PDA

View Full Version : Chiefs DBowe = Otis


Luke
10-12-2011, 03:16 PM
I can't help but be reminded of Otis Taylor the more I watch Dwayne Bowe. I would be curious to hear Lenny the Cool's comparison. The biggest difference I see is DBowes attitude, but I suppose that is more a sign of the times. Like Hank Stram in a suit vs Todd Haley in full hobo mode.:hmmm:

Sofa King
10-12-2011, 03:18 PM
Jamaal Chares= Jerome Bettis.

I can't help but be reminded of Jerome when i see Charles run. The biggest difference i see if their personal preference for teams.

gblowfish
10-12-2011, 03:20 PM
It pisses me off that they're letting Baldwin wear #89. That jersey should be retired.

Demonpenz
10-12-2011, 03:22 PM
I always thought Bettis was alittle more of a power runner.

pr_capone
10-12-2011, 03:55 PM
It pisses me off that they're letting Baldwin wear #89. That jersey should be retired.

Andre Rison's Jersey number should be retired league wide.

Deberg_1990
10-12-2011, 04:00 PM
Cassel reminds me of a young Steve Bono

Demonpenz
10-12-2011, 04:03 PM
I have more confidence in Sonny Bono's Skiing than I do of Matt Cassel throwing a football.

stonedstooge
10-12-2011, 04:05 PM
I have more confidence in Sonny Bono's Skiing than I do of Matt Cassel throwing a football.

Sonny proved he could hit something dead on at least

Demonpenz
10-12-2011, 04:05 PM
Sonny proved he could hit something dead on at least

LMAO

Deberg_1990
10-12-2011, 04:06 PM
Sonny proved he could hit something dead on at least

Sonny Hit Cher dead on....many many times....

Stewie
10-12-2011, 04:09 PM
Otis says, WTF?

http://amayberrystateofmind.com/images/Otis201-9.jpg

stonedstooge
10-12-2011, 04:09 PM
Sonny Hit Cher dead on....many many times....

I'm glad he isn't around to see the spectacle his daughter/son has become. Damn

Mr. Arrowhead
10-12-2011, 05:00 PM
Jackie Battle reminds me of Christian Okoye

kysirsoze
10-12-2011, 05:02 PM
Jackie Battle reminds me of Christian Okoye

Keary Colbert reminds me of a young "Snoop" Minnis.

Shogun
10-12-2011, 05:03 PM
Thats funny OP, he reminds me of "Shaft", but all black guys remind me of Shaft.

Deberg_1990
10-12-2011, 05:09 PM
McCluster reminds me of Emile Harry or Robb Thomas. True story
Posted via Mobile Device

DA_T_84
10-12-2011, 05:12 PM
Sit On A Potato Pan Otis

Willie Lanier
10-12-2011, 05:23 PM
ROFLCassel reminds me of a young Steve Bono


Very Accurate

milkman
10-12-2011, 05:40 PM
Otis Taylor, relative to his era, was Calvin Johnson.

Chiefs Pantalones
10-12-2011, 05:41 PM
Otis should be in the HOF. Fuckers

whoman69
10-12-2011, 06:04 PM
Unfortunately Otis will never get in because receivers are judged by today's numbers. From a real numbers standpoint he had three outstanding years and two of those were in the old AFL. He had a three year period in the middle of his career where he averaged 32 catches a year. I would make a better case for Johnny Robinson to get in.

WV
10-12-2011, 06:32 PM
Keary Colbert reminds me of a young "Snoop" Minnis.

:)

DTLB58
10-12-2011, 06:40 PM
Why can't D-Bowe just be himself?

I mean, I think he is pretty darn unique.

mikey23545
10-12-2011, 06:43 PM
As far as the way he dresses, Haley makes me think of Hank Stram...

DaKCMan AP
10-12-2011, 06:43 PM
DaKCMan AP reminds me of Awesome.

Rain Man
10-12-2011, 07:31 PM
I'll do my annual, "Why the heck is Fred 'Sticky Cheater' Biletnikoff in the Hall of Fame while Otis isn't" rant.

Let's look at the stats.

Otis Taylor won one Super Bowl and made the play of the game. He had 6 catches for 81 yards and 1 TD
Sticky Cheater won one Super Bowl and had 4 catches for 79 yards and 0 TDs (named MVP, oddly).

