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Tribal Warfare
09-10-2011, 01:22 AM
Chiefs not anticipating shootout with Bills (http://www.kansascity.com/2011/09/09/3132194/chiefs-not-anticipating-shootout.html)
By ADAM TEICHER
The Kansas City Star

The prevailing wisdom after a most unusual offseason was that defenses would rule the early weeks of the NFL’s schedule.

Offenses, which rely more on timing than brute strength, would need a few games to catch up.

Then came Thursday night’s opener between the Saints and Packers. The teams combined for 76 points and 876 yards and seemed to trash the defense-is-king theory.

Some of the principal figures in Sunday’s game between the Chiefs and Buffalo Bills at Arrowhead Stadium aren’t necessarily buying into that. They warn that their game won’t likely resemble the one in Green Bay.

“You’re dealing with a lot of guys who played football for a long time, so to say one side of the ball has an advantage over the other maybe is not accurate,” Chiefs linebacker Andy Studebaker said.

“(Thursday) night, you maybe had a shootout. But who knows? There will probably be low-scoring games this weekend. It’s the NFL. There are shootouts every week and then there are defensive games every week, and I think that will continue to be the case.”

The Saints and Packers are built to win scoring wars, but not so for either the Chiefs or Bills. Neither was among the league leaders in scoring last season; both will ask their defenses to keep them in the game.

Last season, the Chiefs and Bills played five full quarters at Arrowhead Stadium and combined for just 23 points. The Chiefs won 13-10 on a Ryan Succop field goal with no time left on the clock in overtime.

The Chiefs and Bills also struggled to score points in the preseason. The Chiefs were last in preseason scoring, and Buffalo was not much better.

“If anything, it should put the defense ahead,” Chiefs defensive coordinator Romeo Crennel said of the offseason training lost due to this summer’s lockout. “Generally, offenses take longer to jell. But this has been a crazy year. Teams have done things differently to kind of prepare for it. Considering the circumstances and the new rules that we had to work under, I think we were efficient and I think we got a lot done.”

Chiefs coach Todd Haley said he wasn’t thinking of early-season advantages in terms of offense or defense. Instead, he said, the teams that will prosper in the first few weeks are the ones with continuity on their coaching staff and roster.

Haley is in his third season with the Chiefs; Chan Gailey his second with the Bills.

“The teams that have been together and in relatively the same system for an extended amount of time with the same players are going to be at an advantage, especially early on,” Haley said. “We’re kind of in the middle. I’m grateful that I feel like we have a core group of guys that have been together now going into our third year. The system hasn’t changed a whole bunch, though we’re always evolving.”

The Packers-Saints game featured two touchdowns on special teams. New Orleans’ Darren Sproles, a former standout at Olathe North High and Kansas State, brought back a punt 72 yards, while Green Bay’s Randall Cobb returned a kickoff 108 yards.

Big plays in the kicking game could be the norm early in the season if teams didn’t spend enough practice time in training camp trying to prevent them.

“You haven’t had time to cover everything quite as thoroughly as it needs to be covered,” Haley said. “Coaches played percentages probably on just what they felt was most important to them.”

Judging from Thursday’s results in Green Bay, special teams weren’t adequately covered.

“As a guy covering, you’ve got to expect every time that a guy is coming out of the end zone,” Chiefs special-teams player Terrance Copper said. “You can’t slack off just because the ball is 5 yards deep.”

A new rule passed by a majority of NFL owners this last offseason moved kickoffs to the 35-yard line instead of the 30. The result, Thursday night excepted, should be more touchbacks. Fewer kick returns, the owners have said, should cut down on injuries.

“Before the rule change, you kick a ball 5 yards deep and they’re staying in the end zone,” Copper said. “Now, it’s more of a trend to bring it out from 5 yards deep. So the cover team better be expecting it regardless of how deep it is.”

SEASON OPENER
•WHO: Bills at Chiefs

•WHEN: noon Sunday

•WHERE: Arrowhead

•TV/RADIO: Chs. 5, 13; KCFX (101.1 FM)

Bump
09-10-2011, 01:27 AM
maybe it will come down to a field goal with time running out in overtime.

Guru
09-10-2011, 01:31 AM
maybe it will come down to a field goal with time running out in overtime.

Shut your mouth

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 01:35 AM
Shootout?? Seriously??

Until we get a serious O-line that can truly provide some lanes and protect our QB (a la 2003-2005 O-line) I say we don't average more than 17-20pts a game if we are lucky.

Please don't give me the 1st in rushing in 2010 stat because we had a weakass schedule. This year you will see how truly weak our O-line is with a 'real schedule' and the Balt playoff game from last year was a good hint of how weak our O-line was and still is IMO.

Fruit Ninja
09-10-2011, 01:44 AM
Shootout?? Seriously??

Until we get a serious O-line that can truly provide some lanes and protect our QB (a la 2003-2005 O-line) I say we don't average more than 17-20pts a game if we are lucky.

Please don't give me the 1st in rushing in 2010 stat because we had a weakass schedule. This year you will see how truly weak our O-line is with a 'real schedule' and the Balt playoff game from last year was a good hint of how weak our O-line was and still is IMO.

imma turn it around n say untilw e get serious qb that can make some plays and carry the team, i dont say we average more then 17-20 pts a game

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 01:53 AM
imma turn it around n say untilw e get serious qb that can make some plays and carry the team, i dont say we average more then 17-20 pts a game

I actually forgot to put Cassel in there and yes you are correct:thumb:

But I would even bump it up to 20-23 pts a game if Cassel had the O-line from 2003-2005 but no more than that because well you know it's Matt.;)

ChiefsNow
09-10-2011, 01:54 AM
I'm not getting on this wagon. I really think Haley wants to open it up.

dannybcaitlyn
09-10-2011, 01:57 AM
Shootout?? Seriously??

Until we get a serious O-line that can truly provide some lanes and protect our QB (a la 2003-2005 O-line) I say we don't average more than 17-20pts a game if we are lucky.

Please don't give me the 1st in rushing in 2010 stat because we had a weakass schedule. This year you will see how truly weak our O-line is with a 'real schedule' and the Balt playoff game from last year was a good hint of how weak our O-line was and still is IMO.

