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Pants
10-21-2011, 01:39 PM
Would you continue to play KU in the state of Kansas if they bolted to the Pac 12?

Jesus Christ, dude. We're talking about Arrowhead here, not Columbia. The football game should stay if it benefits both schools financially. I would say the same thing about the basketball game, but I just don't think KU has anything to gain by scheduling MU in the Sprint center and taking another non-con game out.

DeezNutz
10-21-2011, 01:41 PM
Deuces.

Dew says, indeed.

bobbything
10-21-2011, 01:42 PM
How many football games do KU and MU play against each other per year now?
The rivalry would/will not be anywhere near the same if MU moves conferences. You know that as well as anyone. The rivalry is what it is because they're in the same conference.

Pitt Gorilla
10-21-2011, 01:42 PM
The SEC will be less fun for the fans./KK

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 01:42 PM
Would you continue to play KU in the state of Kansas if they bolted to the Pac 12?

At Livestrong? 30 minutes from Lawrence, and 3 hours from Columbia? Probably not. If the Kansas border stretched over to Arrowhead which is 2 and a half hours from Columbia and an hour and fifteen minutes from Lawrence? Sure.

beer bacon
10-21-2011, 01:43 PM
The rivalry would/will not be anywhere near the same if MU moves conferences. You know that as well as anyone. The rivalry is what it is because they're in the same conference.

Uhhhh, we had a pretty intense rivalry before football and basketball were invented.

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 01:43 PM
The rivalry would/will not be anywhere near the same if MU moves conferences. You know that as well as anyone. The rivalry is what it is because they're in the same conference.

Who is Iowa State's biggest rival?

Mr. Plow
10-21-2011, 01:44 PM
I would say the same thing about the basketball game, but I just don't think KU has anything to gain by scheduling MU in the Sprint center and taking another non-con game out.


Exactly.

patteeu
10-21-2011, 01:44 PM
The ****? What game is KU going to schedule that makes as much money as the Border War at Arrowhead?

As far as Illinois goes, MU/Illinois don't have a 100+ year history. Champaign is 200 miles from the nearest big city in Missouri. Missourians never burned Champaign to the ground. That is a piss-poor comparison.

If KU commits to scheduling MU in it's non-con, their chances of achieving bowl eligibility will take a significant hit. Does anyone believe KU is going to win 3+ games with any regularity in the Big XII?

BigCatDaddy
10-21-2011, 01:44 PM
The SEC will be less fun for the fans./KK

Losing sucks no matter to whom and where you are losing. He's right on that one.

DeezNutz
10-21-2011, 01:45 PM
Mizzou is going to leave to a league of football giants with unbelievable facilities, but we're going to stay stagnant. Less fun for fans.

Real rivals don't do this!

Mr. Plow
10-21-2011, 01:46 PM
The rivalry would/will not be anywhere near the same if MU moves conferences. You know that as well as anyone. The rivalry is what it is because they're in the same conference.

The rivalry is what is because KU hates MU & MU hates KU and we want, and hope for, the worst for our counterpart. It has nothing to do with being in the same conference.

DeezNutz
10-21-2011, 01:46 PM
Mizzou is going to leave to a league of football giants with unbelievable facilities, but we're going to stay stagnant. Less fun for fans.

Real rivals don't do this!

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 01:46 PM
The SEC will be less fun for the fans./KK

I'm going to miss Ames, Lawrence, Manhattan, Waco, Stillwater, etc. when we are forced to play in Gainesville, Athens, Knoxville, Fayetville, Tuscaloosa, Baton Rouge, etc.

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 01:47 PM
If KU commits to scheduling MU in it's non-con, their chances of achieving bowl eligibility will take a significant hit. Does anyone believe KU is going to win 3+ games with any regularity in the Big XII?

I don't think they can win 2+ now. Maybe when the city schools come marching in.

Reerun_KC
10-21-2011, 01:47 PM
I'm going to miss Ames, Lawrence, Manhattan, Waco, Stillwater, etc. when we are forced to play in Gainesville, Athens, Knoxville, Fayetville, Tuscaloosa, Baton Rouge, etc.

Just curious?

do you or did you travel alot for the road games?

Bambi
10-21-2011, 01:48 PM
Great call that last one.

|Zach|
10-21-2011, 01:48 PM
The rivalry is what is because KU hates MU & MU hates KU and we want, and hope for, the worst for our counterpart. It has nothing to do with being in the same conference.

Yea.

Game on I say!

Mr. Plow
10-21-2011, 01:48 PM
I'm going to miss Ames, Lawrence, Manhattan, Waco, Stillwater, etc. when we are forced to play in Gainesville, Athens, Knoxville, Fayetville, Tuscaloosa, Baton Rouge, etc.


Yeah....Columbia ranks right up there with the best SEC towns. Columbia has always been this hidden gem in the crapfest that is the Big 12.

DeezNutz
10-21-2011, 01:49 PM
Yeah....Columbia ranks right up there with the best SEC towns. Columbia has always been this hidden gem in the crapfest that is the Big 12.

Actually, Columbia is a fantastic town, and the seamless blend from university to downtown makes for a great atmosphere.

Pants
10-21-2011, 01:49 PM
Yeah....Columbia ranks right up there with the best SEC towns. Columbia has always been this hidden gem in the crapfest that is the Big 12.

LMAO

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 01:50 PM
Just curious?

do you or did you travel alot for the road games?

I've been to Manhattan, Ames, Lawrence, and Norman. I will plan on making one road game per year in the SEC.

Pants
10-21-2011, 01:51 PM
Just curious?

do you or did you travel alot for the road games?

We already established that he didn't. But that's only because the venues were not up to par. That's probably how all MU fans think which explains why they don't travel.

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 01:51 PM
Yeah....Columbia ranks right up there with the best SEC towns. Columbia has always been this hidden gem in the crapfest that is the Big 12.

Columbia is a fantastic college town. The SEC isn't filled with glamorous destinations, but they are loaded with great college football venues.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 01:53 PM
I really am going to miss going against the old rivals. I mean, just look at this back and forth between the various fans of the assorted schools. That being said, two things -

1) It's going to be a blast forming new rivalries. Yes, we will take it on the chin against these teams the first coule of years, but it can only help us in the long run. If it don't kill ya.....

2) All the KU/KSU/Big XII fans cannot deny that if their schools were offered an opportunity to join the SEC and escape the Texas overlords, every single one of those schools would have jumped feet first at the opportunity. Don't lie, don't act like your school wold be above such actions for the sake of "tradition" or "rivals". You'd be being extremely dishonest with yourself. (I'm not sure of this point has been brought up in this thread or the other one yet, so I figured I'd throw it out there)


Missouri is doing what's best for Missouri, period.

bobbything
10-21-2011, 01:54 PM
The rivalry is what is because KU hates MU & MU hates KU and we want, and hope for, the worst for our counterpart. It has nothing to do with being in the same conference.
If you honestly don't think the rivalry would take a significant hit if KU and MU weren't in the same conference, then arguing about this is moot.

I think it has a lot to do with being in the same conference.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 01:54 PM
Yeah....Columbia ranks right up there with the best SEC towns. Columbia has always been this hidden gem in the crapfest that is the Big 12.

Finally, someone that gets it.

eazyb81
10-21-2011, 01:55 PM
Yeah....Columbia ranks right up there with the best SEC towns. Columbia has always been this hidden gem in the crapfest that is the Big 12.

COLUMBIA — Touting its independent arts scene, quantity of colleges, homecoming traditions and “healthy dose of Southern charm,” Columbia recently landed on Southern Living Magazine’s list of “The South’s Best College Towns.” (http://www.southernliving.com/travel/best-college-towns-00417000074763/)

Mr. Plow
10-21-2011, 01:55 PM
Columbia is a fantastic college town. The SEC isn't filled with glamorous destinations, but they are loaded with great college football venues.


So what exactly makes Columbia a "fantastic college town" and Lawrence/Manhattan/Ames/pretty much every other Big 12 town shitty?

Bowser
10-21-2011, 01:56 PM
So what exactly makes Columbia a "fantastic college town" and Lawrence/Manhattan/Ames/pretty much every other Big 12 town shitty?

Not to answer for him, but who said that?

Mr. Plow
10-21-2011, 01:56 PM
COLUMBIA — Touting its independent arts scene, quantity of colleges, homecoming traditions and “healthy dose of Southern charm,” Columbia recently landed on Southern Living Magazine’s list of “The South’s Best College Towns.” (http://www.southernliving.com/travel/best-college-towns-00417000074763/)


Congrats?

Bowser
10-21-2011, 01:56 PM
Hell, from what I hear, Ames is a kick ass college town.

dirk digler
10-21-2011, 01:56 PM
Caller - MU is already middle to upper level of the SEC :facepalm:

I think they would be about in the same position in either conference football wise.

Pants
10-21-2011, 01:56 PM
So what exactly makes Columbia a "fantastic college town" and Lawrence/Manhattan/Ames/pretty much every other Big 12 town shitty?

Those beautiful red-brick smokestacks strewn all over the place.

kstater
10-21-2011, 01:57 PM
Yeah....Columbia ranks right up there with the best SEC towns. Columbia has always been this hidden gem in the crapfest that is the Big 12.

Sleeping giant

eazyb81
10-21-2011, 01:57 PM
Congrats?

Thanks. You kind of walked right into that one.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 01:57 PM
Those beautiful red-brick smokestacks strewn all over the place.

The SEC agrees with you.

Mr. Plow
10-21-2011, 01:58 PM
Not to answer for him, but who said that?

He didn't say it, but he has certainly implied it throughout the thread.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 01:59 PM
He didn't say it, but he has certainly implied it throughout the thread.

As a Mizzou fan, I would whole heartedly disagree with that sentiment.

Pants
10-21-2011, 01:59 PM
The SEC agrees with you.

LOL

Yeap, that was the deciding factor. How aesthetically [un*]pleasant Columbia is.

*In my subjective and biased opinion.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 02:00 PM
LOL

Yeap, that was the deciding factor. How aesthetically [un]pleasant Columbia is.

In your opinion. Maybe if they'd opened up a few Duds n Suds, Columbia would have a more authentic college town appeal?

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 02:00 PM
So what exactly makes Columbia a "fantastic college town" and Lawrence/Manhattan/Ames/pretty much every other Big 12 town shitty?

Nothing at all. Football games at Memorial Stadium are electric.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 02:02 PM
Look, you fuckers. No matter where Mizzou plays, we will forever be rivals to KU and KSU. It's gotten to where we're arguing over town decor, for God's sake.

Pants
10-21-2011, 02:02 PM
In your opinion. Maybe if they'd opened up a few Duds n Suds, Columbia would have a more authentic college town appeal?

Yeah, I edited that for those who don't understand that tastes are subjective. You do, so you're good. :)

Mr. Plow
10-21-2011, 02:04 PM
As a Mizzou fan, I would whole heartedly disagree with that sentiment.

Maybe I'm taking this wrong....it's been said several times throughout the thread.


I'm going to miss Ames, Lawrence, Manhattan, Waco, Stillwater, etc. when we are forced to play in Gainesville, Athens, Knoxville, Fayetville, Tuscaloosa, Baton Rouge, etc.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 02:04 PM
Yeah, I edited that for those who don't understand that tastes are subjective. You do, so you're good. :)

My lightning fast reflexes with the quote button has doomed you. :p

Mr. Plow
10-21-2011, 02:04 PM
Nothing at all. Football games at Memorial Stadium are electric.

Ok, so you're just talking about football gameday experience. So we can exclude the prestigious Southern Magazines Top College Towns of the South.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 02:07 PM
Maybe I'm taking this wrong....it's been said several times throughout the thread.

Just my opinion, but I think that was more of a sarcastic reply to a sarcastic statement? Eh, I dunno. Name me a Big XII (or division I school, for that matter) that has a "boring atmosphere", especially on gameday.

Hell, Warrensburg and Maryville are pretty freaking fun college towns, or used to be. It's been awhile since I've been to either....

