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View Full Version : Music Rock N Poll: Round 1, Heat 30


Rain Man
03-17-2011, 05:35 PM
Almost there, almost there.

Got some heavyweight boxing going on in this heat.

Gadzooks
03-17-2011, 05:40 PM
First in

DJ's left nut
03-17-2011, 05:42 PM
'Sympathy' should win this event. Lyrics, rhythm, raw skill; it's a damn work of art.

Wayward Son - A little overrated, IMO, but certainly good enough to move on.

And Tribute - This song has virtually no redeeming value whatsoever, I just get a kick out of it. I wasn't in love with any other options and wasn't going to risk giving my vote to a song that could end up fighting with what is likely the greatest rock song ever recorded....

BigMeatballDave
03-17-2011, 05:43 PM
'Sympathy' should win this event. Lyrics, rhythm, raw skill; it's a damn work of art.

Wayward Son - A little overrated, IMO, but certainly good enough to move on.

And Tribute - This song has virtually no redeeming value whatsoever, I just get a kick out of it. I wasn't in love with any other options and wasn't going to risk giving my vote to a song that could end up fighting with what is likely the greatest rock song ever recorded....Kansas wins this in a landslide! :)

DJ's left nut
03-17-2011, 05:45 PM
Kansas wins this in a landslide! :)

Duh, it's ChiefsPlanet.

But let's be real - Kansas is AA compared to the Stones. If there's ever a Mount Rushmore of Rock, The Stones should be right alongside the Beatles.

BigMeatballDave
03-17-2011, 05:48 PM
Duh, it's ChiefsPlanet.

But let's be real - Kansas is AA compared to the Stones. If there's ever a Mount Rushmore of Rock, The Stones should be right alongside the Beatles.In the music world, I would agree. I've never been a big fan of the Stones. They are Icons, no doubt.

DJ's left nut
03-17-2011, 05:51 PM
Look at these lyrics:

Please allow me to introduce myself
I'm a man of wealth and taste
I've been around for a long, long year
Stole many a man's soul and fate

I was 'round when Jesus Christ
Had his moments of doubt and pain
Made damn sure that Pilate
Washed his hands and sealed his fate

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guess my name, oh yeah
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game

I stuck around St. Petersburg
When I saw it was a time for a change
Killed the Czar and his ministers
Anastasia screamed in vain

I rode a tank
Held a General's rank
When the Blitzkrieg raged
And the bodies stank

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guess my name, oh yeah
What's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game, oh yeah

I watched the glee
While your kings and queens
Fought for ten decades
For the Gods they made

I shouted out
"Who killed the Kennedys?"
Well after all
It was you and me

Let me please introduce myself
I'm a man of wealth and taste
( From: http://www.elyrics.net/read/r/rolling-stones-lyrics/sympathy-for-the-devil-lyrics.html )
And I laid traps for troubadours
Who get killed before they reached Bombay

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guess my name, oh yeah
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game, oh yeah

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guess my name, oh yeah
But what's confusing you
Is just the nature of my game, ooh yeah

Just as every cop is a criminal
And all the sinners saints
As heads is tails just call me Lucifer
I'm in need of some restraint

So if you meet me, have some courtesy
Have some sympathy and some taste
Use all your well learned politics
Or I'll lay your soul to waste, mmm yeah

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guess my name, mmm yeah
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game, get down
Woo hoo, ah yeah, get on down, oh yeah

Tell me, baby, what's my name?
Tell me, honey, baby guess my name
Tell me, baby, what's my name?
I'll ya one time you're to blame

What's my name?
Tell me, baby, what's my name?
Tell me, sweetie, what's my name?

Historical references abound! Samba Music! Cool Guitar noises!

This song just kicks immense amounts of ass.

patteeu
03-17-2011, 05:53 PM
Wow, heavyweight heat.

Thunder Road, Bruce Springsteen & The E-Street Band - This is the best Springsteen song for my money. It gets my #2 vote.

Carry On My Wayward Son, Kansas - Kansas deserves to move on and this song is far more worthy than Dust in the Wind, IMO. #3 vote.

