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JohnnyHammersticks
11-07-2012, 12:12 AM
...as Colorado and Washington "Legalize It". :clap:

fire_egoli
11-07-2012, 12:14 AM
GO JAGUARS!

Simply Red
11-07-2012, 12:15 AM
Great thread creation!

Mugalug
11-07-2012, 12:21 AM
:bong::bong::bong:


Woot!

BWillie
11-07-2012, 01:22 AM
I didnt even know that there was a discussion about legalizing pot. Good deal. The cartel is really gonna be pissed....

MTG#10
11-07-2012, 07:04 AM
Unfortunately it won't hold up in court

theelusiveeightrop
11-07-2012, 07:05 AM
Hey mon, great thread.

Woodchuck
11-07-2012, 07:07 AM
...as Colorado and Washington "Legalize It". :clap:

It's a Start!!!! Hell yes! :clap:

htismaqe
11-07-2012, 07:17 AM
Unfortunately it won't hold up in court

They won't use the courts. They'll use the IRS.

Woodchuck
11-07-2012, 07:27 AM
They won't use the courts. They'll use the IRS.

Why can't this country do anything that makes sense? Legalizing pot and the fair tax are two examples of what I mean.

Red Beans
11-07-2012, 07:35 AM
Unfortunately it won't hold up in court

It won't matter, the dam has broken. Once states see how they put those tax revenues to use, you're going to have the staunchest conservatives lobbying for similar measures in their states.

htismaqe
11-07-2012, 07:50 AM
It won't matter, the dam has broken. Once states see how they put those tax revenues to use, you're going to have the staunchest conservatives lobbying for similar measures in their states.

Don't be so sure about that.

California, in some jurisdictions, has literally taxed the dispensaries out of existence, licking the gift horse in the mouth.

I believe it's in the Bay area that they allowed all of these business to get started and established and then retroactively applied new tax code, resulting in a several hundred percent increase in taxes overnight. Several dispensaries just shut their doors.

the Talking Can
11-07-2012, 08:04 AM
love it

JohnnyHammersticks
11-07-2012, 08:06 AM
Unfortunately it won't hold up in court

You do realize that there are currently over 3x as many marijuana stores in Denver as there are McDonalds and Starbucks combined, right? This has been in place since 2009, and although the Feds certainly haven't made it easy on us, they realize it would be political suicide in Colorado to come in a try to shut it down.

This actually gives me a slight bit of hope for our country, as it appears that--at least in 2 states--more people believe in the intelligence of ending cannabis prohibition than do still believe the brainwashing propaganda that they've been fed the last 75 years.

Good job Colorado! Good job Washington! Good job America! Chalk one up for individual freedom and liberty!

KC Tattoo
11-07-2012, 08:06 AM
It's still illegal under federal law. That could be just a minor inconvenience to some?

BigCatDaddy
11-07-2012, 08:11 AM
As long as the mother fuckers aren't driving down the highway at 45MPH on this shit then I'm cool with it.

malachi47000
11-07-2012, 08:33 AM
http://www.theatlanticwire.com/national/2012/11/suddenly-pot-legal-part-united-states/58780/


Adam Clark Estes 12:42 AM ET

While you were watching to see whether Romney or Obama won Ohio, both Colorado and Washington legalized marijuana for recreational use on Tuesday. We're not talking about making medical marijuana legal or decriminalizing the possession of small amounts of pot. These two states just gave the green light to an entirely new industry including but not limited to the large scale production, distribution and sale of marijuana. Just like in Amsterdam, only more comprehensive.

There's only one problem: Marijuana is still illegal at a federal level. Ever since states started to legalize medical marijuana in the 1990s, state and federal authorities have locked horns over the enforcement of drug laws. It was entirely legal from the states' point of view for folks to run commercial marijuana farms and to set up medical marijuana dispensaries. The DEA, however, has continued to raid farms and dispensaries, leaving many to wonder if the latest marijuana initiatives will fly on a federal level.

Generally speaking, we'll have to wait and see. In both states, it's going to be a number of months before shops actually start to sell pot. When they do -- based on the legislation that voters approved on Tuesday -- the tax revenue generated will go towards important things like improving schools. Attorney General Eric Holder hasn't said yet how exactly he plans to deal with the new state provisions, but if history is any indication, he's not going to give them a free pass.

