PDA

View Full Version : Football Unlikely, Colts scenario...


melbar
03-03-2012, 01:57 PM
First off, I know its unlikely! ....

Bear with me here...What about the small chance the colts dont draft Luck?

Colts have a LOT of needs. Everyone is focusing on the Rams for a trade up.
Manning says he can play which the Colts cant officially see firsthand, yet a video "leakes" out of Peyton throwing well.

So what if they believe they can still have Peyton for a couple of years?

1. Colts keep Manning
2. Colts trade#1 for say in our case 2 #1's and 2# 3's give or take
3. Colts draft say Tannehill and groom for a year or 2 under Manning
4. Colts have 4 higher picks to bolster line etc.
5. Chiefs (or other bidder) get Luck on a team with less holes

I know the odds are low, but it seems to be a forgotten scenario and a forgone conclusion that the Colts take Luck no matter what. Seems RG3 has stollen all the press and momentum, but there is still a chance (albeit small) that the Colts Believe in Manning and use this position to correct the mistake of not preparing for Mannings replacement, build for the future, and keep the fanbase happy.

Just a little fun, but I'd absolutely go for this!

The Rick
03-03-2012, 02:13 PM
Good thought, but...

If any team should know the value of a franchise quarterback, it's the Colts. Tannehill is far from the (almost) sure thing that Luck/Griffin are. Manning was great and maybe still is, but he's surely done in 2-3 years.

10-15 years of Luck/Griffin > 2-3 years of Manning + Tannehill (who is a question mark at this point)

PGM
03-03-2012, 02:15 PM
Impossible does not equal unlikely

melbar
03-03-2012, 02:18 PM
Impossible does not equal unlikely

Your saying that its impossible for an NFL front office to make a bad decision?

ChiefGator
03-03-2012, 02:29 PM
If any team should know the value of a franchise quarterback, it's the Colts.

I think they are overvalueing it, frankly. Luck could end up being Alex Smith. We really don't know yet. But, they have Manning on the brain and are buying the hype.

They are a really bad team in ALOT of areas.... I think trading down would actually be the smartest thing to do. Poor QB they draft is going to be inheriting a bad team that only Manning can likely cover up.

DBoweShow
03-03-2012, 02:31 PM
I think they are overvalueing it, frankly. Luck could end up being Alex Smith. We really don't know yet. But, they have Manning on the brain and are buying the hype.

They are a really bad team in ALOT of areas.... I think trading down would actually be the smartest thing to do. Poor QB they draft is going to be inheriting a bad team that only Manning can likely cover up.

I'm sure the Colts are going to trade down and lose their chance to draft the surest QB prospect since Peyton. You are insane if you truly think this.

PGM
03-03-2012, 02:32 PM
Luck is going to be a Colt. I thought that would be common knowledge by now. Easiest selection by a team in a loooong time.

melbar
03-03-2012, 02:32 PM
Remember when Reggie Bush was the obvious choice for the Texans? Granted franchise QB is a different story, but great as Luck is coming in, there are still GM's who are afraid to take that chance at QB (see Chiefs). We still dont know what the new regime has in mind. We assume, but we dont know.

DBoweShow
03-03-2012, 02:34 PM
Remember when Reggie Bush was the obvious choice for the Texans? Granted franchise QB is a different story, but great as Luck is coming in, there are still GM's who are afraid to take that chance at QB (see Chiefs). We still dont know what the new regime has in mind. We assume, but we dont know.

Name one time the Chiefs have had the #1 pick with a QB prospect comparable to Luck and passed on it. Get real. This pick is a no brainer.

ChiefGator
03-03-2012, 02:40 PM
I'm sure the Colts are going to trade down and lose their chance to draft the surest QB prospect since Peyton. You are insane if you truly think this.

No, I don't think this. I think it could be a reasonable argument that they SHOULD though. They are caught up in that phrase "surest QB since Peyton",which I just don't really believe. And I'm not sure it's worth the ransom in draft picks they could likely get.