We need a serious QB also. Watching them QB'S thursday made me want to slap Cassel.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 02:00 AM
I'm not getting on this wagon. I really think Haley wants to open it up.

He may want to open it up but Cassel will be on his ass with our RBs having no lanes and only one WR who consistently catches the ball in Breaston. Please don't give me the Bowe TD stat from last yr either with a weakass schedule. We'll see what he does 'THIS' Year with a real schedule and I predict he will continue to have ADD of the hands at the most "inopportune time" assuming Cassel has enough time to throw.

Not trying to be a "Debbie Downer" but I deal in reality and am already preparing myself emotionally so much so I did not purchase the NFL Ticket this year.;)

Guru
09-10-2011, 02:00 AM
I'm not getting on this wagon. I really think Haley wants to open it up.

He'll need a different QB for that.

Thig Lyfe
09-10-2011, 02:02 AM
I'd think defenses would actually have more trouble since they have to react to what the offense does, meaning if they're a little rusty it would be harder to adjust in-game.

ThaVirus
09-10-2011, 02:04 AM
Shootout?? Seriously??

Until we get a serious O-line that can truly provide some lanes and protect our QB (a la 2003-2005 O-line) I say we don't average more than 17-20pts a game if we are lucky.

Please don't give me the 1st in rushing in 2010 stat because we had a weakass schedule. This year you will see how truly weak our O-line is with a 'real schedule' and the Balt playoff game from last year was a good hint of how weak our O-line was and still is IMO.

Charles averaged like 8 ypc in that playoff game last year. We were pretty much having our way with them on the ground until Charles coughed it up and didn't touch the ball anymore... pass protection was a whole different story, I know.

KC_Connection
09-10-2011, 02:08 AM
I did pick up the Chiefs defense in fantasy for this reason. Don't fail me now.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 02:10 AM
I'd think defenses would actually have more trouble since they have to react to what the offense does, meaning if they're a little rusty it would be harder to adjust in-game.

I would agree if we had a good O-line at this point but we don't so therefore D's will dictate the trench(a la no pass and no run) and that is not good.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 02:13 AM
I did pick up the Chiefs defense in fantasy for this reason. Don't fail me now.

I was tempted myself but here is what is going to happen our D will be on the field 2/3rds of the game and you know what that means. Until Houston starts I won't even think of it. Houston is flat out a playmaker.:clap:

JASONSAUTO
09-10-2011, 02:21 AM
He may want to open it up but Cassel will be on his ass with our RBs having no lanes and only one WR who consistently catches the ball in Breaston. Please don't give me the Bowe TD stat from last yr either with a weakass schedule. We'll see what he does 'THIS' Year with a real schedule and I predict he will continue to have ADD of the hands at the most "inopportune time" assuming Cassel has enough time to throw.

Not trying to be a "Debbie Downer" but I deal in reality and am already preparing myself emotionally so much so I did not purchase the NFL Ticket this year.;)
Might as well just shoot yourself in the face right now.

12 gauge
Posted via Mobile Device

Just Passin' By
09-10-2011, 02:29 AM
Shootout?? Seriously??

Until we get a serious O-line that can truly provide some lanes and protect our QB (a la 2003-2005 O-line) I say we don't average more than 17-20pts a game if we are lucky.

Please don't give me the 1st in rushing in 2010 stat because we had a weakass schedule. This year you will see how truly weak our O-line is with a 'real schedule' and the Balt playoff game from last year was a good hint of how weak our O-line was and still is IMO.

imma turn it around n say untilw e get serious qb that can make some plays and carry the team, i dont say we average more then 17-20 pts a game

The Chiefs averaged 23 ppg last season, so I don't really get what you two are about here.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 02:30 AM
Charles averaged like 8 ypc in that playoff game last year. We were pretty much having our way with them on the ground until Charles coughed it up and didn't touch the ball anymore... pass protection was a whole different story, I know.

Initially you are correct about Charles and he still should have had more than 9 rushing attempts and only 1 receiving attempt but Weis pulled the plug or was it Haley? Who knows?

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 02:35 AM
I don't know what football team you two followed last year, but the Chiefs averaged 23 ppg.

Read closely my replies my friend. I am talking about last years weakass schedule and why it was much easier for Bowe and Charles to light it up statistically. But this year with a much tougher schedule with a young O-line that hasn't been much to brag about those stats all the way around won't be there IMO.

Just Passin' By
09-10-2011, 03:05 AM
Read closely my replies my friend. I am talking about last years weakass schedule and why it was much easier for Bowe and Charles to light it up statistically. But this year with a much tougher schedule with a young O-line that hasn't been much to brag about those stats all the way around won't be there IMO.

I read your replies. I agree that the schedule is much harder. You were saying that they won't beat 17-20 points even if they got lucky, though. That didn't make any sense to me.

I say we don't average more than 17-20pts a game if we are lucky.

Only the Panthers at 12.2 ppg, and the Browns at 16.9 ppg, finished under 17 ppg last year. Are you saying that you think the Chiefs will be a bottom 2 type of offense this season?

milkman
09-10-2011, 07:17 AM
Shootout?? Seriously??

Until we get a serious O-line that can truly provide some lanes and protect our QB (a la 2003-2005 O-line) I say we don't average more than 17-20pts a game if we are lucky.

Please don't give me the 1st in rushing in 2010 stat because we had a weakass schedule. This year you will see how truly weak our O-line is with a 'real schedule' and the Balt playoff game from last year was a good hint of how weak our O-line was and still is IMO.

Do you even watch football?

JFC, you dumbass, that line from '02 to '05 was a once in a lifetime group.

Aaron Rodgers didn't have all kinds of time in the pocket against the Saints, whose defense isn't anything to write home about.

He makes lightening quick decisions and throws.
He has outstsanding pocket mobility.

He was making plays as the pocket was collapsing around him.

James Starks, meanwhile was breaking tackles.

The Chiefs O-Line isn't good, but the Pack aren't really any better, except at RT.

donkhater
09-10-2011, 07:27 AM
Only the Panthers at 12.2 ppg, and the Browns at 16.9 ppg, finished under 17 ppg last year. Are you saying that you think the Chiefs will be a bottom 2 type of offense this season?

