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View Full Version : Football Looking at 2011... Denver


Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 07:51 AM
Ok, it's only a matter of time before this thread is destroyed :evil:, but I wanted to throw out my initial thoughts based on the recently released depth charts for the preseason. I think this is more in line with what we'll see in week 1, simply because teams don't have the time they have had in the past to tinker too much with positions.

Going into this offseason, Denver needed a lot of work... I had some wish lists and it primarily focused on Defense. I'll start by saying that I don't care about the QB "issues" at this time and I honestly think it's more media/fan driven than anything and the team is fine with the current QB situation. They're at the practices and they see who is doing well. I believe the players all want to win now, so I think you'll have few (if any) that disagree with the notion that Orton is the man in the #1 slot.

My wish list focused mainly on improving the pass rush and improving the ground game. If they don't do those two things... QB doesn't matter.

As I look at the depth chart (http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_18642680) I like the fact that they have 3 rookies set up as starters. I like the fact that they focused on defense early and often in the draft and I like the two rookie TEs, they won't make an impact this year, but that's why they brought in the two vets.

DL - Dumervil returning is huge, he's an anchor and has proven he can play at a high level. The additions of Bunkley and Warren behind him at DT should prove to be solid additions. I'd like to see youth there, but there were only so many draft picks and they loved Miller.

LB - Miller, Mays and Williams have a nice look to them and the depth is solid. Miller will have typical rookie issues, but his attitude is great and the renewed focus with what is hopefully a better scheme should make fans rest a bit easier about their ability to not look anything like they were in 2010.

DBs - The old guys have still got it, even if they've lost some steps, but there is a nice infusion of youth with Rahim Moore. And, they have younger guys in depth positions - McBath, McCarty and Carter provide solid options with various packages.

Overall on defense, I like that they brought in Fox and a new defensive scheme... I'm not thrilled that this is ANOTHER new defensive scheme, because that has been the issue. Denver has had 0 stability on defense from a philosophy point of view... hopefully, that changes.

Offensively, there's not a lot of change and that's partially ok with me. I'm not a fan of McGahee and had hoped that DeAngelo was coming to town. I like seeing Franklin (rookie) starting at RT and I like seeing Royal back in as WR2, with Decker behind him. I'm not a fan of Royal being WR2 and KR... that needs to change.

The RB depth is kinda blech to me... I like Moreno, but not as the lead. However, if they keep the same philosophy that they had last year - Orton proved he can make big plays. It would be ideal if they could run the ball with more consistency and authority and I think that will haunt them at times as it did last season.

Overall - solid steps in moving forward... but, they're still looking at best to win 6-8 games. It's not a horrible schedule, but there are a number of difficult games and with the changes (again), they'll have some kinks to work out.

So, flame away... tell me how they won't win more than 2 games... how the QB issues will destroy them from within and how the defense will again be the bottom of the barrel. And, check it out... I typed all these words without mentioning the name of the #2 QB. o:-)

Ebolapox
08-09-2011, 07:55 AM
you have pretty much the same schedule as we do (save two games), and most of us would be happy with 8-9 wins (TOUGH schedule). so.... who's a homer expecting 6-8 wins? just a black hole of talent in many positions, man.

:)

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 08:05 AM
Well, as always ... I project 3-3 within the AFCW for each team. I don't care how good or bad they are, teams within the AFCW typically split. No, it doesn't always happen, but that's my general starting point.

Denver hosts CIN in week 2... I like that game a lot for Denver.
Denver @ TEN in week 3 ... TEN has the edge, but Denver should do well.
Denver hosts DET in week 8... they've proven nothing of late and I like Denver's chances.
Denver @ MIN in week 13 ... The Vikings are not world beaters.
Denver @ BUF in week 16 ... Another good, but not great team late in the season.

The game I really want to see is week 14 ... Bears @ Denver. Anything could happen there...

So, no, Denver won't win all of the games I listed, but it wouldn't be shocking if they won the bulk of them.

Shaid
08-09-2011, 08:09 AM
I could flame away on Denver but I don't think they are as bad as some people like to say. You'd think they had a group of quadriplegics playing by how some people talk (although I understand the comparison :hmmm:).

I think with Orton in there you are looking at 4-6 wins. Basically just enough to get you out of the conversation for the top QB in next years draft, and that's ok with me. o:-)

Saul Good
08-09-2011, 08:12 AM
Denver's best players are ancient or broken. That's a bigger problem than your QB soap opera.

Shox
08-09-2011, 08:13 AM
Well, as always ... I project 3-3 within the AFCW for each team. I don't care how good or bad they are, teams within the AFCW typically split. No, it doesn't always happen, but that's my general starting point.

Denver hosts CIN in week 2... I like that game a lot for Denver.
Denver @ TEN in week 3 ... TEN has the edge, but Denver should do well.
Denver hosts DET in week 8... they've proven nothing of late and I like Denver's chances.
Denver @ MIN in week 13 ... The Vikings are not world beaters.
Denver @ BUF in week 16 ... Another good, but not great team late in the season.

The game I really want to see is week 14 ... Bears @ Denver. Anything could happen there...

So, no, Denver won't win all of the games I listed, but it wouldn't be shocking if they won the bulk of them.

3-3 in the division????? You are really drinking the coolaid heavy. Bronco will go lucky to win 2 games in the division....0fer vs Chargers, should be ofer vs Chiefs and split with the Raiders....1-5 is the most likely

Cin W
Ten L (unless CJ is holding out then you will have a chance)
Det L (you have no chance, sorry unless Det is crippled up)
Min W (toss-up I will be nice)
Buf L (Buf is an improving team, your season is over long before wk 16)

2011 3-5 wins is in the Donkies future.

Ebolapox
08-09-2011, 08:14 AM
Well, as always ... I project 3-3 within the AFCW for each team. I don't care how good or bad they are, teams within the AFCW typically split. No, it doesn't always happen, but that's my general starting point.

