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alnorth
07-27-2011, 06:28 PM
Ron Paulís Surprisingly Lucid Solution to the Debt Ceiling Impasse (http://www.tnr.com/article/politics/91224/ron-paul-debt-ceiling-federal-reserve)

Representative Ron Paul has hit upon a remarkably creative way to deal with the impasse over the debt ceiling: have the Federal Reserve Board destroy the $1.6 trillion in government bonds it now holds. While at first blush this idea may seem crazy, on more careful thought it is actually a very reasonable way to deal with the crisis. Furthermore, it provides a way to have lasting savings to the budget.

...

In short, Representative Paul has produced a very creative plan that has two enormously helpful outcomes. The first one is that the destruction of the Fedís $1.6 trillion in bond holdings immediately gives us plenty of borrowing capacity under the current debt ceiling. The second benefit is that it will substantially reduce the governmentís interest burden over the coming decades. This is a proposal that deserves serious consideration, even from people who may not like its source.

This probably should be an option. One of the very basic unspoken assumptions everyone is working under is that we would not simply print $1.6B+ to get us through 2013. When the fed bought up a lot of treasuries, they effectively printed a lot of money, but the potential damage was limited because of the assumption they would eventually sell the bonds back into the market, and basically warehouse/burn all of that created money. If we burn the bonds instead, then the money we created would no longer be temporary and the market would react.

At this point though, I think the market reaction to an outright default would be worse than the reaction to a big increase in the money supply.

BucEyedPea
07-27-2011, 06:42 PM
http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=246815&highlight=Paul%27s+Solution

Hey, it's okay. I like seeing it again. :thumb:

alnorth
07-27-2011, 06:58 PM
http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=246815&highlight=Paul%27s+Solution

Hey, it's okay. I like seeing it again. :thumb:

ahh, didn't see it. Though one interesting recent development is that where Paul's ideas are ordinarily dismissed as looney by the mainstream, a few people who would normally not be his ally are now taking a serious look and asking "well, why not?"

At this late date though, we're probably too far gone and our political leaders are going for either a debt ceiling increase or bust.

petegz28
07-27-2011, 07:03 PM
ahh, didn't see it. Though one interesting recent development is that where Paul's ideas are ordinarily dismissed as looney by the mainstream, a few people who would normally not be his ally are now taking a serious look and asking "well, why not?"

At this late date though, we're probably too far gone and our political leaders are going for either a debt ceiling increase or bust.

You're missing the entire point of it. If we had the Fed tear up the debt they bought from us with their counterfeit money then we would not have a reason to raise the debt ceiling. We don't raise the debt ceiling and the politicos can't keep spending our tax $'s on their pet projects.

This is all a scam.

BigChiefFan
07-27-2011, 07:06 PM
I'd still like to restore some semblence of the Constitution being the law of the land. The way it is now, seems like it couldn't be further from what the elected officials adhere to. Ron Paul would be a good start to restoring some confidence in the system. Short of that, I can't see us climbing out of the hole the crooked politicans have dug for us.

BucEyedPea
07-27-2011, 07:20 PM
ahh, didn't see it. Though one interesting recent development is that where Paul's ideas are ordinarily dismissed as looney by the mainstream, a few people who would normally not be his ally are now taking a serious look and asking "well, why not?"

Yeah, funny how that is.

Taco John
07-27-2011, 08:37 PM
The Neo-con wing of the party is starting to push for the Boehner plan.

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William Kristol:
To vote against John Boehner on the House floor this week in the biggest showdown of the current Congress is to choose to vote with Nancy Pelosi. And it is to choose to increase the chances that Obama emerges from this showdown politically stronger. So when the Heritage Action Fund and the Club for Growth, and Senators Vitter, Paul, et al., choose to urge House Republicans to join the Democrats to defeat Boehner, they’re choosing to side with Barack Obama.

