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Count Alex's Losses
09-27-2010, 09:21 PM
Suck it, drafturbators?

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=AhGIpZHWuAmJmwCf5VTnLF5DubYF?slug=cr-winnersandlosers092610


When will Scott Pioli fall flat on his face?

In some NFL circles one year ago, that wasn’t so much a question as it was a certainty.

When Pioli took over as general manager of the Kansas City Chiefs with so much fanfare in January of 2009, there were opposing executives who wagged their finger and smirked. These were the same officials who had long felt Pioli was too smug for his own good, and had a reputation that far exceeded his talents. They thought he was in a coddled position in New England – allowed to scoop up executive of the year awards when things were going good, and able to disappear behind Patriots coach Bill Belichick when things were going bad.

Kansas City, these executives smacked, would be his downfall. The roster was rotted to the core. The market was small. The fan base was impatient. And Pioli would struggle with all of that.

Asked about those doubts when we sat in his office more than a year ago, Pioli said he was aware of the outside bitterness. He talked about how he suspected the league was rampant with resentful competitors who would toast his downfall. He talked about how he knew he was gambling a chunk of his sterling reputation on unproven commodities like quarterback Matt Cassel(notes) and head coach Todd Haley. And he figured he’d be roundly criticized for dealing tight end Tony Gonzalez(notes) to the Falcons when Gonzalez clearly had a few good years left on his Hall of Fame résumé.

And as the Chiefs went through their blood-letting over the past 20 months, butchering almost 50 percent of the roster and gutting the coaching staff, more than a few critics said it spoke volumes. Pioli was supposedly in over his head. They theorized he had hired the wrong coach in Haley, an emotional grinder who would eventually get on Pioli’s nerves, or undermine personnel decisions.

When it became clear the coaching staff needed retooling, detractors snickered at the additions of offensive coordinator Charlie Weis and defensive coordinator Romeo Crennel. It would be too many egos in one room, they said … and no lording Belichick to keep “Patriots West” in working order.

Here we are, 20 months from his hiring, and the improbable Chiefs are sitting atop the AFC West at 3-0, thanks to a 31-10 drubbing of the 49ers. And much to the cynics’ dismay, Kansas City is doing it through Pioli’s machinations.

The offense is sometimes uneven, but maturing. The defense is surprisingly superb. The coaching staff, as expected, has been disciplined and prepared. And the draft classes are already showing signs of being something special, particularly guys like safety Eric Berry(notes), cornerback Javier Arenas(notes), tight end Tony Moeaki(notes), defensive end Tyson Jackson(notes), and utility man Dexter McCluster(notes).

Of course, it’s early. Three straight wins in Kansas City won’t anoint Pioli and the Chiefs – not the way three Super Bowl wins did in New England. But there is growth in Kansas City again. A once barren roster is now fertile, and players are responding to the blunt prodding and high expectations that once made the Patriots great.

Where they go from here is anyone’s guess. But Pioli has won more than just games. He’s won silence from the bitter masses, too.

Count Alex's Losses
09-27-2010, 09:22 PM
Utility man?

You're just giving the drafturbators ammo now, Charles.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 09:27 PM
His approval rating should, rightfully, be trending up, but there are some things worth considering:

The combined records of our opponents are 1-8

If you were to look at the best players on this team, all of them come from the prior regime.

That's why this was such a good job to take. There was so much young talent here already that a year or two in you were going to look good just based on their ascendancy.

Baconeater
09-27-2010, 09:30 PM
Yeah...let's see how the season plays out before we crown his ass. Or better yet, see if he can put together a team that will go beyond a first round playoff loss.

-King-
09-27-2010, 09:30 PM
His approval rating should, rightfully, be trending up, but there are some things worth considering:

The combined records of our opponents are 1-8

If you were to look at the best players on this team, all of them come from the prior regime.

That's why this was such a good job to take. There was so much young talent here already that a year or two in you were going to look good just based on their ascendancy.

A year ago, we were a team with no talent. Now they're a team that had "so much young talent"?

headsnap
09-27-2010, 09:31 PM
If you were to look at the best players on this team, all of them come from the prior regime.



