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Deberg_1990
08-24-2012, 10:17 AM
http://tracking.si.com/2012/08/24/marvin-lewis-replacement-ref-rule/



Packers tight end Tom Crabtree left a preseason game against the Bengals on Thursday after being injured on a hit by Cincinnati safety Taylor Mays.

Mays was penalized on the play, but even Crabtree said the call was incorrect. Cincinnati Bengals coach Marvin Lewis said the replacement official who made the call didn’t understand the “defenseless receiver” rule, reports Bengals.com’s Geoff Hobson.

“(The replacement refs) are getting better,” Lewis said. “Hopefully, it will get closer and closer to what we need. His understanding was that the player was a defenseless receiver.

“He was, but you are allowed to hit a defenseless receiver shoulder-to-shoulder. There is no such thing as a defenseless player unless he is hit in the head with your head. It was a misinterpretation of the rule. I know they are working hard. The league is working hard to get this stuff corrected. They are working overtime on it actually. It’ll get better and better.”

Lewis praised the officials and league for working hard to improve, but his criticism reflects the worries of others in the league. The NFL’s vice president of operations said that he expects the replacement referees to start the regular season, raising the stakes on any mistakes that could potentially affect a team’s playoff hopes.

milkman
08-24-2012, 10:19 AM
So, is there a story here?

mr. tegu
08-24-2012, 10:20 AM
We need the regulars back. The NFL knows they need to get this done because the replacements are getting way too much attention which is usually not good for refs, officials, and umps.

Inmem58
08-24-2012, 10:20 AM
It's not like this was a game changer.


Who gives a fuck

htismaqe
08-24-2012, 10:25 AM
Last night, the Titans had 12 men on the field. They let the play commence and on the play, Arizona committed a holding penalty.

The dumbass refs called offsetting penalties. ROFL

-King-
08-24-2012, 10:26 AM
http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1312272/mays.gif
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Chiefnj2
08-24-2012, 10:27 AM
http://tracking.si.com/2012/08/24/marvin-lewis-replacement-ref-rule/




“ There is no such thing as a defenseless player unless he is hit in the head with your head. .”

.

I'm no NFL head coach, but I think Lewis may want to take a look at the rules again. I'm 99.9% certain that he is wrong. It doesn't have to be head to head. I'm pretty sure you can't hit a defenseless receiver in the head with your forearm or shoulder either.

Mays was a clean hit because it was shoulder to shoulder.

Molitoth
08-24-2012, 10:28 AM
The Pussification of the NFL cont..... oh nevermind.

DJ's left nut
08-24-2012, 10:29 AM
The real refs fuck that play up every week.

I'm not convinced the ref didn't know the rule, they just continue to screw up and call hard shoulder to shoulder hits a hit to the head.

It was out of control on that front all year last year. If you hit a guy hard enough to pop his head back and he stays on the ground for a moment, they're going to flag you.

You'll see that exact hit get flagged even if Carey and Hochuli and the rest of the crew are back out there.

milkman
08-24-2012, 10:29 AM
I'm no NFL head coach, but I think Lewis may want to take a look at the rules again. I'm 99.9% certain that he is wrong. It doesn't have to be head to head. I'm pretty sure you can't hit a defenseless receiver in the head with your forearm or shoulder either.

Mays was a clean hit because it was shoulder to shoulder.

You're right I think, but it really doesn't matter, since that hit was clearly shoulder to shoulder.

Detoxing
08-24-2012, 10:32 AM
I'm no NFL head coach, but I think Lewis may want to take a look at the rules again. I'm 99.9% certain that he is wrong. It doesn't have to be head to head. I'm pretty sure you can't hit a defenseless receiver in the head with your forearm or shoulder either.

Mays was a clean hit because it was shoulder to shoulder.

From another Camera Angle, it looks like his shoulder hit Crabtree's head. It was pretty damn close if it didn't, and in full speed i can see how a ref could see it as Defenseless. The real refs likely woulda made the same call, we've seen them do it. This shouldn't even be talked about, just a coach bitching.

Detoxing
08-24-2012, 10:34 AM
The real refs **** that play up every week.

I'm not convinced the ref didn't know the rule, they just continue to screw up and call hard shoulder to shoulder hits a hit to the head.

It was out of control on that front all year last year. If you hit a guy hard enough to pop his head back and he stays on the ground for a moment, they're going to flag you.

You'll see that exact hit get flagged even if Carey and Hochuli and the rest of the crew are back out there.

This.

