PDA

View Full Version : Elections The Trouble with Herman Cain


BucEyedPea
09-27-2011, 11:28 AM
I putting this up because Cain is actually being labeled "Tea Party favorite?"
We're in trouble if this is what many "Tea Partiers" think.


<iframe width="640" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/xl_RXM8Kt6g" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

patteeu
09-27-2011, 11:29 AM
Us tea partiers aren't all gung ho about returning to the dark ages and subsistence farming like some of you.

HonestChieffan
09-27-2011, 11:30 AM
Us tea partiers aren't all gung ho about returning to the dark ages and subsistence farming.

you are not a real TP'er. Just a johnnie come lately neo tea guy

BucEyedPea
09-27-2011, 11:39 AM
you are not a real TP'er. Just a johnnie come lately neo tea guy

Do you have something to add to the discussion, or can you only cut and paste anti-Obama articles? I think I know what your problem is, you simply can't articulate an argument. Sarcasm and mockery and following another's absurdities.

But you're right about patteeu not being a Tea Partier. He's one of the hijackers who prefers another statist. I'm sure he didn't see the video because he can only afford dial-up.

Saul Good
09-27-2011, 11:50 AM
Do you have something to add to the discussion, or can you only cut and paste anti-Obama articles? I think I know what your problem is, you simply can't articulate an argument. Sarcasm and mockery and following another's absurdities.

But you're right about patteeu not being a Tea Partier. He's one of the hijackers who prefers another statist. I'm sure he didn't see the video because he can only afford dial-up.

Are you really accusing someone else of being a Johnny One-Note? What delicious irony...

Ace Gunner
09-27-2011, 12:23 PM
well said tom woods. this country is the titanic that already hit the berg. If you don't already have a seat on a boat, you won't get one.

BucEyedPea
09-27-2011, 12:26 PM
Are you really accusing someone else of being a Johnny One-Note? What delicious irony...

I see you are having a reading comprehension problem here. I was referring to HCf lack of commentary of his own—not that he wants to focus on Obama. That's just what he happens to cuts and paste. For that matter, using your standard, you could be a Johnny One-Note too.

I can also see, judging from the reactions of you three, that the video got to y'all.

Bewbies
09-27-2011, 12:27 PM
I like the term neo-tea. LMAO

BucEyedPea
09-27-2011, 12:33 PM
I like the term neo-tea. LMAO

So you like the fact that Cain said the information the Bush admin was giving out about the economy was good information when it was really collapsing?

I remember arguing with pat in 2007 how a recession was starting and he argued other wise supporting Bush. How'd that turn out?

What does this tell you, since Bush was wrong, about his economic knowledge and understanding? Neo-dumb, I'd say.

It tells me he's someone who does not have a clue how an economy really works. He's too far up the ass of the Keynesian system.

Then the "Tea Party" was started by the Ron Paul primary movement which was largely libertarian, anti-war, anti-Patriot act. This guy supports
the Patriots act and thinks it's even GOOD. Then, he doesn't even understand about the question on the Fed is even about.

Yeah, I get it. I'm a Tea Partier but keep your hands off my Medicare.

Bewbies
09-27-2011, 12:39 PM
So you like the fact that Cain said the information the Bush admin was giving out about the economy being in good shape?
( I remember arguing with pat in 2007 how a recession was starting and he argued other wise supporting Bush. How'd that turn out?)

What does this tell you, since Bush was wrong, about his economic knowledge and understanding?

It tells me he's someone who does not have a clue how an economy really works. He's too far up the ass of the Keynesian system.

Then the "Tea Party" was started by the Ron Paul primary movement which was largely libertarian, anti-war, anti-Patriot act. This guy supports
the Patriots act and thinks it's even GOOD.

Yeah, I get it. I'm a Tea Partier but keep your hands off my Medicare.

I didn't watch the video yet, I just read the thread. Hence my comment.

patteeu
09-27-2011, 12:45 PM
Do you have something to add to the discussion, or can you only cut and paste anti-Obama articles? I think I know what your problem is, you simply can't articulate an argument. Sarcasm and mockery and following another's absurdities.

But you're right about patteeu not being a Tea Partier. He's one of the hijackers who prefers another statist. I'm sure he didn't see the video because he can only afford dial-up.

I'm the core of the tea party. We're otherwise known as non-nutty conservatives.