We doubt any of this news is going to get the potheads of Colorado and Washington down. Supporters of the measures have poured millions of dollars into the campaign to get them passed, and they've succeeded in two out of the three states that had legalization on the ballot. Additionally, Massachusetts legalized marijuana for medical use. No matter what the federal government does, nobody can deny that there's momentum behind the movement to legalize pot. Then again, a lot of people probably said the same thing back in the 1970s when Oregon became the first state to decriminalize pot. Forty years later, voters have legalized pot completely in two states. At this rate we should be able to buy packs of joints by the 22nd century.

JohnnyHammersticks
11-07-2012, 08:39 AM
As has been covered in the thread right next to the new one you started...

rabblerouser
11-07-2012, 08:40 AM
Holy shit, who knew!!!???


Oh, that's right - everyone in America did 10 hours ago.

Predarat
11-07-2012, 08:43 AM
V-A-C-A-T,I,O,N gunna have a toke! Cant wait for Coors Green.

JohnnyHammersticks
11-07-2012, 08:44 AM
Something that isn't getting any publicity related to the constitutional amendment that we just passed in Colorado, is that Amendment 64 not only regulates marijuana like alcohol, but also directs the general assembly to regulate the cultivation, processing, and sale of industrial hemp.

This is HUGE! Regardless of any backwards-ass perceptions people have about the marijuana that gets you high, I think even the most dull, uninformed, morons would have to agree that ending the ban on the cultivation and production of industrial hemp is a great thing! Good job Colorado!

Der Flöprer
11-07-2012, 08:47 AM
Shit. May have to move back to Seattle. :bong:

So I guess Oregon didn't pass it? Surprising considering they were the very last state to criminalize it, and that was over highway funding being threatened.

htismaqe
11-07-2012, 09:01 AM
Something that isn't getting any publicity related to the constitutional amendment that we just passed in Colorado, is that Amendment 64 not only regulates marijuana like alcohol, but also directs the general assembly to regulate the cultivation, processing, and sale of industrial hemp.

This is HUGE! Regardless of any backwards-ass perceptions people have about the marijuana that gets you high, I think even the most dull, uninformed, morons would have to agree that ending the ban on the cultivation and production of industrial hemp is a great thing! Good job Colorado!

:clap::clap::clap:

That's not 100% accurate.

Hemp is a staple crop. Medicinal (or recreational) marijuana is just the "fruit" if you will. The rest of the plant is imminently useable.

I'm still pissed we're not using hemp for more biofuel. It's easier to grow than soybearns, yields more useable product per acre than corn, and produces more oxygen than the equivalent square footage of trees.

I posted that yesterday in another thread.

JohnnyHammersticks
11-07-2012, 09:24 AM
I wrote a thesis paper on industrial hemp in college. Most people have no idea how big this is, but I'm every bit as excited about the industrial hemp aspect of Amend. 64 as I am the recreational mj aspect! It really is huge, farmers in Colorado should be doing cartwheels right now!

Ace Gunner
11-07-2012, 09:31 AM
I wrote a thesis paper on industrial hemp in college. Most people have no idea how big this is, but I'm every bit as excited about the industrial hemp aspect of Amend. 64 as I am the recreational mj aspect! It really is huge, farmers in Colorado should be doing cartwheels right now!

for example, our computers and car bumpers/fenders could be made from hemp plastic with hemp fiber imbedded in them for strength much the way our currency is.

Ace Gunner
11-07-2012, 09:35 AM
As long as the mother ****ers aren't driving down the highway at 45MPH on this shit then I'm cool with it.

today 30 americans will die from alcohol related automobile activity.

Molitoth
11-07-2012, 10:16 AM
Awesome! Hopefully they can model a plan for the rest of the states to hop on board.

Ace Gunner
11-07-2012, 10:49 AM
except that employers will continue anti pot policies and pour the budweiser at christmas parties, which severely limits pot retail.

frankotank
11-07-2012, 10:54 AM
DUDE! WHOA!

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m611tp0iYC1qap7nno1_1280.png

BoneKrusher
11-07-2012, 10:58 AM
now we know why Manning went to Denver.

Frosty
11-07-2012, 10:59 AM
Can someone point me to a good explanation on how this is supposed to work (in Washington particularly), without the hyperbole? How is the state going to control/tax it? Are there going to be state run head shops like the liquor stores (used to be)?

listopencil
11-07-2012, 10:59 AM
except that employers will continue anti pot policies and pour the budweiser at christmas parties, which severely limits pot retail.


