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View Full Version : Chiefs Why Cant the Chiefs do this? Panthers GM is out of a job.


ChiefsandO'sfan
10-22-2012, 07:49 AM
ProFootballTalk ‏@ProFootballTalk

Panthers announced Marty Hurney is out as G.M.

mr. tegu
10-22-2012, 07:50 AM
Bring him in for a look?

BigCatDaddy
10-22-2012, 07:51 AM
Bring him in for a look?

Wrong Marty.

BoneKrusher
10-22-2012, 07:51 AM
Clark dont have the Balls?

ChiefsandO'sfan
10-22-2012, 07:51 AM
2 Gm's fired before week 8 come on Chiefs Join the club.

Reerun_KC
10-22-2012, 07:52 AM
Wrong Marty.

I would bring in Martha Stuart before I brought in Marty...

At least Martha would offer something of substance to the team.

Woodchuck
10-22-2012, 07:52 AM
Not good... These teams like Cleveland and Carolina that are getting new GMs might be taking QBs in April. Especially with the lower rookie wage scale.

Reerun_KC
10-22-2012, 07:53 AM
Not good... These teams like Cleveland and Carolina that are getting new GMs might be taking QBs in April. Especially with the lower rookie wage scale.

This!

We need to nut up and become a player.

ChiefsNow
10-22-2012, 07:54 AM
I have the feeling we will and other teams are trying to beat us to it so they can find their replacement first.

ILChief
10-22-2012, 07:54 AM
Not good... These teams like Cleveland and Carolina that are getting new GMs might be taking QBs in April. Especially with the lower rookie wage scale.

Cleveland maybe, no way Carolina gives up on cam newton this quick

ChiefsandO'sfan
10-22-2012, 07:54 AM
Adam Caplan ‏@caplannfl

The coaching staff clearly is not safe now that Hurney is gone no matter what Richardson might say in the future.



Look's like they might give into Cam.

mr. tegu
10-22-2012, 07:55 AM
I have the feeling we will and other teams are trying to beat us to it so they can find their replacement first.

Good time to be a GM candidate. Just like Peyton, the best guy will have his choice.

bowener
10-22-2012, 07:57 AM
http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/19273365.jpg

RunKC
10-22-2012, 07:58 AM
CLARK IS A PUSSY. He won't fire Pioli.

CoMoChief
10-22-2012, 07:59 AM
If money wasn't the only thing Clark cared about, then Pioli would have been fired already.

People REALLY need to get this through their heads.

bowener
10-22-2012, 08:00 AM
Do you think Cam Newton's personality will scare away some GM's?

Will the Browns being in The Cleve scare away any sane man?

Will the Chiefs ever not be a shit franchise?

Woodchuck
10-22-2012, 08:01 AM
Cleveland maybe, no way Carolina gives up on cam newton this quick

I don't know man. QBs don't get much time nowadays. Even with all the numbers and stats he put up last year, he didn't win games. It's like Peter King said this morning, Cam hasn't won a game in which he threw a pick.

Woodchuck
10-22-2012, 08:03 AM
Do you think Cam Newton's personality will scare away some GM's?

Yes

Will the Browns being in The Cleve scare away any sane man?

Depends on who their coach is

Will the Chiefs ever not be a shit franchise?

probably not

.

theelusiveeightrop
10-22-2012, 08:05 AM
Firing a GM is a process. Omaha.

SNR
10-22-2012, 08:05 AM
The guy's now on medical leave.

For a Hurney-a

BoneKrusher
10-22-2012, 08:07 AM
The guy's now on medical leave.

For a Hurney-a

yeah, he tried to lift Carolina out of it's slump.

RunKC
10-22-2012, 08:07 AM
The guy's now on medical leave.

For a Hurney-a

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/FNSZgbJsSxU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

mr. tegu
10-22-2012, 08:11 AM
If money wasn't the only thing Clark cared about, then Pioli would have been fired already.

People REALLY need to get this through their heads.

This doesn't make sense because Pioli is costing Clark money.

Reerun_KC
10-22-2012, 08:13 AM
This doesn't make sense because Pioli is costing Clark money.

Not yet.

The tickets are sold and TV money in the bank... ONLY thing he will lose is parking and Vendor money...

mr. tegu
10-22-2012, 08:24 AM
Not yet.

The tickets are sold and TV money in the bank... ONLY thing he will lose is parking and Vendor money...

We continually hear that season ticket holders are not renewing for next year. I am positive Clark knows this as well. Vendor money and merchandise sales are still likely taking a noticeable dive.

Chiefshrink
10-22-2012, 08:29 AM
CLARK IS A PUSSY. He won't fire Pioli.

I will go even farther and say Clark :wayne: Pioli

Woodchuck
10-22-2012, 08:34 AM
I will go even farther and say Clark :wayne: Pioli

Yep, Clark is under Pioli's thumb imo.

The Bad Guy
10-22-2012, 08:34 AM
I don't know man. QBs don't get much time nowadays. Even with all the numbers and stats he put up last year, he didn't win games. It's like Peter King said this morning, Cam hasn't won a game in which he threw a pick.

As usual, you're fucking stupid.

Cam Newton is going nowhere. The owner loves him. He's going to tailor the entire operation around him.

I could also see the Browns giving Weeden another year. He's actually played a lot better than most would admit.

The Bad Guy
10-22-2012, 08:35 AM
Not yet.

The tickets are sold and TV money in the bank... ONLY thing he will lose is parking and Vendor money...

Which is still quite a bit of cash.

Woodchuck
10-22-2012, 08:36 AM
As usual, you're ****ing stupid.

Cam Newton is going nowhere. The owner loves him. He's going to tailor the entire operation around him.

I could also see the Browns giving Weeden another year. He's actually played a lot better than most would admit.

Maybe so? However, history has proven that it takes alot more than talent to be a successful franchise QB.

Saccopoo
10-22-2012, 08:38 AM
If money wasn't the only thing Clark cared about, then Pioli would have been fired already.

People REALLY need to get this through their heads.

If money is what Clark is worried about, he would fire Pioli.

You watch the crowds at Arrowhead as we get deeper into the year.

You aren't selling hot dogs, parking passes and beer to an empty stadium.

