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View Full Version : Football Was Tim Tebow’s game-winning touchdown illegal?


Deberg_1990
01-11-2012, 01:24 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/tim-tebow-game-winning-touchdown-illegal-163812959.html



A review of the Denver Broncos' pre-snap formation on the game-winning touchdown pass from Tim Tebow to Demaryius Thomas suggests that the play could have been ruled illegal.

Only six Denver Broncos players were lined up on the line of scrimmage before the snap. NFL rules say that a team must have seven or more players on the line for a snap to be legal. As the picture above shows, tight end Dante Rosario was well behind his teammates.

The formation eventually caught the eye of current Fox analyst and former NFL Vice President of Officiating Mike Pereira. He dismissed any suggestion that the play should have been whistled dead. "Watch on any Sunday," he tweeted. "This is a good formation compared to many. They are not technical with this."

In other words, the "seven men on the line" is a rule on the books but one that doesn't require a tape measure and straight edge to determine if every player is precisely on the line of scrimmage. If seven guys are close to line and set, Pereira implies, then the formation is fine.

[Related: Pittsburgh mayor salutes Tim Tebow to settle bet]

This seems to go against all other NFL rule enforcements, which always say that the letter of the law is far more important than the spirit of it. Still, when Pereira speaks, it's wise to listen.

That being said, I went back and looked at tape from every touchdown scored during wild-card weekend and didn't see a single formation in which the scoring team wasn't set with at least seven guys on the line of scrimmage. In this comprehensive highlight package of Bengals-Texans, there's only one play (at the 4:10 mark) that has a similar sloppy formation. This neither confirms nor contradicts Pereira's point, it only shows that illegal sets aren't exactly a pox on the NFL.

Should Tebow's touchdown have counted? Absolutely. It isn't a penalty if you don't get caught.

Garcia Bronco
01-11-2012, 01:25 PM
The NFL has said that it was a legal play and no flag should have been thrown. Which is what happened. Shall we talk about backward passes?

Munson
01-11-2012, 01:29 PM
Damn cheaters!

Rain Man
01-11-2012, 01:31 PM
I'm still annoyed that we had a penalty called against us for not having the interior line covered. I don't think I'd ever seen that penalty called before.

Mr. Arrowhead
01-11-2012, 01:32 PM
The NFL has said that it was a legal play and no flag should have been thrown. Which is what happened. Shall we talk about backward passes?

of course they did, because they get have the media talk about tebow all week for another week

htismaqe
01-11-2012, 01:32 PM
He's on the line.

Their line is setup in an arc. His position is in a straight line to the guy next to him. He's not "back" at all.

loochy
01-11-2012, 01:33 PM
Oh well...he lined up a few inches too far back. That obviously gave the Broncos a competitive advantage and resulted in a touchdown.:rolleyes:

Mile High Mania
01-11-2012, 01:34 PM
I'm surprised this took so long to show up here... I've read about this one and everyone in the know has said it was a solid formation. What they should be concerned about is the numerous missed face-mask calls against Tebow in recent weeks.

Every Sunday, in every game... you'll see something similar.

Deberg_1990
01-11-2012, 01:35 PM
He's on the line.

Their line is setup in an arc. His position is in a straight line to the guy next to him. He's not "back" at all.

looks like hes about 2 yards off the LoS

Chiefs Pantalones
01-11-2012, 01:35 PM
I'm surprised this took so long to show up here... I've read about this one and everyone in the know has said it was a solid formation. What they should be concerned about is the numerous missed face-mask calls against Tebow in recent weeks.
Every Sunday, in every game... you'll see something similar.

That's Elway's doing right there. ;)

Chiefnj2
01-11-2012, 01:36 PM
I've never understood that rule. Many teams on passing plays employ a big arc where the tackle is well away from the line of scrimmage.

BoneKrusher
01-11-2012, 01:36 PM
build em' up....


tear em down.

Pitt Gorilla
01-11-2012, 01:38 PM
He's on the line.

