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View Full Version : Chiefs Cassel addressed targeting WR's in preseason games...sorta


petegz28
08-21-2012, 05:44 PM
Heard him on 610 today, he was asked why Baldwin had only been targeted 3 times in 2 games.

Cassel: You'd have to ask the coach. We've been working on things and they (the WR's) have been doing a good job of opening up things over the middle for the others


So you can take that as:

A) He didn't throw to them for whatever reason, scared, didn't see them, whatever
B) Daboll is wanting to work on the passing game to the TE's
C) The WR isn't the primary in the route and the TE is and the TE is open so Cassel goes there

Setsuna
08-21-2012, 05:45 PM
Or Cassel can only throw to the player covered by LBs and not CBs? Or past the LoS, the bigger the red jersey, the better?

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 05:46 PM
Total deflection.

Real answer is he sucks.

petegz28
08-21-2012, 05:47 PM
Or Cassel can only throw to the player covered by LBs and not CBs?

That's possible but I am sure when he goes to the sidelines and looks at the pics between posessions he sees that there are guys open downfield. I would think if Daboll was insisting on him making those throws he would press him to do so. With preseason and the way coaches are in the preseason it's hard to say exactly.

His answer of "you have to ask the coach" sorta tells me that there is a concerted effort right now to work the underneath game with the TE's.

DaneMcCloud
08-21-2012, 05:47 PM
If you watch Hard Knocks, you'll hear Mike Sherman tell his QB to hit a specific receiver on certain plays. It wouldn't surprise me much if Daboll is doing the same thing in preseason.

I don't think that Romeo or Daboll want to overplay their hand in the preseason. Time will tell if I'm right or wrong.

Coogs
08-21-2012, 05:54 PM
If you watch Hard Knocks, you'll hear Mike Sherman tell his QB to hit a specific receiver on certain plays. It wouldn't surprise me much if Daboll is doing the same thing in preseason.

I don't think that Romeo or Daboll want to overplay their hand in the preseason. Time will tell if I'm right or wrong.

Wait. I thought we heard recently that Cassel had the go ahead to audible into better plays. Now we are being told he has the handcuffs on? Something is fishy here!

DaneMcCloud
08-21-2012, 05:57 PM
Wait. I thought we heard recently that Cassel had the go ahead to audible into better plays. Now we are being told he has the handcuffs on? Something is fishy here!

I didn't say "handcuffs", I said that maybe the OC wants to see how a player will react or do with a certain route, matchup, etc.

Daboll's new and I'd be willing to guess that he doesn't know everything about his players just yet.

Direckshun
08-21-2012, 05:58 PM
If you watch Hard Knocks, you'll hear Mike Sherman tell his QB to hit a specific receiver on certain plays. It wouldn't surprise me much if Daboll is doing the same thing in preseason.

I don't think that Romeo or Daboll want to overplay their hand in the preseason. Time will tell if I'm right or wrong.

He was clearly doing it on the first couple plays against the Rams.

Direckshun
08-21-2012, 05:58 PM
You don't force it to the receivers, you force it to the open player.

The problem is you gotta be pretty fucking open before Cassel considers you.

Tribal Warfare
08-21-2012, 06:10 PM
It's all a part, of the classic Cassel reaction that nothing is his fault when it comes to mistakes on the field.

Mr. Laz
08-21-2012, 06:14 PM
Wait. I thought we heard recently that Cassel had the go ahead to audible into better plays. Now we are being told he has the handcuffs on? Something is fishy here!
stop it, just stop it

Mr. Laz
08-21-2012, 06:15 PM
You don't force it to the receivers, you force it to the open player.

The problem is you gotta be pretty ****ing open before Cassel considers you.this is true

he's a chicken

Coogs
08-21-2012, 06:15 PM
I didn't say "handcuffs", I said that maybe the OC wants to see how a player will react or do with a certain route, matchup, etc.

Daboll's new and I'd be willing to guess that he doesn't know everything about his players just yet.

Sorry! I wasn't trying to put words in your mouth. I was just thinking what you said combined with Cassel saying "You will have to ask the coaches" to assume maybe he is handcuffed a bit.

Coogs
08-21-2012, 06:16 PM
stop it, just stop it

Stop what? Cassel said "you will have to ask the coaches".

Mr. Laz
08-21-2012, 06:19 PM
Stop what? Cassel said "you will have to ask the coaches".
your constantly,endless bitchfest about QB's

Cassel has been productive in preseason and yet you are still looking for some way to cry and gnash you teeth about it.


just STFU

Chocolate Hog
08-21-2012, 06:21 PM
How many times has Breaston been thrown to?

Coogs
08-21-2012, 06:23 PM
your constantly,endless bitchfest about QB's

Cassel has been productive in preseason and yet you are still looking for some way to cry and gnash you teeth about it.


just STFU


I'm not bitching. Nor have I been on a bitchfest about QB's. I have pointed out some true facts. :shrug:

L.A. Chieffan
08-21-2012, 06:23 PM
It's preseason, they're keeping Cassell Unchained under wraps until the real thing starts.

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 06:24 PM
How many times has Breaston been thrown to?

Not once.

And last preseason he had 6 catches for 35 yards.

Mr. Laz
08-21-2012, 06:26 PM
How many times has Breaston been thrown to?
zero as far as i know

not sure Moeaki has been targeted either


Maybe ... just maybe ... Daboll thinks he knows what he has in Bowe,Breaston, Moeaki etc so he wants to focus on Baldwin,DMC etc.

maybe it's just the defense trying to take away the known guys


I dunno

O.city
08-21-2012, 06:26 PM
I'd imagine they haven't exactly opened up the playbook but it still doesn't make any sense

Mr. Laz
08-21-2012, 06:29 PM
I'm not bitching. Nor have I been on a bitchfest about QB's. I have pointed out some true facts. :shrug:

this ...
Wait. I thought we heard recently that Cassel had the go ahead to audible into better plays. Now we are being told he has the handcuffs on? Something is fishy here!
is not pointing out facts. It's trying to find a way to bitch about Cassel.

I did it enough times about Carl Peterson to know exactly what it is.

you know it ... i know it, just let it go.


Cassel will have a ton of legitimate screw-ups that you don't have to twist for them. Just give it time.

kstater
08-21-2012, 06:33 PM
How many times has Breaston been thrown to?
Why aren't you posting in this thread?


http://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=262640

Coogs
08-21-2012, 06:33 PM
this ...

is not pointing out facts. It's trying to find a way to bitch about Cassel.

I did it enough times about Carl Peterson to know exactly what it is.

you know it ... i know it, just let it go.


Cassel will have a ton of legitimate screw-ups that you don't have to twist for them. Just give it time.

I was asking a question. That would be why the question mark. I thought I read where Cassel had the right to audible. The OP sort of contridicts this.
And I have said Cassel has played well this preseason. Go look it up.

O.city
08-21-2012, 06:33 PM
I'd imagine the whole "checking from play to play" is more like checking from a pass to a run or vice versa at this point, in the preseason.


Maybe they do want to see what they have on the guys on the inside, being safe etc.


From what we have seen from Cassel in the past, it's not likely. Maybe it's not, but from previous history, it's all we have to go on.

rico
08-21-2012, 06:34 PM
Stop what? Cassel said "you will have to ask the coaches".

Oh, that lack of accountability that I just love about Cassel. He is such a "great" guy. :rolleyes:

royr17
08-21-2012, 06:49 PM
He's just tellin Cassel to get familiar with the the new TE's cause he's already familiar with the receivers. This team is goin to be a hard team to beat, there is so much talent on the offensive side of the ball and talent on the defensive side, I just hope Flowers gets healthy enough in time.

Setsuna
08-21-2012, 06:51 PM
He's just tellin Cassel to get familiar with the the new TE's cause he's already familiar with the receivers. This team is goin to be a hard team to beat, there is so much talent on the offensive side of the ball and talent on the defensive side, I just hope Flowers gets healthy enough in time.

