PDA

View Full Version : Zone Blocking Interior Lineman


Direckshun
03-30-2012, 09:25 AM
From wiki:

In a zone blocking scheme, fleet-footedness and athletic ability trump size as desirable qualities in offensive linemen. Coordination and technique matter more than muscle in implementing a successful scheme because defensive linemen are often double-teamed at the point of attack. Creating movement on the defensive line is more important than opening a specific hole in the defense.

Lots of pulling, lots of second-level blocking, ideally is powerful enough in short space but is perhaps even more important that the lineman is athletic and fast, really good on technique.

This particular draft is a little weaker down the line with ZBS offensive lineman.

Perfect Fits

Philip Blake, Baylor -- not as straight-line fast as we like our guys, but has really good athleticism, technique, and versatility to take on bigger nose tackles (important in today's NFL)

David Molk, Michigan -- I don't need to tell you guys this, but Molk is a brilliant, perfect fit and Day One starter in Kansas City if he comes here

Will Blackwell, LSU -- athletic guard who can get to the second level, first-team SEC

Ryan Miller, Colorado -- really good at the second level with sneaky athleticism, is a development in process, however, but would be served well on our bench for a year or two

Desmond Wynn, Rutgers -- only 300 lbs, extremely athletic with a two-year starting record. can play center/guard

Joe Looney, Wake Forest -- four-year starter, comes pretty NFL ready.

Adam Gettis, Iowa -- guy I really love, from program Pioli really loves. drastically undersized though at 290 lbs

Austen Pasztor, Virginia -- when you read the words "needs to add some bulk," you've got yourself a ZBS lineman

Decent, Not Great Fits

David DeCastro -- talented enough to make anything work, total technician, but can't get down the field like any of the Chiefs' current starters

Cordy Glenn -- super big and really athletic, but ZBS scheme requires smaller lineman who are technicians, Glenn is neither

Michael Brewster, Ohio State -- really no reason to pick this guy up, you'll need a 2nd or a 3rd to do so and he's going to need a couple seasons' development

Brandon Washington -- mean streak, but plays more of a man-position type blocking that works better in the power game

Jaymes Brooks, Virginia Tech -- player that clearly loves the run game but will need a lot of development

Quentin Saulsberry, Mississippi State -- not a great fit, but has insane versatility

Stephen Good, Oklahoma -- perfect for the ZBS system but needs a shit ton of development in the run game. might be a great UDFA pickup if he lasts that long

Lonnie Edwards, Texas Tech -- Edwards seems to have the physical tools, but T-Tech players always need a ton of development

Moe Petrus, Connecticut -- Casey Weigmann-esque undersized body, but withotu any of Wiegmann's tools

Bad Fits

Peter Konz, Wisconsin -- like Zeitler, looks great on tape but his measurables are just miserable for the ZBS

Ben Jones, Georgia -- never was a fan

Lucas Nix, Pitt -- not athletic

Garth Gerhart, Arizona State -- plodder, not developed

Johnnie Troutman, Penn State -- pure power blocking

Rokevious Watkins, South Carolina -- woolly mammoth

Art Forst, Rutgers -- massive fucking dude, some tackle potential

Antoine McClain, Clemson -- slowwwwwww

Andrew Tiller, Syracuse -- shit lineman

William Vlachos, Alabama -- sucks shit through a hose

SNR
03-30-2012, 09:32 AM
Molk is a day one starter? He might know zone pretty well, but he's incredibly undersized. I want a center who could actually help us convert 3rd/4th and shorts. Another Wiegmann would be awful.

O.city
03-30-2012, 09:35 AM
Molk or Wynn would be good pickups.

Saccopoo
03-30-2012, 01:06 PM
Molk is a day one starter? He might know zone pretty well, but he's incredibly undersized. I want a center who could actually help us convert 3rd/4th and shorts. Another Wiegmann would be awful.

Weigmann is and has been one of the best at his position over the past decade plus. His longevity is a testament to his ability to man the line pivot exceptionally well. Another Weigmann would be a freaking god send.

