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View Full Version : Poop Ok, lets hear it from the Matt Cassel nutthuggers!


BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 05:31 PM
:D

Bane
11-14-2010, 05:32 PM
33/53 469 yards 4 TD's 0 INT's.Enjoy.

:edit: See post #46 if this confuses you as to which side I am on.

teedubya
11-14-2010, 05:32 PM
BCD making a gay reference. Imagine that.

-King-
11-14-2010, 05:32 PM
Franchise QB material.

patteeu
11-14-2010, 05:32 PM
I don't know who the nuthuggers are, but it's ridiculous to have Cassel at the top of the hate list after the game the Chiefs just played.

Smed1065
11-14-2010, 05:32 PM
Must be a deflect from this shitty D?

KChiefs1
11-14-2010, 05:33 PM
Peyton Manningesque numbers today from Matty Nice.

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 05:33 PM
BCD making a gay reference. Imagine that.:spock: Do I do this on a regular basis?

Count Zarth
11-14-2010, 05:33 PM
Most meaningless 470-yard, 4 TD game in NFL history.

FAX
11-14-2010, 05:34 PM
Brought us back to within ... 30 ... or something like that.

FAX

Tactical Funky
11-14-2010, 05:35 PM
Yeah, Matt's fumble in the second quarter really hurt us, but damn, our defense ensured that we didn't even have a chance. Can't mount a comeback if you can't stop the other team from scoring.

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 05:35 PM
Must be a deflect from this shitty D?Not deflecting at all. He was complete ass in the 1st half. He contributed to this shellacking.

tk13
11-14-2010, 05:36 PM
2nd highest passing total in Chiefs history today.

He also now has 16 TD/4 INT on the season. I don't know if that's the best ratio in the league but it's gotta be close.

Mr_Tomahawk
11-14-2010, 05:36 PM
Fantasy Football MVP of the week.

Bane
11-14-2010, 05:36 PM
Most meaningless 470-yard, 4 TD game in NFL history.
Sad day.

Brought us back to within ... 30 ... or something like that.

FAX

Greatest garbage time QB in NFL history.

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 05:36 PM
Yeah, Matt's fumble in the second quarter really hurt us, but damn, our defense ensured that we didn't even have a chance. Can't mount a comeback if you can't stop the other team from scoring.Denver's D is AWFUL. He's incapable of keeping up.

He cant hold Orton's jock.

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 05:37 PM
I don't know who the nuthuggers are, but it's ridiculous to have Cassel at the top of the hate list after the game the Chiefs just played.Where was he when the D was sucking and giving up 28 points?

DeezNutz
11-14-2010, 05:38 PM
Cassel just orchestrated the greatest garbage time, stat-padding performance in NFL history.

When it mattered, he was fucking awful, taking unnecessary sacks, missing open receivers, ensuring that we moved out of field goal range, and turning the ball over.

With zero pressure and the game out of reach, though, look the fuck out! Cassel time, baby.

LaChapelle
11-14-2010, 05:39 PM
He was a badminton champ in college

Pablo
11-14-2010, 05:39 PM
Cassel sure can carve up a prevent defense.

milkman
11-14-2010, 05:40 PM
There's no question that the D was responsible for the loss today.

Lonewolf Ed
11-14-2010, 05:40 PM
Cassel made some bad throws and some bad decisions, but this is nothing new. He made some good throws, threw a lot of passes and had a lot of completions, over 450 yards and 4 TDs. If someone had not heard or seen the game today and you told them that, plus that Bowe had a career day, you could make them think the Chiefs had won.

The biggest factors in my opinion today were, one, the Broncos took away KC's running game, and two, the defense was atrocious. Cassel cost the team some points with the fumble when they had the ball on the 8 yard line, but that was not what sunk the team. 21-0 at the end of the first quarter is what did them in and that was all on the defense. 4 straight possessions and 4 TDs for Denver... that is not a recipe for a win for KC.

And a little side note... is anyone else noticing that if teams need a pass play of 10 yards or more, they throw toward Carr? For those who know this game better than me, tell me... is Carr an average corner or a bit below average? He's no Bartee, but he seems like the weak link back there.

Bwana
11-14-2010, 05:40 PM
Cassel just orchestrated the greatest garbage time, stat-padding performance in NFL history.

When it mattered, he was ****ing awful, taking unnecessary sacks, missing open receivers, ensuring that we moved out of field goal range, and turning the ball over.

With zero pressure and the game out of reach, though, look the **** out! Cassel time, baby.

This

Three7s
11-14-2010, 05:40 PM
My crap ass arm could complete passes against Denver's 4th quarter prevent defense. I'm not giving Cassel any credit, other than making the score look a tad bit less ugly.

Bwana
11-14-2010, 05:41 PM
There's no question that the D was responsible for the loss today.

And this.......

FAX
11-14-2010, 05:41 PM
What stat lovers will forget is that "garbage time" started about 18 minutes in.

FAX

Marcellus
11-14-2010, 05:42 PM
Please let me hear from the defensive nuthuggers.

One performance was kind of expected, the other wasn't.

Hell I will give Cassel credit for at least taking what he could in garbage time, the defense couldn't even do that.

1 fucking punt.

And fuck Cassel for that Goddamn fumble.

banyon
11-14-2010, 05:42 PM
Cassel just orchestrated the greatest garbage time, stat-padding performance in NFL history.

When it mattered, he was ****ing awful, taking unnecessary sacks, missing open receivers, ensuring that we moved out of field goal range, and turning the ball over.

With zero pressure and the game out of reach, though, look the **** out! Cassel time, baby.

+1 QFT

LaChapelle
11-14-2010, 05:42 PM
Carr can't defend for 45 seconds
orton could knit a sweater

Baby Lee
11-14-2010, 05:42 PM
There's no question that the D was responsible for the loss today.

Switching Lewis and McGraw for Price and Washington was a big part of that, though.

Remember the Colts w/ and w/o Sanders their SB year?

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 05:42 PM
There's no question that the D was responsible for the loss today.Oh, without a doubt. However, what did Cassel do between Bronco scoring drives?

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 05:43 PM
Cassel just orchestrated the greatest garbage time, stat-padding performance in NFL history.

When it mattered, he was fucking awful, taking unnecessary sacks, missing open receivers, ensuring that we moved out of field goal range, and turning the ball over.

With zero pressure and the game out of reach, though, look the fuck out! Cassel time, baby.:clap:

Chiefs Pantalones
11-14-2010, 05:43 PM
Oh, without a doubt. However, what did Cassel do between Bronco scoring drives?

Eat a hotdog...

With NO MUSTARD! THE BASTARD!

doomy3
11-14-2010, 05:43 PM
There's no question that the D was responsible for the loss today.

Not a fucking doubt. This has become such an irrational board.

Baby Lee
11-14-2010, 05:44 PM
Oh, without a doubt. However, what did Cassel do between Bronco scoring drives?

5 & O
3 & O
sacked out of FG range
sacked for defensive TD.

Other than that, meh.

Chiefs Pantalones
11-14-2010, 05:44 PM
Cassel just orchestrated the greatest garbage time, stat-padding performance in NFL history.

When it mattered, he was ****ing awful, taking unnecessary sacks, missing open receivers, ensuring that we moved out of field goal range, and turning the ball over.

With zero pressure and the game out of reach, though, look the **** out! Cassel time, baby.

lol pretty much

Lbedrock1
11-14-2010, 05:44 PM
33/53 469 yards 4 TD's 0 INT's.Enjoy.

Those stats are BS. We lost by 20 so we know why he threw for 469 yards. Soft coverage and less preassure. He still missing throws when we need him to make them.

tk13
11-14-2010, 05:44 PM
Switching Lewis and McGraw for Price and Washington was a big part of that, though.

Remember the Colts w/ and w/o Sanders their SB year?

That's the sad part. Everyone here is so obsessed with Cassel's bowel movements no one is going to talk about the fact that our safeties were out and Washington got abused like a rented mule in the first 5 minutes.

chiefzilla1501
11-14-2010, 05:45 PM
I don't know who the nuthuggers are, but it's ridiculous to have Cassel at the top of the hate list after the game the Chiefs just played.

You know me. I'm not the type to overreact to bad games by teams or players. I thought this was easily Cassel's worst game all season. That's independent of how the defense played or of his statistics in the first 2 quarters. The Chiefs didn't move down the field on offense because he was staring down his primary receiver and holding onto the ball too long.

Regardless of how the defense played, this was a terrible game for Cassel.

FAX
11-14-2010, 05:45 PM
5 & O
3 & O
sacked out of FG range
sacked for defensive TD.

Other than that, meh.

He always starts a little slow, though.

FAX

Three7s
11-14-2010, 05:45 PM
Another big problem was the D-line. They were getting pushed around all game. NO PRESSURE AT ALL!

Shogun
11-14-2010, 05:45 PM
Eat a hotdog...

With NO MUSTARD! THE BASTARD!

Maybe he needs to try Nachos?

BryanBusby
11-14-2010, 05:46 PM
Cassel fucking sucked, but it's irrelevant when your defense gives up almost 50 points to a shitty team.

FAX
11-14-2010, 05:46 PM
You know me. I'm not the type to overreact to bad games by teams or players. I thought this was easily Cassel's worst game all season. That's independent of how the defense played or of his statistics in the first 2 quarters. The Chiefs didn't move down the field on offense because he was staring down his primary receiver and holding onto the ball too long.

Regardless of how the defense played, this was a terrible game for Cassel.

You needlessly over-analyze the living crap out of things, Mr. chiefzilla1501. But, that's why I like you ... no homo.

You're right this time, though. The goats had Cassel scouted perfectly.

Gif it up.

FAX

milkman
11-14-2010, 05:48 PM
Please let me hear from the defensive nuthuggers.

One performance was kind of expected, the other wasn't.

Hell I will give Cassel credit for at least taking what he could in garbage time, the defense couldn't even do that.

1 ****ing punt.

And **** Cassel for that Goddamn fumble.

What we are beginning to see is the defense has no depth and are getting worn, which also leads to the deficiencies that many of us were concerned about being exposed.

No consistent pass rush outside of Hali, no real NT, and only two competent 5 techs that are playing a lot minutes.

Add the fact that we were starting our 4th safety, a converted corner who looks even more lost at safety than he did at corner, and you have a recipe for bad defense.

Bane
11-14-2010, 05:49 PM
Those stats are BS. We lost by 20 so we know why he threw for 469 yards. Soft coverage and less preassure. He still missing throws when we need him to make them.

1 I am not pro Cassel,in fact I hate him more than any QB KC has ever had.I just posted that as a base for his nutthuggers.

2 He can die in an aids tree fire and I wouldn't shed a tear.

3 I label him the greatest garbage time QB ever all the time.

milkman
11-14-2010, 05:49 PM
Switching Lewis and McGraw for Price and Washington was a big part of that, though.

Remember the Colts w/ and w/o Sanders their SB year?

Noted.

Baby Lee
11-14-2010, 05:49 PM
That's the sad part. Everyone here is so obsessed with Cassel's bowel movements no one is going to talk about the fact that our safeties were out and Washington got abused like a rented mule in the first 5 minutes.

Nah, we need to keep throwing Washington out there, gotta believe one of these days the lights will come on, and our perserverence will pay off handsomely.

See I can speak nuthuggerese.

milkman
11-14-2010, 05:50 PM
Oh, without a doubt. However, what did Cassel do between Bronco scoring drives?

I'm not defending Cassel.

