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Chiefshrink
06-21-2010, 10:50 PM
or both?

FAX
06-21-2010, 10:59 PM
When you snatch the marble from my hand, you will know the answer, Grasshopper.

Is a golf club sporting equipment or a weapon?

FAX

Chiefshrink
06-21-2010, 11:21 PM
When you snatch the marble from my hand, you will know the answer, Grasshopper.

Is a golf club sporting equipment or a weapon?

FAX

Gotcha:thumb:


Very little athleticism IMO. I see good golfers very much like good woodworking craftsmen whose touch improves overtime, being able to take a piece of wood and carve something beautiful and just like a good golfer takes a course and carves a beautiful score. Both study, measure and then apply their "skilled touch".

Either you have "the touch" or you never made it past Junior High Shop class(hackers for life-ME). Just swinging many types of clubs and walking 72 holes is not enough for me to be called a sport. Maybe if the PGA forced the golfers to carry their own bags for 72 holes then you could say there is a little exercise going on but still not quite enough for me.

Successfully swinging many types of golf clubs consistently is like working a "lathe" with many different lathe tools creating consistent beauty. Most can't do it.

Philosophical I know but I see alot of parallel here.

I marvel at people who can swing and create.

Next time you are on the course see yourself as a "craftsman" and I bet your score improves. Well maybe not mine.

FAX
06-21-2010, 11:24 PM
I see your point, Mr. sportsshrink. But, have you played a lot of golf? 18 holes can get a little tiresome sometimes. It's damn difficult to have the same swing on the first tee and the 18th. At least, it is for me. Golf requires quite a bit of muscle memory and stamina.

Although personally, I think golf is neither a skill nor sport. For me, it falls under the heading of "insanity".

FAX

Phobia
06-21-2010, 11:30 PM
I think a lot of people associate the word "sport" with something that is more aptly described as a "contact sport". There is little question that golf is a sport. It's not a contact sport and one is not required to be a physical specimen to participate but yet; sport.

Chiefshrink
06-21-2010, 11:32 PM
I see you point, Mr. sportsshrink. But, have you played a lot of golf? 18 holes can get a little tiresome sometimes. It's damn difficult to have the same swing on the first tee and the 18th. At least, it is for me. Golf requires quite a bit of muscle memory and stamina.

Although personally, I think golf is neither a skill nor a sport. For me, it falls under the heading of "insane".

FAX

Insane it is!!! But I still see the same parallel that you have just mentioned with either a custom builder "kickass carpenter" or specialized cabinet maker working all day with heavy wood at times, both must still have the same precision,stamina and mental focus as they did starting that morning.

FAX
06-21-2010, 11:37 PM
Insane it is!!! But I still the same parallel that you have just mentioned with either a custom builder "kickass carpenter" or specialized cabinet maker working all day with heavy wood at times, both must still have the same precision,stamina and mental focus as they did starting that morning.

All very true. The carpenter can take a break any time he wishes, though. And, of course, no one is keeping score so if he messes up, he just grabs another hunk of wood and begins anew.

This question was argued on here before, I believe, and the question of NASCAR came up as well. To me, I'm not sure that car racing should be termed "sport". It requires skill and stamina, but is it a sport? Not so sure.

FAX

Chiefshrink
06-21-2010, 11:38 PM
I think a lot of people associate the word "sport" with something that is more aptly described as a "contact sport". There is little question that golf is a sport. It's not a contact sport and one is not required to be a physical specimen to participate but yet; sport.

The question really is then how do you define sport? Is it that there must be "only" the element of competition regardless of the task at hand. I don't know of any "woodworking competition" and there definitely is a difference there.

Chiefshrink
06-21-2010, 11:41 PM
All very true. The carpenter can take a break any time he wishes, though. And, of course, no one is keeping score so if he messes up, he just grabs another hunk of wood and begins anew.

This question was argued on here before, I believe, and the question of NASCAR came up as well. To me, I'm not sure that car racing should be termed "sport". It requires skill and stamina, but is it a sport? Not so sure.

FAX

I see NASCAR just like Golf. Glad you brought that up because I had this same discussion with a friend of mine back home who thinks NASCAR is a sport and I told him no it is not.

FAX
06-21-2010, 11:42 PM
Generally, "sport" is defined as an activity governed by a previously agreed to set of rules and involves competition.

However, the "competition" could well be against oneself - you know, trying to beat your best time at unfastening a bra strap with one hand.

FAX

FAX
06-21-2010, 11:43 PM
I see NASCAR just like Golf. Glad you brought that up because I had this same discussion with a friend of mine back home who thinks NASCAR is a sport and I told him no it is not.

Some Planeteers will argue that point with you. Vehemently.

The problem with this topic is that "sport" means different things to different people. Not all "sport" is "athletic".

FAX

Chiefshrink
06-21-2010, 11:48 PM
Generally, "sport" is defined as an activity governed by a previously agreed to set of rules and involves competition.

However, the "competition" could well be against oneself - you know, trying to beat your best time at unfastening a bra strap with one hand.

FAX

Or with just your teeth:D Chicks dig that when you can actually show more "skill" than just your hands and your johnson.

I get your point and we'll just leave it to the "philosophical parallel".

FAX
06-21-2010, 11:49 PM
Some "nonathletic" sports might include Beer Pong, Checkers or Chess, Dressage, and Beaver Hunting among others.

Automobile racing is performed while seated and, although you press on pedals and turn a wheel, you're sweating - not due to exertion - but due to stress, anxiety, and/or heat.

FAX

Chiefshrink
06-21-2010, 11:51 PM
Some Planeteers will argue that point with you. Vehemently.

The problem with this topic is that "sport" means different things to different people. Not all "sport" is "athletic".

FAX

Oh I know, the "little badass Dale Ernhardt wanna be's" but it's all cool:clap:

cdcox
06-21-2010, 11:51 PM
It's a skort.

Chiefshrink
06-21-2010, 11:53 PM
It's a skort.

Clever!:clap:

rambleonthruthefog
06-22-2010, 12:36 AM
there is no running, jumping, tackling, sliding/diving, blocking, etc. so no it is not a sport. it is hard then a MFer, though.

Duck Dog
06-22-2010, 12:42 AM
It's neither. It's a game.

Fruit Ninja
06-22-2010, 01:07 AM
tell anyone who doesnt play golf to play 18 holes and after that 18 holes, you will fucking be tired and sore. Its a sport. Try to drive a nascar car 500 miles after your done, you will be exhausted and freaking sore.

Guru
06-22-2010, 01:09 AM
I play and I would consider it a skill before a sport. And I'm not skilled at it at all. LMAO

BigRichard
06-22-2010, 05:27 AM
tell anyone who doesnt play golf to play 18 holes and after that 18 holes, you will ****ing be tired and sore. Its a sport. Try to drive a nascar car 500 miles after your done, you will be exhausted and freaking sore.

When I get done tilling my garden I am relly tired. I don't think you would classify that as a sport would ya?

Garcia Bronco
06-22-2010, 06:04 AM
Anything with competition is a sport and it does require skill. 95 percent of the 50 million people that play Golf shoot above 90. It's hard. It's frustrating. Are golfers athletes? Semi-athletes.

KINGPIN CHIEFS FAN
06-22-2010, 06:57 AM
I would agree that it's a game but it has been made into a sport by making it a competition. Many games or activities have been made into a sport by seeing who can be the best at it, whether it's horse racing or Nascar or golf. Man's desire for competition and dominance combined with a monetary payoff makes it a sport.

PunkinDrublic
06-22-2010, 07:23 AM
tell anyone who doesnt play golf to play 18 holes and after that 18 holes, you will ****ing be tired and sore. Its a sport. Try to drive a nascar car 500 miles after your done, you will be exhausted and freaking sore.

That's why Men are able to play it well into their 70's. It's a very hard skill to learn and not everyone can do it but I'm sick of people calling Tiger the worlds greatest athlete. Golfers aren't athletes and nothing they do compares to what athletes in the big 3 sports is comparable.

morphius
06-22-2010, 07:31 AM
I tend to like to define sports as an athletic competition in which a competitor has direct influence, excluding mental pressure and just having someone slower or faster in your way. So I consider bowling and golf to both be skills/games, but tennis, soccer, baseball, boxing, etc would be sports because there you have an opponent using their athletic ability in a way that you have to react to immediatly. So there are a lot of very difficult skills/games that I don't consider sports, gymnastics, track and field, and Nascar would all be skills/games, not sports.

Sofa King
06-22-2010, 08:46 AM
http://i890.photobucket.com/albums/ac104/boyd507/golfcartdrift.gif

Saulbadguy
06-22-2010, 09:05 AM
Soccer is a sport.

Golf is a good walk ruined.

mikeyis4dcats.
06-22-2010, 09:08 AM
I view it as a game. To me, a sport requires a chance of physical contact between players during competition.

rambleonthruthefog
06-22-2010, 09:47 AM
how can it be a sport if there is no running?

Sofa King
06-22-2010, 09:48 AM
how can it be a sport if there is no running?

There is... all it requires is one bad slice.... they run for their lives and you run to the back of the group you're golfing with....

jspchief
06-22-2010, 09:56 AM
I look at 2 things when considering whether something is a sport.

