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View Full Version : Chiefs Improving mechanics helps Cassel


FringeNC
10-10-2011, 10:16 AM
From ESPN Insider last week, before Indy:

The Kansas City Chiefs suffered two brutal losses to start the season, and quarterback Matt Cassel was a large cause of it. Granted, they lost Jamaal Charles in the process, but Cassel posted quarterback ratings of 64.5 and 44.5 in those contests. The good news for Chiefs fans is that Cassel's rating topped 102 the past two weeks, as the Chiefs nearly took down the San Diego Chargers and earned their first victory of the season versus the Minnesota Vikings on Sunday.

Offensive coordinator Bill Muir credits Cassel's hard work on improving his mechanics for the dramatic change in success.

"(Quarterbacks coach) Jim Zorn has been doing a heck of a job with him, working on his mechanics," Muir said, "and I think that's really the most encouraging thing."

The Chiefs have a tasty matchup with the struggling Indianapolis Colts Sunday. With a win, they could head to their bye week at 2-3 and with the hope they can remain competitive despite losing so many of their top players to injuries already.

Dayze
10-10-2011, 10:18 AM
lol...working on mechanics at 29 years old.

awesome.

BigMeatballDave
10-10-2011, 10:19 AM
lol...working on mechanics at 29 years old.

awesome.
LMAO just thinking the same thing.

Brock
10-10-2011, 10:24 AM
By the time he's 35, we should really have something!

SPATCH
10-10-2011, 10:25 AM
It's true though. When his footwork is good, he plays very well. When his footwork isn't sound, he throws 3 INTs. It's that simple with him, which is baffling.

jd1020
10-10-2011, 10:25 AM
By the time he's 35, we should really have something!

Jim Zorn at HC and Cassel at QB coach?

FringeNC
10-10-2011, 10:26 AM
Don't know if I read it on here, read it on the internet, or heard it on TV, but a follow-up to the above is somehow Zorn has changed his delivery, and taken the arc out of his passes. I don't believe it. I think the up and usually down performance is mental rather than physical, but it's kind of interesting.

jd1020
10-10-2011, 10:26 AM
It's true though. When his footwork is good, he plays very well. When his footwork isn't sound, he throws 3 INTs. It's that simple with him, which is baffling.

When Cassel can run up in the pocket like hes an outfielder throwing a guy out at home he can get the ball 30 yards down field!

Deberg_1990
10-10-2011, 10:38 AM
We can always move him back to TE if he doesnt work out at QB.

SPATCH
10-10-2011, 10:40 AM
When Cassel can run up in the pocket like hes an outfielder throwing a guy out at home he can get the ball 30 yards down field!

really? truly? a whole 30 yards?

I guess you're assuming i'm a fanboy, which would be false. peace.

Cheater5
10-10-2011, 10:55 AM
Late Bloomer? I don't believe in Cassel; I think he's a spaz who has little ability to improvise effectively. I just don't see him being 'the guy'.

But- for the sake of argument, how many good-to-very good QBs developed late? Rich Gannon comes to mind. Trent Green. Hell, you can technically put Kurt Warner in that category. (Stop- I'm not suggesting an impossible comparison).

So why can't Cassel learn mechanics at 29? Yeah, I'm totally playing devil's advocate but other than an emotional "STFU dummy- S4L!", why can't Cassel be one of those guys? He obviously has heart and more than a little competitiveness. Does he not possess certain qualities you'd like to see in a QB?

Looking at it from all sides...

DaKCMan AP
10-10-2011, 10:57 AM
His mechanics were stellar on that 30ft overthrow of McCluster

jd1020
10-10-2011, 10:57 AM
But- for the sake of argument, how many good-to-very good QBs developed late? Rich Gannon comes to mind. Trent Green. Hell, you can technically put Kurt Warner in that category. (Stop- I'm not suggesting an impossible comparison)

This question has been asked already and the only real QB that we came up with that developed into a franchise QB at or beyond Cassel's age was Steve Young.