I think Deeznut hit the nail on the head in his post.

Marcellus
11-14-2010, 05:52 PM
Oh, without a doubt. However, what did Cassel do between Bronco scoring drives?

What did anyone do early on?

How about that running game.

Look Cassel didn't cost us the game, he just didn't overcome the pathetic excuse for a defensive whatever it was that showed up. If you want to blame it on Cassel to make you feel better, knock yourself out.

We know Cassel won't carry the team. I don't think Manning could of overcome that 1st quarter defensive pile of shit. I tell you this ,Carr and Washington fucking killed us. As well as the whole fucking defensive line.

I would rather see Arenas as the #2 CB than Carr at this point.

We got our shit pushed in on the line on both sides of the ball. That was the issue.

The defense looked like a bunch of beat pussies the first 3 quarters.

I just hope this put some confidence in the Cassel / Bowe connection for future games.

FAX
11-14-2010, 05:53 PM
What did anyone do early on?

How about that running game.

Look Cassel didn't cost us the game, he just didn't overcome the pathetic excuse for a defensive whatever it was that showed up. If you want to blame it on Cassel to make you feel better, knock yourself out.

We know Cassel won't carry the team. I don't think Manning could of overcome that 1st quarter defensive pile of shit. I tell you this ,Carr and Washington ****ing killed us. As well as the whole ****ing defensive line.

I would rather see Arenas as the #2 CB than Carr at this point.

We got our shit pushed in on the line on both sides of the ball. That was the issue.

The defense looked like a bunch of beat pussies the first 3 quarters.

I just hope this put some confidence in the Cassel / Bowe connection for future games.

There is sad truth in these words of death.

FAX

milkman
11-14-2010, 05:58 PM
We got our shit pushed in on the line on both sides of the ball. That was the issue.

What DCs have learned from film this season is that Cassel is not a guy that is going to beat you with his arm, even in situations where he should have all the advantage.

They are doing even more to take the Chiefs out of the running game and daring Cassel to beat them.

The Raiders and Donkeys were among the worst run defenses in the league going into these games, yet they somehow managed to shut the run game down.

Blick
11-14-2010, 05:58 PM
What are the thoughts on Carr now? I've always thought that he was overrated on here.

chiefzilla1501
11-14-2010, 05:58 PM
What did anyone do early on?

How about that running game.

Look Cassel didn't cost us the game, he just didn't overcome the pathetic excuse for a defensive whatever it was that showed up. If you want to blame it on Cassel to make you feel better, knock yourself out.

We know Cassel won't carry the team. I don't think Manning could of overcome that 1st quarter defensive pile of shit. I tell you this ,Carr and Washington ****ing killed us. As well as the whole ****ing defensive line.

I would rather see Arenas as the #2 CB than Carr at this point.

We got our shit pushed in on the line on both sides of the ball. That was the issue.

The defense looked like a bunch of beat pussies the first 3 quarters.

I just hope this put some confidence in the Cassel / Bowe connection for future games.

Bullshit. If your team is getting blown out by the other team early, your job as a QB has to be to step up and be a momentum stopper. Even with the Chiefs down 2-3 TDs, I think your QB can make a huge statement by driving the team downfield for a TD and telling your defense "we forgive you for fucking up, let's get a stop and we can put this team back in this."

Cassel didn't do that. He broke momentum by not converting drive-extending passes. He took a needless sack that turned a 45 yard field goal into a 52 yard field goal. And then he broke momentum on a productive drive by a stupid fumble.

I'm not upset about Cassel's production in the first half. I'm upset at the way he did it. I was watching his head the entire first half. And what bothered me the most was that he was taking coverage sacks because he was staring at his primary receiver for at least 4-5 seconds on every play. He was as much to blame for the loss because he made critical mistakes that completely took away any chance for the Chiefs to get back in the game.

notorious
11-14-2010, 05:59 PM
What are the thoughts on Carr now? I've always thought that he was overrated on here.

This.


He is the weak link of our secondary.

Pasta Giant Meatball
11-14-2010, 05:59 PM
Denver could have scored any time they wanted today (and did). I've liked the improvement of the D this season since preseason, but the efense was back in full force today.They've got to shake it off and take it out on Zona.

Sully
11-14-2010, 05:59 PM
This is the first loss where you can't really look at Cassel and make a strong argument that it was mainly his fault.
That said, when it mattered, there he was overthrowing 4-yard patterns, holding the ball, and playing like we've all gotten used to.

Sadly, he put up monster stats after the game was over, so his first half putting us behind the 8-ball will be forgotten. Cause, you know, he just needs more time before we can judge him.

Sully
11-14-2010, 06:00 PM
What are the thoughts on Carr now? I've always thought that he was overrated on here.

He's had a rough couple f games, but is a very good number two CB.

Saul Good
11-14-2010, 06:02 PM
In the first half, he threw for 169 yards, 1 TD, and 0 INTs.

He's back to hanging onto the ball too long, though. That said, this loss had nothing to do with Cassel. He's going to be here for the next few years, so you might as well get used to it. He's getting his roster bonus.

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 06:02 PM
What are the thoughts on Carr now? I've always thought that he was overrated on here.He's fine. Keep in mind how much difficulty the DL has getting pressure.

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 06:03 PM
This is the first loss where you can't really look at Cassel and make a strong argument that it was mainly his fault.
That said, when it mattered, there he was overthrowing 4-yard patterns, holding the ball, and playing like we've all gotten used to.

Sadly, he put up monster stats after the game was over, so his first half putting us behind the 8-ball will be forgotten. Cause, you know, he just needs more time before we can judge him.He played like ass during the 1st half, but the D was worse.

Sully
11-14-2010, 06:05 PM
He played like ass during the 1st half, but the D was worse.

You are absolutely correct.
That doesn't absolve him from criticism, though.

Smed1065
11-14-2010, 06:06 PM
Defense cost today period.

Bottom line.

kaplin42
11-14-2010, 06:06 PM
33/53 469 yards 4 TD's 0 INT's.Enjoy.

You quote this like it's a good thing.

He had 53 passes today, that's not a good thing, not his fault, but not a good thing. A lot of those yards are YAC, that had nothing to do with him. You also forgot the 4 sacks + fumbles for 6pts that are all his fault. Manipulate the stats the way you want. Game tape tells the truth, and he blew it yet again today.

However, the D was atrocious, and they are all at fault today. I'm beggining to believe that Carr is a serious weak link in the D. Teams pick on him and he gets burnt constantly.

Letting your opponent score on the first 4 possesions is a strong case to be pink slipped in the offseason. Absolutely horrible display today.

Bane
11-14-2010, 06:07 PM
You quote this like it's a good thing.

He had 53 passes today, that's not a good thing, not his fault, but not a good thing. A lot of those yards are YAC, that had nothing to do with him. You also forgot the 4 sacks + fumbles for 6pts that are all his fault. Manipulate the stats the way you want. Game tape tells the truth, and he blew it yet again today.

However, the D was atrocious, and they are all at fault today. I'm beggining to believe that Carr is a serious weak link in the D. Teams pick on him and he gets burnt constantly.

Letting your opponent score on the first 4 possesions is a strong case to be pink slipped in the offseason. Absolutely horrible display today.

See post #46.

patteeu
11-14-2010, 06:08 PM
Not deflecting at all. He was complete ass in the 1st half. He contributed to this shellacking.

He contributed about as much as Tonga contributed to the invasion of Iraq.

Marcellus
11-14-2010, 06:08 PM
You are absolutely correct.
That doesn't absolve him from criticism, though.

No it doesn't but to make him the scapegoat is being blind.

The o-line couldn't run block or pass block, the d-line couldn't stop the run or get pressure on the pass.

That was the issue.

doomy3
11-14-2010, 06:09 PM
You quote this like it's a good thing.

He had 53 passes today, that's not a good thing, not his fault, but not a good thing. A lot of those yards are YAC, that had nothing to do with him. You also forgot the 4 sacks + fumbles for 6pts that are all his fault. Manipulate the stats the way you want. Game tape tells the truth, and he blew it yet again today.

However, the D was atrocious, and they are all at fault today. I'm beggining to believe that Carr is a serious weak link in the D. Teams pick on him and he gets burnt constantly.

Letting your opponent score on the first 4 possesions is a strong case to be pink slipped in the offseason. Absolutely horrible display today.


This is one of the biggest lines of bullshit on this board.

YAC is a huge part of every QB's statline. Peyton Manning regularly gets good YAC from Reggie Wayne, Dallas Clark, Garcon, etc. Rodgers gets great YAC from Jennings, Driver, Finley.

If we weren't getting YAC, this board would be screaming that Cassel isn't putting the ball in places where his receivers could run after the catch. Kind of like last year, when the board was claiming that the drops were Cassel's fault because of the "kind of ball he throws."

kaplin42
11-14-2010, 06:10 PM
See post #46.

Fair enough.

Didn't see that the first time through.

Sully
11-14-2010, 06:10 PM
No it doesn't but to make him the scapegoat is being blind.

The o-line couldn't run block or pass block, the d-line couldn't stop the run or get pressure on the pass.

That was the issue.

If you see me making him the scapegoat for this particular loss, let me know.

patteeu
11-14-2010, 06:11 PM
Denver's D is AWFUL. He's incapable of keeping up.

He cant hold Orton's jock.

Orton put 3 passes right in the hands of Chiefs defenders today.

chiefzilla1501
11-14-2010, 06:12 PM
No it doesn't but to make him the scapegoat is being blind.

The o-line couldn't run block or pass block, the d-line couldn't stop the run or get pressure on the pass.

That was the issue.

Nobody's calling him a scapegoat. But don't give me that bullshit excuse that this is in any way on the o-line. The Chiefs couldn't run block because, like last game, defenses are daring the Chiefs to throw the ball and they can't. And the pass blocking sucked today because unlike early in the season, when Cassel was getting rid of the ball pretty quickly, he was locking onto his primary receiver and holding onto the ball way too long.

The Chiefs lost because of the defense. But even if the defense played very well today, based on what I saw from Cassel in the first 4 drives, it was close to the worst I've seen him all season.

FAX
11-14-2010, 06:12 PM
I didn't see one area in which we performed particularly well ... with the possible exception of Bowe who looked like he kept bringing it. Of course, I'm watching a stream, so I may have missed some stuff. The goats looked faster, stronger, and better in every phase.

I wish, though, that DJ would catch some of those interception things.

FAX

Bane
11-14-2010, 06:13 PM
Fair enough.

Didn't see that the first time through.

I simply wanted his stats to be out there so it was an even argument all the way around.Even as much as I hate him,I expect both sides to be heard.

patteeu
11-14-2010, 06:13 PM
Where was he when the D was sucking and giving up 28 points?

He was watching the real goats of the game from the sideline just like Jamaal Charles and Tony Moeaki were.

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 06:14 PM
Orton put 3 passes right in the hands of Chiefs defenders today.Good luck is seldom a bad thing.

Marcellus
11-14-2010, 06:14 PM
If you see me making him the scapegoat for this particular loss, let me know.

Wasn't referring to you sir.

Rain Man
11-14-2010, 06:15 PM
i'd rather have cassel than orton on pure principle.
Posted via Mobile Device

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 06:15 PM
He was watching the real goats of the game from the sideline just like Jamaal Charles and Tony Moeaki were.I suppose you think Matt had a good game?