Pioli isn't making Clark Hunt shit. It's the TV deal that's making him money on this franchise, not Pioli. At this point, Pioli is starting to cost Hunt money and respect and his historical perspective/place in the NFL (which is probably a lot more important to Clark than hot dog revenue right now).

htismaqe
10-22-2012, 08:40 AM
As usual, you're ****ing stupid.

Cam Newton is going nowhere. The owner loves him. He's going to tailor the entire operation around him.

I could also see the Browns giving Weeden another year. He's actually played a lot better than most would admit.

I was going to post this but then thought to myself "why bother".

The Panthers fired their GM in order to cater MORE to Newton's wishes.

His leash is getting LONGER, not shorter.

Woodchuck
10-22-2012, 08:47 AM
I was going to post this but then thought to myself "why bother".

The Panthers fired their GM in order to cater MORE to Newton's wishes.

His leash is getting LONGER, not shorter.

:facepalm:

Why would you fire the GM to cater more to Cam's wishes? Was Cam calling out the GM or the coaches? If they were catering to Cam, they would have fired some coaches. The GM got fired because they don't have much talent. I think you got it backwards bud.

booger
10-22-2012, 08:47 AM
One important dynamic to think of is who Clark would replace Pioli with in an interim basis for the rest of the season.

Asst. GM Joel Collier is one of Pioli's best friends in football and the two were GA's at Syracuse together on Paul Pasqualoni's Staff in the late 80's. Pretty much the entire scouting staff are Pioli guys. And it's structured a bit different with a ton of inexperienced yes men. I could see a situation where Collier would decline the interim title and honestly I think if you fire Pioli you may as well kick a few of his closest buddies asses out the door in the process. If it was me I wouldn't want to chance it handing the rains over to guys he hired, even if just over half a season.

If Phil Emery didn't take the Bears job it would be that much easier, just promote him. Emery's job as Director of College Scouting isn't really even technically filled yet. Jim Nagy was promoted and this is basically a trial year for him without Emery's old title. Collier is Pioli's watch dog, helping out with the college scouting and making sure Nagy doesn't screw up.

Take the entire college scouting staff and you have 2 left overs from the Carl era. Willie Davis and Terry Delp. Then you have Aundrae Harris who came from AZ in '09 very likely at the request of Todd Haley. Normally a rookie HC wouldn't have the pull to do that but considering Haley's background as starting off in scouting and Pioli needing to fill out a scouting staff I think it's likely why Harris was brought in.

The rest of the college staff are all Pioli hires. If they don't have New England ties they have ties from Pioli's background in the few stops he coached in college before getting his shot with Cleveland.

When you look at the rest of the staff, pro and college, there are a ton of entry level yes men. Guys they want to groom to do things the Pioli way. Very inexperienced as well.

I'm not saying it can't be done in season. If it was me I would promote Ray Farmer to interim GM. Or give him a promotion to VP of Player Personnel and give him GM responsibilities w/o the title. The next GM may want to keep him around and it's not as easy to do with the GM title. More likely the next GM would have his own guy anyway. Let Farmer and Romeo finish out the season and make resigning Bowe, Albert, Colquitt a priority. What to do with Dorsey is another matter. The pieces are in place where it would make the most sense to run some sort of a 34 in the future with Hali and Houston at OLB. Just tweak it like most of the other 34 teams do to allow more penetration from the front 3. Whether to trade, resign, or let Dorsey walk is probably a choice the new GM would make. Whereas the others will fit regardless.

Farmer does not have the college scouting experience needed to oversee that aspect. He does little college scouting in season and almost certainly doesn't travel like the college scouts do. At least not to college games but rather other pro leagues. And most of those players scouted in other pro leagues don't warrant an in person scouting visit. Farmer's college scouting experience is that of the coaching staff. Once the season is over, the combine and pro days, visits, etc.

So in addition you need to hire a consultant for the rest of the season. Try to find a Ron Wolf, Bobby Bethard, or Ernie Accorsi and pay them enough to make it worth their while to oversee the college scouting staff and help Farmer when needed. At this point it would only be basically a 3 month job anyway. I threw those 3 names out there but it could basically be any Personnel man who doesn't have a current gig or is retired. I don't really trust Casserly's judgement and a guy like Kuharich hasn't been employed by an NFL team since KC let him go. I don't know that he would want to come back and do the team a favor necessarily.

But Collier's relationship with Pioli is a key thing to remember when thinking about whether Clark would fire him mid season or not.

htismaqe
10-22-2012, 08:50 AM
:facepalm:

Why would you fire the GM to cater more to Cam's wishes? Was Cam calling out the GM or the coaches? If they were catering to Cam, they would have fired some coaches. The GM got fired because they don't have much talent. I think you got it backwards bud.

LMAO

He absolutely called out the coaches and GM. It was not only discussed in another thead, but you are PARTICIPATING in said thread.

Do you have to try to be this much of a moron?

ChiefsandO'sfan
10-22-2012, 08:54 AM
Jason La Canfora ‏@JasonLaCanfora

Many execs, agents, believe we could 6-8 full GM/coaching house cleanings, with owners flush post-lockout, Carolina among them..


Jason La Canfora ‏@JasonLaCanfora

Several coaches early in their tenure (Mularkey, Rivers, Crennel) could be caught up in in it if/when a change made at GM.

CaliforniaChief
10-22-2012, 08:58 AM
Seeing 2 franchises do this midstream in just the past week has to embolden Clark.

theelusiveeightrop
10-22-2012, 08:59 AM
Piloi has a fine future in the housekeeping or food-service industries.

CoMoChief
10-22-2012, 09:00 AM
Maybe so? However, history has proven that it takes alot more than talent to be a successful franchise QB.

True, but the common factor is the franchise QB.

Unless you have one of the best defenses ever (2000 Ravens or 2002 Bucs) you're not going anywhere unless you have a franchise type QB.

MotherfuckerJones
10-22-2012, 09:01 AM
Pioli, As Chung-Lei in bloodsport says "YOU ARE NEXT!"

Cave Johnson
10-22-2012, 09:03 AM
Hurney was a bottom 5 GM.... the contracts he gave out in 2011 were unconscionable.

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8406098/the-roster-moves-made-panthers-gm-incompetent-best

Hoover
10-22-2012, 09:03 AM
For as much as people around here want to get rid of Pioli, and I understand the appreciate the argument why he needs to go, I don't think he's going anywhere.