1. Does it require a particular physical skill set?
2. Is it done for score/competition?

That may not be the end all of the debate, but it's my initial benchmark. And by those standards golf is certainly a sport.

Sofa King
06-22-2010, 10:00 AM
I look at 2 things when considering whether something is a sport.

1. Does it require a particular physical skill set?
2. Is it done for score/competition?

That may not be the end all of the debate, but it's my initial benchmark. And by those standards golf is certainly a sport.

I feel pretty much the same way... unless it's performed by women.... :D

mikeyis4dcats.
06-22-2010, 10:02 AM
I look at 2 things when considering whether something is a sport.

1. Does it require a particular physical skill set?
2. Is it done for score/competition?

That may not be the end all of the debate, but it's my initial benchmark. And by those standards golf is certainly a sport.

by those standards horseshoes is a sport.

jspchief
06-22-2010, 10:05 AM
by those standards horseshoes is a sport.And billiards.

Pitt Gorilla
06-22-2010, 10:19 AM
I tend to like to define sports as an athletic competition in which a competitor has direct influence, excluding mental pressure and just having someone slower or faster in your way. So I consider bowling and golf to both be skills/games, but tennis, soccer, baseball, boxing, etc would be sports because there you have an opponent using their athletic ability in a way that you have to react to immediatly. So there are a lot of very difficult skills/games that I don't consider sports, gymnastics, track and field, and Nascar would all be skills/games, not sports.This. If the other golfers could shove the golfer while he was trying to hit the ball or if they could stand by the cup and knock the shots away, it would approach a sport.

Nascar and some track & field events are closer, I would argue, due to the fact "defense" (shoving, bumping, etc.) can be used to gain advantage.

Pitt Gorilla
06-22-2010, 10:20 AM
by those standards horseshoes is a sport.Beer pong, paper football, PS3, etc.

Chiefs Pantalones
06-22-2010, 10:21 AM
It's a skill. I hate it when people call Tiger and all those other golfers "athletes." I laugh my ass off when I hear that. They aren't athletes.

Pitt Gorilla
06-22-2010, 10:22 AM
Anything with competition is a sport and it does require skill. 95 percent of the 50 million people that play Golf shoot above 90. It's hard. It's frustrating. Are golfers athletes? Semi-athletes.High-school debate is a sport?

PunkinDrublic
06-22-2010, 10:25 AM
It's a skill. I hate it when people call Tiger and all those other golfers "athletes." I laugh my ass off when I hear that. They aren't athletes.

This. If people are going to say golf is a sport then they would have to include bowling. Bowling isn't held in high regard because it isn't filled with elitist douchebags the way golf is.

Pants
06-22-2010, 10:26 AM
Skill vs skill in a competition = sport. No?

SCTrojan
06-22-2010, 11:07 AM
My rule of thumb is if you can comfortably smoke a cigar while doing it, it's not a sport.

'Hamas' Jenkins
06-22-2010, 11:19 AM
The biggest problem with the perception of golf is the fact that pro players have caddies and most people who play on the weekend ride in carts.

Walking 18 holes in 90 degree heat while carrying your bag requires a lot more stamina than people think.

Also, being able to execute the swing, which requires strength, flexibility, and timing, is an incredibly athletic move.

And NASCAR isn't a good analogy.

You could give Tiger hickory shafted clubs and a gutta percha and he'd still kill me by 15 strokes.

You put me in a Ferrari and Jimmy Johnson in a Model T, and he's getting smoked.

NASCAR is basically a mechanical version of horse racing.

Gonzo
06-22-2010, 11:27 AM
I've been playing golf since 1985 and made the Varsity team in H.S. as a freshman. When I was 13, I shot even par for 18 at the toughest course in NE. I played well over 108 holes per week and could drive over 280 yards before I was 15.
I never drove a cart, always carried my clubs and never cheated.

When I turned 17 I gave it up because I was so sick of it. Ten years ago I started up again and played once a week. I figred with a little practice I could get back to scratch golf. I have only shot even par once, (last week) since I started up again.
Short answer, for people who go out once a week, drive carts and drink beer:
No, it's not a sport. It's a hobby.

For people who play the game with passion and actually walk the course on a 90+ degree day then yes, it's a sport that requires a degree of muscle conditioning.

FTR, I now have a 8 handicap and can pop the ball 300 yards, (on a good day).

RustShack
06-22-2010, 11:29 AM
Theres nothing athletic about golf. Thats why old men play it.

FAX
06-22-2010, 11:30 AM
My rule of thumb is if you can comfortably smoke a cigar while doing it, it's not a sport.

And the martinis, Mr. SCTrojan. Don't forget the martinis.

I approach golf as a serious sport and I play my very best with a cigar and a thermos of martinis.

FAX

boogblaster
06-22-2010, 11:34 AM
skill yes .. sporting true .. the fellowship boring and stuff-shirted ....

Deberg_1990
06-22-2010, 11:52 AM
Is NASCAR and other alledged motor sports a skill or sport?

Pants
06-22-2010, 12:01 PM
Is NASCAR and other alledged motor sports a skill or sport?

People don't realize how physically demanding it is to drive a fast race car around the track. Your arms, back and neck start to give out on you after a while of pulling crazy g's.

BWillie
06-22-2010, 12:01 PM
Golf is considered to be a sport, but just because it requires little athleticism doesn't mean it's not a sport. It's a skill and a sport. Being a pitcher doesn't require alot of athleticism either. Some people can just wake up and do it despite being fat or slow etc. Contrastingly, if you are a marathon runner, that is almost all acquired skill until you get to the top levels. You work your way up to that. I don't think anybody would consider marathon running not to be a sport.

FAX
06-22-2010, 12:04 PM
skill yes .. sporting true .. the fellowship boring and stuff-shirted ....

Not really, Mr. boogblaster. In some cases, yes ... but not always. Some golfers are pretty cool people who just happen to have developed an obsession with hitting and then chasing a little, white ball around for no good reason.

FAX

Phobia
06-22-2010, 12:10 PM
Is tossing a football around in the back yard a sport? No, it's not. Comparably, tossing the football is what fully 98% of "golfers" do on the course. Is that a sport? No it's not.

But for the people who play the game how it was intended to be played in the full spirit of competition it's fully a sport.

There's the rub. Lots of people toss the ball around but only a small percentage play the sport.

Deberg_1990
06-22-2010, 12:16 PM
People don't realize how physically demanding it is to drive a fast race car around the track. Your arms, back and neck start to give out on you after a while of pulling crazy g's.

Sure.....wont deny that...but those guys are not athletes.

Even if you think they are for the sake of argument, too many other factors are involved for them to be successful than just their athletic skills. (I.E. the car, the pit crew, etc....)

Pants
06-22-2010, 01:07 PM
Sure.....wont deny that...but those guys are not athletes.

Even if you think they are for the sake of argument, too many other factors are involved for them to be successful than just their athletic skills. (I.E. the car, the pit crew, etc....)

LMAO

Scuderia Ferrari once had all their drivers hurt for a race so they had to put their test driver of something like 12 years into the cockpit for a race... Now, this guy drove their iterations of F1 cars more than anyone for a decade. You know where he finished the race at? FOURTEEN seconds behind the field. 14 seconds in F1 is like an eternity, it's embarrassing. And this guy had the most F1 experience on the race track. To be a good race driver, you have to have God-given talent, proper schooling and be in a top physical condition. Racing is no joke.

BWillie
06-22-2010, 02:10 PM
Theres nothing athletic about golf. Thats why old men play it.

Yeah, but how good are they at it?

Mr. Laz
06-22-2010, 02:13 PM
it's a freaking skill just like Nascar and Billiards


just because golf is played on a HUUUUUUUUUGE "table" doesn't mean it's not a skill like billiards.

BWillie
06-22-2010, 02:27 PM
Sport: a. Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively.

Like it or not, but that includes a whole hell of alot of things. It's just the way it is, and that is how it is defined. Athletic sport? Probably not, but a sport nonetheless. It is a physical activity. Golf is a sport, end of story. If you don't like it, you are wrong. Go change the definition of the word, then you can say it's not a sport.

Great Expectations
06-22-2010, 02:36 PM
With Motorsports women can compete with men w/out having to level the playing field. Anika Sorenstam can't compete with the guys playing the same tees.

Saulbadguy
06-22-2010, 02:39 PM
With Motorsports women can compete with men w/out having to level the playing field.

Come on, now.

BWillie
06-22-2010, 02:40 PM
Come on, now.

? He's right. Danica, like in horse racing, has an advantage especially in Indy car as she is so light too.

morphius
06-22-2010, 03:14 PM
Golf is considered to be a sport, but just because it requires little athleticism doesn't mean it's not a sport. It's a skill and a sport. Being a pitcher doesn't require alot of athleticism either. Some people can just wake up and do it despite being fat or slow etc. Contrastingly, if you are a marathon runner, that is almost all acquired skill until you get to the top levels. You work your way up to that. I don't think anybody would consider marathon running not to be a sport.
I wouldn't call a marathon a sport, I would call it a race.

