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View Full Version : Obama New Dem message: 'Improve' health care, don't talk cost


HonestChieffan
08-20-2010, 07:09 AM
Like watching cats covering a dump in a litterbox. As facts emerge on the disaster called ObamaCare, the need to overturn this dungheap will grow and grow.
http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0810/The_new_message_Improve_health_care_dont_talk_cost.html




New Dem message: 'Improve' health care, don't talk cost



Key White House allies are dramatically shifting their attempts to defend health care legislation, abandoning claims that it will reduce costs and deficit and instead stressing a promise to "improve it."

The messaging shift was circulated this afternoon on a conference call and PowerPoint presentation organized by Families USA — one of the central groups in the push for the initial legislation. The call was led by a staffer for the Herndon Alliance, which includes leading labor groups and other health care allies. It was based on polling from three top Democratic pollsters: John Anzalone, Celinda Lake and Stan Greenberg.

The confidential presentation, available in full here and provided to POLITICO by a source on the call, suggests that Democrats are acknowledging the failure of their predictions that the health care legislation would grow more popular after its passage, as its benefits became clear and rhetoric cooled. Instead, the presentation is designed to win over a skeptical public, and to defend the legislation — and in particular the individual mandate — from a push for repeal.

The presentation concedes that groups typically supportive of Democratic causes — people under 40, non-college-educated women and Hispanic voters — have not been won over by the plan. Indeed, it stresses repeatedly that many are unaware that the legislation has passed, an astonishing shortcoming in the White House's all-out communications effort.

"Straightforward ‘policy’ defenses fail to [move] voters’ opinions about the law," says one slide. "Women in particular are concerned that health care law will mean less provider availbality — scarcity [is] an issue."

The presentation also concedes that the fiscal and economic arguments that were the White House's first and most aggressive sales pitch have essentially failed.

"Many don’t believe health care reform will help the economy," says one slide.

The presentation's final page of "Don'ts" counsels against claiming "the law will reduce costs and deficit."

The presentation advises, instead, sales pitches that play on personal narratives and promises to change the legislation.

"People can be moved from initial skepticism and support for repeal of the law to favorable feelings and resisting repeal," it says. "Use personal stories — coupled with clear, simple descriptions of how the law benefits people at the individual level — to convey critical benefits of reform."

The presentation also counsels against the kind of grand claims of change that accompanied the legislation's passage.

"Keep claims small and credible; don’t overpromise or ‘spin’ what the law delivers," it says, suggesting supporters say, "The law is not perfect, but it does good things and helps many people. Now we’ll work [to] improve it.”

The Herndon Alliance, which presented the research, is a low-profile group that coordinated liberal messaging in favor of the public option in health care. Its "partners" include health care legislation's heavyweight supporters: AARP, AFL-CIO, SEIU, Health Care for America Now, MoveOn and the National Council of La Raza, among many others.

The presentation cites three private research projects by top Democratic pollsters: eight focus groups by Lake; Anzalone's 1,000-person national survey; and an online survey of 2,000 people by Greenberg's firm.

"If we are to preserve the gains made by the law and build on this foundation, the American public must understand what the law means for them," says Herndon's website. "We must overcome fear and mistrust, and we must once again use our collective voice to connect with the public on the values we share as Americans."

Chief Henry
08-20-2010, 07:33 AM
You mean this new health care cluster phuck of a bill won't help with keeping medical care cost in line ? HOPE AND CHANGE at its best.

kc rush
08-20-2010, 08:10 AM
The presentation concedes that groups typically supportive of Democratic causes — people under 40, non-college-educated women and Hispanic voters — have not been won over by the plan. Indeed, it stresses repeatedly that many are unaware that the legislation has passed, an astonishing shortcoming in the White House's all-out communications effort.




So they are saying that typical Democrat voters don't pay attention? :hmmm:

HonestChieffan
08-20-2010, 08:22 AM
So they are saying that typical Democrat voters don't pay attention? :hmmm:

Sadly, not just dem voters. But the preponderance of the left has no ability to equate what something costs to how it will be paid for. And with so few people now paying all the taxes, the ones who don't pay could care less.

Brainiac
08-20-2010, 08:34 AM
Sadly, not just dem voters. But the preponderance of the left has no ability to equate what something costs to how it will be paid for. And with so few people now paying all the taxes, the ones who don't pay could care less.
Just let the rich bastards pay for everything! /Democrats

HonestChieffan
08-20-2010, 08:37 AM
Just let the rich bastards pay for everything! /Democrats


Pretty close to the mantra.

healthpellets
08-20-2010, 09:14 AM
Sadly, not just dem voters. But the preponderance of the left has no ability to equate what something costs to how it will be paid for. And with so few people now paying all the taxes, the ones who don't pay could care less.

they don't CARE how it's paid for. it doesn't matter to them. they see no reason why anyone making less than 400k a year should ever vote for a republican. they see no reason why taxes aren't over 60%. they want what they want, and don't care who or what they have to trample over to get it.

chiefsnorth
08-20-2010, 09:21 AM
The local sychophants will still claim that we're going to get ten times as much for one tenth of the cost and it will be ten times the quality.