The Chiefs football product has sucked for all of the Pioli years except one. While the Chiefs have talent on the roster, it has not translated to wins. All that said, I think the Chiefs are a much better run franchise under Pioli than they were under Carl Petersen. While none of you care about the business side of things, ownership sure does. So if one were to grade Pioli he would get low marks for football performance and high marks for the business side of things.

I think Pioli deserves to be on the hot seat, but I'm not sold that his replacement would do any better in KC without a QB than Pioli has done. Pioli brought in Cassel, hired two lousy coaches, but I'm not opposed to letting him do a control, alt, delete, especially if we have the top pick in the draft which in addition to our current roster should be enticing to prospective head coaches.

As for Clark, you have to understand he's has a long view perspective. I know some fans want him to listen to them, but come on now. You all hated Carl when he traded Jared Allen, now some of you would take him back. Chiefs fans are like the weather, if you don't like what they are saying give it a minute because their tune will surely change on the drop of a dime.

Yes, I know Dane, I'm a fucking idiot.

htismaqe
10-22-2012, 09:06 AM
The Chiefs football product has sucked for all of the Pioli years except one. While the Chiefs have talent on the roster, it has not translated to wins. All that said, I think the Chiefs are a much better run franchise under Pioli than they were under Carl Petersen. While none of you care about the business side of things, ownership sure does. So if one were to grade Pioli he would get low marks for football performance and high marks for the business side of things.

That's all well and good, except that Pioli doesn't run the business side, or at least he shouldn't be running it.

Hunt said after he got rid of Peterson that football and business would be run independently and then he hired Marc Donovan.

MotherfuckerJones
10-22-2012, 09:08 AM
Thank god Pioli doesnt run the business side!

The Bad Guy
10-22-2012, 09:08 AM
Maybe so? However, history has proven that it takes alot more than talent to be a successful franchise QB.

No shit, sherlock.

As Parker just posted, they are giving Cam basically the keys to the franchise. If you don't think that, then I'm amazed you had the ability to fill in your information to register for this site.

The Bad Guy
10-22-2012, 09:09 AM
Thank god Pioli doesnt run the business side!

He has his hands in that side as well. Mark Donovan brings everything to him.

suds79
10-22-2012, 09:10 AM
You know what's interesting is that I think seeing stuff like this probably makes Scott want to draft a QB in the 1st even less.

Hear me out. I think Scott wants to be the man, the genius, the guy who gets all the credit who would rather try to win with "the right 53" vs having the right one in a superstar QB.

Then he see's this GM is out because there's a case where a superstar QB has a lot of power.

Sure it's probably a moot point. I think we're draft a QB in the 1st whether Scott likes it or not. Just think maybe it's part of why he's never taken a QB high.

The Bad Guy
10-22-2012, 09:10 AM
That's all well and good, except that Pioli doesn't run the business side, or at least he shouldn't be running it.

Hunt said after he got rid of Peterson that football and business would be run independently and then he hired Marc Donovan.

In theory, they are separate entities. However, Donovan brings stuff to Pioli all the time. Now, it's not a huge deal because Donovan has the final say, but Pioli dabbles in every part of the organization.

boogblaster
10-22-2012, 09:11 AM
this team needs a house-cleaning .. top to bottom .. lota players just dont get it .. coaching sucks .. office is in disarray .....

The Bad Guy
10-22-2012, 09:11 AM
You know what's interesting is that I think seeing stuff like this probably makes Scott want to draft a QB in the 1st even less.

Hear me out. I think Scott wants to be the man, the genius, the guy who gets all the credit who would rather try to win with "the right 53" vs having the right one in a superstar QB.

Then he see's this GM is out because there's a case where a superstar QB has a lot of power.

Sure it's probably a moot point. I think we're draft a QB in the 1st whether Scott likes it or not. Just think maybe it's part of why he's never taken a QB high.

The right 53 is just another way of saying "the quarterback isn't that important. The guy has put the wrong 53 on the field for 4 years now.

Woodchuck
10-22-2012, 09:12 AM
True, but the common factor is the franchise QB.

Unless you have one of the best defenses ever (2000 Ravens or 2002 Bucs) you're not going anywhere unless you have a franchise type QB.

I think you misunderstood me. Being a franchise QB is about more than talent. It's about brains and leadership.

Dilfer and Johnson weren't franchise QBs and they didn't have the talent that other QBs did but, they were leaders with brains.

People forget but Tony Banks started that season for Baltimore and it got alot better when Dilfer took his job and led the team.

Brad Johnson was always in command of his offense. Neither of these guys were afraid to call players out and let them have it.

Guys like Jeff George, Joey Harrington, Tim Couch, Ryan Leaf, and Mike Vick were drafted early because they had talent but, talent isn't everything and that's my point.

CaliforniaChief
10-22-2012, 09:13 AM
The right 53 is just another way of saying "the quarterback isn't that important. The guy has put the wrong 53 on the field for 4 years now.

Yes. "The Right 53", along with all the other bullcrap that steams from Scott and his Patriot minions has been fully debunked.

Tom Brady. That's all.

mcaj22
10-22-2012, 09:16 AM
the right 53 was the philisophy Belicheck and the gang had when they were in the Cleveland Browns in like 95.

If you watch the A Football Life he talks about trying to make a team of blue collar players and hope to be competitive if the athleticism (especially at QB) isnt there. Thats basically what Pioli tried to do in KC. High character guys that may not be that talented and hope for the best. It's a god awful philospohy because it was terrible in Cleveland and it's terrible here and it's all from that Bill Parcells Giants/Jets teams they take this shit from

Woodchuck
10-22-2012, 09:17 AM
the right 53 was the philisophy Belicheck and the gang had when they were in the Cleveland Browns in like 95.

If you watch the A Football Life he talks about trying to make a team of blue collar players and hope to be competitive if the athleticism (especially at QB) isnt there. Thats basically what Pioli tried to do in KC. High character guys that may not be that talented and hope for the best. It's a god awful philospohy because it was terrible in Cleveland and it's terrible here and it's all from that Bill Parcells Giants/Jets teams they take this shit from

That was definately worth watching but it pissed me off. After seeing that, I realized Pioli wasn't going anywhere. I can see any owner eating that shit up.

suds79
10-22-2012, 09:21 AM
The right 53 is just another way of saying "the quarterback isn't that important. The guy has put the wrong 53 on the field for 4 years now.

