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Dunit35
02-19-2012, 07:34 PM
My wife and I have been searching for our first house for about a little over a month now. We found the house we want after 11 houses. The house seems overpriced for the neighborhood, but its completely remolded. It'll need a new roof in the next 6-8 years and a new furnace/ac unit in the next five. So, we are hoping the seller accepts a lower offer.

How many houses did you see before buying one?

Bowser
02-19-2012, 07:37 PM
Shit, we went through two dozen, easily. I'd love some that she would hate, and vice versa. Hell, I hate the one we're in now, but she loves it. Never can win.

Baconeater
02-19-2012, 07:38 PM
What the house may need 5 or more years down the road shouldn't have that much affect on what it's worth today. You go into the purchase knowing it's going to cost you money to maintain.

But to answer your question, about a dozen.

Saul Good
02-19-2012, 07:38 PM
Tons.

Make a super low offer and force the sellers to work the offer on your terms. If your realtor tries to convince you not to lowball and risk "offending" the sellers, get a new realtor.

Bowser
02-19-2012, 07:39 PM
It's definitely a buyer's market out there for houses right now. Take Saul's advice and offer real low.

hometeam
02-19-2012, 07:59 PM
I looked at around 20 or so before I landed on mine.

I looked at it, liked it, looked at some more, and then looked at it again before putting in an offer.

It had been on the market for around a year at 100k, and was priced at 85k when I looked at it, ended up getting it at 79.5k with the seller paying all closing expenses.

ChiefsCountry
02-19-2012, 08:05 PM
As a real estate agent I generally see people on average look at 3 to 4 with me. Most looking anymore is done online.
Posted via Mobile Device

notorious
02-19-2012, 08:09 PM
As a real estate agent I generally see people on average look at 3 to 4 with me. Most looking anymore is done online.
Posted via Mobile Device

Not to take the thread off-subject, but is the new "House Sales Tax" for funding health care rumor true?

Dunit35
02-19-2012, 08:12 PM
We usually look online. One thing we've noticed is pictures make homes look nice.

The home is priced at $90k. Our realtor did a CMA and said the home is around $84k value without getting an actual appraisal. We want to start at $78k, her grandpa says we should start at $70k.

notorious
02-19-2012, 08:14 PM
Financed or Cash?

Dunit35
02-19-2012, 08:24 PM
Financed or Cash?

FHA. We have around $9500 down.

Rain Man
02-19-2012, 08:40 PM
I'll certainly note that a person can find their dream house on their first visit or fifth visit or tenth visit, but I'm always shocked at how few houses people look at before buying. For most people, this is the biggest purchase you'll make in your life, and you only look at five or ten before making a decision? The variable are infinite, and even if you find a house you like how do you know that it's a good deal if you're only looking at five or whatever?

I looked at about 80 homes before I bought. I didn't drag a Realtor along, though, not wishing to cause a Realtor suicide. I just went and looked at tons of open houses before I got a Realtor (and fended off solicitations at every one since I didn't want to have one at that point).

Granted, I bought my house before the Internet was big, so I can see doing a lot of winnowing down now via online research, but I still think nothing matches walking around and kicking tires and seeing what houses next door look like and peeking in the basement closets and all that stuff. Other than perhaps a virtual video tour, you're not going to get that full level of detail online.

Phobia
02-19-2012, 08:40 PM
The house seems overpriced for the neighborhood, but its completely remolded.

That's honestly not very desirable in most states.

rageeumr
02-19-2012, 08:42 PM
I probably looked at 30 houses. My wife looked at all those plus about 20 more.

The one we bought was one of the first ones we looked at, but we wanted to see as much stuff that was in our price range as possible.

Phobia
02-19-2012, 08:44 PM
We looked at nearly 30. We bought the 19th house we looked at a single Saturday. It was more than twice as big as our nearest candidate and has a huge shop in the back yard. It's perfect for our family.

ChiefsCountry
02-19-2012, 08:52 PM
You should know that ethically you shouldn't be giving this kind of advice on a message board, especially when he is already represented and you know nothing about the market he is looking in, much less the actual house he is considering. To say that he should be able to get the house at $81k is absolutely a guess on your part.

