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SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 06:26 AM
I know that we want to pile on Cassel. He hasn't looked great. I also know that the Chiefs have been rather conservative in these games.

The Chiefs only care about winning. Pretty or Ugly doesn't matter.

I think the Chiefs will continue to be conservative through the Indy game.

This week, they have the 9ers. The 49ers aren't a huge threat to put up a ton of points. I expect, Herm lite again this week.

They will go to the bye and then play the Colts. There is a part of me that thinks they will open up the offense in this game. But, I think they will stick to the run predominantly. The Colts do not have a good run defense, and the Chiefs will be fully rested after the bye week. Give the pass rushing prowess of Indy and the fact that it is in the dome, the Chiefs will try very diligently to stick to that game plan.

It will be the following week, that I think the Chiefs will open up the playbook. Houston is a good team. They will put up a ton of points. And, they are good against the run and pass. I think the Chiefs will have to open it up against the Texans.

I am not going to blow sunshine here and say Cassel is great. But, this will be the test, in my mind. Right now, I feel like his hands are a little tied.

The Chiefs will have to untie his hands and hope for the best in a couple weeks.

At the end of that game, I think we will have a very good read on exactly what Cassel is. Unfortunately, I am very concerned that we will not like the way the book ends.

King_Chief_Fan
09-20-2010, 06:30 AM
You have already touched the stove it is hot....you touched it again,,hot
No need to touch it a 3rd time
Cassel is not a starting QB. We should admit that and prepare his departure

The colts don't have a run defense.......ask the Giants about that.

Chiefs get killed against the Colts and Texans

bevischief
09-20-2010, 06:31 AM
:popcorn:

-King-
09-20-2010, 06:32 AM
I goes you can't really get a good read from him from his last SEVENTEEN games huh?...

I think it's pretty sad that cassel isn't even an effective game manager.
Posted via Mobile Device

-King-
09-20-2010, 06:33 AM
After the Houston game you'll then say that you won't judge him until after the Denver game... After that you'll say that he needs 3 years to be judged...
Posted via Mobile Device

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 06:49 AM
I goes you can't really get a good read from him from his last SEVENTEEN games huh?...

I think it's pretty sad that cassel isn't even an effective game manager.
Posted via Mobile Device

A manager is only as good as the people he manages. Until this year, the talent around him was subpar. Even this year, the WR's don't get a ton of separation.

There is a reason that Tony the second is Cassel's favorite target. He actually gets open.

The second part here is that I am not saying he has played great, or that he will play great. But, the Houston game is the first one that I expect the Chiefs to really open it up. And, at that point, I think we will get the best read we can get on Cassel.

Hydrae
09-20-2010, 06:49 AM
Houston has won two games but given up a ton of passing yardage. That game will be all about Mattie boy.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 06:51 AM
After the Houston game you'll then say that you won't judge him until after the Denver game... After that you'll say that he needs 3 years to be judged...
Posted via Mobile Device

Wow, if you can see the future, what stocks do you recommend?

This game will give the fans the best chance to see him with his hands untied. Right now, Haley is all about winning games, and doesn't care how it looks. The Pats were also that way when they won their first Super Bowl. It can be ugly. It can look bad on a stat sheet for both the offense and defense. But, the W is all that matters.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 06:52 AM
Houston has won two games but given up a ton of passing yardage. That game will be all about Mattie boy.

This is the point.

notorious
09-20-2010, 06:55 AM
Ugly wins are the Patriot way, and nobody makes them uglier then Matt Cassel.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 07:00 AM
Ugly wins are the Patriot way, and nobody makes them uglier then Matt Cassel.

ROFL

Oddly, I didn't start this thread as support for Matt Cassel, but rather the line I have personally drawn in the sand for him.

suds79
09-20-2010, 07:00 AM
Well to be fair, you can't expect absolutely everybody to see that Matt is clearly a bad QB.

I mean no matter what you're talking about, there's always going to be that 5% of the population that just views things differently. No matter how clear it is.

So SensibleChiefsfan, go ahead and judge him after the Texan's game. When you report your findings, we'll all be here not surprised.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 07:16 AM
Well to be fair, you can't expect absolutely everybody to see that Matt is clearly a bad QB.

I mean no matter what you're talking about, there's always going to be that 5% of the population that just views things differently. No matter how clear it is.

So SensibleChiefsfan, go ahead and judge him after the Texan's game. When you report your findings, we'll all be here not surprised.

Nor will I be. I don't think he is going to be great. I don't think I will like what I see. I am just saying that the first time I expect the Chiefs to open it up is Houston.

Chiefnj2
09-20-2010, 07:17 AM
Receivers who can get separation would help a lot, but Cassel can't deliver the ball very well past 12-15 yards. His pocket presence also hasn't improved.

blaise
09-20-2010, 07:19 AM
Cassel is just a participant in the offense. He doesn't lead it in any way that I can see.

kepp
09-20-2010, 07:20 AM
Receivers who can get separation would help a lot, but Cassel can't deliver the ball very well past 12-15 yards. His pocket presence also hasn't improved.

True. Cassel is the kind of QB that needs top-level (or near) WRs to be successful.

donkhater
09-20-2010, 07:21 AM
Cassel is clearly struggling but if KC wanted to improve his chances at becoming more productive, they have to do 2 things IMO:

1. Pass more: It's obvious he has a confidence problem. You can see it. His receivers aren't exactly helping him, but that certainly doesn't explain his poor showing. More to the point, when your coaching staff doesn't trust you to put the ball in the air, it'll affect your confidence.

Dilfer was slobbering a bit during the Chargers game, but what he said had some truth. Being a 'game manager' is the hardest way to play QB and pass effectively. He's not the only one with this opinion. Phil Simms has said it many times about his career with the Giants and comparing his experience with Joe Montana (who was drafted the same year).

In the short term this may cost KC some games, but as Mellinger pointed out in his piece today, where is the alternative? They are going to sink or swim with Cassel.

2. Play Charles. I can't believe this has to be even said. One of the things Cassel actually does pretty well is ball fake. But play-faking to Jones is a hell of a lot different than play-faking to Charles.

I know Haley says it's a 'process'. Perhaps he wants to develop a toughness about his team and disciplined running. Maybe Charles isn't hittting the hole he is supposed to all the time and it's pissing Haley off. All I know is that I saw a HUGE hole open up early in the game yesterday and Jones couldn't get there in time to take advantage of it. Charles would have. This is a no-brainer.

suds79
09-20-2010, 07:28 AM
Nor will I be. I don't think he is going to be great. I don't think I will like what I see. I am just saying that the first time I expect the Chiefs to open it up is Houston.

Fair enough. Although I would argue that with Todd & Charlie's reluctance to open it up already should tell you all you need to know about Matt.

They're not exactly conservative guys by nature.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 07:29 AM
Cassel is just a participant in the offense. He doesn't lead it in any way that I can see.

I disagree. I think that his toughness and leadership are his strongest assets.

I think his biggest issue is between the ears. He just needs to let it go. I see him thinking too much and pressing too much.

Bane
09-20-2010, 07:30 AM
You post in threads
just like hootie.

Cassel sucks
get over it.

Hog Farmer
09-20-2010, 07:31 AM
Cassel had all sorts of time to pass yesterday. After 5 seconds in the pocket he still couldn't make a decision except to tuck the ball and run. He has no confidence because he's smart enough to know he sucks. And whats up with him not getting the ball to McCluster. Our most talented player on offense had one carry for three yards and thats it ! Cassel threw 2 picks and this is about all we can expect from him. He sucks and if I were coach I'd give him the San Fran game and if he doesn't have at least 280 yards and a passer rating of 90 I'd let Croyle take over after the bye.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 07:33 AM
Fair enough. Although I would argue that with Todd & Charlie's reluctance to open it up already should tell you all you need to know about Matt.

They're not exactly conservative guys by nature.

I disagree with your assessment of Weis and Haley. They are merely concerned with winning. They will do whatever they must to win a game.

Bane
09-20-2010, 07:34 AM
Cassel had all sorts of time to pass yesterday. After 5 seconds in the pocket he still couldn't make a decision except to tuck the ball and run. He has no confidence because he's smart enough to know he sucks. And whats up with him not getting the ball to McCluster. Our most talented player on offense had one carry for three yards and thats it ! Cassel threw 2 picks and this is about all we can expect from him. He sucks and if I were coach I'd give him the San Fran game and if he doesn't have at least 280 yards and a passer rating of 90 I'd let Croyle take over after the bye.

An average QB would have went for 300 yards and 3 TD's against the bullshit Casshole saw yesterday.Casshole is a complete fuggn joke and so is everyone who supports him.Pisoli included. I'd bet anything that Todd Haley would kick his ass to the curb in a second if he could.

The Bad Guy
09-20-2010, 07:34 AM
What I'm insanely confused by is the lack of screen passes in this offense.

The center is one of the best in the league at pulling on screens, we have 2 backs who have great vision and create big yards, and it would help take the pass rush off Cassel a bit.

I just don't understand it.

The Bad Guy
09-20-2010, 07:35 AM
I disagree with your assessment of Weis and Haley. They are merely concerned with winning. They will do whatever they must to win a game.

Which means putting Cassel on a leash.

Coogs
09-20-2010, 07:36 AM
I know that we want to pile on Cassel. He hasn't looked great. I also know that the Chiefs have been rather conservative in these games.

The Chiefs only care about winning. Pretty or Ugly doesn't matter.

I think the Chiefs will continue to be conservative through the Indy game.

This week, they have the 9ers. The 49ers aren't a huge threat to put up a ton of points. I expect, Herm lite again this week.

They will go to the bye and then play the Colts. There is a part of me that thinks they will open up the offense in this game. But, I think they will stick to the run predominantly. The Colts do not have a good run defense, and the Chiefs will be fully rested after the bye week. Give the pass rushing prowess of Indy and the fact that it is in the dome, the Chiefs will try very diligently to stick to that game plan.

It will be the following week, that I think the Chiefs will open up the playbook. Houston is a good team. They will put up a ton of points. And, they are good against the run and pass. I think the Chiefs will have to open it up against the Texans.

I am not going to blow sunshine here and say Cassel is great. But, this will be the test, in my mind. Right now, I feel like his hands are a little tied.

The Chiefs will have to untie his hands and hope for the best in a couple weeks.

At the end of that game, I think we will have a very good read on exactly what Cassel is. Unfortunately, I am very concerned that we will not like the way the book ends.

I actually think the Chiefs tried to open up the playbook in the first half for Cassel. The weather was good, and we came out throwing the ball early and often. Sadly, the results were not good in the first half.

Haley stated he has accepted the fact we are going to have to be creative to score weeks ago. What isn't there, isn't there.

The wins are going to be ugly wins. If the defense plays well, and special teams play well, and Cassel doesn't turn it over, we will have a chance to win. So far so good.

threebag02
09-20-2010, 07:37 AM
A manager is only as good as the people he manages. Until this year, the talent around him was subpar. Even this year, the WR's don't get a ton of separation.

There is a reason that Tony the second is Cassel's favorite target. He actually gets open.

The second part here is that I am not saying he has played great, or that he will play great. But, the Houston game is the first one that I expect the Chiefs to really open it up. And, at that point, I think we will get the best read we can get on Cassel.

What seperation they do get mark cassel negates by throwing behind his receiver. The best way cassel could help this team is by taking Brodie clipboard.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 07:37 AM
Cassel had all sorts of time to pass yesterday. After 5 seconds in the pocket he still couldn't make a decision except to tuck the ball and run. He has no confidence because he's smart enough to know he sucks. And whats up with him not getting the ball to McCluster. Our most talented player on offense had one carry for three yards and thats it ! Cassel threw 2 picks and this is about all we can expect from him. He sucks and if I were coach I'd give him the San Fran game and if he doesn't have at least 280 yards and a passer rating of 90 I'd let Croyle take over after the bye.

Hey, I like Croyle. I would rather have Croyle than Cassel. I have always said that if he could stay healthy, he would easily be a top third QB in my opinion.

He has an arm that would be top five in the league. He has a Brett Favre/Jeff George type arm.

The problem is staying healthy.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 07:41 AM
An average QB would have went for 300 yards and 3 TD's against the bullshit Casshole saw yesterday.Casshole is a complete fuggn joke and so is everyone who supports him.Pisoli included. I'd bet anything that Todd Haley would kick his ass to the curb in a second if he could.

Do you think Weis would come to the Chiefs if he thought that he couldn't make the decision at QB? This fan conjecture is ridiculous to me.