Obviously. Because Cassell is the worst QB to lace up shoestrings EVER. He has brains of Leaf, the arm of Couch, and the ability to avoid the rush of Huard. Those 27 TDs last year were against the school of the blind not Professional football teams. THIS year well see just how bad he is.:)

Marcellus
09-10-2011, 07:33 AM
The Chiefs averaged 23 ppg last season, so I don't really get what you two are about here.

Beat me to it. I love how people just spew shit without knowing a damn thing about what they are saying.

I knew we averaged more than that last year without having to think twice about it but I should probably listen to their opinion first I guess.

kstater
09-10-2011, 07:44 AM
The Chiefs averaged 23 ppg last season, so I don't really get what you two are about here.

It's amazing all the doom and gloom around here. It's like the Herm years never existed, and this is the worst team ever.

Tribal Warfare
09-10-2011, 08:07 AM
It's amazing all the doom and gloom around here. It's like the Herm years never existed, and this is the worst team ever.

KC is still in football purgatory until they get a legitimate franchise QB, it's not doom gloom it's more like vexed then anything else .

WhiteWhale
09-10-2011, 08:16 AM
I actually forgot to put Cassel in there and yes you are correct:thumb:

But I would even bump it up to 20-23 pts a game if Cassel had the O-line from 2003-2005 but no more than that because well you know it's Matt.;)

So we can't have a good offense unless we have 2 future HOFers on the OL and at least one other all-pro?

Why? Does any current offensive powerhouse have an OL that good?

WhiteWhale
09-10-2011, 08:20 AM
KC is still in football purgatory until they get a legitimate franchise QB, it's not doom gloom it's more like vexed then anything else .

He's not the worst, but he's not the type of player who makes everyone on the offense better.

He's an average QB. A mediocre player. The type of player you *might* catch lightning in a bottle with if the defense is a top 3 unit and everything on offense clicks around him.

He doesn't give us an advantage though.

And people need to shut up about the probowl. Elvis Grbac and Steve Bono BOTH made probowls in KC. In Bono's case it was against a cupcake schedule. They were both about the same type of QB Cassel is... a back up who's starting on a team without the nerve to roll the dice on developing their own QB.

We'll probably win the same amount of playoff games with him as well. I've seen this play before. I know what happens in the 3rd act.

BmoreBills
09-10-2011, 08:30 AM
He's not the worst, but he's not the type of player who makes everyone on the offense better.

He's an average QB. A mediocre player. The type of player you *might* catch lightning in a bottle with if the defense is a top 3 unit and everything on offense clicks around him.

He doesn't give us an advantage though.

And people need to shut up about the probowl. Elvis Grbac and Steve Bono BOTH made probowls in KC. In Bono's case it was against a cupcake schedule. They were both about the same type of QB Cassel is... a back up who's starting on a team without the nerve to roll the dice on developing their own QB.

We'll probably win the same amount of playoff games with him as well. I've seen this play before. I know what happens in the 3rd act.

We had a thread at TBD that was asking about what the Chiefs would gameplan for, and I think it is obvious- pick on our secondary with reckless abandon and add a blocker, because now the weakness in our defense is a complete lack of depth at safety and defensive back. If Cassel can get the ball down the field, we might be in trouble. The difference from the last game is that we have boosted our run defense, so now Cassel may very well have to win the game.

milkman
09-10-2011, 08:44 AM
KC is still in football purgatory until they get a legitimate franchise QB, it's not doom gloom it's more like vexed then anything else .

You are a fucking idiot.

I don't even disagree with your post, I simply believe that it can not be said enough that you are a fucking idiot.

jspchief
09-10-2011, 08:47 AM
We had a thread at TBD that was asking about what the Chiefs would gameplan for, and I think it is obvious- pick on our secondary with reckless abandon and add a blocker, because now the weakness in our defense is a complete lack of depth at safety and defensive back. If Cassel can get the ball down the field, we might be in trouble. The difference from the last game is that we have boosted our run defense, so now Cassel may very well have to win the game. I doubt our gameplan revolves around the passing game in any form. At best, it will be run heavy with an inordinate amount screens and 5 yard passes. Unless your pass rush is invisible, in which case Cassel will carve it up.

Pasta Giant Meatball
09-10-2011, 08:51 AM
Shootout?? Seriously??

Until we get a serious O-line that can truly provide some lanes and protect our QB (a la 2003-2005 O-line) I say we don't average more than 17-20pts a game if we are lucky.

Please don't give me the 1st in rushing in 2010 stat because we had a weakass schedule. This year you will see how truly weak our O-line is with a 'real schedule' and the Balt playoff game from last year was a good hint of how weak our O-line was and still is IMO.

The Chiefs averaged over 20 points a game after Charles took over in 09. That squad was far worse off than the one we have now. They scored over 20 a game last year. (Yeah, yeah cram the "weak schedule BS).

The team will be much better offensively (comparison to preseason play here) with 25 on the field more when the real games start this Sunday. They aren't facing the Ravens D this week, not even close.

Extra Point
09-10-2011, 08:52 AM
How many people will be bitching that we don't pass on the first play of the game?

Not I, said the dog. I won't be surprised if we run on 65% of offensive plays, and not R2P2.

Pasta Giant Meatball
09-10-2011, 08:56 AM
The Chiefs averaged 23 ppg last season, so I don't really get what you two are about here.

ROFL Absolutely ridiculous isn't it?? But, but, but, but, but those games don't count.

BmoreBills
09-10-2011, 09:14 AM
I doubt our gameplan revolves around the passing game in any form. At best, it will be run heavy with an inordinate amount screens and 5 yard passes. Unless your pass rush is invisible, in which case Cassel will carve it up.

In that case, you may very well be playing into the hands of our strength on defense. We've replaced three average starters on the front 7 with Dareus, Merriman, and Barnett, and so this isn't the same sucky, weak run defense (if you could call it that). I know this will be a defensive game, but it will come down to who turns the ball over the least.

Hog Farmer
09-10-2011, 09:19 AM
Mike and Mike on Espn said the player to watch this weekend would be Jamaal Charles going against last years 32nd rated run defense. But I predict by the end of the Year it will be the McCluster show.