ReynardMuldrake
10-10-2011, 10:59 AM
Playing the worst teams in the league helps Cassel
FTFY

Demonpenz
10-10-2011, 11:00 AM
He throuh an rocket right between the 8 and 2 to bowe on that play action pass. Very Deberg Like.

jd1020
10-10-2011, 11:03 AM
Playing the worst teams in the league helps Cassel
FTFY

True. He's never shown he deserves to start in the NFL and then some bottom dwelling scum of the earth team rolls in on the schedule and he puts up decent numbers and everyone is saying "Wellllllllll... maybe if he can continue this against the top teams he might be the guy." NO HE CANT! He's not the guy! Get him the fuck out now while we still have a team to work with.

Ralphy Boy
10-10-2011, 11:06 AM
I didn't care to start a thread about this but as a fan looking for hope, in the absence of Luck, I choose to believe that the injuries to Moeaki & Charles could be the best thing to happen to Cassel. Lacking their presence, as well as Weis, MC might be forced to grow from within and elevate his play to something we as fans deserve.

That or he'll fall flat on his face and frankly I would have thought (wished) he would.

ChiefsCountry
10-10-2011, 11:10 AM
Dwayne Bowe in beast mode is the change in his mecanics.

Demonpenz
10-10-2011, 11:13 AM
and call some more slants and crossing routes with bowe.

Bewbies
10-10-2011, 11:20 AM
Playing shitty teams is what helps Matt Cassel.

I'm going to drink a jug of anti-freeze if we win enough games to roll with him again next year.

Epic Fail 007
10-10-2011, 11:21 AM
lol...working on mechanics at 29 years old.

awesome.

idiot lets see u do it stfu

jd1020
10-10-2011, 11:22 AM
idiot lets see u do it stfu

I'll try for $63mil.

Put me in coach!

FringeNC
10-10-2011, 11:35 AM
Playing shitty teams is what helps Matt Cassel.

I'm going to drink a jug of anti-freeze if we win enough games to roll with him again next year.

It's not that simple. Minnesota has a better pass defense than Buffalo, easily. I am not arguing Cassel has turned the corner. We've seen this before. He can sometimes play quite well. Everyone thought he'd shit the bed because of the pass rush, and he had the best game of his Chiefs career. Who the fuck knows what his problem is.

OnTheWarpath58
10-10-2011, 11:39 AM
It's not that simple. Minnesota has a better pass defense than Buffalo, easily. I am not arguing Cassel has turned the corner. We've seen this before. He can sometimes play quite well. Everyone thought he'd shit the bed because of the pass rush, and he had the best game of his Chiefs career. Who the fuck knows what his problem is.

We all know exactly what his problem is.

He just doesn't have enough talent, nor the mental toughness required.

When his receivers are gaining significant amounts of YAC, dude looks like a serviceable QB. When they don't, he doesn't.

Okie_Apparition
10-10-2011, 11:41 AM
I heard it's because Charlie Weis was up in the booth wearing a Muir mask

lcarus
10-10-2011, 11:42 AM
Cassel has a consistency problem. If he could be consistent, he'd be an average QB week in and week out, with good games against shitty opponents. Which if we have a great running game and a monster defense, that would be good enough to be competitive and MAYBE win a playoff game someday (not this year). So knowing that's his ceiling...WHY stick with him any longer than we have to?

Pawnmower
10-10-2011, 11:43 AM
idiot lets see u do it stfu

GO GETEM ERIC!!!

Chiefnj2
10-10-2011, 11:43 AM
WHY stick with him any longer than we have to?

Who thinks KC should stick with Cassel in the future?

OnTheWarpath58
10-10-2011, 11:44 AM
Who thinks KC should stick with Cassel in the future?

Sadly, probably Scott Pioli.

FringeNC
10-10-2011, 11:44 AM
We all know exactly what his problem is.