PGM
03-03-2012, 02:42 PM
No, I don't think this. I think it could be a reasonable argument that they SHOULD though. They are caught up in that phrase "surest QB since Peyton",which I just don't really believe. And I'm not sure it's worth the ransom in draft picks they could likely get.

Screw that. If you think he's the guy, you take him and don't think twice. I'd say 99 percent of people who follow the game think he is. You don't mess around when you have a chance at that kind of player.

DBoweShow
03-03-2012, 02:43 PM
Screw that. If you think he's the guy, you take him and don't think twice. I'd say 99 percent of people who follow the game think he is. You don't mess around when you have a chance at that kind of player.

This.

melbar
03-03-2012, 02:43 PM
Name one time the Chiefs have had the #1 pick with a QB prospect comparable to Luck and passed on it. Get real. This pick is a no brainer.

Obviously the Chiefs havent had the #1 overall, but they havent drafted one in the first. Thats not the point. I'm just saying that nobody seems to even consider the possibility. If you think you have 3 more years of the greatest QB maybe in the history of the NFL, the guy who built your franchise, and a team hurting for talent everywhere it has to have been considered. Otherwise why not just cut him loose now? 2 weeks ago? Again, not the most likely, but not impossible.

melbar
03-03-2012, 02:50 PM
Screw that. If you think he's the guy, you take him and don't think twice. I'd say 99 percent of people who follow the game think he is. You don't mess around when you have a chance at that kind of player.

Thats conventional wisdom, but again, there is another school of thought that you build the team first. Not saying that I agree in this situation, just saying that it is an option that everyone has just written off. Either the Colts have or havent made that decision. Peyton isnt gone, so its still an option not being talked about in all the RG3 frenzy.

Pestilence
03-03-2012, 03:05 PM
New coach. New front office. New QB. It's that simple.

ChiefGator
03-03-2012, 03:25 PM
New coach. New front office. New QB. It's that simple.

Helluva way to start a new administration. I know they were losing last year (obviously), but kicking the hall of fame QB to the curb is probably going to guarantee three more losing seasons before a rookie QB starts to learn and before that awful team can finally get some talent.

It sounds like they are doing that.. but the wisdom of it is still out. It depends on:

1) Can Manning play at a high level for 2-3 more years

2) Does Luck pan out to be as good as Manning (when VERY VERY few QB's have been)

3) All the players they lose out on by not making a trade.

kysirsoze
03-03-2012, 03:35 PM
I don't think the Colts are one or two pieces away even with Manning. It's a win-win. He gets to go somewhere more equipped to win quickly and the Colts get to start over with a stud QBOTF.

melbar
03-03-2012, 03:36 PM
Helluva way to start a new administration. I know they were losing last year (obviously), but kicking the hall of fame QB to the curb is probably going to guarantee three more losing seasons before a rookie QB starts to learn and before that awful team can finally get some talent.

It sounds like they are doing that.. but the wisdom of it is still out. It depends on:

1) Can Manning play at a high level for 2-3 more years

2) Does Luck pan out to be as good as Manning (when VERY VERY few QB's have been)

3) All the players they lose out on by not making a trade.

Thats what makes the conversation so compelling...

O.city
03-03-2012, 03:38 PM
You guys might as well move on from this topic.


I bet the Colts have Luck locked up before the draft even starts.

whoman69
03-03-2012, 03:42 PM
Your saying that its impossible for an NFL front office to make a bad decision?

That bad? Even Matt Millen thinks its a slam dunk.

Okie_Apparition
03-03-2012, 03:46 PM
Rebuilding with a 28 million or 5 million QB hit isn't that hard of a choice
& I'd bet they've seen enough of the Curtis Painters & Jim Sorgis of the world

melbar
03-03-2012, 05:21 PM
That bad? Even Matt Millen thinks its a slam dunk.

