

Anyone?

Generally an enterprise BB server is simply a "middleman" between the BB client and an Exchange server, that is only required by BB. Other phones don't need that "middleman", and can just connect directly to the Exchange server. Most companies that use a BB server had their Exchange server already in place, but had to purchase the BBES just so their employees with BB phones could access the existing Exchange server. If that's the case, she can get a new phone and connect directly to the Exchange server.

That's the case for my employer and most others I know. Have her ask the IT department to be sure though.

NewChief
06-08-2010, 11:24 AM
The main thing that Austinchief, and all the other people who hate on Apple fail to see is that it's not about hardware specs vs. hardware specs. It's not about what's the superior product. It's about marketshare, marketing, and consumer awareness.

While I know that the free marketers out there would love to have faith in the American consumer... they're just not always that smart and predictable. There's more to their choice than going down and doing a point by point comparison of products. So you can argue about how inferior Apple is to Droid products all you want, but that doesn't mean that Apple phones are going to suddenly fall behind and become unpopular.

Dicky McElephant
06-08-2010, 11:38 AM
Generally an enterprise BB server is simply a "middleman" between the BB client and an Exchange server, that is only required by BB. Other phones don't need that "middleman", and can just connect directly to the Exchange server. Most companies that use a BB server had their Exchange server already in place, but had to purchase the BBES just so their employees with BB phones could access the existing Exchange server. If that's the case, she can get a new phone and connect directly to the Exchange server.

That's the case for my employer and most others I know. Have her ask the IT department to be sure though.

This.

Have her ask her IT guys what phones will work and what phones won't.

Huffmeister
06-08-2010, 12:07 PM
The main thing that Austinchief, and all the other people who hate on Apple fail to see is that it's not about hardware specs vs. hardware specs. It's not about what's the superior product. It's about marketshare, marketing, and consumer awareness.
Which is exactly what could be said about Microsoft for the last 20 years.

NewChief
06-08-2010, 12:11 PM
Which is exactly what could be said about Microsoft for the last 20 years.

Exactly. As much sense as it would make for the entire world to switch to Linux... it just hasn't happened.

QuikSsurfer
06-08-2010, 01:08 PM
I'm loving Safari 5 on my windows 7 netbook.

AustinChief
06-08-2010, 03:45 PM
Actually, they aren't necessarily wrong in that assertion. Google has no software in their OS to support it. If we're going to say third party apps are in the running for things devices "support", the iPhone has a lot more features than people are claiming. As does Android.

As I stated, yes they DO.. Qik is bundled and preconfigured.. it is their version of facetime... just because Google doesn't own them, doesn't mean it wasn't ready to go...

The great thing about the Android model is... they provide an open environment and allow development of even better products like fring... so you don't have to wait for Apple to spoon-feed you and tell you when you are ready for something.

The FACT is, the supposed journalist who made the comment was dead wrong.

Silock
06-08-2010, 03:46 PM
Hence the reason I think capped data plans are in the future for all carriers. It just makes sense for them. "Midair" networks just don't have the carrying capacity of hard-wired networks. It makes the most sense to charge you by how much you download (just like they do with the broadband "sticks" that you can plug into your laptop).

And it's fair. If User X uses 2G per month, and User Y uses 100G per month, why should User X help foot the bill to pay for User Y's consumption?

I'm not saying it doesn't make sense. What I don't like is that I don't even have the ABILITY to pay for a plan that includes more than 2gb of usage. I would switch right now if they offered a 5gb plan.

AustinChief
06-08-2010, 03:46 PM
Are you calling me an ignorant Apple fanboy?

NO, I'm calling the supposed journalist one... he should have checked his facts before posting something so outragously stupid.

Silock
06-08-2010, 03:49 PM
I really really doubt you would hit that 2GB cap like you think you would. It's very difficult to use your phone enough to hit that. Remember that your transfers over WiFi don't count against that 2GB cap. Only what you transfer over 3G. So streaming over WiFi from your home computer wouldn't count against the cap.