Otis played 10 years (not counting 1975 when he was active for only one game).
Sticky Cheater played 14 years

Otis averaged 2.93 receptions per game over 10 years.
Sticky Cheater averaged 2.97 receptions per game over 14 years.

Otis averaged 17.8 yards per reception.
Sticky Cheater averaged 15.2 yards per reception.

Otis averaged 730 yards per season receiving.
Sticky Cheater averaged 641 yards per season receiving.

Otis averaged a TD every 7.2 receptions.
Sticky Cheater averaged a TD every 7.8 receptions.

Otis' top three seasons:
58 rec, 1297 yds, 22.4 ypc, 8 TDs
57 rec, 1110 yds, 19.5 ypc, 7 TDs
59 rec, 958 yds, 16.2 ypc, 11 TDs

Sticky Cheater's top three seasons:
61 rec, 1037 yds, 17.0 ypc, 6 TDs
61 rec, 929 yds, 15.2 ypc, 9 TDs
54 rec, 837 yds, 15.5 ypc, 12 TDs

Otis: 3 pro bowls, 2 all pro
Sticky Cheater: 6 pro bowls, 2 all pros

Otis: 30 rushes, 161 yards, 3 TDs
Sticky Cheater: 0 rushes in career

Biletnikoff has more stats to some extent because he played longer, and only for that reason:

Otis: 410 receptions, 7306 yds, 57 TDs (plus 161 rushing yds and 3 TDs)
Sticky Cheater: 589 receptions, 8974 yds, 79 TDs


Is Biletnikoff really a Hall of Famer because he had four average years after Otis retired? Isn't Otis' ten years of being the best receiver in the business enough for consideration? It's not like he had a shortened career like Billy Sims or Terrell Davis. He played for a decade, and during his career he outperformed Biletnikoff. He also has a ring. What more does he need?

SenselessChiefsFan
10-12-2011, 09:01 PM
ROFL


Very Accurate

Actually, I think he was suggesting the opposite.

SenselessChiefsFan
10-12-2011, 09:08 PM
Otis Taylor, relative to his era, was Calvin Johnson.

I think he played more physical than CJ does. He is like Bowe with better route running and a more natural catching ability.

I think of TO, actually, but again, Otis had better hands.

milkman
10-12-2011, 09:14 PM
I think he played more physical than CJ does. He is like Bowe with better route running and a more natural catching ability.

I think of TO, actually, but again, Otis had better hands.

CJ doesn't have to play as physical as Otis because the DBs are handcuffed today.

Otis Taylor was big, physical receiver, with outstanding speed and outstanding hands, much like CJ.

Deberg_1990
10-12-2011, 09:16 PM
Unfortunately Otis will never get in because receivers are judged by today's numbers. From a real numbers standpoint he had three outstanding years and two of those were in the old AFL. He had a three year period in the middle of his career where he averaged 32 catches a year. I would make a better case for Johnny Robinson to get in.

Theres no way you can compare yesteryears WR's to today simply by catches and numbers. Teams throw the ball so many more times, its not even a fair comparison.

whoman69
10-12-2011, 09:23 PM
Theres no way you can compare yesteryears WR's to today simply by catches and numbers. Teams throw the ball so many more times, its not even a fair comparison.

I don't think the HOF committee has discovered that fact.

Gonzo
10-12-2011, 09:33 PM
Ryan Simms reminds me of Chazz Bono. (Same bra size, anyway)
Posted via Mobile Device

suzzer99
10-12-2011, 09:51 PM
McCluster reminds me of a syphlitic Herman Heard on ketamine.

Rain Man
10-12-2011, 10:56 PM
Perhaps you're one of those interdimensional beings for which time has no meaning.

I've often wondered if you're right.

Count Zarth
10-12-2011, 10:58 PM
I remember thinking back in the 80s that Kevin Ross reminded me of Brandon Flowers, but it was really confusing and disturbing because at that time I had no idea who Brandon Flowers was.

Perhaps you're one of those interdimensional beings for which time has no meaning.

Rain Man
10-12-2011, 11:04 PM
I remember thinking back in the 80s that Kevin Ross reminded me of Brandon Flowers, but it was really confusing and disturbing because at that time I had no idea who Brandon Flowers was.

suzzer99
10-12-2011, 11:05 PM
ha ha

Count Zarth
10-12-2011, 11:10 PM
I remember thinking back in the 80s that Kevin Ross reminded me of Brandon Flowers, but it was really confusing and disturbing because at that time I had no idea who Brandon Flowers was.