BmoreBills
09-10-2011, 09:24 AM
Mike and Mike on Espn said the player to watch this weekend would be Jamaal Charles going against last years 32nd rated run defense. But I predict by the end of the Year it will be the McCluster show.

When Posluzny, Troup and Moats come back to start on our line, then I'll give them that, but teams do make upgrades in the offseason. Which Mike said that, or was it one of their magical guests? I already know that Greeny would be the one to say that... fuggin Jets...

Deberg_1990
09-10-2011, 09:29 AM
This story sounds like lowering expectations
Posted via Mobile Device

Red Beans
09-10-2011, 10:19 AM
I did pick up the Chiefs defense in fantasy for this reason. Don't fail me now.


You and I both are crazy then...

Pasta Giant Meatball
09-10-2011, 10:20 AM
You and I both are crazy then...

Seems like a pretty smart play to me.

boogblaster
09-10-2011, 10:49 AM
if .. and i said if .. our O-line can somehow block this year .. and our LBers can cover the short and tailing routes .. we might be in bout every game ....

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 10:51 AM
Do you even watch football?

JFC, you dumbass, that line from '02 to '05 was a once in a lifetime group.

Aaron Rodgers didn't have all kinds of time in the pocket against the Saints, whose defense isn't anything to write home about.

He makes lightening quick decisions and throws.
He has outstsanding pocket mobility.

He was making plays as the pocket was collapsing around him.

James Starks, meanwhile was breaking tackles.

The Chiefs O-Line isn't good, but the Pack aren't really any better, except at RT.

Your subconscious anxiety about the reality of our schedule and mediocre O-line play(at best) is beginning to bleed through.:hmmm:

Take some 'paxil' along with your milk this a.m., uh?

BmoreBills
09-10-2011, 10:53 AM
You and I both are crazy then...

I chose the Steelers defense... nothing gets you more points over the many years I have been doing this. I don't have one Buffalo Bill on my team- I play to win :P

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 10:58 AM
The Chiefs averaged over 20 points a game after Charles took over in 09. That squad was far worse off than the one we have now. They scored over 20 a game last year. (Yeah, yeah cram the "weak schedule BS).

The team will be much better offensively (comparison to preseason play here) with 25 on the field more when the real games start this Sunday. They aren't facing the Ravens D this week, not even close.

09 & 10 were weakass schedules PERIOD. Yes the squad from 09 was worse I agree but you CAN'T CRAM/AVOID THE OBVIOUS and this year will be much more difficult with a much harder schedule/mediocre O-line and now with Moe out it sure doesn't help the avg PPG issue.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 10:58 AM
I chose the Steelers defense... nothing gets you more points over the many years I have been doing this. I don't have one Buffalo Bill on my team- I play to win :P

Same here!!

milkman
09-10-2011, 11:05 AM
Your subconscious anxiety about the reality of our schedule and mediocre O-line play(at best) is beginning to bleed through.:hmmm:

Take some 'paxil' along with your milk this a.m., uh?

Don't try to analyze me over the internet.

My anxiety about the O-Line is conscious.
I know what they are.

I also know that you don't have a clue about the Pack's O-Line.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 11:14 AM
I read your replies. I agree that the schedule is much harder. You were saying that they won't beat 17-20 points even if they got lucky, though. That didn't make any sense to me.



Only the Panthers at 12.2 ppg, and the Browns at 16.9 ppg, finished under 17 ppg last year. Are you saying that you think the Chiefs will be a bottom 2 type of offense this season?

What I'm saying is that with the much tougher schedule(a la playing much better and stouter D's with some having superior CB tandems and brick wall D lines) with a mediocre O-line(on a good day at best) with Moe out and Cassel at the helm you should brace yourself emotionally for a potential very disappointing season.

God let's hope not but I deal in reality and the pre-season was just flat out ugly(except for Houston, Stanzi & Palko). And please let's not stay in our denial stating that "pre-season play" is irrelevant and doesn't count and the Colts go 0-4 every pre-season because that is far different than what is reality for our Chiefs meaning "trust your eyes" and see that our O-line is not good. Our QB's were either running for their life or on their ass and our RBs had no real lanes to run through.

Remember JC and how disappointed he was in himself that he didn't have any long runs this pre-season?

There is a reason why.

IMO our weakass schedule from the last 2yrs will expose us this year and I hope I'm proven wrong.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 11:26 AM
Don't try to analyze me over the internet.

My anxiety about the O-Line is conscious.
I know what they are.

I also know that you don't have a clue about the Pack's O-Line.

Hey the Pack and the Saints are SB champs both within the last 3yrs.

SUPER BOWL CHAMPS, MILK !!!!!

DO OUR CHIEFS HAVE EVEN HAVE HALF THE O-LINE TALENT OF THESE SB CHAMPS O-LINES???? OF COURSE NOT!!!

TWO SB TEAMS WITHIN THE LAST 3YRS WHO "PLAYED EACH OTHER" IF YOU DIDN'T NOTICE THIS LAST THURS NIGHT.

LOOK AT BOTH SB TEAMS PLAYING EACH OTHER "IN PROPER CONTEXT"!!!!

BmoreBills
09-10-2011, 11:28 AM
Same here!!

Did you follow Mike & Mike where Greeny said he'd never draft a Patriot? He's pretty hardcore about it.. he'll be dead last in no time :P

The Bad Guy
09-10-2011, 11:30 AM
Shootout?? Seriously??

Until we get a serious O-line that can truly provide some lanes and protect our QB (a la 2003-2005 O-line) I say we don't average more than 17-20pts a game if we are lucky.

Please don't give me the 1st in rushing in 2010 stat because we had a weakass schedule. This year you will see how truly weak our O-line is with a 'real schedule' and the Balt playoff game from last year was a good hint of how weak our O-line was and still is IMO.

They ran on the Chargers and they ran on the 49ers.

You know what, you are right. We should invalidate all their stats since they played the schedule they did.

Funny, I don't see fans rushing out to invalidate the Chargers D, or their offense when they played basically the same schedule, sans 2 games.