BTW, on that last point you need to check my archives to see what my current connection speed is. You're about two years behind the times (which is pretty good given that you're generally about a century behind them).

HonestChieffan
09-27-2011, 12:46 PM
I like the term neo-tea. LMAO

There can only be one true Tea. The Pure and wonderful. Not the tea we see today, polluted by new comers and people with impure pasts and ideas that are counter to those of the real tea.

Neo-Tea is filled with the false prophets and those who are wandering lost in the misty mountains of scrambled and confused ideas.

BucEyedPea
09-27-2011, 12:47 PM
There can only be one true Tea. The Pure and wonderful. Not the tea we see today, polluted by new comers and people with impure pasts and ideas that are counter to those of the real tea.

Neo-Tea is filled with the false prophets and those who are wandering lost in the misty mountains of scrambled and confused ideas.

Neo-Dumb LMAO

patteeu
09-27-2011, 12:48 PM
I remember arguing with pat in 2007 how a recession was starting and he argued other wise supporting Bush. How'd that turn out?

If we were arguing in 2007, then I was probably right since the recession didn't start until December of that year. Of course, in your grocery store it might have started sooner.

BucEyedPea
09-27-2011, 12:50 PM
Yup, nothing like a good intelligent man, like Tom Woods talking to refute some things being claimed by the media to turn a thread into a Flying Monkey one with the same Flying Monkeys each time.

HonestChieffan
09-27-2011, 12:51 PM
I'm the core of the tea party. We're otherwise known as non-nutty conservatives.

BTW, on that last point you need to check my archives to see what my current connection speed is. You're about two years behind the times (which is pretty good given that you're generally about a century behind them).

To the true Tea purists you are a false prophet. You do not and have not blindly followed the teachings of Dr Paul. I know for a fact you have had independent thought. That will get you tossed out.

Ace Gunner
09-27-2011, 12:52 PM
it used to be a man would admit being wrong.

BucEyedPea
09-27-2011, 12:54 PM
it used to be a man would admit being wrong.

No he can only take the whole thread off course instead and use the mental health argument the Soviets used to rely on. That's covered in the video too but he can only afford dial-up to be able to see where that line comes from.

patteeu
09-27-2011, 12:55 PM
To the true Tea purists you are a false prophet. You do not and have not blindly followed the teachings of Dr Paul. I know for a fact you have had independent thought. That will get you tossed out.

Yeah, I know. They're tea bigots. It's their tea or no tea. I'm more of a big tent tea man. My main interest is in tea winning out over coffee.

patteeu
09-27-2011, 12:56 PM
it used to be a man would admit being wrong.

What man are you talking about and what do you think he got wrong? I don't really remember a time when successful politicians admitted they were wrong with any regularity.

BucEyedPea
09-27-2011, 12:57 PM
To the true Tea purists you are a false prophet. You do not and have not blindly followed the teachings of Dr Paul. I know for a fact you have had independent thought. That will get you tossed out.
This is not about patteeu's TP credentials. It's to show how Cain is not a Tea Partier with specfics as to why. He's voiced a few things that could be consider TP, like jobs are created by the private sector and his claim that he beat cancer without Obamacare, but other than that most of his stands are in direct opposition to what the TP was created for. The media is probably making this claim anyway.

So now can you make an intelligent comment?

patteeu
09-27-2011, 12:59 PM
But you're right about patteeu not being a Tea Partier.

This is not about patteeu's TP credentials. It's to show how Cain is not a Tea Partier with specfics as to why. The media is probably making this claim anyway.

So now can you make an intelligent comment?

It seems to me that you helped make it about my tea party credentials. In fact, it seems to me that you were the first person to seriously question them (I use the term "seriously" loosely).

BucEyedPea
09-27-2011, 01:07 PM
Gotta love it. Cain wins one straw poll and some act like they claim of the Paul supporters—like he's a leading contender. Then one notes the irony in others.

patteeu
09-27-2011, 01:09 PM
Gotta love it. Cain wins one straw poll and some act like they claim of the Paul supporters—like he's a leading contender. Then one notes the irony in others.

Who?

ClevelandBronco
09-27-2011, 01:21 PM
I blame Wyoming.

banyon
09-27-2011, 01:24 PM
Gotta love it. Cain wins one straw poll and some act like they claim of the Paul supporters—like he's a leading contender. Then one notes the irony in others.

Seems like it's more about the obvious double standard.