He just doesn't have enough talent, nor the mental toughness required.

When his receivers are gaining significant amounts of YAC, dude looks like a serviceable QB. When they don't, he doesn't.

I mostly agree but I tend to lean towards the mental aspect. He just seems completely different sometimes. Most games when he drops back, he is so indecisive and his footwork is so poor, he's a disaster waiting to happen. In his good games, his footwork is good, and he's decisive, and I actually am confident when he drops back. Is there another QB like that in the NFL?

lcarus
10-10-2011, 11:47 AM
Who thinks KC should stick with Cassel in the future?

Possibly the Chiefs...we don't know yet. Hopefully not....

BigMeatballDave
10-10-2011, 12:02 PM
Who thinks KC should stick with Cassel in the future?

You?

BigMeatballDave
10-10-2011, 12:03 PM
idiot lets see u do it stfu

Dumbass LMAO

Chiefnj2
10-10-2011, 12:04 PM
Is there another QB like that in the NFL?

To a degree Carson Palmer, Jay Cutler and Tony Romo. Those guys all have WTF mental breakdown moments.

Chiefnj2
10-10-2011, 12:05 PM
You?

Sorry. I'm the guy who wanted Stafford, Bradford and Mallett. Just because I didn't slobber over Sanchez and Clausen doesn't mean I didn't want a QB; I just disagreed with the drafturbators.

jd1020
10-10-2011, 12:07 PM
Sorry. I'm the guy who wanted Stafford, Bradford and Mallett. Just because I didn't slobber over Sanchez and Clausen doesn't mean I didn't want a QB; I just disagreed with the drafturbators.

So basically, you wanted 2 QB's that we never had a chance of drafting and 1 QB who's brain was fried from drug abuse and is as productive as Stanzi right now.

Dartgod
10-10-2011, 12:08 PM
idiot lets see u do it stfu
"Idiot". And you're the one who can barely form a coherent thought, let alone manage to type it out on this message board.

It's a wonder you could even manage to click the "Submit Reply" button.

FringeNC
10-10-2011, 12:11 PM
To a degree Carson Palmer, Jay Cutler and Tony Romo. Those guys all have WTF mental breakdown moments.

Romo takes a lot of chances, but he doesn't give off a different vibe like Cassel does. I don't know about Palmer, has been a long time since he's been good. Cutler I can agree with.

Chiefnj2
10-10-2011, 12:11 PM
So basically, you wanted 2 QB's that we never had a chance of drafting and 1 QB who's brain was fried from drug abuse and is as productive as Stanzi right now.

I wanted those two QB before it was certain they were going to be taken #1. Plus, you could always try to package some picks and grab them - much like everyone is dying to do with Luck.

jd1020
10-10-2011, 12:13 PM
I wanted those two QB before it was certain they were going to be taken #1. Plus, you could always try to package some picks and grab them - much like everyone is dying to do with Luck.

Would a package have been worth it? Staffords been injured most of his career and Bradford has been pretty bad.

BoneKrusher
10-10-2011, 12:24 PM
By the time he's 35, we should really have something!

:clap:

reschief
10-10-2011, 12:34 PM
Romo takes a lot of chances, but he doesn't give off a different vibe like Cassel does. I don't know about Palmer, has been a long time since he's been good. Cutler I can agree with.

In the first half of the Donk game yesterday, Orton looked like Cassel does when he plays bad too. There seems to be an upper eschelon of QB's like Brady and a low end of QB's with real suckage factors. One could argue it's always been that way in NFL football too.

threebag02
10-10-2011, 12:39 PM
His mechanics were stellar on that 30ft overthrow of McCluster

It really wasn't that far off. It just looked that bad because McCluster is that short.

BossChief
10-10-2011, 12:48 PM
The total bullshit part of this is that Weis spent forever and a day trying to fix Cassels' mechanics and it looked as if he had done so.

It has NOTHING to do with the physical part of the game with Matt, it's ALL mental.