Everybody keeps talking about him being undersized, no push, blah, blah, blah, but I still recall the 49er's game in 2010 where he absolutely destroyed Franklin all game long.

People put too much stock into the height/weight thing. Nobody thought Kyle Williams could have played the NT in a 3-4, but he has been the best at it over the past couple of years.

Molk is exceptionally strong and very skilled. He'd be a nice potential player for this offense.

I'm a little disappointed that Direckshun didn't include Oklahoma State center Grant Garner in his "perfect fit" section though. Garner was First Team All-Big 12, a Rimington Award finalist and the Big 12 Offensive Lineman of the Year. He had a superb season blocking for Weeden. Was incredibly effective in both run and pass protection and would be a very nice fit for this offense as well.

http://media.scout.com/Media/Image/94/948448.jpg

Sfeihc
03-30-2012, 06:43 PM
What about Kelemete from Washington as a guard?

AustinChief
03-30-2012, 07:11 PM
Molk is a day one starter? He might know zone pretty well, but he's incredibly undersized. I want a center who could actually help us convert 3rd/4th and shorts. Another Wiegmann would be awful.

Molk is just BARELY undersized and has never had a problem with it due to his immense strength... he would be an AMAZINGLY good pick for us.

O.city
03-30-2012, 07:26 PM
Where is Molk expected to be picked?

AustinChief
03-30-2012, 08:52 PM
Where is Molk expected to be picked?

He is projected by some to be 5th round... but those people are idiots. He should go 3rd or 4th round at the latest. If we don't take DeCastro at #11 and Molk falls to us in the 4th... he would be a perfect addition and allow us to keep Hudson at Guard.

buddha
03-30-2012, 09:03 PM
From wiki:



Lots of pulling, lots of second-level blocking, ideally is powerful enough in short space but is perhaps even more important that the lineman is athletic and fast, really good on technique.

This particular draft is a little weaker down the line with ZBS offensive lineman.

Perfect Fits

Philip Blake, Baylor -- not as straight-line fast as we like our guys, but has really good athleticism, technique, and versatility to take on bigger nose tackles (important in today's NFL)

David Molk, Michigan -- I don't need to tell you guys this, but Molk is a brilliant, perfect fit and Day One starter in Kansas City if he comes here

Will Blackwell, LSU -- athletic guard who can get to the second level, first-team SEC

Ryan Miller, Colorado -- really good at the second level with sneaky athleticism, is a development in process, however, but would be served well on our bench for a year or two

Desmond Wynn, Rutgers -- only 300 lbs, extremely athletic with a two-year starting record. can play center/guard

Joe Looney, Wake Forest -- four-year starter, comes pretty NFL ready.

Adam Gettis, Iowa -- guy I really love, from program Pioli really loves. drastically undersized though at 290 lbs

Austen Pasztor, Virginia -- when you read the words "needs to add some bulk," you've got yourself a ZBS lineman

Decent, Not Great Fits

David DeCastro -- talented enough to make anything work, total technician, but can't get down the field like any of the Chiefs' current starters

Cordy Glenn -- super big and really athletic, but ZBS scheme requires smaller lineman who are technicians, Glenn is neither

Michael Brewster, Ohio State -- really no reason to pick this guy up, you'll need a 2nd or a 3rd to do so and he's going to need a couple seasons' development

Brandon Washington -- mean streak, but plays more of a man-position type blocking that works better in the power game

Jaymes Brooks, Virginia Tech -- player that clearly loves the run game but will need a lot of development

Quentin Saulsberry, Mississippi State -- not a great fit, but has insane versatility

Stephen Good, Oklahoma -- perfect for the ZBS system but needs a shit ton of development in the run game. might be a great UDFA pickup if he lasts that long

Lonnie Edwards, Texas Tech -- Edwards seems to have the physical tools, but T-Tech players always need a ton of development

Moe Petrus, Connecticut -- Casey Weigmann-esque undersized body, but withotu any of Wiegmann's tools