I'm not sure what phone you're currently using, but look to see if it tells you how much data you transfer per month that actually counts as carrier data. Most phones do. I'm not saying I don't believe you, but averaging anywhere close to 2GB a month is incredibly rare. You would drain the battery twice a day if you really used that much data.

I don't have a smartphone right now. I just know what I would use it for when I DO get one. Instead of taking my computer with me on trips, I could just take my iPhone and stream movies to my house. Unfortunately, a LOT of hotels/condos either don't have free WiFi, or they make you pay for access. Well, why do that when I can just use my iPhone? Oh wait, I know why ... because 2gb goes by really quickly when you start streaming video.

Fish
06-08-2010, 04:37 PM
I don't have a smartphone right now. I just know what I would use it for when I DO get one. Instead of taking my computer with me on trips, I could just take my iPhone and stream movies to my house. Unfortunately, a LOT of hotels/condos either don't have free WiFi, or they make you pay for access. Well, why do that when I can just use my iPhone? Oh wait, I know why ... because 2gb goes by really quickly when you start streaming video.

This explanation makes things a little more clear.

First off, you won't be able to simply stream movies from your home machine over 3G. To do so would be such a PIA, it would never be worth it. There are apps like Orb (http://www.orb.com/en), which are supposed to do this, but they totally suck and only really work right over WiFi. And that would cost you too. And even then, the movie would have to be converted to iPhone format in iTunes. Then you install the Orb iTunes plugin, which is the equivalent of taping a rocket onto a Ford Pinto. I've seen Orb in action, and it was ugly. Quality was terrible, and that was over WiFi.

Currently you can do that for free by jailbreaking, but even then it gets seriously complicated. Check this out: http://www.iphonehacks.com/2007/09/iphone-trick.html

That should give you an idea of what you're looking at. Even then, watching movies on the iPhone really sucks. Even transferring a movie to the iPhone and watching it that way sucks.

Not to mention that this would drain your battery in a matter of hours. So you'd have to have your iPhone plugged in, which kinda ruins the whole "mobile" aspect.

What you're wanting to do isn't really feasible. The 2GB cap would be the least of your concerns... .

Shag
06-08-2010, 04:48 PM
This explanation makes things a little more clear.

First off, you won't be able to simply stream movies from your home machine over 3G. To do so would be such a PIA, it would never be worth it. There are apps like Orb (http://www.orb.com/en), which are supposed to do this, but they totally suck and only really work right over WiFi. And that would cost you too. And even then, the movie would have to be converted to iPhone format in iTunes. Then you install the Orb iTunes plugin, which is the equivalent of taping a rocket onto a Ford Pinto. I've seen Orb in action, and it was ugly. Quality was terrible, and that was over WiFi.

Currently you can do that for free by jailbreaking, but even then it gets seriously complicated. Check this out: http://www.iphonehacks.com/2007/09/iphone-trick.html

That should give you an idea of what you're looking at. Even then, watching movies on the iPhone really sucks. Even transferring a movie to the iPhone and watching it that way sucks.

Not to mention that this would drain your battery in a matter of hours. So you'd have to have your iPhone plugged in, which kinda ruins the whole "mobile" aspect.

What you're wanting to do isn't really feasible. The 2GB cap would be the least of your concerns... .

Check out AirVideo: http://www.inmethod.com/air-video/index.html;jsessionid=1E9BCC833C1DDFF0CD4C302F882BC66D

On the fly transcoding to h.264, streaming directly to your device. Works great over wifi, but haven't tried it over 3g, though it's reported to work. Slick program...

JD10367
06-08-2010, 04:49 PM
A guy I work with just bought an iPad, mainly so he could get grandfathered in to the unlimited-data plan. He's had it two days, and he's already used up almost 2GB. It can go pretty fast if you do anything with video or high-quality pics.

I'm surprised AT&T isn't offering higher-GB plans. Hell, even the broadband-mobile "sticks" for your laptop offer up to 5GB.

I didn't want to sign up for a 2-year commitment (which would've gotten me the "stick" for free) so I paid $100 for the stick and signed up with Virgin Mobile's pay-as-you-go plan. For $20 I get 300MB, but I could've gone up to 5GB (for $50 or $60 I think).

