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Count Zarth
06-08-2012, 03:39 AM
Holy shit. The propganda machine is churning. :facepalm:

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d829a8aae/article/matt-cassel-is-a-winner-according-to-new-chiefs-oc

Matt Cassel has had an up-and-down three-season run with the Kansas City Chiefs, but new offensive coordinator Brian Daboll believes he inherited a winner at the quarterback position.

Cassel led the New England Patriots to an 11-5 record after Tom Brady wrecked his knee in Week 1 of the 2008 season. He later piloted the Chiefs to a 10-6 mark and an AFC West title in 2010. Cassel has never won a playoff game -- in fact, he played terribly against the Ravens in his only postseason start -- but Daboll sees a player who knows how to lead his team.


"He's been a winner," Daboll told reporters Thursday, according to ESPN.com. "He's had two 10-plus win seasons. I did a study just this offseason about 10-plus-win quarterbacks, which is what you're defined by, obviously. There's been nine of them in the last four years that have had two or more 10-plus win seasons in the regular season, and Matt is one of them.

"The other ones being Brady, (Drew) Brees, (Aaron) Rodgers, Peyton Manning, Ben Roethlisberger, Eli (Manning), (Joe) Flacco, (Matt) Ryan, so he's been a winner. He works his tail off in the classroom. I think he's done a good job in these OTAs, and I'm looking forward to working with him."

Daboll finds a creative way to lump Cassel in with a group of the game's best quarterbacks, but he does leave out the big picture. Despite those 10-plus win seasons, Cassel is a pedestrian 28-26 in games he's started overall.

If you really are defined by your record, this seems about right.

Fritz88
06-08-2012, 04:00 AM
I think Daboll is right here.
Posted via Mobile Device

Flachief58
06-08-2012, 04:28 AM
Brady, (Drew) Brees, (Aaron) Rodgers, Peyton Manning, Ben Roethlisberger, Eli (Manning), (Joe) Flacco, (Matt) Ryan, Mark Casshole


One of these things is not like the others, one of these things just does'nt belong.

Kyle DeLexus
06-08-2012, 04:52 AM
I'd rather they just not said anything at all regarding Mat Casel. He is a sub-par backup QB and shouldn't even have a roster spot let alone a huge contract as a starter.

ZootedGranny
06-08-2012, 04:53 AM
I did a study just this offseason about 10-plus-win quarterbacks, which is what you're defined by, obviously.

http://i.minus.com/iiOtSHjplaTXg.gif

the Talking Can
06-08-2012, 04:54 AM
fml

Mr_Tomahawk
06-08-2012, 05:01 AM
Q

BigMeatballDave
06-08-2012, 05:01 AM
Heil Pioli

BoneKrusher
06-08-2012, 05:15 AM
it's a typo, Daboll meant to say Matt Cassel's a wiener.

Flachief58
06-08-2012, 05:35 AM
it's a typo, Daboll meant to say Matt Cassel's a wiener.

I believe the proper term is "Bleeding Vagina"

BoneKrusher
06-08-2012, 05:38 AM
I believe the proper term is "Bleeding Vagina"

:thumb:

Gary
06-08-2012, 05:39 AM
Nevermind things like reading defenses in less than 10 seconds, field vision, being able to make all the throws without praying every time the ball leaves your hands, leading your receiver, proper footwork and body motion...ya know, the stuff that makes consistent winners do at the quarterback position.

Count Zarth
06-08-2012, 05:39 AM
Four years is way too small a sample size to definitively say "two 10-win seasons means you're a winner, bro!"

How about...go back as far as 2000...and see which QBs had two 10+ win seasons in their career. And see what it really means.

Answer:

Chad Pennington
Kerry Collins
Jake Delhomme
Philip Rivers
Matt Hasselbeck
Brett Favre
Tony Romo
Steve McNair
Donovan McNabb
Carson Palmer
Jake Plummer
Trent Green
Rich Gannon
Brad Johnson
Jeff Garcia
Kurt Warner
Kordell Stewart
Vinny Testaverde
Jay Fiedler

So yeah...you could go for a really small sample size and compare Matt Cassel to some pretty good quarterbacks, some awesome quarterbacks.

Or maybe he's just a piece of shit like Kordell Stewart or any of the other quarterbacks I bolded.

Two 10+ wins seasons isn't a barometer for shit, Brian Daboll.

Hog Farmer
06-08-2012, 05:51 AM
Actually Cassel is one of the best quarterbacks in the league when he has Charles running the ball.

BoneKrusher
06-08-2012, 05:56 AM
Actually Cassel is one of the best quarterbacks in the league when he has Charles running the ball.

he had Charles running the ball vs Baltimore in the wild card game.

i think he was one of the best quarterbacks in the league when he plays the NFC West.

he's had an 11 win season and a 10 win season when he plays them.

Flachief58
06-08-2012, 06:01 AM
So all we have to do is get the commish to agree to let the Chiefs play the NFC west twice every year?

SUPERBOWL BABY!!!

BoneKrusher
06-08-2012, 06:05 AM
So all we have to do is get the commish to agree to let the Chiefs play the NFC west twice every year?

SUPERBOWL BABY!!!

if Cassel stays as the Starter, Yes.

Flachief58
06-08-2012, 06:17 AM
Well given peeholy's man crush on Matty, we're stuck with that turd for at least 1 more year. If the rest of the team can cover up for shitty QB play and somehow get to the playoffs, he may even get an extension (God help us all)

Agent V
06-08-2012, 06:20 AM
So, a few months ago, Pioli was pushing the "open competition at quarterback" idea. Now you can see how it's slowly turning into Cassel being the starter no matter what (something many here predicted anyway), with Quinn and Stanzi battling for the second spot.

Fucking shit. I bet if we had signed Manning, we'd have put him at second string.

Okie_Apparition
06-08-2012, 06:26 AM
Weis would switch out Matt's gatorade
with Roarin' Raspberry Cranberry Kool-Aid
laced with Imodium A-D

Rausch
06-08-2012, 06:41 AM
What defines good QB's is that their play speaks for itself...

Guru
06-08-2012, 06:43 AM
Yet all he does is lose lately. 3 and out, 3 and out, 3 and out. Then Orton comes in and we start moving the ball and pick up a couple wins.

yep, Cassel is a winner.

KC Tattoo
06-08-2012, 06:44 AM
http://i883.photobucket.com/albums/ac32/norsevalkyrie/IMG_0973.jpg

Bwana
06-08-2012, 06:50 AM
Yeah.................

http://harmonia.meccahosting.com/~a0002223/bullshit_meter_2.jpg

BoneKrusher
06-08-2012, 06:54 AM
http://i883.photobucket.com/albums/ac32/norsevalkyrie/IMG_0973.jpg

yep Pioli and Daboll can polish all they want but Cassel's still gonna be a turd.

Messier
06-08-2012, 06:58 AM
Four years is way too small a sample size to definitively say "two 10-win seasons means you're a winner, bro!"

How about...go back as far as 2000...and see which QBs had two 10+ win seasons in their career. And see what it really means.

Answer:

Chad Pennington
Kerry Collins
Jake Delhomme
Philip Rivers
Matt Hasselbeck
Brett Favre
Tony Romo
Steve McNair
Donovan McNabb
Carson Palmer
Jake Plummer
Trent Green
Rich Gannon
Brad Johnson
Jeff Garcia
Kurt Warner
Kordell Stewart
Vinny Testaverde
Jay Fiedler

So yeah...you could go for a really small sample size and compare Matt Cassel to some pretty good quarterbacks, some awesome quarterbacks.

Or maybe he's just a piece of shit like Kordell Stewart or any of the other quarterbacks I bolded.

Two 10+ wins seasons isn't a barometer for shit, Brian Daboll.

Yeah, Cassel belongs in that group you highlighted. Borderline starters. Better than the likes of Thigpen, who now is a third stringer, but not good starting QBs.

Deberg_1990
06-08-2012, 07:00 AM
Hes right. Career 28-26 record as a starter.

Art Vader
06-08-2012, 07:04 AM
if the glove don't fit, you must acquit.

durtyrute
06-08-2012, 07:18 AM
Yet all he does is lose lately. 3 and out, 3 and out, 3 and out. Then Orton comes in and we start moving the ball and pick up a couple wins.

yep, Cassel is a winner.

How that never caught on as his nickname will forever amaze me.

Chiefnj2
06-08-2012, 07:18 AM
Oh noes, the offensive coordinator didn't badmouth the starting QB. Oh noes.

BoneKrusher
06-08-2012, 07:22 AM
Oh noes, the offensive coordinator didn't badmouth the starting QB. Oh noes.

yeah, i know.
like we said he's just trying to polish a turd, hoping we wont notice the smell..

Guru
06-08-2012, 07:23 AM
Oh noes, the offensive coordinator didn't badmouth the starting QB. Oh noes.

Of course that is all it is. Doesn't change the fact it is annoying as hell though.

HemiEd
06-08-2012, 07:50 AM
Brady, (Drew) Brees, (Aaron) Rodgers, Peyton Manning, Ben Roethlisberger, Eli (Manning), (Joe) Flacco, (Matt) Ryan, Mark Casshole


One of these things is not like the others, one of these things just does'nt belong.

That was going to be my post, good job.

Fish
06-08-2012, 07:51 AM
Oh noes, the offensive coordinator didn't badmouth the starting QB. Oh noes.

I never expected him to bad mouth the QB. I'm disappointed that they have to have the new OC come out and cherry pick stats in a sad attempt to somehow make it sound like Cassel is an elite QB.

Guru
06-08-2012, 08:01 AM
I never expected him to bad mouth the QB. I'm disappointed that they have to have the new OC come out and cherry pick stats in a sad attempt to somehow make it sound like Cassel is an elite QB.

Not an elite QB. Just a winner. LMAO

He does have a winning attitude.

Chiefnj2
06-08-2012, 08:06 AM
I never expected him to bad mouth the QB. I'm disappointed that they have to have the new OC come out and cherry pick stats in a sad attempt to somehow make it sound like Cassel is an elite QB.

He's supporting his QB. I'm sure it would work wonders if he browbeat the guy to the press.

Fire Me Boy!
06-08-2012, 08:26 AM
<iframe width="640" height="480" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/yiJ9fy1qSFI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

bricks
06-08-2012, 08:26 AM
28-26 is average. Average doesn't equate to a winner.
Average isn't the same league as Brees, Brady, Rogers, Manning, Roethlistberger, etc..

How about he has been on good teams? And he has had all the support in the world. How about he hasn't beaten a playoff team or teams with a winning record. Yeah he is some winner alright. Fuck you Chiefs. Seriously.

Reerun_KC
06-08-2012, 09:00 AM
28-26 is average. Average doesn't equate to a winner.
Average isn't the same league as Brees, Brady, Rogers, Manning, Roethlistberger, etc..

How about he has been on good teams? And he has had all the support in the world. How about he hasn't beaten a playoff team or teams with a winning record. Yeah he is some winner alright. **** you Chiefs. Seriously.

No isnt what championship franchises look for, but in KC its ring of fame worthy...

All Chiefs fans want it 8-8 and make some "noise" in the playoffs.

Messier
06-08-2012, 09:09 AM
He's supporting his QB. I'm sure it would work wonders if he browbeat the guy to the press.

Exactly. Did Daboll call a PC to proclaim Cassel in a hall of famer? or was he asked about him?

To keep getting angry at coaches saying positive things about Cassel is pointless. They are going to have his back because he is the starting QB. If Stanzi were to win the starting QB job, they'd talk about how good Stanzi is. Sure he's cherry picking, those are the only cherries he has to pick. Most of the other cherries are rotten and mushy.

He's using what he's got, Cassel DID QB two 10 plus win teams. It doesn't matter if the competition was bad, or the team around him was great. The coaches aren't going to make a case for Cassel being bad in the public, even if they believe he isn't good. Their job isn't to please the ABC crowd, they have to get the players they have ready, one way to make sure that doesn't happen would be to bash the starting QB in the press.

Count Zarth
06-08-2012, 09:11 AM
Daboll is an idiot.

Remember what Charlie Weis said about Cassel?

There's a man to respect.

Messier
06-08-2012, 09:20 AM
Daboll is an idiot.

Remember what Charlie Weis said about Cassel?

There's a man to respect.

Weis said he was there to fix the QB. I'll bet based on Cassels 2010 he feels he did that.

What should a coach who doesn't get a say in who starts say about his starting QB, when asked directly, what do you think of Matt Cassel?

Count Zarth
06-08-2012, 09:27 AM
Just say something generic that no one will care about.

Don't insult our intelligence.

KC Tattoo
06-08-2012, 09:28 AM
http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t320/ReEnergizer/baghdadbob.jpg

Messier
06-08-2012, 09:32 AM
I'll say it's a mistake to compare Cassel, or any average QB, to great or really good QB's. It does them no favors.

tredadda
06-08-2012, 09:33 AM
One turd polishing another. Nothing serious here. Honestly he was going to say great things about him, I can't imagine Daboll keeping his job long if he were to criticize Cassel to the media. That reflects poorly on the team as it would on any team. Actions speak louder than words though and we will see the kind of support Cassel has during training camp based on if there is any "serious" competition for the starting job or it is all just smoke and mirrors. Unless Stanzi comes on strong it is clear that by bringing in Quinn the Chiefs were never serious about challenging Cassel.

King_Chief_Fan
06-08-2012, 09:41 AM
28-26 is average. Average doesn't equate to a winner.
Average isn't the same league as Brees, Brady, Rogers, Manning, Roethlistberger, etc..