:spock:

DaFace
09-27-2010, 09:32 PM
His approval rating should, rightfully, be trending up, but there are some things worth considering:

The combined records of our opponents are 1-8

If you were to look at the best players on this team, all of them come from the prior regime.

That's why this was such a good job to take. There was so much young talent here already that a year or two in you were going to look good just based on their ascendancy.

I don't disagree with your take, but that stat is getting on my nerves. The teams we beat were 1-5 against other teams. You shouldn't include the games we played in a statement like that.

FAX
09-27-2010, 09:32 PM
That "1-8" record would be somewhat different ...

... IF WE HADN'T KICKED THEIR ASSES!!!

FAX

Sannyasi
09-27-2010, 09:33 PM
His approval rating should, rightfully, be trending up, but there are some things worth considering:

The combined records of our opponents are 1-8

If you were to look at the best players on this team, all of them come from the prior regime.

That's why this was such a good job to take. There was so much young talent here already that a year or two in you were going to look good just based on their ascendancy.

I don't really disagree, but Pioli deserves credit for bringing in competent coaches to develop the talent already on the roster.

BigMeatballDave
09-27-2010, 09:33 PM
The combined records of our opponents are 1-8

Seems some around here like to use this as ammo to argue that the Chiefs my be a fluke. Maybe they are. The Chiefs DID contribute to that 1-8 record, however, and were picked to lose every game.

Just sayin'...

Count Alex's Losses
09-27-2010, 09:33 PM
:spock:

He's right:

Charles
Albert
Richardson
Bowe
Flowers
Dorsey
DJ
Carr

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 09:35 PM
A year ago, we were a team with no talent. Now they're a team that had "so much young talent"?

I don't know of a single critic of Pioli on this board who ever claimed that we were bereft of talent.

Not one.

Flowers, Carr, DJ, Dorsey, Hali, Bowe, Charles, Albert and to a lesser extent, B-Rich and Studebaker are a really nice core of young talent. You also had Waters and Gonzalez as quality vets with plenty of gas left in the tank.

Now, combine that with the fact that we had a #3 overall pick and #34 overall, and it was a damned nice position to be in.

FAX
09-27-2010, 09:36 PM
He's right:

Charles (Improved & Contributing)
Albert (Improved)
Richardson (Improved & Contributing)
Bowe (Vastly Improved)
Flowers (Improved)
Dorsey (Vastly Improved)
DJ (Vastly Improved)
Carr (Improved)


I don't know what you expect from a coaching staff if you're going to bitch about that.

FAX

BigMeatballDave
09-27-2010, 09:36 PM
Yeah...let's see how the season plays out before we crown his ass. Or better yet, see if he can put together a team that will go beyond a first round playoff loss.A winning record this season would exceed everyones expectations around here. I'm not expecting a play-off win til the 2012 season.

headsnap
09-27-2010, 09:36 PM
He's right:

Charles
Albert
Richardson
Bowe
Flowers
Dorsey
DJ
Carr

"all"

BossChief
09-27-2010, 09:36 PM
He's right:

Charles
Albert
Richardson
Bowe
Flowers
Dorsey
DJ
Carr

Arenas
Moeaki
DexFator
Weigman
Lilja

Count Alex's Losses
09-27-2010, 09:36 PM
How good would this team be with Tony Gonzalez?

We might be really dangerous.

And you'd have an extra third-round pick instead of Moeaki.

ChiefsCountry
09-27-2010, 09:37 PM
If Pioli hadn't been a dumbass and traded for Cassel, and took Sanchez. Pioli would be looking like the best fucking GM in the league right now. Young ascending team with a young promising QB leading it.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 09:37 PM
And yes, it is true that our combined opponents' records are 1-5 outside of playing us and that, despite two poor initial hires, we brought in quality coordinators to help.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 09:39 PM
How good would this team be with Tony Gonzalez?

We might be really dangerous.

And you'd have an extra third-round pick instead of Moeaki.

It's foolish to bash him for that trade. We aren't going to contend this year, and Gonzo isn't going to help us when we will. No, we wouldn't have spent the 3rd and 5th on Moeaki, but we wouldn't have had the 2B selection, either.

