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Mr_Tomahawk
02-23-2012, 03:13 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/02/23/kansas-city-radio-host-says-chiefs-condon-have-spoken-about-peyton-manning/

Posted by Mike Florio on February 23, 2012, 5:06 PM EST


The news of lingering neck problems that eventually would result in season-ending surgery for Peyton Manning first arose via a couple of Indianapolis radio hosts. And so it’s fitting, we suppose, that the first semi-concrete report regarding Manning’s next destination would come from a Kansas City radio host.

Bob Fescoe of 610 Sports writes via Twitter that he is “[h]earing” the Chiefs and agent Tom Condon “have spoken twice” about Colts quarterback Peyton Manning, and that Fescoe is “told” the financials are a “good fit” for the Chiefs.

Technically, no team may talk to Peyton or Condon until the Colts release Manning. But tampering happens all the time at this time of the year, and it becomes nearly blatant at the Scouting Combine in Indianapolis.

Manning makes sense for the Chiefs for various reasons. They have more than enough cap space, a relatively strong defense, a great young running back in Jamaal Charles, and competent receivers (who’d look a lot better with Peyton Manning throwing the passes). Last year, even after Charles, safety Eric Berry, and tight end Tony Moeaki were lost early to torn ACLs, the Chiefs pulled it together and nearly pulled off a second straight AFC West title.

The fact that the Chiefs play in the AFC West would make Peyton’s path back to the postseason easier than elsewhere.

With the AFC West teams playing the AFC North and NFC South teams in 2012, eight or nine wins will likely once again result in a playoff berth. Apart from the Ravens (home), Bengals (home), Steelers (away), Browns (away), Falcons (home), Panthers (home), Buccaneers (away), and Saints (away), the Chiefs play the Bills in Buffalo and, yes, the Colts at Arrowhead Stadium.

And so, 19 years after the Chiefs acquired Joe Montana for a late-career second act, it’s time to add the Chiefs to the list of teams that possibly could provide Peyton Manning with a place to chase another Super Bowl title. Or two.

Sofa King
02-23-2012, 03:14 PM
http://www.cinemaspy.com/img/user/judi-dench-m-bond_250.jpg

loochy
02-23-2012, 03:15 PM
JIMP

http://employeesofthemonth.net/phpBB3/images/smilies/jimp.png

O.city
02-23-2012, 03:16 PM
You know, looking at this years schedule this time last year I was pretty terrified. Now, I'm not sure we won't beat the Ravens and Steelers, don't know about the Saints tho.

Dayze
02-23-2012, 03:18 PM
this guy wrote this based on what Fescoe had tweeted? lol.


Fescoe.....lol

HemiEd
02-23-2012, 03:19 PM
If there is one shred of truth to this, it has to give everyone of us hope. Even if it is only a sliver, it would mean Pioli is not the slobbering/drooling idiot that thinks Cassel is truly the answer.

AndChiefs
02-23-2012, 03:19 PM
Just draft a real QBOTF to follow him this time.

HemiEd
02-23-2012, 03:20 PM
this guy wrote this based on what Fescoe had tweeted? lol.


Fescoe.....lol

Well crap.

O.city
02-23-2012, 03:20 PM
Say we had this draft.

11. Trent Richardson, RB, Alabama
44. Coby Fleener, TE, Stanford
75. Bobby Massie, OT, Ole Miss
108. Ryan Broyles WR, Oklahoma.

And signed Manning, Soliai, and Bowe.


Where would that put us financially?

ChiefAshhole20
02-23-2012, 03:20 PM
And yet were not even in NFL32s top 5 teams likely to get him. ESPN has become such a joke...

Dayze
02-23-2012, 03:20 PM
let's not jump the gun here boys... he still has to compete with Cassel for the starting job. Come at me Bro.

Thig Lyfe
02-23-2012, 03:21 PM
Q

DMAC
02-23-2012, 03:22 PM
Just draft a real QBOTF to follow him this time.

Impossible this year (or so it eye-poppingly appears).

Might as well get a badass QB now with this talented team.

Mr_Tomahawk
02-23-2012, 03:22 PM
Q

Not really.

Unless you are referring the tweet I posted....this elaborate on it.

loochy
02-23-2012, 03:22 PM
This would make me forget about that Carr guy

Mr_Tomahawk
02-23-2012, 03:23 PM
This would make me forget about that Carr guy

Yup.

Dayze
02-23-2012, 03:23 PM
Chiefs will probably be dumb enough to trade for him instead of waiting it out.

WV
02-23-2012, 03:26 PM
There are some serious hurdles for Manning to get over to even consider this....I truly hope Pioli doesn't get to enamored with the idea of Manning if his isn't back to normal.

KCUnited
02-23-2012, 03:27 PM
Florio is the one that got burned by Pizzagate, I'm surprised he's rolling with Fescoe again.

Thig Lyfe
02-23-2012, 03:29 PM
Not really.

Unless you are referring the tweet I posted....this elaborate on it.

whoops I meant to type "QB should be our top priority"

suds79
02-23-2012, 03:30 PM
There are some serious hurdles for Manning to get over to even consider this....I truly hope Pioli doesn't get to enamored with the idea of Manning if his isn't back to normal.

I don't understand the hesitation to land one of the best QBs of this generation.

He'll have to pass a physical with the Chiefs. That's obvious. So relax about that part.

But lets say the worse possible thing happens. We sign Peyton. He plays 1 game and isn't healthy and gets hurt. Big deal. Then we're right in the same situation we're headed in right now with Matt Cassel.

It's not like they would hand Peyton a 5 year deal.

Just keep in mind it's either Peyton "Freaking" Manning or Matt Cassel. That's all you need to know.

talastan
02-23-2012, 03:31 PM
I don't see anything really exciting in this report. I'm sure Condon has probably had "a couple" of conversations with every QB hungry team in the NFL already. Nothing new here IMO. Could be presumption on Fescoe's part. :shrug:

siberian khatru
02-23-2012, 03:33 PM
Any team with a potential QB opening would be stupid not to call Condon and ask:

1. What are the medicals looking like?
2. What kind of money are you looking for?

That's just due diligence. Doesn't mean you're in hot pursuit, just means you're keeping the bases covered. I would HOPE that Pioli would do that bare minimum.

stonedstooge
02-23-2012, 03:35 PM
Any team with a potential QB opening would be stupid not to call Condon and ask:

1. What are the medicals looking like?
2. What kind of money are you looking for?
3. Is he able to bend over to pick up candy wrappers?
That's just due diligence. Doesn't mean you're in hot pursuit, just means you're keeping the bases covered. I would HOPE that Pioli would do that bare minimum.

FYP

ChiefsandO'sfan
02-23-2012, 03:35 PM
This is from pizza shop bob so safe to say not true.

Chocolate Hog
02-23-2012, 03:37 PM
This is from pizza shop bob so safe to say not true.

They just talked about it on PTI.

gblowfish
02-23-2012, 03:37 PM
http://www.hulu.com/watch/1603/saturday-night-live-snl-digital-short-united-way

PunkinDrublic
02-23-2012, 03:40 PM
I don't see anything really exciting in this report. I'm sure Condon has probably had "a couple" of conversations with every QB hungry team in the NFL already. Nothing new here IMO. Could be presumption on Fescoe's part. :shrug:

The difference is the Chiefs are one of the few teams in a position to offer him what he is looking for.

Chocolate Hog
02-23-2012, 03:40 PM
BTW pizzagate was Danny Parkins.

O.city
02-23-2012, 03:40 PM
What was said on PTI, Bo?

ChiefsandO'sfan
02-23-2012, 03:40 PM
BTW pizzagate was Danny Parkins.

No it was bob.



Chiefs Play Calling Duties Reportedly Went To Todd Haley In 2nd Half Of Ravens Game

by Joel Thorman on Jan 10, 2011 12:20 PM CST in 2010 Kansas City Chiefs Season

363 comments
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Somehow we knew the stories surrounding Charlie Weis' exit weren't done yet.

610 Sports' Bob Fescoe reports that Charlie Weis has told people that Todd Haley took away play calling duties from him in the second half of Sunday's game against the Baltimore Ravens. Here's what Fescoe had to say on Monday morning:

"Jamaal Charles had just finished speaking to us literally five minutes maybe before that. I received a text from someone up in the Northland, and I received another one from someone this morning that was in the same pizza shop, not Pizza Shoppe, but a pizza location up there in the Northland......They both said Charlie Weis was up there telling anybody who would listen that Todd Haley took second half play calling duties away from him in the second half yesterday."

The Chiefs offense struggled throughout Sunday's game though maybe more so in the second half when they were faced with a two-score deficit. Todd Haley is expected to conduct his end of season press conference sometime this week but I have a hard time seeing him revisiting this topic.

Speaking of Weis, Matt Cassel was on 810 WHB's The Program with Soren Petro on Monday and confirmed that Weis was still in Kansas City.

"We'll definitely get together for dinner," Cassel said of Weis. "I don't know when he's heading down to Florida. I'll see him today and we'll discuss that."

Chocolate Hog
02-23-2012, 03:44 PM
I thought you were referring to this years pizza story about Haley leaving a meeting early in Chicago to go out for pizza.

58-4ever
02-23-2012, 03:53 PM
Print 'em

Chocolate Hog
02-23-2012, 03:58 PM
BTW Florio was saying this on ESPN Radio yesterday so Fescoe doesn't really matter.