What game were you looking at? The D got torched by 2nd string players....ON THE ST. LOUIS RAMS :eek:

BoneKrusher
08-21-2012, 06:51 PM
What game were you looking at? The D got torched by 2nd string players....ON THE ST. LOUIS RAMS :eek:

sad but true

Mr. Laz
08-21-2012, 06:52 PM
our inability to cover in the st. louis game was really disappointing.

O.city
08-21-2012, 06:54 PM
We played typical vanilla coverage against the Rams, and were very undisciplined in doing it.

royr17
08-21-2012, 06:55 PM
What game were you looking at? The D got torched by 2nd string players....ON THE ST. LOUIS RAMS :eek:

Point blank, we played a bad game, i was very dissapointed in our team, there was no pass rush, our heads were not in that game, i think they thought they could come in and walk all over the rams like the colts did, well they was wrong, hopefully that game will be a wake up call for them.

The defense is talented, from what I saw it looks like Poe is improving, we all know Hali and Houston are goin to cause havoc for QB's all year long, the secondary is where we are hurting right now. If you have no pressure on the QB then the QB is goin to have all day to throw.

I think we'll be alright.

royr17
08-21-2012, 06:56 PM
our inability to cover in the st. louis game was really disappointing.

hey just like everybody, i was very dissapointed in how the defense performed

petegz28
08-21-2012, 07:01 PM
Here is the facts of the situation and you can speculate from there but at least base your speculation on the facts:

1. Coaches knew Bowe was going to be in at some point thus Baldwin and Breaston would be moving around.

2. Boss and Maneri are new to the team\position and T-Mo is coming off an injury

3. Dex is being moved to the slot

Those are the facts. Now for the speculation on my part:

1. They knew Bowe was coming in so Baldwin and Breaston would be getting shifted around anyway so why waste a bunch of time when you can foucs elsewhere

2. Boss is new to to the team so why not get him involved a lot, especially when you are uncertain of the stability of TMo? Maneri is new to the position so why not get him involved a lot? TMo is coming off injury so you have to see how he is holding up so why not get him involved a alot?

3. Dex in the slot is new for him so why not get him some action to see how he is going to perform?

The only thing that hurts is Baldwin to a degree. Breaston is a pro and we know what we have in him so it isn't as important to get him action in preseason as it is the others.

Plus, there is this possibility that the TE's are going to be the passing weapons because we know Cassel isn't the greatest downfield passer.

When you have so many new pieces coupled with limited playing time you have to pick where you want to focus your efforts in preseason. I think it is clear Daboll has said the TE's as that is the area that is experiencing the most change and that would make sense.

Setsuna
08-21-2012, 07:02 PM
Point blank, we played a bad game, i was very dissapointed in our team, there was no pass rush, our heads were not in that game, i think they thought they could come in and walk all over the rams like the colts did, well they was wrong, hopefully that game will be a wake up call for them.

The defense is talented, from what I saw it looks like Poe is improving, we all know Hali and Houston are goin to cause havoc for QB's all year long, the secondary is where we are hurting right now. If you have no pressure on the QB then the QB is goin to have all day to throw.

I think we'll be alright.

I agree with you. I just hope that game didn't tip teams off at the secondary and they game plan specifically to expose it. That won't be good for anybody.

petegz28
08-21-2012, 07:03 PM
Cassel also did say that the Rams were running a "split cover 2 D" (I believe) and the WR's getting downfield was opening up the passing game to the TE's. There is this concept of "take the what the defense gives you". When you have a QB like Cassel, that's exactly what you do.

O.city
08-21-2012, 07:06 PM
When you have a wr like Bowe, and one who we hope to be good in Baldwin, and Breaston, you have to give them a chance to make a play.




Perfect example was the Texans game last week. Schaub takes a play action semi roll out, chucks it down field to AJ who is double covered, he makes a play.

petegz28
08-21-2012, 07:07 PM
I agree with you. I just hope that game didn't tip teams off at the secondary and they game plan specifically to expose it. That won't be good for anybody.

I'm going to say Bradford made 3 passes that most times he doesn't.

1. The opening play he threw the ball to a perfect spot and no defender was going to stop that

2. The pass where Poe got a hand on Bradford he somehow completed the pass. I would bet $'s to Peso's that the ball hits the ground in that situation more times than not.

3. The TD pass against Arenas I will call a fluke. Yes there was PI but regardless of the pressure agan I would bet $'s to Peso's that ball hits the ground more than it is caught.

So kudos for Bradford for having a hot hand but it's not a lot to get me overly-concerned. I have seen the plays broken down a few times now and there are correctable mistakes and there are some plays where you tip your hat and say I'll take that every time because I will win that more times than not.

petegz28
08-21-2012, 07:09 PM
When you have a wr like Bowe, and one who we hope to be good in Baldwin, and Breaston, you have to give them a chance to make a play.




Perfect example was the Texans game last week. Schaub takes a play action semi roll out, chucks it down field to AJ who is double covered, he makes a play.

Game 1 Cassel did similar and Baldwin dropped it though it was decently defended

Game 2 he took a shot in the endzone to Baldwin and 1 of 2 things happened if not both. Baldwin got tangled up with the defender and it did cause him to stutter step and it appeared he failed to locate the ball in time. Either way the pass was where it needed to be. If Baldwin doesn't get his legs bumped I say he makes that catch.

Marcellus
08-21-2012, 07:23 PM
So the 1st team offense has scored 24 points in 3 quarters and looked pretty good minus 1 Baldwin fumble and a phantom penalty. Now people are seeking ways to complain and say the offense hasn't been productive because through 3 preseason quarters we haven't thrown to the WR enough?

OK.

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 07:24 PM
Game 2 he took a shot in the endzone to Baldwin and 1 of 2 things happened if not both. Baldwin got tangled up with the defender and it did cause him to stutter step and it appeared he failed to locate the ball in time. Either way the pass was where it needed to be. If Baldwin doesn't get his legs bumped I say he makes that catch.

Baldwin was hand fighting, his legs weren't interfered with.

The ball was overthrown. It was a terrible, terrible deep pass.

Par for the course for Mr. Matt Cassel.

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 07:26 PM
So the 1st team offense has scored 24 points in 3 quarters and looked pretty good minus 1 Baldwin fumble and a phantom penalty. Now people are seeking ways to complain and say the offense hasn't been productive because through 3 preseason quarters we haven't thrown to the WR enough?

OK.

The offense looked good against the Cardinals.

They weren't good enough against the Rams. They were a clusterfuck of turnovers, penalties, dumpoffs and poor blocking, with one nice TD drive mixed in.

The other 3 points came against St. Louis 2nd team.

This offense needs to kick some ass Friday night. These are scrub teams we're playing.

petegz28
08-21-2012, 07:26 PM
Baldwin was hand fighting, his legs weren't interfered with.

The ball was overthrown. It was a terrible, terrible deep pass.

Par for the course for Mr. Matt Cassel.

Gif it up, please. I seem to remember seeing Baldwin and the defender seem to get their legs tied up just a touch.

lcarus
08-21-2012, 07:27 PM
zero as far as i know

not sure Moeaki has been targeted either


Maybe ... just maybe ... Daboll thinks he knows what he has in Bowe,Breaston, Moeaki etc so he wants to focus on Baldwin,DMC etc.

maybe it's just the defense trying to take away the known guys


I dunno

Moeaki caught a pass for like...half a yard against the Rams lol. That's all I've seen. And I have not seen Breaston at all so far. Then again I haven't been paying keen attention to these preseason games so far. I was ready to turn off the St. Louis game pretty early. Can't wait for the real games to start.

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 07:27 PM
I'm going to say Bradford made 3 passes that most times he doesn't.



LMAO

Yeah, or maybe Sam Bradford is just good?