-King-
09-27-2010, 09:40 PM
And yes, it is true that our combined opponents' records are 1-5 outside of playing us and that, despite two poor initial hires, we brought in quality coordinators to help.

I remember you guys laughing at people who said good coordinators are worth 2 games just by themselves.

Count Alex's Losses
09-27-2010, 09:40 PM
If Pioli hadn't been a dumbass and traded for Cassel, and took Sanchez. Pioli would be looking like the best fucking GM in the league right now. Young ascending team with a young promising QB leading it.

Wow. And we could have added someone like Max Unger or Loadholt in the 2nd.

beach tribe
09-27-2010, 09:41 PM
His approval rating should, rightfully, be trending up, but there are some things worth considering:

The combined records of our opponents are 1-8

If you were to look at the best players on this team, all of them come from the prior regime.

That's why this was such a good job to take. There was so much young talent here already that a year or two in you were going to look good just based on their ascendancy.

If Herm&co were still here, instead of Haley, Weis, and Crennel there wouldn't be any of this ascendancy.

BossChief
09-27-2010, 09:41 PM
It's foolish to bash him for that trade. We aren't going to contend this year, and Gonzo isn't going to help us when we will. No, we wouldn't have spent the 3rd and 5th on Moeaki, but we wouldn't have had the 2B selection, either.

That good, because we didnt.

We traded a 4th and 5th on Tony 2 (TM).

DeezNutz
09-27-2010, 09:41 PM
Arenas
Moeaki
DexFator
Weigman
Lilja

LMAO.

Count Alex's Losses
09-27-2010, 09:42 PM
It's foolish to bash him for that trade. We aren't going to contend this year, and Gonzo isn't going to help us when we will. No, we wouldn't have spent the 3rd and 5th on Moeaki, but we wouldn't have had the 2B selection, either.

I'm just speculating about how good we might be, not bashing.

The passing game might look entirely different with Gonzalez.

They'd be in the playoffs for sure, IMO.

-King-
09-27-2010, 09:42 PM
If Pioli hadn't been a dumbass and traded for Cassel, and took Sanchez. Pioli would be looking like the best fucking GM in the league right now. Young ascending team with a young promising QB leading it.

Eh, everyone's favorite GM Ozzie Newsome fucked up with his first QB.

Baconeater
09-27-2010, 09:43 PM
A winning record this season would exceed everyones expectations around here. I'm not expecting a play-off win til the 2012 season.
Yes, a winning record would exceed everyone's expectations, but there's still a lot of games left to play. I'm not ready to say it's a foregone conclusion. And I didn't mean go beyond the first round in the playoffs this year, I meant in the future.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 09:43 PM
If Herm&co were still here, instead of Haley, Weis, and Crennel there wouldn't be any of this ascendancy.

I'll take "False Dichotomy" for $600.

ChiefsCountry
09-27-2010, 09:44 PM
Eh, everyone's favorite GM Ozzie Newsome ****ed up with his first QB.

He has fucked up with all of his QB's. Its Baltimore's major flaw, which has been discussed on here.

Count Alex's Losses
09-27-2010, 09:44 PM
Eh, everyone's favorite GM Ozzie Newsome fucked up with his first QB.

Jumping the gun a little there, aren't you?

Flacco's gonna be fine. He's too talented, surrounded by too much talent.

Direckshun
09-27-2010, 09:44 PM
The fan base's impatience that has vexed Pioli for 20 months is going to be his strongest reward for now. But I desperately hope he has longer-term hopes than just pleasing a fanbase riddled with ADD.

This team is still lacking in the foundational places: passrushing, wide receivers, defensive line, and quarterback. And this team is still banking on Matt Cassel. And this team will have to be double-digit win-worthy against tough schedules with elite QBs everywhere.

Pioli's brought this franchise pretty far in 2 years. The coaching staff in particular has been magnificent.

But he needs to remember that he has a looooooooooooooooooong ways to go to getting us where we need to be.

DeezNutz
09-27-2010, 09:45 PM
He has ****ed up with all of his QB's. Its Baltimore's major flaw, which has been discussed on here.

Flacco is a promising young player. Completely disagree with this post.

We were fucking stupid not to draft him, actually.

-King-
09-27-2010, 09:45 PM
Jumping the gun a little there, aren't you?