Can't argue with that.

I honestly think that Scott would rather win like this where people say... (and this in relation to the right 53)

"Wow look at this SB team. They're just so solid top to bottom. The right 53. Scott Pioli built this."

vs something like.

"Wow look at this SB team. That Andrew Luck is going to be an all time great." (where Scott doesn't get nearly as much credit)

mcaj22
10-22-2012, 09:22 AM
yea we are handcuffed in a prison to a god awful tree of coaches/schemes and philosophy and our franchise suffers because of it.

At least the Panthers show the urgency to do something/clean house because they at least have a potential franchise QB and want to show the fanbase they need to win now around him

mcaj22
10-22-2012, 09:23 AM
Can't argue with that.

I honestly think that Scott would rather win like this where people say... (and this in relation to the right 53)

"Wow look at this SB team. They're just so solid top to bottom. The right 53. Scott Pioli built this."

vs something like.

"Wow look at this SB team. That Andrew Luck is going to be an all time great." (where Scott doesn't get nearly as much credit)


it's pretty much

Scott Pioli would rather lose his way, than win somebody else's way

Woodchuck
10-22-2012, 09:28 AM
it's pretty much

Scott Pioli would rather lose his way, than win somebody else's way

It's ironic that Haley was the same way. We are right back where we started.

Buckweath
10-22-2012, 09:30 AM
As usual, you're ****ing stupid.

Cam Newton is going nowhere. The owner loves him. He's going to tailor the entire operation around him.

I could also see the Browns giving Weeden another year. He's actually played a lot better than most would admit.

The Panthers are not drafting another QB with their first pick no matter how well Newton plays this year.

The Browns will draft Smith or Barkley if given the chance, only if Weeden doesn't improve and disappoints this year. Actually, even if he does well, I wouldn't be surprised to see them going after a top Qb prospect.

siberian khatru
10-22-2012, 09:33 AM
The right 53 is just another way of saying "the quarterback isn't that important. The guy has put the wrong 53 on the field for 4 years now.

That reminds me of something that was said when the Chiefs played the Cowboys on Thanksgiving Day 1995. Comparing the Chiefs' overall roster depth vs. the Cowboys' stars at key positions.

Sweet Daddy Hate
10-22-2012, 09:40 AM
How sad is it when the Bungles look like world-beaters compared to this team?

Strongside
10-22-2012, 09:49 AM
Cleveland maybe, no way Carolina gives up on cam newton this quick

If they do, we'd better jump on his ass.

Rausch
10-22-2012, 09:50 AM
It WILL happen.

We just have to keep pushing forward...

Rausch
10-22-2012, 09:52 AM
If they do, we'd better jump on his ass.

:grr:

http://www.ee0r.com/lolckyhorror/21-donotwant.jpg

Chiefnj2
10-22-2012, 09:54 AM
In hindsight, it's probably a good thing Pioli never took a QB early. Does anyone really think that Scott would hire a bright young offensive mind and let that guy develop a system around the QB? No way. The kid would be forced into a "Patriot Way" offense.

Sweet Daddy Hate
10-22-2012, 09:55 AM
I'm truly hating everything called "Patriot" these days...

DenverDanChiefsFan
10-22-2012, 10:06 AM
I'm truly hating everything called "Patriot" these days...

Well, it might be nice to have a Patriot missile hit 1 Arrowhead drive.

Sweet Daddy Hate
10-22-2012, 10:21 AM
Well, it might be nice to have a Patriot missile hit 1 Arrowhead drive.

Mmm...:evil:

DaneMcCloud
10-22-2012, 10:22 AM
Hurney should have been fired when John Fox was fired and it's no surprise that he crashed and burned.

Cam Newton called out the organization and Jerry Richardson listened. This is no different than if John Elway or Dan Marino had called out their organizations back in the day. Newton IS the Panthers future and I'd be shocked if the coaching staff weren't fired at the end of the year.

I just hope Clark doesn't make the same mistake: Let Pioli and friends stick around for year too long, draft a QB, only to fire everyone after the QB has been drafted, likely setting him back at least a year, if not more.

Pestilence
10-22-2012, 10:26 AM
I'd take Ron Rivera as our DC.

Predarat
10-22-2012, 10:28 AM
ahhh so maybe when Scam runs the coaching staff off as well they can hire the recently fired (not official yet) Gene Chizik.

ILChief
10-22-2012, 10:28 AM
Hurney should have been fired when John Fox was fired and it's no surprise that he crashed and burned.

Cam Newton called out the organization and Jerry Richardson listened. This is no different than if John Elway or Dan Marino had called out their organizations back in the day. Newton IS the Panthers future and I'd be shocked if the coaching staff weren't fired at the end of the year.

I just hope Clark doesn't make the same mistake: Let Pioli and friends stick around for year too long, draft a QB, only to fire everyone after the QB has been drafted, likely setting him back at least a year, if not more.

Maybe Cassel will demand Pioli gets fired lol

Bump
10-22-2012, 10:47 AM
Not good... These teams like Cleveland and Carolina that are getting new GMs might be taking QBs in April. Especially with the lower rookie wage scale.

lol, Carolina isn't giving up on Cam Newton after this season. If they get the #1 or 2 pick, I bet they will trade it unless there is a badass player that they can't pass up that's not a QB.

bevischief
10-22-2012, 10:59 AM
JFC just fire this want a be GM.

HC_Chief
10-22-2012, 11:01 AM
Hurney should have been fired when John Fox was fired and it's no surprise that he crashed and burned.

Cam Newton called out the organization and Jerry Richardson listened. This is no different than if John Elway or Dan Marino had called out their organizations back in the day. Newton IS the Panthers future and I'd be shocked if the coaching staff weren't fired at the end of the year.

I just hope Clark doesn't make the same mistake: Let Pioli and friends stick around for year too long, draft a QB, only to fire everyone after the QB has been drafted, likely setting him back at least a year, if not more.

Nailed it.
Some people bemoaned Newton's tirade as "spoiled"; called him a prima donna. I thought what he did was great! Rather than keep his mouth shut & suffer the stupidity of the organization, he spoke out and said what needed to be said. I wish someone in the Chiefs organization would do the same.

Woodchuck
10-22-2012, 11:04 AM
lol, Carolina isn't giving up on Cam Newton after this season. If they get the #1 or 2 pick, I bet they will trade it unless there is a badass player that they can't pass up that's not a QB.