The Bad Guy
09-10-2011, 11:31 AM
Hey the Pack and the Saints are SB champs both within the last 3yrs.

SUPER BOWL CHAMPS, MILK !!!!!

DO OUR CHIEFS HAVE EVEN HAVE HALF THE O-LINE TALENT OF THESE SB CHAMPS O-LINES???? OF COURSE NOT!!!

TWO SB TEAMS WITHIN THE LAST 3YRS WHO "PLAYED EACH OTHER" IF YOU DIDN'T NOTICE THIS LAST THURS NIGHT.

LOOK AT BOTH SB TEAMS PLAYING EACH OTHER "IN PROPER CONTEXT"!!!!

Do you even know who's on the Saints line? They have one stud player, one good player and a bunch of fringe players.

By your complete bullshit rational, Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfer must be stud QBs because they won a SB.

Count Alex's Wins
09-10-2011, 11:32 AM
DO OUR CHIEFS HAVE EVEN HAVE HALF THE O-LINE TALENT OF THESE SB CHAMPS O-LINES???? OF COURSE NOT!!!


You don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

Jermon Bushrod is a terrible left tackle for the Saints.

beach tribe
09-10-2011, 11:40 AM
You don't know what the **** you're talking about.

Jermon Bushrod is a terrible left tackle for the Saints.

No. He doesn't know what the **** he's talking about. To even suggest that this team is not going to be able to run the ball is just ridiculous.
We are going to ****ing POUND people on the ground this season.
McClain is arguably the best blocking FB in the NFL.
By the 4th qtr. JC and DMC are going to be ripping off yards in huge chunks, and their effectiveness is going to set up play-action that will slow down the pass rush until we can figure out how to stop player from getting past the Ts.
I think Albert is going to be OK, but we need Pope to be glued to Richardson's hip.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 11:42 AM
Funny, I don't see fans rushing out to invalidate the Chargers D, or their offense when they played basically the same schedule, sans 2 games.

Rivers is the reason why they don't invalidate their O. Versus Cassel? Pleeeease. And had SD known their ST play was really that bad last yr and did something about it early on they would have been Divisional Champs IMO.

Like I said, I hope this season is not going to be as disappointing as I think it will be and I do apologize for being a "Debbie Downer" but I deal in reality and what I see.

Buffalo ain't gonna be no rollover either and I see Fitz as a better QB than Cassel.

beach tribe
09-10-2011, 11:44 AM
God let's hope not but I deal in reality and the pre-season was just flat out ugly


This is an oxymoron. If you think what you saw in the pre-season is sure fire proof that we are going to flat out suck, you are not dealing in reality.

beach tribe
09-10-2011, 11:45 AM
I see Fitz as a better QB than Cassel.

This tells me all I need to know.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 11:49 AM
By your complete bullshit rational, Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfer must be stud QBs because they won a SB.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO they had stud O-lines who protected very well and run blocked very effectively. And these so-called "fringe players" are "diamonds in the rough" and the result of excellent scouting and will get their just do in due time. Let's hope this is the same for Hudson/AsM which I think it will.

whoman69
09-10-2011, 11:53 AM
You can talk all about last year and how much we scored. At this point of the season it looks pretty clear this team is not ready offensively. I would be very surprised to see this team surpass 20 points in this game.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 11:56 AM
This tells me all I need to know.

Remember last year when Fitz & Co. came to town? Bills should have won that game and Fitz was not only a better QB that game but a better QB overall IMO.

beach tribe
09-10-2011, 11:56 AM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOO they had stud O-lines who protected very well and run blocked very effectively. And these so-called "fringe players" are "diamonds in the rough" and the result of excellent scouting and will get their just do in due time. Let's hope this is the same for Hudson/AsM which I think it will.

I fully expect Hudson, and Big Jon to be upgrades at their positions once they are acclimated. Which means...improvement.

Oh, and that Attitude you were talking about?
Big MFing Jon has plenty of it, and will soon smear it on his line mates. You watch. This guy is down right Nasty. Like I said, we are going to ****ing RAPE people on the ground this season. So much so that single coverage is going to thrown at us on the regular. Have you seen what Bowe does to single coverage? Well Baldwin capable of the same thing.
Buck up. There is plenty of reason for you to put the white flag away, and wear your Chiefs gear in public.....Nancy

beach tribe
09-10-2011, 12:05 PM
Remember last year when Fitz & Co. came to town? Bills should have won that game and Fitz was not only a better QB that game but a better QB overall IMO.

Do you even remember how that game ended? Maybe you should watch it again. Cassel looked damn good in the final game-winning drive.

Fitz: 24/48 223yrds 4.6av 1TD 1INT 61.4 rating (Awesome)


Cassel: 14/26 152yrds 5.8av 1TD 0INT 84.1 rating.
(And delivered the game winning drive)

We ran the ball 45 times at an average of 6.1 ypc. Had Cassel thrown the ball as many times as Fitz he would have been right at 300 yards.
But you just keep talking out of your ass, and sucking the dick of everything Not the Chiefs.

beach tribe
09-10-2011, 12:10 PM
Fitz was not only a better QB that game but a better QB overall IMO.


Sure he was. He only had Fewer TDs, less yards, more INTs, a lower average per attempt, lower completion percentage, and lower rating with 4 less wins.

That all translates to him being the better player.

KcMizzou
09-10-2011, 12:11 PM
Sure he was. He only had Fewer TDs, less yards, more INTs, a lower average per attempt, lower completion percentage, and lower rating with 4 less wins.

That all translates to him being the better player.LMAO

beach tribe
09-10-2011, 12:21 PM
LMAO

I was LMAO too.
He doesn't have much to say now.
It's pretty evident that he didn't watch more than 1 Bills game other than the one against us, but Fitz it the better QB in his opinion.
His opinions are skewed by his defeatist point of view though. He can't help it.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 12:28 PM
Sure he was. He only had Fewer TDs, less yards, more INTs, a lower average per attempt, lower completion percentage, and lower rating with 4 less wins.

That all translates to him being the better player.