58-4ever
02-23-2012, 03:59 PM
BTW Florio was saying this on ESPN Radio yesterday so Fescoe doesn't really matter.

And on Gottlieb's show today.

O.city
02-23-2012, 04:00 PM
What was said on PTI today?

Rain Man
02-23-2012, 04:01 PM
I wonder if they'll "invite him in to compete with Matt Cassel for the starting spot".

Who was it that Carl said that about once? It was some big star, and Carl said something like, "we'll invite him in to complete with [some not very impressive starter at the time]?"

xztop12
02-23-2012, 04:08 PM
I don't think Peyton wants to learn a new offensive system and have a guy his own age in Daboll teaching him stuff

Mr_Tomahawk
02-23-2012, 04:12 PM
I don't think Peyton wants to learn a new offensive system and have a guy his own age in Daboll teaching him stuff

Bullshit.

If you are Daboll and Peyton wants to join your team...you adjust whatever you need to please him.

Peyton keeps you employed regardless of how bad of an OC/HC you are.

See: Jim Caldwell

Discuss Thrower
02-23-2012, 04:13 PM
Joe Montana 2: Electric Boogaloo

Coogs
02-23-2012, 04:15 PM
Doesn't Miami have a billboard up though? How are we supposed to compete with that shit?!?!

Fritz88
02-23-2012, 04:17 PM
If my shit talks, it will have more credibility than Fesco.

PunkinDrublic
02-23-2012, 04:18 PM
Bullshit.

If you are Daboll and Peyton wants to join your team...you adjust whatever you need to please him.

Peyton keeps you employed regardless of how bad of an OC/HC you are.

See: Jim Caldwell

Plus Peyton Manning is a savant when it comes to learning new offenses anyway. Dude is one of the smartest QBs ever to play the game.

Fruit Ninja
02-23-2012, 04:19 PM
Keep the smoke coming, eventually that fire will break out!

vailpass
02-23-2012, 04:19 PM
Peyton could win his division almost every year in KC 111!!!

Fruit Ninja
02-23-2012, 04:20 PM
Bullshit.

If you are Daboll and Peyton wants to join your team...you adjust whatever you need to please him.

Peyton keeps you employed regardless of how bad of an OC/HC you are.

See: Jim Caldwell
Yep, they will do whatever it is to please Peyton. YOu adjust to what your qb can do! Daboll isnt a stupid man.

Plus we got better offensive players then any team that can actually sign him.

Coogs
02-23-2012, 04:24 PM
Say we had this draft.

11. Trent Richardson, RB, Alabama
44. Coby Fleener, TE, Stanford
75. Bobby Massie, OT, Ole Miss
108. Ryan Broyles WR, Oklahoma.

And signed Manning, Soliai, and Bowe.


Where would that put us financially?

You get that draft and just Manning and Bowe and I would be a happy camper.

Pasta Giant Meatball
02-23-2012, 04:24 PM
:hmmm: Interdasting.

Cap space plus surrounding talent does seem like a perfect fit. All HandBowenana would know is ball, good, and rape.

mikey23545
02-23-2012, 04:25 PM
:holdman:


:grovel:

O.city
02-23-2012, 04:26 PM
You get that draft and just Manning and Bowe and I would be a happy camper.

That draft, Bowe, Manning and Soliai sets us everywhere.


Hell if we could scrounge up the money to franchise Carr with those guys, I'll take that team.


I dn't think there is anyway Carr is a Chief next yera but who knows.

If it was down to Carr or those free agents, I know which way I'm leaning.

Okie_Apparition
02-23-2012, 04:29 PM
A full stadium & multiple prime time games would get Hunt some of that scratch back

whoman69
02-23-2012, 04:29 PM
I have to wonder how the league office won't look suspiciously on tampering.

KC Dan
02-23-2012, 04:30 PM
I would have no problems whatsoever (assuming he's healthy) with him passing the ball in a Chiefs uniform. Don't think it will happen but....

keg in kc
02-23-2012, 04:31 PM
Well, that would certainly be competition.

I still take the "I'll believe it when I see it" approach.

Pasta Giant Meatball
02-23-2012, 04:32 PM
At bare minimum, he can at least show Cassel the ropes on hat tossing.

Coogs
02-23-2012, 04:36 PM
That draft, Bowe, Manning and Soliai sets us everywhere.


Hell if we could scrounge up the money to franchise Carr with those guys, I'll take that team.


I dn't think there is anyway Carr is a Chief next yera but who knows.

If it was down to Carr or those free agents, I know which way I'm leaning.

That would be the ultimate, but even without Carr and Soliai we could be in pretty good shape. With Manning throwing the ball to Bowe, Baldwin, Breaston, Moeaki, and possibly even McCluster, along with Charles and Richardson carrying the ball.... that's an offense that can score some points.

The defense, while not perfect, should be more than adaquate to win a lot of ballgames with that offense. Especially if Houston takes his game up another level across from Hali.

CoMoChief
02-23-2012, 04:36 PM
I'm gonna go to bed tonight and jerk off to this idea that a healthy Peyton Manning is the QB in KC.

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 04:38 PM
I have to wonder how the league office won't look suspiciously on tampering.

The front office is probably thinking getting caught is only worth a 7th rounder so who gives a crap.

Chiefless
02-23-2012, 04:38 PM
I'm gonna go to bed tonight and jerk off to this idea that a healthy Peyton Manning is the QB in KC.

Yer gonna jerk off to peyton manning?

Okie_Apparition
02-23-2012, 04:43 PM
The piles of spooge around this place after they drafted Berry
made Buffalo NY residents look twice

CoMoChief
02-23-2012, 04:43 PM
Offseason FA wish list (i know there's a thread for this but STFU)

CB - Brandon Carr
QB - Peyton Manning
OT - Jared Gaither
OG - Ben Grubbs
NT - Paul Soliai
SS - La'Ron Landry

CoMoChief
02-23-2012, 04:44 PM
Yer gonna jerk off to peyton manning?

the thought of him being our QB - ................yes, then Peyton Manning

If he's 100% healthy, we're serious immediate SB contenders

tk13
02-23-2012, 04:44 PM
Also, KU is on the way to the ACC.

chiefqueen
02-23-2012, 04:44 PM
A full stadium & multiple prime time games would get Hunt some of that scratch back

You know Indy @ KC would be a primetime game and probable KC @ Pitt.

DeezNutz
02-23-2012, 04:46 PM
Reports that he's asked for #19.

saphojunkie
02-23-2012, 04:46 PM
Chiefs will probably be dumb enough to trade for him instead of waiting it out.

Can't - trade deadline has passed.

oldman
02-23-2012, 04:47 PM
If,and it's a big if, Manning is truly healthy and could push MC out of KC, I'd buy in. Personally, I don't think they guy will ever play like he did before, so I see no need to throw buckets of money at him only to see our back-up play 15 3/4 games. Just say no.

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 04:49 PM
Ok silly question here and highly unlikely I'm sure, but with rolling that 28 million roster bonus. We just had a cap rollover of 20 million. Is it completely far fetched that we could not trade for him?

lcarus
02-23-2012, 04:49 PM
Well, that would certainly be competition.

I still take the "I'll believe it when I see it" approach.

I'd love it if it were true. Manning would be a good fit here, and it would be so reminiscent of when we got Joe Montana for his final years in the league. We had a great defense, good running game...QB was all that was missing. Sounds awfully familiar doesn't it?

Joe gave us the best chance to win a Super Bowl that we've had since we won the damn thing. If Manning is healthy enough, it could work out really really well. History does tend to repeat itself, does it not? Still...seems unlikely. Of course we're Chiefs fans and we've all grown so jaded and pessimistic. For reasons I need not explain. :eek:

DeezNutz
02-23-2012, 04:51 PM
Part of me is shocked to see posters generally interested in this actually coming to fruition. Guess we've just given up the ghost.

farmerchief
02-23-2012, 04:51 PM
I've been hearing all this hype for a few weeks. IMO, If he is healthy I am all for it! He would make the Chiefs a legitimate playoff contender and maybe more? I might actually buy some season tickets again, make the 3 1/2 hour drive to KC, and watch the Chiefs with my family! I loved when we got Joe Montana, enjoyed watching him and the Chiefs play, just wish we could have attained him earlier in his career! I just honestly can't see Peyton wanting to come here, when he could go to Miami, and bask in the sun most of the season.

whoman69
02-23-2012, 04:52 PM
The front office is probably thinking getting caught is only worth a 7th rounder so who gives a crap.

Only the Chiefs are stupid enough to get caught doing it.

thurman merman
02-23-2012, 04:52 PM
Say we had this draft.

11. Trent Richardson, RB, Alabama
44. Coby Fleener, TE, Stanford
75. Bobby Massie, OT, Ole Miss
108. Ryan Broyles WR, Oklahoma.

And signed Manning, Soliai, and Bowe.


Where would that put us financially?

IN THE SUPER BOWL.

Oh, financially?

farmerchief
02-23-2012, 04:53 PM
I'd love it if it were true. Manning would be a good fit here, and it would be so reminiscent of when we got Joe Montana for his final years in the league. We had a great defense, good running game...QB was all that was missing. Sounds awfully familiar doesn't it?