Flacco's gonna be fine. He's too talented, surrounded by too much talent.

Um....Kyle Boller....

BossChief
09-27-2010, 09:46 PM
LMAO.

Im just pointing out that his statement of ALL of our better players were here before he got here was false, that's all.

Is it even arguable? Let alone laughable?

beach tribe
09-27-2010, 09:47 PM
How good would this team be with Tony Gonzalez?

We might be really dangerous.

And you'd have an extra third-round pick instead of Moeaki.

Seriously? Moeaki looks to have legit skills, and is going to be here for the next decade. I'll take him, and Arenas at 22 over a 35 year old TG any day.

DeezNutz
09-27-2010, 09:48 PM
Im just pointing out that his statement of ALL of our better players were here before he got here was false, that's all.

Is it even arguable? Let alone laughable?

He said all of our "best," so, yes, that list was weak as fuck in comparison. All of those players, right now, aren't allowed even to think about Smithing Flowers' balls.

DrRyan
09-27-2010, 09:50 PM
He said all of our "best," so, yes, that list was weak as **** in comparison. All of those players, right now, aren't allowed even to think about Smithing Flowers' balls.

I hate it when people Smith my balls!

BigMeatballDave
09-27-2010, 09:50 PM
I'm just speculating about how good we might be, not bashing.

The passing game might look entirely different with Gonzalez.

They'd be in the playoffs for sure, IMO.
Play-offs? Didnt we only win 2 games 2 yrs ago when TG was here?

Brock
09-27-2010, 09:50 PM
That first draft is still ass.

headsnap
09-27-2010, 09:50 PM
Im just pointing out that his statement of ALL of our better players were here before he got here was false, that's all.

Is it even arguable? Let alone laughable?

thank you....

DeezNutz
09-27-2010, 09:51 PM
thank you....

LMAO, so you don't feel left out.

ChiefsCountry
09-27-2010, 09:51 PM
Gonzalez is a selfish loser bitch. Chiefs are better off with Arenas and Moleki.

BossChief
09-27-2010, 09:53 PM
He said all of our "best," so, yes, that list was weak as fuck in comparison. All of those players, right now, aren't allowed even to think about Smithing Flowers' balls.

Barry Richardson was on that list I responed to...as were Carr, Albert and DJ.

If those guys are on that list, so can those guys I listed.

My list accounts for 4 of our what? 6 touchdowns? Also credited for improving our OL to where we are the #1 rushing team (without even properly using our best offensive player in this area) and only giving up 2 sacks in 3 games.

Its early, but you can surely say that the list I provided are some of our better players, if not some of our best players.

chiefzilla1501
09-27-2010, 09:54 PM
I don't know of a single critic of Pioli on this board who ever claimed that we were bereft of talent.

Not one.

Flowers, Carr, DJ, Dorsey, Hali, Bowe, Charles, Albert and to a lesser extent, B-Rich and Studebaker are a really nice core of young talent. You also had Waters and Gonzalez as quality vets with plenty of gas left in the tank.

Now, combine that with the fact that we had a #3 overall pick and #34 overall, and it was a damned nice position to be in.

I don't know the history or who said what.

But I can sure tell you there were more than just a few people who claimed that the Chiefs did not have a lot of talent coming into the Pioli era. I know, because I got shelled at when I said that the team had a pretty decent foundation built.

BigMeatballDave
09-27-2010, 09:55 PM
That first draft is still ass.Yep. Looks like they may have cleared the bases with this yrs, though. We'll see.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 09:56 PM
Barry Richardson was on that list I responed to...as were Carr, Albert and DJ.

If those guys are on that list, so can those guys I listed.

My list accounts for 4 of our what? 6 touchdowns? Also credited for improving our OL to where we are the #1 rushing team (without even properly using our best offensive player in this area) and only giving up 2 sacks in 3 games.

Its early, but you can surely say that the list I provided are some of our better players, if not some of our best players.

First of all, you are conflating GC's list with mine.

I listed who I considered to be our best players (in no order)

Albert, Dorsey, Hali, DJ, Bowe, Charles, Carr, and Flowers.

None of the players you listed are yet nearly as good as those above.