Denver hosts CIN in week 2... I like that game a lot for Denver.
Denver @ TEN in week 3 ... TEN has the edge, but Denver should do well.
Denver hosts DET in week 8... they've proven nothing of late and I like Denver's chances.
Denver @ MIN in week 13 ... The Vikings are not world beaters.
Denver @ BUF in week 16 ... Another good, but not great team late in the season.

The game I really want to see is week 14 ... Bears @ Denver. Anything could happen there...

So, no, Denver won't win all of the games I listed, but it wouldn't be shocking if they won the bulk of them.

you're counting on road games? ok, dude. sure. guess we'll see how it goes. ;)

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 08:21 AM
you're counting on road games? ok, dude. sure. guess we'll see how it goes. ;)

So, road games against teams that aren't all that great either shouldn't be put into the mix? Interesting. And, yeah when the Jets and NE ... as well as CHI are coming to Denver, you have to look at the weaker road matchups.

Shox - I'm guessing you've been a fan for a while... how many times do AFCW teams (good or bad) sweep or get shut out? It's rare.

I think 8 is the maximum and it would take a lot... I think 6-7 is more realistic. Sad still, but realistic.

Shox
08-09-2011, 08:22 AM
So, road games against teams that aren't all that great either shouldn't be put into the mix? Interesting.

Shox - I'm guessing you've been a fan for a while... how many times do AFCW teams (good or bad) sweep or get shut out? It's rare.

2010 - Oakland Raiders Undefeated.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 08:24 AM
2011 - Oakland Raiders Undefeated.

So, they're going undefeated this year or are you pointing to the 2010 record?

And, you understand the definition of rare... right?

Ebolapox
08-09-2011, 08:25 AM
So, road games against teams that aren't all that great either shouldn't be put into the mix? Interesting. And, yeah when the Jets and NE ... as well as CHI are coming to Denver, you have to look at the weaker road matchups.

Shox - I'm guessing you've been a fan for a while... how many times do AFCW teams (good or bad) sweep or get shut out? It's rare.

I think 8 is the maximum and it would take a lot... I think 6-7 is more realistic. Sad still, but realistic.

kinda hard to count on how good or bad said teams are compared to last year. minny still has a LOT of talent, as do the lions. at buffalo is NEVER a given.

let's just put it this way-- every year, I do a prediction based on best-case, and worst-case. this looks like your best-case prediction.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 08:31 AM
kinda hard to count on how good or bad said teams are compared to last year. minny still has a LOT of talent, as do the lions. at buffalo is NEVER a given.

let's just put it this way-- every year, I do a prediction based on best-case, and worst-case. this looks like your best-case prediction.

I don't disagree at all and yes, 6-8 wins is my best case. Why would I project a worst case? Hell, the best case isn't all that great outside of just improving from 2010.

I was looking at the AFCW Div records going back to 2006... and no, I didn't have a reason for stopping in 2006.

SD was 3-3 in 2010 and 5-1 within the division from 2009-2006.
Denver was 1-5 in 2010 and 3-3 from 2009-2006.
KC was 2-4 in 2010, they had the same 2-4 record from 2009-2007. In 2006, they were 4-2.
Oak was 6-0 in 2010, they were 2-4 from 2009-2007 and then 0-6 in 2006.

So, I guess I see now why you guys don't believe in the 3-3 projections...

Ebolapox
08-09-2011, 08:34 AM
I don't disagree at all and yes, 6-8 wins is my best case. Why would I project a worst case? Hell, the best case isn't all that great outside of just improving from 2010.

I was looking at the AFCW Div records going back to 2006... and no, I didn't have a reason for stopping in 2006.

SD was 3-3 in 2010 and 5-1 within the division from 2009-2006.
Denver was 1-5 in 2010 and 3-3 from 2009-2006.
KC was 2-4 in 2010, they had the same 2-4 record from 2009-2007. In 2006, they were 4-2.
Oak was 6-0 in 2010, they were 2-4 from 2009-2007 and then 0-6 in 2006.

So, I guess I see now why you guys don't believe in the 3-3 projections...

last year was a really fucking weird year in the afc west, lot of division games went the other way at the last minute.

DaFace
08-09-2011, 08:38 AM
I agree with the 3-3 in the division rule of thumb. Sometimes it's higher, sometimes it's lower, but the games are ALWAYS close, regardless of the teams' relative strengths.

As for Denver in general, the offense seems pretty stagnant to me. Orton will probably be about the same - a good game manager, but never anything special. I don't really see any notable improvements for the offense as a whole.

The defense, on the other hand, could benefit a ton from 1) having Dumervil back and 2) having someone (Miller) to complement him on the other side. IF (and it's a big IF) those two can both get it going, they could be a handful for other teams to deal with.

Still, I'd say 4-6 wins personally.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 08:46 AM
I agree with the 3-3 in the division rule of thumb. Sometimes it's higher, sometimes it's lower, but the games are ALWAYS close, regardless of the teams' relative strengths.

As for Denver in general, the offense seems pretty stagnant to me. Orton will probably be about the same - a good game manager, but never anything special. I don't really see any notable improvements for the offense as a whole.

The defense, on the other hand, could benefit a ton from 1) having Dumervil back and 2) having someone (Miller) to complement him on the other side. IF (and it's a big IF) those two can both get it going, they could be a handful for other teams to deal with.

Still, I'd say 4-6 wins personally.

I don't disagree with the thoughts on offense, aside from being stagnant. Offense was not the issue aside from consistency rushing. Turnovers were not a problem. Playing catchup thanks to a sad defense was the issue.

Gonzo
08-09-2011, 08:51 AM
I fucking hate Denver but....

There will always be the surprise teams, every year. Fox is a decent coach, (better than anything Denver's had for a long time) and he'll bring them up to mediocrity this year. The maturity level alone was a huge factor last year, not to mention all of the off the field distractions. I think they will have anywhere from 6 to 8 wins this year, make some moves in FA and the draft and be extremely competitive in 2012.

