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View Full Version : Fantasy Football FFL debate: Vick, Charles or AJ


The Bad Guy
08-09-2011, 02:03 PM
My brother's are splitting a team. They are up next on the clock.

They are fighting over who to take...

They kept Ben Roethlisberger as the franchise (you can only keep someone between rounds 11-15 as your keeper).

It's 4 per touchdown pass, PPR...

Would you take Vick even though Roethlisberger is on the roster, or would you roll with Jamaal or Andre Johnson?

My one brother wanted to go with Vick, other wanted Andre. I said Jamaal.

I can see though the appeal of Vick right now. Guy is going to put up a shit ton of points.

What say you?

Pestilence
08-09-2011, 02:05 PM
Where are they picking at?

DeezNutz
08-09-2011, 02:06 PM
Take the best at his position: AJ.

SNR
08-09-2011, 02:06 PM
It's the perfect time to take Vick if you have a backup like Rothlisberger on your roster. It's not smart to not have a quality backup on your team if you're a Vick owner, and you already got that in place.

If you really need to, you can trade Roethlisberger later in the year, too, if he's doing very well and wasting points on the bench.

Go bold, man. Take Vick.

Mile High Mania
08-09-2011, 02:07 PM
There's too much unknown... but easy money says AJ.

Detoxing
08-09-2011, 02:09 PM
That's actually a really hard one. Vick/Charles/AJ...hrmmm.....guess it would depend on where I am drafting and who's been taken. I think I'd lean towards Vick though...

The Bad Guy
08-09-2011, 02:10 PM
Take the best at his position: AJ.

Most people think Vick is the best at his position fantasy wise this year, too.

The Bad Guy
08-09-2011, 02:11 PM
They have 5th overall.

So far....

Foster, Rodgers, Peterson are gone.

I'm thinking that Vick might go 4, but if he doesn't, they might kill each other.

Detoxing
08-09-2011, 02:12 PM
They have 5th overall.

So far....

Foster, Rodgers, Peterson are gone.

I'm thinking that Vick might go 4, but if he doesn't, they might kill each other.

Rodgers over Vick, eh?

Predarat
08-09-2011, 02:12 PM
Vick is going to get benched or hurt, go against the grain and take vINTe young.

DeezNutz
08-09-2011, 02:13 PM
Most people think Vick is the best at his position fantasy wise this year, too.

I just don't trust him to stay healthy. Not taking him top 5.

Rams Fan
08-09-2011, 02:13 PM
I'd take Charles or AJ over Vick. They already have their QB situation addressed with Big Ben.

Pestilence
08-09-2011, 02:14 PM
Charles

DTLB58
08-09-2011, 02:15 PM
I say getting into business with family whether it's real or in this case fantasy is a bad idea. Now you are adding your 2 cents which makes 3 brothers.

I've never heard of such a thing. :banghead:

SNR
08-09-2011, 02:16 PM
They have 5th overall.

So far....

Foster, Rodgers, Peterson are gone.

I'm thinking that Vick might go 4, but if he doesn't, they might kill each other.Oh, really? That's gay. 5th overall is way too high for Vick.

Charles is the smart option here. You're going to get a good WR/QB on the turnaround in the 2nd.

Sofa King
08-09-2011, 02:20 PM
Charles. Pick a good wr in the 2nd or if another good rb drops take him.

SNR
08-09-2011, 02:25 PM
Greg Jennings has usually been there for me in the 2nd round when i've drafted roughly where you have been in my mock drafts. That's a much better value than taking Andre that high

wazu
08-09-2011, 02:25 PM
I'd lean Jamaal in a 4 pt passing TD league, especially if you already have Roethlisberger.

Sam Hall
08-09-2011, 02:38 PM
Definitely go with Charles. The people who draft quarterbacks and receivers in the first round are making a mistake.

Rams Fan
08-09-2011, 02:41 PM
Definitely go with Charles. The people who draft quarterbacks and receivers in the first round are making a mistake.

I don't think you can make a mistake if you take Rivers, Rodgers, Brees or Brady in the 1st.

Detoxing
08-09-2011, 02:42 PM
I don't see why Charles is the favorite here (other than him being a Chief).

None of them belong @ 5 in my opinion. Charles doesn't score enough and will be losing red zone touches to Jones & McClain. Charles is good for yards, but TD's win Games, and Vick will get them both throwing and running.

I still think you go Vick.

Fish
08-09-2011, 02:43 PM
Ask yourself..... "Why not Matt Cassel?"

Pestilence
08-09-2011, 02:45 PM
Definitely go with Charles. The people who draft quarterbacks and receivers in the first round are making a mistake.