Ron Paul wins straw poll... rejoice we are saved, Paul is dominating! Proof our righteousness is being rewarded.

Herman cain wins straw poll... means nothing, just a small poll..bleh doesn't favor Ron Paul or righteousness

BucEyedPea
09-27-2011, 01:31 PM
By Tom Woods
If you didn't see the video.

"The other day I wrote about the Florida straw poll that Herman Cain won by a substantial margin. I didn’t call anyone stupid or evil for supporting Cain. I laid out some facts that appear to speak against him to anyone who supports the market economy and a free society.

The three I pointed to in the post were his support for TARP, his 2008 endorsement of Mitt Romney (whom Cain supporters claim they despise), and his failure to see the housing collapse coming or even to detect that something might be wrong with the bubble economy.

It’s worse than that, actually — he gave the economy a clean bill of health practically until the collapse came. That is a serious problem. How can we want someone in charge at a critical moment like this whose grasp of the economy is evidently so poor?

I did not invent these things. They really happened. They need to be addressed."

BucEyedPea
09-27-2011, 01:36 PM
followed by Wood's answers to them:

Q1. There’s a reason why Mr. Cain has run multi-million dollar corporations amazingly well, and you have not. Mr. Cain knows what he’s talking about, and your just a talking head rattling off rhetoric, and nonsense. You think you are better than those who lack your credentials. NEWS FLASH: YOU ARE NOT! Mr. Cain could school you in humility, which you definitely need educated in. get off your damn pedestal, at the end of the day, you aren’t special.


A. How many of my concerns are addressed here? Zero. Evidently it is “rhetoric” and “nonsense” to say Cain supported TARP and Romney, and didn’t perceive the housing bubble at all. It’s “rhetoric” and “nonsense” to say Americans need to understand what causes the booms and busts in our economy.

As for Cain’s ability to run businesses, what on earth does that have to do with my post?

What’s more, as Ludwig von Mises showed long ago (in Bureaucracy, Yale University Press, 1944), it is literally impossible to run government like a business. [Something Gingrich makes frequent arguments for when he says he'll make bureaucrats act like entrepreneurs.]

Business firms make decisions via forecasts of consumer demand, with those forecasts being informed by the existing array of prices, the profits or losses they have earned, and from general entrepreneurial insight. They then decide, on this basis, whether they have too many or too few people in customer service, in order fulfillment, or whatever; whether they should invest in more capital equipment; whether they should discontinue a whole line of products, etc.

Government can’t do this. It doesn’t make profits or losses; it merely seizes what it wants from the public. Thus it has no way of knowing what the public actually wants or the intensity with which it wants it. It can’t know if it should produce more of X or more of Y, how it should produce those things, where it should produce them, etc. It must grope in the dark. All the Ross Perots and Herman Cains in the world cannot change the nature of government, which is a non-market institution.

BucEyedPea
09-27-2011, 01:45 PM
On Cain and Mitt Romney, see Herman Cain, “Why I Support Mitt Romney: Leadership Substance.” (http://004eeb5.netsolhost.com/hc098.htm)

On TARP, see the Reagan Administration’s David Stockman, “The End of Sound Money and the Triumph of Crony Capitalism.” (http://mises.org/daily/5113/The-End-of-Sound-Money-and-the-Triumph-of-Crony-Capitalism)

On Cain and Afghanistan, see this FOX News interview transcript. (http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/fox-news-sunday/transcript/herman-cain-his-presidential-bid-sen-mitch-mcconnell-talks-foreign-policy-debt-reduction?page=3)

On the PATRIOT Act, see the Reagan Administration’s Bruce Fein, “The USA PATRIOT Act: Dispelling the Myths,” (http://www.fff.org/comment/com1105h.asp) the text of his May 2011 testimony before the House Judiciary Committee.

For Cain on the housing bubble, see Herman Cain, “The Media Say the Economy Is Horrible, So It Must Be True.” (http://www.mrc.org/bmi/commentary/2005/Commentary_The_Media_Say_the_Economy_Is_Horrible_So_It_Must_Be_True.html)

For Cain on the economy in 2006, see Herman Cain, “More Economic Bull from Media Bears.” (http://www.mrc.org/bmi/commentary/2006/More_Economic_Bull_from_Media_Bears.html)

On auditing the Fed and what we would learn (and we would learn even more than this), see Arnold Kling, “The Case for Auditing the Fed Is Obvious.” <— This is a CATO Briefing Paper linked as a .pdf on the Woods site. So go here to download. http://www.tomwoods.com/cain/

Chocolate Hog
09-27-2011, 02:43 PM
Us tea partiers aren't all gung ho about returning to the dark ages and subsistence farming like some of you.