Sympathy For The Devil, The Rolling Stones - This is the best RS song ever. It's worthy of going deep into this competition or maybe even winning it. #1 vote.

I could have voted for any of the others if they had appeared in a weaker heat. It was particularly hard for me to pass on Live and Let Die.

BillSelfsTrophycase
03-17-2011, 05:53 PM
Sympathy isn't getting enough love

patteeu
03-17-2011, 05:54 PM
Wow, Springsteen fatigue must have kicked in.

Woodrow Call
03-17-2011, 05:56 PM
Sympathy For The Devil is easily in my personal top 10 so it gets a vote. It's right up there with Paint It Black as far as my favorite Stones' song.

Carry on my Wayward Son is good enough for me to break my never vote for anything Kansas policy.

Live and Let Die is awesome, I prefer the GnR version higher but it still gets a vote here.



Quality trio in this round.

Bwana
03-17-2011, 06:01 PM
Kansas baby!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQru7oCdYXA

http://albums.ml-cdn.com/9773_kansas_the_best_of_kansas.jpg

Bwana
03-17-2011, 06:05 PM
Wow, Springsteen fatigue must have kicked in.

That may because Bruce SUCKS? Seriously, fuck commie Bruce.

Gonzo
03-17-2011, 06:09 PM
God I am so tired of Kansas. Way overplayed. I don't think I've ever really liked them.
Stones, ftw.
Posted via Mobile Device

Bwana
03-17-2011, 06:12 PM
God I am so tired of Kansas. Way overplayed. I don't think I've ever really liked them.
Stones, ftw.
Posted via Mobile Device

That's exactly how I feel about Bruce.

KCUnited
03-17-2011, 06:15 PM
Pink Floyd "Pigs" and its not close.

Rain Man
03-17-2011, 06:16 PM
That may because Bruce SUCKS? Seriously, **** commie Bruce.

Next time you drive through a leaf pile, you'd better be careful, mister.

seclark
03-17-2011, 06:20 PM
first springsteen tune i've voted for.
kansas
sftd
sec

Bwana
03-17-2011, 06:20 PM
Next time you drive through a leaf pile, you'd better be careful, mister.

LMAO

I figured you would chime in after that post.

Baconeater
03-17-2011, 06:43 PM
I actually like the GnR version of Sympathy for the Devil better. (ducks)

Gonzo
03-17-2011, 06:51 PM
I actually like the GnR version of Sympathy for the Devil better. (ducks)

Meh, it wasn't bad.
Posted via Mobile Device

Rain Man
03-17-2011, 07:02 PM
Thunder Road, Bruce Springsteen & The E-Street Band - Obvious #1 vote. One of the best rock songs of all time, and shame on anyone who didn't vote for it. Even if you're not a Springsteen fan, how can you not be a fan of this song about escaping your hard life and seeking redemption on the open road with a woman at your side? Listen to it, people! Listen to it!

Carry On My Wayward Son, Kansas - Easy #2 pick. I'm always torn on which Kansas song is my favorite between this, Dust in the Wind, and Point of Know Return.

Tribute, Tenacious D. I was afraid to listen to this because I assumed it was some skanky rap song or something, but it was quite entertaining. Chalk it up for a #3 vote for pure uniqueness.

Pigs, Pink Floyd - That was it? Seriously? (Shrug.) I didn't get a whole lot of musical enjoyment out of that.

Macy's Day Parade, Green Day - Liked it. I don't like most Green Day stuff, but this was, like, a real song and stuff. Pretty close to getting my #3 vote, but didn't.

Live and Let Die, Paul McCartney - I honestly thought this was a joke submission. I really did. It's a good song, though I can't get past the "theme song" stereotype.

Sympathy For The Devil, The Rolling Stones - (Looks left, looks right.) Okay, what am I missing here? That was kind of okay, but nothing worth salivating over.

Ain't That a Shame, Cheap Trick - Okay, that was pretty darn good. Plus, the youtube video I saw had the drummer and guitarist playing with cigarettes hanging out of their mouth, which I thought was funny. Good hard rock sound. I probably should have voted for this one over Tenacious D, but the Tenacious D was more fun.