Probably not but, if Cam keeps pouting and crying like a little bitch to the media it could happen. He better start winning some games. Remember how much their owner hated Brees and Manning during the lockout? He was the coldest out of all the owners. He won't feel a bit sorry for Cam.

clyde05
10-22-2012, 11:04 AM
Maybe this is good for Clark, now he isn't the first one to ax a gm. c'mon Clark, fire Pioli!

SNR
10-22-2012, 11:04 AM
Hurney should have been fired when John Fox was fired and it's no surprise that he crashed and burned.

Cam Newton called out the organization and Jerry Richardson listened. This is no different than if John Elway or Dan Marino had called out their organizations back in the day. Newton IS the Panthers future and I'd be shocked if the coaching staff weren't fired at the end of the year.

I just hope Clark doesn't make the same mistake: Let Pioli and friends stick around for year too long, draft a QB, only to fire everyone after the QB has been drafted, likely setting him back at least a year, if not more.

Who do we have who could call out the owner? Jamaal Charles?

"Yo Clark. I like all these carries I'm getting, but geez. Get me some help at QB."

"You're going to the glue factory in a few seasons, Jamaal. I don't have to listen to you"

stevieray
10-22-2012, 11:08 AM
if players now control teams, count me out.

bevischief
10-22-2012, 11:12 AM
if players now control teams, count me out.

Explain the Crennel hiring?

SNR
10-22-2012, 11:16 AM
Explain the Crennel hiring?
The players liked Crennel, but I think this one is still Pioli's deal.

They players also liked Herm, and Pioli said, "No thank you."

DaneMcCloud
10-22-2012, 11:21 AM
Who do we have who could call out the owner? Jamaal Charles?

I think you misunderstood my post.

I don't want to see Pioli draft a QB, only to be fired mid-2013 season after hiring a new coaching staff, etc. It would set back the franchise even further. Burn the motherfucker down, start over, all at once.

Hurney should have been fired after he gave Jake Delhomme an extension five years ago, so this was a long time coming (not to mention huge deals for both running backs, neither of which they're using).

Woodchuck
10-22-2012, 11:26 AM
if players now control teams, count me out.

No kidding man and I agree. :thumb:

SNR
10-22-2012, 11:32 AM
I think you misunderstood my post.

I don't want to see Pioli draft a QB, only to be fired mid-2013 season after hiring a new coaching staff, etc. It would set back the franchise even further. Burn the motherfucker down, start over, all at once.

Hurney should have been fired after he gave Jake Delhomme an extension five years ago, so this was a long time coming (not to mention huge deals for both running backs, neither of which they're using).

Definitely. But hey, at least he didn't bitch out everybody for leaving candy wrappers on the floor

Sweet Daddy Hate
10-22-2012, 11:33 AM
Definitely. But hey, at least he didn't bitch out everybody for leaving candy wrappers on the floor

Scott Pioli:

Setting priorities in life.

the Talking Can
10-22-2012, 11:53 AM
One important dynamic to think of is who Clark would replace Pioli with in an interim basis for the rest of the season.

Asst. GM Joel Collier is one of Pioli's best friends in football and the two were GA's at Syracuse together on Paul Pasqualoni's Staff in the late 80's. Pretty much the entire scouting staff are Pioli guys. And it's structured a bit different with a ton of inexperienced yes men. I could see a situation where Collier would decline the interim title and honestly I think if you fire Pioli you may as well kick a few of his closest buddies asses out the door in the process. If it was me I wouldn't want to chance it handing the rains over to guys he hired, even if just over half a season.

If Phil Emery didn't take the Bears job it would be that much easier, just promote him. Emery's job as Director of College Scouting isn't really even technically filled yet. Jim Nagy was promoted and this is basically a trial year for him without Emery's old title. Collier is Pioli's watch dog, helping out with the college scouting and making sure Nagy doesn't screw up.

Take the entire college scouting staff and you have 2 left overs from the Carl era. Willie Davis and Terry Delp. Then you have Aundrae Harris who came from AZ in '09 very likely at the request of Todd Haley. Normally a rookie HC wouldn't have the pull to do that but considering Haley's background as starting off in scouting and Pioli needing to fill out a scouting staff I think it's likely why Harris was brought in.

The rest of the college staff are all Pioli hires. If they don't have New England ties they have ties from Pioli's background in the few stops he coached in college before getting his shot with Cleveland.

When you look at the rest of the staff, pro and college, there are a ton of entry level yes men. Guys they want to groom to do things the Pioli way. Very inexperienced as well.

I'm not saying it can't be done in season. If it was me I would promote Ray Farmer to interim GM. Or give him a promotion to VP of Player Personnel and give him GM responsibilities w/o the title. The next GM may want to keep him around and it's not as easy to do with the GM title. More likely the next GM would have his own guy anyway. Let Farmer and Romeo finish out the season and make resigning Bowe, Albert, Colquitt a priority. What to do with Dorsey is another matter. The pieces are in place where it would make the most sense to run some sort of a 34 in the future with Hali and Houston at OLB. Just tweak it like most of the other 34 teams do to allow more penetration from the front 3. Whether to trade, resign, or let Dorsey walk is probably a choice the new GM would make. Whereas the others will fit regardless.

Farmer does not have the college scouting experience needed to oversee that aspect. He does little college scouting in season and almost certainly doesn't travel like the college scouts do. At least not to college games but rather other pro leagues. And most of those players scouted in other pro leagues don't warrant an in person scouting visit. Farmer's college scouting experience is that of the coaching staff. Once the season is over, the combine and pro days, visits, etc.

So in addition you need to hire a consultant for the rest of the season. Try to find a Ron Wolf, Bobby Bethard, or Ernie Accorsi and pay them enough to make it worth their while to oversee the college scouting staff and help Farmer when needed. At this point it would only be basically a 3 month job anyway. I threw those 3 names out there but it could basically be any Personnel man who doesn't have a current gig or is retired. I don't really trust Casserly's judgement and a guy like Kuharich hasn't been employed by an NFL team since KC let him go. I don't know that he would want to come back and do the team a favor necessarily.