QBs need the ability to trust in themselves enough to use their mechanics when the protection isn't perfect and Cassel doesnt seem to be mentally tough enough to do so.

I've been saying this over and over, that's why Haley called him a pussy.

Since we are basically out of the SFL sweepstakes, all we can hope is that changes and he starts reading defenses, manipulating safeties, hitting the open man with accuracy and all of a sudden develops a football iq and stops with the weak minded need for someone (Weis or Zorn) to hold his hand.

FML

HemiEd
10-10-2011, 12:48 PM
Who thinks KC should stick with Cassel in the future?

After a 17 point come back win?

Scott Pioli is probably chugging the Cassel Kool-Aid right now and serving big helpings to everyone at One Arrowhead Drive.

Okie_Apparition
10-10-2011, 12:52 PM
I think Pioli would like to work out a deal that gets him a second round value back for Cassel. He sees he's no Tom Brady or Mike Brady for that matter. Save some face

Dave Lane
10-10-2011, 12:55 PM
Playing shitty teams is what helps Matt Cassel.

I'm going to drink a jug of anti-freeze if we win enough games to roll with him again next year.

Noted.

the Talking Can
10-10-2011, 12:58 PM
I'm glad our franchise QB forgets how to play the position in the offseason, then spends the first 2-3 games each year learning how to be a QB again...

Ralphy Boy
10-10-2011, 01:08 PM
Would a package have been worth it? Staffords been injured most of his career and Bradford has been pretty bad.

This is absurd.
Surely you have seen them play and know this. Bradford's line & receivers are not good. Last week he was sacked 7 times and it wasn't from holding on to the ball too long.

Stafford is phenomenal and not just because he's throwing to Megatron.

jd1020
10-10-2011, 01:11 PM
This is absurd.
Surely you have seen them play and know this. Bradford's line & receivers are not good. Last week he was sacked 7 times and it wasn't from holding on to the ball too long.

Stafford is phenomenal and not just because he's throwing to Megatron.

Stafford has yet to play a full season. Let me know when he does.

In Bradfords case: Good QB's make receivers. How good was Branch in Seattle?

Chris Meck
10-10-2011, 01:33 PM
Until this season, Stafford's offensive line was horrible. That's why he was on the dl, he was getting killed.

Bradford is going through the same thing. When he is given any time at all, he looks really good.

Just saying.

FAX
10-10-2011, 01:46 PM
I'm glad our franchise QB forgets how to play the position in the offseason, then spends the first 2-3 games each year learning how to be a QB again...

Just what I was thinking, Mr. the Talking Can.

What about all those practices that Cassel organized during the off-season and stuff? I wonder if maybe a bumblebee flew up his shorts and stung him real bad on the anus which caused him excruciating pain every time he dropped back and so he used some ointment that over-lubricated his ass crack resulting in a kind of super slide back step effect that contributed to sloppy mechanics and it has taken a couple of games for his buttocks to return to normal? What about that?

FAX

Dayze
10-10-2011, 02:39 PM
idiot lets see u do it stfu

:deevee:

DJJasonp
10-10-2011, 02:44 PM
I'm no Cassel lover or defender. But this article doesnt tick me off, nor do I see anything too out of the ordinary here.

MLB teams have pitching coaches for the very same reason.....mechanics can be "lost", and they are there to help the pitchers (young or old) get them back.

Whatever works. I dont like being a punching bag or the butt of unfunny Jay Leno jokes

suzzer99
10-10-2011, 02:44 PM
Well Oakland should expose him pretty well then we can stop talking about this until he plays well against Miami and Denver at home. :( But then we can all shut up about Cassel's development as the Chiefs probably lose out the season.

BigMeatballDave
10-10-2011, 02:46 PM
I'm no Cassel lover or defender. But this article doesnt tick me off, nor do I see anything too out of the ordinary here.