I totally expect the Chiefs to do the same. Anywhere between 7 to 9 wins this year for KC.
They will start slow, then the team will start to gel and break off a 5 - 6 game streak later in the year. Don't get me wrong, they have the talent to have 10 - 12 wins this year but I just don't think they will be ready to really kick ass until later in the season. The schedule really sucks but as we all know, some of those teams that have been strong in the past are getting awfully old. *Cough *Indy* Cough*

There's always the surprise team that should have gone 13-3 but end up being 7-9 due to the intangables... Injuries, mental breakdowns, coach punching them in the head etc...

NFL Predictions are like assholes, everyone has one.

Direckshun
08-09-2011, 08:54 AM
The Broncos have a player here or there with really special talent. I think if Demaryius Thomas heals, he's special. The left tackle. Dumervil, the rookie, both very special. Champ Bailey is a HOFer and still playing like it, and you've got a great rookie safety in Rahim Moore. Tebow even scares me a bit, though I doubt he'll ever play a full season.

Everywhere else, it's just an abomination though. The tackles are patches, the RBs are patches, the OL is patched together, and the back seven is patched together.

It's going to get a lot worse before it gets better for the Broncos. And John Fox is not the answer at coach any more than Elway is as GM, or whatever the hell he is.

Sofa King
08-09-2011, 08:57 AM
I ****ing hate Denver but....

There will always be the surprise teams, every year. Fox is a decent coach, (better than anything Denver's had for a long time) and he'll bring them up to mediocrity this year. The maturity level alone was a huge factor last year, not to mention all of the off the field distractions. I think they will have anywhere from 6 to 8 wins this year, make some moves in FA and the draft and be extremely competitive in 2012.

I totally expect the Chiefs to do the same. Anywhere between 7 to 9 wins this year for KC.
They will start slow, then the team will start to gel and break off a 5 - 6 game streak later in the year. Don't get me wrong, they have the talent to have 10 - 12 wins this year but I just don't think they will be ready to really kick ass until later in the season. The schedule really sucks but as we all know, some of those teams that have been strong in the past are getting awfully old. *Cough *Indy* Cough*

There's always the surprise team that should have gone 13-3 but end up being 7-9 due to the intangables... Injuries, mental breakdowns, coach punching them in the head etc...

NFL Predictions are like assholes, everyone has one.

What makes you think we start off slow? We started off well last year, being the last undefeated team and all. And our tough games are later on in the year.

If anything, we start fast and fall off.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 09:06 AM
The Broncos have a player here or there with really special talent. I think if Demaryius Thomas heals, he's special. The left tackle. Dumervil, the rookie, both very special. Champ Bailey is a HOFer and still playing like it, and you've got a great rookie safety in Rahim Moore. Tebow even scares me a bit, though I doubt he'll ever play a full season.

Everywhere else, it's just an abomination though. The tackles are patches, the RBs are patches, the OL is patched together, and the back seven is patched together.

It's going to get a lot worse before it gets better for the Broncos. And John Fox is not the answer at coach any more than Elway is as GM, or whatever the hell he is.

Yeah, I'm not sure if DT will ever be healed... that was his knock in the draft, but McDaniels sure believed in him. Oh wait, sorry ... shouldn't have just typed DT, so much easier to type Demaryius... I think he's going to go the way of Marcus Nash, if he isn't already there.

Gonzo
08-09-2011, 09:07 AM
What makes you think we start off slow? We started off well last year, being the last undefeated team and all. And our tough games are later on in the year.

If anything, we start fast and fall off.

New OC, new gameplan, we'll likely play our rooks, Cassel's not exactly a member of Mensa with a 159 IQ. I have no confidence in our O-Line right now.
I see this team playing well, but not really getting a firm hold of the operation until around week 5 or so.

Don't get me wrong, I sincerly hope I'm wrong, (it's been known to happen).
If the defense steps up and plugs the run, then this will be a moot point. No one want's to pass against our DB's.

I really think that we could declare victory if at the halfway point, they are sitting at .500. JMHO

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 09:13 AM
New OC, new gameplan, we'll likely play our rooks, Cassel's not exactly a member of Mensa with a 159 IQ. I have no confidence in our O-Line right now.
I see this team playing well, but not really getting a firm hold of the operation until around week 5 or so.

Don't get me wrong, I sincerly hope I'm wrong, (it's been known to happen).
If the defense steps up and plugs the run, then this will be a moot point. No one want's to pass against our DB's.

I really think that we could declare victory if at the halfway point, they are sitting at .500. JMHO

Victory as in having the AFCW title locked up ... or what?

boogblaster
08-09-2011, 09:16 AM
general good read .. but .. i really dont care bout donks .. hope they lose every game ...

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 09:19 AM
general good read .. but .. i really dont care bout donks .. hope they lose every game ...

:thumb: I know you do...

Gonzo
08-09-2011, 09:27 AM
Victory as in having the AFCW title locked up ... or what?

No, victory as in they're playing well enough to be 500. I'm a little pessemistic this year, I guess.

I think the AFCW title is really up for grabs this year. Well, except for Denver. ;)

I don't know. I'm having a hell of a time predicting how KC will do this year. I could be on a severe crack high and maybe they will go 12-4, win a playoff game and have a home game for the AFC divisional playoff game.

Then again...

They could go 5-11, suck severe tit and run home with their tails between their legs.

Who knows? Tough to predict. That's why the NFL is the best sport in the world... Parody, you know?
I would be happy with 9-7 this year, though. That way I know that they are moving in the right direction. You should be estatic with anything better than 6-10.

Shag
08-09-2011, 09:39 AM
Who knows? Tough to predict. That's why the NFL is the best sport in the world... Parody, you know?
I would be happy with 9-7 this year, though. That way I know that they are moving in the right direction. You should be estatic with anything better than 6-10.