But Collier's relationship with Pioli is a key thing to remember when thinking about whether Clark would fire him mid season or not.

it's sad i had to wade trough black retard's posts to get to this...thanks for the background

T-post Tom
10-22-2012, 12:00 PM
Eric Davis, former Panther, says that the Panther owner works on a plus/minus basis. Once you have two consecutive minuses: you're gone. Hmmmmm...Clark, ya hear that?

(BTW, Hard to believe that he's only now getting his first set of consecutive minuses.)

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-am/0ap1000000083688/Panthers-GM-Hurney-fired

BoneKrusher
10-22-2012, 12:02 PM
if players now control teams, count me out.

maybe it the players in KC would be better fit to run the show, Scott Pioli sure can't run the team.


on second thought yes he can run it in the ground.

T-post Tom
10-22-2012, 12:33 PM
Probably not but, if Cam keeps pouting and crying like a little bitch to the media it could happen. He better start winning some games. Remember how much their owner hated Brees and Manning during the lockout? He was the coldest out of all the owners. He won't feel a bit sorry for Cam.

Maybe Newton and his agent are playing a clever game of cat and mouse:

Newton - 4 yr/$22M (post new CBA)
Bradford - 6 yr/$78M (pre new CBA)

The Bad Guy
10-22-2012, 12:36 PM
It's funny. Pioli wants a team full of choir boys and captains. However, he runs his organization like a dictator devil and treats people like complete shit.

The Bad Guy
10-22-2012, 12:38 PM
I wish Booger would post more. Dude has incredible knowledge about coaches, how they are connected and what their backgrounds are.

ChiefsandO'sfan
10-22-2012, 01:04 PM
Adam Caplan ‏@caplannfl

Oh boy.....RT @josephperson: Rivera: "Changes are coming." Said firing an assistant coach could be a possibility.

Pestilence
10-22-2012, 01:07 PM
Adam Caplan ‏@caplannfl

Oh boy.....RT @josephperson: Rivera: "Changes are coming." Said firing an assistant coach could be a possibility.

Later Daboll.

Von Dumbass
10-22-2012, 01:22 PM
Not good... These teams like Cleveland and Carolina that are getting new GMs might be taking QBs in April. Especially with the lower rookie wage scale.

The Chargers are probably gonna be in the market for a new GM as well.

Von Dumbass
10-22-2012, 01:37 PM
Carolina Panthers should place call to Brian Xanders


Now that Marty Hurney has been fired, the Carolina Panthers need a general manager.

Brian Xanders should be on their short-list of candidates. This is a guy who knows the inner front-office systems of three teams — the Atlanta Falcons, Broncos and New England Patriots (through his time with Josh McDaniels). Xanders has worked nearly NFL job, from coach to salary cap manager to talent evaluator to general manager.

He has worked with coaches Dan Reeves, Jim Mora, Mike Shanahan, Josh McDaniels and John Fox. All that, and Xanders is still only 41. Xanders was let go a week after the 2012 draft as Broncos vice president of football operations John Elway streamlined his front office. But Elway acknowledged then he was saying goodbye to a good football executive.

Panthers owner Jerry Richardson should give Xanders a call.http://blogs.denverpost.com/broncos/2012/10/22/carolina-panthers-place-call-brian-xanders/16373/

Sorter
10-22-2012, 01:40 PM
Not good... These teams like Cleveland and Carolina that are getting new GMs might be taking QBs in April. Especially with the lower rookie wage scale.

http://cdn.hotstockmarket.com/0/0b/0bb69f87_954-not-sure-if-serious.jpeg

Woodchuck
10-22-2012, 01:43 PM
Jason Cole said some interesting stuff about this move by Carolina in the 610 interview. He said GMs might not want to take on Cam Newton because of the way he's acted this year. Cole knocked his leadership and attitude.

ChiefMojo
10-22-2012, 01:47 PM
Which points to what the Denver Post just stated... Panthers should look into someone like Xander as I would assume he would take the gamble of dealing with Cam.

SNR
10-22-2012, 02:33 PM
http://blogs.denverpost.com/broncos/2012/10/22/carolina-panthers-place-call-brian-xanders/16373/
Right. The same guy who drafted Tebow.

Who traded away a rising young franchise QB and his insanely talented WR.

Who with that trade value used a first rounder the following year to acquire a 2nd rounder, which he used to draft Alphonso Smith, who makes OUR midget CBs look like Goliaths. Then he cut Smith the following year.

THAT Brian Xanders?

Why the fuck isn't Carolina on the phone right now with him?!?

Woodchuck
10-22-2012, 02:39 PM
Right. The same guy who drafted Tebow.

Who traded away a rising young franchise QB and his insanely talented WR.

Who with that trade value used a first rounder the following year to acquire a 2nd rounder, which he used to draft Alphonso Smith, who makes OUR midget CBs look like Goliaths. Then he cut Smith the following year.

THAT Brian Xanders?

Why the **** isn't Carolina on the phone right now with him?!?

Actually, he traded Smith to Detroit. Also, Cowhers daughters live in Carolina. Wonder if they have him in mind?

SNR
10-22-2012, 03:07 PM
Actually, he traded Smith to Detroit. Also, Cowhers daughters live in Carolina. Wonder if they have him in mind?

Ah, rape. Oh well. Dan Gronkowski was basically selected with a 1st round pick. Pretty equal to a cut in terms of draft pick pissaway value

BigChiefTablet
10-22-2012, 03:11 PM
"Welcome to Wal-Mart."
Scott Pioli

Pawnmower
10-22-2012, 03:38 PM
Not good... These teams like Cleveland and Carolina that are getting new GMs might be taking QBs in April. Especially with the lower rookie wage scale.

Cam Newton & Weeden? I highly doubt either of these teams will be taking an early QB with their 1st or even 2nd pick

Rams Fan
10-22-2012, 05:30 PM
2 Gm's fired before week 8 come on Chiefs Join the club.

Holmgren wasn't GM.

KCBOSS1
10-22-2012, 06:02 PM
Is it possible to miss King Carl?

Von Dumbass
10-22-2012, 07:28 PM
Right. The same guy who drafted Tebow.

Who traded away a rising young franchise QB and his insanely talented WR.

Who with that trade value used a first rounder the following year to acquire a 2nd rounder, which he used to draft Alphonso Smith, who makes OUR midget CBs look like Goliaths. Then he cut Smith the following year.

THAT Brian Xanders?

Why the **** isn't Carolina on the phone right now with him?!?