Nah, I get your stats point here and I should have clarified my statement about better overall QB. As the season went on for Fitz he was everybit as much the QB Cassel was if not a little more showing much better composure, decision making and playmaking ability IMO.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 12:32 PM
I fully expect Hudson, and Big Jon to be upgrades at their positions once they are acclimated. Which means...improvement.

Oh, and that Attitude you were talking about?
Big MFing Jon has plenty of it, and will soon smear it on his line mates. You watch. This guy is down right Nasty. Like I said, we are going to ****ing RAPE people on the ground this season. So much so that single coverage is going to thrown at us on the regular. Have you seen what Bowe does to single coverage? Well Baldwin capable of the same thing.
Buck up. There is plenty of reason for you to put the white flag away, and wear your Chiefs gear in public.....Nancy

Let's hope.....:homer:

bobbything
09-10-2011, 12:38 PM
We're going to win this game by 10 points. Our defense is going to play great. The offense will be solid. The game is at home. We have upgraded in a number of key areas. The defense is a year older. It's the Bills. We ran for like a bazillion yards against them last year.

23-13 Good Guys.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 12:40 PM
He doesn't have much to say now.
.

Here is an NFL litmus acumen question for you.

Take the last play of Thursday nights game on the 1yd line but you do not have Brees QBing. You only have 2 choices of Cassel or Fitz to execute 2 plays to tie the game. The first play which is the last play of regulation to get your 6 and then the last play to get your 2 to go into overtime.

Who do you play at QB that gives you the best chance for making those 2 plays successful?

You trust Cassel more???

beach tribe
09-10-2011, 12:42 PM
Nah, I get your stats point here and I should have clarified my statement about better overall QB. As the season went on for Fitz he was everybit as much the QB Cassel was if not a little more showing much better composure, decision making and playmaking ability IMO.

Bullshit. What did you watch all of the Bills games last season? Look at the #s for the games. Cassel is the one whose # improved throughout the season right up until Weis fucked up the offensive rhythm, and Cassel looked like shit, and lost his composure.
If Cassel can keep from panicking, and keep the poise that he had mid-season last year, (that completely disappeared during the Oak. game because our whole offense was getting their shit pushed in) he is twice the QB that Fitz is.
When Cassel is comfortable (and I know he hasn't proven that he can stay comfortable yet) He is head, and fucking shoulders above RF.
Until then he is only a little better, but definitely better.

bobbything
09-10-2011, 12:45 PM
Here is an NFL litmus acumen question for you.

Take the last play of Thursday nights game on the 1yd line but you do not have Brees QBing. You only have 2 choices of Cassel or Fitz to execute 2 plays to tie the game. The first play which is the last play of regulation to get your 6 and then the last play to get your 2 to go into overtime.

Who do you play at QB that gives you the best chance for making those 2 plays successful?

You trust Cassel more???
Bring in Palko and hand it off to Charles.

beach tribe
09-10-2011, 12:45 PM
Here is an NFL litmus acumen question for you.

Take the last play of Thursday nights game on the 1yd line but you do not have Brees QBing. You only have 2 choices of Cassel or Fitz to execute 2 plays to tie the game. The first play which is the last play of regulation to get your 6 and then the last play to get your 2 to go into overtime.

Who do you play at QB that gives you the best chance for making those 2 plays successful?

You trust Cassel more???

**** Yeah. Cassel to Bowe!! They did just that many times last season. Why the **** would I choose the guy who lost more games, and threw more INTs, and fewer TDs? Why would I do that, and not choose the guy who led the game winning drive against the team led by the latter.

jspchief
09-10-2011, 12:48 PM
Here is an NFL litmus acumen question for you.

Take the last play of Thursday nights game on the 1yd line but you do not have Brees QBing. You only have 2 choices of Cassel or Fitz to execute 2 plays to tie the game. The first play which is the last play of regulation to get your 6 and then the last play to get your 2 to go into overtime.

Who do you play at QB that gives you the best chance for making those 2 plays successful?

You trust Cassel more???I don't particularly like either one in that situation.

But I have 2 questions..

1. What does that very specific scenario have to do with this game? It's very unlikely that it comes down to that.

2. How many Chiefs fans can honestly claim to have even a minor clue about Fitzpatrick? Really? You watched a lot of the Bills last year?

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 12:57 PM
Bring in Palko and hand it off to Charles.

LMAO

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 01:01 PM
I don't particularly like either one in that situation.

But I have 2 questions..

1. What does that very specific scenario have to do with this game? It's very unlikely that it comes down to that.

2. How many Chiefs fans can honestly claim to have even a minor clue about Fitzpatrick? Really? You watched a lot of the Bills last year?

NFL ticket and Fitz had the equivalent talent of the 09 Chiefs to work with, with the exception of S Johnson and why his stats weren't as good. He is a good QB to watch and I think you will see the difference tomorrow.

beach tribe
09-10-2011, 01:09 PM
NFL ticket and Fitz had the equivalent talent of the 09 Chiefs to work with, with the exception of S Johnson and why his stats weren't as good. He is a good QB to watch and I think you will see the difference tomorrow.

They had as much talent as the 09' Chiefs huh?
And in this past off-season they've added the pieces kick our asses no problem?
Cassel didn't exactly have an arsenal of weapons at his disposal either. Not to mention horrible protection.
My guess is Eric Berry Picks off Fitz,(just like last time) and the D shuts these guys the F down. I can't wait till tomorrow to see Fitz in all his majestic glory.
I hope Cassel is paying close attention, and taking notes so he can strive to one day be the player that RF is.:rolleyes:

jspchief
09-10-2011, 01:09 PM
NFL ticket and Fitz had the equivalent talent of the 09 Chiefs to work with, with the exception of S Johnson and why his stats weren't as good. He is a good QB to watch and I think you will see the difference tomorrow.Look, there are a lot of individual situations where I'd prefer Fitzpatrick. Needing a quick score, or needing to erase a large deficit for example. But he's erratic as hell. Claiming to prefer him over Cassel in the absence of specific scenarios strikes me as absurd.

"Good to watch" doesn't equal "good NFL QB"

As for using the Sunday Ticket to build your opinion of him, again, I have serious doubts that many Chiefs fans have seen enough of him to be particularly informed. Even with every game available, and having a TV to present all of them at once, I doubt many NFL fans focused on the Bills' QB play outside of when their team faced Buffalo.