Bewbies
11-14-2010, 06:15 PM
Is there a place to look up Assel's stats on 3rd down? When I'm watching I figure we aren't converting if it's not short enough to run. Has he completed a pass on 3rd down that resulted in a first down all year?

DeezNutz
11-14-2010, 06:15 PM
In the first half, he threw for 169 yards, 1 TD, and 0 INTs.

He's back to hanging onto the ball too long, though. That said, this loss had nothing to do with Cassel. He's going to be here for the next few years, so you might as well get used to it. He's getting his roster bonus.

Very misleading statement.

You're right that the "loss" probably happens regardless because KC's defense was non-existent. But Cassel had a major hand in ensuring that the game was out of reach before half.

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 06:15 PM
i'd rather have cassel than orton on pure principle.
Posted via Mobile DeviceNo, I'd still take Orton.

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 06:17 PM
Very misleading statement.

You're right that the "loss" probably happens regardless because KC's defense was non-existent. But Cassel had a major hand in ensuring that the game was out of reach before half.QFT The Cassel apologists dont get it.

Pasta Giant Meatball
11-14-2010, 06:17 PM
This is one of the biggest lines of bullshit on this board.

YAC is a huge part of every QB's statline. Peyton Manning regularly gets good YAC from Reggie Wayne, Dallas Clark, Garcon, etc. Rodgers gets great YAC from Jennings, Driver, Finley.
If we weren't getting YAC, this board would be screaming that Cassel isn't putting the ball in places where his receivers could run after the catch. Kind of like last year, when the board was claiming that the drops were Cassel's fault because of the "kind of ball he throws."

Absolutely

DeezNutz
11-14-2010, 06:19 PM
28-0 because:

1. Cassel misses a wide open Charles that might well have resulted in a TD.
2. Cassel overthrows Chambers on what would have been a sure TD.
3. Cassel takes a sack instead of throwing the ball away, setting up a 52-yard FG.

The D was terrible, and, unfortunately, Cassel was, too.

Sully
11-14-2010, 06:19 PM
Is there a place to look up Assel's stats on 3rd down? When I'm watching I figure we aren't converting if it's not short enough to run. Has he completed a pass on 3rd down that resulted in a first down all year?

Several today.
None that I recall prior to 21-0.

milkman
11-14-2010, 06:19 PM
Is there a place to look up Assel's stats on 3rd down? When I'm watching I figure we aren't converting if it's not short enough to run. Has he completed a pass on 3rd down that resulted in a first down all year?

Did you happen to see how inept we were running the ball in short yardage situations today?

patteeu
11-14-2010, 06:21 PM
5 & O
3 & O
sacked out of FG range
sacked for defensive TD.

Other than that, meh.

Cassel didn't do that alone though. Where was the running game, both ball carriers and blockers, against one of the worst run defenses in the league? The entire offense got off to a slow start, but it wasn't anywhere near the extraordinary suckage that the defense presented.

patteeu
11-14-2010, 06:28 PM
I suppose you think Matt had a good game?

I think he had an average game before the 2nd half statfest. The kind of game that should make him the 5th or 6th thing that comes to mind when reflecting on why the Chiefs lost.

Seriously, I think Jones and Charles had worse games than Cassel. And they were exceeded in suckage by the offensive line and the defense.

DeezNutz
11-14-2010, 06:30 PM
Cassel didn't do that alone though. Where was the running game, both ball carriers and blockers, against one of the worst run defenses in the league? The entire offense got off to a slow start, but it wasn't anywhere near the extraordinary suckage that the defense presented.

Yes, he did.

Charles is wide open, and the line provided plenty of time. All other players did their job, but Cassel misses the throw.

Chambers is open, and Cassel had time. Albert didn't miss the throw.

Rinse and repeat for the sacks. Cassel had time, but the dipshit possess no awareness and takes unnecessary sacks.

Cassel did all of this all on his lonesome. And in the interim, the defense was conjuring memories of '03.

With average-good QB play, the Chiefs still lose, but are "in" the game for all four quarters.

Marcellus
11-14-2010, 06:30 PM
28-0 because:

1. Cassel misses a wide open Charles that might well have resulted in a TD.
2. Cassel overthrows Chambers on what would have been a sure TD.
3. Cassel takes a sack instead of throwing the ball away, setting up a 52-yard FG.

The D was terrible, and, unfortunately, Cassel was, too.

Why couldn't we run the damn ball? 10 in the box? Been that way for a while.

jd1020
11-14-2010, 06:32 PM
Why couldn't we run the damn ball? 10 in the box? Been that way for a while.

We couldn't run the ball because both offense and defense laid a f#ckin egg in the first half.

patteeu
11-14-2010, 06:44 PM
Yes, he did.

Charles is wide open, and the line provided plenty of time. All other players did their job, but Cassel misses the throw.

Chamber is open, and Cassel had time. Albert didn't miss the throw.

Rinse and repeat for the sacks. Cassel had time, but the dipshit possess no awareness and takes unnecessary sacks.

Cassel did all of this all on his lonesome. And in the interim, the defense was conjuring memories of '03.

With average-good QB play, the Chiefs still lose, but are "in" the game for all four quarters.

Forgive me. I forgot that board protocol is to cherry pick only bad Cassel plays and ignore the numerous failures of the rest of the offense. Carry on with the irrationality.

Bewbies
11-14-2010, 06:48 PM
Forgive me. I forgot that board protocol is to cherry pick only bad Cassel plays and ignore the numerous failures of the rest of the offense. Carry on with the irrationality.

Do you honestly watch Cassel and think he's good?

Count Zarth
11-14-2010, 06:50 PM
After Cassel fumbled, everything else he did in that game was irrelevant.

EVERYTHING.

He fucking sucked ass when the game was remotely competitive.

He stood by and watched our defense get raped up the butt AND DID NOTHING ABOUT IT.

FUCK HIM, FUCK ANYONE WHO SUPPORTS HIM, AND FUCK HIM AGAIN.

Smed1065
11-14-2010, 06:50 PM
Yes, he did.

Charles is wide open, and the line provided plenty of time. All other players did their job, but Cassel misses the throw.

Chambers is open, and Cassel had time. Albert didn't miss the throw.

Rinse and repeat for the sacks. Cassel had time, but the dipshit possess no awareness and takes unnecessary sacks.

Cassel did all of this all on his lonesome. And in the interim, the defense was conjuring memories of '03.

With average-good QB play, the Chiefs still lose, but are "in" the game for all four quarters.

Hemorrhage yet?

JohnnyV13
11-14-2010, 06:52 PM
After Cassel fumbled, everything else he did in that game was irrelevant.

EVERYTHING.

He ****ing sucked ass when the game was remotely competitive.

He stood by and watched our defense get raped up the butt AND DID NOTHING ABOUT IT.

**** HIM, **** ANYONE WHO SUPPORTS HIM, AND **** HIM AGAIN.

This.

He has the rest of the season to show something. Maybe he convinces us he can be a winning QB....but I wouldn't bet on it.

Guru
11-14-2010, 06:52 PM
I wasn't impressed by cassel at all today other than two really good throws. today falls on coaching plain and simple.

Smed1065
11-14-2010, 06:52 PM
Yes, he did.

Charles is wide open, and the line provided plenty of time. All other players did their job, but Cassel misses the throw.

Chambers is open, and Cassel had time. Albert didn't miss the throw.

Rinse and repeat for the sacks. Cassel had time, but the dipshit possess no awareness and takes unnecessary sacks.

Cassel did all of this all on his lonesome. And in the interim, the defense was conjuring memories of '03.

With average-good QB play, the Chiefs still lose, but are "in" the game for all four quarters.

You are right. In it for average QB play.

Best rating ever but yes, It was the QB fault. WTF.

milkman
11-14-2010, 06:54 PM
The reason the QB is the guy that gets blame for a loss is that in losses like this, where a couple of plays from your QB can stop the bleeding, and help the team regain confidence and momentum, our QB didn't make plays, and in fact opened the wound just a little more.

chiefzilla1501
11-14-2010, 06:54 PM
Cassel didn't do that alone though. Where was the running game, both ball carriers and blockers, against one of the worst run defenses in the league? The entire offense got off to a slow start, but it wasn't anywhere near the extraordinary suckage that the defense presented.

If I'm playing basketball, I'm not going to blame my superstar for not being able to score points when he constantly draws double and triple teams. Rather, I ask myself--there was obviously one guy open, so why was he not good enough to make the easy wide open shots?

mlyonsd
11-14-2010, 06:55 PM
Do you honestly watch Cassel and think he's good?

He wasn't the reason we lost the game.

That being said his mistakes make me think he isn't the answer.

DeezNutz
11-14-2010, 06:55 PM
Forgive me. I forgot that board protocol is to cherry pick only bad Cassel plays and ignore the numerous failures of the rest of the offense. Carry on with the irrationality.

Cherry picking? You mean like picking the key plays that Cassel ****ed up that ensured that the offense didn't score on their first four possessions?

Board protocol is to try to excuse our highest paid player, who occupies the most important position on the field, as in "it's not all his fault." Offensively, he was culprit #1 when it mattered. The other players did their jobs.

The defense, however, was comprised of a bunch of arsonists today.

chiefzilla1501
11-14-2010, 06:55 PM
You are right. In it for average QB play.

Best rating ever but yes, It was the QB fault. WTF.

That's what happens when you play prevent defense.

Bewbies
11-14-2010, 06:58 PM
He wasn't the reason we lost the game.

That being said his mistakes make me think he isn't the answer.

His 2 horrible throws on 3rd and short in the first quarter gave us 2 quick 3 and outs when our defense couldn't stop anything. Then when he finally got a drive rolling he fumbled away a scoring opportunity.

When it's 3rd down we all know we won't covert. We all know we won't because we all know our QB can't complete a pass on 3rd down. Only some of us are willing to admit that around here though.

Marcellus
11-14-2010, 06:58 PM
Cherry picking? You mean like picking the key plays that Cassel ****ed up that ensured that the offense didn't score on their first four possessions?

Board protocol is to try to excuse our highest paid player, who occupies the most important position on the field, as in "it's not all his fault."

Offensively, he was culprit #1 when it mattered. The other players did their job.

The defense, however, was comprised of a bunch of arsonists today.

Uh nope. OL fail all game long, Charles not setting after going in motion on 3rd down fail (killed a drive).

The whole offense failed in the 1st half including Cassel. Yes Cassel as QB get's more blame but to say the other players did their job? Nope.

DeezNutz
11-14-2010, 07:00 PM
Uh nope. OL fail all game long, Charles not setting after going in motion on 3rd down fail (killed a drive).

The whole offense failed in the 1st half including Cassel. Yes Cassel as QB get's more blame but to say the other players did their job? Nope.

Hit the throw to Charles, possible TD. Hit the throw to Chambers, definite TD. Throw the ball away, very good chance at 3. Not fumble the fucking ball, great chance at 3, at least.

Pivotal moments and Cassel shit the bed. No excuses.

Count Zarth
11-14-2010, 07:02 PM
The sad thing is IDIOTS are already fellating Cassel at Arrowhead Pride over his gaudy stats.

Fucking morons.

Say what you want to about Cassel but it wasn't his to lose this game. Are you kidding me, over 400 + yards!? D killed this game and I am sick to my stomach after this performance. 21 points to the Broncos (http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/teams/denver-broncos) in the first quarter alone. Totally took our game plan away which was run the ball.