A lot of that was McDaniels, although Xanders was a huge Tebow guy.

The Cutler and Marshall deals were ALL McDaniels.

Xanders never had the final say in anything. Shanahan, McDaniels, and Elway were the shot callers when he was in Denver. Xanders was like an overseer of the draft preparations and worked on the contracts.

DaneMcCloud
10-22-2012, 08:03 PM
A lot of that was McDaniels, although Xanders was a huge Tebow guy.

The Cutler and Marshall deals were ALL McDaniels.

Xanders never had the final say in anything. Shanahan, McDaniels, and Elway were the shot callers when he was in Denver. Xanders was like an overseer of the draft preparations and worked on the contracts.

Nobody gives a fuck

Von Dumbass
10-22-2012, 08:10 PM
Nobody gives a ****

He could be your next General Manager so you might want to give a lil shit.

Pasta Giant Meatball
10-22-2012, 08:13 PM
He could be your next General Manager so you might want to give a lil shit.

Dumb.

MotherfuckerJones
10-22-2012, 08:34 PM
If hes our next GM ill SHIT!! NOPE! not happening. its gona be Russ Ball from GB, KC guy that was here with marty. I want Gruden as HC. He was a raider coach. He knows QBs and the AFC West. He also has an attitude and passion. He's a winner too.

DaneMcCloud
10-22-2012, 08:47 PM
He could be your next General Manager so you might want to give a lil shit.

You're fucking dumb

Setsuna
10-22-2012, 09:11 PM
I like Mularkey. Former Gator. Gene Smith and Gene Smith alone needs to be fired.

mnchiefsguy
10-22-2012, 10:13 PM
Props to the Panthers ownership for having the balls to make a move.

Come on Clark, step up to the plate. Time for a change.

cdcox
10-22-2012, 10:28 PM
For as much as people around here want to get rid of Pioli, and I understand the appreciate the argument why he needs to go, I don't think he's going anywhere.

The Chiefs football product has sucked for all of the Pioli years except one. While the Chiefs have talent on the roster, it has not translated to wins. All that said, I think the Chiefs are a much better run franchise under Pioli than they were under Carl Petersen. While none of you care about the business side of things, ownership sure does. So if one were to grade Pioli he would get low marks for football performance and high marks for the business side of things.

I think Pioli deserves to be on the hot seat, but I'm not sold that his replacement would do any better in KC without a QB than Pioli has done. Pioli brought in Cassel, hired two lousy coaches, but I'm not opposed to letting him do a control, alt, delete, especially if we have the top pick in the draft which in addition to our current roster should be enticing to prospective head coaches.

As for Clark, you have to understand he's has a long view perspective. I know some fans want him to listen to them, but come on now. You all hated Carl when he traded Jared Allen, now some of you would take him back. Chiefs fans are like the weather, if you don't like what they are saying give it a minute because their tune will surely change on the drop of a dime.

Yes, I know Dane, I'm a ****ing idiot.

Pioli had total control when he came in. The only break I will give him is on his first head coach, since Clark screwed his options by making him "evaluate" Herm for two weeks, during which time all the coaching talent was signed elsewhere. I hang RAC totally on Pioli.

Since an alt-ctrl-del is a 3-year commitment, minimum, I don't want to go down that road with a guy who has shown such bad judgement to date.

DaneMcCloud
10-22-2012, 10:52 PM
Pioli had total control when he came in. The only break I will give him is on his first head coach, since Clark screwed his options by making him "evaluate" Herm for two weeks, during which time all the coaching talent was signed elsewhere. I hang RAC totally on Pioli.

Since an alt-ctrl-del is a 3-year commitment, minimum, I don't want to go down that road with a guy who has shown such bad judgement to date.

All the coaching talent? Really?

Dude.

cdcox
10-22-2012, 10:55 PM
All the coaching talent? Really?

Dude.

Exactly who was available on January 23, 2009 that would have taken HC only position we should have snapped up?

DaneMcCloud
10-22-2012, 10:57 PM
Exactly who was available on January 23, 2009 that would have taken HC only position we should have snapped up?

Well first off, Pioli wasn't going to hire anyone outside the "Tree". He hired all of his old cronies, from Carthon to Haley, etc. and so on and tried to hire Crennel. Crennel refused due to hip surgery.

The bottom line is that a 35 year old Bill Walsh could have been available and Pioli would have passed.

cdcox
10-22-2012, 11:08 PM
Looking at new HCs in 2010 and 2011, the only one that was 1) available and 2) would take HC only positions that I would strongly prefer over Haley is Jim Harbaugh.

DaneMcCloud
10-22-2012, 11:14 PM
Looking at new HCs in 2010 and 2011, the only one that was 1) available and 2) would take HC only positions that I would strongly prefer over Haley is Jim Harbaugh.

So, out of 114 FBS schools and 32 NFL teams, there was only ONE candidate for the KC Chiefs?

Seriously?

Furthermore, your post was about January 2009, not 2010 or 2011.

cdcox
10-22-2012, 11:22 PM
So, out of 114 FBS schools and 32 NFL teams, there was only ONE candidate for the KC Chiefs?

Seriously?

Furthermore, your post was about January 2009, not 2010 or 2011.

I think the Chiefs were the last team to sit down in the musical chairs of 2009 coaching changes (due to Clark's meddling), so Pioli could not have landed any of those candidates. That's why I looked at 2010 and 2011. If there was another gem other than Jim Harbaugh, no other team found him either. Under the circumstances, Haley was a reasonable choice for a coach. I think he could have been successful with a real QB and a non-dick of a GM.

DaneMcCloud
10-22-2012, 11:34 PM
I think the Chiefs were the last team to sit down in the musical chairs of 2009 coaching changes (due to Clark's meddling), so Pioli could not have landed any of those candidates. That's why I looked at 2010 and 2011. If there was another gem other than Jim Harbaugh, no other team found him either. Under the circumstances, Haley was a reasonable choice for a coach. I think he could have been successful with a real QB and a non-dick of a GM.

After nearly 4 years of the fucking "Parcells Way" in Kansas City, how could you POSSIBLY believe that Haley would have hired ANYONE outside of the "Tree"?

Come on, Dude. You're better than this.

cdcox
10-22-2012, 11:57 PM
After nearly 4 years of the ****ing "Parcells Way" in Kansas City, how could you POSSIBLY believe that Haley would have hired ANYONE outside of the "Tree"?