You're part of the Tea Party? LMAO

patteeu
09-27-2011, 03:17 PM
You're part of the Tea Party? LMAO

Absolutely. How about you?

BucEyedPea
09-27-2011, 03:23 PM
You're part of the Tea Party? LMAO

Of course he isn't.

Let me see:

Keynesian supply-sider with a tax cut on top—>despite huge deficits because
it's revenue neutral which means govt needs all that money.

America needs to use it's military to project power around the world.

I'm for limited govt but it's impractical to implement. So Dick Cheney is da' man.

I'm for free-markets but they cannot be implemented.

I'm for small govt, free-markets but I voted for Romney.

Just like the TP's saying keep your hands off my Medicare.

Chocolate Hog
09-27-2011, 04:32 PM
Absolutely. How about you?

Of course. I just found it strange because I recall you openly mocking meetup groups.

patteeu
09-27-2011, 05:16 PM
Of course. I just found it strange because I recall you openly mocking meetup groups.

I was mocking the size of RonPaul-specific meet-ups, not the small-government philosophy or the general popular interest in "the tea party" and tea party rallies.

Ace Gunner
09-27-2011, 07:09 PM
I'm the core of the tea party. We're otherwise known as non-nutty conservatives.


what you are interested in conserving?

ClevelandBronco
09-27-2011, 07:36 PM
what you are interested in conserving?

The tattered, barely recognizable remains of market capitalism perhaps.

Bewbies
09-27-2011, 07:44 PM
Finally watched Ron Paul's campaign ad. LMAO

I'm telling you, Ron Paul has people dancing in ways that Obama dreams about at night.

Ace Gunner
09-27-2011, 07:51 PM
The tattered, barely recognizable remains of market capitalism perhaps.

I'll wait for the OP before I come back to you.

ClevelandBronco
09-27-2011, 07:57 PM
I'll wait for the OP before I come back to you.

Catch me when I'm not busy making money to pay for your collecting ass.

Ace Gunner
09-27-2011, 07:59 PM
you have me confused with your wife's boyfriend.

ClevelandBronco
09-27-2011, 08:03 PM
you have me confused with your wife's boyfriend.

Unlikely. I hear he has a dick.

patteeu
09-27-2011, 08:09 PM
what you are interested in conserving?

what you are talking about?

Hoover
09-27-2011, 08:19 PM
Ron Pauls poll numbers must suck if Woods is attacking Herman Cain...

Chocolate Hog
09-27-2011, 08:20 PM
Pat i'm not trying to tell you what you are or aren't but I do find it a bit strange you call yourself a tea partier. Ya'll do realize what the new tea party is right? It has some imagined libertarianism but those people are mostly concerned about illegal immigration, executions, and abortion. They're neo-cons who don't want to be associated with George Bush's failures.

Ace Gunner
09-27-2011, 08:21 PM
Unlikely. I hear he has a dick.

your sexual interests are best keep to yourself. just sayin.

Ace Gunner
09-27-2011, 08:23 PM
what you are talking about?

I note you call yourself a "conservative" - what are you interested conserving (I typed slowly for you this time sunshine).

patteeu
09-27-2011, 09:17 PM
Pat i'm not trying to tell you what you are or aren't but I do find it a bit strange you call yourself a tea partier. Ya'll do realize what the new tea party is right? It has some imagined libertarianism but those people are mostly concerned about illegal immigration, executions, and abortion. They're neo-cons who don't want to be associated with George Bush's failures.

I don't agree with every idea that every person who calls themselves a tea partier has. As far as I'm concerned, the tea party is essentially a backlash against big centralized government, high taxation to support an over-extended welfare state, and over regulation. I don't think it has much to do with foreign policy, illegal immigration or abortion even though some people who consider themselves tea partiers feel strongly about those issues one way or the other.

patteeu
09-27-2011, 09:19 PM
I note you call yourself a "conservative" - what are you interested conserving (I typed slowly for you this time sunshine).

The American way of life. Freedom and prosperity at home and benevolent global dominance abroad.

