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View Full Version : U.S. Issues Immigration Fingerprint Program Now In Colo


Donger
02-16-2011, 08:39 AM
http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/26876045/detail.html

DENVER -- A rapidly expanding federal program that identifies illegal immigrants when they're arrested and fingerprinted is now operational in Denver, El Paso and Arapahoe counties.

Colorado Department of Public Safety spokesman Lance Clem said Secure Communities was launched Tuesday in the three jurisdictions.

The program checks arrestee's fingerprints against six federal databases to determine the person's legal status and arrest record.

Critics argue it creates an incentive for racial profiling. Denver Mayor Bill Vidal calls it "worrisome" and says it should be monitored closely.

The Arapahoe County Sheriff’s Office said within two hours after the fingerprints are submitted, the office will receive information regarding an inmate’s immigration status and a determination of whether U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement will place a deportation detainer on the arrestee who is an illegal alien.

"This is a very important program that will have a positive impact upon public safety, will enhance our ability to identify criminal aliens, and will focus upon the timely deportation of those who continue to victimize our community," said Arapahoe County Sheriff Grayson Robinson.

Both the County Sheriffs of Colorado and the Colorado Association of Chiefs of Police support it.

Secure Communities was launched in 2007. ICE said last week that Secure Communities is active in more than 1,000 jurisdictions in 38 states.

ICE hopes to have it in every jail in the country by 2013.

Jaric
02-16-2011, 08:55 AM
I'm confused.

I was under the impression that it was standard practice to fingerprint everyone who was arrested? Am I mistaken here?

(Never been arrested myself)

Otter
02-16-2011, 09:00 AM
Keep making noise

www.numbersusa.com

Rain Man
02-16-2011, 09:12 AM
Unless they have every American's fingerprints in the database, how can they tell citizenship status? Do you presume that a person is illegal if their fingerprints aren't in the database? I don't know about Mexican policy, but I doubt that Mexico has the fingerprints of every rural Mexican villager who's hopping the border.

Presumably we've got the person's fingerprints if they've been arrested before, and maybe - maybe - have already done the legwork to see if they're a citizen. But I'm not sure that happens if it's not a major crime, and from what I hear the illegals tend to not have ID and give names like "Juan Rodriquez" that are impossible to trace. Nonetheless, it would be good to know if the person has been arrested before.

Donger
02-16-2011, 09:14 AM
I'm confused.

I was under the impression that it was standard practice to fingerprint everyone who was arrested? Am I mistaken here?

(Never been arrested myself)

Through the Secure Communities strategy, U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) improves public safety every day by transforming the way criminal aliens are identified and removed from the United States. This strategy leverages an existing information sharing capability between the U.S. Department of Homeland Security (DHS) and the Department of Justice (DOJ) to quickly and accurately identify aliens who are arrested for a crime and booked into local law enforcement custody. With this capability, the fingerprints of everyone arrested and booked are not only checked against FBI criminal history records, but they are also checked against DHS immigration records. If fingerprints match DHS records, ICE determines if immigration enforcement action is required, considering the immigration status of the alien, the severity of the crime and the alien's criminal history. Secure Communities also helps ICE maximize and prioritize its resources to ensure that the right people, processes and infrastructure are in place to accommodate the increased number of criminal aliens being identified and removed.

Secure Communities modernizes the identification and removal processes by:

* Using fingerprint-based biometric identification technology,
* Prioritizing resources toward the greatest threats, and
* Sharing information between law enforcement partners.

Jaric
02-16-2011, 09:16 AM
Through the Secure Communities strategy, U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) improves public safety every day by transforming the way criminal aliens are identified and removed from the United States. This strategy leverages an existing information sharing capability between the U.S. Department of Homeland Security (DHS) and the Department of Justice (DOJ) to quickly and accurately identify aliens who are arrested for a crime and booked into local law enforcement custody. With this capability, the fingerprints of everyone arrested and booked are not only checked against FBI criminal history records, but they are also checked against DHS immigration records. If fingerprints match DHS records, ICE determines if immigration enforcement action is required, considering the immigration status of the alien, the severity of the crime and the alien's criminal history. Secure Communities also helps ICE maximize and prioritize its resources to ensure that the right people, processes and infrastructure are in place to accommodate the increased number of criminal aliens being identified and removed.

Secure Communities modernizes the identification and removal processes by:

* Using fingerprint-based biometric identification technology,
* Prioritizing resources toward the greatest threats, and
* Sharing information between law enforcement partners.