'Hamas' Jenkins
06-22-2010, 03:15 PM
There isn't a woman on Earth who could have shot +50 for the tournament at an average US Open (7400 yards, 5" rough, super tight pins, greens rolling 13+)

Pants
06-22-2010, 03:15 PM
I wouldn't call a marathon a sport, I would call it a race.

Marathon doesn't require skill.

Valiant
06-22-2010, 04:24 PM
I think a lot of people associate the word "sport" with something that is more aptly described as a "contact sport". There is little question that golf is a sport. It's not a contact sport and one is not required to be a physical specimen to participate but yet; sport.

Disagree, of course I associate sport with athletic ability..

Golf has 80yo and 300 fat asses do well.. not a sport..
It is equal to darts and bowling..

Valiant
06-22-2010, 04:25 PM
Sport: a. Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively.

Like it or not, but that includes a whole hell of alot of things. It's just the way it is, and that is how it is defined. Athletic sport? Probably not, but a sport nonetheless. It is a physical activity. Golf is a sport, end of story. If you don't like it, you are wrong. Go change the definition of the word, then you can say it's not a sport.

Except it is not a physical activity..

epitome1170
06-22-2010, 04:36 PM
Disagree, of course I associate sport with athletic ability..

Golf has 80yo and 300 fat asses do well.. not a sport..
It is equal to darts and bowling..

Fat Pitchers in MLB - Bartolo Colon, Ray King, C.C. Sabbathia, David Wells to name a few

Some old Pitchers - Jamie Moyer, Clemens was 46 when he retired, Nolan Ryan was getting up there too.

By your logic, baseball is not a sport.... and I would have to say that there is definitely a higher percentage of fat asses playing football competively than golf (just playing devils advocate).

Valiant
06-22-2010, 04:41 PM
Fat Pitchers in MLB - Bartolo Colon, Ray King, C.C. Sabbathia, David Wells to name a few

Some old Pitchers - Jamie Moyer, Clemens was 46 when he retired, Nolan Ryan was getting up there too.

By your logic, baseball is not a sport.... and I would have to say that there is definitely a higher percentage of fat asses playing football competively than golf (just playing devils advocate).

I guess if 100% of baseball was pitchers you might have a point..

Phobia
06-22-2010, 04:42 PM
Disagree, of course I associate sport with athletic ability..

Golf has 80yo and 300 fat asses do well.. not a sport..
It is equal to darts and bowling..

Baseball has fatasses who can pitch well and play 1B well.

'Hamas' Jenkins
06-22-2010, 04:47 PM
Hell, Shaq has been a fatass for most of his NBA career.

Pitt Gorilla
06-22-2010, 04:48 PM
Golf is considered to be a sport, but just because it requires little athleticism doesn't mean it's not a sport. It's a skill and a sport. Being a pitcher doesn't require alot of athleticism either. Some people can just wake up and do it despite being fat or slow etc. Contrastingly, if you are a marathon runner, that is almost all acquired skill until you get to the top levels. You work your way up to that. I don't think anybody would consider marathon running not to be a sport.The pitcher is essentially facing a "defense" of sorts, in that the batter is a key to his success or lack thereof. That is the key element for a sport: a "defense."

'Hamas' Jenkins
06-22-2010, 04:50 PM
The pitcher is essentially facing a "defense" of sorts, in that the batter is a key to his success or lack thereof. That is the key element for a sport: a "defense."

So what would bunkers, rough, sloped greens, OB stakes, lateral hazards, trees, and lakes be?

Pitt Gorilla
06-22-2010, 04:54 PM
So what would bunkers, rough, sloped greens, OB stakes, lateral hazards, trees, and lakes be?Parts of the playing field, like boundary lines, backboards, etc. If you let the other golfers interfere with players swings or knock the ball off the path (like a goalie), you'd have a sport.

stevieray
06-22-2010, 04:55 PM
sport....? they sell the equipment in Sporting Goods...lol
skill...? takes uber-tons of practice to master.
pure adrenaline....? one great swing or stroke
pure anger management..? one bad swing or stroke.

'Hamas' Jenkins
06-22-2010, 04:56 PM
Parts of the playing field, like boundary lines, backboards, etc. If you let the other golfers interfere with players swings or knock the ball off the path (like a goalie), you'd have a sport.

Boundary lines and backboards are standardized. None of the other forms of hazard on a golf course are.

FAX
06-22-2010, 05:07 PM
How about bull- or bronc-riding, I wonder? For the most part, the animals are darn good athletes.

Is that a sport or skill or Cowboy Roulette?

FAX

BWillie
06-22-2010, 06:45 PM
Marathon doesn't require skill.

It requires acquired skill. You work your way up to running those. Nobody can run more than a few miles w/out working up to it.

Sweet Daddy Hate
06-22-2010, 06:49 PM
In as much as pool or darts are sports.

DJ's left nut
06-22-2010, 07:35 PM
If golf were purely a 'skill' Arnold Palmer would still be battling Jack for tour supremacy and women could hang with men.

Age clearly erodes their ability to compete professionally - that's a clear sign of physical fitness being a pre-requisite. If it were just raw skill, these guys would get better every day they did it until they became infirm.

Women can't even begin to compete with men at the highest levels, where physical differences can trump significant variances in raw skill.

I really don't know that anything else needs to be said.

Pitt Gorilla
06-22-2010, 07:44 PM
Boundary lines and backboards are standardized. None of the other forms of hazard on a golf course are.Boundary lines are standardized on a baseball field? You ought to check out the outfield dimensions of a few professional baseball parks. Similar to a baseball field, while each park/hole has unique features, these features remain nearly the same for each participant.

Pitt Gorilla
06-22-2010, 07:46 PM
If golf were purely a 'skill' Arnold Palmer would still be battling Jack for tour supremacy and women could hang with men.

Age clearly erodes their ability to compete professionally - that's a clear sign of physical fitness being a pre-requisite. If it were just raw skill, these guys would get better every day they did it until they became infirm.

Women can't even begin to compete with men at the highest levels, where physical differences can trump significant variances in raw skill.

I really don't know that anything else needs to be said.I think golf is a game.

However, I'm not sure I buy your point that skills don't diminish.

tk13
06-22-2010, 07:50 PM
It's absolutely a sport. I'd have to ask people who think golf is not a sport... do they think tennis is a sport?

DJ's left nut
06-22-2010, 08:11 PM
I think golf is a game.

However, I'm not sure I buy your point that skills don't diminish.

At 45?

Explain how 99% of golfers are better at 30 than they are at 45. They have 15 years of extra time to hone their skills.

It's because their bodies are no longer able to compete with younger, stronger players.

That's the earmark of a sport.

cdcox
06-22-2010, 08:19 PM
At 45?

Explain how 99% of golfers are better at 30 than they are at 45. They have 15 years of extra time to hone their skills.

It's because their bodies are no longer able to compete with younger, stronger players.

That's the earmark of a sport.

Then math and physics are sports too. Most great discoveries made in these fields are done by young guys under 40.

DJ's left nut
06-22-2010, 08:24 PM
Then math and physics are sports too. Most great discoveries made in these fields are done by young guys under 40.

Since when was your average mathmatician better at 30 than 40?

Yeah, they come up with their breakthrough at a young age...because 30 comes before 40. It's not like they could look at what the incredible accomplishment they came up with at 30 and be unable to understand or duplicate it at 40.

Those guys don't get any less brilliant as they age. In fact, by and large, it's quite the opposite. They build on their breakthroughs. They refine them. They perfect them.

BWillie
06-22-2010, 08:34 PM
If golf were purely a 'skill' Arnold Palmer would still be battling Jack for tour supremacy and women could hang with men.

Age clearly erodes their ability to compete professionally - that's a clear sign of physical fitness being a pre-requisite. If it were just raw skill, these guys would get better every day they did it until they became infirm.

Women can't even begin to compete with men at the highest levels, where physical differences can trump significant variances in raw skill.

I really don't know that anything else needs to be said.

You don't have to be in shape to be real good at golf. On my college golf team, the weakest kid on the team, the biggest pussy of them all bombed it and was a great golfer. I really think the correlation to being tall, your body being a certain proportion, and your flexibility is the biggest determining factor on being able to hit the ball far.

I'd say out of any sport I've ever played, you need to be mentally stable and focused to play golf well. That is why I never made it to an elite status. Because I wasn't mentally stable. I once had 47 putts on 18 holes in a college tournament and hit 17/18 greens and was on the fringe on the other one. I actually had the physical part down. I'm physically fit, much stronger than most golfers, doesn't mean I'm a great golfer. My best friend is 5'10'', 270 lbs, fat, can't even touch a basketball net and is probably the least athletic person I've ever seen, and he totally owns at golf. I watched him shoot 66 on a pro course from the pro tee's a few days after a Nike Tour event.

soundmind
06-22-2010, 08:36 PM
The original thread on this subject is somewhere in the 1930's....BUMP!

RJ
06-22-2010, 08:40 PM
Golf is a sport. The reason some people think it's not is that it looks like anyone should be able to do it.....thus making it a skill. But looks are deceiving.

Golf is a sport for which I possess an inadequate amount of skill.

