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View Full Version : Obama CBO report shows debt would be unsustainable even with Clinton-era tax revenue


HonestChieffan
06-24-2011, 02:40 PM
For the morons who think tax increases will cure all ills....


Earlier, Conn Carroll posted a chart from the Congressional Budget Office that clearly shows spending, not insufficient tax revenue, is the driver of our long-term debt problems. But using CBO data, we can go a bit further. It turns out that even if we brought tax revenues back to the historically high levels that existed at the end of the Clinton era, we'd still wind up with unsustainable deficits using the White House's own definition of "sustainable."

In 2000, the last full-year of President Clinton's administration, tax revenues were 20.6 percent of GDP, according to the CBO. (The White House Office of Management and Budget puts it slightly higher, at 20.9 percent, which places it in a tie with 1944 for the highest ever level in U.S. history). But the CBO's long-term fiscal outlook released yesterday predicts that by 2035, total spending will reach a stunning 33.9 percent of GDP if lawmakers pursue their predictable course. That means even if revenues returned to the coveted pre-Bush tax cut levels, there would be a 13 percent difference.

Yet President Obama's former OMB director Peter Orszag has written that, "a sustainable level is more like 3 percent (of GDP) or lower." So that would put the deficits, even with Clinton-era revenues, at more than four times their sustainable levels.

So let's be clear: when Democrats talk about revenues needing to be part of the solution, for them to really be part of the solution, taxes as a proportion of the economy would have to exceed record levels. And not just marginally, but by a substantial degree.

The chart mentioned above:http://washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/2011/06/charticle-we-have-spending-problem-not-revenue-problem

http://washingtonexaminer.com/files/blog_images/CBO%20spending%20chart.png

Read more at the Washington Examiner: http://washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/2011/06/cbo-report-shows-debt-would-be-unsustainable-even-clinton-era-tax?utm_source=feedburner+BeltwayConfidential&utm_medium=feed+Beltway+Confidential&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+BeltwayConfidential+%28Beltway+Confidential%29feed&utm_content=feed&utm_term=feed#ixzz1QDxMzPkM

The Mad Crapper
06-24-2011, 03:10 PM
afor them to really be part of the solution, taxes as a proportion of the economy would have to exceed record levels. And not just marginally, but by a substantial degree.

Well yeah, that's the moonbats endgame--- total confiscation of wealth. It didn't work in East Germany, but they didn't have Obama.

:thumb:

go bowe
06-24-2011, 03:12 PM
* * *
...by 2035, total spending will reach a stunning 33.9 percent of GDP if lawmakers pursue their predictable course. That means even if revenues returned to the coveted pre-Bush tax cut levels, there would be a 13 percent difference.
* * *
So let's be clear: when Democrats talk about revenues needing to be part of the solution, for them to really be part of the solution, taxes as a proportion of the economy would have to exceed record levels. And not just marginally, but by a substantial degree.
* * *

ok, let's see...

if a return to the coveted pre-bush tax cut levels would reduce the share from 33.9% to just 13%, doesn't that mean that increasing revenues (tax increases) would make more of a dent in the deficit than spending cuts would?

iow, it would only take 13% in spending cuts to get us to a balanced budget?

am i getting this right?

seems like tax increases can be a very large proportion of reducing the deficit, which make them really a part of the solution...

FD
06-24-2011, 03:18 PM
Tax increases are an inevitable part of any solution to our debt problems, there is simply no way out of the hole we're in that doesn't involve them.

The Mad Crapper
06-24-2011, 03:21 PM
Tax increases are an inevitable part of any solution to our debt problems, there is simply no way out of the hole we're in that doesn't involve them.

Well of course. That was Obuttocks whole strategy when he blew the $700 billion back in 2009.

I gotta admit it, a part of me wants to see him get re-elected. I've often wondered what it would be like to see everybody eating dogfood. And let's face it, at least 53% will deserve it. :thumb:

HonestChieffan
06-24-2011, 03:41 PM
If we took %'s to the bank, this would be so simple.

petegz28
06-24-2011, 03:47 PM
Tax increases are an inevitable part of any solution to our debt problems, there is simply no way out of the hole we're in that doesn't involve them.