How about he has been on good teams? And he has had all the support in the world. How about he hasn't beaten a playoff team or teams with a winning record. Yeah he is some winner alright. **** you Chiefs. Seriously.

been on a good team? when, in NE?
Hasn't been on one since he has been in KC...and maybe he is the reason they haven't been good, but he isn't the only reason.
Since Cassel arrived, it has been a freak show carnival.
Offensive Coordinator revolving door -
Head case head coach
Worse D coordinator since Grob (got much better after Crennel got here)
2011 with all the play makers on the DL.

This year, Cassel is on a good team. Most if not all pieces to be successful are in place. All the excuses will be gone.

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 09:46 AM
Actions speak louder than words though

This.

And for all of the knowledgeable posters on this board who bash Pioli for "blindly believing in Matt Cassel", im surprised that no one bothers to mention the most obvious piece of evidence to the contrary.

Look at the way the Chiefs are running their offense. They're building a ground and pound team designed to keep the ball out of Cassel's hands.

That alone speaks volumes about what the Chiefs think of Matt Cassel.

Instead, everyone wants to be reactionary and bite into every piece of coach speak thrown out there.

L.A. Chieffan
06-08-2012, 09:51 AM
He's up there with the top guys, most people on here cant see it with there hater glasses on.

Its ok keep hatin haters, Ill be enjoying that 6 and 0 start son!

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 09:59 AM
He's up there with the top guys, most people on here cant see it with there hater glasses on.

Its ok keep hatin haters, Ill be enjoying that 6 and 0 start son!

ROFL you are going to be very disappointed and wrong.

L.A. Chieffan
06-08-2012, 10:04 AM
ROFL you are going to be very disappointed and wrong.

If we start out 6-0 and and Cassel looks like a stud are you going to be disappointed? Because most of the people on here would be, thats how deep theyre hatred of Matt "Pro-Bowl" Cassell is. I think most of the people here aren't even Chiefs fans actually.

vailpass
06-08-2012, 10:07 AM
Brian Daboll

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 10:10 AM
If we start out 6-0 and and Cassel looks like a stud are you going to be disappointed? Because most of the people on here would be, thats how deep theyre hatred of Matt "Pro-Bowl" Cassell is. I think most of the people here aren't even Chiefs fans actually.

no, no! i would be very happy for chiefs fans and hey, i would come back to you and give credit. i just don't see this happening.

i don't hate cassel. i just can't stand watching him play football. his mechanics are the worst of any QB i've ever seen at the NFL level and i've been watching the NFL since the sixties.

L.A. Chieffan
06-08-2012, 10:14 AM
no, no! i would be very happy for chiefs fans and hey, i would come back to you and give credit. i just don't see this happening.

i don't hate cassel. i just can't stand watching him play football. his mechanics are the worst of any QB i've ever seen at the NFL level and i've been watching the NFL since the sixties.

it went pretty much unnoticed on here but cassel has been working with the esteemed tom house this offseason on mechanics. one less thing to gripe about!

KC Tattoo
06-08-2012, 10:16 AM
If we start out 6-0 and and Cassel looks like a stud are you going to be disappointed? Because most of the people on here would be, thats how deep theyre hatred of Matt "Pro-Bowl" Cassell is. I think most of the people here aren't even Chiefs fans actually.

We can go 13-3 win the division but lose in the playoffs I will still hate the Casshole & his mom too.

Pasta Giant Meatball
06-08-2012, 10:16 AM
The fact that some of you take this at face value is absolutely hilarious.

L.A. Chieffan
06-08-2012, 10:17 AM
We can go 13-3 win the division but lose in the playoffs I will still hate the Casshole & his mom too.

and then youll bust out your patriots gear at that point right dude

L.A. Chieffan
06-08-2012, 10:18 AM
The fact that some of you take this at face value is absolutely hilarious.

daboll is a smart guy and he knows cassel is our man

Pawnmower
06-08-2012, 10:18 AM
I couldve told you this years ago.

KC Tattoo
06-08-2012, 10:19 AM
and then youll bust out your patriots gear at that point right dude

shhhya riiiiight. :rolleyes:

Fuck the patriots and there way.

Pasta Giant Meatball
06-08-2012, 10:20 AM
daboll is a smart guy and he knows cassel is our man

Franchise QB

Fish
06-08-2012, 10:20 AM
Here's some additional cherry picked stats for Matt Cassel's amazing 10 win seasons. These are Cassel's ranks in the league for the respective categories:

2008:
Sacks: 1st in the league with 47. (The year before, Brady had 21. The year after, Brady had 16. Hmmm.)
Comp %: 11th
Avg. Yds: 11th
Yds/Gm: 10th
20+ yd pass: 16th. (Brees was first with an additional 29 passes that went 20+ yds)
40+ yd pass: 18th


2010:
Comp %: 26th
Yards: 19th
Avg. Yds: 18th
Yds/Gm: 24th
20+ yd pass: 16th
40+ yd pass: 24th


His 2008 performance wasn't bad, other than his ridiculous sack numbers that should be a huge red flag. But he still barely got into the top 10 in most categories, and this is with the proficient Pats offense, who won 10+ games from 2001 to 2011 every season except 2002, in which they had 9 wins. So the Pats offense was rolling for an entire decade.

His 2010 season was obviously thanks to Jamaal Charles and the Chiefs #1 ranked rushing attack. His stats that year were pretty shitty for a 10 win team. Nothing about Cassel stands out except the way he handed the ball off.

Wins are all that matter. Daboll got that part correct. But lets not act like those 10 win seasons were directly because of the play of Cassel.

L.A. Chieffan
06-08-2012, 10:21 AM
Franchise QB

Pretty much. Just wait til he gets that extension

Setsuna
06-08-2012, 10:22 AM
Pretty much. Just wait til he gets that extension

You're trolling harder than usual. I'm disappointed. Now STFU.

L.A. Chieffan
06-08-2012, 10:23 AM
You're trolling harder than usual. I'm disappointed. Now STFU.

lick my sack non-chiefs fan. gtfo

Setsuna
06-08-2012, 10:48 AM
lick my sack non-chiefs fan. gtfo

:deevee: Die in a fire!

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 11:01 AM
it went pretty much unnoticed on here but cassel has been working with the esteemed tom house this offseason on mechanics. one less thing to gripe about!

well, we did have a mention of this in another thread sometime back. imo when you start working throwing mechanics it takes a season to implement on the field as a player, a season to get up to speed with them and then by the third season, you can put it out there as your own automatically. nobody throws the same, he will need to find his way.

imo matt cassel won't change. if he is to have success, he needs to know his timing and adjust for it. he has never been able to nail guys in WCO style shallow cross plays because of his mechanics. he takes too much time to release the ball. therefore, the OC needs to either turn those plays into timing oriented "hit the spot at the right moment" type plays or not use those plays.

this offense has been a smashmouth run offense mixed with vertical pass plays, skinny post stuff. you need WR's that can fly and bowe is a liability there, he's not fast enough to get behind cover.

over the years this offense has integrated WCO type plays, spread/coryell type plays, etc but it is still a smashmouth base offense that requires a badass RB. so, that's why jamaal charles was not really given a chance early on. we all know charles is worthy of changing the system to compliment the player, because he is that good of a player. they did that, got charles to change his style and well, it was working for the chiefs during 2010.

i don't know what is going to transpire now, there are many areas in question such as berry/JC/moeaki injuries and come backs. there is the NT problem and it would be unfair to expect poe to just come in and dominate, i don't believe this will happen.

but, there is a pass rush prospect here with the chiefs, and this is most important to regular season wins, so it could be they do well this year from pass rush.

but, the middle of both lines is questionable at best and I don't really see them doing a whole lot this season. then you have this thing with bowe and I think he's going to be exposed this year, i think other WR's are going to excel in this offense and bowe is going to fall a bit because as i said, he's not the kind of guy that is a vertical threat and breaston/baldwin are. so, if those two can get something going with cassel -- who btw can air the ball out in a vertical offense (see the vertical play he made with moss against the chiefs after brady was injured), then maybe at some point mid season, the dust that is bowe will settle and those speedy WR's will get more catches etc.

it'll take them about that same amount of time for the middle of the offensive line to get going and to me, that is primary in why I believe the team is going to be 500 going through the first half of this season. having hillis is not enough, they need to block up the middle for him to have consistent success.

so, all in all, i think this season will be another 8 - 8 season or something insignificant to a team that is supposed to have a "pro bowl QB" yet can't seem to get going from that position.

Fire Me Boy!
06-08-2012, 11:05 AM
but, the middle of both lines is questionable at best and I don't really see them doing a whole lot this season. then you have this thing with bowe and I think he's going to be exposed this year, i think other WR's are going to excel in this offense and bowe is going to fall a bit because as i said, he's not the kind of guy that is a vertical threat and breaston/baldwin are. so, if those two can get something going with cassel -- who btw can air the ball out in a vertical offense (see the vertical play he made with moss against the chiefs after brady was injured), then maybe at some point mid season, the dust that is bowe will settle and those speedy WR's will get more catches etc.


http://30.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lujcm8Ee3G1qhpehmo3_500.gif

Have you watched any Chiefs football in the past 3 years? He's way more apt to overthrow/underthrow those long balls.

Chiefnj2
06-08-2012, 11:06 AM
Here's some additional cherry picked stats for Matt Cassel's amazing 10 win seasons. These are Cassel's ranks in the league for the respective categories:

2008:
Sacks: 1st in the league with 47. (The year before, Brady had 21. The year after, Brady had 16. Hmmm.)
Comp %: 11th
Avg. Yds: 11th
Yds/Gm: 10th
20+ yd pass: 16th. (Brees was first with an additional 29 passes that went 20+ yds)
40+ yd pass: 18th


2010:
Comp %: 26th
Yards: 19th
Avg. Yds: 18th
Yds/Gm: 24th
20+ yd pass: 16th
40+ yd pass: 24th


His 2008 performance wasn't bad, other than his ridiculous sack numbers that should be a huge red flag. But he still barely got into the top 10 in most categories, and this is with the proficient Pats offense, who won 10+ games from 2001 to 2011 every season except 2002, in which they had 9 wins. So the Pats offense was rolling for an entire decade.

His 2010 season was obviously thanks to Jamaal Charles and the Chiefs #1 ranked rushing attack. His stats that year were pretty shitty for a 10 win team. Nothing about Cassel stands out except the way he handed the ball off.

Wins are all that matter. Daboll got that part correct. But lets not act like those 10 win seasons were directly because of the play of Cassel.

His numbers with NE were excellent. For a guy that didn't start a game in college and who sat on the bench for a few years in the NFL to come in, even on an excellent team, and put up those numbers is impressive.

In 2010 he had Bowe and Moeaki as receiving threats and that was it. He got both of them the ball. Heck, Bowe had 15 TDs. Moeaki looked decent. Receiving depth was so bad that Pioli and Haley in their wisest judgment brought in a brand spanking new #2 receiver for the playoffs several days before the game.

Maybe with some better receivers and a head coach that isn't insane the guy can finally settle down in the pocket and handle pressure a little better.

Fire Me Boy!
06-08-2012, 11:07 AM
well, we did have a mention of this in another thread sometime back. imo when you start working throwing mechanics it takes a season to implement on the field as a player, a season to get up to speed with them and then by the third season, you can put it out there as your own automatically. nobody throws the same, he will need to find his way.

imo matt cassel won't change. if he is to have success, he needs to know his timing and adjust for it. he has never been able to nail guys in WCO style shallow cross plays because of his mechanics. he takes too much time to release the ball. therefore, the OC needs to either turn those plays into timing oriented "hit the spot at the right moment" type plays or not use those plays.

this offense has been a smashmouth run offense mixed with vertical pass plays, skinny post stuff. you need WR's that can fly and bowe is a liability there, he's not fast enough to get behind cover.

over the years this offense has integrated WCO type plays, spread/coryell type plays, etc but it is still a smashmouth base offense that requires a badass RB. so, that's why jamaal charles was not really given a chance early on. we all know charles is worthy of changing the system to compliment the player, because he is that good of a player. they did that, got charles to change his style and well, it was working for the chiefs during 2010.

i don't know what is going to transpire now, there are many areas in question such as berry/JC/moeaki injuries and come backs. there is the NT problem and it would be unfair to expect poe to just come in and dominate, i don't believe this will happen.

but, there is a pass rush prospect here with the chiefs, and this is most important to regular season wins, so it could be they do well this year from pass rush.

but, the middle of both lines is questionable at best and I don't really see them doing a whole lot this season. then you have this thing with bowe and I think he's going to be exposed this year, i think other WR's are going to excel in this offense and bowe is going to fall a bit because as i said, he's not the kind of guy that is a vertical threat and breaston/baldwin are. so, if those two can get something going with cassel -- who btw can air the ball out in a vertical offense (see the vertical play he made with moss against the chiefs after brady was injured), then maybe at some point mid season, the dust that is bowe will settle and those speedy WR's will get more catches etc.

it'll take them about that same amount of time for the middle of the offensive line to get going and to me, that is primary in why I believe the team is going to be 500 going through the first half of this season. having hillis is not enough, they need to block up the middle for him to have consistent success.

so, all in all, i think this season will be another 8 - 8 season or something insignificant to a team that is supposed to have a "pro bowl QB" yet can't seem to get going from that position.

Also.....

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-kEdLm94xQJY/TVUA9V86zdI/AAAAAAAAALs/qpTllzb2bbc/s1600/press-shift-key-to-disable-autorun.png

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 11:13 AM
but we can certainly compare notes after the season. if you are worth a shit.

notorious
06-08-2012, 11:14 AM
Great, we had an old fuck calling plays last year, now we have a senile fuck calling plays this year.