Mr. Laz
06-22-2010, 08:43 PM
It's absolutely a sport. I'd have to ask people who think golf is not a sport... do they think tennis is a sport?
have you seen how much a pro tennis player has to run,slide,jump dive to play tennis?

no comparison

DJ's left nut
06-22-2010, 08:47 PM
You don't have to be in shape to be real good at golf. On my college golf team, the weakest kid on the team, the biggest pussy of them all bombed it and was a great golfer. I really think the correlation to being tall, your body being a certain proportion, and your flexibility is the biggest determining factor on being able to hit the ball far.

I'd say out of any sport I've ever played, you need to be mentally stable and focused to play golf well. That is why I never made it to an elite status. Because I wasn't mentally stable. I once had 47 putts on 18 holes in a college tournament and hit 17/18 greens and was on the fringe on the other one. I actually had the physical part down. I'm physically fit, much stronger than most golfers, doesn't mean I'm a great golfer. My best friend is 5'10'', 270 lbs, fat, can't even touch a basketball net and is probably the least athletic person I've ever seen, and he totally owns at golf. I watched him shoot 66 on a pro course from the pro tee's a few days after a Nike Tour event.

Being in great shape and being athletic are two entirely different animals.

Again - if all it took was mental stability, these guys would continue to improve through their 40s. They don't.

There is an unquestioned degree of physical acuity which one has to maintain to be able to compete at the highest levels.

Golfers are at their best through what is generally considered to be an individuals athletic prime. You're willing to ignore that? Chalk it up to coincidence? Of course not.

Golf's a sport and a skill.

Mr. Laz
06-22-2010, 08:56 PM
golf is a sport in the same way that Tee Ball is a sport

morphius
06-22-2010, 08:58 PM
have you seen how much a pro tennis player has to run,slide,jump dive to play tennis?

no comparison
And he has direct competition.

Phobia
06-22-2010, 09:00 PM
You don't have to be in shape to be real good at golf. On my college golf team, the weakest kid on the team, the biggest pussy of them all bombed it and was a great golfer. I really think the correlation to being tall, your body being a certain proportion, and your flexibility is the biggest determining factor on being able to hit the ball far.

I'd say out of any sport I've ever played, you need to be mentally stable and focused to play golf well. That is why I never made it to an elite status. Because I wasn't mentally stable. I once had 47 putts on 18 holes in a college tournament and hit 17/18 greens and was on the fringe on the other one. I actually had the physical part down. I'm physically fit, much stronger than most golfers, doesn't mean I'm a great golfer. My best friend is 5'10'', 270 lbs, fat, can't even touch a basketball net and is probably the least athletic person I've ever seen, and he totally owns at golf. I watched him shoot 66 on a pro course from the pro tee's a few days after a Nike Tour event.

Don't use your own experience as some modicum of reality. You've proven to be an idiot out here over and over again.

RJ
06-22-2010, 09:01 PM
Golf is the most difficult sport I have ever played regardless of what anyone calls it.

George Brett thinks it's a sport and he thinks it's more difficult than hitting major league pitching. Or so he said in an interview I heard a while back.

morphius
06-22-2010, 09:06 PM
So what would bunkers, rough, sloped greens, OB stakes, lateral hazards, trees, and lakes be?
Umm, part of the game, sort of like go directly to jail cards in monopoly, lol.

I don't consider male gymnastics a sport either, and those guys are some of the most fit, flexible people in the world. So my thoughts on golf not being a sport has more to do with the fact that it is just you against the course and elements, no other player can directly influence your play in any way other than indirectly through mental pressure. It is not saying golf is easy, my golf game is proof of that, or the players athletic ability.

RJ
06-22-2010, 09:09 PM
Umm, part of the game, sort of like go directly to jail cards in monopoly, lol.

I don't consider male gymnastics a sport either, and those guys are some of the most fit, flexible people in the world. So my thoughts on golf not being a sport has more to do with the fact that it is just you against the course and elements, no other player can directly influence your play in any way other than indirectly through mental pressure. It is not saying golf is easy, my golf game is proof of that, or the players athletic ability.


Is track a sport? Cause I think that describes most track and field events, at least the ones I ran.

Phobia
06-22-2010, 09:10 PM
Umm, part of the game, sort of like go directly to jail cards in monopoly, lol.

I don't consider male gymnastics a sport either, and those guys are some of the most fit, flexible people in the world. So my thoughts on golf not being a sport has more to do with the fact that it is just you against the course and elements, no other player can directly influence your play in any way other than indirectly through mental pressure. It is not saying golf is easy, my golf game is proof of that, or the players athletic ability.

Again - a person confusing contact sports with "sport". Two different things.

DJ's left nut
06-22-2010, 09:13 PM
Umm, part of the game, sort of like go directly to jail cards in monopoly, lol.

I don't consider male gymnastics a sport either, and those guys are some of the most fit, flexible people in the world. So my thoughts on golf not being a sport has more to do with the fact that it is just you against the course and elements, no other player can directly influence your play in any way other than indirectly through mental pressure. It is not saying golf is easy, my golf game is proof of that, or the players athletic ability.

This argument is truly terrible.

Gymnastics isn't a sport?

Evidently the 100m dash isn't either.

But pursuant to your definition, chess would be. Or checkers. Or scrabble.

Again, this argument is terrible.

morphius
06-22-2010, 09:14 PM
This argument is truly terrible.

Gymnastics isn't a sport?

Evidently the 100m dash isn't either.

But pursuant to your definition, chess would be. Or checkers. Or scrabble.

Again, this argument is terrible.
100 meter dash is a race, not a sport. This post does not stand alone, I was just answering a specific point. Go back earlier and read my first reply.

morphius
06-22-2010, 09:18 PM
Again - a person confusing contact sports with "sport". Two different things.
I understand the official definition would include golf, but it is so badly worded that it also would allow competitive guitar hero as a sport.

What do you mean by contact, as I consider tennis a sport from just a few posts ago.

DJ's left nut
06-22-2010, 09:18 PM
100 meter dash is a race, not a sport. This post does not stand alone, I was just answering a specific point. Go back earlier and read my first reply.

So the Olympic games, be they summer or winter, are not sports but rather races and/or events?

Because there are only about 5 competitions in either event that qualify as 'sports' under your rubric. Curling is one of them, downhill skiing isn't.

morphius
06-22-2010, 09:19 PM
Is track a sport? Cause I think that describes most track and field events, at least the ones I ran.
Track and field is not a sport either.

morphius
06-22-2010, 09:21 PM
So the Olympic games, be they summer or winter, are not sports but rather races and/or events?

Because there are only about 5 competitions in either event that qualify as 'sports' under your rubric. Curling is one of them, downhill skiing isn't.
It is called the Olympic GAMES after all, not the Olympic Sports.

DJ's left nut
06-22-2010, 09:26 PM
Uh...the prosecution rests?

People refer to football 'games' as well, not football 'sports'.

Your arguments suck because your perspective is retarded.

But hey, to each their own.

tk13
06-22-2010, 09:27 PM
I'm beginning to think some of you people are arguing just to argue. It's like saying football is not a sport because we call it a football game.

You get on a slippery slope with these things, eventually you can make an argument that almost anything is or isn't a sport.

RNR
06-22-2010, 09:28 PM
Golf is a good walk spoiled
Mark Twain~

morphius
06-22-2010, 09:29 PM
Uh...the prosecution rests?

People refer to football 'games' as well, not football 'sports'.

Your arguments suck because your perspective is retarded.

But hey, to each their own.
Games can be a sport, being a game doesn't make it a sport. If I can return your logic, then Uno is a sport because it is a game and you are now an idiot.

morphius
06-22-2010, 09:31 PM
I'm beginning to think some of you people are arguing just to argue. It's like saying football is not a sport because we call it a football game.

You get on a slippery slope with these things, eventually you can make an argument that almost anything is or isn't a sport.
I love when people take a single point and make it the entire argument.

RNR
06-22-2010, 09:31 PM
When a 60 year old man can defeat a 20 year old man, it ain't a sport~

morphius
06-22-2010, 09:34 PM
Uh...the prosecution rests?

People refer to football 'games' as well, not football 'sports'.

Your arguments suck because your perspective is retarded.

But hey, to each their own.
And I love how ball hurt some people get when I don't classify their competition of choice as a sport, even though I easily agree that most of them take a lot of hard work, athletic talent and skill. But somehow me not thinking of it as a sport somehow demeans them.

RNR
06-22-2010, 09:35 PM
And I love how ball hurt some people get when I don't classify their competition of choice as a sport, even though I easily agree that most of them take a lot of hard work, athletic talent and skill. But somehow me not thinking of it as a sport somehow demeans them.

If golf is a sport so is darts, pool and ping pong~

DJ's left nut
06-22-2010, 09:36 PM
Games can be a sport, being a game doesn't make it a sport. If I can return your logic, then Uno is a sport because it is a game and you are now an idiot.

But under your definition of sport, a definition requiring active intervention by an opponent, track cannot be a sport. Curling can.

Hell, under the logic you have put forward, Uno is closer to a sport than the decathlon because a 'skip' card can act as direct intervention by an opponent.

morphius
06-22-2010, 09:36 PM
If golf is a sport so is darts, pool and ping pong~
and don't leave out competitive guitar hero.

tk13
06-22-2010, 09:37 PM
I love when people take a single point and make it the entire argument.

I never said it was the entire argument. Don't be defensive.