Come on, Dude. You're better than this.

Well, if we realistically restrict ourselves with the tree, we could have had Josh McDaniels or Jim Schwartz if Clark had stayed out the picture. McDaniels' problems were in the GM type responsibilities, although wanting Cassel is a huge minus. Schwartz?

DaneMcCloud
10-23-2012, 12:08 AM
Well, if we realistically restrict ourselves with the tree, we could have had Josh McDaniels or Jim Schwartz if Clark had stayed out the picture. McDaniels' problems were in the GM type responsibilities, although wanting Cassel is a huge minus. Schwartz?

I'm really glad that McDaniels wasn't hired by the Chiefs. We dodged a bullet there, IMO. He wasn't good in Denver and wasn't good in St. Louis but suddenly looks a little better in New England. I wonder why?

;)

Schwartz isn't looking so hot these days, either. And that's with a Franchise QB and tons of draft picks spent on the defensive line (sound familiar?).

All that said, Pioli has made poor decisions since the day he was hired and I don't think that either of those guys would have made a difference.

AussieChiefsFan
10-23-2012, 12:20 AM
Hopefully this will encourage/break the ice for Clark.

DaneMcCloud
10-23-2012, 12:22 AM
Hopefully this will encourage/break the ice for Clark.

Unfortunately, I don't think it'll have any effect, at least publicly.

The best Chiefs fans can hope for is that he's decided to fire Pioli at the end of the season and has begun putting together a search committee.

Chocolate Hog
10-23-2012, 01:10 AM
Unfortunately, I don't think it'll have any effect, at least publicly.

The best Chiefs fans can hope for is that he's decided to fire Pioli at the end of the season and has begun putting together a search committee.

I think he's keeping Pioli for atleast another year. Cassel has been a scapegoat next will be Crennel.

NJChiefsFan
10-23-2012, 01:30 AM
I think he's keeping Pioli for atleast another year. Cassel has been a scapegoat next will be Crennel.

Haley can be a scapegoat, even though I liked him and thought people blamed him way too much for some of this. But atleast Pioli has some bullshit he can say to blame it on Haley. He has nothing with Cassel. He brought him over, he gave him the contract, and he gave him 4 years. Hell he didn't even take him out until the media and fans got all over him about it.

MotherfuckerJones
10-23-2012, 03:53 AM
IMO Clark will fire him 2 weeks before the end of the season roughly because hell let pioli take heat so he won't have to speak

Woodchuck
10-23-2012, 06:53 AM
Unfortunately, I don't think it'll have any effect, at least publicly.

The best Chiefs fans can hope for is that he's decided to fire Pioli at the end of the season and has begun putting together a search committee.

No, most of the other owners think Jerry Richardson, the Panthers owner, is a nut job. He's that rich old crooner who sits in his house at the top of the hill. He views players as gladiators and has no respect for them. The other owners kicked him out of the cba negociations. Clark probably thinks he's a kook. The guy is an A+ asshole.

okoye35chiefs
10-23-2012, 07:02 AM
A team starts 1-5 that has high pre season praise and expectations. Sound like any other team you know?

The difference is the Panthers have playoff victories and a Super Bowl trip and let their GM go.

DaKCMan AP
10-23-2012, 07:03 AM
A team starts 1-5 that has high pre season praise and expectations. Sound like any other team you know?

The difference is the Panthers have playoff victories and a Super Bowl trip and let their GM go.

Hey, can I finally get my autographed 8x10?

Sweet Daddy Hate
10-23-2012, 09:03 AM
Is it possible to miss King Carl?

Fuck AND no.

htismaqe
10-23-2012, 09:16 AM
I'm really glad that McDaniels wasn't hired by the Chiefs. We dodged a bullet there, IMO. He wasn't good in Denver and wasn't good in St. Louis but suddenly looks a little better in New England. I wonder why?

;)

Schwartz isn't looking so hot these days, either. And that's with a Franchise QB and tons of draft picks spent on the defensive line (sound familiar?).

All that said, Pioli has made poor decisions since the day he was hired and I don't think that either of those guys would have made a difference.

We didn't dodge anything.

Josh McDaniels will be replacing Romeo.

Rausch
10-23-2012, 09:26 AM
We didn't dodge anything.

Josh McDaniels will be replacing Romeo.

Pffffft.

Reason 2,312 to put all our efforts behind replacing Pioli...

htismaqe
10-23-2012, 09:39 AM
Pffffft.

Reason 2,312 to put all our efforts behind replacing Pioli...

Precisely.

Cassel is a symptom. We need to concentrate on the DISEASE.

Rausch
10-23-2012, 09:46 AM
Precisely.

Cassel is a symptom. We need to concentrate on the DISEASE.

Perfectly stated.

Now we need Quinn to play well and Romeo to coach poorly to highlight the idiocy of his moves...

ChiefsandO'sfan
11-09-2012, 11:26 AM
Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer

@josephperson Panthers have hired former NY GIants GM Ernie Accorsi to serve as consultant in search for GM.

bowener
11-09-2012, 12:06 PM
Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer

@josephperson Panthers have hired former NY GIants GM Ernie Accorsi to serve as consultant in search for GM.

Does Ross have the fast track to being GM in CAR now?

Chocolate Hog
11-09-2012, 12:14 PM
Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer

@josephperson Panthers have hired former NY GIants GM Ernie Accorsi to serve as consultant in search for GM.

Fuck. Acorsi is the guy who built most of the current Giants team this is fucking awful. Get off your ass Clark and don't let that loser Marty serve as a consultant.

Chocolate Hog
11-09-2012, 12:15 PM
Does Ross have the fast track to being GM in CAR now?

Maybe but Acorsi also worked in Cleveland during the same time as Belichick.

bowener
11-09-2012, 12:17 PM
Maybe but Acorsi also worked in Cleveland during the same time as Belichick.

GIVE THEM PIOLI NOW!

ChiefsCountry
11-09-2012, 12:49 PM
Accorsi and Ross never worked together.

dallaschiefsfan
11-09-2012, 02:56 PM
Only team we have to worry about that will take a QB is Jax. No way Browns or Panthers take a 1st round QB this year. If Andrew Luck were in the draft...yes...but this draft doesn't have that "must take if he's there" guy.