Chocolate Hog
09-27-2011, 09:21 PM
I don't agree with every idea that every person who calls themselves a tea partier has. As far as I'm concerned, the tea party is essentially a backlash against big centralized government, high taxation to support an over-extended welfare state, and over regulation. I don't think it has much to do with foreign policy, illegal immigration or abortion even though some people who consider themselves tea partiers feel strongly about those issues one way or the other.

If this is the case then why is Ron Paul loathed by many in the tea party but the likes of Michelle Bachmann are adored?

ClevelandBronco
09-27-2011, 09:23 PM
If this is the case then why is Ron Paul loathed by many in the tea party but the likes of Michelle Bachmann are adored?

Loathed? Sounds like you're a bit too sensitive to people who don't worship his every utterance.

patteeu
09-27-2011, 09:36 PM
If this is the case then why is Ron Paul loathed by many in the tea party but the likes of Michelle Bachmann are adored?

Because a lot of tea partiers don't agree with Ron Paul's foreign policy (much like Michelle Bachmann) even though they have a lot of similar views in other areas. That doesn't mean that "the tea party" has a specific foreign policy identity, although I suspect that the majority position falls more closely in line with the thinking of most conservatives over the past 30 years (Ronald Reagan, me, Dick Cheney, Herman Cain, Mitt Romney) rather than with Ron Paul.

Saul Good
09-27-2011, 09:50 PM
Billay, do you understand what brought the term "tea party" back into vogue?

Saul Good
09-27-2011, 09:54 PM
I don't see a lot of foreign policy discussion in Rick Santelli's CNBC rant that launched the "tea party" movement.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/zp-Jw-5Kx8k" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

BucEyedPea
09-27-2011, 10:07 PM
Because that did not launch the Tea Party movement, which started out as mostly libertarian and during the last primary campaign of Ron Paul which became the Campaign for Liberty afterwards. There's no formal leader but that's when it was launched. This Santelli guy is a latecomer.

Bewbies
09-27-2011, 11:47 PM
Because that did not launch the Tea Party movement, which started out as mostly libertarian and during the last primary campaign of Ron Paul which became the Campaign for Liberty afterwards. There's no formal leader but that's when it was launched. This Santelli guy is a latecomer.

Sort of agree, although I am skeptical that it was Ron Paul, the author and finisher of our faith, that started it all.

mikey23545
09-27-2011, 11:56 PM
The Trouble With Herman Cain

I putting this up because Cain is actually being labeled "Tea Party favorite?"
He's not Ron Paul.


FYP.

mikey23545
09-27-2011, 11:57 PM
The Trouble With Mitt Romney

I putting this up because Romney is actually being labeled "Tea Party favorite?"
He's not Ron Paul.


FYP.

mikey23545
09-27-2011, 11:58 PM
The Trouble With Rick Perry

I putting this up because Perry is actually being labeled "Tea Party favorite?"
He's not Ron Paul.


FYP.

mikey23545
09-27-2011, 11:59 PM
The Trouble With Newt Gingrich

I putting this up because Gingrich is actually being labeled "Tea Party favorite?"
He's not Ron Paul.


FYP.

mikey23545
09-28-2011, 12:01 AM
The Trouble With Michele Bachmann

I putting this up because Bachmann is actually being labeled "Tea Party favorite?"
She's not Ron Paul.


FYP.

patteeu
09-28-2011, 06:08 AM
Because that did not launch the Tea Party movement, which started out as mostly libertarian and during the last primary campaign of Ron Paul which became the Campaign for Liberty afterwards. There's no formal leader but that's when it was launched. This Santelli guy is a latecomer.

Wrong. Santelli turned what was a mere spark of an idea from the tiny following of an obscure Congressman from Texas into the raging brushfire of popular political sentiment that it has become.

Saul Good
09-28-2011, 06:56 PM
Here are the latest numbers in Iowa.
http://americanresearchgroup.com/pres2012/primary/rep/ia/

Bachmann 15%
Cain 6%
Gingrich 8%
Huntsman 1%
Johnson -
Palin 4%
Paul 12%
Perry 14%
Roemer 1%
Romney 21%
Santorum 2%
Other 1%
Undecided 15%

Saul Good
09-28-2011, 06:58 PM
Shit's getting real nationally.