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 02:12 PM
Ok, so you're just talking about football gameday experience. So we can exclude the prestigious Southern Magazines Top College Towns of the South.

Are you somehow under the impression that I'm planning on enrolling at every SEC school? I'm not. I am more interested in having a fun weekend centered around a football game. Missouri had 74,000 at last week's game in a stadium with 69,500 seats. We're expecting around 70,000 this weekend, and this is a down year.

When Kansas has 30,000 people in the stands after the end of the third quarter, I'll re-evaluate my opinion of what Lawrence has to offer.

(As a college town, I actually love Larry. Mass street is fun, I am a huge fan of Free State Brewery, the Oread is a great hotel, and AFH is a really cool place to watch a game. It's worth the drive from JoCo, but I wouldn't make a destination of it if I lived farther away.)

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 02:13 PM
Just my opinion, but I think that was more of a sarcastic reply to a sarcastic statement? Eh, I dunno. Name me a Big XII (or division I school, for that matter) that has a "boring atmosphere", especially on gameday.

Hell, Warrensburg and Maryville are pretty freaking fun college towns, or used to be. It's been awhile since I've been to either....Warrensburg's taken a huge shit. They basically shut down the bar district.

HemiEd
10-21-2011, 02:13 PM
I'm going to miss Ames, Lawrence, Manhattan, Waco, Stillwater, etc. when we are forced to play in Gainesville, Athens, Knoxville, Fayetville, Tuscaloosa, Baton Rouge, etc.

You left a few out as usual. (http://www.cityofstarkville.org/)

BigCatDaddy
10-21-2011, 02:14 PM
Hell, from what I hear, Ames is a kick ass college town.

Larry agrees.

|Zach|
10-21-2011, 02:16 PM
Larry agrees.

Interestingly enough that whole ordeal happened in College Town USA. Columbia, Missouri,

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 02:17 PM
You left a few out as usual. (http://www.cityofstarkville.org/)
I also left out Lubbock, TX and Provo, UT.

To your point, that's still supposedly a badass place to watch college football. Shit, they were top 15 to end last season, weren't they?

Saulbadguy
10-21-2011, 02:18 PM
The happiest place on Earth is Manhattan, Kansas.

HemiEd
10-21-2011, 02:18 PM
COLUMBIA — Touting its independent arts scene, quantity of colleges, homecoming traditions and “healthy dose of Southern charm,” Columbia recently landed on Southern Living Magazine’s list of “The South’s Best College Towns.” (http://www.southernliving.com/travel/best-college-towns-00417000074763/)

Columbia Missouri? In the South? Hmmm........Or are they just saying that it is better than most Southern College towns?

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 02:20 PM
Columbia Missouri? In the South? Hmmm........Or are they just saying that it is better than most Southern College towns?

South of the Mason Dixon.

BigCatDaddy
10-21-2011, 02:24 PM
The happiest place on Earth is Manhattan, Kansas.

I've been to the vet hospital there a few times and loved that place. I was just pimping it out yesterday to a lady I work with whose daughter was cosidering KSU among others.

Trevo_410
10-21-2011, 02:24 PM
it seems alot of st. louis fans are not happy about this. Do you guys think alternating this proposed "holiday" tournament from KC to STL would be a bad thing? or should we just wait for us to develop a rivalry on the east side and eventually start a annual neutral game in stl with that team as well? any other ideas? or should they just deal with it?

eazyb81
10-21-2011, 02:24 PM
Columbia Missouri? In the South? Hmmm........Or are they just saying that it is better than most Southern College towns?

I think Southern Magazine is probably qualified to judge what exactly fits as Southern, but if you want to argue with them be my guest.

DeezNutz
10-21-2011, 02:26 PM
My name is KK, and the very mention of the SEC makes a bit of urine squeak out of my hang down.

HemiEd
10-21-2011, 02:31 PM
South of the Mason Dixon.

ROFL, ok, you got me I guess. Columbia is just south of the exact center of the U.S. but don't see the Mason Dixon line. (http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Columbia+missouri&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x87dcabf3bb8182c9:0xa011692dbabd6f20,Columbia,+MO&gl=us&ei=aNWhTvi5PMmKsQLRrsyoBQ&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&ct=image&resnum=1&ved=0CDMQ8gEwAA) I would really like to see where it is in relationship to the MDL.

HemiEd
10-21-2011, 02:37 PM
I think Southern Magazine is probably qualified to judge what exactly fits as Southern, but if you want to argue with them be my guest.

I am really trying to understand, honestly. I never thought of I-70 as being southern, seriously. The exact center of the U.S. is in Lebanon, Kansas, off of 36.

Of course, I argue with the Chicago people about being in the mid-west as well. In the 16 years of being up here, I don't think I have made a change in their minds. :D

dirk digler
10-21-2011, 02:37 PM
So according to kk MU is on average going to be the 9th best team in the SEC.

Maybe I am a homer but outside of Alabama, Florida, and LSU being the top dogs who should MU really be afraid of and can't beat?

Saulbadguy
10-21-2011, 02:38 PM
Columbia Missouri? In the South? Hmmm........Or are they just saying that it is better than most Southern College towns?

pro-slavery.

Saulbadguy
10-21-2011, 02:40 PM
So according to kk MU is on average going to be the 9th best team in the SEC.

Maybe I am a homer but outside of Alabama, Florida, and LSU being the top dogs who should MU really be afraid of and can't beat?

I think they could beat any of those teams, however...

The fact remains that MU hasn't won a conference title in 40 years, and now they are moving to a league that is top to bottom better than the Big XII.

:spock:

Frazod
10-21-2011, 02:41 PM
I am really trying to understand, honestly. I never thought of I-70 as being southern, seriously. The exact center of the U.S. is in Lebanon, Kansas, off of 36.

Of course, I argue with the Chicago people about being in the mid-west as well. In the 16 years of being up here, I don't think I have made a change in their minds. :D

The idiots up here think anything past Kankakee is the South. :D

HemiEd
10-21-2011, 02:41 PM
So according to kk MU is on average going to be the 9th best team in the SEC.

Maybe I am a homer but outside of Alabama, Florida, and LSU being the top dogs who should MU really be afraid of and can't beat?

Kentucky, football powerhouse/saulgood

Reerun_KC
10-21-2011, 02:42 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mason%E2%80%93Dixon_Line

dirk digler
10-21-2011, 02:46 PM
I think they could beat any of those teams, however...

The fact remains that MU hasn't won a conference title in 40 years, and now they are moving to a league that is top to bottom better than the Big XII.

:spock:

Right they could beat those remaining teams so I don't get why they would be any worse shape in the SEC than the Big 12 on average.

Reerun_KC
10-21-2011, 02:46 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mason%E2%80%93Dixon_Line

eazyb81
10-21-2011, 02:47 PM
Right they could beat those remaining teams so I don't get why they would be any worse shape in the SEC than the Big 12 on average.

Because the Big 12 is great when KK is making one argument, and then the Big 12 is terrible when he makes a different one. He is very successful with this style of forming an argument, just go with it.

HemiEd
10-21-2011, 02:48 PM
The idiots up here think anything past Kankakee is the South. :D

Exactly, when I look for scores from the Big 12 in the Tribune, usually they can be found in the Southwest, or West section. :spock: Sometimes they are actually in the Midwest category, but not always.

Did any of these ****ers ever look at a map?


**edit** sure be glad when they get done with the whoring, it is running real slow.

dirk digler
10-21-2011, 02:49 PM
So if MU goes to the SEC which division are they going in?

Bowser
10-21-2011, 02:55 PM
So if MU goes to the SEC which division are they going in?

Wasn't it agreed to that they'd be in the east due to Alabammy wanting to stay in division with Auburn and Tennessee?

Bowser
10-21-2011, 02:55 PM
Because the Big 12 is great when KK is making one argument, and then the Big 12 is terrible when he makes a different one. He is very successful with this style of forming an argument, just go with it.

DOWNTOWN BASEBALL! IT CAN WORK HERE!! KC NEEDS IT!!!

kstater
10-21-2011, 02:58 PM
So if MU goes to the SEC which division are they going in?
Since everyone is equal in the SEC, whatever Alabama decides.

dirk digler
10-21-2011, 03:02 PM
Wasn't it agreed to that they'd be in the east due to Alabammy wanting to stay in division with Auburn and Tennessee?

I don't know that is why I am asking

Trevo_410
10-21-2011, 03:04 PM
omg guys if this isn't a rp i called it...

http://www.610sports.com/topic/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=5526339

listen and enjoy, MIZ-SEC BABY!!

Pitt Gorilla
10-21-2011, 03:08 PM
omg guys if this isn't a rp i called it...

http://www.610sports.com/topic/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=5526339

listen and enjoy, MIZ-SEC BABY!!She literally has a better handle on the situation than KK.

mikeyis4dcats.
10-21-2011, 03:09 PM
Interestingly enough that whole ordeal happened in College Town USA. Columbia, Missouri,


actually ole Larry enjoyed quite a few house parties in Manhappiness as well.

HemiEd
10-21-2011, 03:16 PM
She literally has a better handle on the situation than KK.

saulgood is a female?

Wow, she was fired up and passionate. :blushing:

eazyb81
10-21-2011, 03:26 PM
omg guys if this isn't a rp i called it...

http://www.610sports.com/topic/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=5526339

listen and enjoy, MIZ-SEC BABY!!

LMAO

That was awesome! I want to buy that woman a beer.

ferrarispider95
10-21-2011, 04:01 PM
double post

ferrarispider95
10-21-2011, 04:02 PM
What ku or ksu fan that wouldn't trade mizzou for louisville in a heartbeat? Yeah it will add a bit more footprint, but a better college, better facilities, and better town.

Honestly it we can drop Mizzou, get back to 12 with BYU, Louisville, and WVU we will be stronger than at 10 with Mizzou.

|Zach|
10-21-2011, 04:05 PM
LMAO

kstater
10-21-2011, 04:19 PM
http://m.cjonline.com/sports/2011-10-21/austin-meek-ku-k-state-wont-be-mizzous-fling

KcMizzou
10-21-2011, 04:21 PM
omg guys if this isn't a rp i called it...

http://www.610sports.com/topic/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=5526339

listen and enjoy, MIZ-SEC BABY!!That was awesome. Go Sherie.

baitism
10-21-2011, 04:26 PM
I love the martial applications of logic by people in here and the media....

Spott
10-21-2011, 04:27 PM
At Livestrong? 30 minutes from Lawrence, and 3 hours from Columbia? Probably not. If the Kansas border stretched over to Arrowhead which is 2 and a half hours from Columbia and an hour and fifteen minutes from Lawrence? Sure.

I've made that drive many times in an hour and 15 minutes. :)

Mr. Plow
10-21-2011, 06:06 PM
http://m.cjonline.com/sports/2011-10-21/austin-meek-ku-k-state-wont-be-mizzous-fling

But but but.....it will be ALL KU's fault. Lol

mnchiefsguy
10-21-2011, 06:28 PM
But but but.....it will be ALL KU's fault. Lol

If MU offers to play KU and KU refuses, then that is on KU. KU can say no, it is free to do so, and they can cite any reason they want, but for them to say it is Mizzou's fault would be a lie if Mizzou is willing to play them.

Mr. Plow
10-21-2011, 06:33 PM
If MU offers to play KU and KU refuses, then that is on KU. KU can say no, it is free to do so, and they can cite any reason they want, but for them to say it is Mizzou's fault would be a lie if Mizzou is willing to play them.


Yeah.....MU is totally free of any fault.

mnchiefsguy
10-21-2011, 06:35 PM
Yeah.....MU is totally free of any fault.

If they are willing to play KU, and are not making any ludicrous demands, then I don't see what fault you can hang Mizzou with. If KU wants to refuse and lose money on the deal, then they can live with that. Considering the state of the KU football program, they need a profitable game at Arrowhead with Mizzou much more than Mizzou does.