Rain Man
03-17-2011, 07:05 PM
AAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUGH! I JUST LOOKED AT THE VOTING! WTF IS WRONG WITH ALL BUT EIGHT OF YOU PEOPLE?!?!

patteeu
03-17-2011, 07:05 PM
Sympathy For The Devil, The Rolling Stones - (Looks left, looks right.) Okay, what am I missing here? That was kind of okay, but nothing worth salivating over.

OK, clearly Rain Man shouldn't be running this competition. String him up, fellas.

http://openparachute.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/internetlynchmob.jpg

FWIW, I thought you did pretty well with the rest of your analysis. :thumb:

Baconeater
03-17-2011, 07:06 PM
Sympathy For The Devil, The Rolling Stones - (Looks left, looks right.) Okay, what am I missing here? That was kind of okay, but nothing worth salivating over.

Post #7.

Rain Man
03-17-2011, 07:07 PM
Am I supposed to be on drugs or something? Does that make it all more meaningful?

Bwana
03-17-2011, 07:10 PM
Am I supposed to be on drugs or something? Does that make it all more meaningful?

Well, it would explain your unnatural obsession with Bruce. :evil:

Chiefnj2
03-17-2011, 07:12 PM
Thunder Road - The best Springsteen song. #2 in this heat.
Sympathy for the Devil - the #3 Stones song. #1 in this heat.

The others I'm ambivalent about, except I kind of like Carry on, so that is #3.

patteeu
03-17-2011, 07:14 PM
Thunder Road - The best Springsteen song. #2 in this heat.
Sympathy for the Devil - the #3 Stones song. #1 in this heat.

The others I'm ambivalent about, except I kind of like Carry on, so that is #3.

You fumbled some of the details, but in the end you made the right choices. Good job.

Chiefspants
03-17-2011, 07:26 PM
I am quite surprised that Pigs is not running away with this one.

KurtCobain
03-17-2011, 07:26 PM
I love Rainman's honesty in all this.

patteeu
03-17-2011, 07:29 PM
I love Rainman's honesty in all this.

Yeah, most people would at least pretend to like Sympathy for the Devil just to avoid embarrassment. Rain Man is clearly no slave to pride. :)

ISUJeff
03-17-2011, 07:33 PM
I'm not even a huge stones fan but sympathy deserves serious consideration to win this entire competition, it's that good. Intelligent lyrics from a bunch of stoned rockers, what more could u want?
For the others, voted Pigs bc its underrated and then tough call between Thunderroad and Carry on.
Much tougher choices than most these heats.

Frazod
03-17-2011, 08:08 PM
This one's a no brainer. Wayward Son, Live and Let Die, Sympathy for the Devil.

KurtCobain
03-17-2011, 08:09 PM
Well I just hope you guys don't think I'm crazy but uh
(Tell us, tell us, tell us, tell us)
Ok I will tell you if you don't tell no one else
Think I have a problem and I probably could use help
You know the midnight killer that's been all over TV
I'm not totally sure but I think it could be me
Something happens to me when I'm sleeping in the night
Wake up in my backyard with a shovel and a knife
Filling up a hole again I've dug up 32
I know all my dreams of murder probably all are true

I walk around my neighborhood in my slippers and my sweats
Snoring loud and mumbling steady squeezin necks
Never have to worry about traffic or the cops
All I have to do is stay away from donut shops
I remember napping time in kindegarten class
Wasn't quite a killer yet, I'd only beat some ass
Never very popular most kids would point and stare
That's why I bring the Nyquill and drink that shit right there


The more I think about it all I see that it could be
Everytime I meet a girl and bring her home with me
Wake up in the morning there's no sign of my sweetheart
Yet I see another hole is dug up in my yard
Denny's all night murders, and the Kinko's killing spree
Missing Sunday paper boys I can't believe it's me
I'm the only one from summer camp that made it home
Could this really be what's goin on?
Let me sleep on it


Ride around on possum back and eat with the racoons
Chirpin with the crickets naked underneath the moon
Every morning I wake up and check if I've been gone
Muddy boots, and Steak 'n Shake food wrappers on my lawn
I cannot imagine just to think what I have done
Sat there eating chili fries and slaughtered everyone
Tried to see a hypnotist to get inside my head
But woke up and found that bitch dead

Pablo
03-17-2011, 08:19 PM
Pink Floyd "Pigs" and its not close.This. This. This.