Romney 23
Perry 19
Cain 17
Gingrich 11
Paul 6

http://www.foxnews.com/interactive/politics/2011/09/28/fox-news-poll-gop-race-top-tier/

Chocolate Hog
09-28-2011, 07:17 PM
Wrong. Santelli turned what was a mere spark of an idea from the tiny following of an obscure Congressman from Texas into the raging brushfire of popular political sentiment that it has become.

LMAO @ crediting a guy who works for CNBC yea Republicans love that network. They hi-jacked the effort from Paul the Tea Party is a right-wing christian neo-cons who were tired of apologizing for Bush. John McCain proved you couldn't win running on Bush's ideas anymore hint the electoral landslide for Obama. This is nothing more than a re-branding effort by a part of the Republican party.

Chocolate Hog
09-28-2011, 07:19 PM
Loathed? Sounds like you're a bit too sensitive to people who don't worship his every utterance.

Are you sure me being sensitive or it's the fact I've been to many tea parties and speak from experience? Ron Paul is very disliked by these folks because of his FP, stance on drugs, and leaving abortion rights up to the states.

Saul Good
09-28-2011, 07:44 PM
LMAO @ crediting a guy who works for CNBC yea Republicans love that network. They hi-jacked the effort from Paul the Tea Party is a right-wing christian neo-cons who were tired of apologizing for Bush. John McCain proved you couldn't win running on Bush's ideas anymore hint the electoral landslide for Obama. This is nothing more than a re-branding effort by a part of the Republican party.

That video is what launched the tea party movement. To say otherwise is to be delusional.

Chocolate Hog
09-28-2011, 07:49 PM
That video is what launched the tea party movement. To say otherwise is to be delusional.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/6bNiDx7qTjA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


You must be delusional.

Chocolate Hog
09-28-2011, 07:50 PM
And yea I'm sure it had nothing to do with Paul raising 6 million dollars in one day. Republicans have always been far behind Democrats in grassroots organizing.

Bewbies
09-28-2011, 07:56 PM
Holy shit you'd think Ron Paul walks on water and skips across rainbows that shoot out of his ass when he farts.

Chocolate Hog
09-28-2011, 08:03 PM
Bewbies dodges facts once again.

Saul Good
09-28-2011, 08:22 PM
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/6bNiDx7qTjA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


You must be delusional.

That video didn't launch shit. The video you posted was from 2007. The movement was nothing until years later, immediately after the CNBC rant.

Bewbies
09-28-2011, 08:30 PM
Bewbies dodges facts once again.

No, Bewbies deals in reality.

BucEyedPea
09-28-2011, 08:33 PM
That video didn't launch shit. The video you posted was from 2007. The movement was nothing until years later, immediately after the CNBC rant.

Nope, the movement started in 2007 and later is when the hijackers came in.

Saul Good
09-28-2011, 08:35 PM
Nope, the movement started in 2007 and later is when the hijackers came in.

Nobody had heard of the movement before the rant on CNBC. The rant, incidentally, had nothing to do with Ron Paul. Paul and his band of merry men did some little deal, but it's not like the CNBC rant, years later, was inspired by Paul.

BucEyedPea
09-28-2011, 08:43 PM
Nobody had heard of the movement before the rant on CNBC. The rant, incidentally, had nothing to do with Ron Paul. Paul and his band of merry men did some little deal, but it's not like the CNBC rant, years later, was inspired by Paul.

I heard of it. As to your nobody claim, few hear of many other movements until they get into the msm either. That doesn't make it a little deal. How many men were initially involved in our own break for Independence. Not many either. That's how things begin. We got it, folks like patteeu and you hate Paul and can't even give him credit where it is actually due. Or your someone who thinks something isn't true if the msm doesn't mention it. Most of all, you're not the type of person who'd be in on the loop for such things.

After the last primary, Paul used his money to continue what was named the Campaign for Liberty to keep the spirit of 1776 going; that we weren't going away. There was a decision to keep it going. I remember the email.I get email from them to this day.

That organization led to the tea party assemblies and town halls—then more people saw it and joined when people got more angry at Obama. Then it got hijacked with msm folks which followed with tea party express folks, Palin and Beck later. These guys were not the starters they were the followers. All you saw was the later growth of the movement as it grew and now claim, falsely, that's when it started. It did not.

And there were people who joined who did not like Obamacare because it would take away their Medicare. What a joke some of them were and still are.

Chocolate Hog
09-28-2011, 08:44 PM
No, Bewbies deals in reality.