Brock
10-21-2011, 06:36 PM
If MU offers to play KU and KU refuses, then that is on KU. KU can say no, it is free to do so, and they can cite any reason they want, but for them to say it is Mizzou's fault would be a lie if Mizzou is willing to play them.

If it's not a conference game, what's the point? It's a shame and all, but the rivalry doesn't really mean anything if Missouri's in the SEC. JMO.

mnchiefsguy
10-21-2011, 06:38 PM
If it's not a conference game, what's the point? It's a shame and all, but the rivalry doesn't really mean anything if Missouri's in the SEC. JMO.

And that is a valid opinion. And if KU wants to say that the rivalry means nothing to them and they don't want to play Mizzou anymore, that is well within their rights and they can do that. But with that said, KU can't go around bitching and moaning about how it is Mizzou's fault when it is KU that is refusing to show up and play.

track
10-21-2011, 06:38 PM
If MU offers to play KU and KU refuses, then that is on KU. KU can say no, it is free to do so, and they can cite any reason they want, but for them to say it is Mizzou's fault would be a lie if Mizzou is willing to play them.

Disagree....MU leaves the conference then they are clearly saying they don't support the Big 12 and the teams in the Big 12...in essence they are seeking a divorce from the Big 12 schools. I can't imagine any big 12 team that would schedule MU under those circumstances nor can I envision any fans of schools in the Big 12 wanting to have anything to do with MU or A and M.

kstater
10-21-2011, 06:38 PM
If they are willing to play KU, and are not making any ludicrous demands, then I don't see what fault you can hang Mizzou with. If KU wants to refuse and lose money on the deal, then they can live with that. Considering the state of the KU football program, they need a profitable game at Arrowhead with Mizzou much more than Mizzou does.

A lot of people would argue that giving up a non-conference game would be a ludicrous demand.

Brock
10-21-2011, 06:40 PM
And that is a valid opinion. And if KU wants to say that the rivalry means nothing to them and they don't want to play Mizzou anymore, that is well within their rights and they can do that. But with that said, KU can't go around bitching and moaning about how it is Mizzou's fault when it is KU that is refusing to show up and play.

Who's going to bitch and moan? Honestly, I live right in the middle of KU territory and nobody's even thinking about it, let alone talking about it. Your school is directing this conversation to Kansas City, because KC stands to lose a lot of money in this deal.

KcMizzou
10-21-2011, 06:48 PM
Disagree....MU leaves the conference then they are clearly saying they don't support the Big 12 and the teams in the Big 12...in essence they are seeking a divorce from the Big 12 schools. I can't imagine any big 12 team that would schedule MU under those circumstances nor can I envision any fans of schools in the Big 12 wanting to have anything to do with MU or A and M.Well, so be it.

But Mizzou's not leaving because they're pissed off at KU, KSU, ISU, etc. Texas and OU (and company) were ready to PACk up and leave us all swinging in the wind, until the Pac 10 said "no" to the LHN.

Now we have these 6 year "handcuffs", that they aren't willing to extend to 13... Why? Probably because they figure they might want to bail by then. (Or before, considering those schools can afford to eat the loss.)

Mizzou has a fantastic opportunity here. It really isn't personal. It's common sense.

kstater
10-21-2011, 06:51 PM
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/nIIwsW8_Uf8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Mr. Plow
10-21-2011, 06:54 PM
<iframe src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/nIIwsW8_Uf8" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" width="420"></iframe>


lol. Ouch.


"You have to win your conference championship before you can leave." lol

Bowser
10-21-2011, 06:58 PM
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/nIIwsW8_Uf8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Doomed.

track
10-21-2011, 06:59 PM
Well, so be it.

But Mizzou's not leaving because they're pissed off at KU, KSU, ISU, etc. Texas and OU (and company) were ready to PACk up and leave us all swinging in the wind, until the Pac 10 said "no" to the LHN.

Now we have these 6 year "handcuffs", that they aren't willing to extend to 13... Why? Probably because they figure they might want to bail by then. (Or before, considering those schools can afford to eat the loss.)

Mizzou has a fantastic opportunity here. It really isn't personal. It's common sense.

You want out of the Big 12...that's MU's right....but don't expect anyone associated with the Big 12 to see it any other way than as a divorce.

KcMizzou
10-21-2011, 07:02 PM
Who's going to bitch and moan? Honestly, I live right in the middle of KU territory and nobody's even thinking about it, let alone talking about it. Your school is directing this conversation to Kansas City, because KC stands to lose a lot of money in this deal.Uh, no. KC media is. And there are a lot of Mizzou fans who live in and love KC. (seemingly contrary to popular belief... I'm sick to death of hearing how this is a KU town.)

Mizzou is trying to address the issue, and support KC on the way out.

Brock
10-21-2011, 07:05 PM
Uh, no. KC media is. And there are a lot of Mizzou fans who live in and love KC. (seemingly contrary to popular belief... I'm sick to death of hearing how this is a KU town.)

Mizzou is trying to address the issue, and support for KC on the way out.

“The board wants to make clear how highly we value the tradition here in Kansas City,” said Warren Erdman, chairman of Missouri’s Board of Curators. “Should we depart the Big 12, we want to make it abundantly clear that we’re going to pursue the possibility of the basketball tournament and the football game here in Kansas City.”

No, that ain't the media. That's your guy talking to KC.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 07:06 PM
You want out of the Big 12...that's MU's right....but don't expect anyone associated with the Big 12 to see it any other way than as a divorce.

The only way to know ultimately if Mizzou is making the right decision is to wait 6 years and see if Texas and company shafts the remaining BigXII. But until then, you can call it whatever you want.

KcMizzou
10-21-2011, 07:06 PM
You want out of the Big 12...that's MU's right....but don't expect anyone associated with the Big 12 to see it any other way than as a divorce.That's fine.

You'd go too though, if you had the chance.

KcMizzou
10-21-2011, 07:08 PM
No, that ain't the media. That's your guy talking to KC.A response to the concern in the KC media about losing the BIG 12 Tourney.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 07:10 PM
No, that ain't the media. That's your guy talking to KC.

Is he making reference to the Big XII, or whatever other conference MU ends up in?

Brock
10-21-2011, 07:12 PM
A response to the concern in the KC media about losing the BIG 12 Tourney.

The concern over that is limited to KC media? You think the city isn't wondering about that? The chamber? The KCVA? I guarantee you there is a ton of angst over it.

Brock
10-21-2011, 07:16 PM
Is he making reference to the Big XII, or whatever other conference MU ends up in?

I'm not sure, but the point of what he's saying is trying to reassure a bunch of people that they'll still make money off Missouri games. (And that if it doesn't happen, it's not Mizzou's fault nobody wants to schedule them.)

UL Washington
10-21-2011, 07:22 PM
And Mark May went to Pitt which just bolted for the ACC, interesting.

Priest31kc
10-21-2011, 07:24 PM
Everybody hates Mizzou right now. Oh well, fuck em.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 07:24 PM
I had no idea the University of Missouri was the lynchpin to the ecconomic success or failure of Kansas City, MO.

KcMizzou
10-21-2011, 07:25 PM
I'm not sure, but the point of what he's saying is trying to reassure a bunch of people that they'll still make money off Missouri games. (And that if it doesn't happen, it's not Mizzou's fault nobody wants to schedule them.)If KU had a chance to go to another major conference right now, would you want them to go?

Brock
10-21-2011, 07:36 PM
If KU had a chance to go to another major conference right now, would you want them to go?

Has nothing to do with what I'm saying. I don't care if Missouri leaves, the conference has been a zombie for a while now. It became pretty meaningless to me when Nebraska and Colorado left.

Brock
10-21-2011, 07:39 PM
I shouldn't say I don't care if Missouri leaves, I do care. But I am resigned to it, the old Big 8 is dead and a major reason I followed college sports at all is sort of gone with it.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 07:41 PM
I shouldn't say I don't care if Missouri leaves, I do care. But I am resigned to it, the old Big 8 is dead and a major reason I followed college sports at all is sort of gone with it.

In your opinion, who or what is to blame for that? And I mean specifically - "greed" isn't an acceptable answer. For me, I'm placing the blame squarely at the feet of Dan Beebe. His lack of spine destroyed the Big 8/XII, imo.

dirk digler
10-21-2011, 07:43 PM
If they are willing to play KU, and are not making any ludicrous demands, then I don't see what fault you can hang Mizzou with. If KU wants to refuse and lose money on the deal, then they can live with that. Considering the state of the KU football program, they need a profitable game at Arrowhead with Mizzou much more than Mizzou does.

Yep. If KU doesn't want the $1.25 million dollars or so to play MU then MU can move the Florida or Alabama game to Arrowhead and have SEC football right in the backyard of Big 12 country. I wonder how that will taste in Jayhawk land.

Spott
10-21-2011, 07:45 PM
Uh, no. KC media is. And there are a lot of Mizzou fans who live in and love KC. (seemingly contrary to popular belief... I'm sick to death of hearing how this is a KU town.)

Mizzou is trying to address the issue, and support KC on the way out.

It's funny how people want to make Mizzou out to be the bad guy in all of this and that they will somehow be responsible for KC losing the Big 12 tournament and possibly some Big 12 championship games if the conference ever gets back to 12 teams again.

Before the SWC reject schools from Texas joined the conference, KC had the Big 8 tournament every year and was also home to the conference headquarters. As soon as the Texas schools joined, Tom Penders started bitching about how unfair it was that they had to travel all the way up there for the tournament even though the Big 8 is the one that allowed them to join the conference. Within a few years of the Texas schools bitching, the Big 12 tournament was only played in KC every few years and conference headquarters were moved to Dallas. The funnny thing is that even though the tournament has been rotated to different locations, none of the 4 Texas schools have managed to win the tournament yet and hopefully never will. If Mizzou does leave, it's really just a big F**k you to Texas. Texas has been sticking it to the old Big 8 schools the last 15 years and are the ones responsible for screwing over KC.

Frazod
10-21-2011, 07:45 PM
And Mark May went to Pitt which just bolted for the ACC, interesting.

About the only good thing I can say about May is that he's marginally smarter than that idiot fuck Holtz.

At this point it's ridiculous for anyone to think that Missouri doesn't have some sort of deal in place, and is merely whoring itself out to other conferences.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 07:47 PM
It's funny how people want to make Mizzou out to be the bad guy in all of this and that they will somehow be responsible for KC losing the Big 12 tournament and possibly some Big 12 championship games if the conference ever gets back to 12 teams again.

Before the SWC reject schools from Texas joined the conference, KC had the Big 8 tournament every year and was also home to the conference headquarters. As soon as the Texas schools joined, Tom Penders started bitching about how unfair it was that they had to travel all the way up there for the tournament even though the Big 8 is the one that allowed them to join the conference. Within a few years of the Texas schools bitching, the Big 12 tournament was only played in KC every few years and conference headquarters were moved to Dallas. The funnny thing is that even though the tournament has been rotated to different locations, none of the 4 Texas schools have managed to win the tournament yet and hopefully never will. If Mizzou does leave, it's really just a big F**k you to Texas. Texas has been sticking it to the old Big 8 schools the last 15 years and are the ones responsible for screwing over KC.

What the hell are you thinking bringing this level headedness to this thread?

Brock
10-21-2011, 07:48 PM
In your opinion, who or what is to blame for that? And I mean specifically - "greed" isn't an acceptable answer. For me, I'm placing the blame squarely at the feet of Dan Beebe. His lack of spine destroyed the Big 8/XII, imo.

Obviously the roots of it all are when we said yes to Texas. But on the other hand, I also think that most of the teams of the North came out ahead in terms of recruiting, making their teams better, and making their teams more high profile as a result of being in the same conference as all those Texas schools. I don't know that there is a lot Beebe could have done, but that's JMO.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 07:49 PM
At this point it's ridiculous for anyone to think that Missouri doesn't have some sort of deal in place, and is merely whoring itself out to other conferences.

And I have a problem with that. If you've got a deal, jump on it. Quit flirting with the fucking B1G, and go play football on CBS on Saturdays.