First off that is bogus...

It's not the amount of taxes being paid, it is the amount of people paying taxes.

Roughly 50% get off without paying any federal tax every year. Couple that with the high unemployment levels and you have a revenue problem.

First things first, quit trying to squeeze more and more money out of a shrinking worker base. Increase jobs then you will increase tax revenues.

Secondly, lower taxes across the board and yank the loopholes and tax breaks for things like kids, etc. I know 2 women who literally get returns that were more than what was initially taken out of their checks simply because they had kids.

Anyhow, that is where it has to start. All this talk about raising taxes and such is hollow jibberish otherwise.

FD
06-24-2011, 03:59 PM
First off that is bogus...

It's not the amount of taxes being paid, it is the amount of people paying taxes.

Roughly 50% get off without paying any federal tax every year. Couple that with the high unemployment levels and you have a revenue problem.

First things first, quit trying to squeeze more and more money out of a shrinking worker base. Increase jobs then you will increase tax revenues.

Secondly, lower taxes across the board and yank the loopholes and tax breaks for things like kids, etc. I know 2 women who literally get returns that were more than what was initially taken out of their checks simply because they had kids.

Anyhow, that is where it has to start. All this talk about raising taxes and such is hollow jibberish otherwise.

I agree that a good reform should lower rates and broaden the base, I'm just making the point that ultimately any reform that helps us solve our debt problems also has to be revenue increasing. There are not enough politically feasible spending cuts to solve the problem just on that side of the ledger.

BucEyedPea
06-24-2011, 04:10 PM
There are not enough politically feasible spending cuts to solve the problem just on that side of the ledger.

Obviously that's a matter of opinion and values. There's plenty I could cut. This argument's been had before and yet govt has still grown with all it's programs and spending.

Hydrae
06-24-2011, 04:17 PM
Will someone, either party, step up and be the daddy and shut the wallet and tell the kids that their allowance went bye-bye?

HonestChieffan
06-24-2011, 04:17 PM
I agree that a good reform should lower rates and broaden the base, I'm just making the point that ultimately any reform that helps us solve our debt problems also has to be revenue increasing. There are not enough politically feasible spending cuts to solve the problem just on that side of the ledger.


and revenue increasing is "raising taxes"?

FD
06-24-2011, 06:25 PM
and revenue increasing is "raising taxes"?

In the counterfactual sense, yes.

petegz28
06-24-2011, 06:53 PM
I agree that a good reform should lower rates and broaden the base, I'm just making the point that ultimately any reform that helps us solve our debt problems also has to be revenue increasing. There are not enough politically feasible spending cuts to solve the problem just on that side of the ledger.

I agree that revenue has to increase. It's the method of increasing it that I am disagreeing with the Left on.

4th and Long
06-24-2011, 07:08 PM
In other words, Bush dug a hole so deep, we'll never be able to climb out of it.
Posted via Mobile Device

Simplex3
06-24-2011, 07:46 PM
In other words, Bush dug a hole so deep, we'll never be able to climb out of it.
Posted via Mobile Device

We've been digging this hole since the war on poverty and the great society. The last two guys have just had much bigger and better shovels.

HonestChieffan
06-24-2011, 08:47 PM
In the counterfactual sense, yes.

OK then. In a factual sense, no.

notorious
06-24-2011, 09:22 PM
Honest question:


What if the US just said,"We've done a lot for the rest of this planet, as we see it, we don't owe anyone a fucking thing."


What would the other countries that we owe money to do?

The Mad Crapper
06-24-2011, 09:25 PM
Will someone, either party, step up and be the daddy and shut the wallet and tell the kids that their allowance went bye-bye?

You saw Goodfellas right?

Same thing, only on a much, much larger level.

We're fucked.

Even if you could wave a magic wand and remove every scumbag, criminal congressman and senator, the ship is still pulling into the dock---

And it's not like a car going 50 MPH where you can just pump the breaks and come to a safe stop in a few seconds----

When a ship hits the breaks it still drifts.

And believe me you when it hits the dock gosh all get out it's gonna tear shit up.