Weis wasn't limited to JUST the Chiefs. Weis and Romeo had more than one offer. This idea that they would come here and have their hands tied is ridiculous.

Also, look at it from Pioli's standpoint. Weis is one of his guys. If he was critical of Cassel and thought he needed to go, do you honestly think that Pioli would ignore that?

suds79
09-20-2010, 07:42 AM
I disagree with your assessment of Weis and Haley. They are merely concerned with winning. They will do whatever they must to win a game.

Ah you're close but I think you missed my point.

Sure they just want to win. But take it a step further. Why do you think they've gone with such a conservative approach? Why do you think they haven't opened it up?

It's because they've seen Matt in practice & games for quite a while now. They know the guy can't play.

threebag02
09-20-2010, 07:42 AM
I disagree with your assessment of Weis and Haley. They are merely concerned with winning. They will do whatever they must to win a game.

They aren't doing it so far it's defense and special teams. What is the offense trying to three and out the other teams defense? The offensive gameplan is going over like a turd in a punch bowl. If we had to rely on offense we would be sitting at 0-2.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 07:42 AM
What I'm insanely confused by is the lack of screen passes in this offense.

The center is one of the best in the league at pulling on screens, we have 2 backs who have great vision and create big yards, and it would help take the pass rush off Cassel a bit.

I just don't understand it.

The center 'was' one of the best. I don't know that he is anymore. That said, I expect more screens as the season progresses.

The Bad Guy
09-20-2010, 07:45 AM
The center 'was' one of the best. I don't know that he is anymore. That said, I expect more screens as the season progresses.

He still is.

He was great for Denver last year on pulls and screens.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 07:47 AM
Ah you're close but I think you missed my point.

Sure they just want to win. But take it a step further. Why do you think they've gone with such a conservative approach? Why do you think they haven't opened it up?

It's because they've seen Matt in practice & games for quite a while now. They know the guy can't play.

Or, they know that the Browns are offensively challenged.... and that they don't really need to push the ball downfield that much.

It is odd how little the passing game gets put on the WR's.

ChiTown
09-20-2010, 07:50 AM
The center 'was' one of the best. I don't know that he is anymore. That said, I expect more screens as the season progresses.

I don't know if any of you guys listen to the radio broadcast at all, but Lenny nailed this one early. The Browns were cheating up and over-pursuing big time against the run. He was begging the Chiefs to run a reverse, or mis-direction of some sort - anything to get the Cleveland D on their heels. They weren't scared of Cassel throwing (who would be) and they were NOT going to let our RB's go off. I think this would have greatly helped us out in the 1st half.

Also, I agree. Running more screens would be helpful. The leash on Cassel is crazy short, but a screen isn't that difficult to operate.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 07:54 AM
They aren't doing it so far it's defense and special teams. What is the offense trying to three and out the other teams defense? The offensive gameplan is going over like a turd in a punch bowl. If we had to rely on offense we would be sitting at 0-2.

For all the criticism of the offense, the Chiefs had one three and out that I can remember. They had 10 first downs by pass, and only five by running.

suds79
09-20-2010, 08:00 AM
Or, they know that the Browns are offensively challenged.... and that they don't really need to push the ball downfield that much.

It is odd how little the passing game gets put on the WR's.

That's weak.

Good QBs make WRs look good. It's a QB league.

Amazing how Peyton Manning has always been blessed to always have good WRs like Austin Collie, & Pierre Garcon.

How lucky is Drew Brees to have had the likes of Devery Henderson.

Jay Cutler wouldn't be half the QB he is without Johnny Knox.

But I'm done. You got me sucked in debating Matt Cassel when it's just so silly.

You withhold judgment for now. We'll say welcome to the past after the Houston game and you realize that he's a horrible QB.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 08:16 AM
That's weak.

Good QBs make WRs look good. It's a QB league.

Amazing how Peyton Manning has always been blessed to always have good WRs like Austin Collie, & Pierre Garcon.

How lucky is Drew Brees to have had the likes of Devery Henderson.

Jay Cutler wouldn't be half the QB he is without Johnny Knox.

But I'm done. You got me sucked in debating Matt Cassel when it's just so silly.

You withhold judgment for now. We'll say welcome to the past after the Houston game and you realize that he's a horrible QB.

I have never, even before the trade was made, argued that Cassel will be an elite QB. He isn't. He never will be. That is not what he is. He CAN'T be that.

I will not judge him against greats like Manning, Brees or even Cutler. I would trade Cassel for any of them.

I will judge him against QB's 10-20, because that is what I think he can be.

I will look at him compared to guys like Derek Anderson, Matt Hasselbeck, Kyle Orton and Mark Sanchez.

Bane
09-20-2010, 08:18 AM
Save your breath
Cassel sucks something awful.
1 year wonder in NE
with a previously 18-1 team.
Yeah he sucks.

Short Leash Hootie
09-20-2010, 08:22 AM
people at the bar I go to were CRACKING UP at my Matt Cassel meltdowns...

Reerun_KC
09-20-2010, 08:30 AM
Which means putting Cassel on a leash.

:eek:

I think you just ended the thread...


Yep, you can tell by the joke of a game Haley is allowing Weis to call... They have pretty much hamstrung the whole damn offense right now.. yes I know, I know everyone, Cassel sucks, everything wrong with the NFL is his fault, WE KNOW THIS...

Thing is, there doesn't seem to be any rhythm or reason to the play calling... the sweeps and pitch outs on 3rd and short yesterday? Seems many times they had personnel issues.. Players in wrong packages...

I just think Weis is failing just as hard as Cassel... Right now everyone is sole intention is at all cost to burn Cassel at the stake, they willing to ignore the failing of Weis right now.


Again, Cassel sucks, I get that...

Reerun_KC
09-20-2010, 08:35 AM
Cassel had all sorts of time to pass yesterday. After 5 seconds in the pocket he still couldn't make a decision except to tuck the ball and run. He has no confidence because he's smart enough to know he sucks. And whats up with him not getting the ball to McCluster. Our most talented player on offense had one carry for three yards and thats it ! Cassel threw 2 picks and this is about all we can expect from him. He sucks and if I were coach I'd give him the San Fran game and if he doesn't have at least 280 yards and a passer rating of 90 I'd let Croyle take over after the bye.

Did you read what Rainman said about the WR's yesterday? That they suck and were never open... And the few very few times they were open, Cassel missed...

How is Croyle going to complete passes to WR's that cant get open or cant get separation?

I am curious.

ChiefsNow
09-20-2010, 08:38 AM
:eek:

I think you just ended the thread...


Yep, you can tell by the joke of a game Haley is allowing Weis to call... They have pretty much hamstrung the whole damn offense right now.. yes I know, I know everyone, Cassel sucks, everything wrong with the NFL is his fault, WE KNOW THIS...

Thing is, there doesn't seem to be any rhythm or reason to the play calling... the sweeps and pitch outs on 3rd and short yesterday? Seems many times they had personnel issues.. Players in wrong packages...

I just think Weis is failing just as hard as Cassel... Right now everyone is sole intention is at all cost to burn Cassel at the stake, they willing to ignore the failing of Weis right now.


Again, Cassel sucks, I get that...


I don't think Weis is at full strength either. I have a feeling he would call better games when he gets out of his hoverround wheel chair and can get down on the sidelines.

Ralphy Boy
09-20-2010, 08:56 AM
And whats up with him not getting the ball to McCluster. Our most talented player on offense had one carry for three yards and thats it ! Cassel threw 2 picks and this is about all we can expect from him.

Dante Hall 2.0 needs a lot of help getting open in a league of such big men.

An average QB would have went for 300 yards and 3 TD's against the bullshit Casshole saw yesterday.Casshole is a complete fuggn joke and so is everyone who supports him.Pisoli included. I'd bet anything that Todd Haley would kick his ass to the curb in a second if he could.

So Haley, who "would kick his ass to the curb" is a "fuggn joke" because he supports his QB?


For all the criticism of the offense, the Chiefs had one three and out that I can remember. They had 10 first downs by pass, and only five by running.

Was it really that good of a number? I said elsewhere that I was impressed that Cassel "made plays when he had to" in the 2nd. I thought he looked good in the 2nd and fair in the 1st. The tipped passes at the LOS was an issue, but the pick on the left sideline, intended for Chambers, was not IMO a horrible pass. Chambers has to make a play on the ball and at least defend it. The tipped pass that led to the pick sucked.

:eek:

I just think Weis is failing just as hard as Cassel... Right now everyone is sole intention is at all cost to burn Cassel at the stake, they willing to ignore the failing of Weis right now.


Again, Cassel sucks, I get that...

I know what you mean and as soon as we lose, I'll be on the same horse. For now Weis is 2 & 0 as our OC.

They should play the song "Against All Odds" everytime Cassel takes the field to inspire him.

Sully
09-20-2010, 09:06 AM
Did you read what Rainman said about the WR's yesterday? That they suck and were never open... And the few very few times they were open, Cassel missed...

How is Croyle going to complete passes to WR's that cant get open or cant get separation?

I am curious.

I hate I'm taking part in this,

But,

QBs throw to "covered" WRs all the time. Good QBs put it in spots where only the WR has a chance to catch it. A good QB MUST trust his guys. It drove me nuts in Gonzalez' first couple of years that Grbac would only throw him the ball when wide open. That's simply not the way a passing game works, and this is Cassel's biggest (IMO) problem. He's always waiting for the obvious, wide open throw. Unless you are throwing to the Pats WRs, that's only going to happen 5% of the time.

L.A. Chieffan
09-20-2010, 09:10 AM
No offense, but who gives a shit what your personal line in the sand is?

Every other reasonable human being already knows he sucks.

lcarus
09-20-2010, 10:29 AM
Cleveland was my personal line in the sand.

Deberg_1990
09-20-2010, 10:43 AM
I will wait to judge him until after Hanukkah.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 10:52 AM
I hate I'm taking part in this,

But,

QBs throw to "covered" WRs all the time. Good QBs put it in spots where only the WR has a chance to catch it. A good QB MUST trust his guys. It drove me nuts in Gonzalez' first couple of years that Grbac would only throw him the ball when wide open. That's simply not the way a passing game works, and this is Cassel's biggest (IMO) problem. He's always waiting for the obvious, wide open throw. Unless you are throwing to the Pats WRs, that's only going to happen 5% of the time.

Here is the problem. When he trusts his WR's, they fail him on a consistent basis.

Look at the Chambers play yesterday. Look at the two Bowe Drops last week. One was put RIGHT where he had to.

As this improves, I think Cassel will look better. As it is.... I think he is protecting the ball and not trusting his WR's.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 10:53 AM
No offense, but who gives a shit what your personal line in the sand is?

Every other reasonable human being already knows he sucks.

Yeah, Haley and Weis are being 'forced' to play him, right?

HemiEd
09-20-2010, 10:55 AM
Right now, I feel like his hands are a little tied.



No wonder he has such a problem with accuracy, his hands are tied! Please untie them Todd, maybe he can improve on the 20% error margin of his passes.

10 yard pass= 2 yards off target
20 yard pass= 4 yards off target

L.A. Chieffan
09-20-2010, 10:55 AM
Yeah, Haley and Weis are being 'forced' to play him, right?

This is irrelevant. He still sucks.

Donger
09-20-2010, 10:58 AM
How is that Sanchez chap doing, anyway?

L.A. Chieffan
09-20-2010, 10:59 AM
How is that Sanchez chap doing, anyway?

looked pretty good against the pats.

HemiEd
09-20-2010, 11:05 AM
Cassel had all sorts of time to pass yesterday. After 5 seconds in the pocket he still couldn't make a decision except to tuck the ball and run. He has no confidence because he's smart enough to know he sucks. And whats up with him not getting the ball to McCluster. Our most talented player on offense had one carry for three yards and thats it ! Cassel threw 2 picks and this is about all we can expect from him. He sucks and if I were coach I'd give him the San Fran game and if he doesn't have at least 280 yards and a passer rating of 90 I'd let Croyle take over after the bye.

This. Go back and look at the very first offensive play of the game. It could have easily been a pick 6 by Cleveland, an ugly wobble out to the flat.

Ralphy Boy
09-20-2010, 11:29 AM
I hate I'm taking part in this,

But,

QBs throw to "covered" WRs all the time. Good QBs put it in spots where only the WR has a chance to catch it. A good QB MUST trust his guys. It drove me nuts in Gonzalez' first couple of years that Grbac would only throw him the ball when wide open. That's simply not the way a passing game works, and this is Cassel's biggest (IMO) problem. He's always waiting for the obvious, wide open throw. Unless you are throwing to the Pats WRs, that's only going to happen 5% of the time.