Silock
06-08-2010, 04:58 PM
This explanation makes things a little more clear.

First off, you won't be able to simply stream movies from your home machine over 3G. To do so would be such a PIA, it would never be worth it. There are apps like Orb (http://www.orb.com/en), which are supposed to do this, but they totally suck and only really work right over WiFi. And that would cost you too. And even then, the movie would have to be converted to iPhone format in iTunes. Then you install the Orb iTunes plugin, which is the equivalent of taping a rocket onto a Ford Pinto. I've seen Orb in action, and it was ugly. Quality was terrible, and that was over WiFi.

Currently you can do that for free by jailbreaking, but even then it gets seriously complicated. Check this out: http://www.iphonehacks.com/2007/09/iphone-trick.html

That should give you an idea of what you're looking at. Even then, watching movies on the iPhone really sucks. Even transferring a movie to the iPhone and watching it that way sucks.

Not to mention that this would drain your battery in a matter of hours. So you'd have to have your iPhone plugged in, which kinda ruins the whole "mobile" aspect.

What you're wanting to do isn't really feasible. The 2GB cap would be the least of your concerns... .

Not to torpedo your post, but in a word, "No."

AirVideo works over 3g. My dad connects to our computer all the time on his 3GS to watch movies over 3G.

Is watching a movie on an iPhone ideal? No, but it's better than NOT.

Plus, I could take an iPhone to the gym to watch a movie while I do cardio. Gym has no wifi, no hotspots. But it would get reception. Again, this wouldn't be possible with the current bandwidth caps.

Fish
06-08-2010, 05:32 PM
Not to torpedo your post, but in a word, "No."

AirVideo works over 3g. My dad connects to our computer all the time on his 3GS to watch movies over 3G.

Is watching a movie on an iPhone ideal? No, but it's better than NOT.

Plus, I could take an iPhone to the gym to watch a movie while I do cardio. Gym has no wifi, no hotspots. But it would get reception. Again, this wouldn't be possible with the current bandwidth caps.

Hadn't seen AirVideo. Nifty. Looks like the quality is scaled down considerably on 3G though. Meaning that the stream is going to be much much smaller size wise. So that 2GB cap probably still won't be reached. Actually streaming 2GB takes a long long time.

Have you actually watched a movie on the iPhone though? Painful. I'm quite surprised that you would make this a dealbreaker for whether or not to get a phone.

irishjayhawk
06-08-2010, 05:58 PM
As I stated, yes they DO.. Qik is bundled and preconfigured.. it is their version of facetime... just because Google doesn't own them, doesn't mean it wasn't ready to go...

Sorry, a third party app flat out doesn't count. There's plenty of third party apps that make devices do better things. FT or the equivalent isn't built into the OS. Therefore, it really isn't comparable.


The great thing about the Android model is... they provide an open environment and allow development of even better products like fring... so you don't have to wait for Apple to spoon-feed you and tell you when you are ready for something.

You don't think there will be third party video chat apps?


The FACT is, the supposed journalist who made the comment was dead wrong.

No, he wasn't really.

A guy I work with just bought an iTouch Senior Citizen Edition, mainly so he could get grandfathered in to the unlimited-data plan. He's had it two days, and he's already used up almost 2GB. It can go pretty fast if you do anything with video or high-quality pics.

I'm surprised AT&T isn't offering higher-GB plans. Hell, even the broadband-mobile "sticks" for your laptop offer up to 5GB.

I didn't want to sign up for a 2-year commitment (which would've gotten me the "stick" for free) so I paid $100 for the stick and signed up with Virgin Mobile's pay-as-you-go plan. For $20 I get 300MB, but I could've gone up to 5GB (for $50 or $60 I think).

T-Mobile offers a data only plan. But as far as I can tell, it's only for Win Mo phones, which is major lol.

I'm considering jailbreaking my phone because it's a hell of a lot cheaper to buy the expensive device and then do the pay as you go or stick with whatever plan you're grandfathered into.