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John McCain:
McCain refers to 'tea party hobbits,' blasts Bachmann-backed idea
In the same day that House Speaker John Boehner told Republicans to "Get your asses in line" and support his debt ceiling proposal, Sen. John McCain also blasted fellow Republicans.

In a Senate floor speech laced with sarcasm and stings, the Arizona Republican aimed especially harsh fire at the tea party Wednesday.

McCain said the movement is "foolish" to think a balanced budget amendment could pass before the August 2 deadline. At one point, McCain read from an op-ed in Wednesday's Wall Street Journal. That article referred to activists as "tea party hobbits" – the little people who inhabit Middle-earth in the Lord of the Rings series.
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/07/27/mccain-refers-to-tea-party-hobbits-blasts-bachmann-backed-idea/
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Charles Krauthammer:
Top conservative columnist Charles Krauthammer says Michele Bachmann is being “unbelievably irresponsible” in her decision to not vote to raise the debt ceiling.[
http://thenewcivilrightsmovement.com/bachmann-is-being-unbelievable-irresponsible-says-krauthammer/politics/2011/07/27/24436
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There's no reason for the tea party to care what any of these guys have to say. They just want this deal because they're petrified of the Reid plan because it gets a lot of its cuts through the military. The tea party doesn't care about either of these plans. They're out for the balanced budget amendment, and will hold firm until they get it. This deadline is arbitrary and a fiction created by Obama.

Nothing happens on that date if there is no deal except that Obama ends up looking utterly powerless, and his presidency ends up looking shaky. The tea party loses nothing politically by letting this deadline pass. At the end of the day, the fact that there hasn't been a single budget passed during the entire Obama presidency is what the Tea Party will rally around and ask the American people who is more responsible: the party that is drawing the line around a balanced budget, or the party that refuses to even submit a budget. I'll have that debate every day and twice on Tuesdays.

I dare these establishment Republicans to take this tone to the campaign trail in 2012. Make my day.

alnorth
07-27-2011, 10:18 PM
I hate to break it to ya, but this is not Ron Paul's tea party anymore. It has been completely co-opted by staunch conservatives.

Taco John
07-27-2011, 10:49 PM
I hate to break it to ya, but this is not Ron Paul's tea party anymore. It has been completely co-opted by staunch conservatives.

Doesn't matter to me. I vote how I vote, and this idea that I need to coalition build with the likes of McCain, Kristol, and Krauthammer makes me laugh. They can either vote with us, or vote against us, but they're sure as hell not going to LEAD us. They have no influence over the tea party, and stand more for what the tea party is fighting against than what it is fighting for. I'm happy to be an opponent of Kristol and Obama. That's just where I want to be.

This deal means nothing to me. If it wins, fine. If it loses, fine. I'll vote for the people who stood their ground for a balanced budget amendment, and I'll vote against people who gave up on it. If that means Sharon Angle and Christine Odonnell part 2 come around, so be it.

I'm in it for a balanced budget amendment. Anything short of that amounts to a hill of beans as far as I'm concerned. If we can't get it before the "deadline" I'm ok with that. The deadline is arbitrary and created by Obama. I reject it out of hand, and would happily see the government be forced to prioritize its spending like the rest of us have had to for the last few years. It will be educational, it will weaken the president, and it will make it easier for us to make the case to the American people that we have a plan, and they won't even put together so much as a budget.

Bewbies
07-27-2011, 11:46 PM
I hate to break it to ya, but this is not Ron Paul's tea party anymore. It has been completely co-opted by staunch conservatives.

There will come a day when people will thank these 'hobbits' for standing their ground against "conservative" stalwarts like McCain.

Chocolate Hog
07-28-2011, 02:40 AM
<iframe width="560" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/N2BCR7MEiMY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

teedubya
07-28-2011, 06:12 AM
Have you guys seen this? This is the biggest doomsday speech I've ever seen a politician give. It's full of truth... they'd better find a solution... or shit looks bleak when the dollar completely collapses.

<iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/FHCkFPaePPQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>