Denver is indeed a parody of an NFL team... ROFL

Saul Good
08-09-2011, 09:42 AM
New OC, new gameplan, we'll likely play our rooks, Cassel's not exactly a member of Mensa with a 159 IQ. I have no confidence in our O-Line right now.
I see this team playing well, but not really getting a firm hold of the operation until around week 5 or so.

Don't get me wrong, I sincerly hope I'm wrong, (it's been known to happen).
If the defense steps up and plugs the run, then this will be a moot point. No one want's to pass against our DB's.

I really think that we could declare victory if at the halfway point, they are sitting at .500. JMHO

We really need to start 3-1 to have a legit shot at the division.

el borracho
08-09-2011, 09:44 AM
I think the Broncos will be ok to start and then get murdered in the middle of their season:

Oakland- L
Cincinnati-W
@ Tennessee- L
@ Green Bay- L
San Diego- W
@ Miami- W
Detroit- L
@ Oakland- L
@ KC- L
Jets- L
@ San Diego- L
@ Minnesota- L
Chicago- L
New England- L
@ Buffalo- W
KC- W

5-11

Saul Good
08-09-2011, 09:48 AM
Denver is indeed a parody of an NFL team... ROFL

You like parodies, do you? The Broncos can suck a parodies right here. /grabs crotch //no homo

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 09:52 AM
Denver is indeed a parody of an NFL team... ROFL

Hey, let's not act like KC has been a rock of stability... they won 10 in 2010, but the three years prior were pretty sad with 10 total wins (no more than 4 in any season from 2009-2007).

Denver was a lethargic .500 from 2006-2009 and then the bottom fell out in 2010.

The 2011 Broncos will not be as pathetic as they were in 2010... they won't be prolific, but they sure as hell won't be pathetic.

Cephalic Trauma
08-09-2011, 09:58 AM
Hey, let's not act like KC has been a rock of stability... they won 10 in 2010, but the three years prior were pretty sad with 10 total wins (no more than 4 in any season from 2009-2007).

Denver was a lethargic .500 from 2006-2009 and then the bottom fell out in 2010.

The 2011 Broncos will not be as pathetic as they were in 2010... they won't be prolific, but they sure as hell won't be pathetic.

The only way to go is up.

Gonzo
08-09-2011, 10:06 AM
We really need to start 3-1 to have a legit shot at the division.

Agreed.
I really don't think SD will be nearly as much of a threat but on the other hand, they do have this...


http://rotoassist.com/files/2009/10/5687_2844_stupid-philip-rivers-face-300x273.jpg

Shag
08-09-2011, 10:13 AM
Hey, let's not act like KC has been a rock of stability... they won 10 in 2010, but the three years prior were pretty sad with 10 total wins (no more than 4 in any season from 2009-2007).

Denver was a lethargic .500 from 2006-2009 and then the bottom fell out in 2010.

The 2011 Broncos will not be as pathetic as they were in 2010... they won't be prolific, but they sure as hell won't be pathetic.

The joke wrote itself - I couldn't resist... :)

Mr. Laz
08-09-2011, 10:14 AM
i believe this thread got posted in the wrong place ... mods?




www.stankassdonkeyfootballboard.com

Dave Lane
08-09-2011, 10:16 AM
general good read .. but .. i really dont care bout donks .. hope they lose every game ...

Not me I hope they win 5-6 put them out of the Luck sweepstakes. I don't like the idea of a number one overall QB from Stanford going to the Donks

DaFace
08-09-2011, 10:39 AM
i believe this thread got posted in the wrong place ... mods?




www.stankassdonkeyfootballboard.com




Eh, I don't mind. Every other Bronco thread around here quickly derails into a giant pile of Raiduhs as soon as KnowMo shows his face. It's nice to actually have a legit conversation about our rivals once in a while.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 10:41 AM
Eh, I don't mind. Every other Bronco thread around here quickly derails into a giant pile of Raiduhs as soon as KnowMo shows his face. It's nice to actually have a legit conversation about our rivals once in a while.

That was my thinking as well...

Saulbadguy
08-09-2011, 10:41 AM
tl;dr, you guys will be awful

HotRoute
08-09-2011, 10:42 AM
Oakland- L
Cincinnati-W
@ Tennessee- L
@ Green Bay- L
San Diego- L
@ Miami- L
Detroit- L
@ Oakland- L
@ KC- L
Jets- L
@ San Diego- L
@ Minnesota- L
Chicago- L
New England- L
@ Buffalo- W

Good luck donks, your gonna need it

L.A. Chieffan
08-09-2011, 10:45 AM
elways plan from the beginning...sabotage both qbs and then pull a willis reed and come out of the booth

Saul Good
08-09-2011, 11:04 AM
elways plan from the beginning...sabotage both qbs and then pull a willis reed and come out of the booth

You're gonna die, bitch. I'm comin' outta the booooooth!

L.A. Chieffan
08-09-2011, 11:05 AM
1.25 pa

listopencil
08-09-2011, 11:23 AM
Our biggest problems last year were our two lines. We couldn't run block for shit and our D-Line had no impact on the LOS.

O-Line: Not a whole lot of change here. We gain a strong run blocking RT who looks weak in pass pro (he's a rookie) to replace a serviceable but oft injured vet. Depth is an issue and it's showing up at practice. Looks like we keep a TE in for pass pro more often but should be able to run the ball more effectively. This meshes well with new Head Coach John Fox's apparent offensive philosophy, although it has been reported that Fox lets his coordinators run the show with his oversight.

D-Line: Substantial change. The line has been rebuilt and shows some promise. Look for holdovers Ayers and Thomas to be more effective as they are surrounded by more talent. The return of Doom brings a much needed presence on the edge. Von Miller will be a factor in blitzes, coverage and run support. Time will tell how much of a factor but he has been running with the first team through Training Camp.

The success (or lack thereof) of the Denver Broncos will depend on how well the two lines handle their responsibilities so that the "skill players" can handle theirs. Just like every year. Just like every other team in the league.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 11:29 AM
Our biggest problems last year were our two lines. We couldn't run block for shit and our D-Line had no impact on the LOS.