Now, as for ATT. I'm actually shocked they just don't make an "unlimited" plan available for $40 or $50. Then it would satisfy them AND they'll have to pay for the premium allotment. But just like Sunflower Broadband, they won't because it's a better system when they have to pay multiple times for going over.

Fish
06-08-2010, 06:01 PM
Sorry, a third party app flat out doesn't count. There's plenty of third party apps that make devices do better things. FT or the equivalent isn't built into the OS. Therefore, it really isn't comparable.

It's like an app for everything! Going through all that trouble installing an app.... grumble grumble... [/AustinChief]

:D

irishjayhawk
06-08-2010, 06:02 PM
Hadn't seen AirVideo. Nifty. Looks like the quality is scaled down considerably on 3G though. Meaning that the stream is going to be much much smaller size wise. So that 2GB cap probably still won't be reached. Actually streaming 2GB takes a long long time.

Have you actually watched a movie on the iPhone though? Painful. I'm quite surprised that you would make this a dealbreaker for whether or not to get a phone.

For the uses he's stated, it's perfectly legit. Would I seek out a movie on the iPhone? No.

But if I'm on a car ride and no iPad or in car entertainment system and I have netflix or something, It'd be perfect.

Again, it comes down to caps and the fact that they don't have an unlimited as an option is a major con. But I'm biased because I don't think caps should be allowed because they stifle innovation like netflix or the like.

Silock
06-08-2010, 06:03 PM
Hadn't seen AirVideo. Nifty. Looks like the quality is scaled down considerably on 3G though. Meaning that the stream is going to be much much smaller size wise. So that 2GB cap probably still won't be reached. Actually streaming 2GB takes a long long time.

Have you actually watched a movie on the iPhone though? Painful. I'm quite surprised that you would make this a dealbreaker for whether or not to get a phone.

It's scaled down, but only to the settings you use in the application itself. You can set the resolution. So, you can scale HD stuff down, but it's still a lot of data going back and forth.

Yes, I have. I have an iPod Touch and used to watch movies on it all the time, especially at the gym.

Fish
06-08-2010, 06:15 PM
Well I stand corrected. Death to AT&T.........

AustinChief
06-08-2010, 06:16 PM
Sorry, a third party app flat out doesn't count. There's plenty of third party apps that make devices do better things. FT or the equivalent isn't built into the OS. Therefore, it really isn't comparable.

Here is what the "journalist" wrote... "Here's Apple in a nutshell. The Sprint EVO Android phone ships with a front-facing camera but I believe there's no software for it yet. Apple doesn't do stuff like that. If there's a front-facing camera, there's software to use it."

Number 1.. even if there was just fring.. he would be wrong.. regardless of that... QIK is preinstalled with the phone.

so PLEASE explain how he wasn't wrong in saying there was no software for it?????

NO WHERE DID THE IGNORANT BASTARD SAY ANYTHING ABOUT who makes the software (which is your pointless arguement..who the fuck cares as long as it's there) nor did he even mention that the software had to be preinstalled...

irishjayhawk
06-08-2010, 06:21 PM
[quote=irishjayhawk;6807686]Sorry, a third party app flat out doesn't count. There's plenty of third party apps that make devices do better things. FT or the equivalent isn't built into the OS. Therefore, it really isn't comparable.[/qoute]

Here is what the "journalist" wrote... "Here's Apple in a nutshell. The Sprint EVO Android phone ships with a front-facing camera but I believe there's no software for it yet. Apple doesn't do stuff like that. If there's a front-facing camera, there's software to use it."

Number 1.. even if there was just fring.. he would be wrong.. regardless of that... QIK is preinstalled with the phone.

so PLEASE explain how he wasn't wrong in saying there was no software for it?????

NO WHERE DID THE IGNORANT BASTARD SAY ANYTHING ABOUT who makes the software (which is your pointless arguement..who the **** cares as long as it's there) nor did he even mention that the software had to be preinstalled...

What he said was not wrong at all.

He pointed out that they don't ship a product with a feature that doesn't have software to use it. Moreover, it's implied that the phone manufacturer or the OS maker (in Apple's case it is both, but here it's HTC & Google) would supply such software. What he wrote isn't technically wrong. Neither HTC nor Google has written software to take advantage of the front facing camera.