Give me a break.

petegz28
08-21-2012, 07:28 PM
So the 1st team offense has scored 24 points in 3 quarters and looked pretty good minus 1 Baldwin fumble and a phantom penalty. Now people are seeking ways to complain and say the offense hasn't been productive because through 3 preseason quarters we haven't thrown to the WR enough?

OK.

Unless Cassel comes out and goes 80 yards in 2 plays for a TD with both passes to a WR this place will bash him.

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 07:28 PM
Gif it up, please. I seem to remember seeing Baldwin and the defender seem to get their legs tied up just a touch.

Fuck you, Pete. GIF it yourself.

petegz28
08-21-2012, 07:28 PM
LMAO

Yeah, or maybe Sam Bradford is just good?

Give me a break.

I think 2 of 3 had a little more luck than good on them.

petegz28
08-21-2012, 07:29 PM
**** you, Pete. GIF it yourself.

Sheesh, so angry today, you are.

Marcellus
08-21-2012, 07:31 PM
The offense looked good against the Cardinals.

They weren't good enough against the Rams. They were a cluster**** of turnovers, penalties, dumpoffs and poor blocking, with one nice TD drive mixed in.

The other 3 points came against St. Louis 2nd team.

This offense needs to kick some ass Friday night. These are scrub teams we're playing.

Your concern is misplaced. The defense was much worse, the offense wasn't that bad.

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 07:38 PM
Your concern is misplaced. The defense was much worse, the offense wasn't that bad.

They had 4 drives against the Rams' starters and scored on one of them.

The other 3 drives looked like last year - checkdowns, shitty blocking, penalties, clusterfuck.

That's shit.

xztop12
08-21-2012, 07:39 PM
Am I the only one that thinks Cassel looks ripped and appears to be moving great out there? He still has that piss poor slow delivery but his audibles and presnap reads appear to be good too

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 07:42 PM
Cassel looks ripped

Not this ripped.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2042/2173670109_692b8b756e.jpg

petegz28
08-21-2012, 07:43 PM
They had 4 drives against the Rams' starters and scored on one of them.

The other 3 drives looked like last year - checkdowns, shitty blocking, penalties, cluster****.

That's shit.

1 drive was killed by a fumble
1 drive got us out from our 8 yard line and changed the filed position in our favor
1 ended with a terrible facemask call
1 ended with a TD
1 ended with a FG

petegz28
08-21-2012, 07:43 PM
Am I the only one that thinks Cassel looks ripped and appears to be moving great out there? He still has that piss poor slow delivery but his audibles and presnap reads appear to be good too

Makes a difference when you get to the line with time and aren't rushing to snap the ball.

Marcellus
08-21-2012, 07:44 PM
They had 4 drives against the Rams' starters and scored on one of them.

The other 3 drives looked like last year - checkdowns, shitty blocking, penalties, cluster****.

That's shit.

You are a simplistic fool, but we all know that.

Correlation does not equal causation. (look it up if needed)

Baldwin never fumbled on a play like that last year. What does that play have to do with last year? Not a damn thing.

The check downs weren't an issue. What exactly where you watching? Where was the check down the issue that prevented a score?

One penalty, the most important one was complete fucking phantom. Again you are cherry picking like a simplistic fool.

You best wake up, you are about to get Billayfied.

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 07:44 PM
1 drive was killed by a fumble
1 drive got us out from our 8 yard line and changed the filed position in our favor
1 ended with a terrible facemask call
1 ended with a TD
1 ended with a FG

Like I said, shit.

4 drives, 3 were a clusterfuck.

And this was against the Rams. The Rams.

Don't care about bullshit field goal drives against St. Louis' 2nd string.

You can file that drive under the same section Cassel's 470-yard game is in.

O.city
08-21-2012, 07:45 PM
Clay continuously fires you guys up.



We should have him speak to the Chiefs, pregame.

O.city
08-21-2012, 07:45 PM
1 drive was killed by a fumble
1 drive got us out from our 8 yard line and changed the filed position in our favor
1 ended with a terrible facemask call
1 ended with a TD
1 ended with a FG

Doesn't matter, doesn't fit his agenda

petegz28
08-21-2012, 07:45 PM
Clay continuously fires you guys up.



We should have him speak to the Chiefs, pregame.

LMAO

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 07:46 PM
The check downs weren't an issue. What exactly where you watching? Where was the check down the issue that prevented a score?


I'm glad that checkdowns impress you.

The only decent drive we had was the drive where Cassel threw the ball down the field.

Funny how that works!

Marcellus
08-21-2012, 07:46 PM
Like I said, shit.

4 drives, 3 were a cluster****.

Don't care about bullshit field goal drives against St. Louis' 2nd string.

You can file that drive under the same section Cassel's 470-yard game is in.

Billayfied = "Found to be full of shit". For examples see - Go Chiefs, AKA Claython, AKA Clay, AKA Cassel's Reckoning.

Marcellus
08-21-2012, 07:47 PM
I'm glad that checkdowns impress you.

The only decent drive we had was the drive where Cassel threw the ball down the field.

Funny how that works!


Billayfied!

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 07:47 PM
We should have him speak to the Chiefs, pregame.

"You guys fucking suck shit. I've been watching you for 20 years and you haven't won dick for the last 17. You fucking killed my inner child two years ago. You can raise it from the dead with one playoff win. Now go out there and stop fucking checking the ball down."

O.city
08-21-2012, 07:48 PM
Maybe we are gonna really open it up and throw it down the field more this year?

Marcellus
08-21-2012, 07:50 PM
"You guys ****ing suck shit. I've been watching you for 20 years and you haven't won dick for the last 17. You ****ing killed my inner child two years ago. You can raise it from the dead with one playoff win. Now go out there and stop ****ing checking the ball down."

Plenty of room for you on the SD bandwagon with their 4 or 5 fans. Maybe you should buy a ticket? Fuck I will pay for it.

petegz28
08-21-2012, 07:50 PM
Maybe we are gonna really open it up and throw it down the field more this year?

I think we will go downfield more but not a lot more. I think you are going to see the TE's getting a ton of action this year. If teams start bringing up a saftey to help agains the TE then I think you will see Bowe and Baldwin tear it up in single coverage.

O.city
08-21-2012, 07:51 PM
"You guys ****ing suck shit. I've been watching you for 20 years and you haven't won dick for the last 17. You ****ing killed my inner child two years ago. You can raise it from the dead with one playoff win. Now go out there and stop ****ing checking the ball down."

Great!



BTW, no one can get Marcellus going like you can.

Mr. Laz
08-21-2012, 07:58 PM
i wish they would of killed the whole child instead of just the 'inner'

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 08:09 PM
Maybe we are gonna really open it up and throw it down the field more this year?

Yeah, and maybe I'm a chinese jet pilot.

BossChief
08-21-2012, 08:11 PM
Maybe we are gonna really open it up and throw it down the field more this year?

With Jamaal Charles and Peyton Hillis running the ball behind our offensive line, teams wont be able to afford to double our receivers.

Bowe, Breaston, Baldwin, Moeaki, Boss, Maneri and Dexter (wink) should be able to give Cassel every opportunity to destroy defenses with the pass.

Any one of those guys is gonna rape single coverage every Sunday.

Cassel just needs to be able to locate the guy raping his man every play and get it to him.

If he doesn't, let either Quinn or Stanzi get a shot.

Both of them have the arm/mentatility to get theball to the receivers and not just thetight ends and backs.

BoneKrusher
08-21-2012, 08:15 PM
Any one of those guys is gonna rape single coverage every Sunday.

Cassel just needs to be able to locate the guy raping his man every play and get it to him.


good post Boss.
i hate to be negative
i'm afraid theres' gonna be the problem.

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 08:24 PM
Bowe, Breaston, Baldwin, Moeaki, Boss, Maneri and Dexter (wink) should be able to give Cassel every opportunity to destroy defenses with the pass.