And i still stand by what i said, from the other camera angle in the game, it looked like his shoulder connected with his facemask.

It was a close enough hit that even the real refs woulda called that shit.

mikey23545
08-24-2012, 10:37 AM
I really think this crap is getting blown out of proportion.

Because they are replacement refs, they're under a huge microscope. I think people tend to forget how crappy regular officials are.

Count Alex's Losses
08-24-2012, 10:41 AM
Last night, the Titans had 12 men on the field. They let the play commence and on the play, Arizona committed a holding penalty.

The dumbass refs called offsetting penalties. ROFL

Holy fucking shit.

I am gonna blow my gasket when the refs cost us a game.

Or maybe not.... o:-)

listopencil
08-24-2012, 10:42 AM
http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1312272/mays.gif
Posted via Mobile Device

Yeah, I could see that getting called by real refs.

-King-
08-24-2012, 10:43 AM
I really think this crap is getting blown out of proportion.

Because they are replacement refs, they're under a huge microscope. I think people tend to forget how crappy regular officials are.

No one ia forgetting that. But there's a reason these replacement refs were reffing the Lingerie League, reffing Div III games, and getting fired by the Pac 12 for poor officiating.

Real refs are nowhere near perfect, but in a game played by the best players in the world, I want the best refs possible.
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DRU
08-24-2012, 10:43 AM
I don't remember if it was 2010 or last year, but I remember a very similar play a Chiefs defender made where he blasted a guy with his shoulder right in the chest and was called for the penalty. I can remember Haley screaming and pointing to his shoulder that the defender used his shoulder so it shouldn't be a penalty and the announcers were saying it doesn't matter if it's the shoulder, if he's defenseless it's still a penalty.

I don't think anybody knows the rule.

Chiefnj2
08-24-2012, 10:46 AM
I don't remember if it was 2010 or last year, but I remember a very similar play a Chiefs defender made where he blasted a guy with his shoulder right in the chest and was called for the penalty. I can remember Haley screaming and pointing to his shoulder that the defender used his shoulder so it shouldn't be a penalty and the announcers were saying it doesn't matter if it's the shoulder, if he's defenseless it's still a penalty.

I don't think anybody knows the rule.

They know the rule. Game speed, 10-20 yards away from the play with other players moving around and not always from the best angle, it becomes a judgment call.

And the players can't have it both ways. Don't go and argue that the game is too violent and the NFL doesn't care about concussions, etc., and then complain that close calls are called in a manner that protects the players from concussions.

-King-
08-24-2012, 10:49 AM
Titans’ coaches rip replacement refs

Posted by Michael David Smith on August 24, 2012, 11:10 AM EDT

Add the coaching staff of the Tennessee Titans to the list of those who think the NFL’s replacement officials are in over their heads.

Jim Wyatt of the Tennessean reports that the Titans’ staff grew increasingly frustrated with the referee as Thursday night’s preseason game went on. The ref in the Titans-Cardinals game gave jersey numbers of players who weren’t even on the field three different times when announcing penalties on the Titans.

Titans defensive coordinator Jerry Gray yelled at an official on the sideline and referred to the refs as “The Three Stooges.” Titans coach Mike Munchak was slightly more diplomatic.

“There were a few things,’’ Munchak said. “I think they just got a little sloppy at the end. It seemed like nothing was called most of the game and then all of a sudden there’s a lot of calls. At the end of the game there was a little confusion on was the last ball complete or incomplete. It’s things like that that were frustrating.

Perhaps the worst issue of all was that Titans linebacker Kevin Malast was punched in the groin in front of an official, and no penalty was called. If something needs to spur the players to encourage the owners and the referees to get back to the bargaining table, perhaps uncalled punches to the groin are the thing to do the trick.
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-King-
08-24-2012, 10:50 AM
They know the rule. Game speed, 10-20 yards away from the play with other players moving around and not always from the best angle, it becomes a judgment call.

And the players can't have it both ways. Don't go and argue that the game is too violent and the NFL doesn't care about concussions, etc., and then complain that close calls are called in a manner that protects the players from concussions.
They're not trying to have it both ways. They just want calls made accurately and consistently.
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Valiant
08-24-2012, 11:06 AM
I am sorry, but these examples are stupid. The old refs mad the same mistakes, at no less frequncy either.

Only reason why it is brought up isbecause of the common understanding of the unions backing each other.

These people have done a fine job from I have seen so far of about a dozen games. I am not seeing a huge increase of stupid calls frm past seasons. actually a lil less.

I hope the regular refs stay gone.