I could buy someone saying the guy out hacking around on the weekend is playing a game, I guess.

But when you're talking about playing competitively... those people are playing golf as sport. In my book golf is a sport, track and field is a sport, race car driving is sport. But then you're the one making comparisons of various competitions as sport. But it's more than just competition.

Uno is not a sport. No card game is a sport... it comes down to the luck of the draw and there's no physical exertion, unless you are seriously out of shape.

RNR
06-22-2010, 09:38 PM
and don't leave out competitive guitar hero.

LMAO

Phobia
06-22-2010, 09:39 PM
I understand the official definition would include golf, but it is so badly worded that it also would allow competitive guitar hero as a sport.

What do you mean by contact, as I consider tennis a sport from just a few posts ago.

Tennis is a sport. It is not a contact sport.

Phobia
06-22-2010, 09:41 PM
If golf is a sport so is darts, pool and ping pong~

Ping Pong is a legitimate sport for Asians. It is not a sport for idiots slapping the ball around in the basement.

morphius
06-22-2010, 09:42 PM
But under your definition of sport, a definition requiring active intervention by an opponent, track cannot be a sport. Curling can.

Hell, under the logic you have put forward, Uno is closer to a sport than the decathlon because a 'skip' card can act as direct intervention by an opponent.
You have again ignore my first post which has my definition, which includes athletic ability.

morphius
06-22-2010, 09:44 PM
Tennis is a sport. It is not a contact sport.
So then I'm not confusing contact as sport. I would also consider ping pong a sport.

'Hamas' Jenkins
06-22-2010, 09:47 PM
When a 60 year old man can defeat a 20 year old man, it ain't a sport~

A 60 year old Gordie Howe could smoke plenty of 20 year old hockey players.

Larry Holmes and George Foreman were world class fighters into their late 40s.

This line of reasoning ignores history.

petegz28
06-22-2010, 09:47 PM
The question really is then how do you define sport? Is it that there must be "only" the element of competition regardless of the task at hand. I don't know of any "woodworking competition" and there definitely is a difference there.

They compete against others. There is a winner and losers. It is physical though not a contact sport. Neither is tennis, swimming, ice skating, etc, etc.


Golf is a sport. And with all sports it takes skill to be good at it. I think the only thing harder in sports than hitting a home run is hitting a hole in one.

petegz28
06-22-2010, 09:49 PM
If ping pong, track, swimming, diving, tennis and ice skating, among others, are not sports, then the Olympics is totally full of shit, man!

morphius
06-22-2010, 09:51 PM
If ping pong, track, swimming, diving, tennis and ice skating, among others, are not sports, then the Olympics is totally full of shit, man!
By shit I suppose you mean games?

'Hamas' Jenkins
06-22-2010, 09:51 PM
They compete against others. There is a winner and losers. It is physical though not a contact sport. Neither is tennis, swimming, ice skating, etc, etc.


Golf is a sport. And with all sports it takes skill to be good at it. I think the only thing harder in sports than hitting a home run is hitting a hole in one.

Hitting a home run is a threshold that only certain people can cross.

A hole in one is luck. You can hit the ball right on the center of the face from the tee dozens and dozens of times in a row and not get a hole in one.

There are so many minute, chaos theory factors at play in a hole in one, that it's near indescribable.

'Hamas' Jenkins
06-22-2010, 09:53 PM
For those who consider an opponent to be a threshold, then what do you think of the Ryder Cup, the President's Cup, the Accenture Match Play, the US Amateur, and the first several years of the PGA Championship?

petegz28
06-22-2010, 09:53 PM
By shit I suppose you mean games?

Most sports involve some sort of a game. Baseball game, soccer game, basketball game. But it would sound stupid to say the tennis game as opposed to match, or the track game as opposed to meet. Would it not?

Reerun_KC
06-22-2010, 09:55 PM
Love golf! Dont really care if it is a sport or a game or a skill... Its great bonding time with my 13 year old son....

I hope he continues to love it and enjoy the game as much as I do.. Heck maybe he will get a golf scholarship to a college somewhere and play this game/skill on a competitive level...

Who knows, but for now... Sport, Skill or Game, its about quality bonding time with my son. Thats whats most important.

petegz28
06-22-2010, 09:55 PM
Hitting a home run is a threshold that only certain people can cross.

A hole in one is luck. You can hit the ball right on the center of the face from the tee dozens and dozens of times in a row and not get a hole in one.

There are so many minute, chaos theory factors at play in a hole in one, that it's near indescribable.

I will tell you that both take a certain amount of luck and a shitload of skill. And one does not simply swing a club and luck into a hole in one. It takes a great amount of skill to hit one. Wind, spin on the ball, playing the green. I suppose someone could luck out and just swing a club blindly and get lucky. Then again someone could also luck out and hit the ball over the shortest wall in the field as well.

morphius
06-22-2010, 09:56 PM
Ping Pong is a legitimate sport for Asians. It is not a sport for idiots slapping the ball around in the basement.
I think you definition is pretty screwy, something about a game only being considered a sport if the person is really good at it makes it very difficult to use. Sort of like Football is a sport, until the kicker that shall not be named tries to kick the ball.

petegz28
06-22-2010, 09:58 PM
I think you definition is pretty screwy, something about a game only being considered a sport if the person is really good at it makes it very difficult to use. Sort of like Football is a sport, until the kicker that shall not be named tries to kick the ball.

I think Phil was trying to point out the difference between recreational and organized\professional.

philfree
06-22-2010, 09:58 PM
If golf is a sport so is darts, pool and ping pong~

The are. But what's the big deal of something being catogorized a "sport".

Why would someone take something like golf that has been considered a sport by many if not most people for many many years and say it's not a sport?

The whole thing is silly.

What ever makes you feel like a man I guess. And that's not aimed at just you RnR to be personal. It's aimed at the cull a sport crowd in general.

PhilFree:arrow:

'Hamas' Jenkins
06-22-2010, 10:01 PM
I will tell you that both take a certain amount of luck and a shitload of skill. And one does not simply swing a club and luck into a hole in one. It takes a great amount if skill to hit one. Wind, spin on the ball, playing the green. I suppose someone could luck out and just swing a club blindly and get lucky. Then again someone could also luck out and hit the ball over the shortest wall in the field as well.

The point that I'm trying to make is that there is no difference in the quality of shot between one that is struck pure and ends up an inch, or a foot, away, and one that goes in the hole.

The act of a hole in one is a tremendously lucky event, that is generally caused by executing a great swing. There are exceptions (My father in law getting one after a bounce from hitting a tree and David Toms' 5 wood on the 16th hole in the 3rd round of the 2001 PGA as examples), but a hole in one isn't even the best outcome one can get in golf. A double eagle is. But those are even rarer and still subject to luck.

If you ask Tiger what the best shot he ever hit was, he won't tell you the hole in one he made in Phoenix (or any of the other 18 he's made as a golfer), he actually says it's a long iron he hit from a fairway bunker in the Canadian Open.

The shot didn't go in, but he felt it was a far better swing.

Oh, and you don't read the green when you hit your tee shot on a par 3. You generally try and land the shot on the right tier, hoping that it will trickle near the hole if the green is so sloped. No one is plumb bobbing a 7 iron from 155.

morphius
06-22-2010, 10:02 PM
For those who consider an opponent to be a threshold, then what do you think of the Ryder Cup, the President's Cup, the Accenture Match Play, the US Amateur, and the first several years of the PGA Championship?
It doesn't really change a thing, I mean golf doesn't become a sport just because two/three guys tie and have to play in sudden death holes.

petegz28
06-22-2010, 10:03 PM
A sport is commonly defined as an organized, competitive, and skillful physical activity requiring commitment and fair play. It is governed by a set of rules or customs. In a sport the key factors are the physical capabilities and skills of the competitor when determining the outcome (winning or losing). The physical activity involves the movement of people, animals and/or a variety of objects such as balls and machines. In contrast, games such as card games and board games, though these could be called mind sports, require only mental skills. Non-competitive activities such as jogging and rock-climbing, are usually classified as recreations.

Physical events such as scoring goals or crossing a line first often define the result of a sport. However the degree of skill in some sports such as diving, dressage and figure skating is judged according to well-defined criteria. This is in contrast with other judged activities such as beauty pageants and body-building shows, where skill does not have to be shown and the criteria are not as well defined.

Accurate records are kept and updated for most sports at the highest levels, while failures and accomplishments are widely announced in sport news. Sports are most often played just for fun or for the simple fact that people need exercise to stay in good physical condition. However professional sport is a major source of entertainment.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sport

petegz28
06-22-2010, 10:07 PM
The point that I'm trying to make is that there is no difference in the quality of shot between one that is struck pure and ends up an inch, or a foot, away, and one that goes in the hole.

The act of a hole in one is a tremendously lucky event, that is generally caused by executing a great swing. There are exceptions (My father in law getting one after a bounce from hitting a tree and David Toms' 5 wood on the 16th hole in the 3rd round of the 2001 PGA as examples), but a hole in one isn't even the best outcome one can get in golf. A double eagle is. But those are even rarer and still subject to luck.

If you ask Tiger what the best shot he ever hit was, he won't tell you the hole in one he made in Phoenix (or any of the other 18 he's made as a golfer), he actually says it's a long iron he hit from a fairway bunker in the Canadian Open.