BigMeatballDave
03-17-2011, 08:34 PM
Pink Floyd "Pigs" and its not close.The poll begs to differ.

Rain Man
03-17-2011, 08:35 PM
The poll begs to differ.

In fairness, I think something's wrong with the poll. Thunder Road should be way in the lead. I'm going to have to ask the mods about this.

Bwana
03-17-2011, 08:37 PM
In fairness, I think something's wrong with the poll. Thunder Road should be way in the lead. I'm going to have to ask the mods about this.

I beg to differ. I think there are 13 people hitting the crack pipe! :bong:

RJ
03-17-2011, 08:40 PM
Wow, Springsteen fatigue must have kicked in.


That's a top 5 Springsteen tune, IMO.

Rain Man
03-17-2011, 09:03 PM
That's a top 5 Springsteen tune, IMO.

I think Rolling Stone Magazine put it in the top five rock songs of all time. I don't want to look it up because I don't want to bias my thinking in the Rock N Poll tournament, but I remember seeing it several years ago.

Slainte
03-17-2011, 09:04 PM
Kansas, Pink Floyd, Rolling Stones

cdcox
03-17-2011, 09:08 PM
Great round. I voted for the top 3, but hated not voting for Thunder Road, Pigs, and Ain't That a Shame.

BigMeatballDave
03-17-2011, 09:20 PM
In fairness, I think something's wrong with the poll. Thunder Road should be way in the lead. I'm going to have to ask the mods about this.Bruce can die in a fire :p

Bwana
03-17-2011, 09:24 PM
Bruce can die in a fire :p

:thumb:

Rep!

RJ
03-17-2011, 09:34 PM
I wasn't a Springsteen fan when he first came along. It was a bit too much of a Jersey kind of sound for me. It wasn't until the 90's that I started really appreciating his music. Now I'd say I'm a fan.

My daughter hates cooked carrots. Tonight at dinner, when cooked carrots made an appearance, I told her that she might not like them now but she probably will someday.

Springsteen = cooked carrots for me.

Los Pollos Hermanos
03-18-2011, 05:04 AM
I hate Carry On My Wayward Son and now I hate the 48 people who voted for it.

Sympathy For The Devil should be winning this in a landslide.

mikey23545
03-18-2011, 06:21 AM
That may because Bruce SUCKS? Seriously, **** commie Bruce.

X 10,000

Predarat
03-18-2011, 08:21 AM
Decent pool of song, not as good as the last few though!

Chiefnj2
03-18-2011, 08:26 AM
Carry On beating Sympathy. Wow. Planet music tastes are bizarre.

Los Pollos Hermanos
03-18-2011, 08:50 AM
So, Beast of Burden didn't get nominated and Carry On My Wayward Son gets 57 votes? I hate you people.

Omaha
03-18-2011, 09:11 AM
Duh, it's ChiefsPlanet.

But let's be real - Kansas is AA compared to the Stones. If there's ever a Mount Rushmore of Rock, The Stones should be right alongside the Beatles.

Yeah, the CP Mount Rushmore would have Kansas, Boston, REO Speedwagon, & Metallica. ROFL

Omaha
03-18-2011, 09:13 AM
I hate Carry On My Wayward Son and now I hate the 48 people who voted for it.

Sympathy For The Devil should be winning this in a landslide.

I just repped you so hard I think I pulled something.

Omaha
03-18-2011, 09:17 AM
I love Rainman's honesty in all this.

Welcome back, dude.

Chiefnj2
03-18-2011, 09:33 AM
Yeah, the CP Mount Rushmore would have Kansas, Boston, REO Speedwagon, & Metallica. ROFL

All built on a monument of Appetite for Destruction.