Joe gave us the best chance to win a Super Bowl that we've had since we won the damn thing. If Manning is healthy enough, it could work out really really well. History does tend to repeat itself, does it not? Still...seems unlikely. Of course we're Chiefs fans and we've all grown so jaded and pessimistic. For reasons I need not explain. :eek:

I didnt see your post when I added mine. Seems like our opinions mirror each others thoughts on this issue!:thumb:

vailpass
02-23-2012, 04:53 PM
the thought of him being our QB - ................yes, then Peyton Manning

If he's 100% healthy, we're serious immediate SB contenders

:D

O.city
02-23-2012, 04:54 PM
Part of me is shocked to see posters generally interested in this actually coming to fruition. Guess we've just given up the ghost.

Can only speak for myself, but I don't know what else to do.

DeezNutz
02-23-2012, 04:55 PM
I've been hearing all this hype for a few weeks. IMO, If he is healthy I am all for it! He would make the Chiefs a legitimate playoff contender and maybe more? I might actually buy some season tickets again, make the 3 1/2 hour drive to KC, and watch the Chiefs with my family! I loved when we got Joe Montana, enjoyed watching him and the Chiefs play, just wish we could have attained him earlier in his career! I just honestly can't see Peyton wanting to come here, when he could go to Miami, and bask in the sun most of the season.

Me, too. How did SF get him in the first place?

Detoxing
02-23-2012, 04:55 PM
Part of me is shocked to see posters generally interested in this actually coming to fruition. Guess we've just given up the ghost.

If you're going to have a stop gap QB, might as well have the ultimate stop gap.

It also would put us in prime position for a Favre/Rodgers situation in next season's draft, which is supposedly going to be a deeper QB class.

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 04:56 PM
Part of me is shocked to see posters generally interested in this actually coming to fruition. Guess we've just given up the ghost.

I think everybody is excited to hear that the Chiefs may be serious about addressing the most glaring need that this team has had.

In this case any news is good news.

lcarus
02-23-2012, 04:56 PM
Also - I would imagine a lot of people are worried that if we acquired Peyton that we'd just be "scabbing" our gaping QB wound like we always do. However, I see absolutely no reason we can't sign Peyton AND draft a young QB with upside this year or next to play backup to Manning. We should be ****ing smart for a change and try to win now while also preparing for the future.

On top of that, I think signing a proven, HOF QB would maximize our chances of winning with the current talent we already have in place. Because the window is smaller than you might think. It would be a pity to sacrifice the talent we have, particularly on the defensive side of the ball, all for the sake of Cassel. Flowers, Hali, DJ, Bowe, Charles, Carr (maybe) won't be around forever.

saphojunkie
02-23-2012, 04:57 PM
Say we had this draft.

11. Trent Richardson, RB, Alabama
44. Coby Fleener, TE, Stanford
75. Bobby Massie, OT, Ole Miss
108. Ryan Broyles WR, Oklahoma.

And signed Manning, Soliai, and Bowe.


Where would that put us financially?

Sorry, but signing Manning likely means drafting a right tackle in the first or very latest, second round. His protection becomes the #1 duty of the team.

Chiefs Pantalones
02-23-2012, 04:58 PM
Also, KU is on the way to the ACC.
I would love that. That would make the regular season and conference tournament fun again.

DeezNutz
02-23-2012, 04:58 PM
If you're going to have a stop gap QB, might as well have the ultimate stop gap.

It also would put us in prime position for a Favre/Rodgers situation in next season's draft, which is supposedly going to be a deeper QB class.

Since we're pulling out the '93 playbook, my best guess is that we're going to follow it more faithfully.

Pasta Giant Meatball
02-23-2012, 04:59 PM
Part of me is shocked to see posters generally interested in this actually coming to fruition. Guess we've just given up the ghost.

It's that, Kyle Orton, Matt Cassel, or Tannehill (QB's with that few of starts panning out are about the same as a mid rounder)

Detoxing
02-23-2012, 05:00 PM
Since we're pulling out the '93 playbook, my best guess is that we're going to follow it more faithfully.

If given only two options, Manning or Cassel, which do you roll with?

Red Brooklyn
02-23-2012, 05:01 PM
If given only two options, a 75% or better Manning or 100% Cassel, which do you roll with?
:D

DeezNutz
02-23-2012, 05:02 PM
If given only two options, Manning or Cassel, which do you roll with?

I guess I'd rather be sitting on a beach when I bleed out as opposed to sitting outside the Cell in Chicago, but the end result is the same.

This organization isn't winning shit until it drafts and develops its own QB.

lcarus
02-23-2012, 05:02 PM
I think everybody is excited to hear that the Chiefs may be serious about addressing the most glaring need that this team has had.

In this case any news is good news.

If we show any interest at all in Manning, it tells me that they aren't sold on Cassel being the guy. Yeah I'd say that is ****ing good news, because as of now, the only real reason I disapprove of Pioli is because of his stubborn ways when it comes to Matt Cassel. Other than that, he hasn't been a bad GM in my opinion.

Chiefs Pantalones
02-23-2012, 05:04 PM
If we show any interest at all in Manning, it tells me that they aren't sold on Cassel being the guy. Yeah I'd say that is ****ing good news, because as of now, the only real reason I disapprove of Pioli is because of his stubborn ways when it comes to Matt Cassel. Other than that, he hasn't been a bad GM in my opinion.

I don't think it's legit. Manning is not coming to KC and I don't think the Chiefs want him. Cassel or die.

DeezNutz
02-23-2012, 05:05 PM
I guess I'd rather be sitting on a beach when I bleed out as opposed to sitting outside the Cell in Chicago, but the end result is the same.

This organization isn't winning shit until it drafts and develops its own QB.

In fact, fuck that. I'd rather be outside the Cell because at least then I'd be happy when I died as opposed to depressed.

lcarus
02-23-2012, 05:05 PM
I guess I'd rather be sitting on a beach when I bleed out as opposed to sitting outside the Cell in Chicago, but the end result is the same.

This organization isn't winning shit until it drafts and develops its own QB.

I disagree with this notion. A healthy Manning gives this team a legitimate shot. That doesn't mean we shouldn't draft and develop a QB, and sooner rather than later, but honestly....when the F are we ever going to do that? :#

O.city
02-23-2012, 05:06 PM
Likely, Manning will come in here and get us to a couple AFC Champ games, maybe even a SB. Then, as normal Chiefs things go, we would lose in some crazy ass fashion.

A blocked fg, an int for a td, something crazy I'm sure.

Pasta Giant Meatball
02-23-2012, 05:07 PM
They can't shit out a legit "franchise QB" to be in position to draft. Under Pioli, they haven't passed on one yet.

DeezNutz
02-23-2012, 05:08 PM
I don't think that post-neck surgery Manning is going to sniff the SB, which is exactly why this is an exercise in futility.

O.city
02-23-2012, 05:09 PM
If Manning gets healthy and goes to be a quarterback successfully somewhere, it will be the first franchise quarterback that Pioli has passed on.

Chiefless
02-23-2012, 05:09 PM
the thought of him being our QB - ................yes, then Peyton Manning

If he's 100% healthy, we're serious immediate SB contenders

I'm Just a lurker. I was reading and later got sucked into this board by some of your posters. This board's lexicon frightens and confuses me. When I hear things like: "I hope he is impaled upon an aids tree" I wonder, is there really a tree that grows aids? What I do know is when a man says they masturbate to the image of another man it is cause for some trash talking no matter the context.

:)

saphojunkie
02-23-2012, 05:10 PM
So, assuming that Cleveland trades up to #2 overall...

We're playing Andrew Luck, RG3, Cam Newton, Andy Dalton, Tim Tebow, Drew Brees, Ben Roethlesberger, Matt Ryan, Philip Rivers, Josh Freeman, Joe Flacco, and Carson Palmer next year.

Just think that's interesting, considering this thread. I'd like to see Manning matched up with a lot of those guys. Great storylines.

Chocolate Hog
02-23-2012, 05:10 PM
I don't think that post-neck surgery Manning is going to sniff the SB, which is exactly why this is an exercise in futility.

How do you know?

ILChief
02-23-2012, 05:11 PM
They can't shit out a legit "franchise QB" to be in position to draft. Under Pioli, they haven't passed on one yet.

Honestly, Carl didn't pass on that many either. Rodgers is the only one that comes to mind. Also Carl has said he was going to draft Brady Quinn if Cleveland hadn't. Granted, Quinn didn't turn out to be a franchise QB, but to think there is some conspiracy from the top to not draft a qb is ridiculous

keg in kc
02-23-2012, 05:11 PM
I guess I'd rather be sitting on a beach when I bleed out as opposed to sitting outside the Cell in Chicago, but the end result is the same.

This organization isn't winning shit until it drafts and develops its own QB.It doesn't have to be a mutually-exclusive concept. Although I don't believe they're going to sign Manning or that they'd draft another QB if they did. But in a perfect world they replace Cassel with a vet and they draft a rookie.

Regardless, Manning, with the major caveat of "if healthy," would instantly elevate the play at the position exponentially. It's hard to complain about that. At least it's hard unless that's your thing, to just complain no matter what.

okcchief
02-23-2012, 05:12 PM
Don't even prick tease me with this shit.

saphojunkie
02-23-2012, 05:12 PM
I'm Just a lurker. I was reading and later got sucked into this board by some of your posters. This board's lexicon frightens and confuses me. When I hear things like: "I hope he is impaled upon an aids tree" I wonder, is there really a tree that grows aids? What I do know is when a man says they masturbate to the image of another man it is cause for some trash talking no matter the context.

:)

So just bring me another Dewars and water, pronto, 'k babe?

lcarus
02-23-2012, 05:13 PM
I don't think that post-neck surgery Manning is going to sniff the SB, which is exactly why this is an exercise in futility.