DeezNutz
09-27-2010, 09:56 PM
I don't know the history or who said what.

But I can sure tell you there were more than just a few people who claimed that the Chiefs did not have a lot of talent coming into the Pioli era. I know, because I got shelled at when I said that the team had a pretty decent foundation built.

There were people who made this claim, for sure, because I argued otherwise, as well.

LT, CB, DT (now DE), RB, WR, among others. Some solid foundational pieces

DeezNutz
09-27-2010, 09:57 PM
I would like to say that "Smithing ___'s balls" should be part of the lexicon.

headsnap
09-27-2010, 09:57 PM
LMAO, so you don't feel left out.

IMNSHO, it's too early to make that statement...

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 09:57 PM
I don't know the history or who said what.

But I can sure tell you there were more than just a few people who claimed that the Chiefs did not have a lot of talent coming into the Pioli era. I know, because I got shelled at when I said that the team had a pretty decent foundation built.

There was not a better GM opening in 2009 and a lot of the so-called "negative" fans were those who championed that idea the most.

beach tribe
09-27-2010, 09:57 PM
Im just pointing out that his statement of ALL of our better players were here before he got here was false, that's all.

Is it even arguable? Let alone laughable?

We had Zero depth, and atrocious leadership. We've probably had the highest turnover of any team in the league. Putting together the right coaching staff, and a much more solid roster from top to bottom. Most of those players they are talking about are ones that they said werent going to amount to squat.
It's like dude just said. The detractors said we were completely devoid of talent, now it's like we've been stacked all along.

John Locke
09-27-2010, 10:01 PM
Important to realize that all these "Herm's Picks" never developed and contributed, until they received appropriate coaching, something that would have been unlikely to occur with Herm's coaching staff still in place.

Johnny

BossChief
09-27-2010, 10:01 PM
First of all, you are conflating GC's list with mine.

I listed who I considered to be our best players (in no order)

Albert, Dorsey, Hali, DJ, Bowe, Charles, Carr, and Flowers.

None of the players you listed are yet nearly as good as those above.

Moeaki and DMC have 4 touchdowns in 3 NFL games so far...you are simply underrating them...the same you did on draft day.

Add in those guys and I agree whole heartedly that is the list of our best players.

One could easily say that without those two players, we could easily be 1-2 right now.

right or wrong?

Im simply saying that ALL of our best players weren't all here before GM of the decade got here.

thats all

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 10:02 PM
We had Zero depth, and atrocious leadership. We've probably had the highest turnover of any team in the league. Putting together the right coaching staff, and a much more solid roster from top to bottom. Most of those players they are talking about are ones that they said werent going to amount to squat.
It's like dude just said. The detractors said we were completely devoid of talent, now it's like we've been stacked all along.

This is complete and utter bullshit.

There's no doubt that we had, and still have, a massive lack of depth, but those rookies looked damned fucking good for rookies in 2008.

I'd like to know who said that Albert, Dorsey, Carr, Flowers, Charles, Bowe, and Hali would amount to "squat".

Now, there are a multitude of people who wanted to jettison DJ. I started a thread about trading him for a 2nd rounder two years ago. However, it should also be known that a vast number of people on this site didn't want him starting this year. Others, myself included, realized that whatever warts he had, he still provided far more than Williams.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 10:05 PM
Important to realize that all these "Herm's Picks" never developed and contributed, until they received appropriate coaching, something that would have been unlikely to occur with Herm's coaching staff still in place.

Johnny

Signed,

Branden Albert (in between kicking Seymour and Joey Porter's asses as a rookie)
Brandon Flowers
Brandon Carr
Dwayne Bowe's two near 1000 yard seasons with Damon Huard and Tyler Thigpen
Glenn Dorsey (because you should judge a DT on his first year)
Jamaal Charles (our best RB even in 2008)

beach tribe
09-27-2010, 10:09 PM
There was not a better GM opening in 2009 and a lot of the so-called "negative" fans were those who championed that idea the most.