Bacillus Anthracis
08-24-2012, 11:15 AM
The only reason these coaches are talking shit about the refs is because they're temps. They wouldn't dare open their mouths about the normal zebras because the normal zebras would then be sure to notice a couple of extra personal fouls occurring in crucial situations the next time they officiated a game with said head coach.

The replacement refs are fine. I barely notice them during games, unlike the regulars, who seem to think they own the field but are nice enough to let the teams play the game on it.

CoMoChief
08-24-2012, 11:25 AM
You would hope that something doesn't come down to an officials call, but sometimes it does, and when it does happen this season with the replacement refs, keepin' it real is gonna go wrong.

htismaqe
08-24-2012, 11:36 AM
I am sorry, but these examples are stupid. The old refs mad the same mistakes, at no less frequncy either.

Only reason why it is brought up isbecause of the common understanding of the unions backing each other.

These people have done a fine job from I have seen so far of about a dozen games. I am not seeing a huge increase of stupid calls frm past seasons. actually a lil less.

I hope the regular refs stay gone.

I've never seen the regular refs allow a play to run when the defense has 12 men on the field. It's a freaking dead ball foul.

Chiefnj2
08-24-2012, 11:42 AM
There is certainly enough money available to give the refs a raise. If replacement refs cost some teams and the league games, then they all get what they deserve.

headsnap
08-24-2012, 12:09 PM
the NFL f***ed up big time by not hiring the posters in this thread as replacement refs... :)

Bump
08-24-2012, 12:11 PM
how much will Marvin Lewis get fined for those comments?

Count Alex's Losses
08-24-2012, 12:12 PM
the NFL f***ed up big time by not hiring the posters in this thread as replacement refs... :)

So many potentially elite GMs, head coaches and refs on this forum.

loochy
08-24-2012, 12:13 PM
Maybe replacement refs will actually call holding on Tamba. Maybe they didn't get the memo that you are supposed to work against small market teams.

Mr. Laz
08-24-2012, 01:00 PM
The real refs **** that play up every week.

I'm not convinced the ref didn't know the rule, they just continue to screw up and call hard shoulder to shoulder hits a hit to the head.

It was out of control on that front all year last year. If you hit a guy hard enough to pop his head back and he stays on the ground for a moment, they're going to flag you.

You'll see that exact hit get flagged even if Carey and Hochuli and the rest of the crew are back out there.
if it was that close then i don't see how people can get pissed about it.

hell ... that POS Hoculi ignores a arm around Hali's throat every dam game he refs.

-King-
08-24-2012, 06:25 PM
Poll: 90 percent of players think replacement refs bad for game

Posted by Darin Gantt on August 24, 2012, 4:31 PM EDT

With the NFL doing its best to whistle past the graveyard as it pertains to the issue of replacement refs, they’re ignoring the fact they seem to be the only ones willing to believe it’s not an issue.

Owners may keep saying it’s not a big deal, but coaches who have been expressly warned not to make it an issue keep talking.

Now the players are chiming in.

In a Sporting News poll of 146 players from 29 teams, 132 (90.4 percent) said games would be negatively impacted by the use of replacement officials.

Of those 132, 71 said the game would “suffer greatly” while 61 said there would be a “marginal” difference.

Only 14 players in the survey thought it would not impact the game.

The poll included a collection of quotes from anonymous players, but Lions defensive end Kyle Vanden Bosch was willing to put his name on his thoughts.

“It’s hard for guys who’ve been officiating for 10, 12, 15 years in the NFL to get it right, and there’s so much going on and so many rules changes that it’ll be difficult if there’s guys that have no experience coming in and officiating games,” he said. “And with the big emphasis on player safety and the changes to player safety, as a player you want to make sure that you have capable officials that get it right.”

If more players were willing to do what Vanden Bosch did, it might make a difference.

Until then, the league has no compelling reason to not keep leaning on the regular officials to take a deal they don’t want, simply because it can.
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notorious
08-24-2012, 06:50 PM
All officials suck.

O.city
08-24-2012, 06:52 PM
What would the league do, if say the players said " we won't play, until you get the real officials back"?

-King-
08-24-2012, 08:37 PM
Bump.

SNR
08-24-2012, 08:38 PM
The NFL should pay the real refs using Rain Man's stolen money.

Get these clowns the fuck out of here.

loochy
08-24-2012, 09:00 PM
Maybe replacement refs will actually call holding on Tamba. Maybe they didn't get the memo that you are supposed to work against small market teams.

Well, I guess they DID get the memo.