BoneKrusher
06-08-2012, 11:16 AM
daboll is a smart guy and he knows cassel is our weak kink

fyp

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 11:43 AM
http://30.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lujcm8Ee3G1qhpehmo3_500.gif

Have you watched any Chiefs football in the past 3 years? He's way more apt to overthrow/underthrow those long balls.

ya, that's why i said "bowe is going to be exposed this year" is because it is not obvious to fans like you that bowe is a terrible route runner and has every ****ing excuse for not getting down field, just like his fans do.

bowe has got to go. you watch. if things pan out the way i said, bowe is gone and these new WR's will make cassel look like moss made cassel look. decent.

and don't even come back to me saying i said cassel is not the problem. i will not watch the chiefs until that ****ing queer is on the bench.

both cassel and bowe are ****ing tards. but mostly it is bowe.

here's the play i pointed out -- it is a 35 yard pass to moss, in stride and effortless, so ya, bowe is a liability in cassel's weak game;

http://www.nfl.com/videos/new-england-patriots/09000d5d80a977dc/WK-1-Matt-Cassel-highlights

and oh btw - just because i like you, i will begin typing with proper caps.

RustShack
06-08-2012, 11:45 AM
Matt Cassel will be a winner this year. But only because the rest of the team carries him to the playoffs. He isn't going to lose us games, and that's all he has to do with this team.

durtyrute
06-08-2012, 12:16 PM
ya, that's why i said "bowe is going to be exposed this year" is because it is not obvious to fans like you that bowe is a terrible route runner and has every ****ing excuse for not getting down field, just like his fans do.

bowe has got to go. you watch. if things pan out the way i said, bowe is gone and these new WR's will make cassel look like moss made cassel look. decent.

and don't even come back to me saying i said cassel is not the problem. i will not watch the chiefs until that ****ing queer is on the bench.

both cassel and bowe are ****ing tards. but mostly it is bowe.

here's the play i pointed out -- it is a 35 yard pass to moss, in stride and effortless, so ya, bowe is a liability in cassel's weak game;

http://www.nfl.com/videos/new-england-patriots/09000d5d80a977dc/WK-1-Matt-Cassel-highlights

and oh btw - just because i like you, i will begin typing with proper caps.

That play made me sicker than just about any play evar!!! How the fuck does that happen?

Chocolate Hog
06-08-2012, 12:19 PM
Love threads like these. What do you expect him to say?

Sent from my Nexus S 4G using Tapatalk 2

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 12:24 PM
ya, that's why i said "bowe is going to be exposed this year" is because it is not obvious to fans like you that bowe is a terrible route runner and has every ****ing excuse for not getting down field, just like his fans do.

bowe has got to go. you watch. if things pan out the way i said, bowe is gone and these new WR's will make cassel look like moss made cassel look. decent.

and don't even come back to me saying i said cassel is not the problem. i will not watch the chiefs until that ****ing queer is on the bench.

both cassel and bowe are ****ing tards. but mostly it is bowe.

here's the play i pointed out -- it is a 35 yard pass to moss, in stride and effortless, so ya, bowe is a liability in cassel's weak game;

http://www.nfl.com/videos/new-england-patriots/09000d5d80a977dc/WK-1-Matt-Cassel-highlights

and oh btw - just because i like you, i will begin typing with proper caps.

You go to every game and watch Bowe run routes?

Fire Me Boy!
06-08-2012, 12:36 PM
ya, that's why i said "bowe is going to be exposed this year" is because it is not obvious to fans like you that bowe is a terrible route runner and has every ****ing excuse for not getting down field, just like his fans do.

bowe has got to go. you watch. if things pan out the way i said, bowe is gone and these new WR's will make cassel look like moss made cassel look. decent.

and don't even come back to me saying i said cassel is not the problem. i will not watch the chiefs until that ****ing queer is on the bench.

both cassel and bowe are ****ing tards. but mostly it is bowe.

here's the play i pointed out -- it is a 35 yard pass to moss, in stride and effortless, so ya, bowe is a liability in cassel's weak game;

http://www.nfl.com/videos/new-england-patriots/09000d5d80a977dc/WK-1-Matt-Cassel-highlights

and oh btw - just because i like you, i will begin typing with proper caps.

Dude.... Cassel overthrows and underthrows deep balls way more often than he hits anyone in stride. Your Moss example.... even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 12:50 PM
Dude.... Cassel overthrows and underthrows deep balls way more often than he hits anyone in stride. Your Moss example.... even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while.

Do your homework -- Watch Matt Cassel, Patriots QB and then try to convince yourself. It won't happen.

-King-
06-08-2012, 12:51 PM
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/BpgDtoj73DQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Describes this situation perfectly ROFL

Bowser
06-08-2012, 12:55 PM
Bowser: Daboll is an idiot moran.

Chiefnj2
06-08-2012, 12:58 PM
Do your homework -- Watch Matt Cassel, Patriots QB and then try to convince yourself. It won't happen.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/splits/_/id/8644/year/2008/matt-cassel

Accurate and long ball don't go together when speaking of Cassel.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 12:58 PM
You go to every game and watch Bowe run routes?

I'm a former wideout. You can take my posts however you like, but I have been to a dozen Chiefs games the past few seasons. I watch the wideouts play.

I can tell you Dwayne Bowe takes plays off when he knows the ball is not coming to his side of the field. The list of what Dwayne Bowe does to discourage people like me and his boss, Scott Pioli is a fair list.

As I have said in other threads, fans cannot accurately evaluate WR's unless they actually go out to the games and see it for themselves. The NFL does not allow cameras to show WR action at the snap for a reason. Because if you people did see it from home, you'd turn the shit off.

-King-
06-08-2012, 01:01 PM
I'm a former wideout. You can take my posts however you like, but I have been to a dozen Chiefs games the past few seasons. I watch the wideouts play.

I can tell you Dwayne Bowe takes plays off when he knows the ball is not coming to his side of the field. The list of what Dwayne Bowe does to discourage people like me and his boss, Scott Pioli is a fair list.

As I have said in other threads, fans cannot accurately evaluate WR's unless they actually go out to the games and see it for themselves. The NFL does not allow cameras to show WR action at the snap for a reason. Because if you people did see it from home, you'd turn the shit off.

Oh... so you're the WR version of Tribal Warfare?

JD10367
06-08-2012, 01:04 PM
Hey, Matt! Did you hear your new OC call you a 'winner'?"

http://cache.deadspin.com/assets/images/11/2009/02/medium_mattcassel.jpg

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 01:08 PM
http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/splits/_/id/8644/year/2008/matt-cassel

Accurate and long ball don't go together when speaking of Cassel.

I never said Matt Cassel is an accurate passer, just that his accuracy also depends on whether he is throwing to Randy Moss, Wes Welker etc compared to Dwayne Bowe. It is a very noticable difference in accuracy and completion rates. Go watch the Patriots with Matt Cassel at QB. That is all I have to say to you. Just do yourself the favor and you will stop with that "splits" quotes.

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 01:09 PM
I'm a former wideout. You can take my posts however you like, but I have been to a dozen Chiefs games the past few seasons. I watch the wideouts play.

I can tell you Dwayne Bowe takes plays off when he knows the ball is not coming to his side of the field. The list of what Dwayne Bowe does to discourage people like me and his boss, Scott Pioli is a fair list.

As I have said in other threads, fans cannot accurately evaluate WR's unless they actually go out to the games and see it for themselves. The NFL does not allow cameras to show WR action at the snap for a reason. Because if you people did see it from home, you'd turn the shit off.

Well, apparently Scott Pioli isn't very discouraged at all. And WR taking plays off isn't exactly un common, im sure most of them do.

The NFL doesn't show WR's running routes because, well.....most fans don't give a shit. The Cameras follow the ball. It has very little to do with "WR action"

Bowe's # speak for themselves. He's been a very productive WR, so apparently whatever he IS doing works.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 01:10 PM
Oh... so you're the WR version of Tribal Warfare?

My father used to remind me "if you don't have something intelligent to add, shut up". To bad he wasn't your father too.

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 01:12 PM
I never said Matt Cassel is an accurate passer, just that his accuracy also depends on whether he is throwing to Randy Moss, Wes Welker etc compared to Dwayne Bowe. It is a very noticable difference in accuracy and completion rates. Go watch the Patriots with Matt Cassel at QB. That is all I have to say to you. Just do yourself the favor and you will stop with that "splits" quotes.

So your argument is that if you give him two HoF Wr's and a HoF coach, he becomes a serviceable QB.

Good thing HoF players/coaches grow on trees.

And Yes, Dwayne Bowe is not as good as Randy Moss in his prime. Anything else you'd like to point out?

whoman69
06-08-2012, 01:18 PM
it's a typo, Daboll meant to say Matt Cassel's a wiener.

My guess as well.

-King-
06-08-2012, 01:18 PM
My father used to remind me "if you don't have something intelligent to add, shut up". To bad he wasn't your father too.

Glad he wasn't.

DJJasonp
06-08-2012, 01:22 PM
My thinking is......

Is Cassel's confidence so fragile, that the chiefs PR machine has to continuously kick out these nonsense statements.....so he doesnt get his feelings hurt?

Cause he's gotta be the only guy left on the planet who still believes the propoganda.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 01:33 PM
That play made me sicker than just about any play evar!!! How the **** does that happen?

3rd down, backed up in the opponent's end zone, QB throws from 5 yards back in the paint and completes on the 30yl to a wide open Randy Moss, who outran the coverage.

Answer; No pass rush.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 01:40 PM
Well, apparently Scott Pioli isn't very discouraged at all. And WR taking plays off isn't exactly un common, im sure most of them do.

The NFL doesn't show WR's running routes because, well.....most fans don't give a shit. The Cameras follow the ball. It has very little to do with "WR action"

Bowe's # speak for themselves. He's been a very productive WR, so apparently whatever he IS doing works.

He makes a lot of stats during garbage time. I point this out to you because you don't know it.

What is the point of "routes"? Why do WR's run routes? The answer is most often to get open.

Dwayne Bowe is almost never "open". He most often has a guy on him and catches the ball in spite of cover.

Dwayne Bowe is a poor route runner.

Duh.

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 01:47 PM
He makes a lot of stats during garbage time. I point this out to you because you don't know it.

What is the point of "routes"? Why do WR's run routes? The answer is most often to get open.

Dwayne Bowe is almost never "open". He most often has a guy on him and catches the ball in spite of cover.

Dwayne Bowe is a poor route runner.

Duh.

During Garbage time? Are you kidding me?????

WTF???

:facepalm:

You believe that the #1 WR on this team, who has put 1,000 yard seasons in 4/5 seasons gets his stats in garbage time? Wow.......

And do tell, WR expert, why is it that Dwayne Bowe has guys draped all over him? Could it possibly be, oh, i dont know....that he's the top Target on the team?

Maybe...just Maybe....teams roll coverage towards Dwyane Bowe, considering he's been our only reliable WR over the past 5 years?

The man has produced year after year, with shitstain QB's like Huard, Thigpen, Cassel and Palko.....yet you believe he doesn't know how to run routes.....

JFC...

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 01:53 PM
What is the point of "routes"? Why do WR's run routes? The answer is most often to get open.



I look forward to your next nugget of wisdom....

Fire Me Boy!
06-08-2012, 01:55 PM
Do your homework -- Watch Matt Cassel, Patriots QB and then try to convince yourself. It won't happen.

I have done my homework. I've watched him for the past three years. His first year, he overachieved.

The same thing happened in 2006, the year Damon Huard got the start when Green went down. He played well. Quite well, actually (11 TDs, 1 INT). Everyone thought he was going to be good. In reality, Huard overachieved, as did the players around him. The next year, he sank back to what he really was.

-King-
06-08-2012, 02:10 PM
During Garbage time? Are you kidding me?????

WTF???

:facepalm:

You believe that the #1 WR on this team, who has put 1,000 yard seasons in 4/5 seasons gets his stats in garbage time? Wow.......

And do tell, WR expert, why is it that Dwayne Bowe has guys draped all over him? Could it possibly be, oh, i dont know....that's he's the top Target on the team?

Maybe...just Maybe....teams roll coverage towards Dwyane Bowe, considering he's been our only reliable WR over the past 5 years?

The man has produced year after year, with shitstain QB's like Huard, Thigpen, Cassel and Palko.....yet you believe he doesn't know how to run routes.....

JFC...

Dude it's easy to get 1000 yards every year against NFL defenses even if you don't run correct routes and your qbs throw worse than Steven Hawking....
Posted via Mobile Device

Fish
06-08-2012, 02:13 PM
He makes a lot of stats during garbage time. I point this out to you because you don't know it.

What is the point of "routes"? Why do WR's run routes? The answer is most often to get open.

Dwayne Bowe is almost never "open". He most often has a guy on him and catches the ball in spite of cover.

Dwayne Bowe is a poor route runner.

Duh.

Dude... you're embarrassing yourself.....

Chiefnj2
06-08-2012, 02:14 PM
I never said Matt Cassel is an accurate passer, just that his accuracy also depends on whether he is throwing to Randy Moss, Wes Welker etc compared to Dwayne Bowe. It is a very noticable difference in accuracy and completion rates.

Wrong again.

8 of 38 on 20+ yard passes with the Pats
10 of 45 on 20+ yards in 2010.

That's 21% with the Pats and 22% with KC.

TEX
06-08-2012, 03:07 PM
Dude it's easy to get 1000 yards every year against NFL defenses even if you don't run correct routes and your qbs throw worse than Steven Hawking....
Posted via Mobile Device

:clap: ROFL

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 03:08 PM
Well, once again, I am reminded I am discussing football with Chiefs fans. Carry on ROFL

Marcellus
06-08-2012, 03:14 PM
So, a few months ago, Pioli was pushing the "open competition at quarterback" idea. Now you can see how it's slowly turning into Cassel being the starter no matter what (something many here predicted anyway), with Quinn and Stanzi battling for the second spot.