I remember YOU saying that, but not a whole lot of people agreed. Albert was a ?. Hali was considered to not be worth that 1st. Charles was never considered to be more than a 3rd down back before last season, DJ was a complete underachiever, a few ?? What Dorsey would be too.
That leaves Flowers , Carr, and Bowe, and even Bowe got his fair share of grief. I'm not aiming this at you, but most of the negative fans were pretty negative about all of this.
When asked why they were so negative the answer was "what have the chiefs done to be positive about", and when the players above were mentioned, you were either an idiot, or a true fan, so don't act as though these guys were happy with the moves that we made.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 10:14 PM
FTR, everyone was sold on Albert until 2009 when he lost all the weight and struggled with learning new technique, save for a few of the Saccopoo "5 1st round OL" guys.

I still think when you say "negative fans", who most people will think to be "Horsemen" "Draftfurbators" or "Stupid Name of the week", when in fact those are the ones who the most patient with young players.

It's the homers that often lose perspective in the midst of a long losing streak, as they tend to view things on a week to week basis. If we're 3-0 now, everything is validated. If we lose week 1, Eric Berry is the antichrist.

Most "drafturbators" don't have meltdowns because of any week's worth of plays but rather what long term consequences certain moves have.

FAX
09-27-2010, 10:20 PM
ROFL

FAX

DeezNutz
09-27-2010, 10:22 PM
ROFL

FAX

I know. "Smithing" is an outstanding verb.

Chiefnj2
09-27-2010, 10:22 PM
I don't know the history or who said what.

But I can sure tell you there were more than just a few people who claimed that the Chiefs did not have a lot of talent coming into the Pioli era. I know, because I got shelled at when I said that the team had a pretty decent foundation built.

You are correct. The majority of the board felt that the team didn't have much talent when Pioli took over. There was LJ, Flowers, Bowe and Albert. Everyone else was a "wasted" draft pick because Pioli insisted on going to a 34 defense. I love the way people try to rewrite Planet history to suit their agenda.

O.city
09-27-2010, 10:24 PM
I think our other pashrusher we are looking for might already be on the team. Studebaker looks pretty good playing opposite Hali. Don't know if he can be elite but he has all the intangibles and he is learning from a pretty good vet in Vrabel.

Again not saying he is for sure the answer but if he is that is just one less thing to worry about.

DaneMcCloud
09-27-2010, 10:24 PM
Suck it, drafturbators?



What's sad is that you and most of the other people in this forum (besides BCD) haven't apologized for all the fucking SHIT hurled at me, Hamas, Mecca & OTWP in 2009.

The sad fact is that this team is dramatically improved this year with absolutely NO impact from the first, third, fourth, fifth, sixth and one seventh round pick from 2009.

If the Chiefs even had ONE impact player from 2009, this team would be SO much further along.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 10:25 PM
You are correct. The majority of the board felt that the team didn't have much talent when Pioli took over. There was LJ, Flowers, Bowe and Albert. Everyone else was a "wasted" draft pick because Pioli insisted on going to a 34 defense. I love the way people try to rewrite Planet history to suit their agenda.

Yup, Brandon Carr and Jamaal Charles were directly affected by the change to the 3-4, and everyone thought that Hali was going to perform even worse than his 4(?) sack 2008.

The rage over the change to the 3-4 was focused around the fact that it mitigates (and still mitigates) the full extent of Dorsey's talents. As good as he is in this scheme, he'd be even more beastly as a 4-3 UT.

DaneMcCloud
09-27-2010, 10:25 PM
You are correct. The majority of the board felt that the team didn't have much talent when Pioli took over. There was LJ, Flowers, Bowe and Albert. Everyone else was a "wasted" draft pick because Pioli insisted on going to a 34 defense. I love the way people try to rewrite Planet history to suit their agenda.

What?

You're a fucking mouth-breathing retard.

O.city
09-27-2010, 10:25 PM
Don't forget Succup


LOL

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 10:26 PM
I think our other pashrusher we are looking for might already be on the team. Studebaker looks pretty good playing opposite Hali. Don't know if he can be elite but he has all the intangibles and he is learning from a pretty good vet in Vrabel.

Again not saying he is for sure the answer but if he is that is just one less thing to worry about.

I like him as a third guy. I wouldn't want him as a full-time starter on a SB contending team. We need another PR.