O-Line: Not a whole lot of change here. We gain a strong run blocking RT who looks weak in pass pro (he's a rookie) to replace a serviceable but oft injured vet. Depth is an issue and it's showing up at practice. Looks like we keep a TE in for pass pro more often but should be able to run the ball more effectively. This meshes well with new Head Coach John Fox's apparent offensive philosophy, although it has been reported that Fox lets his coordinators run the show with his oversight.

D-Line: Substantial change. The line has been rebuilt and shows some promise. Look for holdovers Ayers and Thomas to be more effective as they are surrounded by more talent. The return of Doom brings a much needed presence on the edge. Von Miller will be a factor in blitzes, coverage and run support. Time will tell how much of a factor but he has been running with the first team through Training Camp.

The success (or lack thereof) of the Denver Broncos will depend on how well the two lines handle their responsibilities so that the "skill players" can handle theirs. Just like every year. Just like every other team in the league.

Agreed, it begins and ends with how well the big uglies up front on both sides perform...

Gonzo
08-09-2011, 11:31 AM
You're gonna die, bitch. I'm comin' outta the booooooth!

Have another one, you fucking lush!
Posted via Mobile Device

listopencil
08-09-2011, 11:35 AM
Have another one, you fucking lush!
Posted via Mobile Device

If we could somehow transplant Elway's brain into Tebow's body we'd be unstoppable. Hmmm...maybe this was the plan all along. Think about it. The boy never drank or smoked. Never even had sex. His body is a freaking temple. If Elway goes on a "sabbatical" and Tebow suddenly shows up smoking a cigar, holding a glass of scotch, with his arms wrapped around a couple of bimbos and a big scar on the back of his head...well, you heard it here first.

Pasta Giant Meatball
08-09-2011, 11:35 AM
Denver's passing attack will take a hit due to the conservative coaching of Fox. That POS Moreno needs to actually do something for them to unleash that awesome playaction game they will have that KnowMo says. VONDOM will have a tough time stopping the run and forcing teams into 3rd and longs to unleash what should be a very improved pass rush.

listopencil
08-09-2011, 11:40 AM
Denver's passing attack will take a hit due to the conservative coaching of Fox. That POS Moreno needs to actually do something for them to unleash that awesome playaction game they will have that KnowMo says. VONDOM will have a tough time stopping the run and forcing teams into 3rd and longs to unleash what should be a very improved pass rush.

The FO has said that they are keeping the old O in tact to a degree, but the first depth chart released (I know, TC depth charts are weak) shows 2WR/1RB/1FB. The old McD depth charts would show 3WR/1RB. Also, Fox has said that they will be committed to the running game. I expect them to pass less/run more and that's a good thing.

We've already made substantial changes to the D-Line. They (on paper) should be better at stopping the run with the new personnel. We'll see.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 11:42 AM
Denver's passing attack will take a hit due to the conservative coaching of Fox. That POS Moreno needs to actually do something for them to unleash that awesome playaction game they will have that KnowMo says. VONDOM will have a tough time stopping the run and forcing teams into 3rd and longs to unleash what should be a very improved pass rush.

If Orton is healthy, I think it will be similar to 2003-2005 when Fox was in CAR... Jake and the passing game did all right. They didn't have the RB production that they had later in Fox's CAR tenure... and this is similar to what he has now in Denver. Stronger passing game with lots of options and an average ground game.

I won't argue about Moreno... he's been underwhelming and I just don't see McGahee bringing much to the table.

Defensively, they should be greatly improved with Dumervil returning... two veteran additions in the middle and Miller bolstering a good LB group. The secondary is pretty solid too.

It will take some time to gel, but this defense looks much better than what they rolled out there in 2010. And, 'much better' doesn't mean top 10... they have a long way to go, but I think they can be a top 15 defense by the end of the season.

Pasta Giant Meatball
08-09-2011, 11:45 AM
If Orton is healthy, I think it will be similar to 2003-2005 when Fox was in CAR... Jake and the passing game did all right. They didn't have the RB production that they had later in Fox's CAR tenure... and this is similar to what he has now in Denver. Stronger passing game with lots of options and an average ground game.

I won't argue about Moreno... he's been underwhelming and I just don't see McGahee bringing much to the table.

Defensively, they should be greatly improved with Dumervil returning... two veteran additions in the middle and Miller bolstering a good LB group. The secondary is pretty solid too.

It will take some time to gel, but this defense looks much better than what they rolled out there in 2010. And, 'much better' doesn't mean top 10... they have a long way to go, but I think they can be a top 15 defense by the end of the season.

IF they can stop the run, that pass rush has the potential to be lethal. If Warren still has some left in the tank, it's a good start.

BigCatDaddy
08-09-2011, 11:48 AM
If Orton is healthy, I think it will be similar to 2003-2005 when Fox was in CAR... Jake and the passing game did all right. They didn't have the RB production that they had later in Fox's CAR tenure... and this is similar to what he has now in Denver. Stronger passing game with lots of options and an average ground game.

I won't argue about Moreno... he's been underwhelming and I just don't see McGahee bringing much to the table.

Defensively, they should be greatly improved with Dumervil returning... two veteran additions in the middle and Miller bolstering a good LB group. The secondary is pretty solid too.

It will take some time to gel, but this defense looks much better than what they rolled out there in 2010. And, 'much better' doesn't mean top 10... they have a long way to go, but I think they can be a top 15 defense by the end of the season.

This is going to be someone's sig "and this is similar to what he has now in Denver. Stronger passing game with lots of options and an average ground game."

Cephalic Trauma
08-09-2011, 11:50 AM
ESPN Power Rankings are out. Chiefs are 14th, donks settled in at 27th.

listopencil
08-09-2011, 11:54 AM
This is going to be someone's sig "and this is similar to what he has now in Denver. Stronger passing game with lots of options and an average ground game."