Good no, Great yes. I think that in Haley & Weis' "ugly" gameplan Cassel is asked more to completely avoid a turnover than take chances. Fact is he isn't a QB who is going to make a bunch of miraculous throws so why tempt fate? (Fate being that he is destined to throw picks) He was conservative in the first half of last season and only thew 5 picks. Second half he took some chances and threw 11. I'll take conservative over that any day.

Everyone (coaches, media) always says "take what the defense gives you", "if nobody is open, throw it away". There's a reason they say those things but I think they are generally talking about game managers. When they are talking about the great ones they say "taking the team on his back". Realizing that Cassel is simply a game manager, he obviously won't take the team on his back, still you would hope that he would occassionally show he has the ability to make plays when needed.


He was 8 for 11 in the second half of this game and did show a spark of someone capable of making plays when needed.

By this time last season he had been sacked 5 times. This year 2...looking for any signs of hope.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 11:44 AM
How is that Sanchez chap doing, anyway?

Sanchez looked freaking awesome yesterday.

We'll see if it continues, but yesterday, he looked great.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 11:45 AM
Weis wasn't limited to JUST the Chiefs. Weis and Romeo had more than one offer. This idea that they would come here and have their hands tied is ridiculous.


Bullshit. We've been through this before.

The Chicago news media "speculated" that Weis would be a good fit for the Bears but the Bears never contacted him. The Chiefs were the only team that did and regardless, I don't think he would have gone anywhere else.

As for Crennel, he was NOT contacted by any other team before he signed with the Chiefs although he did state that it could have been "interesting" had the Dolphins or Patriots contacted him before signing with KC.

The fact of the matter is that Weis DOES have his hands tied with Cassel. The Chiefs organization believes he's the best QB on the roster and if that's true, there's just not much that Weis can do with him, hence the hand-tying.

If Cassel doesn't improve (and I can't see any reason to believe that he WILL improve), the Chiefs will go into 2011 with a different starting QB.

Pestilence
09-20-2010, 11:48 AM
It never ends.

Cassel played horribly.....it's the WRs fault.
Cassel played horribly.....it's the play calling.

Nevermind the fact that he has no pocket presence, no accuracy and no throw over 15 yards.

Chiefnj2
09-20-2010, 11:50 AM
It never ends.

Cassel played horribly.....it's the WRs fault.
Cassel played horribly.....it's the play calling.

Nevermind the fact that he has no pocket presence, no accuracy and no throw over 15 yards.

Why can't it be all 3?

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 11:51 AM
Bullshit. We've been through this before.

The Chicago news media "speculated" that Weis would be a good fit for the Bears but the Bears never contacted him. The Chiefs were the only team that did and regardless, I don't think he would have gone anywhere else.

As for Crennel, he was NOT contacted by any other team before he signed with the Chiefs although he did state that it could have been "interesting" had the Dolphins or Patriots contacted him before signing with KC.

The fact of the matter is that Weis DOES have his hands tied with Cassel. The Chiefs organization believes he's the best QB on the roster and if that's true, there's just not much that Weis can do with him, hence the hand-tying.

If Cassel doesn't improve (and I can't see any reason to believe that he WILL improve), the Chiefs will go into 2011 with a different starting QB.

Yeah and I posted links before... more than one. Please post your links about how neither found any interest anywhere else in the league and how they were forced to come to the Chiefs because otherwise they would be working at McDonalds.

You're speculation and wishful thinking aren't quite enough.

Bane
09-20-2010, 11:52 AM
Still with this Cassel ball washing thread?JFC!
Posted via Mobile Device

Pestilence
09-20-2010, 11:53 AM
Why can't it be all 3?

It is all three. He has no pocket presence, no accuracy and no throw over 15 yards.


The dude REPEATEDLY had 5 seconds to throw the ball....and he REPEATEDLY shit his pants. He has no accuracy.....therefore he can't throw it to a receiver thats even a little bit covered. He's continually looking for the wide open throw....and it's not going to be there.

I love how people say that we need to give him a chance in on sentence and then in another sentence say that he isn't great.....and at best he's maybe top 25. FFS....if he isn't great.....get fucking rid of him already.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 11:54 AM
Yeah and I posted links before... more than one. Please post your links about how neither found any interest anywhere else in the league and how they were forced to come to the Chiefs because otherwise they would be working at McDonalds.

You're speculation and wishful thinking aren't quite enough.

Oh, just shut the fuck up.

You're wrong. End of story.

It was media speculation, Dummy. JFC.

Oh, and Cassel suck and no one gives a shit about your "line in the sand".

Dumbass.

FAX
09-20-2010, 11:54 AM
I think we shouldn't judge Mr. SensibleChiefsfan until after his 10,000th post.

Then, I think we should let him have it!!! Both barrels!! Maybe strike him about the head and face with a dead cat.

FAX

Chiefnj2
09-20-2010, 11:58 AM
It is all three. He has no pocket presence, no accuracy and no throw over 15 yards.


The dude REPEATEDLY had 5 seconds to throw the ball....and he REPEATEDLY shit his pants. He has no accuracy.....therefore he can't throw it to a receiver thats even a little bit covered. He's continually looking for the wide open throw....and it's not going to be there.

I love how people say that we need to give him a chance in on sentence and then in another sentence say that he isn't great.....and at best he's maybe top 25. FFS....if he isn't great.....get ****ing rid of him already.

KC can't have a bad QB and poor receivers at the same time?

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 12:01 PM
KC can't have a bad QB and poor receivers at the same time?

What I can't figure out is how Dwayne Bowe had 80+ catch seasons (and essentially 1,000 yards) with QB's like Damon Huard, Brodie Croyle and Tyler Thigpen, but he's virtually non-existent with Matt Cassel.

As I stated last season, at some point, you have to stop blaming the receivers and start looking at the QB.

A better QB would make every Chiefs receiver look better.

Mr. Laz
09-20-2010, 12:01 PM
i prefer to judge cassel after every game ... just like every other player. That doesn't mean you have to reach any kind of conclusion.

cassel has the rest of the year to become a viable NFL quarterback, if not he's gone.


So far it's not good because right now Cassel is pretty much our weakest link and that is unacceptable.

FAX
09-20-2010, 12:04 PM
Mark Castle has very little power in his throws. He has poor mechanics and a wacky throwing motion most of the time.

When you don't have "zip" on the ball, you can't hit the tight spaces ... most NFL DBs are just too quick. Mark Castle needs to work on his technique ... should only take a few years.

FAX

Chiefnj2
09-20-2010, 12:08 PM
What I can't figure out is how Dwayne Bowe had 80+ catch seasons (and essentially 1,000 yards) with QB's like Damon Huard, Brodie Croyle and Tyler Thigpen, but he's virtually non-existent with Matt Cassel.

As I stated last season, at some point, you have to stop blaming the receivers and start looking at the QB.

A better QB would make every Chiefs receiver look better.

A better QB would make a receiver look better. Rain Man, who was at the game, said the receivers were not getting separation. The announcers frequently noted that Cassel had nowhere to go with the ball. All I'm saying is that KC needs a true #1 receiver to go along with a new QB. And, Bowe continues to need to work.

FAX
09-20-2010, 12:11 PM
A better QB would make a receiver look better. Rain Man, who was at the game, said the receivers were not getting separation. The announcers frequently noted that Cassel had nowhere to go with the ball. All I'm saying is that KC needs a true #1 receiver to go along with a new QB. And, Bowe continues to need to work.

One is forced to speculate as to the kind of routes our "receivers" were asked to run. If they were predominantly the 5 to 8 yard variety, it kind of makes sense that they weren't going to be open.

The great West Coast offenses of the past typically had somebody who could (and did) stretch the field ... and the coaches used them to help open up the short pass.

FAX

Donger
09-20-2010, 12:12 PM
A better QB would make a receiver look better. Rain Man, who was at the game, said the receivers were not getting separation. The announcers frequently noted that Cassel had nowhere to go with the ball. All I'm saying is that KC needs a true #1 receiver to go along with a new QB. And, Bowe continues to need to work.

Isn't one of the primary gripes about Cassel his inaccuracy? If so, what difference does it make if the receivers aren't getting separation?

Dave Lane
09-20-2010, 12:15 PM
Chiefs get killed against the Colts and Texans

I'm not sold on the Texans being all that. I think they are better than the Chiefs but a couple lucky breaks and we can win this one. Colts.... Not so much.

FAX
09-20-2010, 12:17 PM
Yeah, the Colts game is going to be difficult.

It's hard to compete against teams that can substitute players after the line is set and the QB is doing the Headless Chicken Dance in the backfield before every snap.

FAX

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 12:37 PM
Oh, just shut the **** up.

You're wrong. End of story.

It was media speculation, Dummy. JFC.

Oh, and Cassel suck and no one gives a shit about your "line in the sand".

Dumbass.

So, no links?

Tuckdaddy
09-20-2010, 12:37 PM
KC can't have a bad QB and poor receivers at the same time?

Apparently they can and they do. I remember Trents first year. Sacked alot and threw picks because the WR's were slow and had trouble getting open. When we upgraded that position Trent became the man. I am by no means suggesting Cassel will great with better WR's but Chris and Dwayne are big and slow. They will never leave DB's in the dust or get good separation. This does make things harder for the QB.

jettio
09-20-2010, 12:41 PM
Give the kid a chance.

He does not always make the play, but he is a team player and he is either going to win the job long term or prove that he is a backup.

He has not looked great, but I bet that if the Chiefs defense had played worse, he would have had more chances to make plays because the coaches would have called different plays.

Looks like things are setting up real good for the kid to prove that he can or can't do it and he is going to get the chance so just keep paying lots of money and even more time and see what happens.

Lzen
09-20-2010, 03:01 PM
Oh, just shut the **** up.

You're wrong. End of story.

It was media speculation, Dummy. JFC.

Oh, and Cassel suck and no one gives a shit about your "line in the sand".

Dumbass.

Wow, that's a great comeback. I guess that ends the debate right there. Sheesh, sounds like a little kid. :shake:

teedubya
09-20-2010, 03:03 PM
I won't judge Matt Cassel until he is in the Hall of Fame.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 03:04 PM
Wow, that's a great comeback. I guess that ends the debate right there. Sheesh, sounds like a little kid. :shake:

Fuck you.

SenselessChiefsfan and I have been 'round and 'round this silly debate.

Do you have anything to add?

Pestilence
09-20-2010, 03:04 PM
Give the kid a chance.

He does not always make the play, but he is a team player and he is either going to win the job long term or prove that he is a backup.

He has not looked great, but I bet that if the Chiefs defense had played worse, he would have had more chances to make plays because the coaches would have called different plays.

Looks like things are setting up real good for the kid to prove that he can or can't do it and he is going to get the chance so just keep paying lots of money and even more time and see what happens.

Now I've heard it all.

Blame it on the defense because they didn't give him enough chances to make plays.

I fucking hate this fan base sometimes.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 03:06 PM
Sheesh, sounds like a little kid. :shake:

Says the fucking moron that burned someone's hat.

Shut the fuck up, Dummy.

teedubya
09-20-2010, 03:07 PM
Says the ****ing moron that burned someone's hat.



Oh Burn!! (literally)

Lzen
09-20-2010, 03:08 PM
**** you.

SenselessChiefsfan and I have been 'round and 'round this silly debate.

Do you have anything to add?

Again, great comeback. All you have is **** you. That is childish, really. You sound like a little kid that says "and if you don't agree with me, I hate you". Get a grip, dude.

I just don't buy that the coordinators on a team that won 3 SBs had no other offers. Or rather, would not have had any other offers. I just think the Chiefs were going to get them no matter what it took.

Personally, I was ecstatic that they got Crennel as I think he was the best man for the job. Maybe not so much for Weis, but he is a definite improvement over Haley wearing 2 hats.

Lzen
09-20-2010, 03:09 PM
Says the ****ing moron that burned someone's hat.

Shut the **** up, Dummy.

That has exactly zero to do with this. Your arguments are retarded yet you call everyone else dummy. :rolleyes:

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 03:10 PM
Again, great comeback. All you have is **** you. That is childish, really. You sound like a little kid that says "and if you don't agree with me, I hate you". Get a grip, dude.

Fuck off


I just don't buy that the coordinators on a team that won 3 SBs had no other offers.

Well, clearly you don't know much about the situation.


Or rather, would not have had any other offers.

Would have? WTF?