It depends on how your league is setup. If you're getting 6 points for TDs.....who would you rather have?

Player A who scores 6 TDs.

Player B who scores 30 TDs?

Rams Fan
08-09-2011, 02:48 PM
Ask yourself..... "Why not Matt Cassel?"

Somehow, Cassel became my starting QB after I dealt Brees and got Favre in return with a few other players. :facepalm:

Though, on two separate occasions, him and Bowe combined for over 50 points.

sedated
08-09-2011, 02:54 PM
5th overall is way too high for Vick.

This thinking has always seemed stupid to me. If you want a player, and know he wonít make it to your next pick, you take him. Itís not like you have to negotiate a contract with the guy or anything.

lcarus
08-09-2011, 02:56 PM
If I get the first overall pick in my league, I'm taking Vick. We get 6 for passing TDs.

Radar Chief
08-09-2011, 02:56 PM
Vick.

sedated
08-09-2011, 02:57 PM
The people who draft quarterbacks and receivers in the first round are making a mistake.

If you get 5 or 6 points for passing TDs, its certainly not a mistake. ďTake a RB in the first roundĒ is an outdated notion Ė the NFL is a passing league these days, and RBs either get injured or have to share carries.

Radar Chief
08-09-2011, 02:57 PM
If I get the first overall pick in my league, I'm taking Vick. We get 6 for passing TDs.

Dude, Aaron Rodgers.
You're welcome.

CanadianChief
08-09-2011, 02:59 PM
Vick, AJ, Charles.

I had Charles last year and every time T. Jones came in for a series I cursed at the television.

Very frustrating to see Charles bust off an 80 yard run only to have Jones punch it in.

Pestilence
08-09-2011, 02:59 PM
I'd rather have Rodgers than Vick.

CanadianChief
08-09-2011, 02:59 PM
Dude, Aaron Rodgers.
You're welcome.

I'd also take Rodgers over Vick if I had the choice.

Radar Chief
08-09-2011, 03:02 PM
If you get 5 or 6 points for passing TDs, its certainly not a mistake. ďTake a RB in the first roundĒ is an outdated notion Ė the NFL is a passing league these days, and RBs either get injured or have to share carries.

In most scoring setups QBís are still your highest points scorers.
There are few running backs worth a 1st round pick, IMO.

The Bad Guy
08-09-2011, 03:02 PM
The pick was Andre Johnson.

The PPR put it over the top.

CanadianChief
08-09-2011, 03:06 PM
In most scoring setups QBís are still your highest points scorers.
There are few running backs worth a 1st round pick, IMO.

but is there not more discrepancy between the #1 and #12 ranked WRs and RBs as opposed to QBs?

A. Johnson #1 to M. Williams #12
Vick #1 to E. Manning #12
Foster #1 to Bradshaw #12

These are based on my leagues PPR projections

bsp4444
08-09-2011, 03:14 PM
Vick, and the reason is so that now you have two top quarterbacks locked up that none of your competitors can get to. Vick will score, and you can trade Big Ben down the road.

sedated
08-09-2011, 03:18 PM
Vick, and the reason is so that now you have two top quarterbacks locked up that none of your competitors can get to. Vick will score, and you can trade Big Ben down the road.

Do trades actually happen in your leagues? I canít say Iíve ever traded anyone, and there is usually MAYBE one a year. Most trade offers are a joke.

SNR
08-09-2011, 03:23 PM
This thinking has always seemed stupid to me. If you want a player, and know he wonít make it to your next pick, you take him. Itís not like you have to negotiate a contract with the guy or anything.Greg Jennings is my #2 receiver this year, but that doesn't mean I'd take him in the 1st round

Shaid
08-09-2011, 03:23 PM
Take Vick and trade Rapelisberger to a Steelers fan.

bsp4444
08-09-2011, 03:25 PM
Do trades actually happen in your leagues? I canít say Iíve ever traded anyone, and there is usually MAYBE one a year. Most trade offers are a joke.

I've seen trades happen, but mostly, you're right, the offers are rediculous. Still you have two of the top ten QB's locked up and somebody is going to have to settle for a bottom half QB as a starter.

Ebolapox
08-09-2011, 03:33 PM
none, ray rice.

Sam Hall
08-09-2011, 03:38 PM
If you get 5 or 6 points for passing TDs, its certainly not a mistake. “Take a RB in the first round” is an outdated notion – the NFL is a passing league these days, and RBs either get injured or have to share carries.

It's a mistake if you can wait and draft Matt Ryan in the fifth round. In the PPR mock drafts I've done, my first two picks were Chris Johnson-MJD and Ray Rice-LeSean McCoy. I'll take those combos any day of the week.