Props to Cassel and the offense knowing we had to change the game plan and 'throw'. Crennel for the first time this season looked pitiful along with the players playing for him. Don't know about the rest of you CHIEFS Fans, but knew they were going to pass the ball against us which they did. Our pass 'D' is piss and especially more so with out Lewis and McGraw out there. Practice boy price, was a bad timing to add to the mix. Granted we didn't have much of another option, but still. D.E.F.E.N.S.E. lost this game.

Go Cassel.. maybe there is another dimension to our Offense after all. Whatever we do from here on out I know the donks aren't going to playoffs and perhaps we won't continuing to play the way we are BUT I do know that if we can get on the same page on both sides of the ball then things can get better, but can we do that? Just a horrible performance by the 'D'. Came out playing flat etc ...

what will come to this is a Cassle topic and I am pleading to all to not fault him. Look at the stats, pretty impressive really. Just maybe....Defense as a 'whole' unit crashed and crashed early. Glad to know we are capable to pass the football! Go Cassel and keep it up! Backs against the wall and a Defense knowing it and able to do what he did.. incredible.

Sully
11-14-2010, 07:03 PM
I get it, now...
As long as some other phase of the game was as bad, then we shouldn't criticize Cassel.

Marcellus
11-14-2010, 07:03 PM
Hit the throw to Charles, possible TD. Hit the throw to Chambers, definite TD. Throw the ball away, very good chance at 3. Not fumble the ****ing ball, great chance at 3, at least.

Pivotal moments and Cassel shit the bed. No excuses.

Fine but don't give up 7 TD's on defense. Sorry that is THE abomination of that game.

Marcellus
11-14-2010, 07:04 PM
I get it, now...
As long as some other phase of the game was as bad, then we shouldn't criticize Cassel.

No but most of the criticism should be directed at the root cause of the problem.

DeezNutz
11-14-2010, 07:04 PM
Fine but don't give up 7 TD's on defense. Sorry that is THE abomination of that game.

I agree.

milkman
11-14-2010, 07:04 PM
The sad thing is IDIOTS are already fellating Cassel at Arrowhead Pride over his gaudy stats.

****ing morons.

Holy shit.

Is there anything upstairs for this guy?

FAX
11-14-2010, 07:05 PM
Yeah ... this was a team loss. It's on the whole deal ... coaches, included.

FAX

dirk digler
11-14-2010, 07:06 PM
Cassel just orchestrated the greatest garbage time, stat-padding performance in NFL history.

When it mattered, he was fucking awful, taking unnecessary sacks, missing open receivers, ensuring that we moved out of field goal range, and turning the ball over.

With zero pressure and the game out of reach, though, look the fuck out! Cassel time, baby.

/ end of thread

GloryDayz
11-14-2010, 07:09 PM
Matt's a swell guy! Now just bench him!!

mlyonsd
11-14-2010, 07:09 PM
His 2 horrible throws on 3rd and short in the first quarter gave us 2 quick 3 and outs when our defense couldn't stop anything. Then when he finally got a drive rolling he fumbled away a scoring opportunity.

When it's 3rd down we all know we won't covert. We all know we won't because we all know our QB can't complete a pass on 3rd down. Only some of us are willing to admit that around here though.

If you'll notice in my post I'm not defending the guy. I agree we need a new QB.

But you seem to ignore the obvious pathetic defense we showed. I mean that was Vermiel bad. Herm bad. Both the D and O have to work together.

patteeu
11-14-2010, 07:10 PM
Do you honestly watch Cassel and think he's good?

Does a person have to think Cassel is good to not have a one track mind focused on crucifying him? I don't think I've ever said that I think he's good. I don't think it's possible for him to be as bad as most ChiefsPlanet posters think he is though.

mlyonsd
11-14-2010, 07:10 PM
Yeah ... this was a team loss. It's on the whole deal ... coaches, included.

FAX

Somebody gets it.

Rain Man
11-14-2010, 07:12 PM
Granted, Cassel had some bad passes today, and granted, he's obviously not the long-term solution, but I certainly wouldn't pin the loss on him. It's not his fault that I was the best pass-rusher in the stadium today, and it's not his fault that Carr was like that monk protesting the Vietnam War.

patteeu
11-14-2010, 07:12 PM
If I'm playing basketball, I'm not going to blame my superstar for not being able to score points when he constantly draws double and triple teams. Rather, I ask myself--there was obviously one guy open, so why was he not good enough to make the easy wide open shots?

Our offensive line isn't made up of superstars. Charles is potentially a superstar, but he didn't get it done today. If you want to blame it all on the offensive line, fine, but it wasn't Cassel screwing up the blocking on those plays.

DeezNutz
11-14-2010, 07:13 PM
Does a person have to think Cassel is good to not have a one track mind focused on crucifying him? I don't think I've ever said that I think he's good. I don't think it's possible for him to be as bad as most ChiefsPlanet posters think he is though.

And this is where you're wrong. ;)

Edit: And then the "blame it all on the offensive line" thing???? I'm torn here. Really.

I blame Waters for missing Charles and Chambers on easy throws. Furthermore, Haley should have told Cassel to throw the ball away instead of taking needless sacks.

patteeu
11-14-2010, 07:19 PM
Cherry picking? You mean like picking the key plays that Cassel ****ed up that ensured that the offense didn't score on their first four possessions?

Board protocol is to try to excuse our highest paid player, who occupies the most important position on the field, as in "it's not all his fault." Offensively, he was culprit #1 when it mattered. The other players did their jobs.

The defense, however, was comprised of a bunch of arsonists today.

IMO, it's hard to get past the defense when making a list of culprits for todays loss.

When I make a heroic effort to see past the defensive failures, I see a lot of blame to spread around the offense but IMO the offensive line gets the lion's share of that secondary blame. Charles got his carries today early, and nothing happened.

Bewbies
11-14-2010, 07:22 PM
Does a person have to think Cassel is good to not have a one track mind focused on crucifying him? I don't think I've ever said that I think he's good. I don't think it's possible for him to be as bad as most ChiefsPlanet posters think he is though.

He's paid like Tarzan and plays like Jane.

I don't think I've read anyone saying that Cassel cost us the game. Anyone who watched know that the defense cost the game, but Cassel didn't even give us a shot.

In fact, which games has Cassel won for us?

patteeu
11-14-2010, 07:23 PM
I get it, now...
As long as some other phase of the game was as bad, then we shouldn't criticize Cassel.

When your house is burning down, don't worry about the fact that your windows aren't very energy efficient. I guess you can still complain about those leaky windows if you want, but YOUR HOUSE IS ON FIRE!

FAX
11-14-2010, 07:25 PM
When your house is burning down, don't worry about the fact that your windows aren't very energy efficient. I guess you can still complain about those leaky windows if you want, but YOUR HOUSE IS ON FIRE!

ROFL

FAX

Bewbies
11-14-2010, 07:27 PM
When your house is burning down, don't worry about the fact that your windows aren't very energy efficient. I guess you can still complain about those leaky windows if you want, but YOUR HOUSE IS ON FIRE!

This is hilarious.

Having a suckass QB is the equivalent of your house being on fire. Blaming your defense, o-line, or whatever else you can on one loss is like complaining about the energy efficiency of your freaking windows while ignoring the fact that your house is burning down.

DeezNutz
11-14-2010, 07:29 PM
I think Cassel was liberally pouring gasoline over the house today, and the defense was kind enough to light the collective match.

Thus, the D is responsible for the blaze, but Cassel gets an impressive assist.

dirk digler
11-14-2010, 07:29 PM
IMO, it's hard to get past the defense when making a list of culprits for todays loss.

When I make a heroic effort to see past the defensive failures, I see a lot of blame to spread around the offense but IMO the offensive line gets the lion's share of that secondary blame. Charles got his carries today early, and nothing happened.

The D gets the majority of the blame today but when we needed Cassel and the offense in the 1st quarter they were AWOL.

Also you don't think Cassel has an effect on the running game? If I was a D-coordinator I would sell out to stop the run and make Cassel beat me because everyone knows he can't.

Marcellus
11-14-2010, 07:30 PM
This is hilarious.

Having a suckass QB is the equivalent of your house being on fire. Blaming your defense, o-line, or whatever else you can on one loss is like complaining about the energy efficiency of your freaking windows while ignoring the fact that your house is burning down.

Say what you want, Cassel didn't give up 7 TD's. That's embarrassing I don't care who you are.

Cincy turned the ball over 5 times against Indy and didn't get blown out.

chiefzilla1501
11-14-2010, 07:31 PM
Our offensive line isn't made up of superstars. Charles is potentially a superstar, but he didn't get it done today. If you want to blame it all on the offensive line, fine, but it wasn't Cassel screwing up the blocking on those plays.

The problem is that the past two games, two bad run defenses have set the model--let's sell out against the run until you prove you can beat us deep in the passing game. So was it Cassel screwing up the blocking on those plays? No. But quite simple, if your QB's ineffective play is forcing defenses to crowd the line, then he needs to do his job to pull the safeties back.

Cassel has had a lot of breaks this year. His running game has performed extremely well in spite of Cassel, as has his defense. Cassel can't piggyback on those two things all career long. I thought he played well to his role in Oakland. Not today in Denver. When the defense gives Cassel a mile, you can't be happy when you only take an inch.

milkman
11-14-2010, 07:35 PM
The D gets the majority of the blame today but when we needed Cassel and the offense in the 1st quarter they were AWOL.

Also you don't think Cassel has an effect on the running game? If I was a D-coordinator I would sell out to stop the run and make Cassel beat me because everyone knows he can't.

Casey Weigman was a big reason this O-Line has played well up to this point.

But you begin to see he's wearing down and isn't getting out on his blocks, and you add that Lilja and Waters have been hurt, and the line hasn't had the continuity that it had in the early stages, and we see a unit that hasn't played as well as it did earlier.

This all factors into the running game not performing over the last two weeks..

Bewbies
11-14-2010, 07:45 PM
Say what you want, Cassel didn't give up 7 TD's. That's embarrassing I don't care who you are.

Cincy turned the ball over 5 times against Indy and didn't get blown out.

Clearly someone has difficulty understanding the post they quoted. LMAO

Count Zarth
11-14-2010, 08:26 PM
I think Cassel was liberally pouring gasoline over the house today, and the defense was kind enough to light the collective match.

Thus, the D is responsible for the blaze, but Cassel gets an impressive assist.

MATT CASSEL: FUCKING ARSONIST

ARROWHEAD'S BURNING

Thig Lyfe
11-14-2010, 08:27 PM
Cassel just orchestrated the greatest garbage time, stat-padding performance in NFL history.

When it mattered, he was fucking awful, taking unnecessary sacks, missing open receivers, ensuring that we moved out of field goal range, and turning the ball over.

With zero pressure and the game out of reach, though, look the fuck out! Cassel time, baby.

YEAH I GUESS HE SHOULD PLAY SAFETY TOO HUHUHUHUH

People don't seem to realize that if we had an offense that could sustain a goddamn drive, the defense wouldn't have so many opportunities to fuck up.

Count Zarth
11-14-2010, 08:34 PM
Stats are updated on NFL.com.

Matt Cassel is a badass motherfucker.

94.5 rating (8th)

7.0 yards per attempt (CLEARLY this means he can throw it down the field now)

16 tds (4th in the league, fuck, Cassel homers are going to repeat this ad nauseam "BUT HES FOURTH IN THE LEAGUE IN TOUCHDOWNS!!!")