So there was not grassroots effort across the nation in Dec 07' called the tea party? LMAO


http://ronpaulsteaparty.com/images/newtea_r1_c1.jpg

Saul Good
09-28-2011, 08:48 PM
So there was not grassroots effort across the nation in Dec 07' called the tea party? LMAO

It was about 5 people, and it was totally unrelated to the CNBC rant. That rant is the one that blew up. Because he happened to say "tea party", Paul fans have decided that it was Ron Paul that launched a revolution. It wasn't.

Ron Paul might have worn a John Deere trucker hat once in 1982. That doesn't mean that he, not Ashton Kutcher, started the fad that got popular around 2005.

BucEyedPea
09-28-2011, 08:53 PM
It was about 5 people, and it was totally unrelated to the CNBC rant. That rant is the one that blew up.

How do you know if it was only about 5 people? It wasn't. December 16, 1773 was the date of the original Tea Party during the Revolution.
Paul advertised his fundraising on December 16, 2007 on it's anniversary. It broke records for fundraising at that time. That right there defies your claims of only 5 knowing. Geesh! You guys are the old Tory's of 1776. I understand it's hard to change the status quo. This is all just cultural lag and goes with the territory.


<iframe width="480" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/oG_OwTthS-E" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Saul Good
09-28-2011, 08:55 PM
How do you know if it was only about 5 people? It wasn't. Paul broke records for fundraising at that time. That right there defies you claims.


<iframe width="480" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/oG_OwTthS-E" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Because there was an election in 2008, and he got 5 votes.

Chocolate Hog
09-28-2011, 08:57 PM
Watch out BEP Saul will quote some poll next.

Saul Good
09-28-2011, 08:59 PM
Weird that I would cite election results and scientific polls as evidence for Paul's lack of popularity.

BucEyedPea
09-28-2011, 09:09 PM
Because there was an election in 2008, and he got 5 votes.

So you're going to strawman now by changing the subject. I thought this was about when the TP started. Give it up. You were wrong on this one.

BucEyedPea
09-28-2011, 09:12 PM
Weird that I would cite election results and scientific polls as evidence for Paul's lack of popularity.

This is about who is a Tea Party candidate and who is not. Hijacking will not get you off the hook.

However, exit polls showed in NH that Paul was popular if you mean well liked. The reason given for not casting their vote was they didn't think he could win. There was also a breakdown by age as to who did still vote for him and who didn't. It was young people. I think that cut that off as under 40 because they said it was mostly those over 40 who voted for McCain. So you can't say he is not liked or unpopular. Remember, 73% are sick of war.

BucEyedPea
09-28-2011, 09:13 PM
I threw this one in. LMAO

Saul Good
09-28-2011, 09:19 PM
So you're going to strawman now by changing the subject. I thought this was about when the TP started. Give it up. You were wrong on this one.

It wasn't about who started the TP. It's about who popularized it. The rant would have happened whether or not Ron Paul had ever had a tea party years earlier. It was completely independent of Paul.

Paul was able to parlay the perfect storm into support for a party, and he is looked at by some as the leader of said movement, but most self-identified tea-partiers aren't Paul supporters. Hell, more people would identify with Palin than Paul.

BucEyedPea
09-28-2011, 09:28 PM
It wasn't about who started the TP. It's about who popularized it.

You said "in vogue" in post #52 of yours.

The rant would have happened whether or not Ron Paul had ever had a tea party years earlier. It was completely independent of Paul.
Speculation in your first sentence. Falsehood in your second sentence. The fact is that the rant, ( that being people being unhappy with the direction of their country) happened under Bush and grew under Obama. It would not have been named as the"Tea Party" though. If your camp didn't do that then you can't take any credit for such a grave omission.

Plus, Paul gave a speech during the Bush regime, asking why everyone is so unhappy. His pulse was on the people and his read was accurate—unlike the rest of the Republicans and their media-mouths. It took us to raise this issue until it reached critical mass.

Paul was able to parlay the perfect storm into support for a party, and he is looked at by some as the leader of said movement, ...
So why didn't any of your leaders or guys think of doing it? I'll tell you why—they're followers. So they joined up later.

Even your beloved media, has printed newspaper articles saying he was the godfather of the movement. But no one has even claimed there was some "leader" either. In fact the opposite has been said. It's decentralized so that just wouldn't be. The Paul campaign, though, was the inspiration and the spark.