I'm a big fan of the second tier of wide receivers. Guys like Reggie Wayne, Greg Jennings, Vincent Jackson, Brandon Marshall, Marques Colston, DeSean Jackson, Mike Wallace and Wes Welker. I can piece together a good group of WRs with those guys.

I've also seen Antonio Gates on the board in the fourth round. That's a steal, if he stays healthy. He could be the best receiver on just about any fantasy team.

The Bad Guy
08-09-2011, 03:46 PM
If your league scores 6 for passing TDs, and you wait to take Matt Ryan, you just lost your league.

Sam Hall
08-09-2011, 04:03 PM
The NFL has too many low-scoring games to take a QB in the first round. There are too many games where the halftime score is 6-3. Quarterbacks won't score enough points in those games. Running backs have a better chance, especially in PPR leagues.

Pestilence
08-09-2011, 04:04 PM
The NFL has too many low-scoring games to take a QB in the first round. There are too many games where the halftime score is 6-3. Quarterbacks won't score enough points in those games. Running backs have a better chance, especially in PPR leagues.

:spock:

OnTheWarpath58
08-09-2011, 04:06 PM
It's a mistake if you can wait and draft Matt Ryan in the fifth round. In the PPR mock drafts I've done, my first two picks were Chris Johnson-MJD and Ray Rice-LeSean McCoy. I'll take those combos any day of the week.


Are you playing in a 4 team league?

Detoxing
08-09-2011, 04:07 PM
Are you playing in a 4 team league?

This.

Sam Hall
08-09-2011, 04:08 PM
Are you playing in a 4 team league?

8

Pestilence
08-09-2011, 04:10 PM
8

ROFL

You must play with fucking retards if you pulled Rice and McCoy with back to back picks.

Pestilence
08-09-2011, 04:10 PM
Oh....and I wouldn't consider 8 teams to be a fantasy football league.

Sam Hall
08-09-2011, 04:11 PM
:spock:

I've taken Drew Brees in the second round, only to be disappointed. The best running backs are more consistent.

Sam Hall
08-09-2011, 04:12 PM
Oh....and I wouldn't consider 8 teams to be a fantasy football league.

It's more fun than a 12-team league. Everyone has a better team.

Pestilence
08-09-2011, 04:13 PM
It's more fun than a 12-team league. Everyone has a better team.

It's more fun because it requires no knowledge on your part.

What was your team last year? I'm dying to know.

OnTheWarpath58
08-09-2011, 04:13 PM
It's more fun than a 12-team league. Everyone has a better team.

Wow. Big challenge. Everyone's roster is stacked.

:facepalm:

What a pussy way to play FF.

Detoxing
08-09-2011, 04:15 PM
I've taken Drew Brees in the second round, only to be disappointed. The best running backs are more consistent.

While I kinda agree....look at the roster of RB's this year....There are only a few worthy of 1st rnd picks. What are you going to do at pick 8? Reach for a 2nd rnd back? No thanks.

Sam Hall
08-09-2011, 04:19 PM
It's more fun because it requires no knowledge on your part.

What was your team last year? I'm dying to know.

I was loaded, partially because I drafted Arian Foster in the eighth round (I knew I couldn't wait any longer - everybody wanted him as a flex) and Darren McFadden late (I took a flyer and it worked out).

I also had Brees, Adrian Peterson (I had the #1 pick), Greg Jennings (he was very streaky and sometimes drove me crazy) and Antonio Gates (which hurt me when he got hurt).

I definitely advocate the 8-team league. It's a lot of fun. You can't look at the rosters after the draft and predict who will make the playoffs. Every team seems to be loaded.

Pestilence
08-09-2011, 04:22 PM
I was loaded, partially because I drafted Arian Foster in the eighth round (I knew I couldn't wait any longer - everybody wanted him as a flex) and Darren McFadden late (I took a flyer and it worked out).

I also had Brees, Adrian Peterson (I had the #1 pick), Greg Jennings (he was very streaky and sometimes drove me crazy) and Antonio Gates (which hurt me when he got hurt).

I definitely advocate the 8-team league. It's a lot of fun. You can't look at the rosters after the draft and predict who will make the playoffs. Every team seems to be loaded.

An 8-team league is for people who want to put no thought into FF. It's fucking stupid. It requires no knowledge of drafting. Fuck your 8 man league.

Sam Hall
08-09-2011, 04:23 PM
While I kinda agree....look at the roster of RB's this year....There are only a few worthy of 1st rnd picks. What are you going to do at pick 8? Reach for a 2nd rnd back? No thanks.

I absolutely love having the last pick in a snake draft. I love taking advantage of the people who draft QBs and WRs. Two stud RBs are almost always available at 1-8 and 2-1.