Bad Fits

Peter Konz, Wisconsin -- like Zeitler, looks great on tape but his measurables are just miserable for the ZBS

Ben Jones, Georgia -- never was a fan

Lucas Nix, Pitt -- not athletic

Garth Gerhart, Arizona State -- plodder, not developed

Johnnie Troutman, Penn State -- pure power blocking

Rokevious Watkins, South Carolina -- woolly mammoth

Art Forst, Rutgers -- massive ****ing dude, some tackle potential

Antoine McClain, Clemson -- slowwwwwww

Andrew Tiller, Syracuse -- shit lineman

William Vlachos, Alabama -- sucks shit through a hose

DeCastro can't get down field as well as any of KC's current starters? WTF are you talking about? DeCastro can move. Not only can he get downfield, but his lateral movement is fluid as hell.

BryanBusby
03-31-2012, 03:09 AM
DeCastro can't get down field as well as any of KC's current starters? WTF are you talking about? DeCastro can move. Not only can he get downfield, but his lateral movement is fluid as hell.

Good to see I wasn't the only one that was baffled with that line.

Wilson8
03-31-2012, 11:30 AM
Perfect Fits
Philip Blake, Baylor -- not as straight-line fast as we like our guys, but has really good athleticism, technique, and versatility to take on bigger nose tackles (important in today's NFL)

Philip Blake would be a good 4th round pick for KC. He can play center or guard. He also started 12 games at right tackle as a sophmore at Baylor, so could maybe play there in a pinch. I like the idea of having an experienced college center in case we need him.

Good size at 6'3" 311 lbs, started 38 games at Baylor, 2 seasons at center.

From WalterFootball - http://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2012pblake.php

Strengths:
Secure, accurate shotgun snapper
Quickness and athleticism
Moves well laterally
Ability to mirror speed rushers
Quick feet
Good knee bend
Agile
Phenomenal initial quickness to get to blocks off snap
Plus athletic ability
Mature
Solid run blocker
Gets to blocks on the second level
Flexible to play any blocking scheme
Reliable
Ready to play quickly in the NFL

Weaknesses:
Age (27 for next season)
Could use more power
Needs to improve his body, drop some fat and add muscle
May need to improve his conditioning
Didn't snap with QB under center very much
Didn't pull in run blocking often

whoman69
03-31-2012, 12:07 PM
I have to wonder if the OP is a result of trying to rationalize their objection to drafting DeCastro or Konz in round one. DeCastro is a very mobile player that should be able to fit in a zone blocking scheme. IMO DeCastro provides the biggest immediate talent improvement over any other player we are considering in round one. DeCastro > Lilja at this point in his career more than Keuchly is a upgrade over Belcher. Richardson and Tannehill involve drafting up. In the case of Richardson he would become the #2 back. Tannehill is not ready to step in for probably at least 2 years. Poe is a project. Others mentioned just don't fit for what we would be asking of them such as Upshaw who can't cover at 272 lbs. Brockers, Still et al are being projected as 3-4 DEs to possibly replace Dorsey if he is not resigned next year.

Saccopoo
03-31-2012, 04:19 PM
I have to wonder if the OP is a result of trying to rationalize their objection to drafting DeCastro or Konz in round one. DeCastro is a very mobile player that should be able to fit in a zone blocking scheme. IMO DeCastro provides the biggest immediate talent improvement over any other player we are considering in round one. DeCastro > Lilja at this point in his career more than Keuchly is a upgrade over Belcher. Richardson and Tannehill involve drafting up. In the case of Richardson he would become the #2 back. Tannehill is not ready to step in for probably at least 2 years. Poe is a project. Others mentioned just don't fit for what we would be asking of them such as Upshaw who can't cover at 272 lbs. Brockers, Still et al are being projected as 3-4 DEs to possibly replace Dorsey if he is not resigned next year.

I doubt it. Direckshun has a hard on for DeCastro.