Kill me now.

chris
11-14-2010, 08:35 PM
Granted, Cassel had some bad passes today, and granted, he's obviously not the long-term solution, but I certainly wouldn't pin the loss on him. It's not his fault that I was the best pass-rusher in the stadium today, and it's not his fault that Carr was like that monk protesting the Vietnam War.

Showing your age there, RM. Good analogy. :)

gblowfish
11-14-2010, 08:36 PM
Matt Cassel = Bill Kenney.
Please, you guys must believe me. I feel like I've travelled in time to 1981. I've seen this movie. It doesn't end well...

crazycoffey
11-14-2010, 08:38 PM
Cassel just orchestrated the greatest garbage time, stat-padding performance in NFL history.

When it mattered, he was ****ing awful, taking unnecessary sacks, missing open receivers, ensuring that we moved out of field goal range, and turning the ball over.

With zero pressure and the game out of reach, though, look the **** out! Cassel time, baby.


but but but, STATS ARE EVERYTHING!!!!

Bewbies
11-14-2010, 08:38 PM
People don't seem to realize that if we had an offense that could sustain a goddamn drive, the defense wouldn't have so many opportunities to **** up.

:clap:

crazycoffey
11-14-2010, 08:39 PM
In other news, Thigpen played pretty good today.... :evil:

milkman
11-14-2010, 08:42 PM
In other news, Thigpen played pretty good today.... :evil:

Yeah.

6 passes is a great sample size to make that claim with.

:rolleyes:

crazycoffey
11-14-2010, 08:46 PM
Yeah.

6 passes is a great sample size to make that claim with.

:rolleyes:

but Miami won, and I think it's been posted several times on here, that it's all about the "W"....


:Poke:

Count Zarth
11-14-2010, 08:59 PM
MATT CASSEL IS FOURTH IN THE LEAGUE IN TD PASSES!

HOW CAN YOU SAY HE'S NOT GOOD?

Marcellus
11-14-2010, 09:00 PM
MATT CASSEL IS FOURTH IN THE LEAGUE IN TD PASSES!

HOW CAN YOU SAY HE'S NOT GOOD?

Kinda like you saying NY won the last 2 weeks on Sanchez's shoulders. Both statements are wrong.

FAX
11-14-2010, 09:01 PM
Matt Cassel = Bill Kenney.
Please, you guys must believe me. I feel like I've travelled in time to 1981. I've seen this movie. It doesn't end well...

But we do sustain a 60-yard drive culminating in a field goal during the closing credits.

FAX

chiefzilla1501
11-14-2010, 09:02 PM
Kinda like you saying NY won the last 2 weeks on Sanchez's shoulders. Both statements are wrong.

I have to say that I'm seesawing on the guy.

Because the guy looked like absolute shit especially this week. Complete shit. There's simply no excuse considering the insane protection he gets behind that line.

noa
11-14-2010, 09:11 PM
One question I don't understand, and this has really been nagging at me for a while, is why someone on this freaking team, whether head coach, assistant coach, ball boy, Gatorade dude, janitor, or loud fan can't ****ing tell Matt Cassel that it's OK to throw the ball away when you're outside the tackles? There is absolutely no reason he should be taking some of these sacks, and this is elementary shit. Why can't anyone get this point across to him? Should we all pitch in and buy a full page ad in the newspaper?

Reerun_KC
11-14-2010, 09:18 PM
but but but, STATS ARE EVERYTHING!!!!

Probably so. Considering how Denver raped our defense in the first 20 minutes of the game. It was over before we knew what happened. If the defense would of slightly considered showing up today it might of been different.
But as it stood. They raped the stat sheet.

Sully
11-14-2010, 09:19 PM
When your house is burning down, don't worry about the fact that your windows aren't very energy efficient. I guess you can still complain about those leaky windows if you want, but YOUR HOUSE IS ON FIRE!

I guess that cute little analogy works if you insist on looking only at one game, rather that the entire body of work of the thread topic.

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 09:20 PM
Probably so. Considering how Denver raped our defense in the first 20 minutes of the game. It was over before we knew what happened. If the defense would of slightly considered showing up today it might of been different.
But as it stood. They raped the stat sheet.It would have been nice to have a Qb that was up to the challenge. Sometimes the best Defense is a good offense.

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 09:23 PM
One question I don't understand, and this has really been nagging at me for a while, is why someone on this freaking team, whether head coach, assistant coach, ball boy, Gatorade dude, janitor, or loud fan can't ****ing tell Matt Cassel that it's OK to throw the ball away when you're outside the tackles? There is absolutely no reason he should be taking some of these sacks, and this is elementary shit. Why can't anyone get this point across to him? Should we all pitch in and buy a full page ad in the newspaper?Reason #908675410025678 why I dont like matt Cassel.

Reerun_KC
11-14-2010, 09:29 PM
It would have been nice to have a Qb that was up to the challenge. Sometimes the best Defense is a good offense.

Or better yet? A coaching staff that was up to the challenge. Holy shit Mcfistpump flat out took crennel to the woodshed and laid the lumber to him.

What funny about the whole Cassel thing is, well nothing. Nothing today surprised me. Cassel is what he is. Not one person is posting anything ground breaking that hasn't been rehashed 65 million times. Were not goingto win anything meaningful with him. We need to move on at seasons end.

But to see the coaching staff get worked like this was shocking. They had zero answers for anything the broncos were doing. From opening kickoff to the final gun. Denver owned Haley and company.

milkman
11-14-2010, 09:34 PM
Or better yet? A coaching staff that was up to the challenge. Holy shit Mcfistpump flat out took crennel to the woodshed and laid the lumber to him.

What funny about the whole Cassel thing is, well nothing. Nothing today surprised me. Cassel is what he is. Not one person is posting anything ground breaking that hasn't been rehashed 65 million times. Were not goingto win anything meaningful with him. We need to move on at seasons end.

But to see the coaching staff get worked like this was shocking. They had zero answers for anything the broncos were doing. From opening kickoff to the final gun. Denver owned Haley and company.

I really don't think there's much Crennel could do to get anymore out of this defense.

The lack of depth in the front 7, which has created a worn group, and the injuries on the backend really limited his ability to make any scheme or adjustments to hide weaknesses.

patteeu
11-14-2010, 09:37 PM
I guess that cute little analogy works if you insist on looking only at one game, rather that the entire body of work of the thread topic.

This is postgame discussion. The thread topic is a smilie face. You yourself only talked about one game in your post. Don't even try to pretend you thought we were talking about Cassel's entire body of work. You'll come off better if you just admit that you're obsessed with the leaky windows and don't give a rip about the smoldering ruins of your once somewhat-drafty house.

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 09:37 PM
Cassel Apologists:

Listen up. I'm going to try to put this is easy terms for you to understand.

Our D sucked today. No question. This is not Cassel's fault. However, as a quarterback, Matt should see that his opponent came to play. Time to step it up. He didnt. He shit his pants on several occasions that 1st half. He did nothing. Not one single thing the entire 1st half to bail out the D.

Now, think for a second if Cassel could have sustained drives in the 1st half instead of continually going 3 and out and not putting up points. Could have been an entirely different game.

Count Zarth
11-14-2010, 09:39 PM
Dear fucking GOD.

Cassel looked comfortable in the 4th quarter. Liberated from the outcome of the game, he was taking what the defense gave him, even if it was in a small window. He quite over-thinking his reads and just pulled the trigger. He looked at peace.


Cassel played about as well today as I think we've seen. This is about his ceiling.

Reerun_KC
11-14-2010, 09:39 PM
I really don't think there's much Crennel could do to get anymore out of this defense.

The lack of depth in the front 7, which has created a worn group, and the injuries on the backend really limited his ability to make any scheme or adjustments to hide weaknesses.

Maybe blitz? Shit we just stood there and took it. If were going to get mcfistpumped. At least go down swinging. We threw I the white towel half way through the first qtr. It seemed all we ran was his basic shell defense. Orton had all day and his receivers made plays.

noa
11-14-2010, 09:40 PM
I really don't think there's much Crennel could do to get anymore out of this defense.

The lack of depth in the front 7, which has created a worn group, and the injuries on the backend really limited his ability to make any scheme or adjustments to hide weaknesses.

Yep. I think McDaniels knew exactly who he had to pick on and did a good job of doing it. And you gotta give credit to Kyle Orton for making that happen. They were clicking on all cylinders those first few drives and we had plenty of weaknesses that were prone to exploitation. Not much Crennel could have done unless he could have traded for some better players mid-game.

milkman
11-14-2010, 09:42 PM
Maybe blitz? Shit we just stood there and took it. If were going to get mcfistpumped. At least go down swinging. We threw I the white towel half way through the first qtr. It seemed all we ran was his basic shell defense. Orton had all day and his receivers made plays.

I really don't think blitzing would have done much to change the game today.

noa
11-14-2010, 09:45 PM
Maybe blitz? Shit we just stood there and took it. If were going to get mcfistpumped. At least go down swinging. We threw I the white towel half way through the first qtr. It seemed all we ran was his basic shell defense. Orton had all day and his receivers made plays.

Meh, I don't think blitzing more would have helped.

I honestly think the best thing Crennel could have done would have been to design some masterful plays for the offense to run as soon as they got the ball. Or maybe crowbar Matt Cassel in the knee cap on the sideline. Because that was about the only thing that could have helped our defense -- keep the Broncos offense off the field. As soon as that first drive was over, you could tell they were in a good groove. They knew who to go after, and their offensive line was having their way with us. Giving the ball right back to them was killer, and then doing it again was just the nail in the coffin. They needed to keep that offense off the field long enough so they couldn't maintain a rhythm or keep their confidence that high.

Reerun_KC
11-14-2010, 09:46 PM
I really don't think blitzing would have done much to change the game today.

Probably not. But at least it would of looked like we were trying. I was watching the game with dunit35 and all of his family. We couldnt believe what we were watching. We didnt expect much from Cassel like always. But to see the whole team get physically abused in all three phases of the game was just disappointing.

DeezNutz
11-14-2010, 09:48 PM
Probably not. But at least it would of looked like we were trying. I was watching the game with dunit35 and all of his family. We couldnt believe what we were watching. We didnt expect much from Cassel like always. But to see the whole team get physically abused in all three phases of the game was just disappointing.

Defensive line was consistently blown off the ball today, and the lack of a NT is really starting to be apparent. Smith wasn't even close enough to grab a penis today.

Reerun_KC
11-14-2010, 09:50 PM
Meh, I don't think blitzing more would have helped.

I honestly think the best thing Crennel could have done would have been to design some masterful plays for the offense to run as soon as they got the ball. Or maybe crowbar Matt Cassel in the knee cap on the sideline. Because that was about the only thing that could have helped our defense -- keep the Broncos offense off the field. As soon as that first drive was over, you could tell they were in a good groove. They knew who to go after, and their offensive line was having their way with us. Giving the ball right back to them was killer, and then doing it again was just the nail in the coffin. They needed to keep that offense off the field long enough so they couldn't maintain a rhythm or keep their confidence that high.

I agree and I was even calling for Brokie. I was wanting to watch the comedy that would of ensured with Haley. Brodie would of brought out last years cussing Haley. It would o made me smile on a gloomy football day.

Ever since I became a chiefs fan in 1987. We have always had HOF backup qbs onthe bench.

Reerun_KC
11-14-2010, 09:53 PM
Defensive line was consistently blown off the ball today, and the lack of a NT is really starting to be apparent. Smith wasn't even close enough to grab a penis today.

They were the more physical football team today. Both lines were over matched all day. Not even close. He'll I can't think of one player on our team that didn't get abused today. Were not a tough football team.