Brock
10-21-2011, 07:50 PM
Yep. If KU doesn't want the $1.25 million dollars or so to play MU then MU can move the Florida or Alabama game to Arrowhead and have SEC football right in the backyard of Big 12 country. I wonder how that will taste in Jayhawk land.

It would be fantastic. I would go to that game.

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 07:51 PM
Disagree....MU leaves the conference then they are clearly saying they don't support the Big 12 and the teams in the Big 12...in essence they are seeking a divorce from the Big 12 schools. I can't imagine any big 12 team that would schedule MU under those circumstances nor can I envision any fans of schools in the Big 12 wanting to have anything to do with MU or A and M.

Why play non-conference games at all, then? Kansas has 3 or 4 games to schedule each year. This year, Kansas scheduled Georgia Tech, Northern Illinois, and McNeese State.

I defy you to make a single argument as to why any one of those teams makes more sense for KU to play than Mizzou. It's certainly not like Missouri needs that game in order to generate interest in the football team. Outside of the Mizzou game at Arrowhead, there is not one compelling game on their schedule with the possible exception of KSU.

Your home schedule next year looks something like:

McNeese State
Northern Illinois
Oklahoma State
Texas
Iowa State
Louisville

Now THAT is a compelling reason to buy season tickets. Not even Bob Davis can get excited about that.

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 07:55 PM
Yep. If KU doesn't want the $1.25 million dollars or so to play MU then MU can move the Florida or Alabama game to Arrowhead and have SEC football right in the backyard of Big 12 country. I wonder how that will taste in Jayhawk land.

That would be amazing, but the reason it works for KU/MU is the fact that both games give up their home games to play it. MU could play Alabama at Arrowhead instead of Faurot, but they're still playing in Tuscaloosa every other year.

dirk digler
10-21-2011, 07:56 PM
It would be fantastic. I would go to that game.

As I would. But apparently KU doesn't need that million dollars for their football program.

kstater
10-21-2011, 07:58 PM
As I would. But apparently KU doesn't need that million dollars for their football program.

Even at only 35k tickets sold at 40 bucks brings in over 1.4 million if the kept their non conference games at home.

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 07:59 PM
Even at only 35k tickets sold at 40 bucks brings in over 1.4 million if the kept their non conference games at home.

As long as expenses are $0, that's a good deal for KU.

dirk digler
10-21-2011, 08:03 PM
That would be amazing, but the reason it works for KU/MU is the fact that both games give up their home games to play it. MU could play Alabama at Arrowhead instead of Faurot, but they're still playing in Tuscaloosa every other year.

I realize that but if KU\K-St\Iowa St decide not to play us then I think that is what MU should do. It would be a huge money maker and probably would partially make up for the lack of the Big 12 tournament.

WilliamTheIrish
10-21-2011, 08:06 PM
Yep. If KU doesn't want the $1.25 million dollars or so to play MU then MU can move the Florida or Alabama game to Arrowhead and have SEC football right in the backyard of Big 12 country. I wonder how that will taste in Jayhawk land.

I'll take 10 tickets please!

Al Bundy
10-21-2011, 08:06 PM
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/nIIwsW8_Uf8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Took Holtz to smack the former Forskin back down to size.

WilliamTheIrish
10-21-2011, 08:10 PM
I think we have the answer to MU leaving. Now it's time to determine who will replace them

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 08:21 PM
I think we have the answer to MU leaving. Now it's time to determine who will replace them

Louisville will be announced on Thursday is my semi-educated guess.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 08:21 PM
I think we have the answer to MU leaving. Now it's time to determine who will replace them

Missouri State. It will be like MU never left. [/Keitzman]

Bowser
10-21-2011, 08:21 PM
Louisville will be announced on Thursday is my semi-educated guess.

Memphis shortly thereafter, maybe followed by Cincinati?

mnchiefsguy
10-21-2011, 08:27 PM
Whomever they get to replace Mizzou is going to have to be available to play in the league next year, or the Fox Tier 2 TV deal will fall apart. It requires the league to be at ten teams. BYU is the best immediate option, unless they can get Louisville out of the Big East without the 27 month penalty.

baitism
10-21-2011, 08:41 PM
Mormons and Christians living together!

Mr. Plow
10-21-2011, 08:44 PM
Yep. If KU doesn't want the $1.25 million dollars or so to play MU then MU can move the Florida or Alabama game to Arrowhead and have SEC football right in the backyard of Big 12 country. I wonder how that will taste in Jayhawk land.


Won't happen.

KcMizzou
10-21-2011, 08:49 PM
And I have a problem with that. If you've got a deal, jump on it. Quit flirting with the ****ing B1G, and go play football on CBS on Saturdays.Mizzou's not flirting with anyone. I highly doubt the Big 10 is a factor in this. Mizzou is going to the SEC.

They're just taking their time and doing it properly. (following the advice of the lawyers... and A&M's exit strategy)

dirk digler
10-21-2011, 08:51 PM
Won't happen.

why not?

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 08:52 PM
Syracuse is beating West Virginia's asses.

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 08:54 PM
Whomever they get to replace Mizzou is going to have to be available to play in the league next year, or the Fox Tier 2 TV deal will fall apart. It requires the league to be at ten teams. BYU is the best immediate option, unless they can get Louisville out of the Big East without the 27 month penalty.

Not necessarily. If the TV people are convinced the conference will be expanding and that the product is worth it, they won't void the deal. In fact, if the conference goes back to 12 teams, they would be getting a bargain. TV CAN void the deal if the membership falls below 10, it doesn't mean it automatically does.

Add to that, if the Big XII does pick up three Big East schools, TCU which was going to be in the Big East, and then the two that went to the ACC, there wouldn't technically be a football conference to speak of and the 27 month rule may not even matter.

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 08:57 PM
why not?

I agree it "probably" won't happen. Why would Mizzou take money out of Columbia and take one of their conference home games off their schedule? Of course, its Mizzou, so they might make that move.

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 08:59 PM
Not necessarily. If the TV people are convinced the conference will be expanding and that the product is worth it, they won't void the deal. In fact, if the conference goes back to 12 teams, they would be getting a bargain. TV CAN void the deal if the membership falls below 10, it doesn't mean it automatically does.

Add to that, if the Big XII does pick up three Big East schools, TCU which was going to be in the Big East, and then the two that went to the ACC, there wouldn't technically be a football conference to speak of and the 27 month rule may not even matter.

I agree. The 27 month thing doesn't seem likely to hold up. It needs to be dealt with, but I don't see it being insurmountable. That said, its going to be hard for the Big XII to try to collect exit fees from Mizzou while replacing them with teams that have 27 month notice requirements.

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 09:01 PM
I agree. The 27 month thing doesn't seem likely to hold up. It needs to be dealt with, but I don't see it being insurmountable. That said, its going to be hard for the Big XII to try to collect exit fees from Mizzou while replacing them with teams that have 27 month notice requirements.

I have no idea on what the "difficulty" meter is for lawyers and it really concerns me little. I don't imagine it will be "easy" on either side.

KcMizzou
10-21-2011, 09:02 PM
I agree it "probably" won't happen. Why would Mizzou take money out of Columbia and take one of their conference home games off their schedule? Of course, its Mizzou, so they might make that move.Haha!!! Stupid Mizzou.

I agree that probably wont happen.

But I also figure they're smart enough to know it's time to GTFO.

dirk digler
10-21-2011, 09:03 PM
I agree it "probably" won't happen. Why would Mizzou take money out of Columbia and take one of their conference home games off their schedule? Of course, its Mizzou, so they might make that move.

They do that already with the KU game and I wouldn't suggest doing every year but the first year...definitely.

Florida vs MU at Arrowhead...that would be awesome

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 09:04 PM
I tell you what, though, if KC offered to pay KU double whatever it was going to give Mizzou to play that game in Arrowhead, then I would do it. None of this equal split stuff, though.

Pitt Gorilla
10-21-2011, 09:06 PM
What ku or ksu fan that wouldn't trade mizzou for louisville in a heartbeat? Yeah it will add a bit more footprint, but a better college, better facilities, and better town.

Honestly it we can drop Mizzou, get back to 12 with BYU, Louisville, and WVU we will be stronger than at 10 with Mizzou.This is an interesting point; if the league will actually be stronger without Mizzou, why are so many people butthurt over them leaving? It would seem they should be congratulating us on the way out.

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 09:08 PM
I tell you what, though, if KC offered to pay KU double whatever it was going to give Mizzou to play that game in Arrowhead, then I would do it. None of this equal split stuff, though.

Mizzou would go for that. After all, we need a big name on our schedule to supplement the no-names in the SEC.

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 09:11 PM
This is an interesting point; if the league will actually be stronger without Mizzou, why are so many people butthurt over them leaving? It would seem they should be congratulating us on the way out.

Absolutely. Louisville is a beautiful city. Their academics are stellar. Their football program is strong. They really deliver the huge state of Kentucky because they are the most popular university in the state. The Big XII would be upgrading.

mnchiefsguy
10-21-2011, 09:12 PM
Mizzou would go for that. After all, we need a big name on our schedule to supplement the no-names in the SEC.

I could see Mizzou going for that, if only that they know KU will be an ass about it and refuse it, thus absolving MU of any blame whatsoever. No one in their right mind would not blame KU for the rivalry ending if KU turned down a double payday to play MU at Arrowhead.

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 09:13 PM
This is an interesting point; if the league will actually be stronger without Mizzou, why are so many people butthurt over them leaving? It would seem they should be congratulating us on the way out.

I think you are over simplifying what we're upset about. We're upset that (a) you think so little of the common regional rivalries that you are willing to toss them aside and (b) the impact it has on KC. Its not that we will miss Missouri, its the periphery implications of Missouri leaving. I've been on record saying that I think the conference is stronger with Missouri in it. But, if they don't want to be here, it isn't like its some death blow to the conference. WVU would be an equivalent to Mizzou except for proximity. There's just no way to get around the proximity issue or the importance it gives KC.

Basketball becomes much better in the conference, undoubtedly. It just sucks that KC won't get to host it.

Spott
10-21-2011, 09:14 PM
I tell you what, though, if KC offered to pay KU double whatever it was going to give Mizzou to play that game in Arrowhead, then I would do it. None of this equal split stuff, though.

They could just put North Dakota St back on the schedule to give them more wins.

Saul Good
10-21-2011, 09:14 PM
I could see Mizzou going for that, if only that they know KU will be an ass about it and refuse it, thus absolving MU of any blame whatsoever. No one in their right mind would not blame KU for the rivalry ending if KU turned down a double payday to play MU at Arrowhead.

There is zero chance that Mizzou takes a 1\3 share when its a favor to KU that we even play them.

Trevo_410
10-21-2011, 09:15 PM
WVU football is such a great program, They just had a really bad day. If they joined the best conference next year they could easily win against kentucky and vanderbilt for a 2-10 season. Missouri football program is pathetic and the sec would be dumb to pick them over wvu. Who says mizzou's fanbase is bigger than ours? We have some fans in Pittsburgh, DC, and even New York. Not to mention, Missouri already said they'd rather join the big10 over the sec. Anyway, we'll continue playing in our depleted but competitive conference for the rest of the year and maybe end up 1st place. When was the last time mizzou could say they participated in a bcs bowl game?

KcMizzou
10-21-2011, 09:16 PM
You have to admit, for a school just looking for attention... we've done a pretty good job.

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 09:18 PM
They could just put North Dakota St back on the schedule to give you more wins.

It isn't like we don't need them. Look, I really want KU to get their football program on track. But, do you really think football smack really gets in the way of the obtuse nature of our basketball pride?

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 09:20 PM
You have to admit, for a school just looking for attention... we've done a pretty good job.

Sure, in the midwest. I got back from the DC area today, and nobody there cares.

Pitt Gorilla
10-21-2011, 09:20 PM
I think you are over simplifying what we're upset about. We're upset that (a) you think so little of the common regional rivalries that you are willing to toss them aside and (b) the impact it has on KC. Its not that we will miss Missouri, its the periphery implications of Missouri leaving. I've been on record saying that I think the conference is stronger with Missouri in it. But, if they don't want to be here, it isn't like its some death blow to the conference. WVU would be an equivalent to Mizzou except for proximity. There's just no way to get around the proximity issue or the importance it gives KC.