Chiefnj2
09-10-2011, 01:11 PM
Cassel still isn't confident. You get him started nice and slow with some easy passes, then he can build his confidence and put together a solid game where he doesn't hurt the team. You pressure him early or ask him to do things he isn't that great at then you are in for a long day.

beach tribe
09-10-2011, 01:13 PM
Look, there are a lot of individual situations where I'd prefer Fitzpatrick. Needing a quick score, or needing to erase a large deficit for example. But he's erratic as hell. Claiming to prefer him over Cassel in the absence of specific scenarios strikes me as absurd.

"Good to watch" doesn't equal "good NFL QB"

As for using the Sunday Ticket to build your opinion of him, again, I have serious doubts that many Chiefs fans have seen enough of him to be particularly informed. Even with every game available, and having a TV to present all of them at once, I doubt many NFL fans focused on the Bills' QB play outside of when their team faced Buffalo.

Exactly what I was thinking. You can only watch one game at a time, and I seriously doubt that SS was giving airtime to the 6-10 Bills, and their 27th ranked QB. Seriously. C'mon.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 01:27 PM
**** Yeah. Cassel to Bowe!! They did just that many times last season. Why the **** would I choose the guy who lost more games, and threw more INTs, and fewer TDs? Why would I do that, and not choose the guy who led the game winning drive against the team led by the latter.

I totally get your logic here but as you said in one of your previous posts Cassel still panicks(and there is the 'rub' for me) and after watching Fitz on the Ticket last yr after he played the Chiefs from there on out with the lack of talent around him Fitz showed more composure,accuracy and playmaking ability than Cassel thus is why I would trust Fitz with Bowe and Breaston on that last play of the game.

I'm tellin ya Fitz has moxy and is alot better than you think.

BTW, Payton blew that call on the 1yd line. Up the middle on Raji the way he was playing???

Where was the fake dive roll out pass to Graham, Henderson, or Meachem? Even if they were looking for it and regardless if Colston was already hurt !!! No way in hell they run it up the middle.

Bottom line: I would choose the fake dive roll out pass from Fitz to Bowe having more of a chance to succeed than with Cassel based on composure and playmaking ability alone 9 times out of 10 based on what I saw last yr from Fitz in 10.

Just Passin' By
09-10-2011, 01:31 PM
Here is an NFL litmus acumen question for you.

Take the last play of Thursday nights game on the 1yd line but you do not have Brees QBing. You only have 2 choices of Cassel or Fitz to execute 2 plays to tie the game. The first play which is the last play of regulation to get your 6 and then the last play to get your 2 to go into overtime.

Who do you play at QB that gives you the best chance for making those 2 plays successful?

You trust Cassel more???

Cassel, and the numbers bear it out.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/players/7406/situational;_ylt=AnAcIzC96biUVWpTnK9ojQf.uLYF?year=career

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/players/7426/situational;_ylt=AnAcIzC96biUVWpTnK9ojQf.uLYF?year=career

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 01:31 PM
Look, there are a lot of individual situations where I'd prefer Fitzpatrick. Needing a quick score, or needing to erase a large deficit for example. But he's erratic as hell. Claiming to prefer him over Cassel in the absence of specific scenarios strikes me as absurd.

"Good to watch" doesn't equal "good NFL QB"

As for using the Sunday Ticket to build your opinion of him, again, I have serious doubts that many Chiefs fans have seen enough of him to be particularly informed. Even with every game available, and having a TV to present all of them at once, I doubt many NFL fans focused on the Bills' QB play outside of when their team faced Buffalo.

We'll agree to disagree but I go with composure and playmaker ability and that would be Fitz at this point. His erraticness was based on his lack of talent around him and trying to do more than he could but it wasn't because he couldn't read D's or make plays and that just comes with time IMO.

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 01:32 PM
Cassel, and the numbers bear it out.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/players/7406/situational;_ylt=AnAcIzC96biUVWpTnK9ojQf.uLYF?year=career

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/players/7426/situational;_ylt=AnAcIzC96biUVWpTnK9ojQf.uLYF?year=career

We're talking situational football here.;)

Just Passin' By
09-10-2011, 01:33 PM
We're talking situational football here.;)

I posted the links to the situational stats...

Chiefshrink
09-10-2011, 01:33 PM
Gotta go fellas! Love the conversation!!! Gotta watch my kid go kick some a$$ playing LB!!

beach tribe
09-10-2011, 01:45 PM
Gotta go fellas! Love the conversation!!! Gotta watch my kid go kick some a$$ playing LB!!

Umm, those stats are for exactly that situation, and as is the case between these two QBs, and every other statistical category, Cassel is better.

What kids organization plays football on Saturday? PeeWee?

Chiefnj2
09-10-2011, 01:46 PM
His erraticness was based on his lack of talent around him and trying to do more than he could but it wasn't because he couldn't read D's or make plays and that just comes with time IMO.

You don't think having no legitimate NFL #2, #3 or #4 WR hampered Cassel?

milkman
09-10-2011, 02:29 PM
Maybe it's just me, but when I was watching the game Thursday night, I saw both defenses getting after the QBs pretty effectively, collapsing the pocket, and getting hits.

Didn't look like either QB had a butt load of time in the pocket all that often.

But they are both QBs that make quick reads, make good decisions and get the ball out.

Those guys perfectly illustrate how a QB can make an O-Line look better than they are.

cdcox
09-10-2011, 02:31 PM
Yep. A good QB can significantly neutralize the effect of a a strong pass rush.

beach tribe
09-10-2011, 02:58 PM
Maybe it's just me, but when I was watching the game Thursday night, I saw both defenses getting after the QBs pretty effectively, collapsing the pocket, and getting hits.

Didn't look like either QB had a butt load of time in the pocket all that often.

But they are both QBs that make quick reads, make good decisions and get the ball out.

Those guys perfectly illustrate how a QB can make an O-Line look better than they are.