^

Mr. Laz
11-07-2012, 11:03 AM
it will eventually be legal everywhere

Detoxing
11-07-2012, 11:04 AM
Can someone point me to a good explanation on how this is supposed to work (in Washington particularly), without the hyperbole? How is the state going to control/tax it? Are there going to be state run head shops like the liquor stores (used to be)?

Also, is it only sold in Smoke Shops, or is this something we're going to find in liquor stores and 7-11's?

BigCatDaddy
11-07-2012, 11:19 AM
today 30 americans will die from alcohol related automobile activity.

And you want to add to the total number of people killed by someone being under the influence of something behind the wheel?

malachi47000
11-07-2012, 11:21 AM
Also, is it only sold in Smoke Shops, or is this something we're going to find in liquor stores and 7-11's?

it will be in 7-11's right next to the funyuns and hostess cakes (both which will produce record sales in 2013)

malachi47000
11-07-2012, 11:22 AM
today 30 americans will die from alcohol related automobile activity.

All of whom will be trying to speed around the potheads going 30 miles per hour...

Garcia Bronco
11-07-2012, 11:25 AM
I can understand the Federal Government's right to police interstate commerce, but if the pot stays here in my state, I say they have no room to do anything to any individual.

Ace Gunner
11-07-2012, 11:42 AM
And you want to add to the total number of people killed by someone being under the influence of something behind the wheel?

heh? is the date stamp on this post correct? I mean, isn't this post from 1936?

Where in my posts have I condoned drug use and driving?

Au contraire -- I have urged folks to obstain from these activities during obvious holiday threads.

drug related deaths are primarily related to alcohol and script drugs. not by a small margin, by a huge margin.

maybe, just maybe many of those "addict" personalities could be redirected toward a far less socially and individually dangerous drug on their way to full recovery.

Ace Gunner
11-07-2012, 11:44 AM
All of whom will be trying to speed around the potheads going 30 miles per hour...

http://www.scribbleoneverything.com/images/uploads/WallDecals/cartoon/bam.gif

BigCatDaddy
11-07-2012, 11:47 AM
heh? is the date stamp on this post correct? I mean, isn't this post from 1936?

Where in my posts have I condoned drug use and driving?

Au contraire -- I have urged folks to obstain from these activities during obvious holiday threads.

drug related deaths are primarily related to alcohol and script drugs. not by a small margin, by a huge margin.

maybe, just maybe many of those "addict" personalities could be redirected toward a far less socially and individually dangerous drug on their way to full recovery.


From someone that has drove drunk and stoned in my youth. I know which one impaired my driving more and it wasn't alchohol.

Getting behind the wheel being anything but sober is a bad idea.

Frosty
11-07-2012, 11:51 AM
drug related deaths are primarily related to alcohol and script drugs. not by a small margin, by a huge margin.

Not trying to send this off to DC or anything, but how do they know for sure? Do they routinely test for THC in every case of fatal traffic accidents?

teedubya
11-07-2012, 11:52 AM
Something that isn't getting any publicity related to the constitutional amendment that we just passed in Colorado, is that Amendment 64 not only regulates marijuana like alcohol, but also directs the general assembly to regulate the cultivation, processing, and sale of industrial hemp.

This is HUGE! Regardless of any backwards-ass perceptions people have about the marijuana that gets you high, I think even the most dull, uninformed, morons would have to agree that ending the ban on the cultivation and production of industrial hemp is a great thing! Good job Colorado!

YES. Herein lies one of the greatest opportunities of the 21st century, IMO.

I've been a HUGE proponent of hemp for about 20 years. Hemp is why marijuana is illegal... NOT BECAUSE YOU CAN GET HIGH FROM MARIJUANA... the prohibition of marijuana was an indirect ploy to make hemp illegal.

Brock
11-07-2012, 11:53 AM
From someone that has drove drunk and stoned in my youth. I know which one impaired my driving more and it wasn't alchohol.


You just thought you were driving better when you were drunk. Hint: You weren't.

BigCatDaddy
11-07-2012, 11:54 AM
You just thought you were driving better when you were drunk. Hint: You weren't.

I didn't say it was good driving, but I know which one was worse. No studies to back it up just my broscience experience.

listopencil
11-07-2012, 12:07 PM
I can understand the Federal Government's right to police interstate commerce, but if the pot stays here in my state, I say they have no room to do anything to any individual.