Lol...is that a comment on competent GM's or Matt Millen?

NJChiefsFan
03-03-2012, 05:25 PM
Thats what makes the conversation so compelling...

The Colts have bascially already said they are getting a new QB. If they were even considering trading it they would be holding a poker face and fielding all offers. The Colts have seen how good your team can be when you have an elite QB.

Even with it not being a lock, you need to take a chance on an elite QB. It means so much that its worth giving up the ransom you would get in return.

Speaking of the ransom, the Chiefs giving up 2 first and 2 thirds is not even close to good enough for the Colts pick anyway.

bricks
03-03-2012, 05:47 PM
Luck is going to be a Colt. I thought that would be common knowledge by now. Easiest selection by a team in a loooong time.

I'd say the chances are about, 99.999999999999%.

milkman
03-03-2012, 05:53 PM
First, the chance that the Colts don't move on from Manning and draft Luck are almost nil.

Second, if they did put the first pick on the market and decided to build around Manning, they'd more than likely want players with contarcts that they can afford rather than draft picks, because they don't have the talent around him to compete now, they won't have to money to bring in free agents after paying Manning, and they won't have the time to build around him through the draft.

whoman69
03-03-2012, 06:03 PM
I'd say the chances are about, 99.999999999999%.

you need more 9s at the end

BigChiefFan
03-03-2012, 06:16 PM
To those saying Manning will be released, you do realize he signed a new FIVE YEAR DEAL, just last year, right?

If he's healthy, I think the odds are closer to him staying a Colt, than not.

O.city
03-03-2012, 06:18 PM
You do realize that the Colts will have to pay him 35 million dollars this year and have to field a team around him? We saw how bad that roster is without Manning. It needs some serious upgrades.


I don't think there is anyway the guy is a Colt next year.

milkman
03-03-2012, 06:19 PM
To those saying Manning will be released, you do realize he signed a new FIVE YEAR DEAL, just last year, right?

BRAND NEW INFORMATION!

whoman69
03-03-2012, 06:39 PM
To those saying Manning will be released, you do realize he signed a new FIVE YEAR DEAL, just last year, right?

If he's healthy, I think the odds are closer to him staying a Colt, than not.

I think you should stay away from Vegas.

BigChiefFan
03-03-2012, 06:42 PM
Jim Irsay: We Can Make It Work If Peyton Would Like To Remain A Colt
by Stew Blake on Feb 15, 2012 1:53 AM EST in Colts News


Well, Manning-Watch '12 certainly just got a little more interesting.

If you happen to be rooting for Peyton Manning to finish his career as a Colt, Jim Irsay is doing his best to put a small smile on your face and/or make the situation even more intense. The Colts appear to want #18 back in the saddle:

"We can make it work if he wants to be here,’’ Irsay said today. "We’d be excited to have him back and finish his career with us.

Manning and Irsay have engaged in an intense chess match for weeks and now we're likely witnessing Irsay calling Manning's bluff. It's funny and quite hypocritical that Irsay was upset with Manning for not keeping his thoughts "in house", yet Irsay has now decided to one-up (again) Manning and relay this information to the press.

According to Irsay, if Manning truly wants to remain a Colt, the door just swiftly blew open for perfect harmony to exist:

"I want him to be able to make the choice. We would love to have him back here if he can get healthy and we can look at doing a contract that reflects the uncertainty of the . . . healing process with the regeneration of the nerve.’’

"There’s no question it can be worked out if he wants to be here,’’ said Irsay, who has concerns over Manning’s long-term health. "It can work if he wants to come back and can get back to being the old Peyton.’’

This isn't the first time Irsay has been vocal about the decision being in the hands of Manning, but now the entire world knows. Irsay called Manning a "politician" for his interview with Bob Kravitz, but this is politicking at its finest.