Yeah very true.
Posted via Mobile Device

DeezNutz
02-19-2012, 08:52 PM
You should know that ethically you shouldn't be giving this kind of advice on a message board, especially when he is already represented and you know nothing about the market he is looking in, much less the actual house he is considering. To say that he should be able to get the house at $81k is absolutely a guess on your part.

Dude, chill.

doomy3
02-19-2012, 08:53 PM
Dude, chill.

Why do you say to chill? I'm simply trying to help CC out. He can lose his license or be fined by giving advice like that to someone who has another agent. There is a pretty specific code of ethics.

DeezNutz
02-19-2012, 08:58 PM
Why do you say to chill? I'm simply trying to help CC out. He can lose his license or be fined by giving advice like that to someone who has another agent. There is a pretty specific code of ethics.

The "represented" part just read uptight to me. I know that you're literally in the right with everything you said, but this is still a football message board and someone named "chiefscountry" just shot off an opinion from the hip.

Raises an interesting question about "virtual" and "real life" and the potential ramifications they can have on each other.

doomy3
02-19-2012, 09:02 PM
The "represented" part just read uptight to me. I know that you're literally in the right with everything you said, but this is still a football message board and someone named "chiefscountry" just shot off an opinion from the hip.

Raises an interesting question about "virtual" and "real life" and the potential ramifications they can have on each other.

Many, MANY real estate agents have lost their licenses or paid heavy fines by giving advice to people on message boards who they don't represent and who had signed contracts with other agents. It isn't anything to mess around doing if you value being able to sell real estate. Especially when you are giving advice about something that you really don't know a thing about and passing it off as professional opinion.

Maybe it is uptight, but there is certainly a lot of downside to sharing opinions like that right after your first post in a thread is "As a real estate agent I..."

Baconeater
02-19-2012, 09:04 PM
I'll certainly note that a person can find their dream house on their first visit or fifth visit or tenth visit, but I'm always shocked at how few houses people look at before buying. For most people, this is the biggest purchase you'll make in your life, and you only look at five or ten before making a decision? The variable are infinite, and even if you find a house you like how do you know that it's a good deal if you're only looking at five or whatever?

I looked at about 80 homes before I bought. I didn't drag a Realtor along, though, not wishing to cause a Realtor suicide. I just went and looked at tons of open houses before I got a Realtor (and fended off solicitations at every one since I didn't want to have one at that point).

Granted, I bought my house before the Internet was big, so I can see doing a lot of winnowing down now via online research, but I still think nothing matches walking around and kicking tires and seeing what houses next door look like and peeking in the basement closets and all that stuff. Other than perhaps a virtual video tour, you're not going to get that full level of detail online.
Not all of us live in major metropolitan areas that have that many homes to choose from at any given moment. Our realtor had to dig pretty deep to find a dozen that fit our criteria. Plus you probably weren't too concerned about school districts since you don't have kids, that's a huge factor to most homebuyers.

DeezNutz
02-19-2012, 09:05 PM
Many, MANY real estate agents have lost their licenses or paid heavy fines by giving advice to people on message boards who they don't represent and who had signed contracts with other agents. It isn't anything to mess around doing if you value being able to sell real estate. Especially when you are giving advice about something that you really don't know a thing about and passing it off as professional opinion.

Maybe it is uptight, but there is certainly a lot of downside to sharing opinions like that right after your first post in a thread is "As a real estate agent I..."

On "anonymous" boards?

Dunit35
02-19-2012, 09:05 PM
Online looking has kept us from looking at houses that are horrid.

It's 3 bedrooms/1.5 baths, 2 living rooms, dining room, fenced yard, 2 car attached garage, refinished hardwood floors, formica countertops, new gas stove, new dishwasher, new carpets, porch, remodeled bathroom/kitchen. Built in 1954 with 1489 sq ft.

Owner bought it for $45k in july, flipped it put it on the market first week of November for 90k.

doomy3
02-19-2012, 09:06 PM
On "anonymous" boards?

Yes, absolutely. It doesn't take too much to connect dots. I know for sure that my name could get traced back to this board. It is all over the internet, and there would certainly be a post that could get tied back to here. No question.

Dunit35
02-19-2012, 09:07 PM
We haven't signed a contract for an agent. Didn't know you do that? we've been pre-approved but thats as far as we've been so far.

mikeyis4dcats.
02-19-2012, 09:07 PM
On "anonymous" boards?

you;d be surprised how often "anonymous" isn't. And as doomy said, Realtors have a code of ethics. It may even be possible that under that code, CC is responsible for reporting his own violation if he's a member of the BOR.