Much much much higher probability than Cassel or Orton. We have cap room. Let's ****ing use it to increase our chances. Give this team a leader on offense. Give us a god damned identity for a change.

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 05:15 PM
I say we just trade 5 first round picks for aaron rodgers.

lcarus
02-23-2012, 05:15 PM
I'm Just a lurker. I was reading and later got sucked into this board by some of your posters. This board's lexicon frightens and confuses me. When I hear things like: "I hope he is impaled upon an aids tree" I wonder, is there really a tree that grows aids? What I do know is when a man says they masturbate to the image of another man it is cause for some trash talking no matter the context.

:)

If Matt Cassel was impaled on a tree, that tree would then become infected, thus calling it an "aids tree" would be accurate. Yes, I just used the words Matt Cassel and accurate in the same sentence. Said sentence must be about an aids tree and not passing a football to ring true.

DeezNutz
02-23-2012, 05:17 PM
It doesn't have to be a mutually-exclusive concept. Although I don't believe they're going to sign Manning or that they'd draft another QB if they did. But in a perfect world they replace Cassel with a vet and they draft a rookie.

Regardless, Manning, with the major caveat of "if healthy," would instantly elevate the play at the position exponentially. It's hard to complain about that. At least it's hard unless that's your thing, to just complain no matter what.

If the team signs Manning and drafts a legit. QB, I'd be thrilled. If the team wants to sign Manning and then sit on its ass, we've seen this movie.

Coogs
02-23-2012, 05:19 PM
Playing devils advocate for a minute here. Let's say Manning wants to come to KC, but he would like for KC to also bring in Reggie Wayne.

Would you have any interest in a Wayne, Baldwin, Breaston, Moeaki recieving corp, and possibly franchising Bowe and moving him to say Chicago for picks #19 and #80.

O.city
02-23-2012, 05:20 PM
No.


Don't want Wayne. Keep Bowe. Younger and better.

ChiefsandO'sfan
02-23-2012, 05:21 PM
ESPN's Adam Schefter believes the Seahawks and Chiefs are not potential destinations for Peyton Manning.
"Kansas City, Minnesota, Seattle, Cleveland, Buffalo and Jacksonville each could use Manning," Schefter says, "but they need him more than he needs them, giving Manning more viable options." According to John McClain of the Houston Chronicle, the popular sentiment at the Combine is that the Dolphins, Cardinals, and Redskins are the top three possibilities, in that order.

O.city
02-23-2012, 05:22 PM
Someone said on ESPN that the Cardinals pretty much said they were out of the deal.

DeezNutz
02-23-2012, 05:22 PM
Playing devils advocate for a minute here. Let's say Manning wants to come to KC, but he would like for KC to also bring in Reggie Wayne.

Would you have any interest in a Wayne, Baldwin, Breaston, Moeaki recieving corp, and possibly franchising Bowe and moving him to say Chicago for picks #19 and #80.

Only if we could trade these picks for Vermeil.

Chocolate Hog
02-23-2012, 05:25 PM
ESPN's Adam Schefter believes the Seahawks and Chiefs are not potential destinations for Peyton Manning.
"Kansas City, Minnesota, Seattle, Cleveland, Buffalo and Jacksonville each could use Manning," Schefter says, "but they need him more than he needs them, giving Manning more viable options." According to John McClain of the Houston Chronicle, the popular sentiment at the Combine is that the Dolphins, Cardinals, and Redskins are the top three possibilities, in that order.

ROFL

Pestilence
02-23-2012, 05:25 PM
No way he goes to the Redskins.

Pasta Giant Meatball
02-23-2012, 05:26 PM
ESPN's Adam Schefter believes the Seahawks and Chiefs are not potential destinations for Peyton Manning.
"Kansas City, Minnesota, Seattle, Cleveland, Buffalo and Jacksonville each could use Manning," Schefter says, "but they need him more than he needs them, giving Manning more viable options." According to John McClain of the Houston Chronicle, the popular sentiment at the Combine is that the Dolphins, Cardinals, and Redskins are the top three possibilities, in that order.

I'd take the Chiefs roster over the Phins, Cards, and Skins any day and I don't think that's being a homer at all. If Shefter thinks otherwise, he's a damn buffoon.

O.city
02-23-2012, 05:26 PM
I don't really understand that tweet.

Chiefs Pantalones
02-23-2012, 05:28 PM
ESPN's Adam Schefter believes the Seahawks and Chiefs are not potential destinations for Peyton Manning.
"Kansas City, Minnesota, Seattle, Cleveland, Buffalo and Jacksonville each could use Manning," Schefter says, "but they need him more than he needs them, giving Manning more viable options." According to John McClain of the Houston Chronicle, the popular sentiment at the Combine is that the Dolphins, Cardinals, and Redskins are the top three possibilities, in that order.

Exactly. He doesn't wanna come to cold ass small market KC.

petegz28
02-23-2012, 05:28 PM
ESPN's Adam Schefter believes the Seahawks and Chiefs are not potential destinations for Peyton Manning.
"Kansas City, Minnesota, Seattle, Cleveland, Buffalo and Jacksonville each could use Manning," Schefter says, "but they need him more than he needs them, giving Manning more viable options." According to John McClain of the Houston Chronicle, the popular sentiment at the Combine is that the Dolphins, Cardinals, and Redskins are the top three possibilities, in that order.

That's plain stupid. The Redskins suck. The Dolphins are a legit possibility. The Cardinals suck. Let's look at the facts of the situation or what we at least think they are. Manning wants to go to some place that has a legit chance at winning. That rules out the Redskins and Cards as well as Seattle, Cleveland, Buffalo, Jax and Minni. Aside from the fact that I don't see Peyton going to Jax and then facing the Colts twice a year.


The most legit teams out there that actually need a QB are SF, KC, Miami and Houston.

SF is content on spending money on the lines and riding Smith at the QB spot. Houston could be a possibility but Schaubb isn't exactly a bad QB.

Miami and KC are what it comes down to if you take into account legit chances of winning plus cap room plus a dire need for a QB. KC is better than Miami. Miami was full strength and won 6 games. KC was ravaged with injury and won 7.

So when you combine cap room, need for QB and legit shot at winning KC has to be right at the top.

Pasta Giant Meatball
02-23-2012, 05:29 PM
The Chiefs won 7 games only scoring 13 points per game. Damn, with a legit QB this team is scary good.

KC Dan
02-23-2012, 05:30 PM
That's plain stupid. The Redskins suck. The Dolphins are a legit possibility. The Cardinals suck. Let's look at the facts of the situation or what we at least think they are. Manning wants to go to some place that has a legit chance at winning. That rules out the Redskins and Cards as well as Seattle, Cleveland, Buffalo, Jax and Minni. Aside from the fact that I don't see Peyton going to Jax and then facing the Colts twice a year.


The most legit teams out there that actually need a QB are SF, KC, Miami and Houston.

SF is content on spending money on the lines and riding Smith at the QB spot. Houston could be a possibility but Schaubb isn't exactly a bad QB.

Miami and KC are what it comes down to if you take into account legit chances of winning plus cap room plus a dire need for a QB. KC is better than Miami. Miami was full strength and won 6 games. KC was ravaged with injury and won 7.

So when you combine cap room, need for QB and legit shot at winning KC has to be right at the top.It's warmer in Miami with MUCH hotter women. Just sayin'

ChiefFripp
02-23-2012, 05:30 PM
There are some serious hurdles for Manning to get over to even consider this....I truly hope Pioli doesn't get to enamored with the idea of Manning if his isn't back to normal.

Season tickets and hype. Pioli is having wet dreams about Manning and who can blame him?

Three7s
02-23-2012, 05:31 PM
I wouldn't say the Cards are completely hopeless. They still won 8 games with a terrible QB. I'm sure Manning would love to throw to Fitz.

Pasta Giant Meatball
02-23-2012, 05:31 PM
It's warmer in Miami with MUCH hotter women. Just sayin'

Does Peyton look like he gives a shit about women during football season? ;)
The guy lives and breathes football and probably makes sweet love to it.

petegz28
02-23-2012, 05:32 PM
It's warmer in Miami with MUCH hotter women. Just sayin'

The cold weather is a factor to consider. Would he want to play in the cold after being a Dome Baby his entire career? Then again, little brother would tear the Mickey out of him if he didn't come to KC just because of cold weather.

O.city
02-23-2012, 05:32 PM
If the Chiefs sign Manning, do season tickets sell out within a week?

Von Dumbass
02-23-2012, 05:32 PM
If Manning is released, the Dolphins and Redskins are still the leading candidates.

https://twitter.com/#!/ClaytonESPN/status/172805734654943232

petegz28
02-23-2012, 05:33 PM
I wouldn't say the Cards are completely hopeless. They still won 8 games with a terrible QB. I'm sure Manning would love to throw to Fitz.

One weapon? Why would a QB go to a team with one good WR when you have 3 legit WR's plus, when healthy a legit TE AND one of the best RB's in the game?

Pasta Giant Meatball
02-23-2012, 05:34 PM
If Manning is released, the Dolphins and Redskins are still the leading candidates.

https://twitter.com/#!/ClaytonESPN/status/172805734654943232

:hmmm: Denver still needs a QB. When has Little Cryptkeeper ever been right about anything?

Coogs
02-23-2012, 05:34 PM
No.


Don't want Wayne. Keep Bowe. Younger and better.