If they can run the ball more effectively (road grader RT, more beef on the LOS, different O scheme, different blocking scheme) then the weakness I see is in the short passing game. Orton isn't good at screens or throwing to the RB's in the flats. He is good at going through his progressions though, with solid pass protection.

listopencil
08-09-2011, 11:55 AM
ESPN Power Rankings are out. Chiefs are 14th, donks settled in at 27th.

Cool. Who's in line for Homecoming Queen this year? Or will that be the next article?

Cephalic Trauma
08-09-2011, 11:57 AM
Cool. Who's in line for Homecoming Queen this year? Or will that be the next article?

Tim Tebow. He's done enough bitching to gain the starting job, at least.

BigCatDaddy
08-09-2011, 11:58 AM
If they can run the ball more effectively (road grader RT, more beef on the LOS, different O scheme, different blocking scheme) then the weakness I see is in the short passing game. Orton isn't good at screens or throwing to the RB's in the flats. He is good at going through his progressions though, with solid pass protection.

That's a lot of "IF's" to go from the bottom of the league in rushing to "average". Personally I think a RB would have been nice The Chiefs went from a shit running team to the top of the NFL by cutting LJ and inserting Charles. Orton's solid, but I'm not seeing "lot's of options" on offense. I'm sure he is over valueing guys like Thomas and Royal when making that statement and maybe thinking of some TC superstar.

listopencil
08-09-2011, 12:00 PM
Tim Tebow. He's done enough bitching to gain the starting job, at least.

Awesome. One sentence is "enough bitching to gain the starting job". Someone should have told Croyle that, he'd still have a job.

Cephalic Trauma
08-09-2011, 12:03 PM
Awesome. One sentence is "enough bitching to gain the starting job". Someone should have told Croyle that, he'd still have a job.

You asked. Tebow is coming off as a schoolboy bitch, so "Homecoming Queen" seems like a perfect title. Thanks for the suggestion.

listopencil
08-09-2011, 12:05 PM
That's a lot of "IF's" to go from the bottom of the league in rushing to "average". Personally I think a RB would have been nice The Chiefs went from a shit running team to the top of the NFL by cutting LJ and inserting Charles. Orton's solid, but I'm not seeing "lot's of options" on offense. I'm sure he is over valueing guys like Thomas and Royal when making that statement and maybe thinking of some TC superstar.

Yeah it is. Rome wasn't built in a day and you don't go from shitty to good overnight.

I don't know if RB is the answer. We have had such bad run blocking since Moreno has been in the league, I'd like to see what he can do when he's not getting hit 3 yards behind the LOS. Not sure what the "lots of options" are myself. We are solid at WR and we have a large group of TE's with some nice ones in there. And Moreno has shown good hands. I'm more concerned with how we are going to run the ball though.

listopencil
08-09-2011, 12:08 PM
You asked. Tebow is coming off as a schoolboy bitch, so "Homecoming Queen" seems like a perfect title. Thanks for the suggestion.

That's funny. They guy does everything and says everything right for years in college and his first season as a rookie QB on a team that is falling apart, yet that one sentence is enough to make him a schoolboy bitch in your eyes.Thanks for the subjectivity.

Cephalic Trauma
08-09-2011, 12:10 PM
That's funny. They guy does everything and says everything right for years in college and his first season as a rookie QB on a team that is falling apart, yet that one sentence is enough to make him a schoolboy bitch in your eyes.Thanks for the subjectivity.

*sniffles*

U mad?

listopencil
08-09-2011, 12:11 PM
*sniffles*

U mad?

Why would I be?

Cephalic Trauma
08-09-2011, 12:19 PM
Why would I be?

Read your last post. Try not to be so defensive.

listopencil
08-09-2011, 12:21 PM
Read your last post. Try not to be so defensive.


I think you misunderstood. I typed "that's funny" as in "I'm laughing at you" because you're post was kind of dumb.

Chief Faithful
08-09-2011, 02:00 PM
If Orton is healthy, I think it will be similar to 2003-2005 when Fox was in CAR... Jake and the passing game did all right. They didn't have the RB production that they had later in Fox's CAR tenure... and this is similar to what he has now in Denver. Stronger passing game with lots of options and an average ground game.

I won't argue about Moreno... he's been underwhelming and I just don't see McGahee bringing much to the table.



Fox has always put good defenses on the field so I fully expect improvement. The real question to me is the Donks offense. Fox relied on the run in Carolina and never had a pass first offense even when they had the talent. This is the exact opposite of what McDumbass ran in New England and Denver. If Fox pushes Orton back into the role of game manager with a run first mentality it could mean really low offensive production, which I don't think Elway or the fans will accept. Meaning, lots more drama and near future coaching changes in Denver.

Everyone is talking defense, but I think the story will be told on offense.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 02:05 PM
Fox has always put good defenses on the field so I fully expect improvement. The real question to me is the Donks offense. Fox relied on the run in Carolina and never had a pass first offense even when they had the talent. This is the exact opposite of what McDumbass ran in New England and Denver. If Fox pushes Orton back into the role of game manager with a run first mentality it could mean really low offensive production, which I don't think Elway or the fans will accept. Meaning, lots more drama and near future coaching changes in Denver.

Everyone is talking defense, but I think the story will be told on offense.

I think most fans realize that nothing matters if the defense isn't fixed... and if that is done and they can show consistent improvement defensively, then fans will easily accept a more balanced approach on offense. Winning fixes any issues that a team or fans may have...

I personally don't think that they have the RBs that Fox ultimately desires which is why I said earlier this could be more like those 3 years early on when Delhomme and company threw with more success than they ran.

Balance is always good and any time they can run more effectively to extend drives and run the clock... you bet fans would love it. Orton and the receivers showed last year that they can pass with the best of them and be very successful.

Improved defense and more balance will bring winning though.. I don't believe that fans are hell bent on a prolific passing attack.