It's a tricky deal, but doomy is correct.

ChiefsCountry
02-19-2012, 09:08 PM
Yeah i got rid of it. Ethically it was out of line for me.
Posted via Mobile Device

Phobia
02-19-2012, 09:10 PM
Owner bought it for $45k in july, flipped it

He hasn't flipped it until you buy it.

ChiefsCountry
02-19-2012, 09:15 PM
We haven't signed a contract for an agent. Didn't know you do that? we've been pre-approved but thats as far as we've been so far.

You sign with an agent for legal purposes so they don't get screwed on commission when the sale goes through.
Posted via Mobile Device

Dunit35
02-19-2012, 09:20 PM
You sign with an agent for legal purposes so they don't get screwed on commission when the sale goes through.
Posted via Mobile Device

Oh, I just assumed it was all on good faith. I figured people stuck with the same realtor if everything went as desired.

Okie_Apparition
02-19-2012, 09:24 PM
Can you check owners of other houses they flipped
Ask for phone numbers

Dunit35
02-19-2012, 09:26 PM
Can you check owners of other houses they flipped
Ask for phone numbers

Realtor said this was his first flip.

Okie_Apparition
02-19-2012, 09:28 PM
Virgin on virgin crime

Rain Man
02-20-2012, 12:59 AM
Not all of us live in major metropolitan areas that have that many homes to choose from at any given moment. Our realtor had to dig pretty deep to find a dozen that fit our criteria. Plus you probably weren't too concerned about school districts since you don't have kids, that's a huge factor to most homebuyers.

Well, that's a good point. Now that you mention it, when my sister was househunting in rural Missouri her whole town had something like ten listings. So yeah, outside a metro area I can see looking at fewer.

While there are advantages to both types of places, househunting must be an area where living in a metro area has a big advantage. You can look until you find the perfect home, whereas the perfect may not be available in a smaller town. In my sister's case, they ended up buying a lot and building from scratch. None of the few available listings met their needs.

RubberSponge
02-20-2012, 02:46 AM
Eh, a house that is overpriced and needs 2 major upgrades in less than 10yrs in a buyers market doesn't exactly scream great deal to me. That roof right now to replace is not cheap. And that is a big deal. In 6-8 years add another 2K at least on top of 10K to get a good roof now. Your roof is much more important than the aesthetics of remodeling IMO. The furnace and AC, while somewhat expensive to replace is not as vital as a roof.

If I'm buying a home that is somewhat overpriced that damn roof better well be under 5yrs old.

oldman
02-20-2012, 05:52 AM
I'd echo what some of the folks have said on here. You have to consider what it's going to take to maintain (roof, etc.) if you're going to be there very long. If you have a concern, then when you try to sell yourself in 3-4 years, the next buyer will have concerns as well.
Second, never buy the most expensive house in the neighborhood. If the place was bought for $45K and he's asking $90K, then you're overpaying for the renovations.
Lastly, make sure your agent is working for you. The last thing you want to do is use the same agent as the seller.

kc rush
02-20-2012, 07:05 AM
We scouted a bunch online, visited about a half-dozen listings, and visited 6 or 7 new housing developments (with 5-6 model homes each). We weighed a lot of options before buying our house.

Go low and state your concerns, see if they bite.

Dunit35
02-20-2012, 07:21 AM
We are going to start at 75k with all closing costs paid by us. What does everyone else think we should do? We don't really think its worth it to go beyond 80-81k.

mikeyis4dcats.
02-20-2012, 07:36 AM
You sign with an agent for legal purposes so they don't get screwed on commission when the sale goes through.
Posted via Mobile Device

For a buyer though if he wants, he can wait until he finds a house to sign with a realtor if he really wants to. I wouldn't, but it's an option.

mikeyis4dcats.
02-20-2012, 07:37 AM
We are going to start at 75k with all closing costs paid by us. What does everyone else think we should do? We don't really think its worth it to go beyond 80-81k.

I'd make them pay for all inspections. I'd also start at 73,500.

Saul Good
02-20-2012, 08:20 AM
We are going to start at 75k with all closing costs paid by us. What does everyone else think we should do? We don't really think its worth it to go beyond 80-81k.

