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View Full Version : Sac's 2011 Chief's Draft Grades


Saccopoo
05-01-2011, 01:01 PM
1. Jon Baldwin: A
- 6'5", 230 lbs. 4.49 40. 42" vertical. 10'9" broad jump.
Those numbers/measurables are absolutely ridiculous. Has very good hands, catches the ball away from the body and is very good running after the catch. I was fine with the Chiefs selecting him at #21, but to pick up an extra third rounder and still get him? Fantastic. And he doesn't have to be "the guy" with Bowe on the team.

2. Rod Hudson: A
- Has been absolutely dominant in college: Two time first team All-American. Three time first team All-conference. First team freshman All-American. Only gave up two sacks and, remarkably, only four penalties in his entire four years as a starter. Unbelievable. IMO, the best offensive lineman in this draft. Should excel in Haley's zone scheme. Played center in high school and was slated to start at left tackle as a sophomore at FSU before injuries and youth forced him back inside. Very strong and plays with great leverage.

3. Justin Houston: B
- A lot of Planeteers would have been happy if Houston was the Chiefs first round pick. To get a guy like this in the third? Ridiculous! Big, fast and athletic. Had a suspension in 2009 for violating a school substance abuse policy and rumored to have tested positive at the Combine. Has also been on the school's honor roll academically. There's some risk here, but if he gets straightened out, he's got the potential to be a beast in this system.

3. Allen Bailey: B
- An athletic freak of nature who, at 285 lbs., runs a 4.71 40 yard dash. Could potentially play a lot of positions for the Chiefs (OLB, DE, ILB). I was shocked he didn't go earlier to some of the 4-3 teams as a rush end. It will be interesting to see what the Chiefs end up doing with Bailey, but, like Houston, he's huge and fast and athletic with excellent burst and finishes plays with a little nastiness. Hits like a truck.

4. Jalil Brown: B
- Good measurables, proto-type size and a very solid character. The Chiefs don't have any depth at corner beyond Flowers, Carr and Arenas, so this pick does fill a need. Brown plays long and is pretty fluid.

5. Ricky Stanzi: A
- I really like this pick. Stanzi has excellent size and had a very good senior season where he set a school record for passing efficiency. He's been a winner (26-9 career record as a starter) in a tough conference. Winner of three post-season bowl games. Comes out of a pro-style set and will get good coaching under Zorn and Haley. I think he's got a chance to be a very good pro player and it wouldn't surprised me to see him take over as the starter sooner rather than later.

5. Gabe Miller: D
- I just don't get this pick. He looks to be a clone of Studebaker (the exact same size, same athleticism, etc.), and they picked up Houston in round three. If Sheffield can't play because of the injury in the pre-season last year, it's a better pick but still looks to be a reach. I'd have rather have seen Jason Pinkston, OT; Pittsburgh or Tyler Sash, S; Iowa with this pick.

6. Jerrell Powe: A
- Many of us would have been happy with him in the third round. The team needed a true NT, and got one in the Land Shark. A massive and strong guy with huge legs, he's the run plugging, two gap, bull rushing space eater that the chiefs need for their 3-4 defense. Two thumbs up to Pioli and Co. for having the balls to sit on this guy until the sixth round.

7. Shane Bannon: C
- 6'1", 270 lbs. and runs a 4.69 40? And he went to Yale? Seeing as how bad our tackles are with their pass blocking, I'll take a guy like this in the backfield.

crossbow
05-01-2011, 02:19 PM
Pioli's scouting team really did their homework. They projected what players they could get and about what round they would fall to. Except for the Gabe Miller pick, the entire draft was golden. And yeah, an RT would have been a better choice at round 5 but they may upgrade through free agency or find a sleeper that wasn't drafted.

PGM
05-01-2011, 02:24 PM
Nice grades and breakdowns Sac.

DeezNutz
05-01-2011, 02:54 PM
Sac coming in with some accurate and strong analysis.

notorious
05-01-2011, 05:22 PM
Gabe Miller is an F, but I hope my opinion is CoMoed.

KurtCobain
05-01-2011, 05:28 PM
I know it's a dead horse, but I was ok with no RT pick because I think we shoot of Gaither.

SNR
05-01-2011, 05:31 PM
I'm honestly not too worried about not taking OT in the draft. If there's a season, there will be some semblance of a free agency period. Shouldn't be too hard to at the very least grab some depth. Or even find a veteran. Preferably NOT from the Patriots. The last one we picked up was even worse than Barry Richardson

eazyb81
05-01-2011, 05:48 PM
Miller doesnt have the production, but his combine numbers and measurables are very similar to Houston and other top rush backers.