****ing shit. I bet if we had signed Manning, we'd have put him at second string.

I have never read where Pioli said the QB position would be "open competition". I have read where he said he wanted some competition at the position. There is a huge difference.

Where has he ever said there would be an "open competition"? Please provide the link, I have read that 100 times now but I have never seen where this was stated by Pioli.

I can't really stand Pioli but I can't stand things being quoted as fact that simply aren't accurate either. This "open competition" statement appears to be another CP urban legend unless I have totally missed something.

-King-
06-08-2012, 03:17 PM
Well, once again, I am reminded I am discussing football with Chiefs fans. Carry on ROFL

You realize he'd literally have to have the best hands in football for him to have all these 1000 yard seasons without him getting open?

rico
06-08-2012, 03:20 PM
yeah, i know.
like we said he's just trying to polish a turd, hoping we wont notice the smell..

The most disheartening thing is.......many of the average fans don't notice the smell.

SNR
06-08-2012, 03:22 PM
Well, once again, I am reminded I am discussing football with Chiefs fans. Carry on ROFL

You're arguing something pretty contentious here. This isn't "Matt Cassel sucks".

Give us some video. More stats. Talk about specific in-game situations.

Just saying, "LOL DUMBASS CHIEFS FANS" isn't an argument, retard

whoman69
06-08-2012, 03:32 PM
I have never read where Pioli said the QB position would be "open competition". I have read where he said he wanted some competition at the position. There is a huge difference.

Where has he ever said there would be an "open competition"? Please provide the link, I have read that 100 times now but I have never seen where this was stated by Pioli.

I can't really stand Pioli but I can't stand things being quoted as fact that simply aren't accurate either. This "open competition" statement appears to be another CP urban legend unless I have totally missed something.

Competion/Open Competition. Who cares. He said he wanted to bring in competition at QB and he brings in Quinn. Something doesn't add up. Quinn was never going to be competition for Cassel.

Marcellus
06-08-2012, 03:37 PM
Competion/Open Competition. Who cares. He said he wanted to bring in competition at QB and he brings in Quinn. Something doesn't add up. Quinn was never going to be competition for Cassel.

IMO there is a huge difference between stating you want "competition" at the position and there is going to be "open competition" which is what people keep saying.

Competition may simply imply you want somebody who can push the starter, in this case Casshole. And in this case I think he has that form of competition from 2 guys unlike last year.

An "open competition" implies the starting QB position is open and unsettled. Pioli has stated many times Casshole is the starter.

I like most of CP would love for the starting job to be an open competition, but I don't believe Pioli ever said that was the case.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 03:40 PM
You're arguing something pretty contentious here. This isn't "Matt Cassel sucks".

Give us some video. More stats. Talk about specific in-game situations.

Just saying, "LOL DUMBASS CHIEFS FANS" isn't an argument, retard

Well, I don't argue with idiots. Not to say you or anyone here is one, but instead, to say there are some fans here that act like idiots.

I thought I'd laid out some video, some observations and stats that back up my claims, which are somewhere in the area of "Cassel is never going to amount to anything and neither is Dwayne Bowe, and that is your team's biggest problem". But, as they say, you can lead a horse to water..

My point is, your #1 WR is part of a underachieving passing game, yet all Chiefs fans claim the QB is to blame and Bowe is gonna be great with "Andrew Luck" etc. They don't know that when a young group -- QB & #1 WR get together, the ones that catch fire and do things are equally talented and they feed upon each other's performances.

The point I made about Bowe's routes are not something that can be debated via stats and I also reminded folks who primarily follow Bowe that they do not see what I see because they don't go to the games.

So, it becomes a pissing contest of sorts and I don't really have a lot of interest in that. The one bit of evidence I did point out was something most of you can at least acknowledge, though you don't seem to -- Bowe never gets separation, he's never really open. Instead, he is seen fighting for the ball during about every catch. That is evidence he is not a good route runner. But, alas, nobody disputes, so the conversation turns to garbage.

Tribal Warfare
06-08-2012, 03:45 PM
My thinking is......

Is Cassel's confidence so fragile, that the chiefs PR machine has to continuously kick out these nonsense statements.....so he doesnt get his feelings hurt?

Cause he's gotta be the only guy left on the planet who still believes the propoganda.

This

Bump
06-08-2012, 03:46 PM
we are so fucked

why couldn't we have just sucked for Luck, seriously.

Marcellus
06-08-2012, 03:46 PM
we are so ****ed

why couldn't we have just sucked for Luck, seriously.

Because the players aren't fans?

bricks
06-08-2012, 03:52 PM
been on a good team? when, in NE?
Hasn't been on one since he has been in KC...and maybe he is the reason they haven't been good, but he isn't the only reason.
Since Cassel arrived, it has been a freak show carnival.
Offensive Coordinator revolving door -
Head case head coach
Worse D coordinator since Grob (got much better after Crennel got here)
2011 with all the play makers on the DL.

This year, Cassel is on a good team. Most if not all pieces to be successful are in place. All the excuses will be gone.

Yes the NE team was good and imo so was that 2010 10-6 Chiefs team.

I agree with you in that Chiefs are a good team. They have all the components in place to be successful. They can contend for the division but because of Cassel they will not achieve excellence. He is the reason why they are playoff pretenders and not contenders.

Him not winning a game against playoff teams speaks high volumes of where the Chiefs stand and will be. I expect a possible division title and a 1st round playoff loss.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 03:57 PM
Yes the NE team was good and imo so was that 2010 10-6 Chiefs team.

I agree with you in that Chiefs are a good team. They have all the components in place to be successful. They can contend for the division but because of Cassel they will not achieve excellence. He is the reason why they are playoff pretenders and not contenders.

Him not winning a game against playoff teams speaks high volumes of where the Chiefs stand and will be. I expect a possible division title and a 1st round playoff loss.

Is Cassel the reason Dwayne Bowe never caught a pass during his playoff game? Because I don't think so. I think it was because Dwayne Bowe couldn't get open.

Tribal Warfare
06-08-2012, 04:05 PM
Bowser: Daboll is and idiot moran.

FYP

-King-
06-08-2012, 04:06 PM
Well, I don't argue with idiots. Not to say you or anyone here is one, but instead, to say there are some fans here that act like idiots.

I thought I'd laid out some video, some observations and stats that back up my claims, which are somewhere in the area of "Cassel is never going to amount to anything and neither is Dwayne Bowe, and that is your team's biggest problem". But, as they say, you can lead a horse to water..

My point is, your #1 WR is part of a underachieving passing game, yet all Chiefs fans claim the QB is to blame and Bowe is gonna be great with "Andrew Luck" etc. They don't know that when a young group -- QB & #1 WR get together, the ones that catch fire and do things are equally talented and they feed upon each other's performances.

The point I made about Bowe's routes are not something that can be debated via stats and I also reminded folks who primarily follow Bowe that they do not see what I see because they don't go to the games.

So, it becomes a pissing contest of sorts and I don't really have a lot of interest in that. The one bit of evidence I did point out was something most of you can at least acknowledge, though you don't seem to -- Bowe never gets separation, he's never really open. Instead, he is seen fighting for the ball during about every catch. That is evidence he is not a good route runner. But, alas, nobody disputes, so the conversation turns to garbage.

So basically, he has the best hands in football history huh?

If he has to fight for all of his 81 receptions, then he either has the best hands in the league or cornerbacks allow him to catch the balls.

Which one is it?

-King-
06-08-2012, 04:07 PM
Is Cassel the reason Dwayne Bowe never caught a pass during his playoff game? Because I don't think so. I think it was because Dwayne Bowe couldn't get open.

Nah, it was the fact that Cassel was preoccupied with throwing to the other team.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 04:07 PM
Oh, and before I forget -- I go on record here saying those of you who think Brian Daboll is not a good OC have no idea what you are talking about. He's not Charlie Weis, but he did work with Charlie and he is a good OC.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 04:10 PM
So basically, he has the best hands in football history huh?

If he has to fight for all of his 81 receptions, then he either has the best hands in the league or cornerbacks allow him to catch the balls.

Which one is it?

Tell ya what. Let's just watch what happens to Dwayne Bowe this year. Then we can discuss it as it unfolds.

-King-
06-08-2012, 04:11 PM
Tell ya what. Let's just watch what happens to Dwayne Bowe this year. Then we can discuss it as it unfolds.

Why don't you answer the question?

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 04:14 PM
Why don't you answer the question?

I already did but you don't except it. That's okay. You have your opinions, I have mines. Let's reconvene here in a few months.

Fish
06-08-2012, 04:50 PM
Well, I don't argue with idiots. Not to say you or anyone here is one, but instead, to say there are some fans here that act like idiots.

I thought I'd laid out some video, some observations and stats that back up my claims, which are somewhere in the area of "Cassel is never going to amount to anything and neither is Dwayne Bowe, and that is your team's biggest problem". But, as they say, you can lead a horse to water..

My point is, your #1 WR is part of a underachieving passing game, yet all Chiefs fans claim the QB is to blame and Bowe is gonna be great with "Andrew Luck" etc. They don't know that when a young group -- QB & #1 WR get together, the ones that catch fire and do things are equally talented and they feed upon each other's performances.

The point I made about Bowe's routes are not something that can be debated via stats and I also reminded folks who primarily follow Bowe that they do not see what I see because they don't go to the games.

So, it becomes a pissing contest of sorts and I don't really have a lot of interest in that. The one bit of evidence I did point out was something most of you can at least acknowledge, though you don't seem to -- Bowe never gets separation, he's never really open. Instead, he is seen fighting for the ball during about every catch. That is evidence he is not a good route runner. But, alas, nobody disputes, so the conversation turns to garbage.

Victor Cruz disagrees with your silly criticism of Dwayne Bowe. He had some pretty high praise of Bowe on NFLN the other day during their Top 100 show. And I'm pretty sure his justification was more than "You guys just don't go to the games to watch it in person."

Bowe runs routes just fine. He's 6'2" 221lbs, so he doesn't need perfect separation every time, nor should it be expected. His size advantage and athletic ability far outweigh the need for clear cut separation. Which is why he's consistently put up great numbers with shitty QBs his entire career. He's fighting for separation because he's far and away the best receiver, and teams can and do put more emphasis on defending him. 4 out of 5 1,000 yard seasons with these Chiefs QBs and a Pro Bowl and All-Pro says anything but fundamental WR issues.

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 04:57 PM
Well, I don't argue with idiots. Not to say you or anyone here is one, but instead, to say there are some fans here that act like idiots.

I thought I'd laid out some video, some observations and stats that back up my claims, which are somewhere in the area of "Cassel is never going to amount to anything and neither is Dwayne Bowe, and that is your team's biggest problem". But, as they say, you can lead a horse to water..

My point is, your #1 WR is part of a underachieving passing game, yet all Chiefs fans claim the QB is to blame and Bowe is gonna be great with "Andrew Luck" etc. They don't know that when a young group -- QB & #1 WR get together, the ones that catch fire and do things are equally talented and they feed upon each other's performances.

The point I made about Bowe's routes are not something that can be debated via stats and I also reminded folks who primarily follow Bowe that they do not see what I see because they don't go to the games.

So, it becomes a pissing contest of sorts and I don't really have a lot of interest in that. The one bit of evidence I did point out was something most of you can at least acknowledge, though you don't seem to -- Bowe never gets separation, he's never really open. Instead, he is seen fighting for the ball during about every catch. That is evidence he is not a good route runner. But, alas, nobody disputes, so the conversation turns to garbage.

#1. You act like your smarter than everyone else and that no one here pays attention to football. This isn't arrowhead pride. This is not a board full of homers. I'm well aware that i can't see the routes develop downfield. Neither can you. If you wanna claim that he can't get "open" then back it up.

A simple youtube video disproves that.

#2. you should probably re-define "Open". The basis of your assumption is completely wrong. "NFL OPEN" is NOT wide the **** open. A simple step or two is open in the NFL. Calvin Johnson is constantly battling for position to get the ball, leaping over defenders and making highlight reel catches.

But i guess by your definition he can't get open right?

#3. We're talking about the #1 target on this offense. He gets the D's top defender and teams roll coverage his way, yet he still produces.

HE'S NOT GOING TO GET WIDE THE **** OPEN

Unless the D blows their coverage.

I can SHOW you Bowe with seperation. That simple fact alone disproves your theory.

You don't really have an argument here.

The only thing you have to back up your claim is "i played WR back in HS and i've been to a few games so i know Bowe doesn't get seperation"


And your argument that "stats don't prove he gets seperation" is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. If he didnt get seperation, he wouldnt be open to catch the ball. This isn't rocket science here.

If you're looking for Desean Jackson seperation, then no, he isn't going to get that kind of space.

He does however, get Fitz type-space, or Megatron type space.

Okie_Apparition
06-08-2012, 04:59 PM
Staying open while Matty winds up & approaches the runway is not a piece of cake
rubberband glider

Pasta Giant Meatball
06-08-2012, 04:59 PM
Great, another trollolololol

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 05:01 PM
Staying open while Matty winds up & approaches the runway is not a piece of cake

And that's another thing.

When you watch the replays of some these catches he's making, Bowe was open and often Matty boy is late with the ball. The long ass wind up of his allows defenders to break on Bowe making it look like he didn't get seperation.

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 05:05 PM
Lets Watch this awful Calvin Johnson not get seperation....Looks familiar doesn't it....hrmmm wonder why

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/LAbHFAIzYs8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 05:08 PM
Well that was fun wasn't it? Well lets watch Dwayne Bowe NOT get Seperation...