Here is the advice I would give my best friend if he was in the "offer stage":

1. Don't get emotionally attached to the house. If you can't get the deal you want, it makes it much easier to walk away.

2. Have a plan and stick to it. Figure out what the house is worth to you and do not go beyond that number.

3. Don't worry about the feelings of your realtor or the seller. You aren't "wasting their time" or "offending" them by not agreeing to something that doesn't fit your plan.

mikeyis4dcats.
02-20-2012, 08:21 AM
I will say that offending the seller does you no good. I would be somewhat conscious of avoiding that.

Saul Good
02-20-2012, 08:34 AM
I will say that offending the seller does you no good. I would be somewhat conscious of avoiding that.

When I sold my last house, no offer would have offended me. Even a lowball offer beats the $0 offer of those who don't even make an offer.

Also, this isn't the seller's personal residence. He isn't emotionally attached to it the way he might be if he had raised his family there.

I'm not offended if someone has their house priced too high, and I'm not worried about offending someone by offering too little. Buying a house is a decision that is going to impact the rest of your life. Whether or not I offend a perfect stranger in the process by not offering him enough money is not going to cost me any sleep.

mikeyis4dcats.
02-20-2012, 08:39 AM
When I sold my last house, no offer would have offended me. Even a lowball offer beats the $0 offer of those who don't even make an offer.

Also, this isn't the seller's personal residence. He isn't emotionally attached to it the way he might be if he had raised his family there.

I'm not offended if someone has their house priced too high, and I'm not worried about offending someone by offering too little. Buying a house is a decision that is going to impact the rest of your life. Whether or not I offend a perfect stranger in the process by not offering him enough money is not going to cost me any sleep.

no, but if you offer an unreasonable lowball offer on a house you otherwise could have made a reasonable purchase on, it will cost you. People selling homes without a realtor are especially prone to getting offended and allowing it to affect their negotiating.

Saul Good
02-20-2012, 08:59 AM
no, but if you offer an unreasonable lowball offer on a house you otherwise could have made a reasonable purchase on, it will cost you. People selling homes without a realtor are especially prone to getting offended and allowing it to affect their negotiating.

I understand that there is such a thing as offending the seller, but it's a buyer's market and should be treated as such. I'm not suggesting offering $40k or anything nonsensical. If it's even in the ballpark of being reasonable, that's good enough.

If the asking price is $90k, $60k should not be an offensive offer. I wouldn't suggest starting there, as you are likely just wasting your own time, but it shouldn't kill any chance of a deal going forward.

Some dude sitting on an investment property in this market doesn't have the luxury of being offended enough to tell a potential buyer to fuck off. If he wants to roll the dice and try to find someone else who wants to buy a house with a bad roof that is priced above the rest of the neighborhood, he's not someone I want to negotiate with anyway. That's why I don't get emotionally attached to things like houses, cars, boats, etc. until I own them.

Fat Elvis
02-20-2012, 09:25 AM
I understand that there is such a thing as offending the seller, but it's a buyer's market and should be treated as such. I'm not suggesting offering $40k or anything nonsensical. If it's even in the ballpark of being reasonable, that's good enough.

If the asking price is $90k, $60k should not be an offensive offer. I wouldn't suggest starting there, as you are likely just wasting your own time, but it shouldn't kill any chance of a deal going forward.

Some dude sitting on an investment property in this market doesn't have the luxury of being offended enough to tell a potential buyer to **** off. If he wants to roll the dice and try to find someone else who wants to buy a house with a bad roof that is priced above the rest of the neighborhood, he's not someone I want to negotiate with anyway. That's why I don't get emotionally attached to things like houses, cars, boats, etc. until I own them.

$60K is nonsensical considering he paid $45K for the house, did renovations, paid taxes, and will have to pay a realtor's commission upon selling the house. If I don't find a buyer, I rent that sucker out. $500-600/month pays all my mortgage, insurance and taxes + repairs and then some. No one goes into investment properties to waste their time and lose money.

Dunit35
02-20-2012, 09:27 AM
We have an appointment with our realtor at 4. 74k with all closing costs being paid by us, stove and dishwasher stay. There's also one broken window that we'll mention.