Oh, so they're basically just keeping a list of illegals and if your fingerprints match that list you get the boot? Did I get that about right?

How on earth could that be racial profiling?

Donger
02-16-2011, 09:17 AM
Oh, so they're basically just keeping a list of illegals and if your fingerprints match that list you get the boot? Did I get that about right?

How on earth could that be racial profiling?

Because are they going to apply this to everyone who is arrested, or just the brown-skinned dudes who don't speak English?

Jaric
02-16-2011, 09:20 AM
Because are they going to apply this to everyone who is arrested, or just the brown-skinned dudes who don't speak English?

I'm going to make an assuption here, so I admit this might not be the case.

But if this is all computerized, it should just be part of the process when they book someone. I would assume that if I get arrested in State A for doing offense A, they would check to see if I had warrents out in State B for doing offense B.

I would assume this would be no different than that. That would make sense to me at least. In fact, I'm confused why this isn't being done everywhere. Being here illegally is...well illegal. If they check to see if I've got any outstanding warrents I would assume they'd check to see if I've broken other laws.

Donger
02-16-2011, 09:22 AM
I'm going to make an assuption here, so I admit this might not be the case.

But if this is all computerized, it should just be part of the process when they book someone. I would assume that if I get arrested in State A for doing offense A, they would check to see if I had warrents out in State B for doing offense B.

I would assume this would be no different than that. That would make sense to me at least. In fact, I'm confused why this isn't being done everywhere. Being here illegally is...well illegal. If they check to see if I've got any outstanding warrents I would assume they'd check to see if I've broken other laws.

I don't believe that fingerprints previously were checked with DHS and FBI dbases.

Jaric
02-16-2011, 09:26 AM
I don't believe that fingerprints previously were checked with DHS and FBI dbases.

Really? (I actually don't know that) That would seem logical to me that the would be. I mean, how much time and effort would it take to feed a fingerprint into a computer and ask it "does this match anything?"

HonestChieffan
02-16-2011, 09:37 AM
The bigger issue is what do they do when they ID someone as here illegally? We lawyer them up, hold hearings, lots of delays and time spent and years go by. Until we start fast tracking them out of the country we still have the issue.

Amnorix
02-16-2011, 10:02 AM
I'm going to make an assuption here, so I admit this might not be the case.

But if this is all computerized, it should just be part of the process when they book someone. I would assume that if I get arrested in State A for doing offense A, they would check to see if I had warrents out in State B for doing offense B.

I would assume this would be no different than that. That would make sense to me at least. In fact, I'm confused why this isn't being done everywhere. Being here illegally is...well illegal. If they check to see if I've got any outstanding warrents I would assume they'd check to see if I've broken other laws.

I think you, and many, in general overestimate the degree of interstate and federal/state cooperation and information sharing capabilities.

TV shows are a joke. I know, having personally seen it, that a local police station (in a VERY nice zip code) here in Eastern Massachusetts uses a computer that isn't on ANYBODY's desk at work right now. I forget what it was, but it was like a TRS-80 or something so completely absurd my brain could barely comprehend it. It was a DOS based system in any event. :-O

Amnorix
02-16-2011, 10:04 AM
Really? (I actually don't know that) That would seem logical to me that the would be. I mean, how much time and effort would it take to feed a fingerprint into a computer and ask it "does this match anything?"

What you're missing is that the computers (federal, state-to-state) don't really talk to each other much, or at all. Law enforcement doesn't really have a "computer network", or at least it hasn't had one until somewhat recently. I think alot of effort has been put into better communication in the last 10 or so years.

Rain Man
02-16-2011, 10:07 AM
What you're missing is that the computers (federal, state-to-state) don't really talk to each other much, or at all. Law enforcement doesn't really have a "computer network", or at least it hasn't had one until somewhat recently. I think alot of effort has been put into better communication in the last 10 or so years.


That's kind of mind-boggling. I just assumed that everyone who got booked went into some sort of federal database, as did their fingerprints and all outstanding warrants. It doesn't seem like it'd be hard to do that at all.

Amnorix
02-16-2011, 10:10 AM
Also note the different agencies and funding involved in law enforcement. Just using Massachusetts, we have:

1. federal law enforcement (FBI), federally funded

2. probation, state funded, budgeted through the judiciary system (the probation department here reports to the Supreme Judicial court)

3. state police, state funded, through the executive branch

4. county law enforcement, largely in charge of prisons, county funded

5. local law enforcement, funded by the cities and towns.