...but most self-identified tea-partiers aren't Paul supporters. Hell, more people would identify with Palin than Paul.

That's why they're called hijackers...out there with their medicare signs at town halls. They're like current Republicans—not the real thing and won't vote for the real thing. Status-quo Tory's.

Saul Good
09-28-2011, 09:32 PM
You are delusional. Just because Ron Paul happened to stage a little tea party that nobody saw years ago doesn't mean that he owns the term. Nobody would know what the hell the tea party was without that rant. Hell, there wouldn't be a tea party without that rant.

Paul staged a little tea party. That isn't the same as starting a political party called the tea party.

BucEyedPea
09-28-2011, 09:33 PM
Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, but I'll have some more of it. I want my Medicare and get to kill more Muslims.
FYP

BucEyedPea
09-28-2011, 09:34 PM
You are delusional.

Projection. You're the one guilty of that.

I was there, I know what I saw and what happened. You weren't and you're wrong. It's your own pure opinion.

patteeu
09-28-2011, 11:25 PM
Shit's getting real nationally.

Romney 23
Perry 19
Cain 17
Gingrich 11
Paul 6

http://www.foxnews.com/interactive/politics/2011/09/28/fox-news-poll-gop-race-top-tier/

Shit still isn't very real for Ron Paul though.

patteeu
09-28-2011, 11:30 PM
So there was not grassroots effort across the nation in Dec 07' called the tea party? LMAO


http://ronpaulsteaparty.com/images/newtea_r1_c1.jpg

No one is saying that Ron Paul didn't have tea parties. In fact, my little girls used to have a plastic tea set that they had pretend tea parties with too. But neither Ron Paul nor my girls set started the popular conservative political movement. That was Rick Santelli.

* Ron Paul - barely noticed libertarian-pacifist tea parties

* My girls - fake tea parties with plastic cups and saucers and a tea pot

* Rick Santelli - widely embraced anti-government-spending political movement

You Ron Paul guys are hilarious.

ClevelandBronco
09-28-2011, 11:32 PM
No one is saying that Ron Paul didn't have tea parties. In fact, my little girls used to have a plastic tea set that they had pretend tea parties with too. But neither Ron Paul nor my girls set started the popular conservative political movement. That was Rick Santelli.

Ron Paul - barely noticed libertarian-pacifist tea parties

My girls - fake tea parties with plastic cups and saucers and a tea pot

Rick Santelli - widely embraced anti-government-spending political movement

Yeah, sure. But I'll bet you don't know what "yet" means.

BucEyedPea
09-28-2011, 11:46 PM
redefining words, parsing in a petty manner
Love how some of you can support a guy that will open the door to a VAT tax and more Fed caused bubbles/crashes.
Then call that a Tea Party candidate.

<iframe width="480" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/AC5HuGGIX7k" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Chocolate Hog
09-29-2011, 01:32 AM
No one is saying that Ron Paul didn't have tea parties. In fact, my little girls used to have a plastic tea set that they had pretend tea parties with too. But neither Ron Paul nor my girls set started the popular conservative political movement. That was Rick Santelli.

* Ron Paul - barely noticed libertarian-pacifist tea parties

* My girls - fake tea parties with plastic cups and saucers and a tea pot

* Rick Santelli - widely embraced anti-government-spending political movement

You Ron Paul guys are hilarious.

Where'd the "Godfather of the Tea Party" come from? Your ability to spin facts is amazing.

Chocolate Hog
09-29-2011, 01:32 AM
When we were kids, network anchors such as Walter Cronkite read us news each night like parents telling stories. But as we've grown older, the nightly news stories have changed into grim fairy tales about some terrifying threat to you and me. When Republicans were in office in the early '90s, it was the economy. TV told us it was in bad shape and hyped the slogan "It's the economy, stupid"—helping Bill Clinton slink into the West Wing in 1992. Afterward,
the Washington Post admitted the media had been wrong. A Jan. 29. 1993, report revealed that "growth for the second half of last year was the strongest in five years." The economic reporting was just another fairy tale.

Now, 14 years later, the media are telling the same economic story—trying to convince us that what goes up must be down. It has many names—housing bubble, recession, gas prices or even hurricanes named Katrina or Rita—but the boogeyman is always the same. The media portray it as another Big Bad Wolf out to huff and puff and blow away the economy.

Herman Cain
Source: Human Events Oct. 23, 2006 (p. 20)