Omaha
03-18-2011, 09:40 AM
Thunder Road, Bruce Springsteen & The E-Street Band - I don't get this one.

Carry On My Wayward Son, Kansas - OK, cool guitar riff, but this song sucks. It just sounds like cheesy, trailer park, "classic" rock to me.

Tribute, Tenacious D. - This is a cool song. Yeah, it's funny, but it's also good. If you have'n heard this CD, get it. You'll laugh your ass off and the music is freaking great.

Pigs, Pink Floyd - The musicianship in the band is incredible, but most of their songs bore me to sleep.

Macy's Day Parade, Green Day - Green Day, like all Pop Punk, sucks balls. Please, Green Day, stop. You're just making yourselves look silly.

Live and Let Die, Sir Paul & Wings - I've listened to this song too many times, but it's a great song. When Paul was on his game, nobody was better. That guy is crazy talented.

Sympathy For The Devil, The Rolling Stones - One of my all-time favorite songs.

Ain't That a Shame, Cheap Trick - I hate Cheap Trick.

Easy vote: Stones, Wings, Tenacious D. The rest are shit, IMHO!

BigMeatballDave
03-18-2011, 10:41 AM
Thunder Road, Bruce Springsteen & The E-Street Band - I don't get this one.

Carry On My Wayward Son, Kansas - OK, cool guitar riff, but this song sucks. It just sounds like cheesy, trailer park, "classic" rock to me.

Tribute, Tenacious D. - This is a cool song. Yeah, it's funny, but it's also good. If you have'n heard this CD, get it. You'll laugh your ass off and the music is freaking great.

Pigs, Pink Floyd - The musicianship in the band is incredible, but most of their songs bore me to sleep.

Macy's Day Parade, Green Day - Green Day, like all Pop Punk, sucks balls. Please, Green Day, stop. You're just making yourselves look silly.

Live and Let Die, Sir Paul & Wings - I've listened to this song too many times, but it's a great song. When Paul was on his game, nobody was better. That guy is crazy talented.

Sympathy For The Devil, The Rolling Stones - One of my all-time favorite songs.

Ain't That a Shame, Cheap Trick - I hate Cheap Trick.

Easy vote: Stones, Wings, Tenacious D. The rest are shit, IMHO!You like intercourse with Skeletons

Bump
03-18-2011, 11:03 AM
where is Bugeater with his usual "Gosh damn it, I fucking hate Sympathy for the Devil, if it advances I'm gonna cry"

DJ's left nut
03-18-2011, 11:06 AM
Tribute, Tenacious D. - This is a cool song. Yeah, it's funny, but it's also good. If you have'n heard this CD, get it. You'll laugh your ass off and the music is freaking great.

Sympathy For The Devil, The Rolling Stones - One of my all-time favorite songs.


Pick the best song in the world...or I'll eat your souls.

Reaper16
03-18-2011, 11:41 AM
Thunder Road, Bruce Springsteen & The E-Street Band - Obvious #1 vote. One of the best rock songs of all time, and shame on anyone who didn't vote for it. Even if you're not a Springsteen fan, how can you not be a fan of this song about escaping your hard life and seeking redemption on the open road with a woman at your side? Listen to it, people! Listen to it!

Do you really want to know why, Rain Man? Here is my honest answer: except in the rarest of circumstances, I could not care less about a song's lyrics. When I want moving, inspirational words I read fucking literature. When I listen to music, I listen for the music.

As for my votes in this heat:
KCUnited has it exactly right (as usual). Pink Floyd's "Pigs" is the best song (and it even has good lyrics, too, if you're the kind of simpleton who listens to songs primarily for their lyrics [read: all Springsteen fans ever] ) in this heat, and it is so by a fairly wide margin.

My second vote goes to "Carry On My Wayward Son." Classic proggish rocker.

My third vote goes to "Symp"... nah, screw it. "Tribute" is too enjoyable not to vote for.

Halfcan
03-18-2011, 12:03 PM
Look at these lyrics:



Historical references abound! Samba Music! Cool Guitar noises!