Developmental guy for sure, but he has some athletic ability to work with.

Agree on Stanzi - I think he could challenge for the starting gig as early as next season. He has everything you look for in a QB for this system.

Direckshun
05-01-2011, 05:55 PM
Love the work you've done all draft season, Sac.

Stick around for a few years. You've got high upside.

'Hamas' Jenkins
05-01-2011, 06:05 PM
Miller doesnt have the production, but his combine numbers and measurables are very similar to Houston and other top rush backers.

Developmental guy for sure, but he has some athletic ability to work with.

Agree on Stanzi - I think he could challenge for the starting gig as early as next season. He has everything you look for in a QB for this system.

Miller is basically Brian Johnston without any of the college production.

milkman
05-01-2011, 06:30 PM
I know it's a dead horse, but I was ok with no RT pick because I think we shoot of Gaither.

I hate to agree with sac on anything, but I think he's right about Ryan Harris.

He's the guy we should target, as he's a perfect fit for this scheme.

If Tyson Clabo is a RFA, then Harris is my #1 choice.

the Talking Can
05-01-2011, 06:48 PM
pretty much agree, though i think houston is A based on the round


interesting thing about the draft is twice teams traded in front of us to draft tackles...in the 3rd it was Jah Reid, and i bet we were going to take him...i think the team had a tackle as a priority but simply refused to move off their draft board for need...and thank god

lot easier to find RTs in the draft or FA than pass rushing 3-4 backers with Houston's talent...


and i like stanzi in the 5th....that's the right place, and he's got some legit developmental potential

philfree
05-01-2011, 07:06 PM
pretty much agree, though i think houston is A based on the round
interesting thing about the draft is twice teams traded in front of us to draft tackles...in the 3rd it was Jah Reid, and i bet we were going to take him...i think the team had a tackle as a priority but simply refused to move off their draft board for need...and thank god

lot easier to find RTs in the draft or FA than pass rushing 3-4 backers with Houston's talent...


and i like stanzi in the 5th....that's the right place, and he's got some legit developmental potential

I agree and I imagine he'll have a small chip on his shoulder since he slipped all the way to the 3rd round. He'll be out to prove that teams made a mistake by passing on him.

Our first three picks filled needs so well that when combined they equal an A+. Add in Stanzi and then Powe two more As and it's an A+ draft.

PhilFree:arrow:

PhillyChiefFan
05-02-2011, 04:59 AM
A lot of the draft analysts are giving us a B or a C that I saw. I believe we had a great draft, and are building the foundation for a great team for years to come.

Most of the these guys can fill a starting role, or provide breathing room as backups. I'm excited to see what some of these guys can do.

I wanted to draft a WR, C, NT, OLB, and a QB, and we got just that and then some without reaching. I just hope we have a season next year...

PhillyChiefFan
05-02-2011, 05:02 AM
I agree and I imagine he'll have a small chip on his shoulder since he slipped all the way to the 3rd round.

I think so too, the guy was pretty much a sure fire 1st rounder and slipped. I hope it gives him a mean streak and puts a fire under his ass.

Hali, Houston, Berry, Lewis, Powe, Dorsey...all coached by Crennel...our defense is going to be nasty.

MahiMike
05-02-2011, 05:16 PM
Before the draft I wanted 'guys up the middle' G,C,NT, LB. That's why I was high on Pouncey as opposed to a tackle. Hudson is an excellent choice. Maybe even the FB works out and we can actually go up the gut on 3rd and 1 now.

Mr. Laz
05-02-2011, 05:49 PM
it's going to be interesting to see what position they put some of these guys at

Pestilence
05-02-2011, 05:57 PM
it's going to be interesting to see what position they put some of these guys at

My guess minus the obvious ones:

Hudson : Center
Houston: SOLB - Vrabels spot
Bailey: DE

BossChief
05-04-2011, 09:22 AM
My fear with this class is that we will let Carr walk after this season similarly to how NE let Asante Samuel walk a few years back as i see Jalil as a guy that has starters potential. Same fear for Hali/Houston and Baldwin/Bowe.

If we retain our kids long term and add this crop, we should be able to have a chance against almost anyone.