Ebolapox
08-09-2011, 02:08 PM
The FO has said that they are keeping the old O in tact to a degree, but the first depth chart released (I know, TC depth charts are weak) shows 2WR/1RB/1FB. The old McD depth charts would show 3WR/1RB. Also, Fox has said that they will be committed to the running game. I expect them to pass less/run more and that's a good thing.

We've already made substantial changes to the D-Line. They (on paper) should be better at stopping the run with the new personnel. We'll see.

it's funny, that's all I heard when herm took over for vermiel--HE'S KEEPING THE SAME OFFENSE, IT'LL STILL BE HIGH POWERED!

a little problem, though... doesn't always work that way with different coordinators and personnel. sure, the names on the jerseys are pretty much the same, but a year is a HUGE difference.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 02:16 PM
it's funny, that's all I heard when herm took over for vermiel--HE'S KEEPING THE SAME OFFENSE, IT'LL STILL BE HIGH POWERED!

a little problem, though... doesn't always work that way with different coordinators and personnel. sure, the names on the jerseys are pretty much the same, but a year is a HUGE difference.

Offensively, I believe most of the folks from a coaching perspective are still in place. I would have to look it up, but I don't have time.

listopencil
08-09-2011, 02:17 PM
Fox has always put good defenses on the field so I fully expect improvement. The real question to me is the Donks offense. Fox relied on the run in Carolina and never had a pass first offense even when they had the talent. This is the exact opposite of what McDumbass ran in New England and Denver. If Fox pushes Orton back into the role of game manager with a run first mentality it could mean really low offensive production, which I don't think Elway or the fans will accept. Meaning, lots more drama and near future coaching changes in Denver.

Everyone is talking defense, but I think the story will be told on offense.

Good points. I agree to most of them. The only one I disagree with is what Elway is willing to put up with. Elway has said that the Broncos are in a rebuild, so I think he accepts that our Offense isn't going to be the one that McD ran. I think the trade off is that our Defense isn't going to be so shitty.

I don't think this puts Fox on the hot seat, rather this an attempt to bring the team back to the middle of the pack. If the current FO can get the Broncos back to .500 ball, then they start making the changes to get up to playoff level football. That's when it gets interesting. Fox has been there before and should know what it takes to build a playoff caliber team. Right now a system or game manager QB will work.

Orton fills that "game manager" role pretty well, better than Tebow does at this point. At some point if the Broncos are going to continue to get better in Fox's scheme they will need a QB who can make plays. I think in the future Tebow could be that game manager with the ability to make plays when needed, maybe even next year.

I don't know. Bowlen tried hiring the hot shot youngster, looking for a quick fix, and it blew up in his face. I'm certainly willing to put up with seeing my team built up over time instead of being driven off a cliff.

Ebolapox
08-09-2011, 02:19 PM
Offensively, I believe most of the folks from a coaching perspective are still in place. I would have to look it up, but I don't have time.

you know, except for the most important part... offensive coordinator, josh mcdaniels. :)

listopencil
08-09-2011, 02:21 PM
it's funny, that's all I heard when herm took over for vermiel--HE'S KEEPING THE SAME OFFENSE, IT'LL STILL BE HIGH POWERED!

a little problem, though... doesn't always work that way with different coordinators and personnel. sure, the names on the jerseys are pretty much the same, but a year is a HUGE difference.

Yeah. It's probably second nature to a new Head Coach. Someone in the media asks about the successes that the previous coach had so the new guy goes "Well, we're going to do the same thing!" but it's bullshit. You don't do the same thing. That thing is what got the old guy fired. It was nice to have an explosive passing game but we couldn't run for shit. I was disappointed in our Offense.

listopencil
08-09-2011, 02:24 PM
I don't believe that fans are hell bent on a prolific passing attack.

Yep. This is it in a nutshell.

Ebolapox
08-09-2011, 02:26 PM
Yeah. It's probably second nature to a new Head Coach. Someone in the media asks about the successes that the previous coach had so the new guy goes "Well, we're going to do the same thing!" but it's bullshit. You don't do the same thing. That thing is what got the old guy fired. It was nice to have an explosive passing game but we couldn't run for shit. I was disappointed in our Offense.

that's the thing-- with your personnel (aside from injuries and RBs not playing up to draft status), you guys should've been MUCH better.

listopencil
08-09-2011, 02:27 PM
that's the thing-- with your personnel (aside from injuries and RBs not playing up to draft status), you guys should've been MUCH better.

I think it's quite possible that Josh McDaniels is just a dick and the team quit on him.

Ebolapox
08-09-2011, 02:32 PM
I think it's quite possible that Josh McDaniels is just a dick and the team quit on him.

highly possible.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 02:48 PM
I think it's quite possible that Josh McDaniels is just a dick and the team quit on him.

I do think this has a LOT to do with it... I think they bought in early during year 1, but then bailed quickly once it was obvious that we was ill prepared.

Denver is not void of talent and this draft class looks good. McDaniels set Denver back 3-4 years minimum.

listopencil
08-09-2011, 02:53 PM
I do think this has a LOT to do with it... I think they bought in early during year 1, but then bailed quickly once it was obvious that we was ill prepared.

Denver is not void of talent and this draft class looks good. McDaniels set Denver back 3-4 years minimum.

Yeah. During that big 6-0 run the entire team was playing with fire and just barely winning, mainly on the strength of their Defense. They then began to resemble a condemned building as the lights went out one by one, the windows busted out and never repaired. At the time of McD's firing the Broncos were a husk of their former selves. So they could pass the ball well between the 20's, who gives a fuck? They couldn't win a game to save their lives. The future is bright.

Count Zarth
08-09-2011, 03:47 PM
You're so cute...you've been like this for years.

Shanny is gone, the Broncos haven't been a good team since he left. John Fox isn't winning 7 games with a roster that has 3 playmakers on it.

Fuck...you were one of the worst teams in the NFL last year and you're installing new offensive and defensive systems with almost ZERO offseason.

AND YOU THINK YOU'RE WINNING SEVEN GAMES?