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/uF-eFl2FiQQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 05:09 PM
Pretty fucking similar videos eh?

Fish
06-08-2012, 05:14 PM
Well that was fun wasn't it? Well lets watch Dwayne Bowe NOT get Seperation...

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/uF-eFl2FiQQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Dumbass couldn't even get separation from the goalpost.... :shake:

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 05:16 PM
And just for shits and grins lets watch Fitz get seperation

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/a0WN9sepc3g" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 05:17 PM
OMFG He has to fight off defenders too! WHAT A FUCKING COINCIDENCE!!

GEE I WONDER WHY THAT COULD POSSIBLY BE???

damn shitty CJ and Fitz can't get seperation....they should be cut...they're awful....really bad.

No WR worth his weight in salt should have to fight off defenders....

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 05:18 PM
We done here now??

Yeah i think we're done here.

NEXT....

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 05:20 PM
Victor Cruz disagrees with your silly criticism of Dwayne Bowe. He had some pretty high praise of Bowe on NFLN the other day during their Top 100 show. And I'm pretty sure his justification was more than "You guys just don't go to the games to watch it in person."

Bowe runs routes just fine. He's 6'2" 221lbs, so he doesn't need perfect separation every time, nor should it be expected. His size advantage and athletic ability far outweigh the need for clear cut separation. Which is why he's consistently put up great numbers with shitty QBs his entire career. He's fighting for separation because he's far and away the best receiver, and teams can and do put more emphasis on defending him. 4 out of 5 1,000 yard seasons with these Chiefs QBs and a Pro Bowl and All-Pro says anything but fundamental WR issues.

hey, that reads well -- except when you go to the playoff game. Bowe was no show. "It means nothing when you have a QB throwing to the other team" could be your take, it is not mine. The Chiefs could not get on the board because their #1 WR & QB din't make any plays.

As for the Victor Cruz ref, he's a class act, not TO. I'd take Cruz over Bowe any day, that dude has a future as an NFL WR. He's "top 100" and Bowe is not.

Do you know why only two teams were interested in Dwayne Bowe a few months ago?

It has much more to do with what I have been writing on this thread all day than anybody else's writings :D

Watch Victor Cruz. Watch the effect he has on his team mates. Ya. He's good. But what he does to his team mates is electric.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/new-york-giants/09000d5d825eedc5/2011-Best-of-Victor-Cruz

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 05:22 PM
hey, that reads well -- except when you go to the playoff game. Bowe was no show. "It means nothing when you have a QB throwing to the other team" could be your take, it is not mine. The Chiefs could not get on the board because their #1 WR & QB din't make any plays.

As for the Victor Cruz ref, he's a class act, not TO. I'd take Cruz over Bowe any day, that dude has a future as an NFL WR. He's "top 100" and Bowe is not.

Do you know why only two teams were interested in Dwayne Bowe a few months ago?

It has much more to do with what I have been writing on this thread all day than anybody else's writings :D

Watch Victor Cruz. Watch the effect he has on his team mates. Ya. He's good. But what he does to his team mates is electric.


http://www.nfl.com/videos/new-york-giants/09000d5d825eedc5/2011-Best-of-Victor-Cruz

Yeah im over you now. You need to re-evaulate what you THINK you know.

You continue to prove how little you know and how much you THINK you know.

TinyEvel
06-08-2012, 05:24 PM
This article hasn't improved my opinion of Matt Cassel as much as it has hurt my opinion of Daboll.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 05:24 PM
#1. You act like your smarter than everyone else and that no one here pays attention to football. This isn't arrowhead pride. This is not a board full of homers. I'm well aware that i can't see the routes develop downfield. Neither can you. If you wanna claim that he can't get "open" then back it up.

A simple youtube video disproves that.

#2. you should probably re-define "Open". The basis of your assumption is completely wrong. "NFL OPEN" is NOT wide the **** open. A simple step or two is open in the NFL. Calvin Johnson is constantly battling for position to get the ball, leaping over defenders and making highlight reel catches.

But i guess by your definition he can't get open right?

#3. We're talking about the #1 target on this offense. He gets the D's top defender and teams roll coverage his way, yet he still produces.

HE'S NOT GOING TO GET WIDE THE **** OPEN

Unless the D blows their coverage.

I can SHOW you Bowe with seperation. That simple fact alone disproves your theory.

You don't really have an argument here.

The only thing you have to back up your claim is "i played WR back in HS and i've been to a few games so i know Bowe doesn't get seperation"


And your argument that "stats don't prove he gets seperation" is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. If he didnt get seperation, he wouldnt be open to catch the ball. This isn't rocket science here.

If you're looking for Desean Jackson seperation, then no, he isn't going to get that kind of space.

He does however, get Fitz type-space, or Megatron type space.

dude, you are just a homer. I like you and all, but Dwayne Bowe is going nowhere in the NFL.

Great Highlight can be found of his cousin too, but that only proves these idiots can beat shitty cover not good cover.

Bowe is a choker, a kid in a man's world.

Easy 6
06-08-2012, 05:25 PM
Tell ya what. Let's just watch what happens to Dwayne Bowe this year. Then we can discuss it as it unfolds.

Agreed, i eagerly await that time, it'll be fun to watch you get your nose rubbed in this shit.

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 05:27 PM
dude, you are just a homer. I like you and all, but Dwayne Bowe is going nowhere in the NFL.

Great Highlight can be found of his cousin too, but that only proves these idiots can beat shitty cover not good cover.

Bowe is a choker, a kid in a man's world.

A HOMER????

ROFL ROFL ROFL

GTFO NOW...just go.....

Bowe isn't gonna make it in the NFL????

ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL

His franchise tag and soon to be fat contract say otherwise.

You're an idiot and you dont know shit.

But yeah, continue thinking you know some football secret that no other sports fan can see....Victor Cruz must be soooo wrong.....as is the rest of the NFL.

Only YOU know the truth, right?


ROFL ROFL ROFL

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 05:28 PM
dude, you are just a homer. I like you and all, but Dwayne Bowe is going nowhere in the NFL.

Great Highlight can be found of his cousin too, but that only proves these idiots can beat shitty cover not good cover.

Bowe is a choker, a kid in a man's world.

You you STILL have yet to say ANYTHING that proves your point....still waiting...

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 05:29 PM
Agreed, i eagerly await that time, it'll be fun to watch you get your nose rubbed in this shit.

hahaha, we shall see.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 05:30 PM
You you STILL have yet to say ANYTHING that proves your point....still waiting...

what is your point :D

Fish
06-08-2012, 05:32 PM
hey, that reads well -- except when you go to the playoff game. Bowe was no show. "It means nothing when you have a QB throwing to the other team" could be your take, it is not mine. The Chiefs could not get on the board because their #1 WR & QB din't make any plays.

As for the Victor Cruz ref, he's a class act, not TO. I'd take Cruz over Bowe any day, that dude has a future as an NFL WR. He's "top 100" and Bowe is not.

Do you know why only two teams were interested in Dwayne Bowe a few months ago?

It has much more to do with what I have been writing on this thread all day than anybody else's writings :D

Watch Victor Cruz. Watch the effect he has on his team mates. Ya. He's good. But what he does to his team mates is electric.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/new-york-giants/09000d5d825eedc5/2011-Best-of-Victor-Cruz

In the playoff game, Cassel had 9 completions for 70 yards and 3 INTs. Are you seriously blaming Bowe for that game? LOL...

What do you mean only 2 teams were interested in Bowe? Don't act like you have any idea what the interests are for 32 professional teams.

What you've been writing in this thread is garbage. And that seems to be the overwhelming opinion.

I don't even want to know what you think Cruz does to his teammates.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 05:32 PM
I'm reading a lot of smack here.

which of you smart pussies wants to put up Dwayne Bowe's illustrious future? :D

Let's see the balls.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 05:33 PM
c'mon big talkers. What is Dwayne Bowe going to do?

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 05:37 PM
chirp chirp

Fish
06-08-2012, 05:41 PM
Predictions are kinda silly when Bowe isn't even part of the team right now.

But Bowe will put up a 1000yd season if he plays.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 05:42 PM
hahahaha. you people are funny.

Fish
06-08-2012, 05:46 PM
It's humorous how you abandoned discussion and went to calling people pussies and challenging bets. That's telling.

-King-
06-08-2012, 05:48 PM
dude, you are just a homer. I like you and all, but Dwayne Bowe is going nowhere in the NFL.

Great Highlight can be found of his cousin too, but that only proves these idiots can beat shitty cover not good cover.

Bowe is a choker, a kid in a man's world.

Yep, WRs that are going nowhere in the NFL get franchised for 9.5 million dollars.


You're about to give knowmo and wickedson a run for their money for the dumbest poster on this board.

Ace Gunner
06-08-2012, 05:48 PM
dude, all you got slated for Bowe is a G and you think you got something for me. Snore. I got to do some things, later.

Okie_Apparition
06-08-2012, 05:49 PM
I haven't got time for the pain

-King-
06-08-2012, 05:49 PM
c'mon big talkers. What is Dwayne Bowe going to do?

You never did answer the question. Do CBs let Bowe catch the ball or does he have the best hands in football? It has to be one of the two if he can't get separation, right?

-King-
06-08-2012, 05:51 PM
dude, all you got slated for Bowe is a G and you think you got something for me. Snore. I got to do some things, later.

Name 10 receivers who had 5000 yards and 36 TDs their first 5 seasons.

KC Tattoo
06-08-2012, 05:55 PM
c'mon big talkers. What is Dwayne Bowe going to do?

He would put up a hell of a lot better numbers with out Cassel at QB. Even with Cassel he is going put over 1,000yds on the field and +10 TDs.

Easy 6
06-08-2012, 05:56 PM
Bowe 2012 - 71cat 1400yds 13td

and lets throw in some crucial, physical blocking by a big WR as a bonus.

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 05:57 PM
alright, as some of you know our shop is currently working on a car for a Pro NFL QB.

Next time i see him, ima ask him what HIS opinion of Dwayne Bowe is since he's seen him in person a few times over the last few seasons.

I'll see how his opinion jives with our resident WR expert.

Detoxing
06-08-2012, 05:58 PM
K, chiefsfootballfan?

We'll put your opinion of Bowe next to a Pro NFL QB's opinion and see if they match.

KC Tattoo
06-08-2012, 05:59 PM
I'm reading a lot of smack here.

which of you smart pussies wants to put up Dwayne Bowe's illustrious future? :D

Let's see the balls.

ok so your the one to chirp now what is your numbers for D Bowe this year? Set the bar low so we can make fun of you er I mean see what you think?

Pasta Giant Meatball
06-08-2012, 06:09 PM
Typo, it was supposed to say wiiner

KC Tattoo
06-08-2012, 06:11 PM
it's a typo, Daboll meant to say Matt Cassel's a wiener.

Typo, it was supposed to say wiener.

Q

Guru
06-08-2012, 06:22 PM
I can't believe I just read the whole thread.

What a waste.

Marcellus
06-08-2012, 06:38 PM
I can't believe I just read the whole thread.

What a waste.

Well your post didn't do anything to spice it up, bring me solutions not problems man.

Guru
06-08-2012, 06:42 PM
Well your post didn't do anything to spice it up, bring me solutions not problems man.

Lets get a new QB to throw to Bowe and put this argument to rest.

One thing is certain. if it were so damn easy to be a 1000 yard receiver everyone would be doing it.

Marcellus
06-08-2012, 06:43 PM
Lets get a new QB to throw to Bowe and put this argument to rest.

One thing is certain. if it were so damn easy to be a 1000 yard receiver everyone would be doing it.

Agree 100%

Pasta Giant Meatball
06-08-2012, 06:44 PM
Lets get a new QB to throw to Bowe and put this argument to rest.

One thing is certain. if it were so damn easy to be a 1000 yard receiver everyone would be doing it.

:clap:

Count Zarth
06-08-2012, 10:37 PM
Do your homework -- Watch Matt Cassel, Patriots QB and then try to convince yourself. It won't happen.

Cassel had one of the worst percentages in the league on deep throws, and throws over 15 yards, as Patriots QB.

Count Zarth
06-08-2012, 10:48 PM
c'mon big talkers. What is Dwayne Bowe going to do?

Why are you such an idiot?

The only reason Cassel had 27 TDs in 2010 is because Bowe caught a bunch of short passes near the goal line or caught balls and ran into the end zone.

And FYI, for all your chirping about Randy Moss, Matt Cassel is the ONE QB who couldn't hook up with him deep consistently.

The Patriots deep passing game was trash that year.

Fritz88
06-08-2012, 11:07 PM
I don't give a shit.
Posted via Mobile Device

Ace Gunner
06-09-2012, 10:38 AM
Cassel had one of the worst percentages in the league on deep throws, and throws over 15 yards, as Patriots QB.

Hey, thanks for coming back to my post. You seem like a real smart football guy. Can you tell me how Tom Brady's first season was compared to Matt Cassel's first season? They were both thrust into the starting position due to injury and were also late round draftees. Ya, because I don't remember seeing Brady throw deep balls very much that first season even though they won the SB. And just for giggles, how about Peyton Manning's first season. Thanks in advance. sincerely, **** you, you stupid stat reading idiot.

milkman
06-09-2012, 11:01 AM
Hey, thanks for coming back to my post. You seem like a real smart football guy. Can you tell me how Tom Brady's first season was compared to Matt Cassel's first season? They were both thrust into the starting position due to injury and were also late round draftees. Ya, because I don't remember seeing Brady throw deep balls very much that first season even though they won the SB. And just for giggles, how about Peyton Manning's first season. Thanks in advance. sincerely, **** you, you stupid stat reading idiot.

I watched all but 2 of the '08 Patriot games.