Basketball becomes much better in the conference, undoubtedly. It just sucks that KC won't get to host it.Missouri CLEARLY doesn't want to toss aside the rivalry with KU; I'm not sure they could have been clearer about that point. The conference certainly doesn't make the rivalry.

The impact on KC could be minimal as well. Right now, I'm not sure how anyone would know.

KcMizzou
10-21-2011, 09:22 PM
Sure, in the midwest. I got back from the DC area today, and nobody there cares.Were all the girls dancing to Jay Sean?

mnchiefsguy
10-21-2011, 09:23 PM
I think you are over simplifying what we're upset about. We're upset that (a) you think so little of the common regional rivalries that you are willing to toss them aside and (b) the impact it has on KC. Its not that we will miss Missouri, its the periphery implications of Missouri leaving. I've been on record saying that I think the conference is stronger with Missouri in it. But, if they don't want to be here, it isn't like its some death blow to the conference. WVU would be an equivalent to Mizzou except for proximity. There's just no way to get around the proximity issue or the importance it gives KC.

Basketball becomes much better in the conference, undoubtedly. It just sucks that KC won't get to host it.

You can't have it both ways. If KC is such a KU town, then Mizzou leaving should not negatively impact KC at all, as KU should step up to the plate and use its big basketball weight to keep the tourney here. So, either MU and KU are on more equal footing in the KC metro than you are willing to admit, or Mizzou leaving should not really impact anything at all. Which is it?

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 09:26 PM
Missouri CLEARLY doesn't want to toss aside the rivalry with KU; I'm not sure they could have been clearer about that point. The conference certainly doesn't make the rivalry.

The impact on KC could be minimal as well. Right now, I'm not sure how anyone would know.

How can you say that? For the greatest majority of its existence, it has been a conference game. Most of the truly outstanding rivalries are conference games. Even the OU-Texas rivalry skyrocketed in animosity once it became a conference game.

Like I said, the game, if at Arrowhead, would always be in Missouri. That means the monetary benefits derivative thereof, would also largely go to Missouri. So, if KC really wants to see that game continue even as a non conference affair, it should pay KU more to even out the revenue streams. I mean, if MU is that clear about it, they shouldn't care KU gets paid more for it if that's what it tales to continue it.

Bowser
10-21-2011, 09:27 PM
Were all the girls dancing to Jay Sean?

LMAO

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 09:29 PM
You can't have it both ways. If KC is such a KU town, then Mizzou leaving should not negatively impact KC at all, as KU should step up to the plate and use its big basketball weight to keep the tourney here. So, either MU and KU are on more equal footing in the KC metro than you are willing to admit, or Mizzou leaving should not really impact anything at all. Which is it?

OK, first of all, I never argued this "KU town" thing, so don't place that in my mouth. Second of all, it isn't about whether or not there are enough KU fans to make the tournament successful (they're absolutely are). The matter is putting conference dollars in a non conference state. That's just bad business, no other conference does that. KC would have to make some enticing offer above the ability to sell the tournament out and its just sad Mizzou has put their own city in that position.

mnchiefsguy
10-21-2011, 09:30 PM
How can you say that? For the greatest majority of its existence, it has been a conference game. Most of the truly outstanding rivalries are conference games. Even the OU-Texas rivalry skyrocketed in animosity once it became a conference game.

Like I said, the game, if at Arrowhead, would always be in Missouri. That means the monetary benefits derivative thereof, would also largely go to Missouri. So, if KC really wants to see that game continue even as a non conference affair, it should pay KU more to even out the revenue streams. I mean, if MU is that clear about it, they shouldn't care KU gets paid more for it if that's what it tales to continue it.

The bolded part is not true if you are referring to Mizzou. You could argue that it would be true to the state of Missouri itself, but Mizzou would see no more benefit than KU money wise in terms of payout. KU would actual benefit more, since more Mizzou fans buy tickets to Arrowhead anyway...so a 50-50 split of revenue would favor KU since they are filling less than 40% of the seats.

Spott
10-21-2011, 09:31 PM
Were all the girls dancing to Jay Sean?

This guy from New York told me they were really chicks with dicks.

HemiEd
10-21-2011, 09:32 PM
This is an interesting point; if the league will actually be stronger without Mizzou, why are so many people butthurt over them leaving? It would seem they should be congratulating us on the way out.

Maybe I am mis-reading it, but I don't see anyone butt hurt anymore. I think most of us just want them gone, and lets move on.

I am starting to think Mizzou is enjoying more publicity than the teams have gotten them in quite some time, so they are milking it.

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 09:33 PM
The bolded part is not true if you are referring to Mizzou. You could argue that it would be true to the state of Missouri itself, but Mizzou would see no more benefit than KU money wise in terms of payout. KU would actual benefit more, since more Mizzou fans buy tickets to Arrowhead anyway...so a 50-50 split of revenue would favor KU since they are filling less than 40% of the seats.

Of course, the whole argument is why would KU continuously put money into a non Big XII state? Its Missouri's market. We're not talking about having this game on each other's campus, right? We're talking about KC, MO and Arrowhead. Mizzou is the STATE school of Missouri.

Brianfo
10-21-2011, 09:33 PM
You have to admit, for a school just looking for attention... we've done a pretty good job.

Quote of the year. Shit or get off the pot. That's all anyone is saying.

mnchiefsguy
10-21-2011, 09:35 PM
OK, first of all, I never argued this "KU town" thing, so don't place that in my mouth. Second of all, it isn't about whether or not there are enough KU fans to make the tournament successful (they're absolutely are). The matter is putting conference dollars in a non conference state. That's just bad business, no other conference does that. KC would have to make some enticing offer above the ability to sell the tournament out and its just sad Mizzou has put their own city in that position.

They are costing Kansas money too. Lots of people stay and do things on the Kansas side of the line while the Big XII tourney is in town.

The BIG XII contract with Sprint runs through 2014. If the tourney continues to outperform OKC and Dallas without Mizzou when that contract expires...I can see the Big XII keeping KC in its tournament rotation. If the tourney crashes and burns without Mizzou in it, then it should leave town anyway.

The ACC holds its basketball tourney in Atlanta sometimes. Georgia Tech is an ACC member, but they are far and away the red headed stepchild in that state. Georgia and the SEC dominate that landscape, but Atlanta does the basketball tourney well and stays in their rotation.

At the end of the day it is about buts in the seats. If KC continues to put more buts in the seats than OKC or Dallas, which it consistently has, then I think KC will be able to keep its place in the tourney rotation. Will KC have to work harder than those cities? Yes, because they will have to keep their attendance up and ahead of those cities to keep their spot, but it is doable.

Pitt Gorilla
10-21-2011, 09:38 PM
How can you say that? For the greatest majority of its existence, it has been a conference game. Most of the truly outstanding rivalries are conference games. Even the OU-Texas rivalry skyrocketed in animosity once it became a conference game.

Like I said, the game, if at Arrowhead, would always be in Missouri. That means the monetary benefits derivative thereof, would also largely go to Missouri. So, if KC really wants to see that game continue even as a non conference affair, it should pay KU more to even out the revenue streams. I mean, if MU is that clear about it, they shouldn't care KU gets paid more for it if that's what it tales to continue it.Yeah, Nebraska/OU really sucked prior to them joining the same conference. Florida/FSU, Iowa/ISU, Notre Dame/Michigan, Clemson/South Carolina, Army/Navy, etc. all stink as rivalries as well.

mnchiefsguy
10-21-2011, 09:39 PM
Of course, the whole argument is why would KU continuously put money into a non Big XII state? Its Missouri's market. We're not talking about having this game on each other's campus, right? We're talking about KC, MO and Arrowhead. Mizzou is the STATE school of Missouri.

Because KU does not want to cede the KC market to Mizzou. Because if KU can show demographically that it is at least an equal to Mizzou in the metro area, the Big XII can claim some of the TV sets in the KC market when it negotiates TV deals. Georgia Tech trails Georgia in the whole state of Georgia, but I guarantee the ACC claims the Atlanta market when they present their demographics to the networks.

You are the only one who claims KC is an exclusive MU market. Even the MU fans on here acknowledge that KU is strong in the metro area. Folks are letting a line on a map color their logic when viewing this.

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 09:40 PM
The bolded part is not true if you are referring to Mizzou. You could argue that it would be true to the state of Missouri itself, but Mizzou would see no more benefit than KU money wise in terms of payout. KU would actual benefit more, since more Mizzou fans buy tickets to Arrowhead anyway...so a 50-50 split of revenue would favor KU since they are filling less than 40% of the seats.

According to the KC pleading, the Border War generates 14 million dollars for the KC area. Taxes from those revenues are collected by the state of Missouri which in turn, helps fund the University of Missouri. Guess where those revenue don't partially return? That's right, to KU. So, like I said, if KC wants to pony up to keep that 14 million revenue stream going, it needs to pay the Jayhawks more to do so.

Al Bundy
10-21-2011, 09:44 PM
According to the KC pleading, the Border War generates 14 million dollars for the KC area. Taxes from those revenues are collected by the state of Missouri which in turn, helps fund the University of Missouri. Guess where those revenue don't partially return? That's right, to KU. So, like I said, if KC wants to pony up to keep that 14 million revenue stream going, it needs to pay the Jayhawks more to do so.

That will hurt the Overland Park side of the State line as well. But I do hope that Jayhawk fans enjoy giving all of their money to the states of Texas and Oklahoma. That is where everything is headed.

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 09:46 PM
Because KU does not want to cede the KC market to Mizzou. Because if KU can show demographically that it is at least an equal to Mizzou in the metro area, the Big XII can claim some of the TV sets in the KC market when it negotiates TV deals. Georgia Tech trails Georgia in the whole state of Georgia, but I guarantee the ACC claims the Atlanta market when they present their demographics to the networks.

You are the only one who claims KC is an exclusive MU market. Even the MU fans on here acknowledge that KU is strong in the metro area. Folks are letting a line on a map color their logic when viewing this.

Are you kidding? Look, KU generates most of its revenue and fame from basketball. KU fans are going to watch KU basketball whether its played in KC or not. We don't have to prove that, we already know it. Tech is an Atlanta based school within the larger state of GA. That's not the dynamic at play here.

And quit twisting my words around, I never said "KC is an exclusive MU market". I said KC, MO is threatening to become a non Big XII state. It doesn't mean they're aren't KU fans on the Missouri side or MU fans on the Kansas side. It simply means revenues generated in the state of Missouri don't flow back into Kansas. If the Sprint Center was in Johnson County, I would be all for the Tournament continuing there. I think you are intentionally making things up at this point.

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 09:48 PM
That will hurt the Overland Park side of the State line as well. But I do hope that Jayhawk fans enjoy giving all of their money to the states of Texas and Oklahoma. That is where everything is headed.

It will have a minimal impact, mostly not being able to attend the game in person. Are you trying to tell me that people in Overland Park who went to establishments in Overland Park to watch the tournament will no longer do so if it is broadcast from OKC? Come on.

track
10-21-2011, 09:51 PM
That's fine.

You'd go too though, if you had the chance.

I love the Big 12.... There is no other conference I would rather be in...NONE.

mnchiefsguy
10-21-2011, 09:51 PM
It will have a minimal impact, mostly not being able to attend the game in person. Are you trying to tell me that people in Overland Park who went to establishments in Overland Park to watch the tournament will no longer do so if it is broadcast from OKC? Come on.

So if the impact is so minimal, why should it matter where the tourney is held?

Most of the revenues you are siting are local KC revenues...generated by sales tax. That money is not going anywhere towards Mizzou and you know that. Is there a state sales tax for Mizzou that no one knows about?

dirk digler
10-21-2011, 09:55 PM
Interesting story about the contract that KU-MU signed to extend the border showdown at Arrowhead.