MLB teams have pitching coaches for the very same reason.....mechanics can be "lost", and they are there to help the pitchers (young or old) get them back.

Whatever works. I dont like being a punching bag or the butt of unfunny Jay Leno jokes

Not the same. He's a 29 yr old 4th yr starter. He should have had his mechanics down.

DJJasonp
10-10-2011, 02:49 PM
Not the same. He's a 29 yr old 4th yr starter. He should have had his mechanics down.

If he never had them to begin with (highly likely)......then I agree with you.

SPATCH
10-10-2011, 02:58 PM
Not the same. He's a 29 yr old 4th yr starter. He should have had his mechanics down.

This is not out of the ordinary dude

Pawnmower
10-10-2011, 03:03 PM
Not the same. He's a 29 yr old 4th yr starter. He should have had his mechanics down.

People constantly work on their mechanics in every sport, dumb ass.

On what fuckign planet do you live?

durtyrute
10-10-2011, 03:07 PM
Playing shitty teams is what helps Matt Cassel.

I'm going to drink a jug of anti-freeze if we win enough games to roll with him again next year.

Should I save this now or later

Bewbies
10-10-2011, 03:10 PM
Should I save this now or later

Put it in your sig for all I care. I'm sick of watching our team chase it's tail around and act like we're getting somewhere.

loochy
10-10-2011, 03:13 PM
On what fuckign planet do you live?
On ChiefsPlanet, that's where.

Chiefnj2
10-10-2011, 03:14 PM
Not the same. He's a 29 yr old 4th yr starter. He should have had his mechanics down.

Not with a different QB coach every year.

Then again, it's not his mechanics that are ultimately holding him back.

NJChiefsFan
10-10-2011, 03:14 PM
Playing shitty teams is what helps Matt Cassel.

I'm going to drink a jug of anti-freeze if we win enough games to roll with him again next year.

Careful dude. He may have hit that total already for all we know.

notorious
10-10-2011, 03:15 PM
On what ****ign planet do you live?

On ChiefsPlanet, that's where.






And don't you ever fucking forget it.

Bewbies
10-10-2011, 03:16 PM
Careful dude. He may have hit that total already for all we know.

I should not laugh at this.

Pawnmower
10-10-2011, 03:19 PM
On ChiefsPlanet, that's where.

True...the one planet where calling someone a mediocre QB makes you a ball washer....Where saying he is like a saturn vue instead of a Fiat makes you a 'true fan' and where being 29 years old makes you magically never have to work on mechanics / footwork etc for the rest of your career. Where guys who claim Croyle should be the starter one season, or that Haley Should be fired somehow think their equally as lame opinions are actually important the next season.

It is a special planet.

It is home.

suzzer99
10-10-2011, 03:41 PM
Do you not understand the concept that a mediocre QB who shows just enough to hang around can be more damaging in the long run than a terrible QB (or one made of glass)?

Brock
10-10-2011, 03:42 PM
True...the one planet where calling someone a mediocre QB makes you a ball washer....Where saying he is like a saturn vue instead of a Fiat makes you a 'true fan' and where being 29 years old makes you magically never have to work on mechanics / footwork etc for the rest of your career. Where guys who claim Croyle should be the starter one season, or that Haley Should be fired somehow think their equally as lame opinions are actually important the next season.

It is a special planet.

It is home.

Don't forget, it's also where some dumbass always wants to spend a top 5 draft pick on a shitty tackle.

Chiefnj2
10-10-2011, 03:46 PM
Do you not understand the concept that a mediocre QB who shows just enough to hang around can be more damaging in the long run than a terrible QB (or one made of glass)?

It's a flawed concept. Any GM and HC worth their salt should realize that in today's NFL a mediocre QB is equivalent to that of a terrible QB.

the Talking Can
10-10-2011, 03:55 PM
True...the one planet where calling someone a mediocre QB makes you a ball washer....Where saying he is like a saturn vue instead of a Fiat makes you a 'true fan' and where being 29 years old makes you magically never have to work on mechanics / footwork etc for the rest of your career. Where guys who claim Croyle should be the starter one season, or that Haley Should be fired somehow think their equally as lame opinions are actually important the next season.