This song just kicks immense amounts of ass.

I am reading Keith Richards book-Life

It is a MUST read for any Rock fan. The ins and outs of recording Sympathy is in there as well.

Mick wrote this in 45 minutes.

DJ's left nut
03-18-2011, 12:15 PM
Do you really want to know why, Rain Man? Here is my honest answer: except in the rarest of circumstances, I could not care less about a song's lyrics. When I want moving, inspirational words I read ****ing literature. When I listen to music, I listen for the music.



So you place no value in songwriting?

I don't demand to be told a story or anything, but the ability to write lyrics is absolutely a skill and a very difficult one at that.

I just don't understand how you can simply remove that element when discussing the quality of a song. It's like ignoring the presentation of food when you're judging it. Oh sure, perhaps the presentation isn't the most important part (if it were, just imagine the shit a Springsteen fan would eat), but it's absolutely relevant to the quality of the product being judged.

Chiefnj2
03-18-2011, 12:21 PM
Do you really want to know why, Rain Man? Here is my honest answer: except in the rarest of circumstances, I could not care less about a song's lyrics. When I want moving, inspirational words I read ****ing literature. When I listen to music, I listen for the music.
.

So, you enjoy Rebecca Black - afterwards its Sunday ...

patteeu
03-18-2011, 12:25 PM
Lyrics don't usually matter to me much either. To me, the voice is just another instrument in the band and the overall musical effect is what matters.

But Thunder Road is a Springsteen song where the vocals are a positive part of the music. I don't really even know what the song is about except rolling down the window as you drive down thunder road. I like how the song builds and the vocals build along with the music and I like the melody.

Rain Man
03-18-2011, 01:05 PM
Do you really want to know why, Rain Man? Here is my honest answer: except in the rarest of circumstances, I could not care less about a song's lyrics. When I want moving, inspirational words I read ****ing literature. When I listen to music, I listen for the music.


That's an interesting point, because while I really enjoy Springsteen's music, I think the lyrics are probably the more powerful of the two. I'd put Springsteen at 70 percent lyrical value/ 30 percent musical value. That's not to say the musical value is bad at all, though, because I really like their use of less typical rock instruments like the organ and accordion and saxophone. But yeah, if you're not into the story at all, then I can see how your grade of Springsteen would be much lower.

That said, I think their music is still better than those of the hair bands. :thumb:

I'm a fan of some groups more for their lyrics (Simon and Garfunkel, Indigo Girls, etc.) and I have some groups where the lyrics aren't spectacular, but the music is really good (Proclaimers, Cowboy Mouth, etc.) But if I don't like both, I don't listen to the group. I think with a few, like Springsteen and Ben Folds, I like both the lyrics and the music a lot, which is why they're tops on my list.

DJ's left nut
03-18-2011, 01:15 PM
But now we're getting into purely personal taste, no?

For instance, I'm going to watch Top Gun before I watch Gone With the Wind. If Major League and Citizen Kane are on at the same time, I'm watching Major League.

That said, I'd never even begin to consider Top Gun or Major League among the best films of all time; they clearly aren't. I'd say they are more entertaining to me, but I certainly couldn't say they're better movies.

Back to the food analogy, I'd take a bloody cheeseburger over most any french cuisine I could be offered, but I'd know for sure that the french cuisine was simply done better by a far more skilled artist.

So when you're judging 'better songs', you absolutely have to consider things like lyrics and music. So when people say "I don't care about the lyrics therefore Dust in the Wind is a better song than Sympathy" I have to question what they're looking at.

(All of this comes with the caveat that I know I've thrown votes away on things like Tribute over Pigs, but it's the first round and I'll do what I want. And I generally admit it when I know I'm voting for mindless tripe)

Rain Man
03-18-2011, 01:18 PM
And by the way, this heat will remain open until Thunder Road wins.

Omaha
03-18-2011, 01:47 PM
So you place no value in songwriting?

I don't demand to be told a story or anything, but the ability to write lyrics is absolutely a skill and a very difficult one at that.