Omaha
02-20-2012, 09:29 AM
$60K is nonsensical considering he paid $45K for the house, did renovations, paid taxes, and will have to pay a realtor's commission upon selling the house. If I don't find a buyer, I rent that sucker out. $500-600/month pays all my mortgage, insurance and taxes + repairs and then some. No one goes into investment properties to waste their time and lose money.

But sometimes people get into trouble & just need to get out from under it. If nobody ever lost money flipping houses, everyone would flip houses.

Dunit35
02-20-2012, 09:31 AM
I'm guessing he's 60k invested in the property. maybe paying 7 months in mortage makes him want to sell it.

Dartgod
02-20-2012, 09:32 AM
Typical Saul with his ridiculous analogies. ROFL

It'll need a new roof in the next 6-8 years...

If he wants to roll the dice and try to find someone else who wants to buy a house with a bad roof that is priced above the rest of the neighborhood...

Saul Good
02-20-2012, 09:40 AM
Typical Saul with his ridiculous analogies. ROFL

Figure out what an analogy is before you insult anyone's intelligence, dipshit.

Dartgod
02-20-2012, 09:47 AM
Figure out what an analogy is before you insult anyone's intelligence, dipshit.

OK, so it wasn't an analogy this time. Still doesn't take away from the fact that you're not above exaggerating facts to make a point.

I ain't mad at you, it just made me chuckle.

I know I bust your balls a lot, but you're ok in my book based on your Mizzou BB fandom. You just tend to go overboard on the hyperbole quite often.

Saul Good
02-20-2012, 09:52 AM
I'm guessing he's 60k invested in the property. maybe paying 7 months in mortage makes him want to sell it.

That's probably a pretty good guess. If he has $60k in it, it's a matter of figuring out if he is sweating carrying it for half a year and just wants to unload it.

The reality of the situation is that the house was purchased and rehabbed for somewhere in the neighborhood of $60k by a first time flipper. Anyone else could do the same thing, as it's not like this is some professional flipper who has a magic touch.

It's worth a premium for his time and effore, but it's not worth near the $90k he's asking. He didn't double the value of a $45k house by remodeling it (especially if he didn't replace a 20+ year old roof), though. I think you're in a pretty good spot with your initial offer, but I wouldn't move much.

Saul Good
02-20-2012, 09:58 AM
OK, so it wasn't an analogy this time. Still doesn't take away from the fact that you're not above exaggerating facts to make a point.

I ain't mad at you, it just made me chuckle.

I know I bust your balls a lot, but you're ok in my book based on your Mizzou BB fandom. You just tend to go overboard on the hyperbole quite often.

You don't consider a roof that will need to be replaced in 6-8 years to be bad? I sure as hell do if I'm house hunting. you're talking about an expense that is close to 10% of the purchase price of the entire house, and it's going to come right out of pocket (as opposed to being financed into the loan).

It's like buying a $7,000 used car that is going to need $500 worth of tires in 6 months. It might not be a deal breaker, but it should be part of the negotiation.

Dartgod
02-20-2012, 10:00 AM
You don't consider a roof that will need to be replaced in 6-8 years to be bad? I sure as hell do if I'm house hunting. you're talking about an expense that is close to 10% of the purchase price of the entire house, and it's going to come right out of pocket (as opposed to being financed into the loan).

It's like buying a $7,000 used car that is going to need $500 worth of tires in 6 months. It might not be a deal breaker, but it should be part of the negotiation.

No, I don't. If it was bad, it would need to be replaced now.

vailpass
02-20-2012, 10:01 AM
$60K is nonsensical considering he paid $45K for the house, did renovations, paid taxes, and will have to pay a realtor's commission upon selling the house. If I don't find a buyer, I rent that sucker out. $500-600/month pays all my mortgage, insurance and taxes + repairs and then some. No one goes into investment properties to waste their time and lose money.

Mediterranean and Baltic Avenue eh?

Rain Man
02-20-2012, 10:02 AM
As a side story, I finally got my apartment all ready to rent since we've remodeled the kitchen, and I've been showing it to people.

I got a person who committed for it, but have learned the hard way that sometimes people flake out, so I kept the sign up and let other people know that they could get on a waiting list in case the first deal falls through. I had three people on my waiting list when a couple from Italy showed up and looked at it.

I told them that they'd be fourth in line if they're interested, but they were still welcome to look at it, and they did. They seemed to like it, and the guy said that he'd be back in touch if they wanted to go on the waiting list.