Their line is setup in an arc. His position is in a straight line to the guy next to him. He's not "back" at all.He could literally be standing anywhere on the field and be "in a straight line to the guy next to him."

htismaqe
01-11-2012, 01:41 PM
looks like hes about 2 yards off the LoS

They would only enforce it if he's 2 yards off the guy next to him.

As it is, he's covering the guy next to him, so he's technically on the line.

Garcia Bronco
01-11-2012, 01:42 PM
I'm surprised this took so long to show up here... I've read about this one and everyone in the know has said it was a solid formation. What they should be concerned about is the numerous missed face-mask calls against Tebow in recent weeks.

Every Sunday, in every game... you'll see something similar.

Counting the playoff game...the Broncos have had 17 uncalled fasmask penalties with 9 of them on Tim Tebow.

htismaqe
01-11-2012, 01:43 PM
He could literally be standing anywhere on the field and be "in a straight line to the guy next to him."

The tackle has to be "covered". He is. It's a perfectly legal formation.

Bowser
01-11-2012, 01:46 PM
It's close, but I've seen worse. The ones that piss me off that don't get called are when the left tackle lines up close to where Rosario is.

Lono
01-11-2012, 01:52 PM
The tackle has to be "covered". He is. It's a perfectly legal formation.

In College or HS that is a penalty and they would say he is not "covered" up. We had several penalties called on us this year where our TE did the same exact thing trying to cheat on a pull.

ClevelandBronco
01-11-2012, 01:52 PM
I'm still annoyed that we had a penalty called against us for not having the interior line covered. I don't think I'd ever seen that penalty called before.

I'm pretty sure he said ''inferior'' line. The Chiefs have that covered.

Garcia Bronco
01-11-2012, 01:53 PM
I'm pretty sure he said ''inferior'' line. The Chiefs have that covered.

zing!

loochy
01-11-2012, 01:54 PM
Counting the playoff game...the Broncos have had 17 uncalled fasmask penalties with 9 of them on Tim Tebow.

Pssshhh...Tamba Hali had 12390787 uncalled holding penalties and 123 uncalled facemasks.

ChiefsandO'sfan
01-11-2012, 02:00 PM
League says formation on Tebow-to-Thomas play was valid
Posted by Mike Florio on January 11, 2012, 2:45 PM EST
Wild Card Playoffs - Pittsburgh Steelers v Denver Broncos Getty Images

I’ve been holding this one for a day or two, but I’ve decided that it’s time to throw it out there. It’s raw meat for Tebowmaniacs and Anti-Broncites alike — the notion that the final play of Sunday’s stirring overtime win over the Steelers could have been called back due to a penalty.

Via various media outlets, including an item from the Bay Area News Group that ended up on the Denver Post website, it appears that the Broncos had only six players on the line of scrimmage at the snap of the ball.

Per NFL.com (via the Denver Post), the league says the formation was legal. “There is nothing to this,” NFL spokesman Greg Aiello told NFL.com. “This is a legal formation. This should not have been flagged.”

By rule, seven players must be on the line of scrimmage at the start of every play. On the play in question, the quarterback, a running back, and two wide receivers are clearly behind the line. There’s a tight end at the top of the screen — Dante Rosario — who isn’t flush with the rest of the linemen.

The video of the play shows that receiver Eddie Royal came in motion before the snap, with the play starting just as Royal made it near the tight end on the right side of the field.

Even if a violation occurred, the Broncos realized no advantage, but for the reality that Demaryius Thomas (if he was supposed to be on the line of scrimmage) was in better position to avoid a jam from cornerback Ike Taylor, because Thomas could avoid starting the play with Taylor in his face.

Regardless, it looked close. More importantly, it wasn’t called. Most importantly, the league says it wasn’t even a violation.

Bowser
01-11-2012, 02:01 PM
I'm pretty sure he said ''inferior'' line. The Chiefs have that covered.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/8X_Ot0k4XJc?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

listopencil
01-11-2012, 02:01 PM
Pssshhh...Tamba Hali had 12390787 uncalled holding penalties and 123 uncalled facemasks.