I just don't understand how you can simply remove that element when discussing the quality of a song. It's like ignoring the presentation of food when you're judging it. Oh sure, perhaps the presentation isn't the most important part (if it were, just imagine the shit a Springsteen fan would eat), but it's absolutely relevant to the quality of the product being judged.

The lyrics are absolutely important to the song. Shitty lyrics will ruin an otherwise great song.

patteeu
03-18-2011, 01:53 PM
The lyrics are absolutely important to the song. Shitty lyrics will ruin an otherwise great song.

Agreed, that's why Bloodhound Gang's Fire Water Burn is such a great song:

...

Yo yo this hard-core ghetto gangster image takes a lot of practice,
I'm not black like Barry White no I am white like Frank Black is,

...

I'll spend my days with J.F.K., Marvin Gaye, Martha Raye, and Lawrence Welk,
And Kurt Cobain, Kojak, Mark Twain and Jimi Hendrix's poltergeist,
And Webster yeah Emmanuel Lewis cause he's the anti-christ,

...

Reaper16
03-18-2011, 02:59 PM
Great lyrics can elevate a song. Terrible lyrics can bring a song down. 90% of songs out there fall into some middle-range w/r/t their lyrics where the lyrics don't make the song better or worse.

DJ -- songwriting is something that I place the utmost importance in. The writing of lyrics is something that is pretty much independent of songwriting. The entire word 'lyric' comes from poetry (later associates strongly with a poetic form that was sung w/ accompaniment from a lyre). The lyric and the music have always been two separate things.

If lyrics were so bloody important, then how does one evaluate instrumental music? How about music sung in languages that you don't understand? Do the lyric-backers not consider these things proper songs? For any song in this entire competition, it would be useful to ask yourself: would a hypothetical person who does not understand English, but really loves rock music, think that the given song is great?

Reaper16
03-18-2011, 03:00 PM
I should add that my I do care more about lyrics when it's clear that the artist means to feature them. For Springsteen, you absolutely have to consider his lyrics. They are important to his artistic project. The same thinking applies to pretty much all of the hip-hop genre.

Rain Man
03-18-2011, 03:06 PM
...

If lyrics were so bloody important, then how does one evaluate instrumental music? How about music sung in languages that you don't understand? Do the lyric-backers not consider these things proper songs? For any song in this entire competition, it would be useful to ask yourself: would a hypothetical person who does not understand English, but really loves rock music, think that the given song is great?

I'm actually not a huge fan of instrumental music, other than classical. I remember talking to a guy who was a semi-pro jazz musician getting mad at me because I said I have trouble enjoying a song with no lyrics. (In fairness, he got mad at lots of things all the time.) But to me it's only half the story if you just have instrumentals.

I don't know why classical gets a pass, but it does, and it's not just being snobby. I think perhaps because it's more complex to start with, and I like trying to pick out individual instruments.

Maybe that's it. With classical music there are many instruments and sounds to keep me interested, and with vocals I've got the story, but a three-instrument piece has neither.

Reaper16
03-18-2011, 03:09 PM
I'm actually not a huge fan of instrumental music, other than classical. I remember talking to a guy who was a semi-pro jazz musician getting mad at me because I said I have trouble enjoying a song with no lyrics. (In fairness, he got mad at lots of things all the time.) But to me it's only half the story if you just have instrumentals.

I don't know why classical gets a pass, but it does, and it's not just being snobby. I think perhaps because it's more complex to start with, and I like trying to pick out individual instruments.

Maybe that's it. With classical music there are many instruments and sounds to keep me interested, and with vocals I've got the story, but a three-instrument piece has neither.
1.) You say you favor complexity, yet you can't find a good word to say about Pink Floyd's complex rock music. Hmmmm.

2.) You should probably read books. I think you'd like them.

Rain Man
03-18-2011, 03:12 PM
1.) You say you favor complexity, yet you can't find a good word to say about Pink Floyd's complex rock music. Hmmmm.

2.) You should probably read books. I think you'd like them.


1) But they're boring. Complex and boring doesn't work.