The four-year extension that was signed in 2008 included a reworked contract. Missouri and Kansas no longer receive a guaranteed payout to protect the schools if the game bombs at the box office. The two sides now split all revenue after the Chiefs and Arrowhead take about $350,000 for expenses.

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 09:57 PM
So if the impact is so minimal, why should it matter where the tourney is held?

Most of the revenues you are siting are local KC revenues...generated by sales tax. That money is not going anywhere towards Mizzou and you know that. Is there a state sales tax for Mizzou that no one knows about?

Don't be so intentionally dense. Missouri funds the state sponsored schools. They get those funds from generated revenues. Those revenues are from collected taxes. The more they have, the more discretionary they can be with what improvements they want to make within the state of Missouri. Missouri's desire is to USE the rivalry with Kansas to increase their intake. I don't care if MU and Missouri wants to do that, I'm just stating what I believe KU would concede to to continue the yearly game in the state of Missouri.

As for the tournament, that's a conference decision and the conference will want the tournament held in and to the benefit of a state within the conference. If you really can't understand that then this discussion is at an impasse.

Frazod
10-21-2011, 09:59 PM
According to the KC pleading, the Border War generates 14 million dollars for the KC area. Taxes from those revenues are collected by the state of Missouri which in turn, helps fund the University of Missouri. Guess where those revenue don't partially return? That's right, to KU. So, like I said, if KC wants to pony up to keep that 14 million revenue stream going, it needs to pay the Jayhawks more to do so.

Almost makes up for all the professional sports benefits Kansans enjoy that are paid for by the residents of Jackson County, doesn't it?

Al Bundy
10-21-2011, 10:00 PM
It will have a minimal impact, mostly not being able to attend the game in person. Are you trying to tell me that people in Overland Park who went to establishments in Overland Park to watch the tournament will no longer do so if it is broadcast from OKC? Come on.

No, more along the lines of people who came into the city to watch the tournament in person and stayed on the Kansas side. Now that money will all be in the south. By the way.... the KU AD needs to understand the Big 12 is not a midwest conference, it is a southwest conference.

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 10:02 PM
Almost makes up for all the professional sports benefits Kansans enjoy that are paid for by the residents of Jackson County, doesn't it?

I think its dangerous to cross collegiate loyalties with professional geographic ones. KC set itself up to be a regional attraction. I know KU fans that can't stand the Chiefs and Kansas based Chiefs fans that can't stand the Jayhawks or Wildcats.

Spott
10-21-2011, 10:03 PM
Interesting story about the contract that KU-MU signed to extend the border showdown at Arrowhead.

Don't be going and bringing facts into these internet arguments.

kcfan82
10-21-2011, 10:09 PM
They are costing Kansas money too. Lots of people stay and do things on the Kansas side of the line while the Big XII tourney is in town.

The BIG XII contract with Sprint runs through 2014. If the tourney continues to outperform OKC and Dallas without Mizzou when that contract expires...I can see the Big XII keeping KC in its tournament rotation. If the tourney crashes and burns without Mizzou in it, then it should leave town anyway.

The ACC holds its basketball tourney in Atlanta sometimes. Georgia Tech is an ACC member, but they are far and away the red headed stepchild in that state. Georgia and the SEC dominate that landscape, but Atlanta does the basketball tourney well and stays in their rotation.

At the end of the day it is about buts in the seats. If KC continues to put more buts in the seats than OKC or Dallas, which it consistently has, then I think KC will be able to keep its place in the tourney rotation. Will KC have to work harder than those cities? Yes, because they will have to keep their attendance up and ahead of those cities to keep their spot, but it is doable.

Surprising considering Georgia Tech has twice as many NC's and has the most recent one by 10 years.

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 10:10 PM
No, more along the lines of people who came into the city to watch the tournament in person and stayed on the Kansas side. Now that money will all be in the south. By the way.... the KU AD needs to understand the Big 12 is not a midwest conference, it is a southwest conference.

It stretches from Iowa to Texas, that looks pretty "mid" to me. I live in SoCal, and even when I hear "southwest", I think of Arizona and New Mexico before I think of San Diego!

The power of the Big XII Tournament in KC was the ability of KU fans from as far out as Topeka to make a short trip to KC and scalp tickets from other fans because you could almost be assured KU was going to be in the finals. Most of the fans didn't have to stay in KC or had relatives they stayed with. Sure, they'll be some loss, but not to the extent KC, MO will endure. When people came to KC, they stayed downtown.

Look, I love the Tournament in KC. But, I'm not so naive as to not understand why an entire conference won't want to funnel those revenues to a non conference state. I understand KU in KC over the holiday break was a nice treat for its fans, but Lawrence isn't that far away. KC will need to make it worth KU's while to come back. Its sad to say, but its true. Anything else is relying on sentiment for tradition, and we've seen how much that is valued.

HolyHandgernade
10-21-2011, 10:11 PM
Don't be going and bringing facts into these internet arguments.

Who cares, its a moot point.

Al Bundy
10-21-2011, 10:20 PM
It stretches from Iowa to Texas, that looks pretty "mid" to me. I live in SoCal, and even when I hear "southwest", I think of Arizona and New Mexico before I think of San Diego!

The power of the Big XII Tournament in KC was the ability of KU fans from as far out as Topeka to make a short trip to KC and scalp tickets from other fans because you could almost be assured KU was going to be in the finals. Most of the fans didn't have to stay in KC or had relatives they stayed with. Sure, they'll be some loss, but not to the extent KC, MO will endure. When people came to KC, they stayed downtown.

Look, I love the Tournament in KC. But, I'm not so naive as to not understand why an entire conference won't want to funnel those revenues to a non conference state. I understand KU in KC over the holiday break was a nice treat for its fans, but Lawrence isn't that far away. KC will need to make it worth KU's while to come back. Its sad to say, but its true. Anything else is relying on sentiment for tradition, and we've seen how much that is valued.

I was talking about where the conference power lies. It is a Southwest conference. Texas and Oklahoma completely control everything.

Mr. Plow
10-21-2011, 10:24 PM
You are the only one who claims KC is an exclusive MU market.


ROFL

Not one KU fan has said anything of the sort in this thread.

HemiEd
10-21-2011, 10:29 PM
They could just put North Dakota St back on the schedule to give them more wins.If they are booked maybe Western Illinois or Miami of Ohio will be available.

Frazod
10-21-2011, 10:35 PM
If they are booked maybe Western Illinois or Miami of Ohio will be available.

Well, KU might be able to give Western Illinois a game......

HemiEd
10-21-2011, 10:52 PM
Almost makes up for all the professional sports benefits Kansans enjoy that are paid for by the residents of Jackson County, doesn't it?
Tim, do you really think all of those "Missouri" pro teams could survive, if they were only supported by Missourians? Really?

As recently as the early 50s, St. Louis was the most western MLB team. My Dad was a fan of the St. Louis Cardinals in the 30s, growing up in NW Kansas. They had half of the U.S. for a territory.

I would guess Kansas Chief fans have paid up pretty well, for all of the fine rewards the Chiefs have bestowed on them the last 40 years. :D

KChiefs1
10-21-2011, 11:23 PM
Nebraska leaving, kind of changed the whole playing field IMO.

The OU vs Nebraska football rivalry was up there with about any and I think it sucks that it is over.

But, the real mistake was made, back when they let all the Texas schools in, and gave the Longhorns the keys to the conference.

I truly think this is going to be very interesting to see how it plays out.

If Mizzou leaves that's another long-tome rival the Big 8 has lost.

KChiefs1
10-21-2011, 11:28 PM
I've heard some insiders say the SEC will be the first major conference to 16 teams. Could they add A&M, Mizzou, Florida State and Virginia Tech.

It has never made sense to me that the SEC would not want FSU just because it doesn't add to their footprint. FSU is a powerhouse program and Florida is a huge state for talent, it makes sense to add another big-time program there and lock up the state.

I guess we don't have to about Ann Richards petitioning this time hu

Reaper16
10-22-2011, 01:15 AM
I think its dangerous to cross collegiate loyalties with professional geographic ones. KC set itself up to be a regional attraction. I know KU fans that can't stand the Chiefs and Kansas based Chiefs fans that can't stand the Jayhawks or Wildcats.
Duh. That's because KU fans act much, much more like Broncos fans than Chiefs fans.

alnorth
10-22-2011, 06:48 AM
With the caveat that no one really knows what is going on, if what we are talking about is either Missouri and stop at 10 or WVU, BYU, and Louisville, honestly I'd rather have the latter.

Saul Good
10-22-2011, 07:18 AM
With the caveat that no one really knows what is going on, if what we are talking about is either Missouri and stop at 10 or WVU, BYU, and Louisville, honestly I'd rather have the latter.

If BYU and WVU are in the same conference, your conference is dead before it starts. Neinas was staying because of the geography and culture. That's a 4000 mile round trip. Beyond that, what do West Virginia, Iowa State, BYU, and TCU have in common culturally? They have nothing.

The Kansas schools had better be working on an exit strategy yesterday. I promise you that Texas is not going to want to live on the island of misfit toys for long. LHN is going to flop, Teexas and ESPN will come to an agreement to let it dissolve, and Texas will be in the PAC 3 years from now.

kstater
10-22-2011, 07:24 AM
So we've gone from the LHN being this unfair beast of a network that Texas is gonna build up and leave with, to, the LHN is gonna fail, Texas is gonna get out of their unfair contract and leave?

Pablo
10-22-2011, 07:39 AM
IS MISSURAH GONE TO THE B1G SEC YET?

kstater
10-22-2011, 07:44 AM
IS MISSURAH GONE TO THE B1G SEC YET?

Yes, but they're giving KU the privilege to attend a basketball tournament that they're hosting.

Saul Good
10-22-2011, 07:44 AM
So we've gone from the LHN being this unfair beast of a network that Texas is gonna build up and leave with, to, the LHN is gonna fail, Texas is gonna get out of their unfair contract and leave?

People are dense. LHN wasn't a beast of a network. It was an obstacle that prevented the creation of the Big XII network. If we were working towards that, this would never have happened.

Pablo
10-22-2011, 07:45 AM
Yes, but they're giving KU the privilege to attend a basketball tournament that they're hosting.That sounds awfully charitable of them.

mnchiefsguy
10-22-2011, 08:01 AM
Don't be so intentionally dense. Missouri funds the state sponsored schools. They get those funds from generated revenues. Those revenues are from collected taxes. The more they have, the more discretionary they can be with what improvements they want to make within the state of Missouri. Missouri's desire is to USE the rivalry with Kansas to increase their intake. I don't care if MU and Missouri wants to do that, I'm just stating what I believe KU would concede to to continue the yearly game in the state of Missouri.

As for the tournament, that's a conference decision and the conference will want the tournament held in and to the benefit of a state within the conference. If you really can't understand that then this discussion is at an impasse.

Don't be so dense yourself. Do you actually think that having the tournament in KC increases Mizzou's funding? If the tournament leaves, is Mizzou's funding level going to be cut? I don't think so. Most of that tax money stays locally and you know it.

Braincase
10-22-2011, 08:30 AM
Link (http://www2.ljworld.com/news/2011/oct/22/missouris-exit-would-be-no-great-loss-big-12/?opinion)

Missouri’s exit would be no great loss for the Big 12


Aside from the Kansas City Chamber of Commerce and its retail members, who really cares if Missouri leaves the Big 12 Conference for the Southeast Conference?


It is known that, years ago, University of Missouri officials tried to gain membership in the Big Ten Conference, but they were rejected. They tried again within the past year or so and once again were denied admission.


Now, MU officials have knocked on the door of the Southeast Conference, asking to be admitted. Initial reports indicated that not enough SEC presidents were in favor of accepting a new member, but, apparently, there has been sufficient arm-twisting that the Tigers have been accepted by the membership committee.
Again, who really cares?


Granted, this writer is a lifelong fan and supporter of Kansas University, and his thoughts about MU may be based on individual actions and incidents, so it is wrong to generalize about the entire MU family. However, for whatever reason, Missouri is a different university and is in a different environment than the other Big 12 schools. Their fans are different; their alumni are different; their behavior is different; and they really don’t fit in with the other Big 12 schools.