The shot didn't go in, but he felt it was a far better swing.

Oh, and you don't read the green when you hit your tee shot on a par 3. You generally try and land the shot on the right tier, hoping that it will trickle near the hole if the green is so sloped. No one is plumb bobbing a 7 iron from 155.

Yes you do read the green, or I should say play the green on a par 3. Knowing the green and how it plays definitely effects the shot you take.Pin placement and the contour of the green are very much in play. Simply hitting it pin-high is not always the best shot unless your are within a few feet of the cup. There is a reason they have pin placements and layouts of the green on scorecards.

philfree
06-22-2010, 10:15 PM
The point that I'm trying to make is that there is no difference in the quality of shot between one that is struck pure and ends up an inch, or a foot, away, and one that goes in the hole.

The act of a hole in one is a tremendously lucky event, that is generally caused by executing a great swing. There are exceptions (My father in law getting one after a bounce from hitting a tree and David Toms' 5 wood on the 16th hole in the 3rd round of the 2001 PGA as examples), but a hole in one isn't even the best outcome one can get in golf. A double eagle is. But those are even rarer and still subject to luck.

If you ask Tiger what the best shot he ever hit was, he won't tell you the hole in one he made in Phoenix (or any of the other 18 he's made as a golfer), he actually says it's a long iron he hit from a fairway bunker in the Canadian Open.

The shot didn't go in, but he felt it was a far better swing.

Oh, and you don't read the green when you hit your tee shot on a par 3. You generally try and land the shot on the right tier, hoping that it will trickle near the hole if the green is so sloped. No one is plumb bobbing a 7 iron from 155.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that most hole-in-ones are a result of luck and frequency of play. Except in my case where I've never made one.:( I'm trying to think of ones that I've witnessed and I can only come up with one. One of my dads three..or is it four? I might be forgetting one...hmmm...

Not to say that skill/ability has nothing to do with it because it does........ with some players.

Lot's of lucky holes-in-ones.

PhilFree:arrow:

Phobia
06-22-2010, 10:53 PM
I think you definition is pretty screwy, something about a game only being considered a sport if the person is really good at it makes it very difficult to use. Sort of like Football is a sport, until the kicker that shall not be named tries to kick the ball.

It's a sport period but when non-sportsmen compete it's not. Kinda like when I pay my $500 to drive a NASCAR racecar around the track, I'm not competing in the sport.

Phobia
06-22-2010, 10:55 PM
Holes-in one have an element of luck but if you're consistently sticking a ball close when they drop there's skill involved there too.

My brother and I both golf and have never hit one. But my little sister hit a driver 108 yards during a corporate outing and dribbled one into the hole. That's luck.

BWillie
06-23-2010, 12:17 AM
Don't use your own experience as some modicum of reality. You've proven to be an idiot out here over and over again.

? I am just making the point that you don't have to be physical fit, really at all, to be good at golf, or even great at golf. I am saying to be an elite golfer, you need to have a strong mental aptitude. I'm not discounting golf as a sport, because it is. You just don't have to be athletic to be good at it. I've seen many many guys who have the raw talent and will light it up in practice rounds. Then when they get into a big tournament, they never play the way they are capable of playing. The mental game, is the most important part of playing golf. It plays a crucial determining factor in how you manage your way around the course, and most of the time how well your short game is.

How that makes me an idiot is beyond me

epitome1170
06-23-2010, 05:37 AM
? I am just making the point that you don't have to be physical fit, really at all, to be good at golf, or even great at golf. I am saying to be an elite golfer, you need to have a strong mental aptitude. I'm not discounting golf as a sport, because it is. You just don't have to be athletic to be good at it. I've seen many many guys who have the raw talent and will light it up in practice rounds. Then when they get into a big tournament, they never play the way they are capable of playing. The mental game, is the most important part of playing golf. It plays a crucial determining factor in how you manage your way around the course, and most of the time how well your short game is.

How that makes me an idiot is beyond me

Well shit... I know a lot of mentally strong guys... since that is the MOST IMPORTANT thing then they should be able to go on tour soon.

BossChief
06-23-2010, 07:18 AM
sport (spôrt, sprt)
n.
1.
a. Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively.
b. A particular form of this activity.
2. An activity involving physical exertion and skill that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often undertaken competitively.
3. An active pastime; recreation.

by this definition on free online dictionary, it is a sport.

stevieray
06-23-2010, 07:44 AM
sport (spôrt, sprt)
n.
1.
a. Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively.
b. A particular form of this activity.
2. An activity involving physical exertion and skill that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often undertaken competitively.
3. An active pastime; recreation.




by this definition on free online dictionary, it is a sport.
where are your golf clubs?

back in the paint dept.

BossChief
06-23-2010, 07:47 AM
where are your golf clubs?

back in the paint dept.

:spock:

No offense but sporting goods is where you find them, buddy.

SPORTing goods

CosmicPal
06-23-2010, 08:12 AM
Those of you who've never played golf will never comprehend the extreme difficulty and skill required to play golf.

Take for instance the playing field these guys play on. They're not playing on your wide open community golf course with straight fairways that lead to a giant green with a tiny bunker on the right a small maple tree sitting behind the green.

No, these pros are playing on golf courses where fairways are no wider than your living room. Each fairway is loaded with natural hazards and every green is surrounded by bunkers bigger than your swimming pool. Shots on these courses require a precision beyond anything you can ever comprehend.

If you've EVER tried to smoke a ball off the tee, then only you can understand and appreciate the great skill required to drive a ball 300 yards through a hallway filled with hazards and place that ball precisely in the middle of the fairway.

People who claim golf is not a skill sport are simply ignorant and have never played the sport. It requires a person many years of training and practice to even become a scratch golfer. I was a single-digit handicapper during my teens, but only because I was playing and practicing golf every single day. I won tournaments, played golf in high school, and received several scholarship offers to play in college. But, I could never get beyond that level of improvement and that's what divides the pros from the scores of very good amateur golfers out there.

I even have a buddy of mine, a longtime friend who is a golf pro in KC. He's a teaching pro. He'd smoke ANY of you guys on the course, but guess what- he'd never be able to compete on the tour. He just isn't that good enough. A lot of it is the mental stamina required to play. So, not only do you need to learn how to hit a golf ball between the trunk of two maple trees with your ball buried in a pile of leaves, but you must be able to put that ball on the green which these pros do all the time. The rest of you whack jobs would shank that ball off the trunk of a tree, shout out an expletive, and throw your club down in disgust. The next time you do that, remember exactly how difficult it was to make that shot and you will finally see how golf is indeed one of the OLDEST skill sports known to man.

milkman
06-23-2010, 08:21 AM
My definitions.

Sport-Competition whose outcome is determined by direct or indirect physical confrontation between participants.

Athletic competition-Outcome determined by judging.

Game-nonathletic competition.

RJ
06-23-2010, 08:27 AM
Track and field is not a sport either.


Then I've been misled.

Sweet Daddy Hate
06-23-2010, 11:48 AM
How do people watch golf on TV? I mean really.

Sweet Daddy Hate
06-23-2010, 11:49 AM
It makes TV Baseball look exciting by comparison.

Sweet Daddy Hate
06-23-2010, 11:49 AM
And TV Baseball sucks ass.

Pestilence
06-23-2010, 11:54 AM
Those of you who've never played golf will never comprehend the extreme difficulty and skill required to play golf.

Take for instance the playing field these guys play on. They're not playing on your wide open community golf course with straight fairways that lead to a giant green with a tiny bunker on the right a small maple tree sitting behind the green.

No, these pros are playing on golf courses where fairways are no wider than your living room. Each fairway is loaded with natural hazards and every green is surrounded by bunkers bigger than your swimming pool. Shots on these courses require a precision beyond anything you can ever comprehend.

If you've EVER tried to smoke a ball off the tee, then only you can understand and appreciate the great skill required to drive a ball 300 yards through a hallway filled with hazards and place that ball precisely in the middle of the fairway.

People who claim golf is not a skill sport are simply ignorant and have never played the sport. It requires a person many years of training and practice to even become a scratch golfer. I was a single-digit handicapper during my teens, but only because I was playing and practicing golf every single day. I won tournaments, played golf in high school, and received several scholarship offers to play in college. But, I could never get beyond that level of improvement and that's what divides the pros from the scores of very good amateur golfers out there.

I even have a buddy of mine, a longtime friend who is a golf pro in KC. He's a teaching pro. He'd smoke ANY of you guys on the course, but guess what- he'd never be able to compete on the tour. He just isn't that good enough. A lot of it is the mental stamina required to play. So, not only do you need to learn how to hit a golf ball between the trunk of two maple trees with your ball buried in a pile of leaves, but you must be able to put that ball on the green which these pros do all the time. The rest of you whack jobs would shank that ball off the trunk of a tree, shout out an expletive, and throw your club down in disgust. The next time you do that, remember exactly how difficult it was to make that shot and you will finally see how golf is indeed one of the OLDEST skill sports known to man.

This.