I can remember seeing about 4 or 5 deep balls that hit the receiver in stride.

Almost every other ball was overthrown, or underthrown, forcing the receiver to slow down or stop to make a play on the ball, giving the DBs the opportunity to recover, in the case of the underthrows.

In the case of Bowe, I've seen him get behind the defense a number of times in the last 3 years, only to see Matt Cassel underthrow the pass.

Rausch
06-09-2012, 11:05 AM
I watched all but 2 of the '08 Patriot games.

I can remember seeing about 4 or 5 deep balls that hit the receiver in stride.

Almost every other ball was overthrown, or underthrown, forcing the receiver to slow down or stop to make a play on the ball, giving the DBs the opportunity to recover, in the case of the underthrows.

In the case of Bowe, I've seen him get behind the defense a number of times in the last 3 years, only to see Matt Cassel underthrow the pass.

I'd argue the man most raped by Casshole's arm is Breaston. Bowe can fight and jump and go after the ball. But there were probably 10 times ol' Steve was wide open but the ball was behind/high/ahead of him because even playing to check-down Casshole is $3it under pressure...

Ace Gunner
06-09-2012, 11:10 AM
Okay, wait a minute -- Are you Wendler? Because if you are, I take that back. But I got to say Wendler, if you are comparing Matt Cassel's first season stats, you need to give context. Give Brady's first year a look and then let's talk about Cassel. You already know I'm no Cassel fan, so don't get your panties in a bunch over this. Cassel did fair his first season, comparatively. It's the seasons afterward that I think he blew. He's never going to get better than 2010. He may have larger stats, but they'll never get significantly better than that season.

As for Dwayne Bowe -- I'm still waiting for a forcast from the Bowe peddlers. He too is never going to do better than that season imo. At least, not a lot better. It's his consistency, his game.

What Dwayne Bowe does is fine, but he's a #1 and it isn't that good, not great anyway.

His technique is to run his route very pedestrian and fight for position on the ball at the end of the route. He is slow in his routes and has no interest in gaining separation, with exception to the end game where he uses the rules and his strength to fight for the ball. That's what a "possession receiver" does, not a #1 WR. That's his game and Pioli knows it, Haley knew it.

The Chiefs do need him this season, but after that, I believe the other WR's will step up into Bowe's position. I believe Jon Baldwin is going to be the #1 starting next year and Dwayne Bowe will either be traded or will be shuffled to the #2 WR position.

I don't think any of you can disprove what I'm predicting, but as I said, have at it. I'd love to see what you've got. So far, you got nothing though. A G is pedestrian for a #1 wideout. BFD people.

Dwayne Bowe is going to be 28 in a few months. He's in the peak of his career. All we have to look forward to is a G? Come on. He's no #1.

milkman
06-09-2012, 11:11 AM
I'd argue the man most raped by Casshole's arm is Breaston. Bowe can fight and jump and go after the ball. But there were probably 10 times ol' Steve was wide open but the ball was behind/high/ahead of him because even playing to check-down Casshole is $3it under pressure...

Every receiver has been fucked by Matty Melt's poor passing, but dumbass' argument here has been that Bowe is unable to get separation.

notorious
06-09-2012, 11:11 AM
Is someone really touting Cassel as a good deep passer?

rocknrolla
06-09-2012, 11:13 AM
Posted via Mobile Device

Rausch
06-09-2012, 11:13 AM
Every receiver has been ****ed by Matty Melt's poor passing, but dumbass' argument here has been that Bowe is unable to get separation.

END OF ARGUMENT: Bowe's job isn't to get separation. It's to fight for the ball and be our version of "Gonzo."

And he does...

Ace Gunner
06-09-2012, 11:17 AM
I watched all but 2 of the '08 Patriot games.

I can remember seeing about 4 or 5 deep balls that hit the receiver in stride.

Almost every other ball was overthrown, or underthrown, forcing the receiver to slow down or stop to make a play on the ball, giving the DBs the opportunity to recover, in the case of the underthrows.

In the case of Bowe, I've seen him get behind the defense a number of times in the last 3 years, only to see Matt Cassel underthrow the pass.

Do you recall Tom Brady's first season? I thought he was shaky at best and that's to be expected from a first year late rounder. I think the same can be said about Cassel. But again, as I said, it was the progress, or lack thereof for Matt Cassel. He just never got better. Not significantly.

Ace Gunner
06-09-2012, 11:18 AM
Every receiver has been ****ed by Matty Melt's poor passing, but dumbass' argument here has been that Bowe is unable to get separation.

okay fartface, what is Dwayne Bowe gonna do now?

ChiefsCountry
06-09-2012, 11:21 AM
Okay, wait a minute -- Are you Wendler? Because if you are, I take that back. But I got to say Wendler, if you are comparing Matt Cassel's first season stats, you need to give context. Give Brady's first year a look and then let's talk about Cassel. You already know I'm no Cassel fan, so don't get your panties in a bunch over this. Cassel did fair his first season, comparatively. It's the seasons afterward that I think he blew. He's never going to get better than 2010. He may have larger stats, but they'll never get significantly better than that season.

As for Dwayne Bowe -- I'm still waiting for a forcast from the Bowe peddlers. He too is never going to do better than that season imo. At least, not a lot better. It's his consistency, his game.

What Dwayne Bowe does is fine, but he's a #1 and it isn't that good, not great anyway.

His technique is to run his route very pedestrian and fight for position on the ball at the end of the route. He is slow in his routes and has no interest in gaining separation, with exception to the end game where he uses the rules and his strength to fight for the ball. That's what a "possession receiver" does, not a #1 WR. That's his game and Pioli knows it, Haley knew it.

The Chiefs do need him this season, but after that, I believe the other WR's will step up into Bowe's position. I believe Jon Baldwin is going to be the #1 starting next year and Dwayne Bowe will either be traded or will be shuffled to the #2 WR position.

I don't think any of you can disprove what I'm predicting, but as I said, have at it. I'd love to see what you've got. So far, you got nothing though. A G is pedestrian for a #1 wideout. BFD people.

Dwayne Bowe is going to be 28 in a few months. He's in the peak of his career. All we have to look forward to is a G? Come on. He's no #1.

I thought Laz was a fucking idiot about Bowe but you sure do take the cake.

milkman
06-09-2012, 11:22 AM
Do you recall Tom Brady's first season? I thought he was shaky at best and that's to be expected from a first year late rounder. I think the same can be said about Cassel. But again, as I said, it was the progress, or lack thereof for Matt Cassel. He just never got better. Not significantly.

75+catches, 1200+yards and 10+TDs.

Ace Gunner
06-09-2012, 11:22 AM
END OF ARGUMENT: Bowe's job isn't to get separation. It's to fight for the ball and be our version of "Gonzo."

And he does...

brilliant. You love having a TE at your #1 WR spot. What a fool.

milkman
06-09-2012, 11:23 AM
BTW, fartface?

What are you?

12 years old?

Ace Gunner
06-09-2012, 11:32 AM
75+catches, 1200+yards and 10+TDs.

and you think that is good from a #1. Not impressed. This is his 6th season as a starter!

It's okay, but he isn't going anywhere with that and neither is his team. That is my point.

He's a good football player, not blessed with speed but has that great size and toughness. He's one of the better blockers in the run game and when he's alert he catches well, fights for the ball, all that stuff you'd expect from a guy built like he is. But, his consistency, his drive, his heart, his desire to win is just not there. He doesn't inspire his team like a #1 WR should, he has no fire. Haley knew it, he helped. We'll just have to see what Bowe does now, but this is his peak now.

The next 3 seasons for Dwayne Bowe are all he's going to be in the NFL.

Ace Gunner
06-09-2012, 11:33 AM
BTW, fartface?

What are you?

12 years old?

you know, you call people names like a 12yo all the time. So, stuff it.

Okie_Apparition
06-09-2012, 11:35 AM
Varied opinions are good stuff

WhiteWhale
06-09-2012, 11:47 AM
Do your homework -- Watch Matt Cassel, Patriots QB and then try to convince yourself. It won't happen.

While with the Patriots Cassel had one of the worst deep passing percentages in the NFL, and his WRs led the NFL in yards after catch.

I said before he even walked on the field that any below average QB could win 10 games with that patriots team. I still believe that's exactly what happened.

milkman
06-09-2012, 11:47 AM
and you think that is good from a #1. Not impressed. This is his 6th season as a starter!

It's okay, but he isn't going anywhere with that and neither is his team. That is my point.

He's a good football player, not blessed with speed but has that great size and toughness. He's one of the better blockers in the run game and when he's alert he catches well, fights for the ball, all that stuff you'd expect from a guy built like he is. But, his consistency, his drive, his heart, his desire to win is just not there. He doesn't inspire his team like a #1 WR should, he has no fire. Haley knew it, he helped. We'll just have to see what Bowe does now, but this is his peak now.

The next 3 seasons for Dwayne Bowe are all he's going to be in the NFL.

Andre Johnson, one of the receivers in the NFL considered among the elite, top 3 in the league, has 2 seasons in his career in which he has surpassed the 1200+yard mark, and only 1 season with that number.

Every other season he has fewer than 1200 yards.

DBowe is in an offense with a limited QB that is going to be a run first team.

1200+yards with this QB, in this offense, will be an outstanding number.

you know, you call people names like a 12yo all the time. So, stuff it.

I call people names like "dumbass", and "idiot".
I call their intelligence, or lack of, into question.

I don't call them names that 12 year olds find funny.

That's the difference here, dumbass.

milkman
06-09-2012, 11:50 AM
Can someone remind me what numbers the "Cassel 3:16" references?

Ace Gunner
06-09-2012, 11:52 AM
So, Andre Johnson is no better than Dwayne Bowe. That is dumbassery that is unparalleled on this site.

Thank you for letting me in on the secrets that make Chiefs fans the most gullible idiots in pro football.

Pasta Giant Meatball
06-09-2012, 12:04 PM
Let's rip on one of the better players on the team. BRILLIANT!!!! The team's roster is pretty good, but there's still turds for you Debbie Downers to fish out of the bowl.

milkman
06-09-2012, 12:08 PM
So, Andre Johnson is no better than Dwayne Bowe. That is dumbassery that is unparalleled on this site.

Thank you for letting me in on the secrets that make Chiefs fans the most gullible idiots in pro football.

Do you have any kind of fucking clue?

Let me see if I understand what you are saying here.

Just about every expert out there has Andre Johnson as one of the top 3 receivers in the game.

There isn't a single expert that rates him lower than the top 5.

Yet, in your infinite wisdom, gained from your experience as WR in high school (let me guess, backup at a small school that could only field an 8 man team), he is no better than Dwayne Bowe, who you think is essentially a JAG.

Wow.

Just wow.

My mind is bottled.

Ace Gunner
06-09-2012, 12:08 PM
While with the Patriots Cassel had one of the worst deep passing percentages in the NFL, and his WRs led the NFL in yards after catch.

I said before he even walked on the field that any below average QB could win 10 games with that patriots team. I still believe that's exactly what happened.

Yes, I agree. I also say this is what got the Tom Brady Pats their first SB.

But the point I'm trying to at least discuss here, is that the Chiefs don't even compare with Cassel and though Cassel isn't going to do anything significant in the NFL, the Chiefs should at least make him look decent. They did during 2010, but last year they flopped because Dwayne Bowe was never the "engine" of 2010, though many Chiefs fans want people to believe he was.

Kyle Orton comes in here and shows us what this team can be with a decent pro quality QB at the helm. He and the defense smoked the world champs for their only loss last season.

If Dwayne Bowe makes that elementary catch in the end zone against the Raiders, it would have been a different game, perhaps even a different season for the Chiefs. It would have meant Dwayne Bowe can do what a #1 WR can do -- WIN. But alas, Bowe drops the easy one and the next play Orton throws the pick. It really cannot be clearer to football fans, yet I still have a shit ton of Chiefs fans here attacking me for stating the obvious.

Jamaal Charles is an amazing football player. Dwayne Bowe could have been too, but he just doesn't have "it" and this is not even close. Chiefs fans need to come to terms and look at Bowe for what he is. Bowe is an underachieving lazy minded punk. He needs to go if y'all want to win a championship. He at least needs to siddown and let these other WR's get going. I think Jon Baldwin is your man. He's got all that talent and he plays to win. It will take him a bit more time now, but this season I expect Baldwin to light it up. Just wait and see.

BoneKrusher
06-09-2012, 12:08 PM
Matt Cassel's Nickname should be

Three N Out

or

Oscar Meyer

ChiefsCountry
06-09-2012, 12:13 PM
Yes, I agree. I also say this is what got the Tom Brady Pats their first SB.

But the point I'm trying to at least discuss here, is that the Chiefs don't even compare with Cassel and though Cassel isn't going to do anything significant in the NFL, the Chiefs should at least make him look decent. They did during 2010, but last year they flopped because Dwayne Bowe was never the "engine" of 2010, though many Chiefs fans want people to believe he was.

Kyle Orton comes in here and shows us what this team can be with a decent pro quality QB at the helm. He and the defense smoked the world champs for their only loss last season.

If Dwayne Bowe makes that elementary catch in the end zone against the Raiders, it would have been a different game, perhaps even a different season for the Chiefs. It would have meant Dwayne Bowe can do what a #1 WR can do -- WIN. But alas, Bowe drops the easy one and the next play Orton throws the pick. It really cannot be clearer to football fans, yet I still have a shit ton of Chiefs fans here attacking me for stating the obvious.