According to a source familiar with the entire situation (don't hold your breath), the Manning camp would be interested in an incentive-laden contract as a free agent. Whether this offer applies to the Colts (or any team, for that matter), who knows? Tom Condon acknowledged the possibility of delaying the March 8th bonus during the week of the Super Bowl, but there seemed to be little interest in doing so. If Manning were to give the go ahead for a preventative deal, it would essentially protect any team that has fears of their investment in Manning never paying off, in the event he that isn't able to fully recover.

Sounds fair enough, right? But is Manning willing to play under such a deal for the Colts?

First, let me just preface my thoughts by stating that contract matters don't always tend to be as cut and dry as people would like to believe. We can say that Irsay is giving Manning a chance to return (and he is), but until we know the specifics of any said deal, we cannot fairly judge the outcome.

That considered, Manning appears to have firm control of his destiny and legacy as a Colt. If Irsay is ready to negotiate, a fair deal can be finalized to circumvent the option bonus Manning is due by March 8th. Of course, it's no secret that teams are coyly campaigning to win the services of the 36-year-old. And even in uncertain health, some team will be willing to pay Manning a boatload of money, unlike Irsay. There's also the fact that if he decides to join another team (like the Texans), his chances of securing another ring will be all but guaranteed. That much is obvious. However, if he decides this is his best option, what about the thought of abandonment that could ooze from Indianapolis? His legacy reaches far beyond the brink of winning another Super Bowl ring. Peyton Manning came into the NFL as a Colt and he should leave the NFL as a Colt. But through these trying times, Irsay's fumbling of the situation, and the elimination of virtually every connection from his past, how far can Manning's loyalty stretch? Is it possible that Manning feels abandoned in his own regard?

Only time will tell. Yes. More time.

The resources are in place to get the job done and we're all aware that Manning is a class act. Actually, if you look up class in the dictionary, Manning's glorious forehead is pictured directly to the right. After all, Manning was the one who allowed the Colts to protect themselves with his current contract (one year structure, four year option). And yes, like most of us in the world, he also enjoys his money. A lot of money, actually. I'm certainly not trying to suggest that he's greedy (his fortune is more than well-deserved), but if I may borrow a line from the classic film, Wall Street, "How many yachts can you water-ski behind? How much is enough, huh?"

When it comes to his legacy as a Colt, guaranteed money---his estimated net worth is approximately $115 million---should be the least important factor in his decision. If he can return to form, Manning will have plenty of money waiting for him. As for the rest, will the restructuring of his contract really be enough to keep him in Indy?

"The Decision" is upon us, friends.

http://www.stampedeblue.com/2012/2/15/2799158/jim-irsay-we-can-make-it-work-if-peyton-wants-to-remain-a-colt

Not quite as cut and dry, as you blowing smoke up our asses like you have some insider information, of what's going to transpire.

Just like the article states it's a chess game and no one is sure of the outcome. Nice attempt at not knowing anymore than the rest of us, though and playing it off like it's so revolutionary to think Manning could be released. Wow, thanks for crystal ball, lead-pipe-lock of knowing the future.

He may be released, he may not, but you pretending to act like you know, is quality humor. Thanks for the laughs.

PGM
03-03-2012, 07:47 PM
I'd say the chances are about, 99.999999999999%.

So, you're saying there's a chance!!!/Lloyd "melbar" Christmas

whoman69
03-03-2012, 07:51 PM
Simply a matter of Irsay trying to save face. They have five days to restructure or cut Manning. Its hard having to cut a legend, but that's why the job is there. Without the emotional aspect, its a no-brainer that he has to go. If Irsay wants to make the right business decision about what to do with Manning, he needs to wave goodbye. If Peyton is a competitor, he should want the same thing. The cast they would be able to put around him will not be championship calibre. If I'm Luck and see that Peyton is still there, I demand a trade. Why would you throw away three or four years of your career when you know there are five or six teams that will put him on the field day one?