Sweet Daddy Hate
06-23-2010, 12:01 PM
The next time you do that, remember exactly how difficult it was to make that shot and you will finally see how golf is indeed one of the OLDEST skill sports known to man


Couldn't we just go back to playing kick-ball with human heads instead? That's old too, and much more exciting!

Garcia Bronco
06-23-2010, 12:47 PM
How do people watch golf on TV? I mean really. Majors are fun to watch. If you missed the final two rounds of theMasters, you missed some epic golf by Phil Mickelson.

CosmicPal
06-23-2010, 01:15 PM
How do people watch golf on TV? I mean really.

You don't follow the sport, nor do you play the sport. Therefore, you do not have any appreciation for it and the immense skill required to play it. Every single hole, every single shot presents its unique challenges.

You can equate this lack of interest to that girlfriend of ours who has absolutely no interest in watching football with us every Sunday. She's never played the game, and she's never watched the game. She doesn't understand nor appreciate the game for what it is. Therefore, she doesn't understand why we invest so much time into watching it and thinks football is boring.

ROR- I'm not pointing you out specifically, I'm just replying to that "How can people watch it on TV?" response.

There are a lot of sports that people don't watch and if you ask someone why they don't watch it, their usual response is, is because they don't understand it, nor do they understand the rules.

To people in the South, hockey is a boring sport- just a bunch of guys going up and down the ice slapping a puck around. Very few people in the South play hockey, therefore, it is not a popular sport in the south.

Sure, people understand the basic goal of golf is to have the lowest score. But people don't understand the exact precision required to launch a golf ball 300 yards and have it land in an area no bigger than your bedroom each and every time.

Have you ever tried putting on a professionally designed golf green? I very much doubt it. These greens, particularly in Augusta, Georgia where the Masters is played every year, are nothing but rolling, sloping, fast greens with very short grass. What looks like an easy putt to you on TV is actually a downhill putt that should the golfer miss it, it will roll all the way off the green.

I'll admit I don't watch golf that much these days. But I do watch all the majors. It's an exciting sport to watch on television- but it's exciting to me because I've been playing golf since I was five-years old.

RNR
06-23-2010, 03:54 PM
A 60 year old Gordie Howe could smoke plenty of 20 year old hockey players.

Larry Holmes and George Foreman were world class fighters into their late 40s.

This line of reasoning ignores history.

You are talking greatest of all time. The average 60 can go out and beat an average 20 year old in the game of golf. It is a skill not a sport IMO

RNR
06-23-2010, 03:59 PM
The are. But what's the big deal of something being catogorized a "sport".

Why would someone take something like golf that has been considered a sport by many if not most people for many many years and say it's not a sport?

The whole thing is silly.

What ever makes you feel like a man I guess. And that's not aimed at just you RnR to be personal. It's aimed at the cull a sport crowd in general.

PhilFree:arrow:

I consider it a game of skill and it takes great skill to be good at it. It has nothing to do with being a man. It is not a macho thing it is my perspective of the game. If you disagree with that fine. We just see it differently~

'Hamas' Jenkins
06-23-2010, 04:01 PM
You are talking greatest of all time. The average 60 can go out and beat an average 20 year old in the game of golf. It is a skill not a sport IMO

No, they can't.

The average sixty year old has far less strength and flexibility. Play them on the back tees and two guys with similar talent, and the younger guy will win because of his superior strength and flexibility.

RNR
06-23-2010, 04:05 PM
No, they can't.

The average sixty year old has far less strength and flexibility. Play them on the back tees and two guys with similar talent, and the younger guy will win because of his superior strength and flexibility.

Read my viewpoint in my reply to PhilFree. That is where I stand on the subject. It is not important enough to me to debate about it much. This is the most I have talked about golf in my life~

CosmicPal
06-23-2010, 04:09 PM
It is not important enough to me to debate about it much. This is the most I have talked about golf in my life~

Then don't reply. 'Cause the fact is, if you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, then you should refrain from discussing the subject at hand. And it is evidently clear, you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about when it comes to the sport of golf.

PunkinDrublic
06-23-2010, 04:13 PM
A 60 year old Gordie Howe could smoke plenty of 20 year old hockey players.

Larry Holmes and George Foreman were world class fighters into their late 40s.

This line of reasoning ignores history.

Those are exceptions and you know it. Get back to me when retirement facilities include boxing rings and hockey rinks. The average 60 year old isn't playing hockey or in a boxing rink. The golf course however is filled with geriactric folks.

RNR
06-23-2010, 04:16 PM
Then don't reply. 'Cause the fact is, if you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, then you should refrain from discussing the subject at hand. And it is evidently clear, you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about when it comes to the sport of golf.

F&ck off I stated my opinion on it a friendly manner Mr golf pro guy.

'Hamas' Jenkins
06-23-2010, 04:29 PM
Those are exceptions and you know it. Get back to me when retirement facilities include boxing rings and hockey rinks. The average 60 year old isn't playing hockey or in a boxing rink. The golf course however is filled with geriactric folks.

And 5 year olds use Nerf hoops.

It doesn't detract from basketball.

Old people do all kinds of swimming.

It doesn't detract from competitive swimming, either.

Spott
06-23-2010, 04:31 PM
It's a non-athletic sport, just like pool, darts, etc.

PunkinDrublic
06-23-2010, 04:34 PM
And 5 year olds use Nerf hoops.

It doesn't detract from basketball.

Old people do all kinds of swimming.

It doesn't detract from competitive swimming, either.

ROFL sorry I have to laugh at that argument.

CosmicPal
06-23-2010, 04:36 PM
The golf course however is filled with geriactric folks.

That's called retirement. Jeezus phucking krist. Retired people with money golf every day and they do it for fun and relaxation.

How many 60 year olds are on the pro tour? (And we're not talking about the Senior Tour here.)

Those that ARE showing up for the majors and are 60 years-old are doing so because the course fits their game. There are some courses that don't have 500 yard par 4's and 300 yard par 3's and these tourneys are a good fit for those tenured pros because the field is shorter and requires a different golf game.

More often than not, the veteran golfers don't make even make the cut. You put the young pros up against a veteran golfer on a long course, and the young pros will win every time.

RNR
06-23-2010, 04:38 PM
It's a non-athletic sport, just like pool, darts, etc.

That is how I see it and that seems to of offended one poster :rolleyes: I think it takes great skill to play the game and there are men and women who make huge bank playing it. It reminds me of NASCAR they are very skilled drivers but I do not view it as a sport. Many call NASCAR a sport though.

PunkinDrublic
06-23-2010, 04:43 PM
That's called retirement. Jeezus phucking krist. Retired people with money golf every day and they do it for fun and relaxation.

How many 60 year olds are on the pro tour? (And we're not talking about the Senior Tour here.)

Those that ARE showing up for the majors and are 60 years-old are doing so because the course fits their game. There are some courses that don't have 500 yard par 4's and 300 yard par 3's and these tourneys are a good fit for those tenured pros because the field is shorter and requires a different golf game.

More often than not, the veteran golfers don't make even make the cut. You put the young pros up against a veteran golfer on a long course, and the young pros will win every time.

How many retired people are boxing, playing hoops football or baseball. Slow pitch softball doesn't count.

Sweet Daddy Hate
06-23-2010, 04:45 PM
That is how I see it and that seems to of offended one poster :rolleyes: I think it takes great skill to play the game and there are men and women who make huge bank playing it. It reminds me of NASCAR they are very skilled drivers but I do not view it as a sport. Many call NASCAR a sport though.

I call it a drinking game.

RNR
06-23-2010, 04:46 PM
I call it a drinking game.

I often drink while watching it if that counts :)

PunkinDrublic
06-23-2010, 04:48 PM
I call it a drinking game.

I call it hillbilly eliminator.

Sweet Daddy Hate
06-23-2010, 04:48 PM
I often drink while watching it if that counts :)

BINGO! :D

Sweet Daddy Hate
06-23-2010, 04:49 PM
I call it hillbilly eliminator.

That's not very nice, sir. :evil:

BIG_DADDY
06-23-2010, 04:49 PM
How many retired people are boxing, playing hoops football or baseball. Slow pitch softball doesn't count.

This guy can't seem to pull it off

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9m3GyDh6M8

CosmicPal
06-23-2010, 04:53 PM
That is how I see it and that seems to of offended one poster :rolleyes:

If that "one poster" you are so affectionately referring to is me, you have it all wrong. I am not by ANY means offended. I'm just relaying the fact that golf requires a skillset most people can never comprehend and will never ever reach no matter how many time they practice, take lessons, and play.

It reminds me of NASCAR they are very skilled drivers but I do not view it as a sport. Many call NASCAR a sport though.

Golf has many obstacles. NASCAR is driving around in circles with a well-oiled machine.

CosmicPal
06-23-2010, 04:54 PM
How many retired people are boxing, playing hoops football or baseball. Slow pitch softball doesn't count.

And your point is...Sherlock?

RNR
06-23-2010, 04:56 PM
If that "one poster" you are so affectionately referring to is me, you have it all wrong. I am not by ANY means offended. I'm just relaying the fact that golf requires a skillset most people can never comprehend and will never ever reach no matter how many time they practice, take lessons, and play.



Golf has many obstacles. NASCAR is driving around in circles with a well-oiled machine.