So if Manning requests Wayne... the chemistry between those two is already in place, and could be a valuable assett to the rest of the receiving corp... what would you suggest as an alternative.

Again, this would only be if Manning requested Wayne be included.

vailpass
02-23-2012, 05:34 PM
One weapon? Why would a QB go to a team with one good WR when you have 3 legit WR's plus, when healthy a legit TE AND one of the best RB's in the game?

You need to run a quick self-homer check.

Sure-Oz
02-23-2012, 05:34 PM
Fescoe lol....right

boogblaster
02-23-2012, 05:36 PM
maybe ......

petegz28
02-23-2012, 05:36 PM
I think on par the Chiefs are the most talented team out there in the running. SF with a close second but I still think the Chiefs when healthy are the best team available. We have a solid defense so Manning wouldn't or shouldn't have to worry about having to win the games all on his own. We have a talented WR corps and we have one of the best RB's in the league. Anyone could see how much better this team looked with just Orton. Peyton has to watch that film and think, "if that were me and not Kyle the Chiefs are in the playoffs".

Pasta Giant Meatball
02-23-2012, 05:36 PM
You need to run a quick self-homer check.

Charles isn't one of best backs in the game? Bowe, Baldwin and Breaston aren't solid targets? Moeaki didn't have a solid rookie year, but is injury prone?

The Chiefs also had one of the best defenses in football the last 6 weeks.

BryanBusby
02-23-2012, 05:36 PM
I wouldn't say the Cards are completely hopeless. They still won 8 games with a terrible QB. I'm sure Manning would love to throw to Fitz.

Giving up on Kolb after one wacky season that began with a lock out would be career suicide for anyone in that Front Office.

KC Tattoo
02-23-2012, 05:36 PM
You know, looking at this years schedule this time last year I was pretty terrified. Now, I'm not sure we won't beat the Ravens and Steelers, don't know about the Saints tho.

Saints in the Super Bowl? or just the regular season game that could bump us out of playoff run?

Three7s
02-23-2012, 05:38 PM
One weapon? Why would a QB go to a team with one good WR when you have 3 legit WR's plus, when healthy a legit TE AND one of the best RB's in the game?
True, but they do have a couple of young receivers that are getting better, one of them being Early Doucet. Their running game is good too.

petegz28
02-23-2012, 05:39 PM
Clark needs to dump the coin and sign him if he is healthy. You put a healthy Manning and a healthy JC on the same field and defenses are going to get lit up liek a mother fucker.

KC Tattoo
02-23-2012, 05:39 PM
I predict Manning will be a Chief, that or sign with another team, that or even stay with the Colts as luxury with the Luck pick.

tredadda
02-23-2012, 05:40 PM
Impossible this year (or so it eye-poppingly appears).

Might as well get a badass QB now with this talented team.

More possible this year than next year, especially if we get Manning.

stonedstooge
02-23-2012, 05:40 PM
So if Manning requests Wayne... the chemistry between those two is already in place, and could be a valuable assett to the rest of the receiving corp... what would you suggest as an alternative.

Again, this would only be if Manning requested Wayne be included.

Manning is struggling to salvage his own career. Not sure if its not every man for himself at this point

petegz28
02-23-2012, 05:41 PM
True, but they do have a couple of young receivers that are getting better, one of them being Early Doucet. Their running game is good too.

We have a better WR corps as a whole and we have a better running game with JC. Plus as crazy as it may sound, don't count out Lilja as a small chip on the game. Someone on the line Peyton knows and has won with. Little things liek that could potentially impact the larger picture. Then again he could say "get rid of Lilja and I'm yours!"

Coogs
02-23-2012, 05:42 PM
Manning is struggling to salvage his own career. Not sure if its not every man for himself at this point

I agree. I was just throwing a hypothetical in there... as if the first scenario isn't hypothetical enough.

petegz28
02-23-2012, 05:42 PM
Manning is not going to insist on Wayne though if a team brought him in it certainly wouldn't hurt.

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 05:42 PM
Manning is struggling to salvage his own career. Not sure if its not every man for himself at this point

No offense, but I totally disagree with this statement. Manning has more cash than he will ever need I'm sure. I think Manning staying playing has more to do with cash first and a ring second.

I don't think salvaging his career is even in his mind.

Epic Fail 007
02-23-2012, 05:43 PM
well well the qb situation of a sudden looks brighter huh?Wheres the complaining Im waiting.

Epic Fail 007
02-23-2012, 05:45 PM
Manning is not going to insist on Wayne though if a team brought him in it certainly wouldn't hurt.

Im thinkin he would want Jeff Saturday though.

WhiteWhale
02-23-2012, 05:45 PM
No offense, but I totally disagree with this statement. Manning has more cash than he will ever need I'm sure. I think Manning staying playing has more to do with cash first and a ring second.

I don't think salvaging his career is even in his mind.

Players, all players, want to win championships. Manning isn't struggling to recover from a career threatening injury for money. He's doing it because he loves the game, and the best part of the game is winning.

A player who's #1 priority is not a championship should not be welcomed to this team.

Epic Fail 007
02-23-2012, 05:47 PM
If Manning is released, the Dolphins and Redskins are still the leading candidates.

https://twitter.com/#!/ClaytonESPN/status/172805734654943232

No way manning would pick them

petegz28
02-23-2012, 05:49 PM
No way manning would pick them

He might pick Miami.

Coogs
02-23-2012, 05:52 PM
I think Manning staying playing has more to do with cash first and a ring second.

I don't think salvaging his career is even in his mind.

I disagree. I think he desperately wants to slavage his career, and it has everything to do with rings and history as opposed to money.

Coogs
02-23-2012, 05:53 PM
Im thinkin he would want Jeff Saturday though.

That's possible as well. A guy he is comfortable with calling out his protection schemes makes sense too.

Epic Fail 007
02-23-2012, 05:53 PM
ROFL

But Mike florio who dose not like to be wrong and also predicted routt to kc.Also mike and scott are good friends. Florio said he would not be surprised if manning ends up in kc.

petegz28
02-23-2012, 05:54 PM
The thing one also has to take into consideration is how the Chiefs could and probably would adjust the rest of the team around Peyton. This is a selling point when trying to woo said King QB. The tape doesn't lie. The Chiefs defense was tons better once they started blitzing and attacking more. With a QB like Peyton you don't have to go with the typical "ball control" and "bend but don't break" mentality. The defense could be turned loose because you have Peyton and JC that both at any time can hit the HR for a quick score if needed.

The downside to all of this is the hiring of Dabbol or whatever his name is. Do you think Peyton would put up with the shit we hear about this guy?

Jerm
02-23-2012, 05:54 PM
He isn't going to Washington...no way he'd want to play his brother twice a year.

The Manning to KC rumors make too much sense...sadly that's probably exactly why Pioli won't do it. I hope I'm wrong.

Dr. Facebook Fever
02-23-2012, 05:56 PM
Best off season ever part deux?

KCUnited
02-23-2012, 05:56 PM
But Mike florio who dose not like to be wrong and also predicted routt to kc.Also mike and scott are good friends. Florio said he would not be surprised if manning ends up in kc.

Nick Wright?

petegz28
02-23-2012, 05:58 PM
He isn't going to Washington...no way he'd want to play his brother twice a year.

The Manning to KC rumors make too much sense...sadly that's probably exactly why Pioli won't do it. I hope I'm wrong.

It does make a ton of sense. We have Peyton last year and we beat Pitt, we beat SD game #1, we beat the Broncos game #1, I'll go as far to say that we beat the Jets. And given the fact that we would have had some offensive prowess we probably don't get blown out by NE, Buff and Detroit. In fact we probably win 2 of those games because the offense could keep pace. Assuming JC and Berry weren't injured but then again we are assuming Peyton wasn't injured either. It's a Hypo, what can I say?

Mr. Laz
02-23-2012, 06:05 PM
worthless crap

no way does condon or the chiefs say anything IF there really was some talks.


either the agent is trying to get the word out by leaking a completely unrelated team or it's baseless crap.

Epic Fail 007
02-23-2012, 06:05 PM
Nick Wright?

I heard it on Nick wright. But Mike florio said it on the Mike& Mike show

Hoover
02-23-2012, 06:08 PM
I like the ID of Manning mentoring Stanzi. Stop overlooking the guy.

Hoover
02-23-2012, 06:22 PM
Sing Peyton and trade Cassel for a six pack and a cup of soup

RustShack
02-23-2012, 06:25 PM
worthless crap

no way does condon or the chiefs say anything IF there really was some talks.


either the agent is trying to get the word out by leaking a completely unrelated team or it's baseless crap.

Seems like there have been more "leaks" since Haley has been fired. Actually I think the last year in general seen more leaks than Pioli's first two years.

RustShack
02-23-2012, 06:27 PM
As for Manning, obviously we can't sign him if he can't pass a physical. He doesn't even have to be as good as he used to be, as long as hes smart and accurate to compliment this running game and defense we are legit contenders. I'm sure he can still do "just enough" to win games that he has to.

DeezNutz
02-23-2012, 06:28 PM
I like the ID of Manning mentoring Stanzi. Stop overlooking the guy.

Is this post directed at the Chiefs' coaching staff?

Hoover
02-23-2012, 06:29 PM
yes. LOL

stonedstooge
02-23-2012, 06:31 PM
Pioli could be leaking it out to placate the fans

Mr. Laz
02-23-2012, 06:33 PM
Seems like there have been more "leaks" since Haley has been fired. Actually I think the last year in general seen more leaks than Pioli's first two years.I thought it was Pioli that had the cone of silence?

this is different ... team could lose draft picks because of it.