O.city
09-27-2010, 10:27 PM
Would you guys agree the verdict is still out on Jackson...He looked pretty good against SD before the injury...but I think i know what you mean if we could have got a game changer with that third pick and some depth with the rest we would be sitting in the money hole

O.city
09-27-2010, 10:28 PM
Any ideas on a Pass rusher in this years draft or FA?

chiefzilla1501
09-27-2010, 10:28 PM
This is complete and utter bullshit.

There's no doubt that we had, and still have, a massive lack of depth, but those rookies looked damned ****ing good for rookies in 2008.

I'd like to know who said that Albert, Dorsey, Carr, Flowers, Charles, Bowe, and Hali would amount to "squat".

Now, there are a multitude of people who wanted to jettison DJ. I started a thread about trading him for a 2nd rounder two years ago. However, it should also be known that a vast number of people on this site didn't want him starting this year. Others, myself included, realized that whatever warts he had, he still provided far more than Williams.

Actually, beach tribe has a lot of things right.

The one thing that a lot of Pioli haters ripped him a new asshole for was the focus on leadership and character. And the stubbornness to immediately plug the Patriot Way into the organization.

While it remains to be seen how he does from a personnel standpoint (though, the 2010 draft is looking extremely promising), it is very hard to deny that his insistence on bringing in guys that bought into the culture even if that meant cutting some popular guys and bringing in some underperforming scrubs is paying enormous dividends right now.

This team probably isn't nearly as good as their record indicates. But I'll tell you one thing... they're treating every single snap like it's a 2 minute drill in the Super Bowl. Meanwhile, some of the top teams like Cincy and Dallas look sluggish with 10 times the amount of talent on their rosters.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 10:30 PM
Would you guys agree the verdict is still out on Jackson...He looked pretty good against SD before the injury...but I think i know what you mean if we could have got a game changer with that third pick and some depth with the rest we would be sitting in the money hole

Well, let's just say that you are still sold on Cassel. You give him his ill-deserved 60 million and trade the #34 for him.

I, despite still wanting to draft Sanchez there, said that if you were absolutely opposed to drafting him, that we should draft Maclin at #3.

Add Jeremy Maclin to this offense or Brian Orakpo opposite Hali.

WRT Jackson: I don't know of many proclaiming him to be a bust, but a good number of people, myself included, feel as though he will never live up to the draft position and his production could have been relatively easily replaced by a later draft pick.

O.city
09-27-2010, 10:30 PM
I dunno zilla surprisingly there is quite a bit of "talent" on this squad. it's alot of young and unproven talent but i'm not sure we are as behind in terms of talent and was initially thought.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 10:32 PM
Actually, beach tribe has a lot of things right.

The one thing that a lot of Pioli haters ripped him a new asshole for was the focus on leadership and character. And the stubbornness to immediately plug the Patriot Way into the organization.

While it remains to be seen how he does from a personnel standpoint (though, the 2010 draft is looking extremely promising), it is very hard to deny that his insistence on bringing in guys that bought into the culture even if that meant cutting some popular guys and bringing in some underperforming scrubs is paying enormous dividends right now.

This team probably isn't nearly as good as their record indicates. But I'll tell you one thing... they're treating every single snap like it's a 2 minute drill in the Super Bowl. Meanwhile, some of the top teams like Cincy and Dallas look sluggish with 10 times the amount of talent on their rosters.

So now these guys are dominating because of their "character"?

Also, who the hell ever argued that Cincy or Dallas were top teams?

O.city
09-27-2010, 10:32 PM
Or Clay Matthews opposite Hali

Count Alex's Losses
09-27-2010, 10:33 PM
Add Jeremy Maclin to this offense or Brian Orakpo opposite Hali.


I've been going back and forth with some Warpaint tard over Jackson. He insists guys like Mac and Orakpo wouldn't have more of an impact.

Jesus Christ our pass rush would be insane with Orakpo and Hali.

He gave me some BS about Orakpo being a liability in coverage.

chiefzilla1501
09-27-2010, 10:34 PM
I dunno zilla surprisingly there is quite a bit of "talent" on this squad. it's alot of young and unproven talent but i'm not sure we are as behind in terms of talent and was initially thought.