Jamaal Charles is an amazing football player. Dwayne Bowe could have been too, but he just doesn't have "it" and this is not even close. Chiefs fans need to come to terms and look at Bowe for what he is. Bowe is an underachieving lazy minded punk. He needs to go if y'all want to win a championship. He at least needs to siddown and let these other WR's get going. I think Jon Baldwin is your man. He's got all that talent and he plays to win. It will take him a bit more time now, but this season I expect Baldwin to light it up. Just wait and see.

What a fucking clown.

Ace Gunner
06-09-2012, 12:14 PM
Do you have any kind of ****ing clue?

Let me see if I understand what you are saying here.

Just about every expert out there has Andre Johnson as one of the top 3 receivers in the game.

There isn't a single expert that rates him lower than the top 5.

Yet, in your infinite wisdom, gained from your experience as WR in high school (let me guess, backup at a small school that could only field an 8 man team), he is no better than Dwayne Bowe, who you think is essentially a JAG.

Wow.

Just wow.

My mind is bottled.

those were your words buddy, not mine. I would never compare Andre Johnson to Dwayne Bowe. You did and I paraphrased it. Do you know what "paraphrased" means. Google it.

milkman
06-09-2012, 12:14 PM
Yes, I agree. I also say this is what got the Tom Brady Pats their first SB.

But the point I'm trying to at least discuss here, is that the Chiefs don't even compare with Cassel and though Cassel isn't going to do anything significant in the NFL, the Chiefs should at least make him look decent. They did during 2010, but last year they flopped because Dwayne Bowe was never the "engine" of 2010, though many Chiefs fans want people to believe he was.

Kyle Orton comes in here and shows us what this team can be with a decent pro quality QB at the helm. He and the defense smoked the world champs for their only loss last season.

If Dwayne Bowe makes that elementary catch in the end zone against the Raiders, it would have been a different game, perhaps even a different season for the Chiefs. It would have meant Dwayne Bowe can do what a #1 WR can do -- WIN. But alas, Bowe drops the easy one and the next play Orton throws the pick. It really cannot be clearer to football fans, yet I still have a shit ton of Chiefs fans here attacking me for stating the obvious.

Jamaal Charles is an amazing football player. Dwayne Bowe could have been too, but he just doesn't have "it" and this is not even close. Chiefs fans need to come to terms and look at Bowe for what he is. Bowe is an underachieving lazy minded punk. He needs to go if y'all want to win a championship. He at least needs to siddown and let these other WR's get going. I think Jon Baldwin is your man. He's got all that talent and he plays to win. It will take him a bit more time now, but this season I expect Baldwin to light it up. Just wait and see.

If the Packer receivers don't drop about 6 or 7 balls in that game against the Chiefs, including Greg Jennings, that would have been a different game.

Almost every receiver drops passes.

Guys like Greg Jennings and Roddy White have a higher percentage of drops than Bowe.

BigChiefFan
06-09-2012, 12:17 PM
Orton had ZERO TDs against the Packers.

milkman
06-09-2012, 12:19 PM
those were your words buddy, not mine. I would never compare Andre Johnson to Dwayne Bowe. You did and I paraphrased it. Do you know what "paraphrased" means. Google it.

Does your mother still have to tie your shoes for you?

I mean, good god, how can anyone be this fucking stupid, and manage to find the brain cells to crawl out of bed without falling on their ass?

I didn't compare Andre Johnson and Dwayne Bowe.

I used Andre Johnson's numbers to illustrate what a stupid useless fuck you are.

By your standards, you fucking moron, 1200+yards is not impressive.

JFC, it's like arguing with a fucking amoeba.

Pasta Giant Meatball
06-09-2012, 12:26 PM
It's like Wienerson on speed

Ace Gunner
06-09-2012, 12:39 PM
Does your mother still have to tie your shoes for you?

I mean, good god, how can anyone be this ****ing stupid, and manage to find the brain cells to crawl out of bed without falling on their ass?

I didn't compare Andre Johnson and Dwayne Bowe.

I used Andre Johnson's numbers to illustrate what a stupid useless **** you are.

By your standards, you ****ing moron, 1200+yards is not impressive.

JFC, it's like arguing with a ****ing amoeba.

thank you for the laughs :D

Pasta Giant Meatball
06-09-2012, 12:41 PM
This is like watching Muhammed Ali vs. Screech Powers

NWTF
06-09-2012, 01:06 PM
The Chiefs will probably squeak into the playoffs by edging out the rest of the West for the division.

Cassel will be the biggest reason they dont advance.

whoman69
06-09-2012, 04:34 PM
Yes, I agree. I also say this is what got the Tom Brady Pats their first SB.

But the point I'm trying to at least discuss here, is that the Chiefs don't even compare with Cassel and though Cassel isn't going to do anything significant in the NFL, the Chiefs should at least make him look decent. They did during 2010, but last year they flopped because Dwayne Bowe was never the "engine" of 2010, though many Chiefs fans want people to believe he was.

Kyle Orton comes in here and shows us what this team can be with a decent pro quality QB at the helm. He and the defense smoked the world champs for their only loss last season.

If Dwayne Bowe makes that elementary catch in the end zone against the Raiders, it would have been a different game, perhaps even a different season for the Chiefs. It would have meant Dwayne Bowe can do what a #1 WR can do -- WIN. But alas, Bowe drops the easy one and the next play Orton throws the pick. It really cannot be clearer to football fans, yet I still have a shit ton of Chiefs fans here attacking me for stating the obvious.

Jamaal Charles is an amazing football player. Dwayne Bowe could have been too, but he just doesn't have "it" and this is not even close. Chiefs fans need to come to terms and look at Bowe for what he is. Bowe is an underachieving lazy minded punk. He needs to go if y'all want to win a championship. He at least needs to siddown and let these other WR's get going. I think Jon Baldwin is your man. He's got all that talent and he plays to win. It will take him a bit more time now, but this season I expect Baldwin to light it up. Just wait and see.

Dwayne Bow is the best receiver the Chiefs have had since the days of Otis Taylor. He does drop too many passes, and he is not going to be able to get Randy Moss separation, but not too many can. I would also say that many of his "official" drops were poorly thrown balls that he made a play on but couldn't grab. That's what killed me was when the media gave Cassel excuses for dropped balls when in reality they were poorly thrown passes, usually behind and low to the receiver.

Keep in mind that Orton threw that interception when Baldwin was open on a blown coverage. Orton didn't see him. IMO, he is an upgrade from Cassel, but not a lot. He can get the team from 20 to 20, but not the endzone.

We saw in the Denver game just how good Bowe was. With him our offense was clicking. When he went down, we struggled mightily.

BossChief
06-09-2012, 04:39 PM
Can someone remind me what numbers the "Cassel 3:16" references?

Coogs posted a bunch of stats on Cassel and one was that in games that we threw more than pass, we have 3 wins and 16 losses.

I just connected the dots and called it Cassel 3:16 and it caught on.

whoman69
06-09-2012, 05:59 PM
Coogs posted a bunch of stats on Cassel and one was that in games that we threw more than run, we have 3 wins and 16 losses.

I just connected the dots and called it Cassel 3:16 and it caught on.

Help you out. FYP.

Coogs
06-09-2012, 07:14 PM
Coogs posted a bunch of stats on Cassel and one was that in games that we threw more than pass, we have 3 wins and 16 losses.

I just connected the dots and called it Cassel 3:16 and it caught on.

Milkman,

Here is the whole ball of wax...


Matt Cassel has 40 career starts here in KC including the playoffs. His overall record in those 40 games is 18-22.

He is 14-6 in games where the team rushed the ball more times than we passed it.

He is 1-0 in games when the rushes and passes were equal. That game was the Rivers fumbled sanp game this past season.

And he is 3-16 in games where he put the ball in the air more times than we ran the balll. The 3 wins were... Oakland and Pittsburgh in 2009, and Minnesota this past season. Not one time during the 2010 season did we pass the ball more than we ran it in any of his 10 wins.


EDIT: Another interesting stat from the 2010 season is this... During those 10 wins, we averaged 39 carries for right at 197 yards per game. AVERAGED. And a side note to those numbers... the Broncos ran the ball 40 times a game for 182 yards per game in the 8 games they won with Tebow as their starter. Are Tebow and Cassel different players? You bet! But at the same time, they a pretty damn similar.

KC Tattoo
06-09-2012, 07:55 PM
Milkman,

Here is the whole ball of wax...


Matt Cassel has 40 career starts here in KC including the playoffs. His overall record in those 40 games is 18-22.

He is 14-6 in games where the team rushed the ball more times than we passed it.

He is 1-0 in games when the rushes and passes were equal. That game was the Rivers fumbled sanp game this past season.

And he is 3-16 in games where he put the ball in the air more times than we ran the balll. The 3 wins were... Oakland and Pittsburgh in 2009, and Minnesota this past season. Not one time during the 2010 season did we pass the ball more than we ran it in any of his 10 wins.


EDIT: Another interesting stat from the 2010 season is this... During those 10 wins, we averaged 39 carries for right at 197 yards per game. AVERAGED. And a side note to those numbers... the Broncos ran the ball 40 times a game for 182 yards per game in the 8 games they won with Tebow as their starter. Are Tebow and Cassel different players? You bet! But at the same time, they a pretty damn similar.

I'd like this bit of information to find it's way to Clark Hunt. Maybe in the form of a thousand letters sent via post office.

BossChief
06-09-2012, 08:57 PM
Milkman,

Here is the whole ball of wax...


Matt Cassel has 40 career starts here in KC including the playoffs. His overall record in those 40 games is 18-22.

He is 14-6 in games where the team rushed the ball more times than we passed it.

He is 1-0 in games when the rushes and passes were equal. That game was the Rivers fumbled sanp game this past season.

And he is 3-16 in games where he put the ball in the air more times than we

ran the balll. The 3 wins were... Oakland and Pittsburgh in 2009, and Minnesota this past season. Not one time during the 2010 season did we pass the ball more than we ran it in any of his 10 wins.


EDIT: Another interesting stat from the 2010 season is this... During those 10 wins, we averaged 39 carries for right at 197 yards per game. AVERAGED. And a side note to those numbers... the Broncos ran the ball 40 times a game for 182 yards per game in the 8 games they won with Tebow as their starter. Are Tebow and Cassel different players? You bet! But at the same time, they a pretty damn similar.

this post should be copy/pasted and sent to every media member in NLT oy KC, but also sent to Jamie Dukes and Mark Schlereth.

One of them would run with it.

Coogs
06-09-2012, 09:04 PM
this post should be copy/pasted and sent to every media member in NLT oy KC, but also sent to Jamie Dukes and Mark Schlereth.

One of them would run with it.

Send away. I have sent the 3-16 stuff to Jack Harry, the Thorman's at ArrowheadPride, and to Sam Mellinger in won of his "chats".

Send it out as much as possible.

I would love to see Cassel 3:16 signs in visible spots at the 2 pre-season games and at the home opener against Atlanta. Surely people would start to ask what that was about.

NWTF
06-09-2012, 09:57 PM
Milkman,

Here is the whole ball of wax...


Matt Cassel has 40 career starts here in KC including the playoffs. His overall record in those 40 games is 18-22.

He is 14-6 in games where the team rushed the ball more times than we passed it.

He is 1-0 in games when the rushes and passes were equal. That game was the Rivers fumbled sanp game this past season.

And he is 3-16 in games where he put the ball in the air more times than we ran the balll. The 3 wins were... Oakland and Pittsburgh in 2009, and Minnesota this past season. Not one time during the 2010 season did we pass the ball more than we ran it in any of his 10 wins.


EDIT: Another interesting stat from the 2010 season is this... During those 10 wins, we averaged 39 carries for right at 197 yards per game. AVERAGED. And a side note to those numbers... the Broncos ran the ball 40 times a game for 182 yards per game in the 8 games they won with Tebow as their starter. Are Tebow and Cassel different players? You bet! But at the same time, they a pretty damn similar.

Wow those are damning numbers for anyone who still believes Cassel is a legit starting QB.

Another thing I never realized was the AVERAGE rushing ypg for 2010 was 197. Hell what QB couldnt manage 10 wins with that production.

Count Zarth
06-09-2012, 10:07 PM
Tweeted that out and posted it on my FB. I have a lot of Chiefs media on my twitter and 1500 Chiefs fans on FB.

Spread the word, the crusade is afoot.

BigMeatballDave
06-09-2012, 11:31 PM
Dwayne Bowe could have been too, but he just doesn't have "it" and this is not even close. Chiefs fans need to come to terms and look at Bowe for what he is. Bowe is an underachieving lazy minded punk. He needs to go if y'all want to win a championship. He at least needs to siddown and let these other WR's get going.You're either a troll or a drooling retard.
Which is it?

BigMeatballDave
06-09-2012, 11:50 PM
and you think that is good from a #1. Not impressed. This is his 6th season as a starter!

It's okay, but he isn't going anywhere with that and neither is his team. That is my point.

Did you know that Calvin Johnson averages 1174 yards per season?

SNR
06-09-2012, 11:57 PM
Tweeted that out and posted it on my FB. I have a lot of Chiefs media on my twitter and 1500 Chiefs fans on FB.

Spread the word, the crusade is afoot.I saw that. Some of your fans are as meat-headed as Barry when it comes to true fanism

aturnis
06-10-2012, 12:43 AM
Yes, I agree. I also say this is what got the Tom Brady Pats their first SB.
.

Are you that fucking stupid? The talent on the Pats first SB roster was pedestrian compared to the roster Cassel played with. Palko literally could have done what Cassel did that year. You regularly cement yourself as one of the season ngle biggest idiots on this board.

Also, I think you're the one who needs to look up the meaning of the word paraphrasing. It doesn't mean to completely twist someones words into absolute bullshit

Ace Gunner
06-10-2012, 07:21 AM
hahahaha. Calvin Johnson, now. Andre Johnson and Calvin Johnson. you idiots are entertaining. Dwayne Bowe is not in Calvin Johnson's league either.