Don't think for a second that the butthead Irsay wouldn't go after draft picks about a guy he doesn't want anyway.

mlyonsd
02-23-2012, 06:33 PM
Has Peyton ever lost at Arrowhead?

Yeah I'm just throwing crap.

KC_Connection
02-23-2012, 06:45 PM
Yeah, I'm not getting my hopes up here. We're stuck with Cassel.

BigMeatballDave
02-23-2012, 06:59 PM
Has Peyton ever lost at Arrowhead?

Yeah I'm just throwing crap.

Yes. 2004

whoman69
02-23-2012, 07:00 PM
Has Peyton ever lost at Arrowhead?

Yeah I'm just throwing crap.

Yes 2004. Overall, he's 6-1 in regular season against the Chiefs and 2-0 in the playoffs.

Chocolate Hog
02-23-2012, 07:19 PM
http://chzgifs.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/funny-gifs-politics.gif

TRR
02-23-2012, 07:26 PM
Sing Peyton and trade Cassel for a six pack and a cup of soup

How does it go? I don't think I know that song...
Posted via Mobile Device

xztop12
02-23-2012, 07:51 PM
this horse crap, "so gang" thread is lighting up right now.

does anyone even care that the combine is this saturday?

Molitoth
02-23-2012, 07:55 PM
And yet were not even in NFL32s top 5 teams likely to get him. ESPN has become such a joke...

I trust Mort and Schefter over the dumbduck Fescoe.

chiefzilla1501
02-23-2012, 07:56 PM
As fucked up as it sounds, if you sign Peyton, keeping Cassel on as a backup is actually not a terrible idea.

Epic Fail 007
02-23-2012, 08:03 PM
I trust Mort and Schefter over the dumbduck Fescoe.

It did not come from Fescoe.It came from Mike florio,Fescoe just reported on it.

BryanBusby
02-23-2012, 08:17 PM
Florio was only repeating what Fescoe said. Anything that the turd bowl said before then was just a thought.

RustShack
02-23-2012, 08:20 PM
As fucked up as it sounds, if you sign Peyton, keeping Cassel on as a backup is actually not a terrible idea.

Imagine if our three QB's next year were Manning, Orton, Stanzi.

Even Clausen or Henne instead of Orton who would likely not sign here if Manning did.

People talk about no way we try to bring back Carr now because of Routt, I doubt we keep Cassel under contract with Manning either.

smittysbar
02-23-2012, 08:30 PM
Man I hope this happens.

chiefzilla1501
02-23-2012, 08:30 PM
Imagine if our three QB's next year were Manning, Orton, Stanzi.

Even Clausen or Henne instead of Orton who would likely not sign here if Manning did.

People talk about no way we try to bring back Carr now because of Routt, I doubt we keep Cassel under contract with Manning either.

I don't think the Chiefs would pay Orton, and I don't think Orton would want to stay where he couldn't start. Thing about having Manning is that in year 1, you have to have an NFL-ready starter. Can't have a developmental guy like Clausen and Stanzi both. Seeing that few NFL-ready starters would probably want this role, Cassel is surprisingly one of the best and least expensive insurance policies you have out there. I think for $5M, you can keep Cassel around for one more year.

Because one thing's for damn sure. While I've never supported getting a Right Tackle with the first pick, if the Chiefs get Manning, a Right Tackle is pretty much a no-brainer with the first pick.

O.city
02-23-2012, 08:41 PM
See if we were to get Manning, I'd be more inclined to take Richardson with that first pick if he was there.


With Richardson and charles you could protect manning alot.


I guess though with Manning you are gonna be obviously throwing the ball alot more. So RT makes sense.

I just think we can get a good RT later in the draft.

smittysbar
02-23-2012, 08:44 PM
Manning has made shit O-lines look good for years.

chiefzilla1501
02-23-2012, 08:47 PM
See if we were to get Manning, I'd be more inclined to take Richardson with that first pick if he was there.


With Richardson and charles you could protect manning alot.


I guess though with Manning you are gonna be obviously throwing the ball alot more. So RT makes sense.

I just think we can get a good RT later in the draft.

I usually think that too. But the stakes for having a top-notch offensive line were never this high. I'm okay with accidentally whiffing on a 3rd round RT pick if you're protecting Orton or a rookie. You can't afford to make that mistake with Peyton.

Epic Fail 007
02-23-2012, 08:53 PM
Manning has made shit O-lines look good for years.

The line was 16 out of 32

Mr. Laz
02-23-2012, 08:53 PM
Manning has made shit O-lines look good for years.
yea, but you have to have smart offensive players to do that.

WR's have to pay attention and know what hot routes and changes to make. Same with the offensive line, they have to be able to make changes etc.

Barry Richardson is dumbass and i'm not sure that Bowe and Baldwin are exactly scholarly either.

could of been coaching ... dunno.

Mr. Laz
02-23-2012, 08:54 PM
The line was 16 out of 32according to a website

mikey23545
02-23-2012, 08:58 PM
No offense, but I totally disagree with this statement. Manning has more cash than he will ever need I'm sure. I think Manning staying playing has more to do with cash first and a ring second.

I don't think salvaging his career is even in his mind.

?

What's wrong with this post?

I'm pretty sure Manning wants to prove a lot of people wrong, and win another championship to boot.

DJ's left nut
02-23-2012, 09:00 PM
FUU*******!

It's Fescoe? That's the best we could do?

Get ready for Henne, kids.

The Bad Guy
02-23-2012, 09:00 PM
yea, but you have to have smart offensive players to do that.

WR's have to pay attention and know what hot routes and changes to make. Same with the offensive line, they have to be able to make changes etc.

Barry Richardson is dumbass and i'm not sure that Bowe and Baldwin are exactly scholarly either.

could of been coaching ... dunno.

Yeah, because Pierre Garcon and Tony Ugoh look like Oxford Grads.

The Bad Guy
02-23-2012, 09:01 PM
FUU*******!

It's Fescoe? That's the best we could do?

Get ready for Henne, kids.

Apparently people are saying it's Florio, who Fescoe just piggybacked but I haven't seen anything resembling that.

beach tribe
02-23-2012, 09:03 PM
Part of me is shocked to see posters generally interested in this actually coming to fruition. Guess we've just given up the ghost.

Please tell me why we wouldn't want this to happen. It's the best possible scenario. A rookie, or young QB could learn more from Peyton than any coach, and it would give us a SB window until he steps down. You really just seem completely soured.

DJ's left nut
02-23-2012, 09:03 PM
Apparently people are saying it's Florio, who Fescoe just piggybacked but I haven't seen anything resembling that.

Have any of them actually read the OP?

It's written by Florio and very clearly uses Fescoe as the source. Unless Florio fed Fescoe and then cited him as his own source to have cover behind a completely anonymous radio figure. Afterall, lord knows that national media members love it when it appears they were scooped by a morning radio DJ.

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 09:07 PM
Please tell me why we wouldn't want this to happen. It's the best possible scenario. A rookie, or young QB could learn more from Peyton than any coach, and it would give us a SB window until he steps down. You really just seem completely soured.

Here's the one problem I have with this theory: Peyton didn't teach his backups shit. Hence the reason for the number one overall pick.

DJ's left nut
02-23-2012, 09:10 PM
Here's the one problem I have with this theory: Peyton didn't teach his backups shit. Hence the reason for the number one overall pick.

Just exactly what can you teach Jim Sorgi and Curtis Painter?

Those guys just aren't very good. Further, I doubt he was ever tasked with it.

I don't expect him to be some wise sage out there; but there's no way that a guy like Stanzi or Foles wouldn't be able to pick up some tricks of the trade just by observing.

I can't figure out why people would be opposed to this. I guess we're supposed to be throwing games if we can't trade 6 seasons worth of draft picks to get RGIII or something.

Simplicity
02-23-2012, 09:11 PM
Here's the one problem I have with this theory: Peyton didn't teach his backups shit. Hence the reason for the number one overall pick.

Painter is a ****ing moron soooo what's your point?

-King-
02-23-2012, 09:12 PM
Just exactly what can you teach Jim Sorgi and Curtis Painter?

Those guys just aren't very good. Further, I doubt he was ever tasked with it.

I don't expect him to be some wise sage out there; but there's no way that a guy like Stanzi or Foles wouldn't be able to pick up some tricks of the trade just by observing.

I can't figure out why people would be opposed to this. I guess we're supposed to be throwing games if we can't trade 6 seasons worth of draft picks to get RGIII or something.

:thumb:

Brock
02-23-2012, 09:12 PM
Listen here, I'm going to teach you how to throw a 90 mile an hour bullet into a 1 ft. square. You paying attention, Painter?

Simplicity
02-23-2012, 09:15 PM
Listen here, I'm going to teach you how to throw a 90 mile an hour bullet into a 1 ft. square. You paying attention, Painter?

"Yes, Peyton, I'm listening."

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/xFLz6Rz_idY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 09:22 PM
Just exactly what can you teach Jim Sorgi and Curtis Painter?

Those guys just aren't very good. Further, I doubt he was ever tasked with it.

I don't expect him to be some wise sage out there; but there's no way that a guy like Stanzi or Foles wouldn't be able to pick up some tricks of the trade just by observing.