I've often wondered if you're right.

http://images.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/10587702.jpg

Bacillus Anthracis
10-12-2011, 11:17 PM
Otis Taylor isn't in the HoF? That's wierd. I always assumed he was. The guy's a legend. But maybe they figure they need to induct more unheard of guards from the 1960's... or was it the 50's? I don't even remember the guy's name.

Count Zarth
10-12-2011, 11:41 PM
You know, I hate to piss in everyone's cheerios, but I was browsing some Otis Taylor statistics last night and couldn't really see anything that impressed me.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=combined&year_min=1920&year_max=1975&season_start=1&season_end=-1&age_min=0&age_max=99&draft_round_min=0&draft_round_max=99&league_id=&team_id=&is_active=&is_hof=&pos_is_wr=Y&c1stat=rec_yds&c1comp=gt&c1val=1&c2stat=&c2comp=gt&c2val=&c3stat=&c3comp=gt&c3val=&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&order_by=rec_yds

When he retired, Otis Taylor was:

16th in yards
16th in receptions
29th in YPC
21st in TDs
20th in YPG

Receivers from his era who are in the hall of fame, and their rankings at the time of Taylor's retirement

Lance Alworth - 2nd in yards
Raymond Berry - 3rd in yards
Fred Biletnikoff - 13th in yards
Bob Hayes - 15th in yards, but he changed the game
Don Maynard - 1st in yards
Tommy McDonald - 6th in yards
Bobby Mitchell - 10th in yards, and also racked up some numbers at HB.
Charley Taylor - 4th in yards
Paul Warfield - 12th in yards, but 6th in YPC and more yards than anyone above him in YPC.

When he retired, Taylor had nearly identical statistics (including TDs and yards per game) to these guys, who are not in the hall of fame, and no one is pounding their drum:

Garry Garrison
Jimmy Orr
Art Powell
Billy Howton
Lionel Taylor
Charley Hennigan

Maybe I'm crazy but I don't see it as a huge snub that he's not in the HOF. If the Biletnikoff argument is all you've got, you have to let some of those other guys in too.

suzzer99
10-12-2011, 11:58 PM
Billy Howton isn't in the HOF??? There is no god.

Hog Farmer
10-13-2011, 04:25 AM
Tyson Jackson reminds me of a young Ryan Sims

Bacillus Anthracis
10-13-2011, 08:40 AM
You know, I hate to piss in everyone's cheerios, but I was browsing some Otis Taylor statistics last night and couldn't really see anything that impressed me.

Maybe I'm crazy but I don't see it as a huge snub that he's not in the HOF. If the Biletnikoff argument is all you've got, you have to let some of those other guys in too.

Stats don't tell the story of the WR's back in those days. Otis Taylor was one of the stars of the AFL. He was among the players who helped give that league legitimacy. And when it came time for him to perform on the biggest football stage in the world in Superbowl IV he came through.

Freddie B's stats aren't great compared to the modern receiver but anyone who'd argue that he doesn't belong in the HoF has their head up their ass. Both contributed greatly to the success of not just their respective teams but to the football as a whole. That's why they belong, not because of stats.

The biggest snub of a WR that isn't in the Hall is Cliff Branch. Now that's f'ing crazy.

Jenson71
10-13-2011, 08:51 AM
Otis Taylor is still alive. What does he do now?

Rain Man
10-13-2011, 10:32 AM
You know, I hate to piss in everyone's cheerios, but I was browsing some Otis Taylor statistics last night and couldn't really see anything that impressed me.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=combined&year_min=1920&year_max=1975&season_start=1&season_end=-1&age_min=0&age_max=99&draft_round_min=0&draft_round_max=99&league_id=&team_id=&is_active=&is_hof=&pos_is_wr=Y&c1stat=rec_yds&c1comp=gt&c1val=1&c2stat=&c2comp=gt&c2val=&c3stat=&c3comp=gt&c3val=&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&order_by=rec_yds

When he retired, Otis Taylor was:

16th in yards
16th in receptions
29th in YPC
21st in TDs
20th in YPG

Receivers from his era who are in the hall of fame, and their rankings at the time of Taylor's retirement

Lance Alworth - 2nd in yards
Raymond Berry - 3rd in yards
Fred Biletnikoff - 13th in yards
Bob Hayes - 15th in yards, but he changed the game
Don Maynard - 1st in yards
Tommy McDonald - 6th in yards
Bobby Mitchell - 10th in yards, and also racked up some numbers at HB.
Charley Taylor - 4th in yards
Paul Warfield - 12th in yards, but 6th in YPC and more yards than anyone above him in YPC.