Each running their own computer networks. And that's just WITHIN my state. Then consider that there are 50 states that all do it more or less like this, and think about the incredibly patchwork computer system that would result.

Amnorix
02-16-2011, 10:14 AM
That's kind of mind-boggling. I just assumed that everyone who got booked went into some sort of federal database, as did their fingerprints and all outstanding warrants. It doesn't seem like it'd be hard to do that at all.

It **may** work that way now. I remember that some Homeland Security initiatives were trying mightily to fund better communication capabilities.

But consider that 15 years ago we were in Internet infancy and computer to computer communications were practically non-existent absent a floppy disk, and then tie that back to budgetary issues on the local level and it's not hard to see why the system isn't exactly running like a nationwide business network.

Jaric
02-16-2011, 10:21 AM
I think you, and many, in general overestimate the degree of interstate and federal/state cooperation and information sharing capabilities.

TV shows are a joke. I know, having personally seen it, that a local police station (in a VERY nice zip code) here in Eastern Massachusetts uses a computer that isn't on ANYBODY's desk at work right now. I forget what it was, but it was like a TRS-80 or something so completely absurd my brain could barely comprehend it. It was a DOS based system in any event. :-O

:facepalm:

Well, if they are still running DOS, you can ignore my previous posts.

HonestChieffan
02-16-2011, 11:00 AM
Based on what I saw when I got my CCW, they have upgraded the systems an amazing amount.

Rain Man
02-16-2011, 11:26 AM
It **may** work that way now. I remember that some Homeland Security initiatives were trying mightily to fund better communication capabilities.

But consider that 15 years ago we were in Internet infancy and computer to computer communications were practically non-existent absent a floppy disk, and then tie that back to budgetary issues on the local level and it's not hard to see why the system isn't exactly running like a nationwide business network.

Yeah, pre-internet it'd be almost impossible.

I was pondering a while back how easy it must've been to be a criminal in the 1800s or earlier. All you had to do was leave town and move to a new town and you were pretty much doing a system reboot. Most people didn't really move, and there weren't really any good ways to communicate pictures of you, so as long as you didn't get caught in the act you were golden.

Otter
02-16-2011, 11:36 AM
Based on what I saw when I got my CCW, they have upgraded the systems an amazing amount.

I was a consultant less than 2 years back on integrating local & state databases on the east coast and to the best of my knowledge local & state criminal (among lots of other info) data still cannot be accessed by federal departments such as the FBI, CIA and NSA. For example, someone arrested for a DUI in Any-town, USA that's been fingerprinted and processed but has no felony convictions - that persons fingerprints and other data cannot be easily accessed online by federal divisions (ICE included) without and old fashioned email, phone call or fax.

It's a HUGE undertaking with lots of red tape and security measures. PS - you would probably shit your pants if you knew the people that have access to this information once your in "the system".

Hint: Don't get in "the system".

EDIT: I kinda got off track here - when you received your CCW you were only checked by state.

:D

Radar Chief
02-16-2011, 12:12 PM
I think you, and many, in general overestimate the degree of interstate and federal/state cooperation and information sharing capabilities.

TV shows are a joke. I know, having personally seen it, that a local police station (in a VERY nice zip code) here in Eastern Massachusetts uses a computer that isn't on ANYBODY's desk at work right now. I forget what it was, but it was like a TRS-80 or something so completely absurd my brain could barely comprehend it. It was a DOS based system in any event. :-O

Hey, don’t knock the Commodore C64. I used to rule some ass at Karate Tournament and Normandy D-Day Invasion.

thecoffeeguy
02-16-2011, 03:38 PM
Keep making noise

www.numbersusa.com

:thumb:

KILLER_CLOWN
02-17-2011, 08:00 AM
Hey, don’t knock the Commodore C64. I used to rule some ass at Karate Tournament and Normandy D-Day Invasion.

Ya i grew up on the c64, incredible machine back in the early 80's. Karateka and bruce lee. Then i gradyeated to tha Amiga. Trash 80's just do not cut it though.

Radar Chief
02-17-2011, 08:09 AM
Ya i grew up on the c64, incredible machine back in the early 80's. Karateka and bruce lee. Then i gradyeated to tha Amiga. Trash 80's just do not cut it though.

When I picked up MiniRadar yesterday he and his friend were playing with the Kinect system they got for their X-Box. No controllers, just stand in front of the TV and start moving and you’re on screen character moves with you.
How things have changed.