Any one of those guys is gonna rape single coverage every Sunday.


I challenge the entire board, nay, the entire internet, to post ONE CLIP of Dexter raping single coverage as a WR.

It's never happened.

petegz28
08-21-2012, 08:26 PM
good post Boss.
i hate to be negative
i'm afraid theres' gonna be the problem.

I'm not so sure this year. I just have a good feeling about Daboll\Cassel. I am not saying either are the best at what they do but I think they work well together and I like what I am seeing from the offense so far this year. We need to stiffen up on the line but that will come as we play more games and contact increases. I think Daboll understands Cassel and I think Cassel understands Daboll's system better and has a better command of it. Charles and Hillis definitely help but I think that we will see the 2010 Cassel this year if not better.

Coogs
08-21-2012, 08:26 PM
Here is the facts of the situation and you can speculate from there but at least base your speculation on the facts:

1. Coaches knew Bowe was going to be in at some point thus Baldwin and Breaston would be moving around.

2. Boss and Maneri are new to the team\position and T-Mo is coming off an injury

3. Dex is being moved to the slot

Those are the facts. Now for the speculation on my part:

1. They knew Bowe was coming in so Baldwin and Breaston would be getting shifted around anyway so why waste a bunch of time when you can foucs elsewhere

2. Boss is new to to the team so why not get him involved a lot, especially when you are uncertain of the stability of TMo? Maneri is new to the position so why not get him involved a lot? TMo is coming off injury so you have to see how he is holding up so why not get him involved a alot?

3. Dex in the slot is new for him so why not get him some action to see how he is going to perform?

The only thing that hurts is Baldwin to a degree. Breaston is a pro and we know what we have in him so it isn't as important to get him action in preseason as it is the others.

Plus, there is this possibility that the TE's are going to be the passing weapons because we know Cassel isn't the greatest downfield passer.

When you have so many new pieces coupled with limited playing time you have to pick where you want to focus your efforts in preseason. I think it is clear Daboll has said the TE's as that is the area that is experiencing the most change and that would make sense.

This post makes some sense.

petegz28
08-21-2012, 08:26 PM
I challenge the entire board, nay, the entire internet, to post ONE CLIP of Dexter raping single coverage as a WR.

It's never happened.

2010 SF game, maybe?

Coogs
08-21-2012, 08:30 PM
With Jamaal Charles and Peyton Hillis running the ball behind our offensive line, teams wont be able to afford to double our receivers.

Bowe, Breaston, Baldwin, Moeaki, Boss, Maneri and Dexter (wink) should be able to give Cassel every opportunity to destroy defenses with the pass.

Any one of those guys is gonna rape single coverage every Sunday.

Cassel just needs to be able to locate the guy raping his man every play and get it to him.

If he doesn't, let either Quinn or Stanzi get a shot.

Both of them have the arm/mentatility to get theball to the receivers and not just thetight ends and backs.

This post makes total sense. If fact, it is spot on. I have been saying this all summer, and that is not bitching about Cassel. It is just reality.

jspchief
08-21-2012, 08:42 PM
Run heavy offense with a passing game that focuses on the short routes. Defenses are going to have to focus on that.

All our QB will need to do is find the WR with 1 on 1 coverage, and pull the trigger.

So where do you suppose this plan is most likely to fail?

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 08:43 PM
2010 SF game, maybe?

Nope. Dexter had 3 catches in that game and they all came out of the backfield.

petegz28
08-21-2012, 08:44 PM
Nope. Dexter had 3 catches in that game and they all came out of the backfield.

He came out of the backfield. The TD pass was downfield.

Pasta Giant Meatball
08-21-2012, 08:46 PM
Plenty of room for you on the SD bandwagon with their 4 or 5 fans. Maybe you should buy a ticket? Fuck I will pay for it.

He'd make a great Raider fan. Already got the balls deep on Palmer part down.

Pasta Giant Meatball
08-21-2012, 08:47 PM
All Chiefs Planet knows is ball, good,......and rape. We love that term here, heh.

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 08:48 PM
He came out of the backfield. The TD pass was downfield.

No, Pete. He caught the ball in the flat.

I've never seen Dexter "rape" single coverage by a CB once.

petegz28
08-21-2012, 08:55 PM
No, Pete. He caught the ball in the flat.

I've never seen Dexter "rape" single coverage by a CB once.

He caught the ball 7 yards downfield..not sure I would call that the flat but k. But I agree he burned an LB

bowener
08-21-2012, 09:02 PM
I think we will go downfield more but not a lot more. I think you are going to see the TE's getting a ton of action this year. If teams start bringing up a saftey to help agains the TE then I think you will see Bowe and Baldwin tear it up in single coverage.

Teams are already going to stack the box against the Chiefs because they know it is going to be a run first offense, and Cassel isn't known for beating teams with his deep ball. I agree that the TE's will get a lot of action, but for those reasons. Defenses are going to cheat up and eventually bite on a play action fake, and hopefully we will see some TE's flying off the line untouched and uncovered down a seam for a TD.

I really don't know what to expect from the WRs this season. I think there will be a lot of opportunities for them to make plays and get open with the Chiefs backfield and Oline, but it remains to be seen if Cassel will be able to see or take advantage of those opportunities. I have a bad feeling that when the Chiefs play teams with good corners, he isn't even going to look in the vicinity of Bowe or Baldwin, e.g., The 2010 Playoff game.

trndobrd
08-21-2012, 09:03 PM
Baldwin was hand fighting, his legs weren't interfered with.

The ball was overthrown. It was a terrible, terrible deep pass.

Par for the course for Mr. Matt Cassel.


Matt Cassel overthrowing the deep ball?

Must be the first time that particular criticism has appeared on CP.

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 09:10 PM
He caught the ball 7 yards downfield..not sure I would call that the flat but k. But I agree he burned an LB

Exactly. It's not remotely the same thing.

O.city
08-21-2012, 09:12 PM
The Cassel deep ball, was a back foot rusher in his face lob on third down.



It was actually smart to overthrow it at that point, as its either a TD or a FG attempt. It wasn't terribly overthrown, missed Baldwins fingertips by bout 3 inches.

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 09:28 PM
It wasn't terribly overthrown, missed Baldwins fingertips by bout 3 inches.

I'd say he underthrew the crossbar, if anything.

CoMoChief
08-21-2012, 09:39 PM
He came out of the backfield. The TD pass was downfield.

In fairness, that ball was almost intercepted....defender went for the ball and missed, leaving almost an open field for about 20yds until around the goaline, where DMC made a nice dive splitting the defense.

CoMoChief
08-21-2012, 09:43 PM
That deep ball to Baldwin before the half certainly didn't look pretty coming out of MC's hands, but it was placed in a good spot, a lil overthrown by a few inches. But he also had little time to get that pass off....had their been more time, he prob could have set himself better and thrown a better ball.

Just Passin' By
08-21-2012, 09:56 PM
Heard him on 610 today, he was asked why Baldwin had only been targeted 3 times in 2 games.

Cassel: You'd have to ask the coach. We've been working on things and they (the WR's) have been doing a good job of opening up things over the middle for the others


So you can take that as:

A) He didn't throw to them for whatever reason, scared, didn't see them, whatever
B) Daboll is wanting to work on the passing game to the TE's
C) The WR isn't the primary in the route and the TE is and the TE is open so Cassel goes there

With Pioli as his GM, and coming from the Belichick school of press conference communications, do people really expect him to break down routes and progressions to explain his actions?

BossChief
08-21-2012, 10:04 PM
I challenge the entire board, nay, the entire internet, to post ONE CLIP of Dexter raping single coverage as a WR.

It's never happened.

he will be having linebackers wondering where he went all year.

BossChief
08-21-2012, 10:07 PM
No, Pete. He caught the ball in the flat.

I've never seen Dexter "rape" single coverage by a CB once.