BigMeatballDave
11-14-2010, 10:36 PM
BCD making a gay reference. Imagine that.I know why you posted this. I referred to you as a 'queen' in the circumcision thread...LMAO

patteeu
11-15-2010, 05:59 AM
Cassel Apologists:

Listen up. I'm going to try to put this is easy terms for you to understand.

Our D sucked today. No question. This is not Cassel's fault. However, as a quarterback, Matt should see that his opponent came to play. Time to step it up. He didnt. He shit his pants on several occasions that 1st half. He did nothing. Not one single thing the entire 1st half to bail out the D.

Now, think for a second if Cassel could have sustained drives in the 1st half instead of continually going 3 and out and not putting up points. Could have been an entirely different game.

What's easy to understand is that despite a total failure by the defense and miserable play from the offensive line that completely overshadows any other flaws in the Chiefs game today, you're still focused like a laser beam on Matt Cassel.

scho63
11-15-2010, 06:57 AM
Most meaningless 470-yard, 4 TD game in NFL history.
:thumb:

Let's see him do this in a game that counts-what I am seeing is that all the teams now have decided to stop our run at all costs and let Matt Cassel and the passing game beat them.

I also agree that in this game, Matt Cassel is far from the first culprit on the list.

Order of Horrible
1. Run Defense
2. Pass Defense
3. Special Teams
4. Offensive Line
5. Defensive Line
6. Matt Cassel and the Pass Offense

Sully
11-15-2010, 07:45 AM
This is postgame discussion. The thread topic is a smilie face. You yourself only talked about one game in your post. Don't even try to pretend you thought we were talking about Cassel's entire body of work. You'll come off better if you just admit that you're obsessed with the leaky windows and don't give a rip about the smoldering ruins of your once somewhat-drafty house.

Of course I was talking about his shortcomings in this game. It's the latest round of evidence.
I've also been clear that this particular game isn't on Cassel's shoulders.
However, I'm also interested in discussing that, though on paper it looks like he had a good game, he actually played like crap until the dynamics of a comparative game vanished. I'm interested in the actual football discussion of stats not telling the story of how he helped dig the hole we found ourselves in.
But I appreciate you looking out for how I "come off" in the discussion. It warms my heart that you are concerned.

Chiefnj2
11-15-2010, 07:56 AM
Of course I was talking about his shortcomings in this game. It's the latest round of evidence.
I've also been clear that this particular game isn't on Cassel's shoulders.
However, I'm also interested in discussing that, though on paper it looks like he had a good game, he actually played like crap until the dynamics of a comparative game vanished. I'm interested in the actual football discussion of stats not telling the story of how he helped dig the hole we found ourselves in.
But I appreciate you looking out for how I "come off" in the discussion. It warms my heart that you are concerned.

Actually, on the first drive Cassel converted 1 first down throwing the ball. Converted a second that was then called back because of a penalty setting up 3rd and very long because the run game on 1st and 2nd down only netted 3 yards. Cassel came out of the gate okay in this game.

The TEAM then went 3 and out the next drive before Denver's pass rush kicked in sending Cassel into flashbacks of 2009 and taking unnecessary sacks.

I don't know why people need to dwell on Cassel every single week. 98% + of this board want the Chiefs to draft a developmental QB. Cassel can throw for 0, 1, 2, 3 or 4 TDs next week, it doesn't matter -if KC is in position to take a QB in the draft they should do it.

Sully
11-15-2010, 08:08 AM
Actually, on the first drive Cassel converted 1 first down throwing the ball. Converted a second that was then called back because of a penalty setting up 3rd and very long because the run game on 1st and 2nd down only netted 3 yards. Cassel came out of the gate okay in this game.

The TEAM then went 3 and out the next drive before Denver's pass rush kicked in sending Cassel into flashbacks of 2009 and taking unnecessary sacks.

I don't know why people need to dwell on Cassel every single week. 98% + of this board want the Chiefs to draft a developmental QB. Cassel can throw for 0, 1, 2, 3 or 4 TDs next week, it doesn't matter -if KC is in position to take a QB in the draft they should do it.

The reason people dwell on him probably is for three reasons;
1. He plays the most important position on the field.
2. The "what could have been" factor.
And
3. It was the first big move by the new regime, and in hindsight looks like a huge mistake.

I, personally, try only to look at number 1. But I know a huge number of other posters look at the other two, as well.

When we look at the defense, we can discuss adding at this position or that, tweaking here or there, and look at successful/failed gameplans.
On offense we can talk about strengthening other positions, and changing gameplans, but it's so disheartening because so long as our QB is so retarded in his growth, it doesn't matter.

Bottom line, IMO, a better QB would be a huge help both offensively and defensively.

DBOSHO
11-15-2010, 08:10 AM
Does anyone know cassels first half stats? I have a buddy thats actually trying to defend cassel by saying he made every throw most quarterbacks made yesterday lol

Bane
11-15-2010, 08:13 AM
Does anyone know cassels first half stats? I have a buddy thats actually trying to defend cassel by saying he made every throw most quarterbacks made yesterday lol

1st half with their starters in he sucked ass.2nd half with college kids in,he was EPIC!!!!!!!
Fuck Casshole.

Sully
11-15-2010, 08:16 AM
Does anyone know cassels first half stats? I have a buddy thats actually trying to defend cassel by saying he made every throw most quarterbacks made yesterday lol

Even his irst half stats aren't bad.
You don't see the wildly overthrown 4-yard passes in stats, though.

L.A. Chieffan
11-15-2010, 08:24 AM
The game was over after the 1st fucking quarter. Whatever cassel did, or didnt do, after that is irrelevant. including the fumble and the 4 tds

JASONSAUTO
11-15-2010, 08:28 AM
The reason people dwell on him probably is for three reasons;
1. He plays the most important position on the field.
2. The "what could have been" factor.
And
3. It was the first big move by the new regime, and in hindsight looks like a huge mistake.

I, personally, try only to look at number 1. But I know a huge number of other posters look at the other two, as well.

When we look at the defense, we can discuss adding at this position or that, tweaking here or there, and look at successful/failed gameplans.
On offense we can talk about strengthening other positions, and changing gameplans, but it's so disheartening because so long as our QB is so retarded in his growth, it doesn't matter.

Bottom line, IMO, a better QB would be a huge help both offensively and defensively.

ok, what could have been?

BigChiefFan
11-15-2010, 08:51 AM
The freshmaker.

patteeu
11-15-2010, 09:06 AM
Does anyone know cassels first half stats? I have a buddy thats actually trying to defend cassel by saying he made every throw most quarterbacks made yesterday lol

Cassel was 12/16 for 169 yds and 1 TD in the first half. He was sacked 4 times (but 1 was negated by defensive penalty), fumbled once, and threw no interceptions.

Jamaal Charles and Thomas Jones combined for 32 yards on 12 carries. Charles fumbled once (recovered by Chiefs) and he caught 2 passes for 23 yards and a TD.

Cassel may deserve a share of the blame for the sacks (and the fumble one of those sacks produced) in the same way that the running backs may deserve a share of the blame for the anemic running game, but the offensive line should be in the spotlight for the problems on that side of the ball in this game.

patteeu
11-15-2010, 09:11 AM
Even his irst half stats aren't bad.
You don't see the wildly overthrown 4-yard passes in stats, though.

Cassel had a lot more good passes in this game than he had bad passes. A lot more. Very few of Cassel's passes were passes that could have been picked off. Orton, otoh, threw several that not only could have been, but should have been. Nonetheless, I'm hearing a lot of talk about how accurate Orton is today. Go figure.

Sully
11-15-2010, 09:15 AM
ok, what could have been?

It's not an argument I fully subscribe to, because there are several unknowns. But a few of them are...
Drafting Sanchez.
Not drafting Jackson
Getting Orton or some other QB
Not ruining our options at #3, draft or trade-wise
And many others.
The trade for Cassel really did limit our options that offseason, and moving forward.
While I'm not ready to say any or all of those options would have been better, there are those who were Cassel-haters from day 1 that are.

Like I said, though, I don't factor that into my criticism of Cassel.

dirk digler
11-15-2010, 09:16 AM
Cassel had a lot more good passes in this game than he had bad passes. A lot more. Very few of Cassel's passes were passes that could have been picked off. Orton, otoh, threw several that not only could have been, but should have been. Nonetheless, I'm hearing a lot of talk about how accurate Orton is today. Go figure.

Just taking a guess but I imagine alot of Cassel's success at passing was because of the soft coverage the Donkey's were using since they were up by 35 points.

That is just a guess though.

Sully
11-15-2010, 09:19 AM
Cassel had a lot more good passes in this game than he had bad passes. A lot more. Very few of Cassel's passes were passes that could have been picked off. Orton, otoh, threw several that not only could have been, but should have been. Nonetheless, I'm hearing a lot of talk about how accurate Orton is today. Go figure.

Yes.
Once the dynamic of the game changed from that of a competitive game, to that of a blowout, and Denver became more worried about stopping the big play than giving up meaningless yards, he was Joe Montana.
Has anyone argued otherwise?

Chiefnj2
11-15-2010, 09:32 AM
Just taking a guess but I imagine alot of Cassel's success at passing was because of the soft coverage the Donkey's were using since they were up by 35 points.

That is just a guess though.

It's also easy for D's to grab INTs in those situations.

Pestilence
11-15-2010, 09:34 AM
It's also easy for D's to grab INTs in those situations.

Not when they're playing 10 yards off every receiver.

patteeu
11-15-2010, 09:35 AM
Just taking a guess but I imagine alot of Cassel's success at passing was because of the soft coverage the Donkey's were using since they were up by 35 points.

That is just a guess though.

Yes, you'd think so and I think it's absolutely fair to discount this 470 yard performance because of that, but discounting that success doesn't equate to saying he had a bad game. As someone else mentioned, Cassel's passes early in the game were pretty good for the most part too. He was hurt by a lack of running game and a lack of pass protection, both of which I blame primarily on the offensive line. Early in the 3rd quarter, the offensive line failed to get any push when the Chiefs were on Denver's doorstep (1 yard line) on 3 different running attempts. It was pathetic.

Pestilence
11-15-2010, 09:37 AM
Yes, you'd think so and I think it's absolutely fair to discount this 470 yard performance because of that, but discounting that success doesn't equate to saying he had a bad game. As someone else mentioned, Cassel's passes early in the game were pretty good for the most part too. He was hurt by a lack of running game and a lack of pass protection, both of which I blame primarily on the offensive line. Early in the 3rd quarter, the offensive line failed to get any push when the Chiefs were on Denver's doorstep (1 yard line) on 3 different running attempts. It was pathetic.

We might have been able to sustain some drives if dipshit wasn't over throwing his WRs by 5 yards on 3rd down.

Param
11-15-2010, 09:39 AM
I hope Matty gets to start for the Chiefs the next 4 years.

BigMeatballDave
11-15-2010, 09:40 AM
I hope Matty gets to start for the Chiefs the next 4 years.LMAO I'm laughing because I can only assume you are joking.

patteeu
11-15-2010, 09:42 AM
Yes.
Once the dynamic of the game changed from that of a competitive game, to that of a blowout, and Denver became more worried about stopping the big play than giving up meaningless yards, he was Joe Montana.
Has anyone argued otherwise?

You can start the clock whenever you want to and I'll tell you that Cassel didn't have as bad a day as the Chiefs defense, their offensive line, or the runningbacks (Jamaal "more carries" Charles included).