2) Books have lyrics, but they don't have music. And the lyrics don't rhyme at all.

Omaha
03-18-2011, 03:13 PM
Great lyrics can elevate a song. Terrible lyrics can bring a song down. 90% of songs out there fall into some middle-range w/r/t their lyrics where the lyrics don't make the song better or worse.

DJ -- songwriting is something that I place the utmost importance in. The writing of lyrics is something that is pretty much independent of songwriting. The entire word 'lyric' comes from poetry (later associates strongly with a poetic form that was sung w/ accompaniment from a lyre). The lyric and the music have always been two separate things.

If lyrics were so bloody important, then how does one evaluate instrumental music? How about music sung in languages that you don't understand? Do the lyric-backers not consider these things proper songs? For any song in this entire competition, it would be useful to ask yourself: would a hypothetical person who does not understand English, but really loves rock music, think that the given song is great?

Adam Duritz recently wrote about songwriting and he ripped into another writer for suggesting that lyrics were similar to poetry & that music & lyrics are separate things. His point was that songwriting was one thing & poetry was a completely different art form. I'm sure other songwriters might disagree, but I completely see his point.

As for foreign lyrics, I get your point. I can hear a song where lyrics are in another language & appreciate parts of it, but I'll never fully appreciate the song as a whole if I can't understand the lyrics. That songs that I feel are truly great and classic songs are great as a whole. Someone posted in one of these threads that he didn't like grunge because many of the songs were about drug abuse and he couldn't relate. I get that 100%, too.

DJ's left nut
03-18-2011, 03:45 PM
If lyrics were so bloody important, then how does one evaluate instrumental music? How about music sung in languages that you don't understand? Do the lyric-backers not consider these things proper songs? For any song in this entire competition, it would be useful to ask yourself: would a hypothetical person who does not understand English, but really loves rock music, think that the given song is great?

Hey, I voted for a pure instrumental (Fire on High from ELO), so I know that lyrics aren't a pre-requisite to a good song.

But if they're in there, they have to be considered. If you're going to write a song and include words in it, those words should be considered and compared to similarly situated songs, IMO.

If the song is in a language you don't understand, you ought not be evaluating its quality. A hypothetical person that doesn't speak english might be qualified to speak to the beat or perhaps even the overall 'listenability' of a tune, but not its greatness.

If a song is poetry set to music, the poem matters.

Rain Man
03-18-2011, 03:56 PM
I'm not into foreign music because of the lyrics thing, but having said that, The Duhks have a great French language song called Du Temps Que J'etais Jeune. I wish I could find it online to link, but it's a fun song to hear. I have no idea what they're singing about.

Reaper16
03-18-2011, 04:08 PM
If the song is in a language you don't understand, you ought not be evaluating its quality. A hypothetical person that doesn't speak english might be qualified to speak to the beat or perhaps even the overall 'listenability' of a tune, but not its greatness.

If a song is poetry set to music, the poem matters.
It isn't a poem. Also, I will forever disagree with you about this because you are wrong.

Rain Man
03-19-2011, 11:13 AM
Shutting it down. The three advancers are:


Carry On My Wayward Son
Live and Let Die
Sympathy for the Devil
Thunder Road


(C'mon, no one notice, no one notice...)

Bwana
03-19-2011, 11:15 AM
Shutting it down. The three advancers are:


Carry On My Wayward Son
Live and Let Die
Sympathy for the Devil
Thunder Road




LMAO

Frazod
03-19-2011, 12:42 PM
I thought Thunder Road was a Garth Brooks song.




















:fire:

Rausch
03-19-2011, 12:47 PM
Almost there, almost there.

Got some heavyweight boxing going on in this heat.

I feel a great injustice has been done.

Are we talking about Pigs On The Wing (Part One,) Pigs (Three Different Ones,) or Pigs On The Wing?...

patteeu
03-19-2011, 01:00 PM
I feel a great injustice has been done.

Are we talking about Pigs On The Wing (Part One,) Pigs (Three Different Ones,) or Pigs On The Wing?...

It doesn't matter. They're all headed for the meat locker. :)