Bowe is gone kiddies. The Chiefs are going to trade Dwayne Bowe for a bag of peanuts ASAP.

CJ has posted double digit scores in 3 of his 6 seasons, and he's 2 years younger than "I got it, oh" Bowe. CJ is an all - pro and 2 time pro bowler.

hahaha. you guys are too funny.

Ace Gunner
06-10-2012, 07:32 AM
Are you that ****ing stupid? The talent on the Pats first SB roster was pedestrian compared to the roster Cassel played with. Palko literally could have done what Cassel did that year. You regularly cement yourself as one of the season ngle biggest idiots on this board.

Also, I think you're the one who needs to look up the meaning of the word paraphrasing. It doesn't mean to completely twist someones words into absolute bullshit

thanks for coming in, here. your post was especially hilarious :D

-King-
06-10-2012, 07:40 AM
hahahaha. Calvin Johnson, now. Andre Johnson and Calvin Johnson. you idiots are entertaining. Dwayne Bowe is not in Calvin Johnson's league either.

Bowe is gone kiddies. The Chiefs are going to trade Dwayne Bowe for a bag of peanuts ASAP.

CJ has posted double digit scores in 3 of his 6 seasons, and he's 2 years younger than "I got it, oh" Bowe. CJ is an all - pro and 2 time pro bowler.

hahaha. you guys are too funny.
So Bowe is going to be traded when he isn't even under contract? Man you're a brilliant football mind.
Posted via Mobile Device

-King-
06-10-2012, 07:43 AM
Are you that fucking stupid? The talent on the Pats first SB roster was pedestrian compared to the roster Cassel played with. Palko literally could have done what Cassel did that year. You regularly cement yourself as one of the season ngle biggest idiots on this board.

Also, I think you're the one who needs to look up the meaning of the word paraphrasing. It doesn't mean to completely twist someones words into absolute bullshit

Lets not go overboard. Cassel at least deserves to be in the league. Palko shouldn't even be on a div 3 school.
Posted via Mobile Device

Ace Gunner
06-10-2012, 08:03 AM
and, Calvin Johnson has been playing along with a carousel of garbage QB's too;

Jon Kitna
Drew Stanton
Shaun Hill
Matt Stafford
Daunte Culpepper

So, tell me about how Bowe has "suffered through badf QB's" hahaha.

Bullshit.

Andre Johnson is a 6 time pro bowler with 2 all pro seasons on a franchise that hasn't even been in the NFL for a decade. His QB's have been David Carr & Matt Schaub.

But please -- keep those excuses coming folks. It is humor you just cannot get anywhere else on the www :D

Coogs
06-10-2012, 08:11 AM
Wow those are damning numbers for anyone who still believes Cassel is a legit starting QB.

Another thing I never realized was the AVERAGE rushing ypg for 2010 was 197. Hell what QB couldnt manage 10 wins with that production.

That average was only in the 10 games we won. As were the 39 carries per game.

Coogs
06-10-2012, 08:26 AM
And one of the things with the Cassel 3:16 stat...

Yes there were games where we were behind and had to throw the ball more. The Denver game where we were behind 35-0 for example when Cassel threw for 400 yards and 4 TD's.


But the thing is, this is a passing league. Even though I do not know this for a fact, I believe I have read something along the lines of a 60/40 pass to run ratio is the desired balance between the two.

If we operate at that 60/40 ratio... chances are strong we don't win based off of the data that is in on Cassel's career with the Chiefs.

milkman
06-10-2012, 08:45 AM
And one of the things with the Cassel 3:16 stat...

Yes there were games where we were behind and had to throw the ball more. The Denver game where we were behind 35-0 for example when Cassel threw for 400 yards and 4 TD's.


But the thing is, this is a passing league. Even though I do not know this for a fact, I believe I have read something along the lines of a 60/40 pass to run ratio is the desired balance between the two.

If we operate at that 60/40 ratio... chances are strong we don't win based off of the data that is in on Cassel's career with the Chiefs.

Those are pretty damning numbers, but to me, the more damning number is the fact that in 39 games as a starter, he has 1 win against teams that had 10 or more wins, against the Dolphins in '08, who finished 11-5 and won the AFC East.

-King-
06-10-2012, 08:46 AM
and, Calvin Johnson has been playing along with a carousel of garbage QB's too;

Jon Kitna
Drew Stanton
Shaun Hill
Matt Stafford
Daunte Culpepper

So, tell me about how Bowe has "suffered through badf QB's" hahaha.

Bullshit.

Andre Johnson is a 6 time pro bowler with 2 all pro seasons on a franchise that hasn't even been in the NFL for a decade. His QB's have been David Carr & Matt Schaub.

But please -- keep those excuses coming folks. It is humor you just cannot get anywhere else on the www :D

Who's comparing Bowe to CJ? Idiot.
Posted via Mobile Device

Coogs
06-10-2012, 08:49 AM
Those are pretty damning numbers, but to me, the more damning number is the fact that in 39 games as a starter, he has 1 win against teams that had 10 or more wins, against the Dolphins in '08, who finished 11-5 and won the AFC East.

He has had 40 career starts at KC including the playoffs... which makes your number even more skewed since you are including 2008 which is when he was with NE.

Ace Gunner
06-10-2012, 08:53 AM
Who's comparing Bowe to CJ? Idiot.
Posted via Mobile Device

Oh, I see. I have stumbled upon the KING! Well, King, what is Dwayne Bowe going to do? Let's hear it for THE KING!!!1!! :D

-King-
06-10-2012, 09:00 AM
Oh, I see. I have stumbled upon the KING! Well, King, what is Dwayne Bowe going to do? Let's hear it for THE KING!!!1!! :D

1200+ yards 7+ touchdowns.


Once again I ask, does Boer have the best hands in the league? 81 catches with him "never open" would indicate.
Posted via Mobile Device

Ace Gunner
06-10-2012, 09:26 AM
Again, I say Dwayne Bowe is nothing, he will never be anything in the NFL. He is an underachieving sniveling weak ass punk.

But my question has never been answered by you asswipes -- What is Dwayne Bowe going to do in the NFL? Not "one season" yo-yo's.

What is Dwayne Bowe going to do for his team? Is Dwayne Bowe going to lead his team to a championship? Several championships? Is he going to the HOF? Is he going to be a LMVP? TMVP? Is he going to be remembered as a leader?

What is Dwayne Bowe going to do? In the NFL?

I say he will never do better than 2010 overall. Any nitwit can post a G as a #1 WR in today's NFL, especially. But a #1 wideout that can inspire, well, that is a different kind of player. That is what a good #1 WR will do for your football team. Dwayne Bowe will never be that to his team. He never has, never will.

Sure, he is the best wideout the lowly Chiefs have had since the days of Otis Taylor. I am old enough to know this, the rest of you nitwits weren't even a polywog in dad's nutbag when this was happening. So, please, spare me the details in which you have no ****ing clue other than second hand info from folks like me.

So, again I ask -- and I have made the question crystal clear to you anklebiters -- What will Dwayne Bowe do? What will Bowe's career amount to?

Thank you for your dumbassery in advance, knuckleheads.

Pasta Giant Meatball
06-10-2012, 09:31 AM
He's trolling away. Set an open course for his virgin ass....

Marcellus
06-10-2012, 09:31 AM
Man this thread got side tracked.

As far as the OP is concerned, of course Daboll is going to say he thinks Matty is a winner. He has been likely told Cassel is the starter, make him better.

What is he going to do, start out by bashing him in the media?

People take coach speak way too seriously.

Ace Gunner
06-10-2012, 09:39 AM
He's trolling away. Set an open course for his virgin ass....

Wow, you gave it all you got :D

milkman
06-10-2012, 09:39 AM
Again, I say Dwayne Bowe is nothing, he will never be anything in the NFL. He is an underachieving sniveling weak ass punk.

But my question has never been answered by you asswipes -- What is Dwayne Bowe going to do in the NFL? Not "one season" yo-yo's.

What is Dwayne Bowe going to do for his team? Is Dwayne Bowe going to lead his team to a championship? Several championships? Is he going to the HOF? Is he going to be a LMVP? TMVP? Is he going to be remembered as a leader?

What is Dwayne Bowe going to do? In the NFL?

I say he will never do better than 2010 overall. Any nitwit can post a G as a #1 WR in today's NFL, especially. But a #1 wideout that can inspire, well, that is a different kind of player. That is what a good #1 WR will do for your football team. Dwayne Bowe will never be that to his team. He never has, never will.

Sure, he is the best wideout the lowly Chiefs have had since the days of Otis Taylor. I am old enough to know this, the rest of you nitwits weren't even a polywog in dad's nutbag when this was happening. So, please, spare me the details in which you have no ****ing clue other than second hand info from folks like me.

So, again I ask -- and I have made the question crystal clear to you anklebiters -- What will Dwayne Bowe do? What will Bowe's career amount to?

Thank you for your dumbassery in advance, knuckleheads.

Please, name for us all the WRs that have ever been named League MVPs.

wazu
06-10-2012, 09:39 AM
And just like that, I'm already on the "fire Daboll" bandwagon.

Ace Gunner
06-10-2012, 09:41 AM
Man this thread got side tracked.

As far as the OP is concerned, of course Daboll is going to say he thinks Matty is a winner. He has been likely told Cassel is the starter, make him better.

What is he going to do, start out by bashing him in the media?

People take coach speak way too seriously.

Yes! Yes! Side tracked! Of course! What does the #1 WR have to do with the passing game? :D

Ace Gunner
06-10-2012, 09:41 AM
Please, name for us all the WRs that have ever been named League MVPs.

Heh, nice.

milkman
06-10-2012, 09:49 AM
Heh, nice.

Never heard of that guy.

Again, I ask you, tell us all the WRs that have ever been named league MVP.

Coogs
06-10-2012, 09:54 AM
Yes! Yes! Side tracked! Of course! What does the #1 WR have to do with the passing game? :D

Not nearly as much as the QB, but nice try.

BossChief
06-10-2012, 09:54 AM
Chiefsfootballfan wasn't even a chiefs fan till 5 years ago and his takes on Bowe are flat out terrible.

Ace Gunner
06-10-2012, 10:01 AM
Never heard of that guy.

Again, I ask you, tell us all the WRs that have ever been named league MVP.

more hyperbole from the site puppet master.

He's a loser Milkman. The Chiefs lose because he's a loser. He is a large part of the offensive problem here. If you don't know that now, you will soon enough.

I got to get on with some chores now. Catch you later.

WhiteWhale
06-10-2012, 10:03 AM
Again, I say Dwayne Bowe is nothing, he will never be anything in the NFL. He is an underachieving sniveling weak ass punk.

But my question has never been answered by you asswipes -- What is Dwayne Bowe going to do in the NFL? Not "one season" yo-yo's.

What is Dwayne Bowe going to do for his team? Is Dwayne Bowe going to lead his team to a championship? Several championships? Is he going to the HOF? Is he going to be a LMVP? TMVP? Is he going to be remembered as a leader?

What is Dwayne Bowe going to do? In the NFL?

I say he will never do better than 2010 overall. Any nitwit can post a G as a #1 WR in today's NFL, especially. But a #1 wideout that can inspire, well, that is a different kind of player. That is what a good #1 WR will do for your football team. Dwayne Bowe will never be that to his team. He never has, never will.

Sure, he is the best wideout the lowly Chiefs have had since the days of Otis Taylor. I am old enough to know this, the rest of you nitwits weren't even a polywog in dad's nutbag when this was happening. So, please, spare me the details in which you have no ****ing clue other than second hand info from folks like me.

So, again I ask -- and I have made the question crystal clear to you anklebiters -- What will Dwayne Bowe do? What will Bowe's career amount to?

Thank you for your dumbassery in advance, knuckleheads.

This entire rant is devoid of anything substantial at all.

Bowe is on pace for a 10,000 yards career and 70+ TD's. While that may be 'nothing' in your book, NFL players, coaches and basically everyone else knows better.

He's not the best WR in the NFL, and I think he's in the tier below the elites WR's, but he's still a good player even if he's not everything you've ever dreamed of.

#1 receivers don't exist. You never see coaches talk about #1 WR's. It's X, Z, and Y to them. Do you know which position Bowe plays?

milkman
06-10-2012, 10:03 AM
more hyperbole from the site puppet master.

He's a loser Milkman. The Chiefs lose because he's a loser. He is a large part of the offensive problem here. If you don't know that now, you will soon enough.

I got to get on with some chores now. Catch you later.

Hyperbole?

Find a dictionary, dumbass.

Fish
06-10-2012, 10:07 AM
Chiefsfootballfan wasn't even a chiefs fan till 5 years ago and his takes on Bowe are flat out terrible.

Well at least he's now made a name for himself on the forum.... LMAO..

DBOSHO
06-10-2012, 10:08 AM
Is chiefsfootballfan serious?

Fire Me Boy!
06-10-2012, 10:24 AM
Is chiefsfootballfan serious?

He's trolling. No one... NO. ONE.... is this retarded.

Three7s
06-10-2012, 11:01 AM
He's trolling. No one... NO. ONE.... is this retarded.
Either that or Bowe took a piss in his cereal.

Pasta Giant Meatball
06-10-2012, 11:22 AM
He's trolling. No one... NO. ONE.... is this retarded.

He's trolling, but there ARE some people that retarded on here.

beach tribe
06-10-2012, 11:39 AM
He's trolling. No one... NO. ONE.... is this retarded.
No, He's for real.

BigMeatballDave
06-10-2012, 11:41 AM
chiefsfootballF.A.G. is in need of some serious mod abuse