It’s obvious football and money are the driving forces at MU. The university is not shifting to the SEC for academic reasons because the Big 12 has had far more schools in the American Association of Universities, the nation’s most prestigious association of research universities. Prior to Texas A&M’s move to the SEC, the conference had only two AAU schools: the University of Florida and Vanderbilt University.


The Big 12 would have the opportunity to invite one, two or three new members to join the conference if Missouri bolts. Chances are, whatever schools are invited, they will strengthen the excellence of the overall conference rather than merely add another football school.


If MU leaves, the annual Big 12 postseason basketball tournament might be moved, probably to Oklahoma City. Likewise, the so-called “Border War” football game between KU and MU, held at Kansas City’s Arrowhead Stadium in recent years, would come to an end, and any replacement game for KU would be played on the campuses of KU and its opponent — where they belong.


Some in Kansas City are trying to dream up other athletic events in their city to replace the dollars that would be lost by the demise of the traditional basketball tournament and the KU-MU football game. All this is based on dollars and cents and has nothing to do with school ties, history or geography.


Some have asked whether, even if Missouri is no longer a member of the Big 12, KU would agree to play the Tigers in some kind of annual football or basketball game in Kansas City. Based on KU basketball coach Bill Self’s reply to such a suggestion, the chances of such a game are slight.


A Baylor University coach recently was asked a similar question about continuing to play Texas A&M teams now that A&M is joining the SEC. She likened the situation to a nasty divorce. After all the fights and accusations and after the divorce has been granted, the husband acknowledges the divorce but asks his former wife if he might be able to occasionally sleep with her. The coach answered this hypothetical question with a resounding “NO.”


With MU officials and the thousands of MU fans urging the university to thumb its nose at the Big 12 and jump to the SEC, KU officials and fans should make it clear they have no desire to continue any athletic events with Missouri.


MU officials have made it clear they think playing football games in sold-out stadiums and the money attached to such games is the most important yardstick in determining their future intercollegiate athletic and academic relationships.
Once again, who’s sorry to see them leave?

alnorth
10-22-2011, 08:37 AM
If BYU and WVU are in the same conference, your conference is dead before it starts. Neinas was staying because of the geography and culture. That's a 4000 mile round trip. Beyond that, what do West Virginia, Iowa State, BYU, and TCU have in common culturally? They have nothing.

The Kansas schools had better be working on an exit strategy yesterday. I promise you that Texas is not going to want to live on the island of misfit toys for long. LHN is going to flop, Teexas and ESPN will come to an agreement to let it dissolve, and Texas will be in the PAC 3 years from now.

Texas is not giving up the LHN, and ESPN is locked into it for 20 years. They are going nowhere. OU is also going nowhere, especially after the new Tier 1 deal results in per-school payments close to every other major conference.

Braincase
10-22-2011, 08:43 AM
Link (http://www2.kusports.com/weblogs/tale-tait/2011/oct/21/realignment-today-all-signs-point-to-miz/)

Realignment Today: 4:17 - KU AD Zenger releases statement as all signs point to Mizzou exit from Big 12

4:17 p.m. Update:
The following statement from KU athletic director Sheahon Zenger was released a few minutes ago.



“KU-Missouri is a great rivalry. The University of Kansas is a great Midwestern school, loyal to our Midwestern conference and to our Midwestern roots. The KU-Missouri rivalry belongs in the Big 12 Conference. Should Missouri decide to leave the Big 12, we would wish them well.”

Couple of things:


Notice there's nothing in there about continuing to play the Tigers. In fact, if you read into it you'll see that his stance that the KU-MU rivalry belongs in the Big 12 could mean this: You leave, we're done.
Notice that Zenger continues to push the Big 12 and KU's place in it. The guy and this university have been loyal to the league from minute one. They'll continue to be loyal from here on out.
Notice the emphasis on the Midwest. Missouri is not south or east.

All subtle statements, for sure, but it's clear that there will be no love lost between KU and MU if the Tigers leave.



That said, some sources continue to suggest that the Tigers did what they did to day in an attempt to get a better offer from the Big 12 Conference. It's not a bad move, but if they think for a second that the league is going to treat them the way it treated Texas, and to a lesser extent OU, when they threatened to leave, the folks at MU are kidding themselves.
Stay tuned...


3:17 p.m. Update:
Here's a good recap of what went on today from Dave Matter of the Columbia Tribune.



http://www.columbiatribune.com/news/2011/oct/21/mu-takes-another-step-toward-leaving-big-12/?tigerextra

(http://www.columbiatribune.com/news/2011/oct/21/mu-takes-another-step-toward-leaving-big-12/?tigerextra)
Still working the phones to get more reaction, statements, if anyone else is interested in speaking today.
Stay tuned...



2:24 p.m. Update:
Big 12 interim commissioner Chuck Neinas released the following statement regarding Mizzou's "action" today:



"We look forward to discussing Missouri's future with the Big 12 Conference. The school has been involved with the Big 12 and its predecessor conferences since 1907. It is propitious that the Big 12 Board of Directors has a regularly scheduled meeting on Monday. Obviously, Conference membership will be thoroughly discussed at that time."

For those, like me, who aren't sure what propitious means, here's the first definition from dictionary.com: [pruh-Pish-uhs] adj., presenting favorable conditions; favorable.

Sounds like Neinas believes the meeting comes at a good time.
Stay tuned...



2:03 p.m. Update:
Before I jump in, here's a quick recap from the Associated Press regarding Missouri's startling announcement today that sounded an awful lot like the one they made a couple of weeks ago.



This is what the realignment saga has become in the Big 12. Everyone else is all-in and on board, but the Tigers continue to drag their feet. I'm sure they have their reasons. Again, moving to a different conference is not something that should be done overnight or without serious thought. But this is bordering on the ridiculous now.



Since the announcement, which came around 12:30 p.m. today, I've tried to track down some reaction from around the Big 12. The general consensus among those I've talked to is this: We're tired of Missouri's drama and we're ready for them to make a decision. If that means they're gone, we'll live.



Here's the AP report:
Kansas City, Mo. — The governing board of the University of Missouri has given its chancellor the authority to move the school out of the Big 12 Conference if that's what the school decides to do.
Chancellor Brady Deaton was given the authority following a two-day Board of Curators meeting that wrapped up Friday.
Missouri remains in the Big 12 and Deaton said discussions about alignment are ongoing. He says a "decision will be undertaken expeditiously."

Missouri is believed to want to leave for the Southeastern Conference. The Big 12 already has lost Nebraska and Colorado and will lose Texas A&M next year when TCU joins.

That's not all that was said today, though. And it's the other language that seems to indicate the Tigers just tipped their hand.
In addition to giving Deaton the authority to act — again — MU's curators announced that they have given Deaton the authority to explore the idea of playing a mid-season college basketball tournament to be played in Kansas City and an annual football game at Arrowhead Stadium against a regional rival.



Sounds an awful lot like the Tigers trying to save face with the folks in KC on their way out the door to me. Also sounds like that "regional rival" reference points to KU. Just as KU men's basketball coach Bill Self said a couple of weeks ago (http://www2.kusports.com/news/2011/oct/04/missouris-leaving-could-signal-end-border-war-bask/?mens_basketball), sources have told me that if MU leaves the Border War rivalry would likely be dead. At least for a while.
More reaction to come throughout the day.


Stay tuned...

DeezNutz
10-22-2011, 08:51 AM
Link (http://www2.ljworld.com/news/2011/oct/22/missouris-exit-would-be-no-great-loss-big-12/?opinion)

Missouri’s exit would be no great loss for the Big 12


Aside from the Kansas City Chamber of Commerce and its retail members, who really cares if Missouri leaves the Big 12 Conference for the Southeast Conference?


It is known that, years ago, University of Missouri officials tried to gain membership in the Big Ten Conference, but they were rejected. They tried again within the past year or so and once again were denied admission.


Now, MU officials have knocked on the door of the Southeast Conference, asking to be admitted. Initial reports indicated that not enough SEC presidents were in favor of accepting a new member, but, apparently, there has been sufficient arm-twisting that the Tigers have been accepted by the membership committee.
Again, who really cares?


Granted, this writer is a lifelong fan and supporter of Kansas University, and his thoughts about MU may be based on individual actions and incidents, so it is wrong to generalize about the entire MU family. However, for whatever reason, Missouri is a different university and is in a different environment than the other Big 12 schools. Their fans are different; their alumni are different; their behavior is different; and they really don’t fit in with the other Big 12 schools.


It’s obvious football and money are the driving forces at MU. The university is not shifting to the SEC for academic reasons because the Big 12 has had far more schools in the American Association of Universities, the nation’s most prestigious association of research universities. Prior to Texas A&M’s move to the SEC, the conference had only two AAU schools: the University of Florida and Vanderbilt University.


The Big 12 would have the opportunity to invite one, two or three new members to join the conference if Missouri bolts. Chances are, whatever schools are invited, they will strengthen the excellence of the overall conference rather than merely add another football school.


If MU leaves, the annual Big 12 postseason basketball tournament might be moved, probably to Oklahoma City. Likewise, the so-called “Border War” football game between KU and MU, held at Kansas City’s Arrowhead Stadium in recent years, would come to an end, and any replacement game for KU would be played on the campuses of KU and its opponent — where they belong.


Some in Kansas City are trying to dream up other athletic events in their city to replace the dollars that would be lost by the demise of the traditional basketball tournament and the KU-MU football game. All this is based on dollars and cents and has nothing to do with school ties, history or geography.


Some have asked whether, even if Missouri is no longer a member of the Big 12, KU would agree to play the Tigers in some kind of annual football or basketball game in Kansas City. Based on KU basketball coach Bill Self’s reply to such a suggestion, the chances of such a game are slight.


A Baylor University coach recently was asked a similar question about continuing to play Texas A&M teams now that A&M is joining the SEC. She likened the situation to a nasty divorce. After all the fights and accusations and after the divorce has been granted, the husband acknowledges the divorce but asks his former wife if he might be able to occasionally sleep with her. The coach answered this hypothetical question with a resounding “NO.”


With MU officials and the thousands of MU fans urging the university to thumb its nose at the Big 12 and jump to the SEC, KU officials and fans should make it clear they have no desire to continue any athletic events with Missouri.


MU officials have made it clear they think playing football games in sold-out stadiums and the money attached to such games is the most important yardstick in determining their future intercollegiate athletic and academic relationships.
Once again, who’s sorry to see them leave?

All of the bold made me laugh because these comments are either outlandish, misguided, or flat out wrong.

Spott
10-22-2011, 08:56 AM
All of the bold made me laugh because these comments are either outlandish, misguided, or flat out wrong.


I'm guessing that the article was written by a Kansas fan.

DeezNutz
10-22-2011, 08:59 AM
I'm guessing that the article was written by a Kansas fan.

Yes, from the Lawrence Journal World.

KCrockaholic
10-22-2011, 09:00 AM
For Kansas fans not caring about Mizzou leaving they sure do act awful bitter about it.

Spott
10-22-2011, 09:06 AM
Yes, from the Lawrence Journal World.

I could see why the writer is complaining about playing in Arrowhead. Playing there probably puts him an hour behind schedule when he leaves at halftime.

bobbything
10-22-2011, 09:08 AM
For Kansas fans not caring about Mizzou leaving they sure do act awful bitter about it.
Personally, I just want the whole debacle to be over. If they want to leave, then leave. But take a stance and stick to it so the conference can move on.

Trevo_410
10-22-2011, 09:27 AM
Personally, I just want the whole debacle to be over. If they want to leave, then leave. But take a stance and stick to it so the conference can move on.

FFS, go listen to sherrie. Mizzou is taking their time because it'll have more than a couple years effect on the university. It is a decision that effects the entire future of Mizzou. Once, or if, they (Deaton) finds out the SEC would be a better decision, it will happen. Right now we're just going through the steps of switching conferences. Deal with it.