It looks like Federal regs are based on the scheduling of the drug. Right now pot is listed as having no medicinal value with a high likelihood of abuse. So the DEA can go after it.

Nirvana58
11-07-2012, 12:16 PM
I didn't say it was good driving, but I know which one was worse. No studies to back it up just my broscience experience.

Alcohol gives you a false sense of confidence. Trust me there is no way a drunk driver is safer than a stoned driver.

BigCatDaddy
11-07-2012, 12:17 PM
Alcohol gives you a false sense of confidence. Trust me there is no way a drunk driver is safer than a stoned driver.

Trust me. I drove the damn car. Maybe not every driver does that apply for this one it does.

Nirvana58
11-07-2012, 12:21 PM
Trust me. I drove the damn car. Maybe not every driver does that apply for this one it does.

You might be the one exception. However, 99% of the time a drunk driver is way more dangerous than a stoned one. I wouldn't recommend either but I am more afraid of the drunk blaring his music, speeding, and swerving all over the road. Than the stoner who is driving 10 miles under the speed limit, paranoid that there are cops everywhere.

lcarus
11-07-2012, 12:23 PM
As long as the mother fuckers aren't driving down the highway at 45MPH on this shit then I'm cool with it.

Better than being drunk and driving 95 mph lol. Which probably happens all the time.

BigCatDaddy
11-07-2012, 12:25 PM
You might be the one exception. However, 99% of the time a drunk driver is way more dangerous than a stoned one. I wouldn't recommend either but I am more afraid of the drunk blaring his music, speeding, and swerving all over the road. Than the stoner who is driving 10 miles under the speed limit, paranoid that there are cops everywhere.

Maybe I should rephrase. Not shit ass drunk. But maybe 4 beers deep and not about to pass out at the wheel as everything spins in circles.

I can assure you I drive better in that scenario that after smoking a fatty.

Like I said I'm all for legalization, just as long as the same DWI laws apply.

BigCatDaddy
11-07-2012, 12:26 PM
Better than being drunk and driving 95 mph lol. Which probably happens all the time.

Yeah, and as someone pointed out those 2 things don't make for a good combo.

Ace Gunner
11-07-2012, 12:45 PM
Not trying to send this off to DC or anything, but how do they know for sure? Do they routinely test for THC in every case of fatal traffic accidents?

what would be the point? drug abuse is out of control because folks are forensically obsessed instead of being realistic about drug abuse.

Doctors and other medically trained experts have been systematically eliminated from national drug treatment programs in favor of medically novice or otherwise untrained police officers, security personnel & military.

What is the objective in finding the "equally debilitating amount of one drug compared to another" when we already know the nation has a drug abuse epidemic that is responsible for billion$ in spending with no impact on reduction whatsoever?

I think the question has no impact on drug abuse, obviously.

And, just to remind folks -- I am not a pot user and I rarely drink alcohol. I don't use script drugs either unless I have a specific use such as my inhalers for asthma or the Nyquil I use etc.

However, I do associate with many drug users and some abusers in my line of work. So, I do have some first hand experience with the subject.

The_Doctor10
11-07-2012, 01:35 PM
It looks like Federal regs are based on the scheduling of the drug. Right now pot is listed as having no medicinal value with a high likelihood of abuse. So the DEA can go after it.

If thousands of board certified physicians can write scrips for it every day, how can anyone claim it has 'no medicinal value'?

scho63
11-07-2012, 02:47 PM
Peter Tosh is a great reference! Pos Rep!!! :clap:

Braincase
11-07-2012, 02:58 PM
Easy solution... you want less grass related crime, decriminalize it.

JohnnyHammersticks
11-07-2012, 04:45 PM
From someone that has drove drunk and stoned in my youth. I know which one impaired my driving more and it wasn't alchohol.

Getting behind the wheel being anything but sober is a bad idea.

I started to reply to this, but it's just too damn ignorant to waste the time on.

Halfcan
11-07-2012, 04:54 PM
What the hell is Mexico going to do with their truckloads of pot when every one in the midwest is geting it from colorado?

Colorado is about to have the Best economy in the Nation. Throw in the drug tourist with everything else the state has- wow it will be The place to live.

JohnnyHammersticks
11-07-2012, 05:14 PM
What the hell is Mexico going to do with their truckloads of pot when every one in the midwest is geting it from colorado?