It's also interesting that you'd say "who cares if it's there" when you have adamantly told everyone that no flash on the iPad is killer even though they have apps that make up for it. Again, "who cares if it's there"....

irishjayhawk
06-08-2010, 06:21 PM
Well I stand corrected. Death to AT&T.........

Don't get me wrong, I do see their logic and I think ultimately most people will save money.

AustinChief
06-08-2010, 06:30 PM
[quote=AustinChief;6807724]

What he said was not wrong at all.

He pointed out that they don't ship a product with a feature that doesn't have software to use it. Moreover, it's implied that the phone manufacturer or the OS maker (in Apple's case it is both, but here it's HTC & Google) would supply such software. What he wrote isn't technically wrong. Neither HTC nor Google has written software to take advantage of the front facing camera.

It's also interesting that you'd say "who cares if it's there" when you have adamantly told everyone that no flash on the iTouch Senior Citizen Edition is killer even though they have apps that make up for it. Again, "who cares if it's there"....

MY GOD YOU ARE BEING DENSE.

He said there was no software to use it... HE WAS FUCKING WRONG.. it SHIPPED with preloaded software AND there are other ones available for download...

HE NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT WHO MAKES IT... YOU ARE MAKING THAT PART UP... IT IS NOT "IMPLIED", WHY THE FUCK WOULD IT BE

IT ISN'T JUST TECHNICALLY WRONG... IT IS FLAT OUT WRONG.

..and the iPad argument is not inconsistent at all.. I don't want to download HUNDREDS of apps to "make up for" a lack of flash when I could... hmmm.. just use flash... downloading one app for video calls is a bit different then a new app for each piece of web content I want.

Silock
06-08-2010, 06:31 PM
lol @ hundreds of apps

irishjayhawk
06-08-2010, 06:32 PM
[quote=irishjayhawk;6807731]

MY GOD YOU ARE BEING DENSE.

He said there was no software to use it... HE WAS ****ING WRONG.. it SHIPPED with preloaded software AND there are other ones available for download...

HE NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT WHO MAKES IT... YOU ARE MAKING THAT PART UP... IT IS NOT "IMPLIED", WHY THE **** WOULD IT BE

IT ISN'T JUST TECHNICALLY WRONG... IT IS FLAT OUT WRONG.


I though it was strongly implied with the key sentence "Apple doesn't do stuff like that".

But whatevers.


..and the iTouch Senior Citizen Edition argument is not inconsistent at all.. I don't want to download HUNDREDS of apps to "make up for" a lack of flash when I could... hmmm.. just use flash... downloading one app for video calls is a bit different then a new app for each piece of web content I want.

"who cares if it's there"

AustinChief
06-08-2010, 06:33 PM
lol @ hundreds of apps

for me it gets close to that number.. for 90% of users it isn't.. but it's still annoying.

Silock
06-08-2010, 06:34 PM
for me it gets close to that number.. for 90% of users it isn't.. but it's still annoying.

I'm still highly skeptical.

AustinChief
06-08-2010, 06:39 PM
I though it was strongly implied with the key sentence "Apple doesn't do stuff like that".

But whatevers.



It isn't implied at all by that statement. Wow. That simply says Apple wouldn't ship hardware without there being available software for it to be used... well duh, neither did HTC or Google.

AustinChief
06-08-2010, 06:41 PM
I'm still highly skeptical.

You ever use sites like surf the channel and other video aggregators? You get sent ALL OVER THE MAP for video.. I use them daily... over the course of a year I easily hit 100+ different video sites.. especially as they get shut down and pop up in some new incarnation.

irishjayhawk
06-08-2010, 07:47 PM
Don't worry about that. You can still purchase things from the app store and keep them updated like you normally do.
My 3GS is jailbroken with 3.1.3 firmware.
And is it worth it? Uh yes

Out of curiosity, did you jailbreak it while on ATT or jailbreak it to go with another carrier?

Shag
06-08-2010, 08:06 PM
Out of curiosity, did you jailbreak it while on ATT or jailbreak it to go with another carrier?