BossChief
03-03-2012, 09:16 PM
If I were Manning, I would say fuck off to Irsay.

The team signed him to that contract knowing full well what they were getting into medically.

If the neck is fused and his arm strength is returning (as this video shows), that's pretty much a bitch move to ask Peyton to restructure when he can have a better opertunity elsewhere to make more money and have a more talented team around him.

If Irsay REALLY wants Peyton to return, he will pay him the 35 million dollars this year, as he agreed to do before last year.

whoman69
03-03-2012, 10:25 PM
If I were Manning, I would say **** off to Irsay.

The team signed him to that contract knowing full well what they were getting into medically.

If the neck is fused and his arm strength is returning (as this video shows), that's pretty much a bitch move to ask Peyton to restructure when he can have a better opertunity elsewhere to make more money and have a more talented team around him.

If Irsay REALLY wants Peyton to return, he will pay him the 35 million dollars this year, as he agreed to do before last year.

That's the point. He doesn't. You really think he wants to tick off Luck to make Peyton happy with a mediocre team around him? No, he wants the fanbase to think he did all he could to bring back Peyton, but it wasn't in the cards.

Wallcrawler
03-03-2012, 10:33 PM
Jim Irsay: We Can Make It Work If Peyton Would Like To Remain A Colt



Roughly translated: If Peyton would like to bend over and let me PIIHB, and play for a contract not unlike indentured servitude, we can make it work and he can finish his career here.


F*** Jim Irsay.

rocknrolla
03-03-2012, 11:20 PM
I really think Peyton is too much of a competitor to stay. Yea, he built the stadium. But he needs to win. That is his priority. IMO. This Irsay talk is all bullshit. I think we hold all the cards in this whole thing.
Posted via Mobile Device

Fat Elvis
03-04-2012, 12:13 AM
Someone needs to rent a Mayflower moving van and park it outside of Manning's house.

Mike in SW-MO
03-04-2012, 06:36 AM
Remember. The Colts are the team that was strong armed into giving up the rights to Elway. I doubt they want to repeat that history.

Dick Bull
03-04-2012, 06:42 AM
I really think Peyton is too much of a competitor to stay. Yea, he built the stadium. But he needs to win. That is his priority. IMO. This Irsay talk is all bullshit. I think we hold all the cards in this whole thing.
Posted via Mobile Device

I'm not sure if you're a Chiefs fan, however if you are and think that the Chiefs hold all the cards in this whole thing I thing you're going to be let down.

We don't have a single card in this hand at all. Peyton is going to go where he wants to go based on what he wants. It's easy to say he could win a title with us, but the fact remains that we haven't won a playoff game in 19 years.

bricks
03-04-2012, 07:02 AM
I'm not sure if you're a Chiefs fan, however if you are and think that the Chiefs hold all the cards in this whole thing I thing you're going to be let down.

We don't have a single card in this hand at all. Peyton is going to go where he wants to go based on what he wants. It's easy to say he could win a title with us, but the fact remains that we haven't won a playoff game in 19 years.

Chief fans can only hope that he signs w/ KC.

But, you and the rest of us know, KC makes the most sense.

Seriously, out of all the teams out there that need a quarterback, KC has the best team and they have the most cap space to take on his contract. Plus, they have the easiest division. You don't think for one second that Peyton must be going hmmmmm....they look pretty good and make my situation ideal? I do think KC is an attractive destination for him. Hopefully he is sold out on coming here? With all the weapons KC has, he'd be crazy not to at consider them an option.(lol oh Romeo)

Chief Roundup
03-04-2012, 07:41 AM
Just say no to Manning.

bevischief
03-04-2012, 07:43 AM
Drugs are bad.

whoman69
03-04-2012, 10:09 AM
Drugs are bad.

m'kay

melbar
03-04-2012, 11:16 AM
Soooo.....if Peyton comes back, protecting him and his neck would be a priority. The above scenariowould be one option. You can't bring back the most beloved figure in franchise history and kill him!

alnorth
03-04-2012, 11:22 AM
Your saying that its impossible for an NFL front office to make a bad decision?