Well, the next day he e-mails me and says that they're interested in the apartment, but he tries to negotiate me down. He says they're willing to pay 20% less, but not the full amount.

My response was along the lines of "Thank you for your interest, but considering that I have a waiting list of people at the asking price I don't see any need to lower the price."

I just thought it was kind of funny that he was trying to negotiate me down when I've got a waiting list.

And it's a good thing that I don't discriminate against models, because the woman who took the apartment listed her previous job as "promotional model". And you know what? I believe it. My wife was razzing me a bit about whether that impacted my sales strategy, but what can I say? It's illegal to discriminate against attractive people just because they're different than me.

vailpass
02-20-2012, 10:04 AM
As a side story, I finally got my apartment all ready to rent since we've remodeled the kitchen, and I've been showing it to people.

I got a person who committed for it, but have learned the hard way that sometimes people flake out, so I kept the sign up and let other people know that they could get on a waiting list in case the first deal falls through. I had three people on my waiting list when a couple from Italy showed up and looked at it.

I told them that they'd be fourth in line if they're interested, but they were still welcome to look at it, and they did. They seemed to like it, and the guy said that he'd be back in touch if they wanted to go on the waiting list.

Well, the next day he e-mails me and says that they're interested in the apartment, but he tries to negotiate me down. He says they're willing to pay 20% less, but not the full amount.

My response was along the lines of "Thank you for your interest, but considering that I have a waiting list of people at the asking price I don't see any need to lower the price."

I just thought it was kind of funny.

And it's a good thing that I don't discriminate against models, because the woman who took it listed her previous job as "promotional model". And you know what? I believe it. My wife was razzing me a bit about whether that impacted my sales strategy, but what can I say? It's illegal to discriminate against attractive people just because they're different than me.

Got that hidden shower-cam installed did you?

Rain Man
02-20-2012, 10:05 AM
Got that hidden shower-cam installed did you?

Oh, dang. I'm going to have to get on that.

Fat Elvis
02-20-2012, 10:11 AM
Mediterranean and Baltic Avenue eh?

More like Oriental...he's no slum lord.

Saul Good
02-20-2012, 10:14 AM
No, I don't. If it was bad, it would need to be replaced now.

I guess it's just semantics, then. It's used up 75% of it's useful life. If you want to use a word other than "bad" to describe it, that's fine. It's certainly a "con" when listing out the pros and cons, though.

Dartgod
02-20-2012, 10:17 AM
I guess it's just semantics, then. It's used up 75% of it's useful life. If you want to use a word other than "bad" to describe it, that's fine. It's certainly a "con" when listing out the pros and cons, though.
Bunny tickle?

And yes, this post is more accurate and reasonable.

Dr. Gigglepants
02-20-2012, 10:19 AM
50% of the homes in my neighborhood got new roofs after the hail this spring. There are still roofs getting replaced. Just hope for hail and you'll be good.
Posted via Mobile Device

ferrarispider95
02-20-2012, 10:29 AM
No one knows what this guy has in it or his motivation to sell, nor the current local market.

Speculating what he would take is ridiculous.

Dunit needs to come up with he would pay for the house based on his budget and what other comps are selling for.

Whose to say this flipper didn't pay cash for it and would rather wait for a spring/summer market then unload it early? There is so many different scenarios, the only true way to go into it is set a budget and stick to it.


My only advice is to expect the work done throughout the home. New paint, trim, and carpet can hide a lot of sins. Pay a home inspector to identify any problems.






That's probably a pretty good guess. If he has $60k in it, it's a matter of figuring out if he is sweating carrying it for half a year and just wants to unload it.

The reality of the situation is that the house was purchased and rehabbed for somewhere in the neighborhood of $60k by a first time flipper. Anyone else could do the same thing, as it's not like this is some professional flipper who has a magic touch.

It's worth a premium for his time and effore, but it's not worth near the $90k he's asking. He didn't double the value of a $45k house by remodeling it (especially if he didn't replace a 20+ year old roof), though. I think you're in a pretty good spot with your initial offer, but I wouldn't move much.

ferrarispider95
02-20-2012, 10:35 AM
Yes, a roof is a considerable expense and something you should figure into your budget of your offer price.