Weis and Crennel had worked with Haley & Pioli in the past. They were nearly pre-destined to work in KC. Crennel said he may have considered NE or Miami but neither job was open when he signed with KC.

teedubya
09-20-2010, 03:11 PM
my internet penis is fourteen inches long.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 03:12 PM
That has exactly zero to do with this. Your arguments are retarded yet you call everyone else dummy. :rolleyes:

Oh really?

You call me "childish", when you don't even know the gist of the conversation.

Yet you acted like a complete, drunken fool.

So who, in reality, is the child?

Lzen
09-20-2010, 03:12 PM
**** off

I imagine you jumping up and down like a toddler when people don't agree with you.


Well, clearly you don't know much about the situation.

And you do? Where's your proof. I haven't followed your back and forth with SCF so perhaps you have posted it. Why don't you post the links so that I can see?

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 03:16 PM
I imagine you jumping up and down like a toddler when people don't agree with you.

That's due to your extremely limited imagination.


And you do? Where's your proof. I haven't followed your back and forth with SCF so perhaps you have posted it. Why don't you post the links so that I can see?

I have a better idea: If you're so interested, use the search function.

Mecca
09-20-2010, 03:19 PM
Matt Cassel is such a team player he takes no responsibility for his fuckups any time he speaks.

Bane
09-20-2010, 03:20 PM
Matt Cassel is such a team player he takes no responsibility for his ****ups any time he speaks.

Matt Cassel doesn't have "**** ups" /Matt Cassel

Fish
09-20-2010, 03:26 PM
Give the kid a chance.

He does not always make the play, but he is a team player and he is either going to win the job long term or prove that he is a backup.

He has not looked great, but I bet that if the Chiefs defense had played worse, he would have had more chances to make plays because the coaches would have called different plays.

Looks like things are setting up real good for the kid to prove that he can or can't do it and he is going to get the chance so just keep paying lots of money and even more time and see what happens.

Guys... guys... he's right. All we need is a shittier defense. Then we'll begin to see Cassel really shine...

Give him a chance.

Bane
09-20-2010, 03:27 PM
Guys... guys... he's right. All we need is a shittier defense. Then we'll begin to see Cassel really shine...

Give him a chance.

Uh..I'm no genius but wouldn't that have been last year?ROFL

Fish
09-20-2010, 04:29 PM
Uh..I'm no genius but wouldn't that have been last year?ROFL

Well sonofabitch....

Back to the drawing board......

Brock
09-20-2010, 04:31 PM
Give the kid a chance.

He does not always make the play, but he is a team player and he is either going to win the job long term or prove that he is a backup.

He has not looked great, but I bet that if the Chiefs defense had played worse, he would have had more chances to make plays because the coaches would have called different plays.

Looks like things are setting up real good for the kid to prove that he can or can't do it and he is going to get the chance so just keep paying lots of money and even more time and see what happens.

Dumb gunt.

Baconeater
09-20-2010, 04:39 PM
Give the kid a chance.

He does not always make the play, but he is a team player and he is either going to win the job long term or prove that he is a backup.

He has not looked great, but I bet that if the Chiefs defense had played worse, he would have had more chances to make plays because the coaches would have called different plays.

Looks like things are setting up real good for the kid to prove that he can or can't do it and he is going to get the chance so just keep paying lots of money and even more time and see what happens.
Sometimes it is better to keep quiet and be thought a fool than to start typing and completely remove all doubt.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 04:50 PM
I imagine you jumping up and down like a toddler when people don't agree with you.




And you do? Where's your proof. I haven't followed your back and forth with SCF so perhaps you have posted it. Why don't you post the links so that I can see?


I posted links. He posted his opinion. In his mind, he won the debate.

jettio
09-20-2010, 04:51 PM
Sometimes it is better to keep quiet and be thought a fool than to start typing and completely remove all doubt.

Matt Cassell is going to get his chance to prove himself this year.

If you think that he is not starting the San Francisco game because you do not like him, then you are probably wrong.

Bane
09-20-2010, 04:52 PM
Matt Cassell is going to get his chance to prove himself this year.

If you think that he is not starting the San Francisco game because you do not like him, then you are probably wrong.

What's he waiting for?

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 05:11 PM
I posted links. He posted his opinion. In his mind, he won the debate.

Your links were shit.

It was media speculation with no actual confirmation by the Bears or Charlie Weis. A simple Google search will tell you all you need to know.

Your reading comprehension isn't worth a shit if you believe otherwise.

As far as Crennel, he never had an offer from any team but the Chiefs. He later stated that he may have been interested in the Miami and New England positions, but neither were open when he was hired by the Chiefs.

-King-
09-20-2010, 05:18 PM
Dane...how do you know what teams contacted Weis and Crennel? Are you their secretary?

Baconeater
09-20-2010, 05:19 PM
Matt Cassell is going to get his chance to prove himself this year.

If you think that he is not starting the San Francisco game because you do not like him, then you are probably wrong.
LMAO Where in that post did I say ANYTHING about him not starting? Do you smoke crack by any chance?

Chiefs Pantalones
09-20-2010, 05:19 PM
I know that we want to pile on Cassel. He hasn't looked great. I also know that the Chiefs have been rather conservative in these games.

The Chiefs only care about winning. Pretty or Ugly doesn't matter.

I think the Chiefs will continue to be conservative through the Indy game.

This week, they have the 9ers. The 49ers aren't a huge threat to put up a ton of points. I expect, Herm lite again this week.

They will go to the bye and then play the Colts. There is a part of me that thinks they will open up the offense in this game. But, I think they will stick to the run predominantly. The Colts do not have a good run defense, and the Chiefs will be fully rested after the bye week. Give the pass rushing prowess of Indy and the fact that it is in the dome, the Chiefs will try very diligently to stick to that game plan.

It will be the following week, that I think the Chiefs will open up the playbook. Houston is a good team. They will put up a ton of points. And, they are good against the run and pass. I think the Chiefs will have to open it up against the Texans.

I am not going to blow sunshine here and say Cassel is great. But, this will be the test, in my mind. Right now, I feel like his hands are a little tied.

The Chiefs will have to untie his hands and hope for the best in a couple weeks.

At the end of that game, I think we will have a very good read on exactly what Cassel is. Unfortunately, I am very concerned that we will not like the way the book ends.

You won't judge Cassel until after the Houston game? LOL well I hope you're kind.

-King-
09-20-2010, 05:21 PM
What's he waiting for?

Dude have you seen this Oline? Only 1 first round pick. Until he gets 5 1st round pick, All pro, future HOFs infront of him, you cannot fairly judge him.

Bane
09-20-2010, 05:27 PM
Dude have you seen this Oline? Only 1 first round pick. Until he gets 5 1st round pick, All pro, future HOFs infront of him, you cannot fairly judge him.

Oh yeah I remember that argument.The whole all we need is 200 million in pro bowlers to make him great!

KCChiefsFan88
09-20-2010, 05:55 PM
if he isn't great.....get ****ing rid of him already.

Getting rid of Cassel isn't an option as long as Plan B is Brodie Croyle.

The Chiefs are stuck with Steve Bono 2.0 for the remainder of the season.

Bane
09-20-2010, 05:57 PM
Getting rid of Cassel isn't an option as long as Plan B is Brodie Croyle.

The Chiefs are stuck with Steve Bono 2.0 for the remainder of the season.

I believe that as well.IMO barring an injury,or multiple games in which he throws 4-5 picks and we lose in awful fashion because of him,he will start all 16 games.

Pestilence
09-20-2010, 05:58 PM
Getting rid of Cassel isn't an option as long as Plan B is Brodie Croyle.

The Chiefs are stuck with Steve Bono 2.0 for the remainder of the season.

We can bench his dumb ass and let Croyle play. Whats the worst that can happen.....Cassel plays again?

Sweet Daddy Hate
09-20-2010, 05:59 PM
Chiefs I won't judge Cassel until after the Houston Game. (http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?p=7021559#post7021559)

Of course you won't.:shake:

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 06:00 PM
Your links were shit.

It was media speculation with no actual confirmation by the Bears or Charlie Weis. A simple Google search will tell you all you need to know.

Your reading comprehension isn't worth a shit if you believe otherwise.

As far as Crennel, he never had an offer from any team but the Chiefs. He later stated that he may have been interested in the Miami and New England positions, but neither were open when he was hired by the Chiefs.

I know, if not for the sorry Chiefs, they would be working at McDonalds. I am sure that two respected, Super Bowl coordinators, would have never had any other job offers.

http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2010/01/ny_giants_contact_romeo_crenne.html

Yeah, a simple google search does tell you all you need to know.

I know, it only says that they 'contacted' Romeo. I am sure they were wanting to talk to him about managing the stadium's food service operation.

I know, I know just more media speculation. It's media speculation if it doesn't support your argument.

jettio
09-20-2010, 06:03 PM
LMAO Where in that post did I say ANYTHING about him not starting? Do you smoke crack by any chance?

Your post did not say ANYTHING at all.

You just called me a fool for figuring out that Cassell is going to get his chance this year to earn the job long term or to prove that he is a backup.

You have never posted anything insightful or interesting, so why don't you just wait around until next Sunday with your thumb up your azz hoping that Matt Cassell will not play against the 49ers or any other team the rest of the year.

BWillie
09-20-2010, 06:10 PM
I won't judge Cassel until his contract is up and after he has squandered away 60 million dollars that we could have used on other talent or a competent QB...

Bane
09-20-2010, 06:11 PM
I won't judge Cassel until his contract is up and after he has squandered away 60 million dollars that we could have used on other talent or a competent QB...

Well lets just hope this will be the end of our 20+ year dumpster diving QB mission.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 06:17 PM
Well lets just hope this will be the end of our 20+ year dumpster diving QB mission.

The most disapointing thing to me is that even after the 2-14 year, with a franchise QB sitting there, we didn't trade up for Stafford.

At this point, I think we will have Cassel or a similar QB for a long time. Someone will have to fall like Aaron Rogers for the Chiefs to take a flyer on him.

Even if they decide that Cassel isn't the best option, I doubt they trade up this year in the draft to get a chance a real franchise QB.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 06:20 PM
I
I know, I know just more media speculation. It's media speculation if it doesn't support your argument.

Yes, it IS media speculation and he wasn't offered the job.

Same with Weis.

I have NO idea WHY you continue to state otherwise.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 06:22 PM
The most disapointing thing to me is that even after the 2-14 year, with a franchise QB sitting there, we didn't trade up for Stafford.

What in the fucking world gives you the idea that Detroit would have traded out on the spot and missed out on Stafford?

That's just plain dumb.

At this point, I think we will have Cassel or a similar QB for a long time. Someone will have to fall like Aaron Rogers for the Chiefs to take a flyer on him.

Even if they decide that Cassel isn't the best option, I doubt they trade up this year in the draft to get a chance a real franchise QB.


Wrong.

I truly believe that once Cassel bombs this year, he's a goner. These guys want to WIN, not fuck around.

Simply Red
09-20-2010, 06:36 PM
people at the bar I go to were CRACKING UP at my Matt Cassel meltdowns...

http://i52.tinypic.com/5a2xdv.gif

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 06:38 PM
Yes, it IS media speculation and he wasn't offered the job.

Same with Weis.

I have NO idea WHY you continue to state otherwise.

Yeah, the agent confirmed contact. But, just media speculation.

I have no idea why you continue to act like it is such a stretch for two Super Bowl winning coordinators to have more than one job offer. Not much of a stretch, really.

I am sorry that you have trouble using common sense in these things.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 06:40 PM
Yeah, the agent confirmed contact. But, just media speculation.

I have no idea why you continue to act like it is such a stretch for two Super Bowl winning coordinators to have more than one job offer. Not much of a stretch, really.

I am sorry that you have trouble using common sense in these things.

No there was no offer. The agent didn't even know what they spoke about. Furthermore, Crennel runs a 3-4 and the Giants run a 4-3, which is why the chose Fewell. They weren't about to dump their personnel for a coordinator.

Weis had no offers, either. Do you know why?

Both had already planned to join KC at season's end.

So stop with the bullshit, if that's even possible.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 06:45 PM
What in the ****ing world gives you the idea that Detroit would have traded out on the spot and missed out on Stafford?

That's just plain dumb.



Wrong.

I truly believe that once Cassel bombs this year, he's a goner. These guys want to WIN, not **** around.


First, unlike you, I don't claim to know things that I don't. The Chiefs may have asked the Lions if they were interested in trading the pick. But, whether that happened or not, I was still disappointed that the Chiefs didn't trade up for him. I saw him the entire time he was at UGA, and I thought he was a great QB. As the Chiefs were losing, my one ray of hope was that they might be able to get Stafford. So, whether they tried or not... I was disappointed that they didn't get Stafford.