Doom gets the same treatment, every single down. They are usually better about protecting QB's though.
Posted via Mobile Device

HemiEd
01-11-2012, 02:06 PM
He could literally be standing anywhere on the field and be "in a straight line to the guy next to him."

:LOL: This is true!

That being said, if they are going to have that rule, they should enforce it all the time. I see lots of line formations similar to a flight of geese in the sky.

The Broncos cheated again!

htismaqe
01-11-2012, 02:07 PM
In College or HS that is a penalty and they would say he is not "covered" up. We had several penalties called on us this year where our TE did the same exact thing trying to cheat on a pull.

I watch 2-3 college games a weekend, and that's a legal formation in those games as well.

Bowser
01-11-2012, 02:09 PM
In College or HS that is a penalty and they would say he is not "covered" up. We had several penalties called on us this year where our TE did the same exact thing trying to cheat on a pull.

Not disagreeing at all, but everyone in the NBA travels. Badly.

mnchiefsguy
01-11-2012, 02:12 PM
Counting the playoff game...the Broncos have had 17 uncalled fasmask penalties with 9 of them on Tim Tebow.

And Tamba Hali was held at least 80 times this pass season where it was not called. Your point is?

Mile High Mania
01-11-2012, 02:28 PM
And Tamba Hali was held at least 80 times this pass season where it was not called. Your point is?

I think his point is there are other real things to point to and complain about...

kcchiefsus
01-11-2012, 02:31 PM
I'm surprised this took so long to show up here... I've read about this one and everyone in the know has said it was a solid formation. What they should be concerned about is the numerous missed face-mask calls against Tebow in recent weeks.

Every Sunday, in every game... you'll see something similar.

Tebow is a bitch, he deserves it.

Mile High Mania
01-11-2012, 02:41 PM
Tebow is a bitch, he deserves it.

Your momma.

ThaVirus
01-11-2012, 02:44 PM
I'm surprised this took so long to show up here... I've read about this one and everyone in the know has said it was a solid formation. What they should be concerned about is the numerous missed face-mask calls against Tebow in recent weeks.

Every Sunday, in every game... you'll see something similar.

That's partly Tebow's fault. Everytime someone comes near him he sticks an arm out and ducks his head..

ClevelandBronco
01-11-2012, 02:50 PM
Tebow is a bitch, he deserves it.

This is killing you, isn't it? That Tebow is still THE story in week 2 of the playoffs? It hurts, right?

Valiant
01-11-2012, 03:12 PM
I'm surprised this took so long to show up here... I've read about this one and everyone in the know has said it was a solid formation. What they should be concerned about is the numerous missed face-mask calls against Tebow in recent weeks.

Every Sunday, in every game... you'll see something similar.

That is actually tebows fault. In the last 3 games I have seen him cry for facemask for himself and runningbacks when their mask was not grabbed. Helmet and shoulderpad was. Cry like a woman and the refs won't believe you when it does happen.

Consistent1
01-11-2012, 03:17 PM
I'm surprised this took so long to show up here... I've read about this one and everyone in the know has said it was a solid formation. What they should be concerned about is the numerous missed face-mask calls against Tebow in recent weeks.

Every Sunday, in every game... you'll see something similar.

And Von and Elvis get held on every play too I'm sure. haha

Valiant
01-11-2012, 03:18 PM
This is killing you, isn't it? That Tebow is still THE story in week 2 of the playoffs? It hurts, right?

Which I find puzzling. The wr should be story of the week, thomas. The chiefs and everyone else the previous weeks showed how to beat the donks. Run blitz to the qb and stick to your man.

Pitts def was retarded.

That was tims best game though, no real mistakes.

Chiefnj2
01-11-2012, 03:20 PM
Tebow needs to sell the facemasks better. Writhe on the floor holding his eye and stamping his feet. Then with his other hand he can heal himself and jump up.

Mile High Mania
01-11-2012, 03:36 PM
And Von and Elvis get held on every play too I'm sure. haha

Everybody holds or gets held at times in games... Hell I think Matt Willis holds on every play.