Colorado is about to have the Best economy in the Nation. Throw in the drug tourist with everything else the state has- wow it will be The place to live.

This.

It's going to be like the 70's, when people drove to Colorado to get Coors. But without all the drunk driving accidents on the way back to wherever they came from, of course.

JohnnyHammersticks
11-07-2012, 05:34 PM
Why Medical Marijuana Laws Reduce Traffic Deaths

States that legalize medical marijuana see fewer fatal car accidents, according to a new study, in part because people may be substituting marijuana smoking for drinking alcohol.

Sixteen states and the District of Columbia, have legalized medical marijuana since the mid-1990s. For the new study, economists looked at 1990-2009 government data on marijuana use and traffic deaths in the 13 states that had passed legalization laws during that time period. The data were from the National Household Survey on Drug Use and Health and the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration.

Comparing traffic deaths over time in states with and without medical marijuana law changes, the researchers found that fatal car wrecks dropped by 9% in states that legalized medical use — which was largely attributable to a decline in drunk driving. The researchers controlled for other factors like changes in driving laws and the number of miles driven that could affect the results.

Medical marijuana laws were not significantly linked with changes in daytime crash rates or those that didn’t involve alcohol. But the rate of fatal crashes in which a driver had consumed any alcohol dropped 12% after medical marijuana was legalized, and crashes involving high levels of alcohol consumption fell 14%.

The authors found that medical marijuana laws reduced crashes in men more than in women — by 13% compared to 9% — in line with data showing that men are more likely to register as medical marijuana users than women.

The overall reduction in traffic deaths was comparable to that seen after the national minimum drinking age was raised to 21, the authors note.

“We were astounded by how little is known about the effects of legalizing medical marijuana,” lead author Daniel Rees, professor of economics at the University of Colorado-Denver, said in a statement. ”We looked into traffic fatalities because there is good data, and the data allow us to test whether alcohol was a factor. … Traffic fatalities are an important outcome from a policy perspective because they represent the leading cause of death among Americans ages 5 to 34.”

The authors also found that in states that legalized medical use, there was no increase in marijuana smoking by teenagers — a finding seen in other studies as well. But, in many cases, the laws were linked with an increase in marijuana smoking among adults in their 20s; this rise was accompanied by a reduction in alcohol use by college age youth, suggesting that they were smoking weed instead.

Studies have consistently found that while mixing either marijuana or alcohol with driving is unadvisable, driving high is much safer than driving drunk. Research on stoned driving is inconsistent, with some studies finding impairment and others not; the alcohol data, however, is clear in establishing a link between drinking and significant deterioration in driving skills. The data also consistently shows that using both drugs together is worst of all.

Driving under the influence of marijuana seems to be less risky because people who are high tend to be aware that they are impaired and compensate, while alcohol tends to increase recklessness and create false confidence. Also, people are more likely to smoke weed at home or in private, rather than out at bars or other public events that require driving to get to.

The research was published by IZA, a nonprofit labor research organization associated with the University of Bonn in Germany. It is a working paper, which means it has not yet been subjected to peer review.

Maia Szalavitz is a health writer at TIME.com. Find her on Twitter at @maiasz. You can also continue the discussion on TIME Healthland’s Facebook page and on Twitter at @TIMEHealthland.

Read more: http://healthland.time.com/2011/12/02/why-medical-marijuana-laws-reduce-traffic-deaths/#ixzz2BaBH81Vq

Stanley Nickels
11-07-2012, 05:37 PM
Marijuana isn't illegal because it's dangerous, it's dangerous because it's illegal.

Cliched though that phrase may be, it's absolutely true. The border just became a LITTLE BIT safer, and the Mexican cartels just lost a LITTLE BIT of their stranglehold over nearly every facet of Mexican life.

I think it's absolutely prudent and appropriate to restrict its sale and growth, just like alcohol.. but I think it's an absolute sham to proclaim it as a dangerous drug. If you think you're just going to have a bunch of stoned-to-the-gills kids walking around your city, you're probably unaware of how many people are already high on a daily basis. I'm not a big weed smoker (maybe a couple times a year, if that), but I certainly see no reason why it's any more dangerous than alcohol (in terms of its effects on the general public) or cigarettes (and their effect on personal health). I don't think any of the three should be prohibited, and it's very concerning that there are those who would allow the government to simply dictate to a populace what they can and cannot do in their private lives. Driving high? Give 'em a ticket.