At the time, I thought Cassel was the second best option at QB.

Now, on to your your second statement. So far, Cassel hasn't bombed this year. He hasn't cost the Chiefs any games. He was even largely responsible for the Chiefs win in Cleveland.

So, unless the Chiefs have a QB fall to them, or have a veteran that they feel is a significant upgrade.... I just don't see any change.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 06:47 PM
So, unless the Chiefs have a QB fall to them, or have a veteran that they feel is a significant upgrade.... I just don't see any change.

That's because you think they're happy with wins from a QB with a rating of 55 on the season.

That's not going to cut it for these guys and I'm pretty sure they know that Matt Cassel is incapable of putting the team on his shoulder to win a game.

Unless he turns into the second coming of Tom Brady, he's gone.

chiefzilla1501
09-20-2010, 06:47 PM
I know that we want to pile on Cassel. He hasn't looked great. I also know that the Chiefs have been rather conservative in these games.

The Chiefs only care about winning. Pretty or Ugly doesn't matter.

I think the Chiefs will continue to be conservative through the Indy game.

This week, they have the 9ers. The 49ers aren't a huge threat to put up a ton of points. I expect, Herm lite again this week.

They will go to the bye and then play the Colts. There is a part of me that thinks they will open up the offense in this game. But, I think they will stick to the run predominantly. The Colts do not have a good run defense, and the Chiefs will be fully rested after the bye week. Give the pass rushing prowess of Indy and the fact that it is in the dome, the Chiefs will try very diligently to stick to that game plan.

It will be the following week, that I think the Chiefs will open up the playbook. Houston is a good team. They will put up a ton of points. And, they are good against the run and pass. I think the Chiefs will have to open it up against the Texans.

I am not going to blow sunshine here and say Cassel is great. But, this will be the test, in my mind. Right now, I feel like his hands are a little tied.

The Chiefs will have to untie his hands and hope for the best in a couple weeks.

At the end of that game, I think we will have a very good read on exactly what Cassel is. Unfortunately, I am very concerned that we will not like the way the book ends.

Actually, it does matter.

The goal is to win a Super Bowl. You're not going to come close to sniffing a Super Bowl the way our offense played on Sunday. And we're not even talking about wanting pro bowl play out of our QB. We've all pretty much said that with average play, we could be playoff contenders. We can't even get that much.

I don't know what you're waiting for. The receivers aren't that horrible now. Defenses are cheating everyone up daring Cassel to complete a pass. The o-line is holding their blocks for at least 5 seconds on most plays--he wasn't even touched on Sunday. And you're not going to tell me that Cleveland's average secondary somehow shut his receivers down.

The fact is that Cassel doesn't have accuracy, he stares down his primary read, he has no pocket recognition and as a result looks like he's crapping his pants when he doesn't see his primary read open, he checks down more than any QB in the game (maybe apart from Sanchez), and he waits for receivers to get open instead of hitting them as soon as they cut in their route.

Watch Drew Brees tonight. That ball is out of his hand before the receiver even turns around.

But you're right, maybe in the next month, he fixes all of those things.

DeezNutz
09-20-2010, 06:52 PM
So far, Cassel hasn't bombed this year.

QB rating: 57.0

That's about league average, I'm sure.

smittysbar
09-20-2010, 06:59 PM
QB rating: 57.0

That's about league average, I'm sure.

Championship

Sweet Daddy Hate
09-20-2010, 07:28 PM
Sometimes I literally can not believe the takes that "Sensible" thinks are sensible.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 07:30 PM
Sometimes I literally can not believe the takes that "Senseless" thinks are sensible.

FYP

Sweet Daddy Hate
09-20-2010, 07:32 PM
FYP

Well, I used to call him "Nonsensical Chiefs Fan", but I'm trying to be a nicer guy on the board.

tarheel23
09-20-2010, 07:44 PM
If you think we will not have to open up the offense to beat Indy, your not very sensible.

Rausch
09-20-2010, 07:50 PM
Wrong.

I truly believe that once Cassel bombs this year, he's a goner. These guys want to WIN, not **** around.

I can see us showing Casshole the door but I don't see us going QB in the first round. I just don't think Pioli will...

Sweet Daddy Hate
09-20-2010, 07:55 PM
I can see us showing Casshole the door but I don't see us going QB in the first round. I just don't think Pioli will...

If he was willing to give up that kind of grip on a 6th/7th round backup...

Just sayin'.

Lzen
09-20-2010, 08:00 PM
I posted links. He posted his opinion. In his mind, he won the debate.

Hey, I'm in agreement with most that Cassel needs to go. As a matter of fact, I was one of us who wanted to see Croyle in the second half yesterday.

But I just don't understand the attitude of "**** you if you don't agree with my OPINION!" This message board has always been about exchange of ideas and opinions. Just because someone has a different opinion of something doesn't mean they're wrong.

And Google searches don't mean jack. I think its funny how some think they know what goes on inside organizations. It seems pretty naive to me to think that Crennel and even Weis (sp?) were never considered by another team.

Matt Cassell is going to get his chance to prove himself this year.

If you think that he is not starting the San Francisco game because you do not like him, then you are probably wrong.

As a Chiefs fan, I hope he improves enough to give this team a chance to go to the playoffs. I just don't see that happening at that point in time. Right now, he sucks.

I won't judge Cassel until his contract is up and after he has squandered away 60 million dollars that we could have used on other talent or a competent QB...

He should give most of that money he stole back to the Chiefs.

Lzen
09-20-2010, 08:02 PM
No there was no offer. The agent didn't even know what they spoke about. Furthermore, Crennel runs a 3-4 and the Giants run a 4-3, which is why the chose Fewell. They weren't about to dump their personnel for a coordinator.

Weis had no offers, either. Do you know why?

Both had already planned to join KC at season's end.

So stop with the bullshit, if that's even possible.

So you're saying the plan all along was that both would go to the Chiefs after the season was over? I believe that about Crennel (have thought that since he was hired) but when was Weiss fired?

Sweet Daddy Hate
09-20-2010, 08:03 PM
As a Chiefs fan, I hope he improves enough to give this team a chance to go to the playoffs. I just don't see that happening at that point in time. Right now, he sucks.



He should give most of that money he stole back to the Chiefs.

He is...the most Herm Edwards...of Quarterbacks.


http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_MMe9YfPA7Mk/SktwMc8SlXI/AAAAAAAAAD0/YQwainIpGm0/s320/the_most_interesting_man_in_the_world.jpg

Stay hateful, my friends.

-King-
09-20-2010, 08:08 PM
Watch Bowe...
http://cdn0.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548271/presnap.jpg
Keep watching
http://cdn3.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548274/snap_medium.jpg
Hmmmm
http://cdn1.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548289/snap2_medium.jpg
Is Bowe open?
http://cdn2.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548277/open_medium.jpg



Yeah he is, so the ball is going to go to him right?





























Wait...what is he doing with the ball?
http://cdn3.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548325/turnover_medium.jpg

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 08:22 PM
So you're saying the plan all along was that both would go to the Chiefs after the season was over? I believe that about Crennel (have thought that since he was hired) but when was Weiss fired?

Weis was fired November 30, 2009 and as soon as that happened, he was on his way to KC.

He was linked to the Bears by a Chicago area writer but quite honestly, that never made any sense because Weis has no background or past connection with Jerry Angelo or Lovie Smith.

Smith hired Martz because of their past association with the Rams.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 08:25 PM
QB rating: 57.0

That's about league average, I'm sure.

No, that is well below. But, the Chiefs are 2-0. Cassel has helped them win, and not made a bunch of stupid mistakes.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 08:28 PM
If you think we will not have to open up the offense to beat Indy, your not very sensible.

I think that the goal will be to run the ball and limit TOP for the Colts. I think that they will try to keep the game as conservative and close as possible.

Colts are better against the pass than the run and have a great domefield advantage.

The Texans on the other hand give up a lot of passing yards.

DeezNutz
09-20-2010, 08:30 PM
No, that is well below. But, the Chiefs are 2-0. Cassel has helped them win, and not made a bunch of stupid mistakes.

Yeah, that 57 is misleading because Cassel has been a huge plus. For example, he was instrumental in sustaining drives in week 1 and helping to put points on the board in week 2.

Sweet Daddy Hate
09-20-2010, 08:32 PM
No, that is well below. But, the Chiefs are 2-0. Cassel has helped them win, and not been asked to do much more than emulate "Corky" from 'Life Goes On' as a QB for this team.

Yeah, you're right.

-King-
09-20-2010, 08:35 PM
No, that is well below. But, the Chiefs are 2-0. Cassel has helped them win, and not made a bunch of stupid mistakes.

You do realize that a team can win in spite of a player right?

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 08:36 PM
Yeah, that 57 is misleading because Cassel has been a huge plus. For example, he was instrumental in sustaining drives in week 1 and helping to put points on the board in week 2.

He played well in the second half of the Browns game.

I am not saying he is great, but he hasn't played himself out of the position because I don't think that the Chiefs will have much else available.

In other words, unless they see a QB that they believe is a definite upgrade fall to them in the draft, OR a proven veteran that is a significant upgrade.... then I just don't think they make the move.

Cassel is a mid level starter. But, he is a legit starting QB, IMO. I just think the Chiefs will keep him around unless he really wets the bed and costs the Chiefs a win. Especially if it is in a game that matters. (assuming the Chiefs are in some sort of playoff contention towards the end of the season)

I just think that Cassel is the guy until something that they believe is much better, is available.

KCBOSS1
09-20-2010, 08:37 PM
CUT HIM! next

DeezNutz
09-20-2010, 08:37 PM
You do realize that a team can win in spite of a player right?

Bullshit. Where would the Chiefs be without his single TD pass, 2 INTs, and impeccable leadership?

We could win a few games with 53 Matt Gloads.

DeezNutz
09-20-2010, 08:39 PM
I just think that Cassel is the guy until something that they believe is much better, is available.

We agree here. The problem is that it wouldn't be hard some someone to qualify as "much better."

Matt Cassel is a terrible ****ing football player with football instincts that parallel GoChiefs' dating instincts.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 08:40 PM
But, the Chiefs are 2-0. Cassel has helped them win, and not made a bunch of stupid mistakes.

You've just lost any credibility you may have had in this forum.

:shake:

I swear, we're watching completely different QB's and teams.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 08:43 PM
You've just lost any credibility you may have had in this forum.

:shake:

I swear, we're watching completely different QB's and teams.

The guy who thinks that Weis and Romeo couldn't find another job in the NFL thinks I have no credibility. Oh, noes!

Again, until he costs them a game, it won't matter. That is my point. Until the arrow is pointing squarely at him after a loss, then it won't matter how he plays.

And, unless the loss comes at some point that it really matters, then I don't think that the Chiefs will make a move.

Sweet Daddy Hate
09-20-2010, 08:46 PM
The guy who thinks that Weis and Romeo couldn't find another job in the NFL thinks I have no credibility. Oh, noes!

Again, until he costs them a game, it won't matter. That is my point. Until the arrow is pointing squarely at him after a loss, then it won't matter how he plays.

And, unless the loss comes at some point that it really matters, then I don't think that the Chiefs will make a move.

The loss? Not yet.

The arrow already pointing in his sole direction as the major offensive weakness of this team? Oh yes!

DeezNutz
09-20-2010, 08:46 PM
Until the arrow is pointing squarely at him after a loss, then it won't matter how he plays.


Good luck with that.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 08:52 PM
The guy who thinks that Weis and Romeo couldn't find another job in the NFL thinks I have no credibility. Oh, noes!

What the fuck?

JFC, you're an idiot.

Again, until he costs them a game, it won't matter. That is my point. Until the arrow is pointing squarely at him after a loss, then it won't matter how he plays.

And, unless the loss comes at some point that it really matters, then I don't think that the Chiefs will make a move.

Just shut the fuck up. You're embarrassing yourself.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 08:57 PM
Good luck with that.

Here is the thing. I think the Chiefs are 'comfortable' with Cassel. They know what they have. They know he is a mid level QB. But, they also know that he is a hard worker and a good leader. They know he is tough and can take a beating.

That won't ever win over the fans. The fans want a franchise QB. The Chiefs do as well, but they also know that there aren't that many of those in the NFL. So, unless they believe that one will be a franchise QB, I expect them to stick with what they know.

And, again, I think he is on par with mid level QB's. Guys like Orton. Guys that aren't going to win you games, but are decent game managers.