Roofs can vary quite a bit with age, I have seen older roofs that were in far better condition than newer roofs. A lot of the steepness, overhang of trees, previous hail damage, and improper attic ventilation can shorten or extend roof life.

Saul Good
02-20-2012, 10:35 AM
No one knows what this guy has in it or his motivation to sell, nor the current local market.

Speculating what he would take is ridiculous.

Dunit needs to come up with he would pay for the house based on his budget and what other comps are selling for.

Whose to say this flipper didn't pay cash for it? There is so many different scenarios, the only true way to go into it is set a budget and stick to it.


My only advice is to expect the work done throughout the home. New paint, trim, and carpet can hide a lot of sins. Pay a home inspector to identify any problems.

I agree with what you're saying here. That said, if you don't know how low he's willing to go to unload this house, the only way to find out is to offer low. You don't get what you don't ask for.

ferrarispider95
02-20-2012, 10:39 AM
I had a Pakistan gentlemen do the same thing. Smart guy too, had an md in psychology.

I told him I have a couple applications that are in, but if he wanted to go ahead and put an application in by Monday, I would choose the best out of the 3. He said ok, and then try to barter the price of the rent down.

I was like I don't think you understand how this works. He also wanted to basically remodel the entire house to fit his taste.



As a side story, I finally got my apartment all ready to rent since we've remodeled the kitchen, and I've been showing it to people.

I got a person who committed for it, but have learned the hard way that sometimes people flake out, so I kept the sign up and let other people know that they could get on a waiting list in case the first deal falls through. I had three people on my waiting list when a couple from Italy showed up and looked at it.

I told them that they'd be fourth in line if they're interested, but they were still welcome to look at it, and they did. They seemed to like it, and the guy said that he'd be back in touch if they wanted to go on the waiting list.

Well, the next day he e-mails me and says that they're interested in the apartment, but he tries to negotiate me down. He says they're willing to pay 20% less, but not the full amount.

My response was along the lines of "Thank you for your interest, but considering that I have a waiting list of people at the asking price I don't see any need to lower the price."

I just thought it was kind of funny that he was trying to negotiate me down when I've got a waiting list.

And it's a good thing that I don't discriminate against models, because the woman who took the apartment listed her previous job as "promotional model". And you know what? I believe it. My wife was razzing me a bit about whether that impacted my sales strategy, but what can I say? It's illegal to discriminate against attractive people just because they're different than me.

mikeyis4dcats.
02-20-2012, 10:40 AM
that brings up a good point....not sure where this house is, but you'll want to verify with your insurance agent that there was not a roof claim that the seller pocketed. That happened to my sister.

Dr. Gigglepants
02-20-2012, 10:43 AM
I agree with what you're saying here. That said, if you don't know how low he's willing to go to unload this house, the only way to find out is to offer low. You don't get what you don't ask for.

I know, what's he going to do? Leave an upper decker for them in the master bath? This guy flipped a house in an historically soft market. If he takes less than he wants he can chalk it up to a life lesson. He knew what he was getting into. I think 74K sounds absolutely reasonable, I wouldn't go much higher unless you're in love with the place.
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ferrarispider95
02-20-2012, 10:45 AM
I agree with what you're saying here. That said, if you don't know how low he's willing to go to unload this house, the only way to find out is to offer low. You don't get what you don't ask for.

Exactly, I don't worry about offending anyone. Also stay low after that initial offer, don't bump up too quick. You will get a good feeling on his motivation, by his counter.

Also here is a bit of advice that I have learned after buying lots of investment properties, don't even reveal to your agent how much you are willing to spend on that house.

In my experience, especially in smaller towns, all the agents know each other very well. Even though they are working on your behalf, they don't make money unless they close the sell. Keep that top # close to your vest.

ferrarispider95
02-20-2012, 10:49 AM
I know, what's he going to do? Leave an upper decker for them in the master bath? This guy flipped a house in an historically soft market. If he takes less than he wants he can chalk it up to a life lesson. He knew what he was getting into. I think 74K sounds absolutely reasonable, I wouldn't go much higher unless you're in love with the place.
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It is a soft market across the US, but their are pockets of good markets. It ain't 2007, but a lot of smaller towns didn't see near the run up Cali and Florida did.

Ask the realtor about inventory levels, # of sales, avg. price of homes, and % difference between asking and selling price.