HonestChieffan
08-20-2010, 09:58 AM
The local sychophants will still claim that we're going to get ten times as much for one tenth of the cost and it will be ten times the quality.

well thats what they are told to say

WV
08-20-2010, 10:19 AM
Now come on, why wouldn't I line up for coverage that none of our representatives or the Ali Baba himself doesn't want?????

healthpellets
08-20-2010, 10:25 AM
Now come on, why wouldn't I line up for coverage that none of our representatives or the Ali Baba himself doesn't want?????

seriously. if it's such a great plan, i hope to see every single legislator that voted for it give up their federal coverage and line up to take advantage of the awesomeness.

Dylan
08-20-2010, 10:54 AM
HonestChiefFan, Great find!

Thank you.

alnorth
08-20-2010, 11:47 AM
they see no reason why taxes aren't over 60%.

With a big enough exemption so they pay no taxes themselves, of course.

Our tax policy is depressing. A flat tax would be nice, but I would even go along with a progressive tax, as long as it is not stupid. Having these huge personal and mortgage interest exemptions so that roughly half pay nothing is just stupid. If poor people cant pay much, fine make it a 3% tax bracket at the bottom, whatever, but everyone should pay SOMETHING, or it becomes too easy to vote for tax increases. Then we can have discussions like, "You want the top bracket to double from 35-ish percent to 70% like we had a few decades ago? Fine, lets double your bracket too, you dont pay 10% anymore, now you pay 20%". See if they still want tax increases then.

healthpellets
08-20-2010, 11:53 AM
With a big enough exemption so they pay no taxes themselves, of course.

Our tax policy is depressing. A flat tax would be nice, but I would even go along with a progressive tax, as long as it is not stupid. Having these huge personal and mortgage interest exemptions so that roughly half pay nothing is just stupid. If poor people cant pay much, fine make it a 3% tax bracket at the bottom, whatever, but everyone should pay SOMETHING, or it becomes too easy to vote for tax increases. Then we can have discussions like, "You want the top bracket to double from 35-ish percent to 70% like we had a few decades ago? Fine, lets double your bracket too, you dont pay 10% anymore, now you pay 20%". See if they still want tax increases then.

seriously. listening to them whine about deserving free healthcare and free education and a free place to live will make you goddamn ears bleed.

they are parasites. something for nothing every time. and let someone else pay for it. they make more, they should pay more. they do, dumbass. they pay more than nearly everyone else combined. oh, they don't pay enough to fund all of your social programs is what you mean. i see.

i'm really confused as to how someone who makes any decent amount of money can agree with any of their agenda. maybe it's not all about money. i dunno. but if i were wealthy and with a nice income, i'd sure as hell be pissed to find out that the government was taking 45% of my paycheck every two weeks.

and doing what with it? oh, redistributing it to those who need it more. how is anyone okay with that? YOU worked for it. YOU put in the time and energy. YOU got the education. but now YOU are expected to support everyone else.

HonestChieffan
08-20-2010, 11:54 AM
The value of the mortgage interest tax deduction has become very far diminished in reality. Interest rates as low as they are combined with the reduction in tax rate .

I agree we should have some base level . I can remember when if you made over 600 bucks you paid something. We would be far better off if everyone had skin in the game, not a free ride.

JohnnyV13
08-20-2010, 11:58 AM
With a big enough exemption so they pay no taxes themselves, of course.

Our tax policy is depressing. A flat tax would be nice, but I would even go along with a progressive tax, as long as it is not stupid. Having these huge personal and mortgage interest exemptions so that roughly half pay nothing is just stupid. If poor people cant pay much, fine make it a 3% tax bracket at the bottom, whatever, but everyone should pay SOMETHING, or it becomes too easy to vote for tax increases. Then we can have discussions like, "You want the top bracket to double from 35-ish percent to 70% like we had a few decades ago? Fine, lets double your bracket too, you dont pay 10% anymore, now you pay 20%". See if they still want tax increases then.

Tax policy is one of the biggest wastes of talent in our system.

We create this huge, complex, code that applies differently to almost every individual. We waste hundreds of thousands of talented people administering this behemoth: tax lawyers, tax accountants, corporate strategic planners to minimize tax impacts, IRS employees, plus tax preparation time for normal citizens.

These people could be doing something else that actually produces economic value (well, in normal times at least).

3% annual GDP growth on a sustained basis gives you a robust economy. We probably waste more than 3% of our collective annual labor on something that is administrative and inherently non-productive. Not to mention that the complex tax code is a huge power grab by the federal government, that tries to make people behave in ways that please the government.

healthpellets
08-20-2010, 11:59 AM
The value of the mortgage interest tax deduction has become very far diminished in reality. Interest rates as low as they are combined with the reduction in tax rate .

I agree we should have some base level . I can remember when if you made over 600 bucks you paid something. We would be far better off if everyone had skin in the game, not a free ride.

EITC takes away much of the payroll tax burden.

why the hell isn't everyone taxed. hell, just 1%. something.