I think there is some good foundational talent. But not even close when you compare it to a complete team like the Jets or even the talent on the Cowboys' roster.

i think most would agree that the Jets and Cowboys are underperforming while the Chiefs are overperforming. I'll take that every day of the week because it's one thing to have a semi-talented roster overperforming. But next year, you add a successful draft and hopefully a few marquee free agents, and look out. Suddenly you have a much more talented roster playing over their heads.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 10:34 PM
Any ideas on a Pass rusher in this years draft or FA?

I'd forget looking to FA for an impact pass rusher.

As far as OLBs via the draft, Akeem Ayers and Von Miller are the top two rush backers, but the talent at 4-3 pass rusher this year is sick. Heyward, Romeus, Bailey, etc.

O.city
09-27-2010, 10:38 PM
I think Ayers would be pretty good and OLB but haven't seen alot of him. I'm just not a fan of FA, doesn't seem to work out alot although jones has this year.

chiefzilla1501
09-27-2010, 10:39 PM
So now these guys are dominating because of their "character"?

Also, who the hell ever argued that Cincy or Dallas were top teams?

I never said they were dominating. I'm saying that this is a semi-talented team with some good foundational talent, but a ton of holes, but they've all bought into the system very quickly, they're playing largely mistake-free football, and they're playing way over their heads because they are playing with an energy level we haven't seen in years.

And no, I never said that anyone said anything about Dallas and Cincy. I'm just pointing out that while some teams are underperforming their potential because they lack character, the Chiefs are overperforming it because they have players who take winning very seriously. It's a comment we hear quite a bit about New England when people ask why they seem to be so damn inconsistent these days.

O.city
09-27-2010, 10:40 PM
Anybody heard anything about Jerry Hughes with Indy? i haven't seen anything on him thought he would contribute imed.

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 10:42 PM
Anybody heard anything about Jerry Hughes with Indy? i haven't seen anything on him thought he would contribute imed.

He hasn't done anything yet, but it's not like he was going to beat out Mathis and Freeney this year.

O.city
09-27-2010, 10:46 PM
Yeah I know i was thinking something else my bad. Did you notice how they didn't pressure Orton much Sunday? of course that was without the turf. Hopefully we run all over them in two weeks though.

DaneMcCloud
09-27-2010, 10:47 PM
I've been going back and forth with some Warpaint tard over Jackson. He insists guys like Mac and Orakpo wouldn't have more of an impact.

Jesus Christ our pass rush would be insane with Orakpo and Hali.

He gave me some BS about Orakpo being a liability in coverage.

I'll take Matthews over Orapko and certainly over Jackson (and I mentioned that several times last year).

Pioli was paid $5 million in 2009 and put together a shit roster and shit coaching staff.

It wasn't until Romeo, Weis, Pleasant, Thomas, etc. were available that this coaching staff rounded into place.

He should have a nut removed for hiring Clancy Pendergast.

Count Alex's Losses
09-27-2010, 10:50 PM
He should have a nut removed for hiring Clancy Pendergast.

You rang?

http://media.kansascity.com/smedia/2010/09/23/22/ChiefsCamp0870_SP_7-31-10_JFS_09-24-2010_0J1HHKGS.embedded.prod_affiliate.81.jpg

'Hamas' Jenkins
09-27-2010, 10:50 PM
Yeah I know i was thinking something else my bad. Did you notice how they didn't pressure Orton much Sunday? of course that was without the turf. Hopefully we run all over them in two weeks though.

No, you're on to something. I think he's only been active for one game so far, and he's third on the depth chart at RE

BossChief
09-27-2010, 10:53 PM
Smith
Edwards
Dorsey

Orakpo
DJ
Belcher
Hali

Carr
Berry
Lewis
Flowers

That defense would be in GOD MODE for a long time and would allow us to focus our drafts on offense.

With the exception of a franchise nose guard...

-King-
09-27-2010, 10:59 PM
Fuck Maclin. Fuck Orakpo. Fuck Sanchez.


Clay Matthews. Thats where its at.

LaChapelle
09-27-2010, 11:13 PM
Nice try at a reunion but the drafturbators are no more
the backbone of the group have evolved and moved on
just the bitter hangers on are left to wallow on