500th post btw.:mizzou:

Saul Good
10-22-2011, 09:43 AM
Link (http://www2.kusports.com/weblogs/tale-tait/2011/oct/21/realignment-today-all-signs-point-to-miz/)

Realignment Today: 4:17 - KU AD Zenger releases statement as all signs point to Mizzou exit from Big 12

4:17 p.m. Update:
The following statement from KU athletic director Sheahon Zenger was released a few minutes ago.



“KU-Missouri is a great rivalry. The University of Kansas is a great Midwestern school, loyal to our Midwestern conference and to our Midwestern roots. The KU-Missouri rivalry belongs in the Big 12 Conference. Should Missouri decide to leave the Big 12, we would wish them well.”

Couple of things:


Notice there's nothing in there about continuing to play the Tigers. In fact, if you read into it you'll see that his stance that the KU-MU rivalry belongs in the Big 12 could mean this: You leave, we're done.
Notice that Zenger continues to push the Big 12 and KU's place in it. The guy and this university have been loyal to the league from minute one. They'll continue to be loyal from here on out.
Notice the emphasis on the Midwest. Missouri is not south or east.

All subtle statements, for sure, but it's clear that there will be no love lost between KU and MU if the Tigers leave.



That said, some sources continue to suggest that the Tigers did what they did to day in an attempt to get a better offer from the Big 12 Conference. It's not a bad move, but if they think for a second that the league is going to treat them the way it treated Texas, and to a lesser extent OU, when they threatened to leave, the folks at MU are kidding themselves.
Stay tuned...


3:17 p.m. Update:
Here's a good recap of what went on today from Dave Matter of the Columbia Tribune.



http://www.columbiatribune.com/news/2011/oct/21/mu-takes-another-step-toward-leaving-big-12/?tigerextra

(http://www.columbiatribune.com/news/2011/oct/21/mu-takes-another-step-toward-leaving-big-12/?tigerextra)
Still working the phones to get more reaction, statements, if anyone else is interested in speaking today.
Stay tuned...



2:24 p.m. Update:
Big 12 interim commissioner Chuck Neinas released the following statement regarding Mizzou's "action" today:



"We look forward to discussing Missouri's future with the Big 12 Conference. The school has been involved with the Big 12 and its predecessor conferences since 1907. It is propitious that the Big 12 Board of Directors has a regularly scheduled meeting on Monday. Obviously, Conference membership will be thoroughly discussed at that time."

For those, like me, who aren't sure what propitious means, here's the first definition from dictionary.com: [pruh-Pish-uhs] adj., presenting favorable conditions; favorable.

Sounds like Neinas believes the meeting comes at a good time.
Stay tuned...

Based on the fact that Neinas used the word propitious incorrectly, maybe he should read the definition.

KChiefs1
10-22-2011, 10:02 AM
Yes, from the Lawrence Journal World.

My favorite toilet paper.

KChiefs1
10-22-2011, 10:03 AM
For Kansas fans not caring about Mizzou leaving they sure do act awful bitter about it.

Pretty obvious huh?

HemiEd
10-22-2011, 10:45 AM
FFS, go listen to sherrie. Mizzou is taking their time because it'll have more than a couple years effect on the university. It is a decision that effects the entire future of Mizzou. Once, or if, they (Deaton) finds out the SEC would be a better decision, it will happen. Right now we're just going through the steps of switching conferences. Deal with it.


500th post btw.:mizzou:

The decision has been made, they are not still trying to decide. This is their third effort to try and find some other conference that wants them.
They are milking this, keeping everyone else hanging.

Like the article said, they are neither South, nor East. But good luck to them, now get going please.

Reaper16
10-22-2011, 10:58 AM
The decision has been made, they are not still trying to decide. This is their third effort to try and find some other conference that wants them.
They are milking this, keeping everyone else hanging.

Like the article said, they are neither South, nor East. But good luck to them, now get going please.
Parts of the state are pretty Southern. There is significant Southerness to Missouri.

Mr. Plow
10-22-2011, 11:02 AM
The decision has been made, they are not still trying to decide. This is their third effort to try and find some other conference that wants them.
They are milking this, keeping everyone else hanging.

Like the article said, they are neither South, nor East. But good luck to them, now get going please.



Man you're jealous....

HolyHandgernade
10-22-2011, 11:06 AM
I was talking about where the conference power lies. It is a Southwest conference. Texas and Oklahoma completely control everything.

What, you think you're going to a conference where you're going to get exactly 1/14 of the power?! What a stupid argument. Conferences are ruled by football prowess. If KU, KSU and ISU were football powerhouses, it wouldn't make it any more "midwest" than it is. Now you're going to a conference where the powere is all "deep south" rather than "southwest". Why you think this is going to be better for you I have no idea. Your major cities border B!G and Big XII states. But, if you want to think of yourself as "southern", you go right ahead.

HolyHandgernade
10-22-2011, 11:11 AM
Don't be so dense yourself. Do you actually think that having the tournament in KC increases Mizzou's funding? If the tournament leaves, is Mizzou's funding level going to be cut? I don't think so. Most of that tax money stays locally and you know it.

Let me put it this way: KU is not interested in helping the Missouri economy directly or indirectly if they want to be an SEC state. We're not interested in improving your schools, your roads, or your hotels. We're not interested in bringing national attention to your state, it doesn't benefit us in any way other than convenience.

Al Bundy
10-22-2011, 11:14 AM
What, you think you're going to a conference where you're going to get exactly 1/14 of the power?! What a stupid argument. Conferences are ruled by football prowess. If KU, KSU and ISU were football powerhouses, it wouldn't make it any more "midwest" than it is. Now you're going to a conference where the powere is all "deep south" rather than "southwest". Why you think this is going to be better for you I have no idea. Your major cities border B!G and Big XII states. But, if you want to think of yourself as "southern", you go right ahead.

I am from the south. I have no ties to MU at all. I was just pointing out the KU AD's misuse of the term "Midwest conference."

HolyHandgernade
10-22-2011, 11:18 AM
I am from the south. I have no ties to MU at all. I was just pointing out the KU AD's misuse of the term "Midwest conference."

It isn't a "misuse". You decided to articifially limit how a conference's regionality is determined. Iowa, Kansas and even Oklahoma are all "midwest". There are other sports than football. "Southwest" teams still have to travel to the "North-Midwest" schools to play them every other year. Texas is in the "middle" of the country and in the "central" time zone. You just made up a limitation and want to call that the universal reason for labeling.

Reaper16
10-22-2011, 11:20 AM
It isn't a "misuse". You decided to articifially limit how a conference's regionality is determined. Iowa, Kansas and even Oklahoma are all "midwest". There are other sports than football. "Southwest" teams still have to travel to the "North-Midwest" schools to play them every other year. Texas is in the "middle" of the country and in the "central" time zone. You just made up a limitation and want to call that the universal reason for labeling.
My definition of Midwest is among the broadest acceptable definitions, and even it doesn't consider Oklahoma a Midwestern state.

SPchief
10-22-2011, 11:21 AM
Let me put it this way: KU is not interested in helping the Missouri economy directly or indirectly if they want to be an SEC state. We're not interested in improving your schools, your roads, or your hotels. We're not interested in bringing national attention to your state, it doesn't benefit us in any way other than convenience.

Who is going to be Ku's next head coach?

HolyHandgernade
10-22-2011, 11:22 AM
Who is going to be Ku's next head coach?

Who knows? Who's gonna be Mizzou's rival next year?

SPchief
10-22-2011, 11:24 AM
Who knows? Who's gonna be Mizzou's rival next year?

You spoke so definative about ku's stance on not playing in arrowhead I thought you were a KU spokesperson.

HolyHandgernade
10-22-2011, 11:27 AM
You spoke so definative about ku's stance on not playing in arrowhead I thought you were a KU spokesperson.

Sorry, its a carry over from speaking as a person often in a position of authority. If you want someone more "connected", maybe you can divine for yourself what the AD and Coach Self have intimated, what the city of KC fears. I can only speak as someone who lived in Kansas at one time and attended KU. I don't think my sentiment is out on much of an island, but you are free to conclude what you want.

HolyHandgernade
10-22-2011, 11:30 AM
My definition of Midwest is among the broadest acceptable definitions, and even it doesn't consider Oklahoma a Midwestern state.

It was an original Big 8, so I do.

Reaper16
10-22-2011, 11:32 AM
It was an original Big 8, so I do.
Colorado is Midwestern too, then?

HolyHandgernade
10-22-2011, 11:35 AM
Colorado is Midwestern too, then?

Certainly eastern Colorado has more in common than the mountain region. Some states don't fit neatly into any one definition, but yes, when they were Big 8, I considered them midwest.

Reaper16
10-22-2011, 11:50 AM
Certainly eastern Colorado has more in common than the mountain region. Some states don't fit neatly into any one definition, but yes, when they were Big 8, I considered them midwest.
Agreed that some states aren't easily defined as far as region goes.

Which states are Midwestern to you?

HolyHandgernade
10-22-2011, 11:55 AM
Agreed that some states aren't easily defined as far as region goes.

Which states are Midwestern to you?

I tend to look at the Mississippi River as the more true dividing line on the east side and the continental divide on the west, up and until you get into true desert territory to the southwest. Probably more accurately described as the Midwestern Plains with a history dominated by the cattle trails.

I realize this leaves out a large portion of what is considered "Midwest", which I would call the "Upper Midwest", east of the Mississippi to the Great Lakes.

track
10-22-2011, 12:05 PM
Certainly eastern Colorado has more in common than the mountain region. Some states don't fit neatly into any one definition, but yes, when they were Big 8, I considered them midwest.

If someone doesn't like the Midwest label...call it tornado alley...which is typically defined as that area that stretches from Iowa through missouri,kansas,oklahoma and texas....no doubt MU is a part of that as witnessed by the tragedy at Joplin.

Mr. Plow
10-22-2011, 01:42 PM
Ballsack!

BigCatDaddy
10-22-2011, 01:57 PM
Rumor is MU is now lobbying for the SEC to take Iowa State so they can win a game.

Bowser
10-22-2011, 01:58 PM
Rumor is MU is now lobbying for the SEC to take Iowa State so they can win a game.

Link?

Bowser
10-22-2011, 01:59 PM
I'm going to miss you tards during football season, lol. Swear to God.

Al Bundy
10-22-2011, 02:02 PM
bobfescoe Bob Fescoe
Mu will play in a ton of homecoming games in the future good thing they invented it #mizzou

Jerm
10-22-2011, 02:05 PM
Bob Fescoe is the last moron that should be trying to clown Mizzou football...a frickin Pop Warner team could cover the spread against his school right about now.

Bowser
10-22-2011, 02:09 PM
Bob Fescoe is the last moron that should be trying to clown Mizzou football...a frickin Pop Warner team could cover the spread against his school right about now.

It's all he's got.


To state the obvious, however, Mizzou picked the wrong year to come up mediocre. Frankilin over Gabbert was a horrendous decision by Pinkel and company.

Braincase
10-22-2011, 04:26 PM
Looks like Colorado might be having a bit of cognitive dissonance... currently down to Oregon 45-2.

mikeyis4dcats.
10-22-2011, 06:44 PM
bobfescoe Bob Fescoe
Mu will play in a ton of homecoming games in the future good thing they invented it #mizzou

someone should inform Bob that they didn't invent it.

mnchiefsguy
10-22-2011, 06:45 PM
someone should inform Bob that they didn't invent it.

That MU invented homecoming is the first thing Fescoe has gotten right in ages.

mikeyis4dcats.
10-22-2011, 06:48 PM
That MU invented homecoming is the first thing Fescoe has gotten right in ages.

MU did not. Illinois did, or at the very least was holding them before MU.

Bambi
10-22-2011, 06:56 PM
bobfescoe Bob Fescoe
Mu will play in a ton of homecoming games in the future good thing they invented it #mizzou

Bwahahahaha!

Fescoe might be retarded but this is pretty funny.