If Dexter is getting covered by a corner, the defense is probably gonna be in dime...most likely nickle.. Cassel needs to check to a run and let this offensive line and running backs rape.

Seriously.

This offense has so many versatile pieces that if Cassel can learn to identify defenses presnap...we should be able to kill a lot of defenses by checking off the original play

Ace Gunner
08-21-2012, 10:14 PM
Heard him on 610 today, he was asked why Baldwin had only been targeted 3 times in 2 games.

Cassel: You'd have to ask the coach. We've been working on things and they (the WR's) have been doing a good job of opening up things over the middle for the others


So you can take that as:

A) He didn't throw to them for whatever reason, scared, didn't see them, whatever
B) Daboll is wanting to work on the passing game to the TE's
C) The WR isn't the primary in the route and the TE is and the TE is open so Cassel goes there

Generally Petey, NFL teams don't open the playbook until the season starts.

What usually happens during exhibition season is a lot of vanilla and coaches are just looking for execution and consistency. Matt Cassel has been perhaps the most consistent player on the team so far this year.

Does it mean anything? Ya, but just in that execution and consistency thing, nothing else.

They are faced with several options every year in terms of who to keep and how to best shape the roster for the season and beyond.

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 10:20 PM
he will be having linebackers wondering where he went all year.

Because a LB is going to cover a WR when we have 4 WR on the field?

http://i.imgur.com/xs2Es.gif

Dexter was better off as a RB catching swing passes. At least then he had a chance.

BossChief
08-21-2012, 11:40 PM
2 linebackers in nickel when DMC is in the slot and the d is in zone

Count Alex's Losses
08-21-2012, 11:49 PM
2 linebackers in nickel when DMC is in the slot and the d is in zone

DMC is the 4th WR.

One linebacker in dime defense.

DMC is gonna be running routes outside the hash marks anyway, dude.

Dude needs to beat DBs this year.

crazycoffey
08-21-2012, 11:58 PM
dont know if it was said already, but one of brady's first plays sunday was an audible and 20+ yard pass play. I commited to OTWP, "hey we do have pass plays for the WRs"

BossChief
08-22-2012, 12:01 AM
Pioli trolls the shit out of Clay.

DaneMcCloud
08-22-2012, 12:21 AM
Run heavy offense with a passing game that focuses on the short routes. Defenses are going to have to focus on that.

All our QB will need to do is find the WR with 1 on 1 coverage, and pull the trigger.

So where do you suppose this plan is most likely to fail?

Against a great defense.

Fortunately for Chiefs fans, there are very few of those around these days that are coupled with a great offense.

el borracho
08-22-2012, 12:27 AM
Am I the only one that hates Matt Cassel more than they hated Herm?

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 02:16 AM
Am I the only one that hates Matt Cassel more than they hated Herm?

Nope.

Herm was dumb enough to get fired quickly.

Cassel is juuuuust decent enough to stick here as long as Pioli is here.

Rausch
08-22-2012, 06:51 AM
Am I the only one that hates Matt Cassel more than they hated Herm?

No.

It's like when I went out and gave time to elect Bush II.

And afterwards I thought "stop. Just stop. You look like a HS senior running around doing dumb $#it because you know you're done after this."

Devoting yourself to something that doesn't work out hurts.

It hurts worse if you don't end it.

I honestly believe this is the best OC since Chan we've had.

I hated Daboll at first. I looked at the numbers and was ready to punch Clark in the face.

In short Chan might be the best ever at putting perfume on a pig.

Daboll is going to make a name here as the 2nd best...

Pasta Giant Meatball
08-22-2012, 07:14 AM
Nope.

Herm was dumb enough to get fired quickly.

Cassel is juuuuust decent enough to stick here as long as Pioli is here.

Hermines

mcaj22
08-22-2012, 07:23 AM
half the leagues LBers run faster 40 times than slow dick McCluster so that's not happening

noa
08-22-2012, 07:24 AM
Am I the only one that hates Matt Cassel more than they hated Herm?

At least Herm left us with some of his good draft picks. Castle's legacy won't have any silver linings like that.
Posted via Mobile Device

Rausch
08-22-2012, 07:25 AM
At least Herm left us with some of his good draft picks. Castle's legacy won't have any silver linings like that.
Posted via Mobile Device

Cass$#ole could draft for $#it...

mdchiefsfan
08-22-2012, 10:30 AM
Pioli trolls the shit out of Clay.

http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/002/328/834/136326508_display_image.jpg?1339976441

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 10:39 AM
Daboll is working on the passing game with the TEs and backs because he's doing EXACTLY what Charlie Weis did.

Pioli hired RAC, and RAC hired Daboll, because they're all "in sync". They're all going to toe the company line.

And the company line is that Matt Cassel isn't a game-breaking QB. He can be an adequate manager and he can be highly-efficient in the short passing game.

They're simply not going to ask Matt to do things he can't do, like throw the ball down the field early and often.

I fully expect a 10-6 year with a 1st-round playoff loss, a near carbon copy of 2010.

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 10:44 AM
Daboll is working on the passing game with the TEs and backs because he's doing EXACTLY what Charlie Weis did.

Pioli hired RAC, and RAC hired Daboll, because they're all "in sync". They're all going to toe the company line.

And the company line is that Matt Cassel isn't a game-breaking QB. He can be an adequate manager and he can be highly-efficient in the short passing game.

They're simply not going to ask Matt to do things he can't do, like throw the ball down the field early and often.

I fully expect a 10-6 year with a 1st-round playoff loss, a near carbon copy of 2010.

Hit the nail on the head.

Except we won't go 10-6 against this schedule.

This is why I was freaking the fuck out. Cassel had 13 completions and 10 of them were within 5 yards of the line of scrimmage.

Marcellus
08-22-2012, 10:48 AM
Hit the nail on the head.

Except we won't go 10-6 against this schedule.

This is why I was freaking the **** out. Cassel had 13 completions and 10 of them were within 5 yards of the line of scrimmage.

You are freaking out because you are a drama queen. Nothing else.

L.A. Chieffan
08-22-2012, 10:48 AM
When the regular season starts...

it will be CASSEL UNCHAINED!!

http://geektyrant.com/storage/0999-post-images/django-unchained-poster-3232012federico-mancosu.png?__SQUARESPACE_CACHEVERSION=1332527090085

CoMoChief
08-22-2012, 10:59 AM
Daboll is working on the passing game with the TEs and backs because he's doing EXACTLY what Charlie Weis did.

Pioli hired RAC, and RAC hired Daboll, because they're all "in sync". They're all going to toe the company line.

And the company line is that Matt Cassel isn't a game-breaking QB. He can be an adequate manager and he can be highly-efficient in the short passing game.

They're simply not going to ask Matt to do things he can't do, like throw the ball down the field early and often.

I fully expect a 10-6 year with a 1st-round playoff loss, a near carbon copy of 2010.

pretty much agree w/ all of this.

However our Oline and WR core is better this season. If Cassel improves we can do some things.....guess we'll see.

Chiefnj2
08-22-2012, 11:08 AM
Daboll is working on the passing game with the TEs and backs because he's doing EXACTLY what Charlie Weis did.

Pioli hired RAC, and RAC hired Daboll, because they're all "in sync". They're all going to toe the company line.

And the company line is that Matt Cassel isn't a game-breaking QB. He can be an adequate manager and he can be highly-efficient in the short passing game.

They're simply not going to ask Matt to do things he can't do, like throw the ball down the field early and often.

.

Isn't this what RAC and Daboll should be doing? Playing to the strength of their players?

milkman
08-22-2012, 11:10 AM
You are freaking out because you are a drama queen. Nothing else.

He is drama quening, but at the end of teh day he's right.

Good defensive taems are going to be able to contain the Chiefs offense if we can't open it up and air it out to loosen the defense.

We'll be playing teams with QBs that are capable of making plays.