That's all. I think that is what he is. I think that is what he will prove to be. And, I think the Chiefs won't replace him until they get a clear shot at something much better.

go bowe
09-20-2010, 08:59 PM
Well, I used to call him "Nonsensical Chiefs Fan", but I'm trying to be a nicer guy on the board.trying to be a nicer guy?

wtf is wrong with you???

you're the asshole we love to hate, or hate to love, or some such...

don't change a thing...

we have too many nice guys already...

we need more character around here...

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 09:02 PM
And, again, I think he is on par with mid level QB's. Guys like Orton. Guys that aren't going to win you games, but are decent game managers.


More fucking bullshit.

IF Cassel was "on par" with Orton, this team would have won their last two games easily and would no doubt be a playoff team.

You clearly have no fucking clue about the quarterback position and certainly don't know a damn thing about Kyle Orton's 2009 & 2010 performances.

-King-
09-20-2010, 09:07 PM
Here is the thing. I think the Chiefs are 'comfortable' with Cassel. They know what they have. They know he is a mid level QB. But, they also know that he is a hard worker and a good leader. They know he is tough and can take a beating.

That won't ever win over the fans. The fans want a franchise QB. The Chiefs do as well, but they also know that there aren't that many of those in the NFL. So, unless they believe that one will be a franchise QB, I expect them to stick with what they know.

And, again, I think he is on par with mid level QB's. Guys like Orton. Guys that aren't going to win you games, but are decent game managers.

That's all. I think that is what he is. I think that is what he will prove to be. And, I think the Chiefs won't replace him until they get a clear shot at something much better.

I'm sure you haven't seen an Orton game the last 2 years. It's insulting to him to compare him to Cassel. Hell, did you see him last week?

MadMax
09-20-2010, 09:07 PM
trying to be a nicer guy?

wtf is wrong with you???

you're the asshole we love to hate, or hate to love, or some such...

don't change a thing...

we have too many nice guys already...

we need more character around here...



Well then, Fuck you you POS!!! :)

Sweet Daddy Hate
09-20-2010, 09:09 PM
Here is the thing. I think the Chiefs are 'comfortable' with Cassel.

Whoa. Just stop right there, patna.

MadMax
09-20-2010, 09:10 PM
The guy who thinks that Weis and Romeo couldn't find another job in the NFL thinks I have no credibility. Oh, noes!

Again, until he costs them a game, it won't matter. That is my point. Until the arrow is pointing squarely at him after a loss, then it won't matter how he plays.

And, unless the loss comes at some point that it really matters, then I don't think that the Chiefs will make a move.




Do you even watch the games???

-King-
09-20-2010, 09:11 PM
I'm sorry, but I had to PM DaFace to request that he remove the "sensible" from your name.

Sweet Daddy Hate
09-20-2010, 09:21 PM
I'm sorry, but I had to PM DaFace to request that he remove the "sensible" from your name.

ROFL

RustShack
09-20-2010, 09:26 PM
I'm sorry, but I had to PM DaFace to request that he remove the "sensible" from your name.

Win :clap:

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 09:38 PM
More ****ing bullshit.

IF Cassel was "on par" with Orton, this team would have won their last two games easily and would no doubt be a playoff team.

You clearly have no ****ing clue about the quarterback position and certainly don't know a damn thing about Kyle Orton's 2009 & 2010 performances.

Yeah, I mean, they made the playoffs last year..... wait.

Well, he was at least stellar in his last game to give the Broncos a chance at the playoffs.... wait.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 09:40 PM
Whoa. Just stop right there, patna.

Sorry, if you don't like it. I am not saying it's 'right'. Just saying that I think they are comfortable with him.

Sweet Daddy Hate
09-20-2010, 09:43 PM
Yeah, I mean, they made the playoffs last year..... wait.

Well, he was at least stellar in his last game to give the Broncos a chance at the playoffs.... wait.

Is this really the "logic" you're coming from?

:facepalm:

BigMeatballDave
09-20-2010, 09:46 PM
Yeah, I mean, they made the playoffs last year..... wait.

Well, he was at least stellar in his last game to give the Broncos a chance at the playoffs.... wait.

:rolleyes: A Mod should remove 'Sensible' from your user.

BigMeatballDave
09-20-2010, 09:47 PM
I'm sorry, but I had to PM DaFace to request that he remove the "sensible" from your name.LMAO I guess I'm a little late...

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 09:48 PM
I'm sure you haven't seen an Orton game the last 2 years. It's insulting to him to compare him to Cassel. Hell, did you see him last week?

I haven't seen every snap, but I have seen a lot of him.

I think that Cassel and he are very similar level QB's. I also think that the Chiefs haven't had similar talent around Cassel.

Do you think that Josh McD tries to trade for Cassel if he doesn't think that he is at least on Orton's level?

I am not saying that they have played at the same level. I am saying that they are comparable from a talent standpoint.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 09:49 PM
Is this really the "logic" you're coming from?

:facepalm:

Dane said specifically that 'if' the Chiefs had Orton, they would be a playoff team. Denver had as much if not more talent last year and didn't make the playoffs. In fact, in a must win game, Orton wet himself at HOME.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 09:52 PM
:rolleyes: A Mod should remove 'Sensible' from your user.

Dane specifically mentioned playoffs and the Broncos had as much, if not more talent last year. So, no.... no they wouldn't be a playoff team with Orton.

Orton and Cassel are very similar in terms of talent.

McDaniels is a more aggressive coach and the Broncos have better pass protection and WR's.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 10:13 PM
Yeah, I mean, they made the playoffs last year..... wait.

Well, he was at least stellar in his last game to give the Broncos a chance at the playoffs.... wait.

JFC, you're fucking dumb.

DUMB.

Orton had 21 TD's and 12 INT's last year.

This year, he's got 3 TD's, 1 INT more than 600 yards and a QB rating of 103.

IF he were the Chiefs QB, they'd be a playoff team, PERIOD.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 10:13 PM
I haven't seen every snap, but I have seen a lot of him.

I think that Cassel and he are very similar level QB's. I also think that the Chiefs haven't had similar talent around Cassel.



You're a drooling Mongo.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 10:15 PM
Dane specifically mentioned playoffs and the Broncos had as much, if not more talent last year. So, no.... no they wouldn't be a playoff team with Orton.


Again, more fucking stupidity.

-King-
09-20-2010, 10:17 PM
I haven't seen every snap, but I have seen a lot of him.

I think that Cassel and he are very similar level QB's. I also think that the Chiefs haven't had similar talent around Cassel.

What talent? Jabar Gaffney? Brandon Lloyd? Eddie Royal? The two RB that average less than 3 yards a carry?

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 10:19 PM
Do you think that Josh McD tries to trade for Cassel if he doesn't think that he is at least on Orton's level?


The ONLY person to be right about Cassel has been Bill Belichick.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 10:24 PM
What talent? Jabar Gaffney? Brandon Lloyd? Eddie Royal? The two RB that average less than 3 yards a carry?

Have you watched them? They actually get separation.

And, the offensive line gives better protection.

-King-
09-20-2010, 10:26 PM
Have you watched them? They actually get separation.

And, the offensive line gives better protection.

Holy fucking shit. Jabar Gaffney has the same amount of yards as Dbowe and he's been in the league for 10 years. Brandon Lloyd has less yards than Dbowe and he's been in the league 8 years.

Its not the WRs dude.

BossChief
09-20-2010, 10:28 PM
This thread is so damn littered with "the dumb" I'm not sure where to start.

Im just gonna boil it down to this:

sensible isnt very...well, sensible.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 10:28 PM
Holy fucking shit. Jabar Gaffney has the same amount of yards as Dbowe and he's been in the league for 10 years. Brandon Lloyd has less yards than Dbowe and he's been in the league 8 years.

Its not the WRs dude.

There's really no point in debating with SenselessChiefsfan.

He's an uninformed imbecile. Roy III knows more about football than this clown.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 10:29 PM
The ONLY person to be right about Cassel has been Bill Belichick.

He drafted him. He started him for a full year in the absence of Brady. He didn't run out and sign an older free agent that was sitting at home or trade for a QB. (week 1 injury, still time to trade)

Do you honestly think that Belichick and Pioli could work in the same organization and know each other so well and have a huge difference of opinion about Cassel?

Does Pioli strike you as the kind of guy to disregard Belichick's opinion of a player?

I don't know why I expect more of you, but I do. I keep expecting you to use common sense.

Even if Cassel flames out and is out of the league next year, the reality is that everyone around him in 2008 had faith in his ability to be a decent starting QB. That includes Belichick. That includes Pioli. That includes McDaniels.

Sweet Daddy Hate
09-20-2010, 10:30 PM
You're a drooling Mongo.

ROFL

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 10:35 PM
Holy ****ing shit. Jabar Gaffney has the same amount of yards as Dbowe and he's been in the league for 10 years. Brandon Lloyd has less yards than Dbowe and he's been in the league 8 years.

Its not the WRs dude.

The Broncos have a good mix of Wr's. The Chiefs have two clones of the same guy. Two bigger athletic, slower guys. They don't get separation. They don't have someone that will stretch the field and make a team pay.

I am also not saying it is ONLY the WR's. I also think that McDaniels is a much more aggressive coach. (he was aggressive with Cassel in 2008 as well) I think that the line is better at pass protection.

I think it is kind of funny that so many people take exception to the fact that I see Orton and Cassel on the same level. There has been more uproar over that than the comparisons of Cassel to Sanchez. I guess the Chiefs should have just traded for Orton.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 10:35 PM
He drafted him. He started him for a full year in the absence of Brady. He didn't run out and sign an older free agent that was sitting at home or trade for a QB. (week 1 injury, still time to trade)

Do you honestly think that Belichick and Pioli could work in the same organization and know each other so well and have a huge difference of opinion about Cassel?

Does Pioli strike you as the kind of guy to disregard Belichick's opinion of a player?

I don't know why I expect more of you, but I do. I keep expecting you to use common sense.

Even if Cassel flames out and is out of the league next year, the reality is that everyone around him in 2008 had faith in his ability to be a decent starting QB. That includes Belichick. That includes Pioli. That includes McDaniels.

You just don't get it, do you? Not surprised.

:facepalm:

Who was the ONE guy willing to part with Cassel for a measly second round pick (along with Vrabel)?

Who was the ONE guy content with Kevin O'Connell over Cassel?

Who was the ONE guy that quickly grabbed another late round QB, this time, MUCH better than Cassel?

WHO?

Everyone else was wrong about Cassel.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 10:36 PM
I guess the Chiefs should have just traded for Orton.

They wouldn't be in such desperate need of a starting QB if they had traded for Orton.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 10:41 PM
You just don't get it, do you? Not surprised.

:facepalm:

Who was the ONE guy willing to part with Cassel for a measly second round pick (along with Vrabel)?

Who was the ONE guy content with Kevin O'Connell over Cassel?

Who was the ONE guy that quickly grabbed another late round QB, this time, MUCH better than Cassel?

WHO?

Are you this freaking stupid? Seriously, you act like I am a moron, but you tend to try to look at things in a vacuum without any influence by 'reality'.

Someone was going to sign Cassel as a starting QB if the Pats didn't franchise him.

The Pats Franchised him to try to get something for him.

Due to the cost of the franchise tag, the Pats HAD to trade him.

The Chiefs were interested in him, as were the Lions and Broncos. The Chiefs stepped to the plate first and got the deal done. It was a second because the Chiefs jumped on it and got it done. The Pats wanted it done quickly and the Chiefs stepped up. The Broncos were willing to part with a first.

Yeah, I am sure that Bill Belichick wouldn't want to have a guy who threw for 3500 yards in their system as over Kevin O'connell.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 10:42 PM
They wouldn't be in such desperate need of a starting QB if they had traded for Orton.

If they had, everyone would be talking about how great Cassel looks in Denver and how Pioli should have gotten him and how Orton Sucks.

For all the stupid player moves that McDaniels does, he is a heck of an offensive mind.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 10:44 PM
Are you this freaking stupid? Seriously, you act like I am a moron, but you tend to try to look at things in a vacuum without any influence by 'reality'.

Someone was going to sign Cassel as a starting QB if the Pats didn't franchise him.

The Pats Franchised him to try to get something for him.

Due to the cost of the franchise tag, the Pats HAD to trade him.

The Chiefs were interested in him, as were the Lions and Broncos. The Chiefs stepped to the plate first and got the deal done. It was a second because the Chiefs jumped on it and got it done. The Pats wanted it done quickly and the Chiefs stepped up. The Broncos were willing to part with a first.

Yeah, I am sure that Bill Belichick wouldn't want to have a guy who threw for 3500 yards in their system as over Kevin O'connell.