LMAO and to think you called me out for knowing nothing about golf~

CosmicPal
06-23-2010, 04:57 PM
LMAO and to think you called me out for knowing nothing about golf~

Well, you don't.

PunkinDrublic
06-23-2010, 05:00 PM
And your point is...Sherlock?

Golf is a game of skill not a sport.

RNR
06-23-2010, 05:02 PM
Well, you don't.

And you know nothing about NASCAR but I feel no desire to go off on a rant scolding you for your glaring lack of knowledge. You see things differently than I and I am cool with that. Whatever makes your world work~

CosmicPal
06-23-2010, 05:08 PM
And you know nothing about NASCAR but I feel no desire to go off on a rant scolding you for your glaring lack of knowledge. You see things differently than I and I am cool with that. Whatever makes your world work~

This thread isn't about NASCAR. If it was about NASCAR, I'd look at the title and move on to something else. I don't feel the need to waltz into a "Is NASCAR a sport" thread and denounce it as a bunch of rednecks driving a very fast car.

What kills me are those people who don't play the sport of golf and jump into the thread denouncing it as either a skill or sport or both. I provided my argument earlier in a rational manner, but you decided to call me out as being the only person here who gives a shit about golf.

And to add to ROR's comment about over-the-hill golfers. Need I remind you that there is a feat that so many golfers, including pros, would like to accomplish, and that is to shoot a round of golf under their age. Not very many people can do it.

RNR
06-23-2010, 05:17 PM
This thread isn't about NASCAR. If it was about NASCAR, I'd look at the title and move on to something else. I don't feel the need to waltz into a "Is NASCAR a sport" thread and denounce it as a bunch of rednecks driving a very fast car.

What kills me are those people who don't play the sport of golf and jump into the thread denouncing it as either a skill or sport or both. I provided my argument earlier in a rational manner, but you decided to call me out as being the only person here who gives a shit about golf.

And to add to ROR's comment about over-the-hill golfers. Need I remind you that there is a feat that so many golfers, including pros, would like to accomplish, and that is to shoot a round of golf under their age. Not very many people can do it.

You are clearly to attached to the game...errr....sport of golf. I only mentioned NASCAR as something that reminds me of golf as far as sports go. I stated in a friendly manner that I see it as a game of great skill. You called me out scooter. As I told the other posters that I simply disagree. You made it personal~

RJ
06-23-2010, 05:22 PM
This is one of the dumber fucking threads I've seen on this board. And that, as we all know, is really saying something.

Seriously, what difference does it make? I think it's a sport. You don't? No problem, call it what you want. Now let's go play 18 and then have a few beers.

RJ
06-23-2010, 05:25 PM
And to add to ROR's comment about over-the-hill golfers. Need I remind you that there is a feat that so many golfers, including pros, would like to accomplish, and that is to shoot a round of golf under their age. Not very many people can do it.



If I ever do it will be more a testimony to longevity than skill.

And men in my family don't usually live near long enough for me to pull it off.

CosmicPal
06-23-2010, 05:25 PM
You are clearly to attached to the game...errr....sport of golf. I only mentioned NASCAR as something that reminds me of golf as far as sports go. I stated in a friendly manner that I see it as a game of great skill. You called me out scooter. As I told the other posters that I simply disagree. You made it personal~

Dude...no hard feelings, but you did set yourself up for it by saying earlier it's not important enough for you to debate and then you told me to "F*ck off!"

If that's not making it personal, then I don't know what is.

I will defend golf as a skill sport because I know from experience precisely how difficult it is to become a pro golfer. It's not a team sport by any means, but like you said, it does require a lot of skill. I was being defensive, by adding from personal experience.

RNR
06-23-2010, 05:26 PM
This is one of the dumber ****ing threads I've seen on this board. And that, as we all know, is really saying something.

Seriously, what difference does it make? I think it's a sport. You don't? No problem, call it what you want. Now let's go play 18 and then have a few beers.

No shit! I pretty much said the samething and got scolded for it LMAO I have spent several posts trying to make that point. Maybe of of the Planets wise men will be able to get this point across :)

RNR
06-23-2010, 05:32 PM
Dude...no hard feelings, but you did set yourself up for it by saying earlier it's not important enough for you to debate and then you told me to "F*ck off!"

If that's not making it personal, then I don't know what is.

I will defend golf as a skill sport because I know from experience precisely how difficult it is to become a pro golfer. It's not a team sport by any means, but like you said, it does require a lot of skill. I was being defensive, by adding from personal experience.

I was not even talking to you in that post. I was simply telling Hammas to read my reply to PhilFree as that is where I stand on the subject. Rather you like it or not the OP ask for opinions and I gave one. You went off on me because you disagree with me and feel you know so much I should shut up. I told you to f&ck off because you were condesending towards me in your rant~

CosmicPal
06-23-2010, 05:33 PM
No shit! I pretty much said the samething and got scolded for it LMAO I have spent several posts trying to make that point. Maybe of of the Planets wise men will be able to get this point across :)

Don't you have a couch on your front porch to go sit on?

philfree
06-23-2010, 05:52 PM
I don't understand what is meant by skill in this thread.

Golf is a game and considered to be a sport by many. Some people have more natural ability than others like most all games/sports. Some people practice and spend great amounts of time honing their skills as a golfer so they can be a good golfer or even to be a pro golfer. After that I don't know what you guys are talking about as golf being a skill.

What's a skill? Dog Trainning? Wing Shooting? Sporting Clays? ..uh-oh....Is Sporting Clays a sport?


PhilFree:arrow:

morphius
06-23-2010, 07:27 PM
This is one of the dumber fucking threads I've seen on this board. And that, as we all know, is really saying something.

Seriously, what difference does it make? I think it's a sport. You don't? No problem, call it what you want. Now let's go play 18 and then have a few beers.
LOL! I can't seem to come up with an argument against any of that.

Well other than someone will have to help me find my damn ball when I lose it in the trees yet again. Stupid game :D

RNR
06-23-2010, 09:38 PM
Don't you have a couch on your front porch to go sit on?

Don't you have a dildo to sit on?

RJ
06-23-2010, 09:39 PM
LOL! I can't seem to come up with an argument against any of that.

Well other than someone will have to help me find my damn ball when I lose it in the trees yet again. Stupid game :D


That's what really pisses me off about golf. Those damn balls are expensive and I'm always losing the stupid things. Golf balls should be bigger. And brighter. Like neon pink basketballs.

RJ
06-23-2010, 09:41 PM
Don't you have a couch on your front porch to go sit on?


Don't you have a dildo to sit on?



ROFL

An excellent exchange, gentlemen.

Cornstock
06-23-2010, 11:05 PM
I propose 3 separate classifications that can encompass nearly any competitive event. I'm kind of thinking out loud here.
The "Game," the "Athletic Event," and the "Sport."

The "Game" is a competitive event involving a skill that may or may not be athletic in nature. This includes competitive events from chess to darts to golf. In a "game" there does not necessarily need to be an opponent (i.e. golf where you are competing against yourself). In games that do involve an opponent defense is not an aspect of the competition, at least in a physical sense. Psychological defense may play some type of aspect.

An "Athletic Event" involves an athletic movement/motion or set of movement/motions. Such events require physically gifted specimens but do not necessarily amount to a sport. I propose the difference between sport and athletic event involves the ability of an opponent to play some sort of defense. Such "Athletic Events" include Running, Gymnastics, and even (gasp) Competitive judged Cheerleading.

Finally, I propose that "Sport" be classified as an "Athletic Event" meeting all the criteria above, but where the opponent is allowed to physically prevent the other from achieving their objective.

What do you think of that? Any holes in my ideas? Like I said, just kind of thinking out loud.

Sweet Daddy Hate
06-24-2010, 09:57 AM
God, golf has become so Emo...

morphius
06-24-2010, 10:27 AM
That's what really pisses me off about golf. Those damn balls are expensive and I'm always losing the stupid things. Golf balls should be bigger. And brighter. Like neon pink basketballs.
My FiL and his golfing buddy like to find golf balls while they are playing, and he is good enough that he doesn't lose many. So he has a stash of a few 3.5(?) gallon buckets of balls that he feeds me. I'm already half way through bucket 1, lol.

yeah, I suck.

epitome1170
06-24-2010, 11:22 AM
My FiL and his golfing buddy like to find golf balls while they are playing, and he is good enough that he doesn't lose many. So he has a stash of a few 3.5(?) gallon buckets of balls that he feeds me. I'm already half way through bucket 1, lol.

yeah, I suck.

http://www.lostgolfballs.com

Good site for cheap golf balls and you can pick how high of quality you really want.

Pestilence
06-24-2010, 11:26 AM
http://www.hammacher.com/Product/77761

Wear these and you won't be losing golf balls.

Sofa King
06-24-2010, 12:23 PM
http://www.hammacher.com/Product/77761

Wear these and you won't be losing golf balls.

interesting... although i'll doubt they'll find any of my golf balls... they're usually here..


http://cache4.asset-cache.net/xc/200374775-002.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=5047FA587DE1CADE378399F5E4BA1D426257D24A7736123A69A239D1BABDA05EB5AF9B7D601FECA8


or here...

http://rossgreenblat.com/images/Photography/800x600/GolfBallSplashStudioShot.jpg