When he retired, Taylor had nearly identical statistics (including TDs and yards per game) to these guys, who are not in the hall of fame, and no one is pounding their drum:

Garry Garrison
Jimmy Orr
Art Powell
Billy Howton
Lionel Taylor
Charley Hennigan

Maybe I'm crazy but I don't see it as a huge snub that he's not in the HOF. If the Biletnikoff argument is all you've got, you have to let some of those other guys in too.

Nice post.

My rebuttal would be that

a) Taylor belongs in the first group far more than he belongs in the second group from a year to year productivity perspective. Maybe he didn't play as long as some of those guys, but he still played a decade and I suspect had similar yearly production.

b) The guys in the second group are a couple of gadget guys (Hennigan and Taylor) and generally weren't the #1 receivers on their teams.

c) Look at the their top three seasons and see who was most dominant, and Taylor will be high on the list.

It seems to me that the biggest arguments against Otis are statistical, which are based purely on the fact that he didn't play as long as some other players who are in the HoF. But this goes back to my longstanding argument that I'd rather have a player in my franchise who was dominant for 5 or 6 years and played ten than a guy who was above average for 10 years and played 14. That's a philosophical call, but it seems like championships are not won by teams full of above-average players. There have to be some dominant guys who elevate them.

Also, I was in error in my earlier post. Otis had two championships - one in the AFL and of course Super Bowl IV, and he also played in Super Bowl I.

Rain Man
10-13-2011, 10:34 AM
Otis Taylor is still alive. What does he do now?

I read something a while back that indicated he was in extremely poor health. Don't remember the issue.

Rain Man
10-13-2011, 10:38 AM
Is this true? Otis was one of the final five under consideration for the Hall of Fame in 2009? How'd I miss this?

http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2009/8/25/1002151/former-kansas-city-chiefs-wr-otis

Rain Man
10-13-2011, 10:53 AM
Just curious. Did the TD in Super Bowl IV end Earsell Mackbee's career? He was the Vikings' cornerback that had coverage on Otis Taylor.

If you look at his stats in pro-football-reference, he played for five years and appeared to be peaking in 1969 at age 28, but that's his last year:

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MackEa20.htm

Wikipedia then notes that he was injured on the Otis Taylor play:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earsell_Mackbee

Rausch
10-13-2011, 10:58 AM
I don't think the HOF committee has discovered fact.

Neither do I...

milkman
10-13-2011, 09:15 PM
Otis Taylor belongs in the HOF for more than simply stats.

He and Buck Buchanon became the prototype at their respective positions that teams looked for.

suzzer99
10-13-2011, 11:40 PM
I still want to know why I seem to be the only one who thinks Albert Lewis should be in the HOF.

Count Zarth
10-13-2011, 11:42 PM
I still want to know why I seem to be the only one who thinks Albert Lewis should be in the HOF.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=combined&year_min=1983&year_max=1998&season_start=1&season_end=-1&age_min=0&age_max=99&draft_round_min=0&draft_round_max=99&league_id=&team_id=&is_active=&is_hof=&pos_is_cb=Y&c1stat=def_int&c1comp=gt&c1val=25&c2stat=&c2comp=gt&c2val=&c3stat=&c3comp=gt&c3val=&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&order_by=pass_td

During his career only 5 guys had more picks, and only Darrell Green played more games.

Smed1065
10-13-2011, 11:45 PM
DaKCMan AP reminds me of Awesome.

Ahh sum

suzzer99
10-14-2011, 01:06 AM
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=combined&year_min=1983&year_max=1998&season_start=1&season_end=-1&age_min=0&age_max=99&draft_round_min=0&draft_round_max=99&league_id=&team_id=&is_active=&is_hof=&pos_is_cb=Y&c1stat=def_int&c1comp=gt&c1val=25&c2stat=&c2comp=gt&c2val=&c3stat=&c3comp=gt&c3val=&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&order_by=pass_td

During his career only 5 guys had more picks, and only Darrell Green played more games.

Yay there are two of us! Lewis also had 11 blocked punts, and would have had a ton more pics except no one would throw at him for like the whole season.