Can't speak for QS, but I have a jailbroken 3G on AT&T. I'd say go ahead a JB - there's really no reason not to try it, as you can go back to the official firmware at any time...

irishjayhawk
06-08-2010, 09:16 PM
Can't speak for QS, but I have a jailbroken 3G on AT&T. I'd say go ahead a JB - there's really no reason not to try it, as you can go back to the official firmware at any time...

Well, I'm less concerned about JB than the performance on a non-ATT network.

If I could just find a British person to buy and ship me an iPhone 4 from T-Mobile.

SpankyMcSpank
06-09-2010, 03:57 AM
Not to torpedo your post, but in a word, "No."

AirVideo works over 3g. My dad connects to our computer all the time on his 3GS to watch movies over 3G.

Is watching a movie on an iPhone ideal? No, but it's better than NOT.

Plus, I could take an iPhone to the gym to watch a movie while I do cardio. Gym has no wifi, no hotspots. But it would get reception. Again, this wouldn't be possible with the current bandwidth caps.

actually even with unlimited bandwidth it still would be hard for more than a couple to do this simultaniously at the gym without killing performance for everyone. Think of it...the 2-10Mb/s that 3G+ provides is shared by everyone in the tower. If you're the only one then great you get XMb/s But if 2+ people are all watching vids then that BW is split among them. If people are watching movies that will consume alot of bandwith for a long time. Starving the performance for everyone else. It's not just the amount of data used but also how long you watch for. With enough smart phones, every network will have to do it. And there's really no bones about it.

Silock
06-09-2010, 04:01 AM
Irrelevant, really. AT&Ts network issues are just another issue.

Silock
06-09-2010, 04:02 AM
You ever use sites like surf the channel and other video aggregators? You get sent ALL OVER THE MAP for video.. I use them daily... over the course of a year I easily hit 100+ different video sites.. especially as they get shut down and pop up in some new incarnation.

Or, they could just make one app that scrapes the video from all of those sites.

AustinChief
06-09-2010, 05:10 AM
Or, they could just make one app that scrapes the video from all of those sites.

When someone makes that app.. let me know.... THAT would be the ultimate solution... even if it meant buying an i-pad/i-phone.. I would go for it! (well.. assuming I could use it on a non-ATT network...) :D

The problem is that no one will ever make an app like that because most of the video is copyrighted and not supposed to be online anyway... or at least not available at MY leisure.

Also, it would be one HELL of an app to write... it would have to somehow grab the video, transcode it and then deliver it... a pretty daunting task to say the least .. when you are dealing with 100s of sites each with its own Flash implementation.

Cave Johnson
06-09-2010, 03:03 PM
I'm loving Safari 5 on my windows 7 netbook.

I just dl'd it for xp and it's light years better than IE8. I'm making the switch.

Great Expectations
06-15-2010, 08:57 AM
You are only eligible for the upgrade 6 months early if you are an existing iPhone user. My samsung is eligible for an upgrade in November, but they won't sell me an iPhone for $300.

Cave Johnson
06-15-2010, 10:35 AM
I'm having no luck preordering on Apple's site..... they must be slammed.

The Rick
06-15-2010, 10:43 AM
Same here...

Cave Johnson
06-15-2010, 10:45 AM
You going 16 or 32? I thought about cheaping out for about 2 seconds, then I realized I only have 4gb of space on mine now.

The Rick
06-15-2010, 11:06 AM
You going 16 or 32? I thought about cheaping out for about 2 seconds, then I realized I only have 4gb of space on mine now.
Yeah, I think I'm going 32 also. With the ability to take HD video, I don't want to run in to a situation where I'm low on space. I'll pay the extra $100 for that piece of mind.

KCFalcon59
06-15-2010, 12:57 PM
Yeah, I think I'm going 32 also. With the ability to take HD video, I don't want to run in to a situation where I'm low on space. I'll pay the extra $100 for that piece of mind.