The problem with picking DeCastro is that he isn't going to be that much of an upgrade to either Asamoah or Hudson, if he even is an upgrade to either at this point. So what you would be looking at is moving one of those three to the center position - a position none of them has ever really played. Moving one of them is going to require a bit of a learning curve regardless of their talent/skills.

However, by drafting a guy who has played the position, you keep both Hudson and Asamoah at guard.

My center picks would be:

1. Peter Konz, Wisconsin
- An absolute destroyer of worlds on running plays and is very solid in pass protection. He levels nose tackles with regularity and is more athletic than his size suggests (6'5", 315 lbs.). There is a bit of an injury history though.

2. David Molk, Michigan
- The reigning Rimington Award winner (given to the nations top collegiate center) is bull strong with superb athleticism. Bulked up to 300 lbs. for the combine and looked great at that weight.

3. Grant Garner, Oklahoma State
- The top offensive lineman in the Big 12, first team all-conference and a Rimington finalist. Only gave up a half a sack in 2011 and is equally effective in both the run and the pass. He was better than Blake against the same competition.

Brewster is a solid player, but he's going to go higher than he probably should. I also like Jeremiah Hatch out of Kansas. They had a horrible year, but he was pretty solid in the games I saw.

O.city
03-31-2012, 04:52 PM
I'm starting to come around on Molk.


3 or 4 round would be perfect.

AustinChief
03-31-2012, 05:05 PM
However, by drafting a guy who has played the position, you keep both Hudson and Asamoah at guard.

My center picks would be:

1. Peter Konz, Wisconsin
- An absolute destroyer of worlds on running plays and is very solid in pass protection. He levels nose tackles with regularity and is more athletic than his size suggests (6'5", 315 lbs.). There is a bit of an injury history though.

2. David Molk, Michigan
- The reigning Rimington Award winner (given to the nations top collegiate center) is bull strong with superb athleticism. Bulked up to 300 lbs. for the combine and looked great at that weight.


Konz is not a good fit for our system with the high price you'd have to pay for him. You'd be far far better off taking Molk with a 4th (or even 3rd) instead of Konz with a 2nd. I totally agree with drafting a true center and leaving Hudson at guard where we KNOW what he can do. That way we can solidify the line and still use our top 2 or 3 picks on BPA on defense.

Nightfyre
03-31-2012, 05:07 PM
I like the idea of Molk. First off, he's a trash-talker and that is just something you don't get everyday in a center. Second, he's clearly strong enough to take on NTs. And third, he is mobile enough to pull to the point of attack.

buddha
04-01-2012, 12:04 AM
Look, I'm no fan of drafting a guard at #11, but DeCastro is a damn good lineman. He is more fluid and versatile than either of our current OGs were at the same point in their development.

It's interesting that Kiper has us drafting the LB out of BC. That kid is bulldog.

Saccopoo
04-01-2012, 08:42 AM
Look, I'm no fan of drafting a guard at #11, but DeCastro is a damn good lineman. He is more fluid and versatile than either of our current OGs were at the same point in their development.

It's interesting that Kiper has us drafting the LB out of BC. That kid is bulldog.

I'd disagree. Rod Hudson was one of the finest college guards - ever. Freshman All-American and four year, first team All-Conference. One of the most decorated offensive linemen ever.

I personally thought he was the best lineman in the 2011 draft and was thrilled when the Chiefs took him in the second. What dropped Hudson into the second was the same thing that dropped Will Shields to the third - short arms, smaller height/weight (remember that Shields was the Outland trophy winner and like Hudson, a first team All-American).

DeCastro is taller, at a hair under 6'5" and 316 lbs. His combine numbers were somewhat middle of the pack, but he displayed superb skills and fundamentals.

If the Chiefs are confident that Rod can play the center position as effectively as he can play guard, I'd be fine with taking DeCastro. However, having him learn a new position is going to take some adjustments, and I'm not certain that it's not a better option to take a dedicated center over moving a potentially superb guard.

Right now, if the Chiefs stay at #11, I think it comes down to the following players:

1. Luke Kuechly
2. David DeCastro
3. Michael Brockers
4. Dre Kirkpatrick