I get the "whining doesn't help you" argument, but I honestly don't think there's much of that... I'm just remarking about 3-4 blatant misses by the refs in the last 2 games.

ChiTown
01-11-2012, 03:50 PM
That rule, especially how it is applied, is dumber than fuck. It has absolutely no bearing on the effectiveness of any given play. That said, I hope Tebow dies in an Aid's fire this weekend.

Mile High Mania
01-11-2012, 04:13 PM
That rule, especially how it is applied, is dumber than ****. It has absolutely no bearing on the effectiveness of any given play. That said, I hope Tebow dies in an Aid's fire this weekend.

Which Aid? Ohhhh, I see what you mean...

Epic Fail 007
01-11-2012, 04:16 PM
Just proof playoff games are fixed.

Pasta Giant Meatball
01-11-2012, 04:18 PM
Didn't the Chiefs lose a huge gainer to Baldwin on a similar call in the first Bronco game? Was a pretty big momentum killer.

notorious
01-11-2012, 04:19 PM
Counting the playoff game...the Broncos have had 17 uncalled fasmask penalties with 9 of them on Tim Tebow.

That's how Pittsburgh rolls.


I have never seen a team get away with so much "Physical" play in my life week in week out.

Bane
01-11-2012, 04:19 PM
Game never should have been close enough for that snap to matter anyway.

ChiTown
01-11-2012, 04:24 PM
Which Aid?

The whole thing

HemiEd
01-11-2012, 04:32 PM
Didn't the Chiefs lose a huge gainer to Baldwin on a similar call in the first Bronco game? Was a pretty big momentum killer.
Good memory, you are right. That really hurt for the team and Baldwin.

Pasta Giant Meatball
01-11-2012, 04:36 PM
Good memory, you are right. That really hurt for the team and Baldwin.

I remember being shocked that Cassel completed a bomb and of course it was negated by a ticky tack foul :deevee:

Mile High Mania
01-11-2012, 04:40 PM
I remember being shocked that Cassel completed a bomb and of course it was negated by a ticky tack foul :deevee:

And, of course you're sure of the exact type of penalty that was called.

LiveSteam
01-11-2012, 05:26 PM
More than 24 years ago, Pam & her husband Bob were serving as missionaries to the Philippines and praying for a fifth child. Pam contracted amoebic dysentery, an infection of the intestine caused by a parasite found in contaminated food or drink. She went into a coma and was treated with strong antibiotics before they discovered she was pregnant. Doctors urged her to abort the baby for her own saf...ety and told her that the medicines had caused irreversible damage to her baby. She refused the abortion and cited her Christian faith as the reason for her hope that her son would be born without the devastating disabilities physicians predicted. Pam said the doctors didn't think of it as a life, they thought of it as a mass of fetal tissue. While pregnant, Pam nearly lost their baby four times but refused to consider abortion. She recalled making a pledge to God with her husband: If you will give us a son, we’ll name him Timothy and we’ll make him a preacher. Pam ultimately spent the last two months of her pregnancy in bed and eventually gave birth to a healthy baby boy August 14, 1987. Pam’s youngest son is indeed a preacher. He preaches in prisons, makes hospital visits, and serves with his father’s ministry in the Philippines. He also plays football. Pam’s son is Tim Tebow
FML

Frazod
01-11-2012, 05:47 PM
Game never should have been close enough for that snap to matter anyway.

This. No team ever deserved a loss more than Shitsburgh did last Sunday.

Dr. Gigglepants
01-11-2012, 05:54 PM
They would only enforce it if he's 2 yards off the guy next to him.

As it is, he's covering the guy next to him, so he's technically on the line.

I don't really care, the Broncos won, this didn't help them. However, during one of our games this year, the announcer clarified the rule. According to him, your helmet has to be at least even with the center's belt to be considered on the LOS.

If that is the common interpretation of the rule, then both the TE and the LT are too far back, IMO. Could have been a penalty, but the NFL sure isn't going to come out and admit that now. The Tebow train keeps rollin' on.