You are straight up delusional.

listopencil
08-09-2011, 03:57 PM
You're so cute...you've been like this for years.

Shanny is gone, the Broncos haven't been a good team since he left. John Fox isn't winning 7 games with a roster that has 3 playmakers on it.

Fuck...you were one of the worst teams in the NFL last year and you're installing new offensive and defensive systems with almost ZERO offseason.

AND YOU THINK YOU'RE WINNING SEVEN GAMES?

You are straight up delusional.

How many games max do you think the Broncos will win?

Lonewolf Ed
08-09-2011, 03:59 PM
:thumb: I know you do...

I'd like for the Broncos to beat the Raiders. How dare those swine win all their division games last season? Heresy! If I must root for the Broncos and Chargers when they play Oakland to put the Raiders in their rightful place, then so be it. I want KC to beat Oakland every time they play, no matter what, though.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 04:01 PM
You're so cute...you've been like this for years.

Shanny is gone, the Broncos haven't been a good team since he left. John Fox isn't winning 7 games with a roster that has 3 playmakers on it.

****...you were one of the worst teams in the NFL last year and you're installing new offensive and defensive systems with almost ZERO offseason.

AND YOU THINK YOU'RE WINNING SEVEN GAMES?

You are straight up delusional.

Yeah, I'm delusional... if only we could all be more realistic and as intelligent as you think you are, then the world would be a better place.

Count Zarth
08-09-2011, 04:03 PM
Yeah, I'm delusional... if only we could all be more realistic and as intelligent as you think you are, then the world would be a better place.

LMAO

I called 7-9 for the Chiefs last year...I haven't called them this year but we aren't going to the Super Bowl.

You are a ridiculous homer. I'm sure you thought the Broncos were in the running for the division last year.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 04:05 PM
LMAO

I called 7-9 for the Chiefs last year...I haven't called them this year but we aren't going to the Super Bowl.

You are a ridiculous homer. I'm sure you thought the Broncos were in the running for the division last year.

I'm positive that was not the case... feel free to look it up, you know if that doesn't take you away from your Ashton Kutcher porn collection for too long.

vailpass
08-09-2011, 04:05 PM
I'm positive that was not the case... feel free to look it up, you know if that doesn't take you away from your Ashton Kutcher porn collection for too long.

LMAO

warrior
08-09-2011, 04:36 PM
Bronco's will win 5 games if they cheat real hard.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 04:46 PM
Bronco's will win 5 games if they cheat real hard.

Please... if they cheat just halfa$$ then I think they can win 9.

Chiefs Pantalones
08-09-2011, 04:46 PM
They just said on ESPN that the only reason Orton is helping Tebow is that he now knows Tebow isn't a real threat to take his job. They said Tebow stunk it up in practice again. Shocker. ESPN--"Orton won't take you to the promise land, but at least he'll take you to the halfway house. Tebow won't even take you up the ski lift." ROFL

The Denver Lucks.

warrior
08-09-2011, 04:58 PM
Please... if they cheat just halfa$$ then I think they can win 9.


ok that's funny maybe I don't hate all you guy's.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 05:53 PM
They just said on ESPN that the only reason Orton is helping Tebow is that he now knows Tebow isn't a real threat to take his job. They said Tebow stunk it up in practice again. Shocker. ESPN--"Orton won't take you to the promise land, but at least he'll take you to the halfway house. Tebow won't even take you up the ski lift." ROFL

The Denver Lucks.

You should read Reilly's article... Wowzers, I am not sure if Tim has been beaten down like that in a while.

listopencil
08-09-2011, 06:28 PM
They just said on ESPN that the only reason Orton is helping Tebow is that he now knows Tebow isn't a real threat to take his job. They said Tebow stunk it up in practice again. Shocker. ESPN--"Orton won't take you to the promise land, but at least he'll take you to the halfway house. Tebow won't even take you up the ski lift." ROFL

The Denver Lucks.


Yep, a lot of media types are looking at what Tebow is doing with the 2nd team Offense versus the 1st team Defense in practice and throwing him under the bus. Not a big deal.

Ugly Duck
08-09-2011, 06:29 PM
Doesn't Rivers kinda look like a gay elf?

http://rotoassist.com/files/2009/10/5687_2844_stupid-philip-rivers-face-300x273.jpg



http://www.zgeek.com/forum/gallery/files/8/8/3/2/gay.elf.jpg

lcarus
08-09-2011, 07:04 PM
I'm positive that was not the case... feel free to look it up, you know if that doesn't take you away from your Ashton Kutcher porn collection for too long.

I don't have a "collection" per say. Not quite yet anyway. However I did just pick up his new one - Two and a Half Men, One Cup.

Mile High Mania
11-13-2011, 02:32 PM
You're so cute...you've been like this for years.

Shanny is gone, the Broncos haven't been a good team since he left. John Fox isn't winning 7 games with a roster that has 3 playmakers on it.

****...you were one of the worst teams in the NFL last year and you're installing new offensive and defensive systems with almost ZERO offseason.

AND YOU THINK YOU'RE WINNING SEVEN GAMES?

You are straight up delusional.

I wanted to bring this up for Clayton... ok, I'm out.

Count Zarth
11-13-2011, 02:36 PM
Win seven games, then eat my asshole.

Mile High Mania
11-13-2011, 02:37 PM
Win seven games, then eat my asshole.

ROFL No thanks... which team wins 7 first, KC or DEN?

Bowser
11-13-2011, 02:38 PM
ROFL No thanks... which team wins 7 first, KC or DEN?

How many seasons down the road are we talking here?

Mile High Mania
11-13-2011, 02:40 PM
How many seasons down the road are we talking here?

Oh we'll just take 2011... and see if it can happen.

Denver another game vs SD ... KC in Denver ... Bills and NE hasn't looked all that great either.

Seven wins is not impossible, hell they might even reach .500 - it pains me to watch these games, but at least the last 2 have ended well.