I can't figure out why people would be opposed to this. I guess we're supposed to be throwing games if we can't trade 6 seasons worth of draft picks to get RGIII or something.


I'm not necessarily opposed to it. I just don't understand how everyone assumes he's going to be this great teacher to a young quarterback when, in 13 years, nobody has developed behind him.

BossChief
02-23-2012, 09:23 PM
Holy shit, stuck in airports all day and I miss this.

Hope its legit because he would be the best quarterback this team has ever had and it would put this team back on the map.

Sign Peyton and his tag along center
Draft Tannehill at 1A or Richardson at 1B
Go full blown saccoshit the rest of the way...but make sure we come out with another decent option at quarterback to develop and a good power runner that is well rounded so that we can protect Peyton with not only a stronger RT, but also with being able to offer a balanced attack to protect him as well.

Thats how I see it.

CHENZ A!
02-23-2012, 09:23 PM
I predict Manning will be a Chief, that or sign with another team, that or even stay with the Colts as luxury with the Luck pick.

you know.. it's crazy, but I could see it happening.

bowener
02-23-2012, 09:25 PM
Charles has to be popping a massive erection while thinking about Manning keeping safeties out of the box.

(if this happens)

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 09:26 PM
Painter is a ****ing moron soooo what's your point?

Yeah. I got your point. Peyton is a great teacher he just had bad students.


So he never tried.

Simplicity
02-23-2012, 09:29 PM
I'm not necessarily opposed to it. I just don't understand how everyone assumes he's going to be this great teacher to a young quarterback when, in 13 years, nobody has developed behind him.

Idunno how you can teach another QB how to build a stadium?.. :hmmm:

Simplicity
02-23-2012, 09:30 PM
Yeah. I got your point. Peyton is a great teacher he just had bad students.


So he never tried.

Holy ****ing shit bro. Hop off this stupid theory you have. JFC.

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 09:34 PM
Holy ****ing shit bro. Hop off this stupid theory you have. JFC.


Disprove it first please.

beach tribe
02-23-2012, 09:37 PM
Just exactly what can you teach Jim Sorgi and Curtis Painter?

Those guys just aren't very good. Further, I doubt he was ever tasked with it.

I don't expect him to be some wise sage out there; but there's no way that a guy like Stanzi or Foles wouldn't be able to pick up some tricks of the trade just by observing.

I can't figure out why people would be opposed to this. I guess we're supposed to be throwing games if we can't trade 6 seasons worth of draft picks to get RGIII or something.

Exactly. They would learn by following his example. I don't expect him to focus on mentoring anyone one bit.
And yeah, whether they learned anything from him or not, you still have to have a sliver of talent to succeed at the NFL QB position.

BossChief
02-23-2012, 09:38 PM
J Diddy, that kid is like 15 years old.

smile and nod.

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 09:39 PM
Exactly. They would learn by following his example. I don't expect him to focus on mentoring anyone one bit.
And yeah, whether they learned anything from him or not, you still have to have a sliver of talent to succeed at the NFL QB position.



That worked wonders with Tom Brady's backup, didn't it? Who was that guy?


My point being just because the guy is a good quarterback doesn't mean being behind him on the depth chart is going to make him great.

Simplicity
02-23-2012, 09:40 PM
Disprove it first please.

Painter is a terrible QB no matter how much you teach him... There. Now go back to your classroom.

BIG K
02-23-2012, 09:41 PM
I'm not necessarily opposed to it. I just don't understand how everyone assumes he's going to be this great teacher to a young quarterback when, in 13 years, nobody has developed behind him.

I understand your well spoken point. However, in the entire time Manning has been under center, how many times have they drafted a qbof the future to replace him?

Point is, not sure they ever imagined Peyton leaving the building.....

Regardless, the Chiefs need a QB now. it's a good fit for both parties. "If" Stanzi can learn from him, awesome! If not, the Chiefs get one or two years to push for the superbowl.....

Just my humble opinion.....

RustShack
02-23-2012, 09:41 PM
J Diddy, that kid is like 15 years old.

smile and nod.

LMAO

I've seen this a few times, is it actually true?

BossChief
02-23-2012, 09:43 PM
How the fuck do we get out of this without surrendering a pick for tampering?

Have the NFL rules changed or something?

Apparently, this shit happens all the time according to florio...especially at the combine.

beach tribe
02-23-2012, 09:45 PM
Disprove it first please.

Like I said bro, They will have to learn by following his example. It's well documented the level of preparation Manning utilizes. It pretty much is proven by their performances that the QBs behind him were terrible QBs. There's no way to prove whether or not they learned shit, because they just plain suck ass.
It's also strongly believed that Stanzi is a workaholic like Peyton who studies the game very hard. There's no way you could ever convince anyone that it couldn't help his development by being in the same film room as a QB who is arguably the greatest student of the game ever to suit up.

RustShack
02-23-2012, 09:45 PM
The NFL might question the Chiefs and Mannings agent. If they think the rumor is true after that they might be able to do something, but I think it has to be pretty obvious. But its obvious every year that there was tampering as players typically sign at midnight when they are aloud to start negotiating...

DJ's left nut
02-23-2012, 09:46 PM
How the fuck do we get out of this without surrendering a pick for tampering?

Have the NFL rules changed or something?

Apparently, this shit happens all the time according to florio...especially at the combine.

The NFL will do some research into this 'Fescoe' character.

Then they'll realize that his 'reporting' is only slightly more credible than the psychotic ramblings of a town drunk...though somehow less intelligible.

BossChief
02-23-2012, 09:46 PM
I understand your well spoken point. However, in the entire time Manning has been under center, how many times have they drafted a qbof the future to replace him?

Point is, not sure they ever imagined Peyton leaving the building.....

Regardless, the Chiefs need a QB now. it's a good fit for both parties. "If" Stanzi can learn from him, awesome! If not, the Chiefs get one or two years to push for the superbowl.....

Just my humble opinion.....

Im one of the biggest (if not THE biggest) Stanzi supporters on this site and if we sign Manning, the team NEEDS to spend a first or second rounder on a quarterback THIS YEAR to compete with Ricky to be #2 and #3 and sit and develop.

Peyton could go down at any moment to injury and that is gonna open the door for next man up and I dont want to paint ourselves into a corner by only having one option at that point.

It would be more than a tad foolish.

beach tribe
02-23-2012, 09:46 PM
LMAO

I've seen this a few times, is it actually true?

No. He's pushing 40 IIRC. Maybe a little younger, but he's not a kid, and I really can't figure out why he's taken this stance. He's smarter than that.

BIG K
02-23-2012, 09:48 PM
Like I said bro, They will have to learn by following his example. It's well documented the level of preparation Manning utilizes. It pretty much is proven by their performances that the QBs behind him were terrible QBs. There's no way to prove whether or not they learned shit, because they just plain suck ass.
It's also strongly believed that Stanzi is a workaholic like Peyton who studies the game very hard. There's no way you could ever convince anyone that it couldn't help his development by being in the same film room as a QB who is arguably the greatest student of the game ever to suit up.

Exactly my point!

Simplicity
02-23-2012, 09:48 PM
LMAO

I've seen this a few times, is it actually true?

Yes it's true. :doh!:

beach tribe
02-23-2012, 09:48 PM
Im one of the biggest (if not THE biggest) Stanzi supporters on this site and if we sign Manning, the team NEEDS to spend a first or second rounder on a quarterback THIS YEAR to compete with Ricky to be #2 and #3 and sit and develop.

Peyton could go down at any moment to injury and that is gonna open the door for next man up and I dont want to paint ourselves into a corner by only having one option at that point.

It would be more than a tad foolish.

I strongly disagree. I think we need to trade down in the first to whoever wants TR, and use that Amo to move up, and grab a 1st round QB next season.

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 09:49 PM
I understand your well spoken point. However, in the entire time Manning has been under center, how many times have they drafted a qbof the future to replace him?

Point is, not sure they ever imagined Peyton leaving the building.....

Regardless, the Chiefs need a QB now. it's a good fit for both parties. "If" Stanzi can learn from him, awesome! If not, the Chiefs get one or two years to push for the superbowl.....

Just my humble opinion.....

I am inclined to agree with this. I'm just not assuming he's going to come in, work for 2 years and stanzi or whoever is going to be lights out after that. I just don't see his tutelage being a known commodity.

What I do think is that he'd give us a great quarterback for 2 years if the line could protect him. Something we haven't had in forever and a day.

Simplicity
02-23-2012, 09:49 PM
No. He's pushing 40 IIRC. Maybe a little younger, but he's not a kid, and I really can't figure out why he's taken this stance. He's smarter than that.

I dunno why I did either. Just trying to figure out why he is even questioning bringing Peyton to KC.

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 09:50 PM
Yes it's true. :doh!:

I couldn't tell. You're very convincing.

Simplicity
02-23-2012, 09:50 PM
No. He's pushing 40 IIRC. Maybe a little younger, but he's not a kid, and I really can't figure out why he's taken this stance. He's smarter than that.

I'm actually really 15 though.

beach tribe
02-23-2012, 09:53 PM
That worked wonders with Tom Brady's backup, didn't it? Who was that guy?


My point being just because the guy is a good quarterback doesn't mean being behind him on the depth chart is going to make him great.

I think all anyone is saying is that it can only help. No one is saying that backing up PM will turn chicken shit into chicken salad. Talent is still required, and Stanzi has some.