Wow, you STILL don't get it.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 10:45 PM
If they had, everyone would be talking about how great Cassel looks in Denver and how Pioli should have gotten him and how Orton Sucks.

For all the stupid player moves that McDaniels does, he is a heck of an offensive mind.

Huh?

First, you claim that Orton sucks, then you claim it's McDaniels that made Orton play well? Then to top it off, you're claiming that Cassel would succeed in Denver because of McDaniels?

:facepalm:

You clearly don't watch much, if any, football.

munkey
09-20-2010, 10:47 PM
Someone was going to sign Cassel as a starting QB if the Pats didn't franchise him.

The Pats Franchised him to try to get something for him.

Due to the cost of the franchise tag, the Pats HAD to trade him.



:spock:

STFU

munkey
09-20-2010, 10:50 PM
If they had, everyone would be talking about how great Cassel looks in Denver and how Pioli should have gotten him and how Orton Sucks.

For all the stupid player moves that McDaniels does, he is a heck of an offensive mind.

You need to quit while your ahead...ROFL

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 10:54 PM
Huh?

First, you claim that Orton sucks, then you claim it's McDaniels that made Orton play well? Then to top it off, you're claiming that Cassel would succeed in Denver because of McDaniels?

:facepalm:

You clearly don't watch much, if any, football.

The point is that Cassel and Orton are the same. Not the exact same, but you can exchange out either and replace them with the other and not miss much.

Neither are great. Both are dependent on the talent around them and won't make much happen on their own.

I don't see why you struggle with these concepts. You try to make absolute judgments without regard to situations. Sports just aren't that way. There are many shades of gray.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-20-2010, 10:54 PM
:spock:

STFU

What do you not understand about this?

Sweet Daddy Hate
09-20-2010, 10:55 PM
You need to quit while your ahead...ROFL

It's like being in a room with Herm.

BossChief
09-20-2010, 11:09 PM
The point is that Cassel and Orton are the same. Not the exact same, but you can exchange out either and replace them with the other and not miss much.

Neither are great. Both are dependent on the talent around them and won't make much happen on their own.

I don't see why you struggle with these concepts. You try to make absolute judgments without regard to situations. Sports just aren't that way. There are many shades of gray.

Oh, fuck.

Dude, just take a break. You are just arguing the poster and not the points, at all, and are running yourself in circles in doing so.

You should be embarrassed.

If Cassel ever becomes even serviceable, it will be due to Weis and the team around him, not his abilities.

If we had a average quarterback right now, we would have blown out the Chargers and Browns.

If you cant see that right now, take a break.

munkey
09-20-2010, 11:14 PM
It's like being in a room with Herm.


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DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 11:15 PM
The point is that Cassel and Orton are the same.

Thank you, for proving yet once again, that you're a grade A fucking moron.

Please, for the sake of your friends and family, stop posting.

You're embarrassing the FUCK out of yourself.

munkey
09-20-2010, 11:16 PM
What do you not understand about this?

You...:doh!:

Sweet Daddy Hate
09-20-2010, 11:18 PM
<object height="385" width="480">


<embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/IMk5sMHj58I?fs=1&hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" height="385" width="480"></object>

Ahhhh...that's(not/never)the stuff!

johnny961
09-20-2010, 11:35 PM
Oh, ****.

If Cassel ever becomes even serviceable, it will be due to Weis and the team around him, not his abilities.

This is what I keep hoping, is that maybe Weis through coaching and tweaking the playbook can somehow coax just average play out of Cassel. Not gonna hold my breath on it, though.

BossChief
09-20-2010, 11:47 PM
If Weis turns things around even half way for Cassel, that should be a clear cut sign that we should draft a kid for him to develop from "NFL Birth" while we still have him.

A kid in the "premium round" for quarterback talent.

Just like Clark said he wanted to do before we burned 28 million and at least two years on Matt.

DaneMcCloud
09-20-2010, 11:50 PM
If Weis turns things around even half way for Cassel, that should be a clear cut sign that we should draft a kid for him to develop from "NFL Birth" while we still have him.

A kid in the "premium round" for quarterback talent.

Just like Clark said he wanted to do before we burned 28 million and at least two years on Matt.

There should be plenty that fit that description in the 2011 draft.

BossChief
09-20-2010, 11:57 PM
There should be plenty that fit that description in the 2011 draft.

and as I said in another thread, I would be totally ok with trading multiple picks if thats what it takes to get who Weis wants even if there are multiple options to choose from. I dont want to have to settle...we should get someone HE feels has the tools.

If luck comes out and we can ship our 1st, 2nd and 3rd to trade up to select him....DO IT. I think we can afford it if we utilize the remaining picks properly.

Then sign a vet to start for 10 games to a year and CHANGE THE PERCEPTION OF THIS TEAM FOR THE NEXT 15 YEARS!

BryanBusby
09-20-2010, 11:58 PM
and as I said in another thread, I would be totally ok with trading multiple picks if thats what it takes to get who Weis wants.

If luck comes out and we can ship our 1st, 2nd and 3rd to trade up to select him....DO IT. I think we can afford it if we utilize the remaining picks properly.

Then sign a vet to start for 10 games to a year and CHANGE THE PERCEPTION OF THIS TEAM FOR THE NEXT 15 YEARS!

This is an awful idea.

BossChief
09-21-2010, 12:00 AM
This is an awful idea./ carl peterson

fyp

DaneMcCloud
09-21-2010, 12:02 AM
and as I said in another thread, I would be totally ok with trading multiple picks if thats what it takes to get who Weis wants even if there are multiple options to choose from. I dont want to have to settle...we should get someone HE feels has the tools.

If luck comes out and we can ship our 1st, 2nd and 3rd to trade up to select him....DO IT. I think we can afford it if we utilize the remaining picks properly.

Then sign a vet to start for 10 games to a year and CHANGE THE PERCEPTION OF THIS TEAM FOR THE NEXT 15 YEARS!

The Chiefs will be drafting in the Top 15 this year, so it won't likely take much to trade up, if that's even necessary.

At worst, I could see a 2011 number 1 and 3, with a future 2nd thrown in later. And that's worst case scenario.

Most of the teams that I expect to be ahead of the Chiefs in the draft already have a QB in place.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-21-2010, 12:03 AM
There should be plenty that fit that description in the 2011 draft.

I think the Chiefs will pick around 15-20. Who do you think will be there?

BossChief
09-21-2010, 12:11 AM
The Chiefs will be drafting in the Top 15 this year, so it won't likely take much to trade up, if that's even necessary.

At worst, I could see a 2011 number 1 and 3, with a future 2nd thrown in later. And that's worst case scenario.

Most of the teams that I expect to be ahead of the Chiefs in the draft already have a QB in place.
If Luck changes his mind and comes out after this year, I would be totally fine with using whatever picks it would take to move up to take him. The difference between him and the rest of the pack (that seems to be very talented) IMO is a pretty wide margin.

I could see him being a star in this scheme with these players around him.

johnny961
09-21-2010, 12:12 AM
and as I said in another thread, I would be totally ok with trading multiple picks if thats what it takes to get who Weis wants even if there are multiple options to choose from. I dont want to have to settle...we should get someone HE feels has the tools.

If luck comes out and we can ship our 1st, 2nd and 3rd to trade up to select him....DO IT. I think we can afford it if we utilize the remaining picks properly.

Then sign a vet to start for 10 games to a year and CHANGE THE PERCEPTION OF THIS TEAM FOR THE NEXT 15 YEARS!

I'd like to see us draft and develop a QB too. I don't want to give up this much, though. I can see a 1st and a 3rd, maybe even a 1st and a 2nd to move up if there's somebody on the board that the coaches are that high on that won't be around when we come up, but not 3 picks. I'd prefer to give nothing. If memory serves me correctly, in the last several drafts there have been starting caliber QB's available in the mid 1st round. Meaning we shouldn't have to move much if at all if the depth in 2011 is anything like it has been in recent yrs past.

BryanBusby
09-21-2010, 12:14 AM
fyp

Trading a good portion of your draft to select a QB that will have 2 years of experience on college is a huge risk. I say that as someone that likes Luck.

Pioli will not make a move like that and should not.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-21-2010, 12:18 AM
I'd like to see us draft and develop a QB too. I don't want to give up this much, though. I can see a 1st and a 3rd, maybe even a 1st and a 2nd to move up if there's somebody on the board that the coaches are that high on that won't be around when we come up, but not 3 picks. I'd prefer to give nothing. If memory serves me correctly, in the last several drafts there have been starting caliber QB's available in the mid 1st round. Meaning we shouldn't have to move much if at all if the depth in 2011 is anything like it has been in recent yrs past.

I don't care if they give up an entire draft for a franchise QB. I just want the Chiefs to be sold on a guy and go get him.

I think Cassel can be a mid level QB if he is surrounded by good talent. However, the Chiefs would struggle to accomplish anything substantial with him. The Chiefs need to get a real franchise QB.

It is nice that the Chiefs are getting better.... but the ceiling will be a wild card win or two with Cassel at QB.

johnny961
09-21-2010, 12:23 AM
Trading a good portion of your draft to select a QB that will have 2 years of experience on college is a huge risk. I say that as someone that likes Luck.

Pioli will not make a move like that and should not.

I don't see Pioli mortgaging the farm for one player either. If memory serves me correctly, during his time in NE they traded down in the 1st round for more picks more often than they stayed put or traded up.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-21-2010, 12:27 AM
I don't see Pioli mortgaging the farm for one player either. If memory serves me correctly, during his time in NE they traded down in the 1st round for more picks more often than they stayed put or traded up.

They also already had Tom Brady.

We don't.

BossChief
09-21-2010, 12:33 AM
They also already had Tom Brady.

We don't.

this is your first good post Ive read tonight.

spot on.

once you have "that guy" you can win with less and can keep the talent stacking for the future when you need a replacement/s.

Patriots have 2 1sts, 2 2nds a third and 2 4ths iirc in the upcoming draft.

Just watch them replace Randy Moss with one of those premier receiving threats with that Raiders pick they got for Seymour...and still have their own first rounder to play with.

There are at least 12 quarterbacks in the NFL right now that I would trade our top three picks for and it would be well worth it... and I like the possibility of drafting a kid while having a premier coach to bring him along in this league through the difficulties of playing young.

johnny961
09-21-2010, 12:45 AM
I don't care if they give up an entire draft for a franchise QB. I just want the Chiefs to be sold on a guy and go get him.

I think Cassel can be a mid level QB if he is surrounded by good talent. However, the Chiefs would struggle to accomplish anything substantial with him. The Chiefs need to get a real franchise QB.

It is nice that the Chiefs are getting better.... but the ceiling will be a wild card win or two with Cassel at QB.

I understand your pain, man. I just wouldn't want Pioli and Haley to trade our entire draft away for 1 expensive player who is also a potential bust. And a top-10 pick at QB is by no means a slam dunk. If we trade away half of our draft for a top-5 pick and the guy winds up being a bust, that really hurts. And, on the flip side of the coin, there have been numerous pro bowl QB's throughout history that weren't even selected in the 1st round. A high draft pick doesn't guarantee stardom.

DaneMcCloud
09-21-2010, 12:50 AM
I understand your pain, man. I just wouldn't want Pioli and Haley to trade our entire draft away for 1 expensive player who is also a potential bust. And a top-10 pick at QB is by no means a slam dunk. If we trade away half of our draft for a top-5 pick and the guy winds up being a bust, that really hurts. And, on the flip side of the coin, there have been numerous pro bowl QB's throughout history that weren't even selected in the 1st round. A high draft pick doesn't guarantee stardom.

Stop thinking Pro Bowl and start thinking Super Bowl.

johnny961
09-21-2010, 12:53 AM
There are at least 12 quarterbacks in the NFL right now that I would trade our top three picks for and it would be well worth it... and I like the possibility of drafting a kid while having a premier coach to bring him along in this league through the difficulties of playing young.

I still hate to see us trade all those picks, but personally I'd feel better about trading for somebody who has at least proven themselves in the NFL rather than trading up for someone in the draft who is unproven and a potential bust. Just my .02.

johnny961
09-21-2010, 12:56 AM
Stop thinking Pro Bowl and start thinking Super Bowl.

Good point. But the thought of us trading up in the draft to nab the next Ryan Leaf isn't exactly appealing, either.

DaneMcCloud
09-21-2010, 01:03 AM
Good point. But the thought of us trading up in the draft to nab the next Ryan Leaf isn't exactly appealing, either.

Rivers
Roethlisberger
Eli Manning
Matt Ryan

Need I go on?