Totally agree, and it's really what separates Cassel from those guys. There were times last year(that period when Cassel was poised, and comfortable) when cassel was sliding around in the pocket, stepping up, and even shoulder shrugging guys, and then making the throws. When he does that, he is a top 10 QB. No question in my mind. The problem is when the O-line gets out classed early in the game, Cassel starts losing his confidence in his protection, and starts paying too much attention to the rush. He's got to stop doing it. He makes himself, and the O-line look worse than they really are. He has the ability to avoid the rush, and make plays, but he has to do it with the flow of the game, and stop panicking.
Before the season started last year, I said that the only way Cassel is going to do shit is if he recovers from being shell shocked in 2009, and he finally did somewhere near the middle of the season, only to transform back into his paranoid shell during the Oakland game, and not recover.
I've been looking at Cassel's stats, and watching a bunch of last year's games,
and I'm really not being a homer when I say that this guy can, and I believe he will, continue to improve. I feel as though he's going to recover from the shell shock, and be better than ever.
I'm not blaming the O-line for his failures, because he is also partly to blame for their failures.
What I do know for sure, is that they all need to improve, and everyone has shown positive signs that this will happen except for the one weak link in the chain, Richardson. We all know a chain is only as strong as it's weakest link.
I would really feel so much better if we had someone else manning that spot.

dog14787
09-10-2011, 03:09 PM
Fitz is the Shitz,

In order for Ryan Fitzpatrick to cement the starting job long term he has to produce/win football games,

Starting Sunday with the Chiefs...:)

lcarus
09-10-2011, 03:13 PM
Was anyone expecting a shootout between the Chiefs and Bills?

DTLB58
09-10-2011, 03:27 PM
Was anyone expecting a shootout between the Chiefs and Bills?

Nope, Chiefs can't score that many, well on offense anyways. If the D and ST come thru maybe they hit 30 otherwise I say 17.

FAX
09-10-2011, 03:33 PM
I wonder if we'll actually be able to see the impact (or lack thereof) that Zorn has had on the offense?

It would be nice to see a more confident, relaxed Cassel in the pocket. Otherwise, look out Mr. crossbar.

FAX

DTLB58
09-10-2011, 03:43 PM
Do you even watch football?

JFC, you dumbass, that line from '02 to '05 was a once in a lifetime group.

Aaron Rodgers didn't have all kinds of time in the pocket against the Saints, whose defense isn't anything to write home about.

He makes lightening quick decisions and throws.
He has outstsanding pocket mobility.

He was making plays as the pocket was collapsing around him.

James Starks, meanwhile was breaking tackles.

The Chiefs O-Line isn't good, but the Pack aren't really any better, except at RT.

Why do you feel the need to call somebody names first before stating your point?

This board has become so hostile it's ridiculous.

Pasta Giant Meatball
09-10-2011, 04:23 PM
Anyone who pays 'shrink a dime, is a damn fool.

kstater
09-10-2011, 04:28 PM
Why do you feel the need to call somebody names first before stating your point?

This board has become so hostile it's ridiculous.

To be fair, Sportsshrink is pretty retarded.

Deberg_1990
09-10-2011, 04:51 PM
To be fair, Sportsshrink is pretty retarded.

True. I Also think Milk has been here so long he's grown tired of the retards. Understandable. Everyone handles it in different ways.
Posted via Mobile Device

Okie_Apparition
09-10-2011, 06:28 PM
Initially you are correct about Charles and he still should have had more than 9 rushing attempts and only 1 receiving attempt but Weis pulled the plug or was it Haley? Who knows?

Jamaal was on the ground grabbing at his legs & needed help off the field atleast twice. Convenient memory, hack

big cahones
09-10-2011, 07:39 PM
what happens if kyle williams or dareus get through the line and hit cassell so he lands on this broken rib? is it possible to make it worse? what rib was broken? front or back?

beach tribe
09-10-2011, 08:10 PM
what happens if kyle williams or dareus get through the line and hit cassell so he lands on this broken rib? is it possible to make it worse? what rib was broken? front or back?

big cahones???

Wow. Just wow.

big cahones
09-11-2011, 11:12 AM
boom shaka laka........ he's heating up.

big cahones
09-11-2011, 02:41 PM
it's a blow out.

whoman69
09-11-2011, 02:58 PM
But, but, pre-season doesn't matter.

Chiefshrink
09-13-2011, 01:32 AM
Totally agree, and it's really what separates Cassel from those guys. There were times last year(that period when Cassel was poised, and comfortable) when cassel was sliding around in the pocket, stepping up, and even shoulder shrugging guys, and then making the throws. When he does that, he is a top 10 QB. No question in my mind. The problem is when the O-line gets out classed early in the game, Cassel starts losing his confidence in his protection, and starts paying too much attention to the rush. He's got to stop doing it. He makes himself, and the O-line look worse than they really are. He has the ability to avoid the rush, and make plays, but he has to do it with the flow of the game, and stop panicking.
Before the season started last year, I said that the only way Cassel is going to do shit is if he recovers from being shell shocked in 2009, and he finally did somewhere near the middle of the season, only to transform back into his paranoid shell during the Oakland game, and not recover.
I've been looking at Cassel's stats, and watching a bunch of last year's games,
and I'm really not being a homer when I say that this guy can, and I believe he will, continue to improve. I feel as though he's going to recover from the shell shock, and be better than ever.
I'm not blaming the O-line for his failures, because he is also partly to blame for their failures.
What I do know for sure, is that they all need to improve, and everyone has shown positive signs that this will happen except for the one weak link in the chain, Richardson. We all know a chain is only as strong as it's weakest link.
I would really feel so much better if we had someone else manning that spot.

ROFLROFLROFL

Hey cabana boy!!! Did you pick up Fitzy as your 'solid BU QB' in your fantasy league after watching his 4 laser TD's under pressure with poise and accuracy?? :spock:

Nah, hell no you're not a Cassel homer:rolleyes:

Told ya :shrug:

Chiefshrink
09-13-2011, 01:34 AM
Umm, those stats are for exactly that situation, and as is the case between these two QBs, and every other statistical category, Cassel is better.

What kids organization plays football on Saturday? PeeWee?

LMAOLMAOLMAO Yeah Cassel is better!

Out here in Donkey Dung land Middle School Football is played on Saturday. What difference does it make how old he is or what day?