This team will need a lot of breaks to go their way to win 10 games.

Against this schedule, on paper, with Matt Cassel at QB and his limitations, this is a 7 win team this year.

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 11:12 AM
Isn't this what RAC and Daboll should be doing? Playing to the strength of their players?

Absolutely. Don't take my statement as any sort of editorial comment.

If you want to go there, my beef is with Pioli and him surrounding himself with guys that can "pad" his decision to stick with Cassel no matter what.

That being said, RAC and Daboll can only go with what they are given. They're not insane like Haley - they're not going to spend the season trying to jam a square peg in a round hole.

Marcellus
08-22-2012, 11:20 AM
He is drama quening, but at the end of teh day he's right.

Good defensive taems are going to be able to contain the Chiefs offense if we can't open it up and air it out to loosen the defense.

We'll be playing teams with QBs that are capable of making plays.

This team will need a lot of breaks to go their way to win 10 games.

Against this schedule, on paper, with Matt Cassel at QB and his limitations, this is a 7 win team this year.

I don't believe they will have issues throwing the ball down field with Bowe and Baldwin. Mainly because of the running game. Assuming Charles and Hillis stay healthy and productive teams will have to play to defend the run opening the passing game up. They start playing to defend the pass and the running game will flourish.

Cassel is more than serviceable with a ground game to support him.

Lets wait and see.

CoMoChief
08-22-2012, 11:20 AM
It all starts up front. This Oline is going to be a good one.

And if they're sucessful, Charles, Hillis, and Cassel should all be successful as well.

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 11:24 AM
I don't believe they will have issues throwing the ball down field with Bowe and Baldwin. Mainly because of the running game. Assuming Charles and Hillis stay healthy and productive teams will have to play to defend the run opening the passing game up. They start playing to defend the pass and the running game will flourish.

Cassel is more than serviceable with a ground game to support him.

Lets wait and see.

Cassel worked out with a pitching coach this summer. The results are obvious even to the average spectator - he's throwing the ball differently and his release and velocity are different because of it.

The changes he's made all accomplish 1 thing - they make him more accurate in the 5-15 yard window. The ball gets there quicker and is less likely to sail or leave the WR vulnerable.

It's amazing to me that not only this coaching staff but MATT CASSEL HIMSELF acknowledge (through their actions) that Matt simply CANNOT throw the ball downfield and be successful yet people here think the downfield passing game will be "fine".

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 11:24 AM
Against this schedule, on paper, with Matt Cassel at QB and his limitations, this is a 7 win team this year.

Stop being so negative. We can win 8 games.

bevischief
08-22-2012, 11:33 AM
No.

It's like when I went out and gave time to elect Bush II.

And afterwards I thought "stop. Just stop. You look like a HS senior running around doing dumb $#it because you know you're done after this."

Devoting yourself to something that doesn't work out hurts.

It hurts worse if you don't end it.

I honestly believe this is the best OC since Chan we've had.

I hated Daboll at first. I looked at the numbers and was ready to punch Clark in the face.

In short Chan might be the best ever at putting perfume on a pig.

Daboll is going to make a name here as the 2nd best...

I agree as well.

milkman
08-22-2012, 11:35 AM
I don't believe they will have issues throwing the ball down field with Bowe and Baldwin. Mainly because of the running game. Assuming Charles and Hillis stay healthy and productive teams will have to play to defend the run opening the passing game up. They start playing to defend the pass and the running game will flourish.

Cassel is more than serviceable with a ground game to support him.

Lets wait and see.

The league has figured out that is you stack the box and take away the short passing on passing downs that you can contain this offense.

With a healthy Charles and adding a healthy and motivated Hillis, that game plan won't be as effective.

But when you are in close games late, against the clock, when you need your QB to make plays downfield, Cassel's ineffectiveness will bite this team in the ass.

bevischief
08-22-2012, 11:39 AM
The league has figured out that is you stack the box and take away the short passing on passing downs that you can contain this offense.

With a healthy Charles and adding a healthy and motivated Hillis, that game plan won't be as effective.

But when you are in close games late, against the clock, when you need your QB to make plays downfield, Cassel's ineffectiveness will bite this team in the ass.

Sadly I agree, but hoping against hope that doesn't happen. I don't expect them to show everything in the preseason so I awaiting the first 6 games to get my hopes crushed.

Mr. Laz
08-22-2012, 11:42 AM
Adam Teicher ‏@adamteicher
Bowe will play for #Chiefs on Saturday against Seattle: http://bit.ly/NFuZhV
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CoMoChief
08-22-2012, 11:46 AM
Adam Teicher ‏@adamteicher
Bowe will play for #Chiefs on Saturday against Seattle: http://bit.ly/NFuZhV
Expand
Reply Retweet Favorite

OOOOOOOOOOOOH SHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIT

Watch out......Matty Light is going to light the NFL world on fire Fri night.

mdchiefsfan
08-22-2012, 11:46 AM
Adam Teicher ‏@adamteicher
Bowe will play for #Chiefs on Saturday against Seattle: http://bit.ly/NFuZhV
Expand
Reply Retweet Favorite

:rockon:

Mr. Laz
08-22-2012, 11:48 AM
I don't want him to play ... too soon, will probably will get hurt.

Chiefnj2
08-22-2012, 12:01 PM
Cassel worked out with a pitching coach this summer. The results are obvious even to the average spectator - he's throwing the ball differently and his release and velocity are different because of it.

The changes he's made all accomplish 1 thing - they make him more accurate in the 5-15 yard window. The ball gets there quicker and is less likely to sail or leave the WR vulnerable.

It's amazing to me that not only this coaching staff but MATT CASSEL HIMSELF acknowledge (through their actions) that Matt simply CANNOT throw the ball downfield and be successful yet people here think the downfield passing game will be "fine".

That 5-15 yard window is the bread and butter of the passing game.

We all know Pioli is emulating NE.

Last year Brady had 146 attempts 11-20 yards downfield, 32 attempts 21-30 yards, 9 attempts 31-40 and 6 over 41. (only 1 complete pass 31+).

In 2010 (Cassel's 'complete season) he had 113 attempts 11-20, 29 attempts 21-30 and 15 over 31. (actually a better completion % on those over 31 yards than Brady).

Improving his mechanics and utilizing the TE's and slot in preseason looks like they are trying to bump up his 11-20 attempts.

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 12:19 PM
Yeah, but the Patriots have 0 downfield threats at receiver.

When Moss was there Brady was 28 for 69 past 20 yards.

Matt was 10 for 44 in 2010. :facepalm:

buddha
08-22-2012, 12:24 PM
There are very few plays where one receiver is targeted at most higher levels of football. There are read progressions with Option 1, 2, 3 and 4. The defense essentially decides where the ball is going to be thrown based on the offense's reads and the coverage that the defense shows.

Baldwin will get plenty of reps when the games mean something...can't wait.

Mr. Laz
08-22-2012, 12:26 PM
Cassel worked out with a pitching coach this summer. The results are obvious even to the average spectator - he's throwing the ball differently and his release and velocity are different because of it.

The changes he's made all accomplish 1 thing - they make him more accurate in the 5-15 yard window. The ball gets there quicker and is less likely to sail or leave the WR vulnerable.

It's amazing to me that not only this coaching staff but MATT CASSEL HIMSELF acknowledge (through their actions) that Matt simply CANNOT throw the ball downfield and be successful yet people here think the downfield passing game will be "fine".

it even helped in the screen passes and short passes to the RB's

The ball hangs less and gives the RB/WR's a couple of extra steps before the defender gets there.

I believe there as a good example against st. louis ... short pass got us just enough for a 1st down. In previous years the pass would of be more of a lob and the defender would of gotten there in time to prevent those extra couple of years and we would of had to punt.


Now will he continue with it once the real bullets start flying or will he revert?


why didn't Zorn work on this stuff earlier?
why don't any of our QB's even attempt to make fakes etc?

our fundamentals are weak ... apparently Zorn sucks.