Cassel started the game 1 of 3 (although he would have been 2 of 4 with a big first down completion in the first series if it hadn't been for a formation penalty by Charles). After that, he was 11 of 13 for 157 yds and 1 TD in the first half. Seriously, you're watching the game with blinders on.

BigMeatballDave
11-15-2010, 09:44 AM
During the 1st half, the difference between Orton and Cassel was HUGE.

Orton is capable of putting the ball in tight spots. Cassel cannot.

The coverage in our secondary wasnt bad, for the most part. Orton has a good rapport with his guys.

dirk digler
11-15-2010, 09:45 AM
Yes, you'd think so and I think it's absolutely fair to discount this 470 yard performance because of that, but discounting that success doesn't equate to saying he had a bad game. As someone else mentioned, Cassel's passes early in the game were pretty good for the most part too. He was hurt by a lack of running game and a lack of pass protection, both of which I blame primarily on the offensive line. Early in the 3rd quarter, the offensive line failed to get any push when the Chiefs were on Denver's doorstep (1 yard line) on 3 different running attempts. It was pathetic.

The whole game was pathetic but I chalk it up to the Donkeys were coming off a bye and you could tell they were just faster, quicker, sharper and desperate.

As far as the O-Line goes the lack of push on 3rd and short has been happening all year

BigMeatballDave
11-15-2010, 09:47 AM
LMAO ROFL @ the Matt Cassel apologists. They are why I created this thread.

patteeu
11-15-2010, 09:48 AM
We might have been able to sustain some drives if dipshit wasn't over throwing his WRs by 5 yards on 3rd down.

We might have sustained more drives if the offensive line was opening holes and protecting the passer or if the runningbacks were finding a way to break a few 4+ yard carries despite the lack of blocking too. You guys stare down our QB worse than he stares down his receivers.

patteeu
11-15-2010, 09:49 AM
The whole game was pathetic but I chalk it up to the Donkeys were coming off a bye and you could tell they were just faster, quicker, sharper and desperate.

As far as the O-Line goes the lack of push on 3rd and short has been happening all year

I agree. It's an ongoing problem. It's amazing to me that the Chiefs have been as successful as they've been in the running game with as soft as this line is at times.

Sully
11-15-2010, 09:51 AM
You can start the clock whenever you want to and I'll tell you that Cassel didn't have as bad a day as the Chiefs defense, their offensive line, or the runningbacks (Jamaal "more carries" Charles included).

Cassel started the game 1 of 3 (although he would have been 2 of 4 with a big first down completion in the first series if it hadn't been for a formation penalty by Charles). After that, he was 11 of 13 for 157 yds and 1 TD in the first half. Seriously, you're watching the game with blinders on.
I'm not sure how better to say "this loss isn't Cassel's fault" to make you put away the strawman you seem intent on building.
However, everything you mentioned couldve been somewhat alleviated by a better QB, most of all the RB and OL issues (as has been explained several times in this thread).

Let me say it again...

Payton Manning Would've lost this game.
That doesn't absolve Cassel for being part of the problem.

BigMeatballDave
11-15-2010, 09:52 AM
We might have sustained more drives if the offensive line was opening holes and protecting the passer or if the runningbacks were finding a way to break a few 4+ yard carries despite the lack of blocking too. You guys stare down our QB worse than he stares down his receivers.The running game cannot always be there. Cassel needs to step up and make plays. Fail.

dirk digler
11-15-2010, 09:55 AM
I agree. It's an ongoing problem. It's amazing to me that the Chiefs have been as successful as they've been in the running game with as soft as this line is at times.

I think it is in large part due to scheme. but when it comes to 3rd and short there is nothing you can do but line up and hit them in the mouth and we don't have the personnel to do that.

Hopefully Asamoah will reverse that trend.

BigMeatballDave
11-15-2010, 09:58 AM
Had Matt stepped up and been more effective. Lets say, if the score had been 28-17 at the half. Then he does his job.

BigMeatballDave
11-15-2010, 09:59 AM
Hopefully Asamoah will reverse that trend.Asamoah better be replacing Waters, soon.

kaplin42
11-15-2010, 10:00 AM
Fine but don't give up 7 TD's on defense. Sorry that is THE abomination of that game.

I have not read one post were anyone has disputed this, even remotely. The D was owned plain and simple. I don't know if it's cause they are young and just worn out on the season, or if they were overrated to start with, or if it was just a really bad day, but they blew the game without a doubt.

That being said, the continuing issue THIS SEASON is Cassel. And yesterday just added to the ammo of how bad he truly is. He can post all the stats he wants, but as long as he is a single read QB, as long as he holds onto the ball forever and takes sacks, as long as his pocket awareness rivals Helen Keller’s, and as long as he puts easy first down passes to receivers that are 5 yds in front of him in the dirt 2 yards short of them, he will be the constant weak link of this team. And he will consistently be ridiculed for being a pathetic QB who should be nothing more than a backup like he has always been.

patteeu
11-15-2010, 10:05 AM
I'm not sure how better to say "this loss isn't Cassel's fault" to make you put away the strawman you seem intent on building.
However, everything you mentioned couldve been somewhat alleviated by a better QB, most of all the RB and OL issues (as has been explained several times in this thread).

Let me say it again...

Payton Manning Would've lost this game.
That doesn't absolve Cassel for being part of the problem.

I wouldn't compare Matt Cassel to Peyton Manning. Peyton Manning is the kind of triple pane, solar coated window that a 300 lb guy can stand on without breaking it. Matt Cassel is the kind of leaky window that you need to winterize with a sheet of plastic every fall to keep your heating bill from skyrocketing.

The entire Chiefs defense and their offensive line were the flames that were engulfing your house yesterday. Focus on what kind of replacement windows you think the place needs if it will make you happy though.

Sully
11-15-2010, 10:09 AM
You're right. Like I said... So long as some other phase of the game was just as bad as Cassel, then we shouldn't have any criticism of his shortcomings at all.
I hope the coaches all take this tack, as well.

Sully
11-15-2010, 10:13 AM
Let me add.
So long as we are going with the dumbass fire analogy...

When discussing rebuilding this "burned down house," the last thing we should do is discuss installing better windows, that were so drafty that the small flame was blown into a home-consuming one.

patteeu
11-15-2010, 10:30 AM
The running game cannot always be there. Cassel needs to step up and make plays. Fail.

Cassel made a lot of plays yesterday. You can't put him in 3rd and long repeatedly and expect him to bail the team out. You should know this about him by now. Let's look at how the game started though.

On the first possession, Cassel converted on a 3rd and 7 pass, but it was called back on a Jamaal Charles penalty. He didn't convert on 3rd and 12.

The running game got the Chiefs 3 total yards on 1st and 2nd down against the worst run defense in the league and then Charles set them back 5 with his penalty. What's the league average for converting 3rd and 12? I bet it's not very good.

On the second possession, he failed on 3rd and 4.

The running game got 6 total yards on 1st and 2nd down this time which is a little better but still not good enough when you're playing a team that plays the run like a matador plays a bull. Still it's fair to expect a QB to convert on 3rd and 4 more often than he fails, I think.

On the third possession, the game was already starting to get out of hand, but he converted 2 first downs with his arm before the drive was killed by a sack.

I know that the Cassel-bashers will want to blame both of these sacks (there were actually 2 on this drive) on the QB, but I would argue that the offensive line didn't come to play this game and they deserve a healthy share of the blame. Cassel was 4 of 4 for 41 yards on this drive.

So to summarize, you're declaring "FAIL" on the basis of one untimely early incompletion in a game in which the Chiefs running game couldn't put a dent in the worst rushing defense in the NFL and the Chiefs offensive line gave up 4 sacks to one of worst pass rushing defenses (30th in the league in sacks before yesterday). Cassel derangement syndrome is rampaging.

Sully
11-15-2010, 10:33 AM
Let me add.
So long as we are going with the dumbass fire analogy...

When discussing rebuilding this "burned down house," the last thing we should do is discuss installing better windows, that were so drafty that the small flame was blown into a home-consuming one.

Reaper16
11-15-2010, 10:35 AM
Normally I would be laughing my ass off at patteeu. But I have no laughter anymore to give.

patteeu
11-15-2010, 10:43 AM
You're right. Like I said... So long as some other phase of the game was just as bad as Cassel, then we shouldn't have any criticism of his shortcomings at all.
I hope the coaches all take this tack, as well.

This thread was posted immediately after yesterday's game. My interpretation of that wasn't "let's put this game aside and resume our yearlong discussion of Matt Cassel". Instead, I interpreted it as "Boy, did you see that game? After seeing that mess how can anyone possibly not see that Cassel is a disaster".

In fact, Kaplin42 seems to have the same type of take from the game:

I have not read one post were anyone has disputed this, even remotely. The D was owned plain and simple. I don't know if it's cause they are young and just worn out on the season, or if they were overrated to start with, or if it was just a really bad day, but they blew the game without a doubt.

That being said, the continuing issue THIS SEASON is Cassel. And yesterday just added to the ammo of how bad he truly is. He can post all the stats he wants, but as long as he is a single read QB, as long as he holds onto the ball forever and takes sacks, as long as his pocket awareness rivals Helen Kellerís, and as long as he puts easy first down passes to receivers that are 5 yds in front of him in the dirt 2 yards short of them, he will be the constant weak link of this team. And he will consistently be ridiculed for being a pathetic QB who should be nothing more than a backup like he has always been.

The truth is that Cassel wasn't that bad yesterday and to the extent he didn't get the job done on a few occasions, he had lots of help in that failure from the people around him. With all the other completely pathetic performances, it's ridiculous for people to say that Cassel wasn't doing his job because he didn't single-handedly keep the Chiefs in that game yesterday. He did more than enough to win that game. In fact, he's played worse in some of the team's wins.

vailpass
11-15-2010, 10:45 AM
LMAO I'm laughing because I can only assume you are joking.

Or a rival fan?

patteeu
11-15-2010, 10:45 AM
Let me add.
So long as we are going with the dumbass fire analogy...

When discussing rebuilding this "burned down house," the last thing we should do is discuss installing better windows, that were so drafty that the small flame was blown into a home-consuming one.

We'll be in a new house next week. Hopefully it won't be so absurd to focus on how well the windows are performing then.

Sully
11-15-2010, 11:01 AM
A quick football quiz:

The past two weeks, the running game has been poor in comparison with previous games. This is because;
A) the OL has forgotten how to block
B) the RBs have forgotten how to run the ball
C) the coaches have forgotten what plays they used to call
D) teams have decided Cassel cannot win if he becomes a passer, and have dedicated their defense to stopping the run

The best way to unpack the "box" is to;
A) take sacks
B) overthrow open receivers
C) throw for 400 yards after being blown out
D) show the capabilities of an average QB to sustain drives via the pass

When the defense is playing poorly, it is best to;
A) go three and out
B) fumble the ball on an overload blitz
C) take sacks
B) sustain drives

And finally, a T/F question.

Matt Cassel is a good enough QB to overcome games when another facet of our game is not working.

burt
11-15-2010, 11:05 AM
Matt Cassel is a good enough QB to overcome games when another facet of our game is not working.

:Lin::shake:

Sully
11-15-2010, 11:07 AM
This thread was posted immediately after yesterday's game. My interpretation of that wasn't "let's put this game aside and resume our yearlong discussion of Matt Cassel". Instead, I interpreted it as "Boy, did you see that game? After seeing that mess how can anyone possibly not see that Cassel is a disaster".