Was a nightmare this morning. When Apple went live at 3AM here, I got to the screen to add to my cart and it timed out. A few hours later and more time outs on Apple and AT&T, I decided to wait and go to the AT&T store. I get to AT&T around 8:45AM and I am 12th in line. They had 6 sales associates working. As soon as they started, AT&T's computers went down. They eventually took all information by pen and paper.

After I got back home I tried again on Apples site and it still didn't work. I eventually opened the cart and noticed that my 32Gb iPhone 4 was in there. Completed the process online. I rushed back to AT&T and had them cancel my order. Thankfully they were still having problems and hadn't processed it. Now just have to wait for it to be delivered to my door. Woo Hoo! What a deal.

Jewish Rabbi
06-15-2010, 01:52 PM
Got mine preordered at 4 am on At&t's website. If they really are in this short of demand, I may have to sell mine when it gets here and wait for the white one.

Cave Johnson
06-15-2010, 02:12 PM
Supposedly the bottleneck is lack of bandwidth on AT&T's part..... ironic.

Cave Johnson
06-16-2010, 09:26 AM
Was able to log on this morning and got a July 2nd delivery date. F that.

Jewish Rabbi
06-23-2010, 01:39 PM
Just got my iPhone 4!! Syncing as we speak.

MoreLemonPledge
06-23-2010, 02:19 PM
Just got my iPhone 4!! Syncing as we speak.

http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q158/heathmun/lucky.jpg

Jewish Rabbi
06-23-2010, 02:24 PM
Been on the phone forever trying to get this damn thing activated... What do you expect I guess. First impressions are positive, the front facing camera is pretty sweet, the screen is a lot better. Not sure I like the square feel of it, but they were able to make it (slightly) smaller because of it.

Cave Johnson
06-23-2010, 04:34 PM
Anyone have any idea the best place to pick up a non-preordered 4 tomorrow? Looks like my choices are the Evil Empire (the only one which didn't pre-order), BB, and Radio Shack.

DMAC
06-23-2010, 04:58 PM
Was able to log on this morning and got a July 2nd delivery date. F that.I got a July 15th-19th so...it could be worse.

Im in no hurry though.

Jewish Rabbi
06-23-2010, 05:34 PM
Have fun getting it activated if you don't do it in store. I spent a half hour on hold only to be transferred to a guy who didn't speak English.

Seriously tho, I'm very impressed with this the more I use it. The screen is just unspeakably better, as is the battery life. The silence/vibrate button actually stays were you want it to this time too...

The Rick
06-24-2010, 11:23 AM
Picked up my iPhone 4 this morning.

Store opened at 7 AM. I had one reserved, but didn't want to take much time off work to get it, so I arrived at about 5:15-5:30 to wait in line. There were probably 100-200 people in front of me when I got in line.

This Apple store here in Milwaukee is in a mall, so we got to enter the mall at 6:00 AM and wait in line inside. There were two lines inside, one for people like me who had one reserved, and one for people who did not. In my reserved line, there were probably about 50 people in front of me.

As we were waiting in line, Apple Store employees came around with free water and gift certificates for free coffee.

They started letting people into the store at 7 AM sharp. I finally got in about 7:30 and had an employee assigned to me from time time I walked in to handle the entire transaction and activation. There were a couple of snags verifying my account with AT&T, but I was out of there no later than 8:00 AM with fully activated phone in hand.

My first impression of the phone is that the screen is unbelievable. Way better than I imagined. You really have to see it to believe it.

The Rick
06-24-2010, 11:24 AM
Picked up my iPhone 4 this morning.

Store opened at 7 AM. I had one reserved, but didn't want to take much time off work to get it, so I arrived at about 5:15-5:30 to wait in line. There were probably 100-200 people in front of me when I got in line.

This Apple store here in Milwaukee is in a mall, so we got to enter the mall at 6:00 AM and wait in line inside. There were two lines inside, one for people like me who had one reserved, and one for people who did not. In my reserved line, there were probably about 50 people in front of me.

As we were waiting in line, Apple Store employees came around with free water and gift certificates for free coffee.

They started letting people into the store at 7 AM sharp. I finally got in about 7:30 and had an employee assigned to me from time time I walked in to handle the entire transaction and activation. There were a couple of snags verifying my account with AT&T, but I was out of there no later than 8:00 AM with fully activated phone in hand.