Sam Hall
08-09-2011, 04:25 PM
An 8-team league is for people who want to put no thought into FF. It's ****ing stupid. It requires no knowledge of drafting. **** your 8 man league.

I don't see it that way at all. Every league has some smart and dumb owners (at least in my experience). The people who prepare for the draft do better, regardless of the league size. You have to make good picks in the bench rounds, and that's not easy.

The Bad Guy
08-09-2011, 04:45 PM
It's more fun than a 12-team league. Everyone has a better team.

Get the fuck out of here. Yeah, it's great fun playing with a loaded rosters every week.

There's zero strategy involved playing in an 8 team league. There's no deep sleepers.

The Bad Guy
08-09-2011, 04:46 PM
I don't see it that way at all. Every league has some smart and dumb owners (at least in my experience). The people who prepare for the draft do better, regardless of the league size. You have to make good picks in the bench rounds, and that's not easy.

Essentially, by the time you get to the bench rounds, there's about 60 more people for you to choose from as opposed to a 12-team league.

Pest is right.

Brock
08-09-2011, 04:47 PM
Don't want to hijack the thread, although I think Bad Guy has probably gotten the feedback he was looking for at this point.

Anyways, I have an 8 team league because it's just guys I work with and there's 8 of us. Give me some ideas on how to make this league more interesting and challenging.

Sam Hall
08-09-2011, 04:47 PM
Look at the average roster in a 12-team league. The bench doesn't have a whole lot of talent. The owner is in trouble if a few starters struggle (which is usually the case for everyone).

Rosters in 8-team leagues have bigger and more talented benches. You're not screwed if a few starters bust. It helps keep most teams in the playoff race.

DeezNutz
08-09-2011, 04:48 PM
It helps keep most teams in the playoff race.

Exactly everyone's point. There is very little skill involved.

You could autodraft and be just fine.

Detoxing
08-09-2011, 04:48 PM
I absolutely love having the last pick in a snake draft. I love taking advantage of the people who draft QBs and WRs. Two stud RBs are almost always available at 1-8 and 2-1.

When I said pick 8, I was referring to a 12 team league. However, I do agree with you about having the last pick. It's not a bad spot to be in.

But my point still stands, it's stupid to pick a RB if there is better value on the board just because he's a RB.

You stated that your Brees pick let you down. Well, he had a bad year last year. Any player could have a bad year. It's the risk you take.

Sam Hall
08-09-2011, 04:51 PM
Get the **** out of here. Yeah, it's great fun playing with a loaded rosters every week.

There's zero strategy involved playing in an 8 team league. There's no deep sleepers.

There definitely are deep sleepers and strategy involved. You just have to be the person who drafts the sleepers. That's how it is in every league.

I've played in 8-team and 12-team leagues. My strategy was always the same. You have to prepare and make some great picks, regardless of the league size.

Sam Hall
08-09-2011, 04:53 PM
Essentially, by the time you get to the bench rounds, there's about 60 more people for you to choose from as opposed to a 12-team league.

Pest is right.

That's true, which means there are plenty of busts still on the board. You still have to research and pick the right players.

Sam Hall
08-09-2011, 04:56 PM
Exactly everyone's point. There is very little skill involved.

You could autodraft and be just fine.

I think the standings in most leagues go like this: You have a few people at the top, a mess in the middle and a few people at the bottom. The people at the bottom have a better chance in an 8-team league. It helps keep people interested.

Rausch
08-09-2011, 05:01 PM
Get the **** out of here. Yeah, it's great fun playing with a loaded rosters every week.

There's zero strategy involved playing in an 8 team league. There's no deep sleepers.

I had a loaded team last year and then Andre Johnson and Jones Drew both got hurt, then Colton and Rivers played like $#it and I got kicked in the 2nd round with the league's 2nd best record.

Sam Hall
08-09-2011, 05:07 PM
In an 8-team league, there's a lot of strategy in who to start. You have more options, and it's easy to start the wrong players.

MoreLemonPledge
08-09-2011, 05:41 PM
4 per TD pass devalues the QB. PPR increases the value of WRs, especially target monsters like AJ.

No doubt, go AJ.

lcarus
08-09-2011, 05:59 PM
Wow. Big challenge. Everyone's roster is stacked.

:facepalm:

What a pussy way to play FF.

Maybe they could only get 8 people to play? Not everyone is out to prove something while playing "fantasy football".

The Bad Guy
08-09-2011, 05:59 PM
4 points does hurt QBs, but really, that's about a 56 point difference for real good QBs. Vick makes up for that in rushing touchdowns. He's going to get at least 7.