It is impossible for THAT NFL front office to make THAT bad decision.

Chiefshrink
03-04-2012, 11:46 AM
First off, I know its unlikely! ....

Bear with me here...What about the small chance the colts dont draft Luck?

Colts have a LOT of needs. Everyone is focusing on the Rams for a trade up.
Manning says he can play which the Colts cant officially see firsthand, yet a video "leakes" out of Peyton throwing well.

So what if they believe they can still have Peyton for a couple of years?

1. Colts keep Manning
2. Colts trade#1 for say in our case 2 #1's and 2# 3's give or take
3. Colts draft say Tannehill and groom for a year or 2 under Manning
4. Colts have 4 higher picks to bolster line etc.
5. Chiefs (or other bidder) get Luck on a team with less holes

I know the odds are low, but it seems to be a forgotten scenario and a forgone conclusion that the Colts take Luck no matter what. Seems RG3 has stollen all the press and momentum, but there is still a chance (albeit small) that the Colts Believe in Manning and use this position to correct the mistake of not preparing for Mannings replacement, build for the future, and keep the fanbase happy.

Just a little fun, but I'd absolutely go for this!

Not going to happen. Colts will take Luck HANDS DOWN !!! The reasons for this is what happened shortly after the season ended.

GM was fired IMO for 2 reasons: 1. Because he disagreed with the owner on what to do with Manning. Owner wants Luck and the GM wants Manning pure and simple. 2. GM got caught with his pants down with not having a decent backup vet QB available to put in just in case Manning's surgeries were not successful.

Now the GM is in a catch 22 with the Owner pissed at him that he didnt plan for the worst and now Luck is sitting there at your pick. And when the owner is pissed at you and you especially don't agree with letting Manning go after not planning for the worst and you the GM still want Manning in a "high risk" situation it's really a "no brainer" for the owner.

It's nothing personal or a matter of performance other than that little thing of not planning for the worst and now Luck is sitting there at your pick.

melbar
03-04-2012, 12:20 PM
I'd take Luck too, but as the Chiefs I'd at least make the call.

whoman69
03-04-2012, 12:39 PM
Soooo.....if Peyton comes back, protecting him and his neck would be a priority. The above scenariowould be one option. You can't bring back the most beloved figure in franchise history and kill him!

Outside of RT, this is a pretty solid line. That deficit will be corrected this year. You have Hudson moving into C. Who would know better than Peyton if Lilja is still up to the task? You saw what the line can do when you have a QB that knows how to move protections. Palko took 11 sacks in four games because he can't throw more than 10 yards down the field, but at least he moved the protections. Orton took one sack in three games. Matt Cassel took 22 sacks in nine games because he has no idea how to move coverages. Peyton is the master of moving coverages.

melbar
03-04-2012, 12:59 PM
Outside of RT, this is a pretty solid line. That deficit will be corrected this year. You have Hudson moving into C. Who would know better than Peyton if Lilja is still up to the task? You saw what the line can do when you have a QB that knows how to move protections. Palko took 11 sacks in four games because he can't throw more than 10 yards down the field, but at least he moved the protections. Orton took one sack in three games. Matt Cassel took 22 sacks in nine games because he has no idea how to move coverages. Peyton is the master of moving coverages.

Yes we're good. I meant the Colts needing a lot to protect Manning and build if they keep him.

whoman69
03-04-2012, 02:12 PM
Yes we're good. I meant the Colts needing a lot to protect Manning and build if they keep him.

Kind of hard to do when you eat $35 million in cap space for Peyton, and pay a top pick QB money. The Colts can't afford to put a good team around Peyton. They have to rebuild, and a 35 year old QB coming off three surgeries doesn't really fit those plans.