ChiefsCountry
08-22-2012, 12:26 PM
Adam Teicher ‏@adamteicher
Bowe will play for #Chiefs on Saturday against Seattle: http://bit.ly/NFuZhV
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Umm Teicher the game is Friday night.

milkman
08-22-2012, 12:43 PM
it even helped in the screen passes and short passes to the RB's

The ball hangs less and gives the RB/WR's a couple of extra steps before the defender gets there.

I believe there as a good example against st. louis ... short pass got us just enough for a 1st down. In previous years the pass would of be more of a lob and the defender would of gotten there in time to prevent those extra couple of years and we would of had to punt.


Now will he continue with it once the real bullets start flying will he revert?


why didn't Zorn work on this stuff earlier?
why don't any of our QB's even attempt to make fakes etc?

our fundamentals are weak ... apparently Zorn sucks.

Zorn had no offseason to work with the QBs on fundamentals last year, and the offseason is when those things get the work.

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 12:47 PM
That 5-15 yard window is the bread and butter of the passing game.

We all know Pioli is emulating NE.

Last year Brady had 146 attempts 11-20 yards downfield, 32 attempts 21-30 yards, 9 attempts 31-40 and 6 over 41. (only 1 complete pass 31+).

In 2010 (Cassel's 'complete season) he had 113 attempts 11-20, 29 attempts 21-30 and 15 over 31. (actually a better completion % on those over 31 yards than Brady).

Improving his mechanics and utilizing the TE's and slot in preseason looks like they are trying to bump up his 11-20 attempts.

Yes, yes, and yes. Agree on all points.

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 12:48 PM
Yeah, but the Patriots have 0 downfield threats at receiver.

When Moss was there Brady was 28 for 69 past 20 yards.

Matt was 10 for 44 in 2010. :facepalm:

One could argue that we don't have any downfield threats at WR, either. Baldwin may have that potential but Bowe and Breaston are possession guys, through and through.

-King-
08-22-2012, 12:52 PM
One could argue that we don't have any downfield threats at WR, either. Baldwin may have that potential but Bowe and Breaston are possession guys, through and through.

Breaston is a possession guy? First I've ever heard that.
Posted via Mobile Device

Marcellus
08-22-2012, 12:53 PM
Yeah, but the Patriots have 0 downfield threats at receiver.

When Moss was there Brady was 28 for 69 past 20 yards.

Matt was 10 for 44 in 2010. :facepalm:

I thought we didn't throw the ball down field?

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 12:59 PM
One could argue that we don't have any downfield threats at WR, either. Baldwin may have that potential but Bowe and Breaston are possession guys, through and through.

Bowe is far more of a downfield threat than Deion Branch or Wes Welker.

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 01:00 PM
I thought we didn't throw the ball down field?

:facepalm:

Do I need to count up all the fucking 2010 QB splits to prove we don't?

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 01:10 PM
Breaston is a possession guy? First I've ever heard that.
Posted via Mobile Device

Are you being serious?

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 01:11 PM
Bowe is far more of a downfield threat than Deion Branch or Wes Welker.

You're speaking in relative terms and I'm not.

Being "more" of a deep threat than Welker doesn't make Bowe a deep threat anymore than it makes him a 5'6" white guy. :)

Marcellus
08-22-2012, 01:14 PM
:facepalm:

Do I need to count up all the ****ing 2010 QB splits to prove we don't?

You showed MC attempted 44 passes down field correct? I understand the completion % needs to improve, no shit. It is possible if the offense is being run well AKA we are running the ball down people's throats.

Also, I don't give a shit if the ball travels 20 or 10 yards in the air as long as the result is a 20+ yard play.

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 01:18 PM
Also, I don't give a shit if the ball travels 20 or 10 yards in the air as long as the result is a 20+ yard play.

THIS.

milkman
08-22-2012, 01:23 PM
You showed MC attempted 44 passes down field correct? I understand the completion % needs to improve, no shit. It is possible if the offense is being run well AKA we are running the ball down people's throats.

Also, I don't give a shit if the ball travels 20 or 10 yards in the air as long as the result is a 20+ yard play.

If the ball travels 20 yards in the air, then there's a far better chance the result of that play is 20+yards than a ball traveling 10 yards in the air.

Chiefnj2
08-22-2012, 01:25 PM
If the ball travels 20 yards in the air, then there's a far better chance the result of that play is 20+yards than a ball traveling 10 yards in the air.

I'm not sure that's true.

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 01:25 PM
If the ball travels 20 yards in the air, then there's a far better chance the result of that play is 20+yards than a ball traveling 10 yards in the air.

While true, his statement said "if the result IS" which means he's already assuming the 10-yard pass went for a 20-yard gain...

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 01:26 PM
I'm not sure that's true.

It's true when your QB sucks.

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 01:29 PM
It's true when your QB sucks.

Actually, if your QB sucks, the chances of the long pass being completely unsuccessful (incomplete or picked off) increases greatly.

Therefore, milk's statement is infinitely more true when your QB DOESN'T suck.

Marcellus
08-22-2012, 01:30 PM
It's true when your QB sucks.

If your QB sucks you have a better chance of completing a 20 yard pass than a 10 yard pass?

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 01:31 PM
You're speaking in relative terms and I'm not.

Being "more" of a deep threat than Welker doesn't make Bowe a deep threat anymore than it makes him a 5'6" white guy. :)

Well, Bowe is more of a threat to catch a jump ball from 40 yards out than Welker is.

He caught a TD like that in 2007 from Huard.

Welker will basically never make that play.

If Brady had Bowe they would complete more passes down the field, and I bet their 20+ game is a lot more productive this year with Brandon Lloyd.

Meanwhile Cassel was 8 of 38 in 2008 with Moss. LMAO

milkman
08-22-2012, 01:33 PM
While true, his statement said "if the result IS" which means he's already assuming the 10-yard pass went for a 20-yard gain...

I know that, but, really, how often will those 10 yard passes turn into 20+yard gains?

Passing the ball downfield makes a difference.

The more effectively you pass the ball downfield, the more effective the short pasing game becomes in yac.

Spongeblack Bobtard
08-22-2012, 01:35 PM
Total deflection.

Real answer is he sucks.

Really? LOL :facepalm: You don't think they were working on getting the ball to the TEs? Won't that be what they do against Atlanta?

Even if Bowe knows the playbook 100%, he's not going to have a big day against Atlanta. He doesn't do much against good corners and there will be one on him all day.

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 01:36 PM
I'm sure we're gonna try to get the ball to Kevin Boss and Jake O'Cuntell as much as possible this year.

For sure. :facepalm:

Spongeblack Bobtard
08-22-2012, 01:43 PM
I'm sure we're gonna try to get the ball to Kevin Boss and Jake O'****ell as much as possible this year.

For sure. :facepalm:

You are clueless man.

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 01:45 PM
I know that, but, really, how often will those 10 yard passes turn into 20+yard gains?

Passing the ball downfield makes a difference.

The more effectively you pass the ball downfield, the more effective the short pasing game becomes in yac.

Of course. You're talking about an ideal scenario.

Matt Cassel <> ideal

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 01:47 PM
You are clueless man.

Really?

Really?

You think Boss is getting 5 targets a half this year?

Chiefnj2
08-22-2012, 01:48 PM
If the ball travels 20 yards in the air, then there's a far better chance the result of that play is 20+yards than a ball traveling 10 yards in the air.

Here is why I said it might not be true, using Rivers as an example.

Rivers completed 14 of 39 pass attempts that were 21-30 yards downfield. For those 14 passes he should have gains of 20+ yards.

Rivers completed 95 of 161 attempts 11-20 yards down the field. The question is, did more than 14 of those 95 completions gain 20+ yards.

milkman
08-22-2012, 01:50 PM
Of course. You're talking about an ideal scenario.