My first impression of the phone is that the screen is unbelievable. Way better than I imagined. You really have to see it to believe it.
Also, I would estimate that total people in front of me and still in line when I left the mall was easily over 1000 people. It was crazy.

The Rick
06-24-2010, 11:49 AM
One final thing to note...I thought it was cool that AT&T had reps right there in the Apple Store ready to assist with any issues that arose. I guess they've learned their lessons from past launches.

Saulbadguy
06-24-2010, 11:51 AM
Wow, what a bunch of losers.

Fish
06-24-2010, 01:50 PM
Sounds like there's a problem with the reception from the antenna coming in contact with your hands. It's being reported by lots of people that the receptions drops from 5 bars to no signal when your hand comes in contact with the antenna...

http://gizmodo.com/5571171/iphone-4-loses-reception-when-you-hold-it-by-the-antenna-band

Lots of videos and explanation at the link.

Apple is saying "Not our problem, buy a case."

Guru
06-24-2010, 03:22 PM
Wow, what a bunch of losers.
I don't understand the need to wait in line like that either. Just like campers back with the Wii and PS3 came out.

I'll admit we did purchase a Wii that night but we were 2nd on the list, didn't arrive until 10 minutes before opening AND were out the dour at 12:05am going back home. So we only lost 15 minutes of our night while people at other stores gave up 2 full days waiting in line.

DMAC
06-24-2010, 03:31 PM
Sounds like there's a problem with the reception from the antenna coming in contact with your hands. It's being reported by lots of people that the receptions drops from 5 bars to no signal when your hand comes in contact with the antenna...

http://gizmodo.com/5571171/iphone-4-loses-reception-when-you-hold-it-by-the-antenna-band

Lots of videos and explanation at the link.

Apple is saying "Not our problem, buy a case."But weird....reports of not having the problem. I hope mine doesnt do that, I hate cases...and I hate you!

Fish
06-24-2010, 03:48 PM
But weird....reports of not having the problem. I hope mine doesnt do that, I hate cases...and I hate you!

Glad to help... :D

A couple users described fixing it with a piece of scotch tape over the antenna part....

The Rick
06-24-2010, 03:52 PM
Glad to help... :D

A couple users described fixing it with a piece of scotch tape over the antenna part....

Lots of people have apparently been unable to duplicate the problem (myself included). My strength of signal is noticeably better than before. :shrug:

Fish
06-24-2010, 04:07 PM
Lots of people have apparently been unable to duplicate the problem (myself included). My strength of signal is noticeably better than before. :shrug:

That's good to hear. I rarely have any signal issues with my 3GS, and the case on mine didn't affect the signal strength any.

I was surprised when they announced this kind of antenna setup though. Normally, whenever an antenna is physically altered by something else of decent size that's conductive coming directly in contact with it, the electrical properties of that antenna are changed drastically. Ham radios are a good example of that...

The Rick
06-24-2010, 08:00 PM
:)

Saulbadguy
06-24-2010, 09:56 PM
Lots of people have apparently been unable to duplicate the problem (myself included). My strength of signal is noticeably better than before. :shrug:

Yea right. If your new iPhone caught on fire and melted your scrotum you'd log on to Chiefsplanet to report that you are having "no problems" with your new Apple product.

Silock
06-25-2010, 12:19 AM
Yea right. If your new iPhone caught on fire and melted your scrotum you'd log on to Chiefsplanet to report that you are having "no problems" with your new Apple product.

On the other hand, if the iPhone cured cancer, Apple haters would find a way to hate it.

The Rick
06-25-2010, 06:56 AM
Yea right. If your new iPhone caught on fire and melted your scrotum you'd log on to Chiefsplanet to report that you are having "no problems" with your new Apple product.
Dude, what's your problem? Nothing better to do? If that's the case, I'm sorry your life sucks so much.

Saulbadguy
06-25-2010, 07:30 AM
On the other hand, if the iPhone cured cancer, Apple haters would find a way to hate it.

Agreed.