Tribal Warfare
05-04-2011, 10:18 AM
My fear with this class is that we will let Carr walk after this season similarly to how NE let Asante Samuel walk a few years back as i see Jalil as a guy that has starters potential. Same fear for Hali/Houston and Baldwin/Bowe.

If we retain our kids long term and add this crop, we should be able to have a chance against almost anyone.

That's kind of the point of drafting, where you can reload at certain positions of value without being gouged in FA( if there is one)

Pawnmower
05-04-2011, 10:48 AM
thanks for posting this, nice read

SNR
05-04-2011, 11:18 AM
My fear with this class is that we will let Carr walk after this season similarly to how NE let Asante Samuel walk a few years back as i see Jalil as a guy that has starters potential. Same fear for Hali/Houston and Baldwin/Bowe.

If we retain our kids long term and add this crop, we should be able to have a chance against almost anyone.We're not going to lose all three guys. Especially not Bowe.

Wilson8
05-04-2011, 10:49 PM
Sac,
Good evaluation. I also enjoy reading your posts.

The trade down in the 1st was great but I was really surprised with Jonathan Baldwin in the 1st. I thought Pioli would go OT with Carimi or Sherrod. Not that it was the most important need but I thought it was the safest pick and the one with the best value.

Actually after thinking about it, I'm pleased with the Baldwin pick. We really needed the WR position and it showed that Pioli could go outside his comfort zone and pick a player the team really needed.

The thing I like best about the draft is KC addressed so many of their needs, WR, Center, OLB, DL, DB, QB, NT, and FB. What I did not like was no OT. I hope that need is addressed with free agency.

There are still some good CFAs to be picked up but not so much at the OT position.

Saccopoo
05-04-2011, 11:44 PM
Sac,
Good evaluation. I also enjoy reading your posts.

The trade down in the 1st was great but I was really surprised with Jonathan Baldwin in the 1st. I thought Pioli would go OT with Carimi or Sherrod. Not that it was the most important need but I thought it was the safest pick and the one with the best value.

There is two players I'm going to keep a close eye on the next decade, and that's Aaron Curry and Tony Castonzo.

Berry over Okung is a viable and understandable pick. The safety position was the worst on the team and Berry was considered a generational level talent.

Jackson over Curry is borderline delusional, even if we traded that second rounder for Cassel and Vrabel. Vrabel was coming into his 13th NFL season at that point and we literally had nothing on the roster at that point in terms of viable linebackers. (Remember, Johnson was benched and Mays and Williams looked like the Keystone Cops out there.)

Castonzo was, perhaps, the best zone tackle in this draft and we needed one based on the production of both our tackles at that point. Getting Baldwin and Houston for that pick was huge, but both have question marks. It was a gamble. If Pioli hits seven or eleven on that pick(s), it's brilliant. Castonzo, with Manning at QB, is going to look All-Pro from the get go.

Right now, I absolutely think Pioli did the right thing by getting both Baldwin and Houston. Especially considering the amount of offensive tackle talent that will be available in the draft next year. Kalil, Potter, Reynolds, etc., all are better than the best in this last draft. Chiefs, regardless of where they pick, will potentially have a top flight tackle talent available to them in the 2012 draft.

I also think that Jackson is going to have a very big year in 2011 and put to rest a lot of the naysayers concerns.

At this point, it looks like Pioli has done okay.

kcbubb
05-05-2011, 02:31 PM
Has anyone done the math on the trade chart to see if we matched the chart? Other trades for that matter? I wonder if teams are following it. I have always thought the trade chart was stupid. Every year is different and you have to account for who you are getting with what pick and account for who you might be available later.

keg in kc
05-05-2011, 02:40 PM
There is two players I'm going to keep a close eye on the next decade, and that's Aaron Curry and Tony Castonzo.

Berry over Okung is a viable and understandable pick. The safety position was the worst on the team and Berry was considered a generational level talent.

Jackson over Curry is borderline delusional, even if we traded that second rounder for Cassel and Vrabel. Vrabel was coming into his 13th NFL season at that point and we literally had nothing on the roster at that point in terms of viable linebackers. (Remember, Johnson was benched and Mays and Williams looked like the Keystone Cops out there.) I'd say it's Raji and not Curry who you should keep an eye on there.

Wilson8
05-05-2011, 07:50 PM
Has anyone done the math on the trade chart to see if we matched the chart? Other trades for that matter? I wonder if teams are following it. I have always thought the trade chart was stupid. Every year is different and you have to account for who you are getting with what pick and account for who you might be available later.