It is a special planet.

It is home.

and where sucking Cassel's balls makes you you...

BossChief
10-10-2011, 04:01 PM
People constantly work on their mechanics in every sport, dumb ass.

On what fuckign planet do you live?

Dick Stanzis mechanics as a rookie with no offseason were far better than Cassel has ever displayed even though Cassel has had the absolute best position coaching since high school.

Not surprised that Cassels condom reincarnated is the one to come by and defend his honor.

whoman69
10-10-2011, 04:21 PM
He's finally got the mechanics of someone who's been in the league 2 years.

Pawnmower
10-10-2011, 04:31 PM
Don't forget, it's also where some dumbass always wants to spend a top 5 draft pick on a shitty tackle.

Oh and also don't forget it is a place where dudes who still live with their mom, in mobile homes and can't even get a job making more than 20 bux an hour think they can break down film, comment intelligently on QB mechanics, and be better at making front office decisions than the actual staff who are getting paid big bucks and don't have to break down the film off their mom's tivo.

Ralphy Boy
10-11-2011, 08:50 AM
Not the same. He's a 29 yr old 4th yr starter. He should have had his mechanics down.

Good lord I hate saying anything that sounds like I'm defending MC, but Tiger Woods mechanics got off after 10+ years of nearly perfect play. It happens.

My concern over Cassel is his mental ability to make good choices with the football, be poised under pressure and have the ability to accurately make all the throws a NFL QB should make. He cannot consistently do any of those and that is the most disturbing thing about a 29 year old QB making $63 million.

Iowanian
10-11-2011, 08:57 AM
Back off of Cassel, In playing time, he's at least a college Jr now.

A good season and some team might take a shot at him in a later round.

Coogs
10-11-2011, 09:05 AM
Would a package have been worth it? Staffords been injured most of his career and Bradford has been pretty bad.

Yes. And it was reported that the Lions were listening too offers. Unfortunately, we had already traded out 2nd for an old LB and Cassel. And you can go back into the draft threads from that season and find where I was wanting to do this at that time.

As someone else stated, who knows if he would have been injured here. Dude took some shots.

Omaha
10-11-2011, 09:09 AM
Dwayne Bowe in beast mode is the change in his mecanics.

Playing two of the worst teams in the league doesn't hurt. The problems come when he's getting pressured.

DaKCMan AP
10-11-2011, 09:37 AM
Outstanding catches by Bowe and Breaston helps Cassel.

BigMeatballDave
10-11-2011, 12:03 PM
Good lord I hate saying anything that sounds like I'm defending MC, but Tiger Woods mechanics got off after 10+ years of nearly perfect play. It happens.

.Yes, I'm sure good QBs like Rodgers, Brady, and Roethlisberger et all, need their
Mechanics coached up all the time.

Chiefnj2
10-11-2011, 12:15 PM
Yes, I'm sure good QBs like Rodgers, Brady, and Roethlisberger et all, need their
Mechanics coached up all the time.

Still, while the Bears are figuring out ways to reinvent that caveman thing known as the run and asking what else they must fix on this suddenly inept offense, the Packers are rolling along.

Yes, Im definitely more comfortable, Rodgers said when asked if he felt things were easier this season than last. Remember, he won the Super Bowl last season.

And of the roll-out ability, Rodgers added, Part of it is instinctive, but I think I have to give my quarterback coach Tom Clements some credit. Ive been with him six years, and hes a big reason for my success. We work on stuff like that all the time.

Rausch
10-11-2011, 12:23 PM
Don't forget, it's also where some dumbass always wants to spend a top 5 draft pick on a shitty tackle.

On the bright side at least we're hot hoping for a top 10 HB every year...