I not a realtor, just have been part of a lot of sales transactions.

Dr. Gigglepants
02-20-2012, 10:55 AM
I also second the notion of a thorough inspection, especially since it was his first flip. You might get a list of everything he did and give it to the home inspector. If what he did was mostly cosmetic its probably fine though.
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Rain Man
02-20-2012, 11:10 AM
As another side story, my next-door neighbor got solar panels this last week. Our neighborhood is old homes, so the houses are close together, and they all have this interesting and barely perceptible flare at the end of the roofs. (Think pagoda, but much, much less noticeable.) The roofs also have a reasonably steep pitch.

So the guy is up on their roof installing the panels and he drops a tool. Clackity-clackity it bounces down the roof, picking up speed as it goes. Then it hits the bottom where the barely perceptible flare is. Clackity-clackity and all of a sudden it levels out and arches up like it's on a ski ramp. Wheeee, across the empty space between our houses and in a shot worthy of William Tell it misses all of the brick and goes right through a little decorative window next to our fireplace. It must've hit the edge or something because it broke the storm window, but didn't break the interior window. Nice shot, dudes.

vailpass
02-20-2012, 11:48 AM
More like Oriental...he's no slum lord.

That is some racist shit right there. The proper phraseology is chink in the armor.

oldman
02-20-2012, 01:49 PM
Insist on a home inspection at the sellers expense. I'd also second that keeping you final number to yourself.

rageeumr
02-20-2012, 01:59 PM
As another side story, my next-door neighbor got solar panels this last week.

I'm surprised your historical-minded neighborhood allows such a thing. My HOA explicitly outlaws solar panels.

Rain Man
02-20-2012, 02:05 PM
I'm surprised your historical-minded neighborhood allows such a thing. My HOA explicitly outlaws solar panels.

From what I understand they're not allowed to ban solar panels, per...something. State law or local ordinance or something. In the fight of history vs. green, green wins this round.

Dunit35
02-29-2012, 11:34 AM
We made an offer on that house, we couldn't agree on a price. So we looked at another 5-6 houses. My wife found her dream home Saturday. We put in an offer and it was accepted. Time for the next step.

Fat Elvis
02-29-2012, 11:58 AM
We made an offer on that house, we couldn't agree on a price. So we looked at another 5-6 houses. My wife found her dream home Saturday. We put in an offer and it was accepted. Time for the next step.

Sweet and congrats. Sometimes it is great when things don't work out as well as we originally hoped. When the wife gets the dream home and it is in your price range, it makes things a lot smoother.

vailpass
02-29-2012, 12:04 PM
We made an offer on that house, we couldn't agree on a price. So we looked at another 5-6 houses. My wife found her dream home Saturday. We put in an offer and it was accepted. Time for the next step.

Oh boy you are in for it now.

mlyonsd
02-29-2012, 12:19 PM
We made an offer on that house, we couldn't agree on a price. So we looked at another 5-6 houses. My wife found her dream home Saturday. We put in an offer and it was accepted. Time for the next step.Awesome. When's the first BBQ?

Saul Good
02-29-2012, 03:05 PM
We made an offer on that house, we couldn't agree on a price. So we looked at another 5-6 houses. My wife found her dream home Saturday. We put in an offer and it was accepted. Time for the next step.

Congratulations.

What are your thoughts on the new house? Do you feel like you got a better deal on this house than you would have on the other house if he had accepted your highest offer?

Okie_Apparition
02-29-2012, 03:08 PM
He's busy breaking it in

Dunit35
02-29-2012, 07:04 PM
Congratulations.

What are your thoughts on the new house? Do you feel like you got a better deal on this house than you would have on the other house if he had accepted your highest offer?

Yeah, its 350+ sq ft bigger and cheaper, bigger yard. My wife likes it better as well. Better neighborhood, big covered patio. Do I like it as much as the other? Not really, but my wife does.

Shaid
02-29-2012, 08:16 PM
We looked for a good couple of years and finally got a good deal to just build our house. There are 40 year old houses that are smaller than ours that were selling for more than we could build it for. I was shocked at the prices on some of the houses out there. Granted I had to finish the basement on my own but that's what a few buddies and a couple six packs of beer are for. Only cost $10k to finish the whole basement and my house is worth $70k more than what I bought it for a little over 3 years ago.