By Mike Sando
A few thoughts after using the widely circulated draft-value chart to evaluate the 18 trades involving only 2011 choices during the recently completed NFL draft:

Some teams use their own charts reflecting different values for the selections. The trades themselves define actual values, of course. The chart serves only as a point of reference.

The Cleveland Browns' big trade with the Atlanta Falcons does not appear here because it also included 2012 considerations.

Once the Browns moved down from No. 6 to No. 27, the value chart says they paid a 120-point premium to move back up to No. 21 in a deal with Kansas City. That was the largest gross discrepancy among qualifying trades. What does 120 points represent? The chart values the 95th overall selection, three spots from the bottom of the third round, as worth that much.

The chart says Jacksonville overpaid by 110 points in moving up from the 16th to 10th choice to select Blaine Gabbert. The difference is inconsequential if Gabbert becomes a good quarterback. And history says the Jaguars fared OK in sending the 16th and 49th picks to the Redskins for No. 10. In 2000, the New York Jets sent the 16th and 48th picks to San Francisco for the 12th pick (used for Julian Peterson). The Jaguars gained an additional two spots in the first round for essentially the same price.

The value chart is arguably outdated, particularly near the top of the draft, but most of the trades line up pretty evenly. In some cases, teams are willing to pay a premium for a shot at landing players they consider worth the additional price.

The chart breaks out the trades, with point valuations in parenthesis. For example, the Browns sent the 27th and 70th picks, valued at 920 points, to Kansas City for the 21st pick, valued at 800 points. The 120-point differential shows up in the right column.

Go to this link to see the chart...

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/37597/which-teams-won-draft-day-trades

milkman
05-06-2011, 07:20 AM
I'd say it's Raji and not Curry who you should keep an eye on there.

That was what I was going to say.

keg in kc
05-06-2011, 12:09 PM
That was what I was going to say.I didn't/don't want to get into the whole argument of Curry's value again, I was never a fan of his obviously, but the simple truth is that linebackers are easier to find, and easier to integrate, than nose tackles are. As our roster right now pretty clearly demonstrates. Raji would have so much value on this team right now.

(I say that as someone who was also against picking him at the time for the drug and motivation red flags he carried coming in. I was almost as much against Raji as I was against Curry...)

Sweet Daddy Hate
05-06-2011, 09:00 PM
Will Poe or Bailey have any possibility at NT?

doomy3
05-06-2011, 09:18 PM
Will Poe or Bailey have any possibility at NT?

Powe is a nose tackle. Bailey is a defensive end.

JASONSAUTO
05-06-2011, 09:22 PM
Powe and raji could have been a great rotation at nose
Posted via Mobile Device

BossChief
05-06-2011, 09:23 PM
Will Poe or Bailey have any possibility at NT?

"Pow" was a borderline dominant player on ole' miss DL a year ago playing a very similar role to a 3-4 NT...last year they tried to make him a gap shooting 3-tech and it was shown to not be his strength as a player. IMO, if could he read and played last year in a similar role as the previous one, he would have been a borderline first round quality prospect in this last draft.

He should blossom into a stout NT under this coaching staff that should help open up the defense in time. The linebackers should be able to roam and make plays with less responsibilities in run support, same goes for the safeties. It should also help us get to the passer more on blitzes as well...of course, that's if he can learn what teams are trying to do to him through lots of study and work. I don't think he is stupid one bit, just has a disability that prohibits him from learning things the conventional ways...I think Crennel will make him into one of the better nts in the league within two years...but we have to keep realistic expectations for him though...he isn't even close to the type of talent a guy like Suh is...he will take some time to acclimate to the speed and strength of the league and may get pushed around a bit the first year, but that will happen less and less as time passes and he learns.

I think Bailey bounces positions over the first two years until he settles in as a big run stuffing lib for us ala Kirkland of pittsburgh a few years back...he has the strength, speed and plenty of size to do this extremely well.

As a prospect to play the nose on a team coached by Haley?

No way.

He would need to bulk up at least 30 pounds and probably more...with Haleys emphasis on stamina and being at playing weight to even be able to practice, I doubt he drafted the kid with that in mind at all.

Just the way I see it, could be way off...but I doubt it.

BossChief
05-06-2011, 09:25 PM
Powe and raji could have been a great rotation at nose
Posted via Mobile Device

How about "toiletbrush" and Hali?

keg in kc
05-06-2011, 09:28 PM
I think the only way you see Bailey at nose is if he busts out everywhere else they try him. Although who knows what their plans are.