Why in the fucking world would you think that Scott Pioli, Mr. "Team Captain", would draft a guy like Ryan Leaf?

Get real or get the fuck out.

milkman
09-21-2010, 06:03 AM
What I'm insanely confused by is the lack of screen passes in this offense.

The center is one of the best in the league at pulling on screens, we have 2 backs who have great vision and create big yards, and it would help take the pass rush off Cassel a bit.

I just don't understand it.

Pass rush?

Time and time again, I counted 5+ seconds that Cassel had to hold onto the ball before making a decision Sunday.

DaFace and I on one specific play in which Cassel dumped a ball almost simultaneously said "7 seconds in the pocket, and that's all you got".

And the primary reason that you aren't seeing screens is because defenses are playing everything tight, close to the LOS because they don't respect Cassel's intermediate and deep pass.

And I keep reading how the receivers aren't getting separtion, but how the hell are they supposed to manage that when everyone is within 15 yards of the LOS?

Tony Moeaki is becoming Cassel's favorite target because he's getting open at the edge of Cassel's limit, 15 yards down the middle.

Defenses will adjust to that, which might actually open things up a little for everything else underneath.

Short Leash Hootie
09-21-2010, 06:06 AM
personally with our ground attack...

I think we should cut Cassel and throw Vick a 3 year, $40M offer...

He'd be a perfect fit with Charles/McCluster and Thomas Jones...

could you imagine Charles running the ball with opposing defenses having to account for Vick, too?

the Talking Can
09-21-2010, 06:14 AM
I think we should trade for the next Grbassel. Or maybe a Cassono.

Bane
09-21-2010, 06:16 AM
I think we should trade for the next Grbassel. Or maybe a Cassono.

ROFL

milkman
09-21-2010, 06:16 AM
One is forced to speculate as to the kind of routes our "receivers" were asked to run. If they were predominantly the 5 to 8 yard variety, it kind of makes sense that they weren't going to be open.

The great West Coast offenses of the past typically had somebody who could (and did) stretch the field ... and the coaches used them to help open up the short pass.

FAX

Even if you have a receiver going deep, the defense doesn't respect Cassel's ability to throw the deep ball, so you're not seeing saftey help over the top.

There's a lot of trash inside of 12-15 yards of the LOS.

DeezNutz
09-21-2010, 06:17 AM
I'll admit, if Pioli is hell bent on not drafting a QB in round 1 (perhaps round 2 if there is another Clausen-like situation), I would support trying to acquire Vick.

We would have a fucking sick ground attack, assuming we're still not trying to "save" Charles.

Short Leash Hootie
09-21-2010, 06:18 AM
look what Vick did for Warrick Dunn and T.J. Duckett...

IMAGINE Jamaal Charles with a guy like Vick at QB...

dude would average 6.5 YPC...and that's not even an exaggeration.

We don't use our receivers anyways...Vick on KC makes more sense than anything if you ask me...

munkey
09-21-2010, 06:32 AM
IMAGINE Jamaal Charles with a guy like Vick at QB...



Not gonna happen...Not with Vic's troubled past..

the Talking Can
09-21-2010, 06:41 AM
look what Vick did for Warrick Dunn and T.J. Duckett...

IMAGINE Jamaal Charles with a guy like Vick at QB...

dude would average 6.5 YPC...and that's not even an exaggeration.

We don't use our receivers anyways...Vick on KC makes more sense than anything if you ask me...

Charles already averages 6.4 ypc

and he'll be a backup no matter who is QB...because we're saving him for when Jesus returns and wants in on a FFL...

Short Leash Hootie
09-21-2010, 06:43 AM
yeah probably...we'd probably acquire Vick and try to turn him into a pocket passer like Jim Mora did anyways

the Talking Can
09-21-2010, 06:45 AM
i never even thought i entertain the thought


but Vick does kind of look like he 'got it' at QB


that doesn't mean he's a guy you want to bank your franchise on, but he looks more like a real qB than i ever thought possible

milkman
09-21-2010, 06:53 AM
Character does matter.

It's the reason that teams like the Pats and the Colts are consistently contenders.

I want nothing to do with Vick.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-21-2010, 06:53 AM
this is your first good post Ive read tonight.

spot on.

once you have "that guy" you can win with less and can keep the talent stacking for the future when you need a replacement/s.

Patriots have 2 1sts, 2 2nds a third and 2 4ths iirc in the upcoming draft.

Just watch them replace Randy Moss with one of those premier receiving threats with that Raiders pick they got for Seymour...and still have their own first rounder to play with.

There are at least 12 quarterbacks in the NFL right now that I would trade our top three picks for and it would be well worth it... and I like the possibility of drafting a kid while having a premier coach to bring him along in this league through the difficulties of playing young.


I think Cassel is a like a house for midgets, he has a very low ceiling. I think, at his best, he is a mid level QB. He isn't a franchise QB. He is a game manager.

Unfortunately, I think the Chiefs are comfortable with him. They like his work ethic. They like his commitment. They like his leadership.

So, for them to make a move, it will take a major meltdown. It will take a loss that puts them out of playoff contention that can only be blamed on him.

Now, as far as QB's I would give up three picks for.... 12 is probably a little high. But, a guy like P. Manning, or Rodgers would definitely worth it.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-21-2010, 06:53 AM
Character does matter.

It's the reason that teams like the Pats and the Colts are consistently contenders.

I want nothing to do with Vick.

I don't want Vick either... but it certainly sounded like you were channeling your inner Pioli.

milkman
09-21-2010, 06:57 AM
I don't want Vick either... but it certainly sounded like you were channeling your inner Pioli.

The one thing that Pioli has done that I have never had any complaint about is focussing on character.

This is not new for me.

I had arguments with posters over the years about guys like Moss and Owens because I have never liked bringing players with questionable character onto this team.

SenselessChiefsFan
09-21-2010, 07:14 AM
The one thing that Pioli has done that I have never had any complaint about is focussing on character.

This is not new for me.

I had arguments with posters over the years about guys like Moss and Owens because I have never liked bringing players with questionable character onto this team.

I think at a certain point, you can bring a highly talented head case into the organization. But, it is after the team is established and there are a ton of leaders that will keep them in line.

But, I don't know how you can ever bring a QB in like that and not have it adversely affect your organization.

mrbiggz
09-21-2010, 01:46 PM
Watch Bowe...
http://cdn0.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548271/presnap.jpg
Keep watching
http://cdn3.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548274/snap_medium.jpg
Hmmmm
http://cdn1.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548289/snap2_medium.jpg
Is Bowe open?
http://cdn2.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548277/open_medium.jpg



Yeah he is, so the ball is going to go to him right?





























Wait...what is he doing with the ball?
http://cdn3.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548325/turnover_medium.jpg

Dayum! Are there any more examples from Sunday that are obvious like that one.

Chiefnj2
09-21-2010, 01:53 PM
Dayum! Are there any more examples from Sunday that are obvious like that one.

That one isn't obvious at all.

Photo 2 - Cassel beginning to drop back the safety on the top is sliding toward Bowe. The safety on the bottom stays on the hash mark.

Photo 3 - The corner on Bowe still has safety help. There is no safety help for Chambers.

Photo 4 - Cassel's arm is already in motion, he's going for the single coverage. This is the correct decision 99% of the time. Plus, Bowe still has a safety on him.

Fish
09-21-2010, 02:26 PM
Watch Bowe...
http://cdn0.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548271/presnap.jpg
Keep watching
http://cdn3.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548274/snap_medium.jpg
Hmmmm
http://cdn1.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548289/snap2_medium.jpg
Is Bowe open?
http://cdn2.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548277/open_medium.jpg



Yeah he is, so the ball is going to go to him right?





























Wait...what is he doing with the ball?
http://cdn3.sbnation.com/imported_assets/548325/turnover_medium.jpg

For all the folks claiming that the WRs aren't running past 10yds.... it sure looks like we had all 3 at least 12yds deep on that play...

OnTheWarpath58
09-21-2010, 02:35 PM
For all the folks claiming that the WRs aren't running past 10yds.... it sure looks like we had all 3 at least 12yds deep on that play...

Same thing happened multiple times on MNF - missing a wide open Bowe, that is.

Chiefnj2
09-21-2010, 02:42 PM
Same thing happened multiple times on MNF - missing a wide open Bowe, that is.

Bowe's not wide open.

OnTheWarpath58
09-21-2010, 02:46 PM
Bowe's not wide open.

He's got two steps on the CB and the safety committed to the TE.

In this league, that's wide open.

Pestilence
09-21-2010, 02:54 PM
Bowe's not wide open.

Peyton Manning doesn't have to have a WR be "wide open". Neither does Tom Brady.....or Aaron Rodgers.

Matt Cassel has to have them be "wide open" and he still almost over throws them.

Chiefnj2
09-21-2010, 02:57 PM
He's got two steps on the CB and the safety committed to the TE.

In this league, that's wide open.

The safety isn't committed to the TE. The safety is in the same spot from the snap.

He threw a crap ball that the receiver didn't fight for, but he made the right read going to the receiver that had single coverage and no deep help.

OnTheWarpath58
09-21-2010, 02:58 PM
Peyton Manning doesn't have to have a WR be "wide open". Neither does Tom Brady.....or Aaron Rodgers.

Matt Cassel has to have them be "wide open" and he still almost over throws them.

Part of the reason why it APPEARS that our WR's get no separation.

Cassel waits to see them open before throwing, instead of throwing before they come out of their break - like good QB's do.

This gives the DB time to close on the ball.

Chiefnj2
09-21-2010, 02:59 PM
Peyton Manning doesn't have to have a WR be "wide open". Neither does Tom Brady.....or Aaron Rodgers.

Matt Cassel has to have them be "wide open" and he still almost over throws them.

Nobody is saying Cassel is Manning, Brady or Rodgers. Nobody is saying he's Eli, Schaub, Ryan, Bradford, Smith or any other QB that looks to be half way decent most Sundays.

Nobody is arguing that Cassel isn't playing poorly. Stop arguing with yourself you fucking retard.

Mecca
09-21-2010, 03:00 PM
Part of the reason why it APPEARS that our WR's get no separation.

Cassel waits to see them open before throwing, instead of throwing before they come out of their break - like good QB's do.

This gives the DB time to close on the ball.

It's the WR's fault! Nothing is the QB's fault ever, just ask him or our front office.

Pestilence
09-21-2010, 03:01 PM
Nobody is saying Cassel is Manning, Brady or Rodgers. Nobody is saying he's Eli, Schaub, Ryan, Bradford, Smith or any other QB that looks to be half way decent most Sundays.

Nobody is arguing that Cassel isn't playing poorly. Stop arguing with yourself you fucking retard.

If he's not going to be any of those.....then he needs to get the fuck off of my team.

Unlike you....I don't accept mediocre.

O.city
09-21-2010, 03:03 PM
Don't know if this has ever been mentioned but when Brody was the starter, he started for Herm and we know what his system was like, run the ball, check it down. He hasn't been given a real chance in Haley or Weis system. So has he truly had a chance?

Hug it Out Dan
09-21-2010, 03:05 PM
Part of the reason why it APPEARS that our WR's get no separation.

Cassel waits to see them open before throwing, instead of throwing before they come out of their break - like good QB's do.

This gives the DB time to close on the ball.

Which is partly why he holds onto the ball so fucking long.

Hug it Out Dan
09-21-2010, 03:06 PM
Don't know if this has ever been mentioned but when Brody was the starter, he started for Herm and we know what his system was like, run the ball, check it down. He hasn't been given a real chance in Haley or Weis system. So has he truly had a chance?

"No fuck Brodie, Cassel rules!!! STFU!!! He knows the Patriot way!!!"

- Scott Pioli

O.city
09-21-2010, 03:08 PM
Exactly.


When receiver makes his break ball needs to be gone. PERIOD.
Guys aren't running wide open in the NFL, like college or high school. Look at some of the throws good qbs make. when was the last time Cassel stuck it between a safety and a corner on cover two or over a lb under the safety.

Reerun_KC
09-21-2010, 03:11 PM
Exactly.


When receiver makes his break ball needs to be gone. PERIOD.
Guys aren't running wide open in the NFL, like college or high school. Look at some of the throws good qbs make. when was the last time Cassel stuck it between a safety and a corner on cover two or over a lb under the safety.

Last sunday... :huh:

O.city
09-21-2010, 03:13 PM
What? oh he did forgot bout it.

My bad.

I was thinkin of the time Moeaki? was open just over the lb and the backer knocked it away cause it was a little too flat.