And FTR, Cassel may be the best QB to never start a game in college in history, and is a top tier back up QB. I think starting behind Brady absolutely helped him, and is more than likely a huge contributing factor in him having the limited success he's had.

beach tribe
02-23-2012, 09:54 PM
I'm actually really 15 though.

We had pretty much all figured this out already.:D

beach tribe
02-23-2012, 09:55 PM
I dunno why I did either. Just trying to figure out why he is even questioning bringing Peyton to KC.

Get defensive much?

I was talking about diddy.

BIG K
02-23-2012, 09:56 PM
I strongly disagree. I think we need to trade down in the first to whoever wants TR, and use that Amo to move up, and grab a 1st round QB next season.

No disrespect but, do you think the Chiefs record next year will be worse than this year to allow them to pick high enough to grab a QB? With the 'hopeful' return of three awesome players, I do not see the Chiefs getting a better draft status than this year....

beach tribe
02-23-2012, 09:56 PM
I am inclined to agree with this. I'm just not assuming he's going to come in, work for 2 years and stanzi or whoever is going to be lights out after that.

Again, nobody said anything like that.

BIG K
02-23-2012, 09:58 PM
I am inclined to agree with this. I'm just not assuming he's going to come in, work for 2 years and stanzi or whoever is going to be lights out after that. I just don't see his tutelage being a known commodity.

What I do think is that he'd give us a great quarterback for 2 years if the line could protect him. Something we haven't had in forever and a day.

Can't agree more. Not to worried about the line if Peyton is behind center...

tredadda
02-23-2012, 09:58 PM
How sad is the QB situation in KC when fans are drooling over the thought of getting a 37 year old QB who is coming off of 3-4neck surgeries, missed an entire year and has shown no signs that he is even half the QB he was pre-injury. I guess the 40 year cycle continues, instead we will now just plug Manning in with the long list of QBs we have had over the past 40 years. Hopefully he will go all Montana here and lead us to an AFC Championship and then retire! I swear it never ends.

BossChief
02-23-2012, 09:59 PM
I strongly disagree. I think we need to trade down in the first to whoever wants TR, and use that Amo to move up, and grab a 1st round QB next season.

No way.

If we bring in Manning, we wont be within 15 picks of a franchise quarterback for a couple years.

This would probably be our last chance.

If we pass on that opportunity this year, its Stanzi or bust after Peyton is done.

That is, of course, if we would bring him in in the first place.

Simplicity
02-23-2012, 10:00 PM
Again, nobody said anything like that.

This and it's not always "bad" teaching but is the "student" willing to learn?

BossChief
02-23-2012, 10:01 PM
Can't agree more. Not to worried about the line if Peyton is behind center...

Might want to rethink this.

Think: neck problems

BryanBusby
02-23-2012, 10:01 PM
I'm not going to white knight for Manning, but we have no fucking clue what condition he is actually in.

Sure the Manning camp can be overstating his recovery process, but it's just as likely the Colts could be putting out word he's now Terri Shiavo status to limit the PR damage when they cut him.

No way.

If we bring in Manning, we wont be within 15 picks of a franchise quarterback for a couple years.

This would probably be our last chance.

If we pass on that opportunity this year, its Stanzi or bust after Peyton is done.

That is, of course, if we would bring him in in the first place.
This is no certainty either. I don't see the Rams even being interested in moving down to 11/12, when they're likely going to net a big haul moving down just two spots and still get a top 5 talent.

BIG K
02-23-2012, 10:01 PM
No way.

If we bring in Manning, we wont be within 15 picks of a franchise quarterback for a couple years.

This would probably be our last chance.

If we pass on that opportunity this year, its Stanzi or bust after Peyton is done.

That is, of course, if we would bring him in in the first place.

This.

BossChief
02-23-2012, 10:02 PM
This and it's not always "bad" teaching but is the "student" willing to learn?

I wasnt trying to slam ya, so you know.

I really did think you were just a kid.

It wasnt based on your posts or anything, I havent been around as much as I used to be and had heard it a couple times is all.

Tell us all a little about yourself, will ya?

beach tribe
02-23-2012, 10:03 PM
How sad is the QB situation in KC when fans are drooling over the thought of getting a 37 year old QB who is coming off of 3-4neck surgeries, missed an entire year and has shown no signs that he is even half the QB he was pre-injury. I guess the 40 year cycle continues, instead we will now just plug Manning in with the long list of QBs we have had over the past 40 years. Hopefully he will go all Montana here and lead us to an AFC Championship and then retire! I swear it never ends.

It's the best shot we have at a SB in the next 3 seasons period. Regardless of the history behind it.

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 10:03 PM
No. He's pushing 40 IIRC. Maybe a little younger, but he's not a kid, and I really can't figure out why he's taken this stance. He's smarter than that.

I certainly don't get smarter than that because I just accept something as fact without proof. Can you provide that? You can not.

Before everything gets all jumbled let me restate my concern so it is clear: I don't understand why everybody thinks that bringing in Manning will give us a great teacher for a young quarterback.

Here is a fact.: He has never had a backup behind him develop into anything.

Now you can say he didn't have anyone of quality behind him or that he was never asked to do that but the fact remains.

In my opinion, what we would get from Peyton is maybe 2 years of solid quarterback play. I don't expect anything else.

BIG K
02-23-2012, 10:03 PM
Might want to rethink this.

Think: neck problems

A broke neck Manning is > than Cassel.....That is my train of thought...

beach tribe
02-23-2012, 10:06 PM
No way.

If we bring in Manning, we wont be within 15 picks of a franchise quarterback for a couple years.

This would probably be our last chance.

If we pass on that opportunity this year, its Stanzi or bust after Peyton is done.

That is, of course, if we would bring him in in the first place.

Dude, if we pick up an extra 1st in next years draft we will have the ammo to move into position to draft a QB who will in all likelyhood be a better prospect than anything after Luck, and RGIII in this draft.
I think Richardson is a stud, and with Peyton here it would justify taking a RB that high, especially one with that kind of talent, but I would much rather have QBOTF, andwe absolutely will be in position to get one next year if we hold two 1sts.

BossChief
02-23-2012, 10:07 PM
No way.

If we bring in Manning, we wont be within 15 picks of a franchise quarterback for a couple years.

This would probably be our last chance.

If we pass on that opportunity this year, its Stanzi or bust after Peyton is done.

That is, of course, if we would bring him in in the first place.

also, a guy like Tannehill seems like another great prospect to use as a "Aaron Rogers" type in terms of development.

All I keep hearing about his from everyone is that he is a "natural quarterback that is instinctive and plays the position the way its supposed to be played, but is very inexperienced and could do well by sitting for a year or two"

The reason Peyton and Luck on the same roster wouldnt work out is because of the cap implications as well as the fact that Luck is ready to go right now, Tannehill isnt.

I look at it as a perfect scenario for the short and long term of this team if we sign PM and draft RT.

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 10:08 PM
Dude, if we pick up an extra 1st in next years draft we will have the ammo to move into position to draft a QB who will in all likelyhood be a better prospect than anything after Luck, and RGIII in this draft.
I think Richardson is a stud, and with Peyton here it would justify taking a RB that high, especially one with that kind of talent, but I would much rather have QBOTF, andwe absolutely will be in position to get one next year if we hold two 1sts.

How do you propose we get two firsts?

beach tribe
02-23-2012, 10:08 PM
I certainly don't get smarter than that because I just accept something as fact without proof. Can you provide that? You can not.

Before everything gets all jumbled let me restate my concern so it is clear: I don't understand why everybody thinks that bringing in Manning will give us a great teacher for a young quarterback.

Here is a fact.: He has never had a backup behind him develop into anything.

Now you can say he didn't have anyone of quality behind him or that he was never asked to do that but the fact remains.

In my opinion, what we would get from Peyton is maybe 2 years of solid quarterback play. I don't expect anything else.

Can't be proven either way. Fair enough.

beach tribe
02-23-2012, 10:08 PM
How do you propose we get two firsts?

By trading down in this years draft to someone salivating over T. Richardson.

beach tribe
02-23-2012, 10:10 PM
also, a guy like Tannehill seems like another great prospect to use as a "Aaron Rogers" type in terms of development.

All I keep hearing about his from everyone is that he is a "natural quarterback that is instinctive and plays the position the way its supposed to be played, but is very inexperienced and could do well by sitting for a year or two"

The reason Peyton and Luck on the same roster wouldnt work out is because of the cap implications as well as the fact that Luck is ready to go right now, Tannehill isnt.

I look at it as a perfect scenario for the short and long term of this team if we sign PM and draft RT.

I'll take one of next years prospects over Tannehill.
But if we were to take T. Rich, and Tannehill, I would be very happy as well.

tredadda
02-23-2012, 10:10 PM
It's the best shot we have at a SB in the next 3 seasons period. Regardless of the history behind it.

Depends on how serious we are about drafting a franchise QB. This is a QB driven league and as the past few years have shown, a rookie QB can come in and perform well right off the bat. The difference between them and Manning is that they have many more years under them (barring a freak injury) and they would set us up for long term success unlike Manning who might lead us to a SB (if he is as good post injury as pre injury that is), but is ultimately a "fix a flat" for what has plagued this franchise forever.

J Diddy
02-23-2012, 10:11 PM
Can't be proven either way. Fair enough.

I'll make you a deal. IF we get Manning and IF he's alive for 2 years and IF Stanzi becomes a stud because of it. You can have my sig, my avatar, hell my soul, because I will be ecstatic. Of course you'll eventually have to give me my stuff back.