Matt Cassel <> ideal

So, while it's not all that big a deal how you get those 20 yards, it does make a difference in how often you get those 20 yards.

At the end of the day, I don't care if you throw the ball for 20+yards or throw for 10 yards, and get 10+yac.

But since you have a limited QB, you aren't going to do either often.

Reerun_KC
08-22-2012, 01:52 PM
I'm sure we're gonna try to get the ball to Kevin Boss and Jake O'****ell as much as possible this year.

For sure. :facepalm:

ROFL

Someone needs his mydol today...

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 01:54 PM
So, while it's not all that big a deal how you get those 20 yards, it does make a difference in how often you get those 20 yards.

At the end of the day, I don't care if you throw the ball for 20+yards or throw for 10 yards, and get 10+yac.

But since you have a limited QB, you aren't going to do either often.

With a limited QB, surrounded by superior non-WR talent (aka, the Chiefs), the short pass + YAC formula will yield positive results far more often than chucking it downfield. Will it yield OPTIMUM results? Probably not. But this isn't a Delorian, it's a Chevy Malibu.

Reerun_KC
08-22-2012, 01:54 PM
With a limited QB, surrounded by superior non-WR talent (aka, the Chiefs), the short pass + YAC formula will yield positive results far more often than chucking it downfield. Will it yield OPTIMUM results? Probably not. But this isn't a Delorian, it's a Chevy Malibu.

Hey my wife drives a Malibu. :harumph:

milkman
08-22-2012, 01:56 PM
Hey my wife drives a Malibu. :harumph:

Why do you hate your wife?

Spongeblack Bobtard
08-22-2012, 01:56 PM
Really?

Really?

You think Boss is getting 5 targets a half this year?

Like I said, against Atlanta he will. O'Connell probably won't even make the team.

Chiefnj2
08-22-2012, 01:57 PM
With a limited QB, surrounded by superior non-WR talent (aka, the Chiefs), the short pass + YAC formula will yield positive results far more often than chucking it downfield. Will it yield OPTIMUM results? Probably not. But this isn't a Delorian, it's a Chevy Malibu.

Exactly. KC is going to be a run 1st team. If teams stack the box with lineman and linebackers, they will try to use the TE's and McCluster/Breaston in favorable matchups against slower LB's and some play action. Hopefully Baldwin will be able to grab some jump balls in single coverage.

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 01:58 PM
Like I said, against Atlanta he will. O'Connell probably won't even make the team.

In one half?

I'm willing to bet Kevin Boss doesn't 5 targets in one half all season long.

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 01:58 PM
they will try to use the TE's and McCluster/Breaston in favorable matchups against slower LB's

Are we playing the worst DCs in the league this season?

What DCs are going to attempt to cover wide receivers with linebackers?

Where do you guys come up with this stuff?

Reerun_KC
08-22-2012, 01:59 PM
Why do you hate your wife?

:shrug:

Its a nice new one at least. She likes it.

Plus we are saving for her new SS Camaro.... So she is willing to drive the Malibu if it means she gets a new SS soon.

DaneMcCloud
08-22-2012, 02:05 PM
:shrug:

Its a nice new one at least. She likes it.

Plus we are saving for her new SS Camaro.... So she is willing to drive the Malibu if it means she gets a new SS soon.

And the legend continues...

Camaro-head!

Chiefnj2
08-22-2012, 02:06 PM
Are we playing the worst DCs in the league this season?

What DCs are going to attempt to cover wide receivers with linebackers?

Where do you guys come up with this stuff?

Line up McCluster in the backfield then slide him over to the slot. And, in zone D's the LBs will have responsibility at times for receivers.

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 02:09 PM
Line up McCluster in the backfield then slide him over to the slot.

Sounds like this is something no one would ever anticipate.

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 02:10 PM
Are we playing the worst DCs in the league this season?

What DCs are going to attempt to cover wide receivers with linebackers?

Where do you guys come up with this stuff?

We're going to play cover 2 teams. In fact, I believe Atlanta runs a Cover 2 base defense.

That means a slot WR like Breaston is, at some point, going to be covered by a LB.

Come on man, you know this stuff. It's football 101.

Reerun_KC
08-22-2012, 02:15 PM
And the legend continues...

Camaro-head!

I have a 69 that we are restoring, My son and I are restoring and 83 Z28 and we are saving for the wifes new SS...

The Reerun Family should have mullets.

Reerun_KC
08-22-2012, 02:18 PM
We're going to play cover 2 teams. In fact, I believe Atlanta runs a Cover 2 base defense.

That means a slot WR like Breaston is, at some point, going to be covered by a LB.

Come on man, you know this stuff. It's football 101.

:hmmm:

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 02:26 PM
We're going to play cover 2 teams. In fact, I believe Atlanta runs a Cover 2 base defense.

That means a slot WR like Breaston is, at some point, going to be covered by a LB.

Come on man, you know this stuff. It's football 101.

Uh, Cover 2 teams have nickel packages too.

Cover 2 is not limited to base defense.

If you think teams are gonna trot two linebackers out there when we have 4 WR on the field, think again.

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 02:38 PM
Uh, Cover 2 teams have nickel packages too.

Cover 2 is not limited to base defense.

If you think teams are gonna trot two linebackers out there when we have 4 WR on the field, think again.

When did I say anything about 4 WRs?

There's going to be times when McCluster and/or Breaston are matched up with a LB. Stop being deliberately obtuse.

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 02:44 PM
When did I say anything about 4 WRs?

If McCluster and Breaston are both on the field, we're in a 4 WR set 90 percent of the time.


There's going to be times when McCluster and/or Breaston are matched up with a LB. Stop being deliberately obtuse.

I'd argue it won't happen nearly as much as the dude was implying.

DCs aren't stupid.

McCluster got covered by a LB in the past because he was a RB.

Defenses are not gonna throw an extra LB on the field if we're in 4 wide. Why would they?

Chiefnj2
08-22-2012, 02:49 PM
If McCluster and Breaston are both on the field, we're in a 4 WR set 90 percent of the time.



I'd argue it won't happen nearly as much as the dude was implying.

DCs aren't stupid.

McCluster got covered by a LB in the past because he was a RB.

Defenses are not gonna throw an extra LB on the field if we're in 4 wide. Why would they?

original statement
"they will try to use the TE's and McCluster/Breaston in favorable matchups against slower LB's"

you've converted that to 4 WR sets.

htismaqe
08-22-2012, 02:50 PM
If McCluster and Breaston are both on the field, we're in a 4 WR set 90 percent of the time.

I'm not sure anybody actually mentioned McCluster and Breaston both being on the field at the same time, hence my line of questioning.

I'd argue it won't happen nearly as much as the dude was implying.

DCs aren't stupid.

McCluster got covered by a LB in the past because he was a RB.

Defenses are not gonna throw an extra LB on the field if we're in 4 wide. Why would they?

The thing is, it's not limited to McCluster or Breaston. You could also have Charles or Hillis split out wide, after starting the play in the backfield. There's a considerable amount of motion in this offense.

It's no coincidence that guys like Hillis and Bush had career years in this offense. It's also realistic to expect that Cassel will be efficient but not spectacular.

whoman69
08-22-2012, 02:50 PM
Are we playing the worst DCs in the league this season?

What DCs are going to attempt to cover wide receivers with linebackers?

Where do you guys come up with this stuff?

Is it out of the realm of possibility this guy could be hired again in the NFL?

http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/slides/photos/000/908/058/56278267_display_image.jpg?1304353475

Count Alex's Losses
08-22-2012, 03:00 PM
original statement
"they will try to use the TE's and McCluster/Breaston in favorable matchups against slower LB's"

you've converted that to 4 WR sets.

McCluster is probably only going to be out there in 4 wide, dude.

I honestly can't think of a SINGLE REASON you'd have 2 LBs on the field in such a situation.