In fact, Kaplin42 seems to have the same type of take from the game:



The truth is that Cassel wasn't that bad yesterday and to the extent he didn't get the job done on a few occasions, he had lots of help in that failure from the people around him. With all the other completely pathetic performances, it's ridiculous for people to say that Cassel wasn't doing his job because he didn't single-handedly keep the Chiefs in that game yesterday. He did more than enough to win that game. In fact, he's played worse in some of the team's wins.
I can't account or how you interpreted this thread. My personal interpretation was that it was meant as flypaper for people with limited football knowledge that would attempt to make the argument that, due to meaningless stats, Cassel was awesome yesterday.
It was my feeling before this thread was posted that there would be people dumb enough to believe that, so I wanted to get my takes in about it.
I'm simply amazed, though, that the "stop blaming Cassel for the loss" strawman continues to be built.

kaplin42
11-15-2010, 11:27 AM
A quick football quiz:

The past two weeks, the running game has been poor in comparison with previous games. This is because;
A) the OL has forgotten how to block
B) the RBs have forgotten how to run the ball
C) the coaches have forgotten what plays they used to call
D) teams have decided Cassel cannot win if he becomes a passer, and have dedicated their defense to stopping the run

The best way to unpack the "box" is to;
A) take sacks
B) overthrow open receivers
C) throw for 400 yards after being blown out
D) show the capabilities of an average QB to sustain drives via the pass

When the defense is playing poorly, it is best to;
A) go three and out
B) fumble the ball on an overload blitz
C) take sacks
B) sustain drives

And finally, a T/F question.

Matt Cassel is a good enough QB to overcome games when another facet of our game is not working.

Apparently, the correct CP answer to the above quiz is JELLO.

patteeu
11-15-2010, 11:32 AM
I can't account or how you interpreted this thread. My personal interpretation was that it was meant as flypaper for people with limited football knowledge that would attempt to make the argument that, due to meaningless stats, Cassel was awesome yesterday.
It was my feeling before this thread was posted that there would be people dumb enough to believe that, so I wanted to get my takes in about it.
I'm simply amazed, though, that the "stop blaming Cassel for the loss" strawman continues to be built.

You came here looking for a fight with people who you expected to say this game proves that Cassel is awesome and when they didn't show up you decided instead to get defensive when people merely said that Cassel didn't lose this game for the Chiefs and, indeed, his flaws in this game weren't all that bad in light of the near-total collapse around him? Right.

Sully
11-15-2010, 11:46 AM
You came here looking for a fight with people who you expected to say this game proves that Cassel is awesome and when they didn't show up you decided instead to get defensive when people merely said that Cassel didn't lose this game for the Chiefs and, indeed, his flaws in this game weren't all that bad in light of the near-total collapse around him? Right.

The only thing I would be defensive about is people putting arguments in my mouth that I'm not making.
If you want to argue against what I actually type, that'd be great. So far, though, you seem content to build strawmen, though.

BigMeatballDave
11-15-2010, 12:09 PM
Or a rival fan?Good question. I actually dont know. :)

BigMeatballDave
11-15-2010, 12:13 PM
Cassel made a lot of plays yesterday. You can't put him in 3rd and long repeatedly and expect him to bail the team out. You should know this about him by now. Let's look at how the game started though.



The running game got the Chiefs 3 total yards on 1st and 2nd down against the worst run defense in the league and then Charles set them back 5 with his penalty. What's the league average for converting 3rd and 12? I bet it's not very good.



The running game got 6 total yards on 1st and 2nd down this time which is a little better but still not good enough when you're playing a team that plays the run like a matador plays a bull. Still it's fair to expect a QB to convert on 3rd and 4 more often than he fails, I think.



I know that the Cassel-bashers will want to blame both of these sacks (there were actually 2 on this drive) on the QB, but I would argue that the offensive line didn't come to play this game and they deserve a healthy share of the blame. Cassel was 4 of 4 for 41 yards on this drive.

So to summarize, you're declaring "FAIL" on the basis of one untimely early incompletion in a game in which the Chiefs running game couldn't put a dent in the worst rushing defense in the NFL and the Chiefs offensive line gave up 4 sacks to one of worst pass rushing defenses (30th in the league in sacks before yesterday). Cassel derangement syndrome is rampaging.:facepalm:

JASONSAUTO
11-15-2010, 12:15 PM
I can't account or how you interpreted this thread. My personal interpretation was that it was meant as flypaper for people with limited football knowledge that would attempt to make the argument that, due to meaningless stats, Cassel was awesome yesterday.
It was my feeling before this thread was posted that there would be people dumb enough to believe that, so I wanted to get my takes in about it.
I'm simply amazed, though, that the "stop blaming Cassel for the loss" strawman continues to be built.

so you blame cassel for the loss?

BigMeatballDave
11-15-2010, 12:16 PM
A quick football quiz:

The past two weeks, the running game has been poor in comparison with previous games. This is because;
A) the OL has forgotten how to block
B) the RBs have forgotten how to run the ball
C) the coaches have forgotten what plays they used to call
D) teams have decided Cassel cannot win if he becomes a passer, and have dedicated their defense to stopping the run

The best way to unpack the "box" is to;
A) take sacks
B) overthrow open receivers
C) throw for 400 yards after being blown out
D) show the capabilities of an average QB to sustain drives via the pass

When the defense is playing poorly, it is best to;
A) go three and out
B) fumble the ball on an overload blitz
C) take sacks
B) sustain drives

And finally, a T/F question.

Matt Cassel is a good enough QB to overcome games when another facet of our game is not working.D,D,the 2nd B, False.

Do I get a cookie? :)

BigMeatballDave
11-15-2010, 12:19 PM
so you blame cassel for the loss?Not directly. But, he did nothing to ease the hemorrhaging during the 1st half.

JASONSAUTO
11-15-2010, 12:20 PM
Not directly. But, he did nothing to ease the hemorrhaging during the 1st half.

neither did anyone else.

BigMeatballDave
11-15-2010, 12:28 PM
neither did anyone else.He's the Qb. The most important player on the field.

JASONSAUTO
11-15-2010, 12:37 PM
He's the Qb. The most important player on the field.

yeah he plays both ways too.


maybe the DEFENSE should have stepped up and stopped the bleeding

Baby Lee
11-15-2010, 12:37 PM
I wouldn't compare Matt Cassel to Peyton Manning. Peyton Manning is the kind of triple pane, solar coated window that a 300 lb guy can stand on without breaking it. Matt Cassel is the kind of leaky window that you need to winterize with a sheet of plastic every fall to keep your heating bill from skyrocketing.

The entire Chiefs defense and their offensive line were the flames that were engulfing your house yesterday. Focus on what kind of replacement windows you think the place needs if it will make you happy though.

I'm not a 'QB is the center of the universe' guy and even I realize that a QB isn't a 'window,' at the least it's framing, possibly foundation.

So the house might've been on fire, but it was already heavily infested with termites, or had a foundation of sand.

ArrowheadHawk
11-15-2010, 12:37 PM
yeah he plays both ways too.


maybe the DEFENSE should have stepped up and stopped the bleeding

:clap:

BigMeatballDave
11-15-2010, 01:43 PM
yeah he plays both ways too.


maybe the DEFENSE should have stepped up and stopped the bleedingYou CLEARLY understand football.

patteeu
11-15-2010, 01:46 PM
Not directly. But, he did nothing to ease the hemorrhaging during the 1st half.

He completed 12 out of 16 passes. He didn't make any tackles though. :facepalm:

Sully
11-15-2010, 01:46 PM
so you blame cassel for the loss?

Don't quite understand what a strawman is, do ya?

Brock
11-15-2010, 01:47 PM
Don't blame Cassel for being what he is. The guy played about as well as you could reasonably expect. He just isn't good enough to overcome when the 2 phases of the game that this team leans on fail.

BigMeatballDave
11-15-2010, 01:49 PM
He completed 12 out of 16 passes. He didn't make any tackles though. :facepalm::rolleyes:

patteeu
11-15-2010, 01:54 PM
I'm not a 'QB is the center of the universe' guy and even I realize that a QB isn't a 'window,' at the least it's framing, possibly foundation.

So the house might've been on fire, but it was already heavily infested with termites, or had a foundation of sand.

I'm not talking about what Cassel is to this team. I'm talking about what he was to this loss. The analogy may have drifted a bit as I chased Sully through his twisting efforts to make sure he got his licks in on the Chiefs' QB, but Cassel-as-leaky-window was originally intended as a one game analogy and I see no reason to abandon it or apologize for it.

JASONSAUTO
11-15-2010, 01:54 PM
Don't quite understand what a strawman is, do ya?

i think i do. they are used to keep animals out of people's crops, and they have about as much to do with the loss yesterday as matt cassel

JASONSAUTO
11-15-2010, 01:56 PM
You CLEARLY understand football.

when the defense gives up 42 points what do you expect?

patteeu
11-15-2010, 02:01 PM
:facepalm:

BTW, that was quite an insightful argument. Almost as intellectually compelling as the original post. Bravo.

ForeverChiefs58
11-15-2010, 02:31 PM
I'm not talking about what Cassel is to this team. I'm talking about what he was to this loss. The analogy may have drifted a bit as I chased Sully through his twisting efforts to make sure he got his licks in on the Chiefs' QB, but Cassel-as-leaky-window was originally intended as a one game analogy and I see no reason to abandon it or apologize for it.

http://rob.nu/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/facepalm2.jpg

ForeverChiefs58
11-15-2010, 02:32 PM
http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/54/wh-double-facepalm.jpg

ForeverChiefs58
11-15-2010, 02:34 PM
i think i do. they are used to keep animals out of people's crops, and they have about as much to do with the loss yesterday as matt cassel

Oh yeah, I have one for you too
http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:Sh3D4hud7hV9dM:http://i491.photobucket.com/albums/rr279/Wylma7/ImpliedFacePalm.jpg&t=1

Baby Lee
11-15-2010, 03:16 PM
Small point, but it's been transgressed enough times on here to merit mention.

All this mention of 7 TDs gave up, 49 points given up, by the D, ignored that the D was on the sidelines and Cassel was puking on his shoes for one of those.

JASONSAUTO
11-15-2010, 03:37 PM
Small point, but it's been transgressed enough times on here to merit mention.

All this mention of 7 TDs gave up, 49 points given up, by the D, ignored that the D was on the sidelines and Cassel was puking on his shoes for one of those.

post 233?

Pasta Giant Meatball
11-15-2010, 04:19 PM
Don't blame Cassel for being what he is. The guy played about as well as you could reasonably expect. He just isn't good enough to overcome when the 2 phases of the game that this team leans on fail.

True, but I don't recall a game where a team has won when thier defense gave up TD's on the first 4 possessions of the game. I have seen plenty of teams win after not scoring on the first 4 drives.

Pasta Giant Meatball
11-15-2010, 04:21 PM
Small point, but it's been transgressed enough times on here to merit mention.

All this mention of 7 TDs gave up, 49 points given up, by the D, ignored that the D was on the sidelines and Cassel was puking on his shoes for one of those.

Give me an example of a team winning after giving up 28 points on the first 4 possessions of the game. The only game I can think of in the history of the league that might fit is the Buffalo-Houston playoff game where it was like 35-3 at the half.

stevieray
11-15-2010, 07:37 PM
I say take the leash off...team can't afford to be semi one dimesional anymore.