Borrow my analogy from earlier... say that, by some irrational change in logic, hordes of people will (only now that it's legal) get stoned and hang out in public... would you rather that, or have the typical college town experiences where hordes of kids stumble into the street drunk, fighting each other, making out while stumbling over cars, and driving while severely impaired? My answer doesn't take much deliberation.

crispystl420
11-07-2012, 05:39 PM
Thoughts?

Gadzooks
11-07-2012, 05:40 PM
Hey Man, I thin

JohnnyHammersticks
11-07-2012, 05:41 PM
Thoughts?

You're really, really baked?

MeatRock
11-07-2012, 05:43 PM
Too many dead braincells to think. :bong:

Johnny Vegas
11-07-2012, 05:43 PM
?? They didn't have anything on the ballot this year to vote for recreational legalization. Colorado and Washington did.

Stanley Nickels
11-07-2012, 05:45 PM
https://twimg0-a.akamaihd.net/profile_images/512643875/Q_LOGOweb.jpg

BossChief
11-07-2012, 05:47 PM
Hold on, what?

Richard_Cuckold
11-07-2012, 05:48 PM
good. That shit should be legal

theelusiveeightrop
11-07-2012, 05:56 PM
California did? News to me.

DaFace
11-07-2012, 05:57 PM
Based on your username, I'm gonna assume you're high.

crispystl420
11-07-2012, 06:01 PM
Whoops meant Colorado!

crispystl420
11-07-2012, 06:02 PM
I know there's a thread in DC but I loathe that shit hole.

2bikemike
11-07-2012, 06:04 PM
AS far as I know California has not legalized Recreational MJ. They have legalized Medical MJ in the past. Which is being fought by the feds.

Maybe there are some regional areas that passed something throughout the election yesterday but there was nothing on my ballot in Rural San Diego County

BossChief
11-07-2012, 06:07 PM
I think he meant to say that it was legalized in the united states of his spare room...he just calls it California.

DaFace
11-07-2012, 06:10 PM
I merged it with the other thread that was apparently posted in the Lounge this morning, then moved to DC. We can move it back if this ends up seeming too political.

MeatRock
11-07-2012, 06:14 PM
The Fed's think they do and always will until all states legalize the shit.

Stanley Nickels
11-07-2012, 06:20 PM
It looks like Federal regs are based on the scheduling of the drug. Right now pot is listed as having no medicinal value with a high likelihood of abuse. So the DEA can go after it.

I know you're not endorsing the DEAs view, but I'd still like to respond:

That's bullshit.

Marijuana has a number of medicinal uses. They may not be the BEST AVAILABLE treatments, but they're natural and they do produce some level of symptom alleviation.

The prohibition on weed is commonly attributed to the alcohol and tobacco companies, but the MAJOR player in the fight is the pharmaceutical industry. The natural argument to that is, "well, let the pharm companies produce their own". Never, ever. The pharm companies understand that the growth of these plants is easy and readily available, making their advances in that industry difficult-at-best.

To the medicinal uses: weed is primarily a pain alleviator. It reduces intraocular pressure (hence the "glaucoma" stereotype), and depending on strain, can reduce anxiety, break insomnia, and certainly diminish post-chemotherapy symptoms. I work with a clinical oncologist, and she is a big believer in that type of natural approach, but often is left to proscribing whichever insurance-approved pharmaceuticals (many of which present a whole host of unrelated pharmacological issues) she's left with.

Chief Roundup
11-07-2012, 06:22 PM
except that employers will continue anti pot policies and pour the budweiser at christmas parties, which severely limits pot retail.

How are they going to legally test you for something that is not a controlled substance?

Ace Gunner
11-07-2012, 06:23 PM
I know there's a thread in DC but I loathe that shit hole.

go wash your vagina. now.

hometeam
11-07-2012, 06:24 PM
Hooray! Ass backwards missouri will be ten years behind the rest of the country.

Ace Gunner
11-07-2012, 06:25 PM
How are they going to legally test you for something that is not a controlled substance?

If your employer stipulates "no chocolate" and you refuse to empty your pockets, they have the right to dismiss. It's all about your employment agreement.

MeatRock
11-07-2012, 06:26 PM
How are they going to legally test you for something that is not a controlled substance?

Because you would be under the influence of a drug, be it pot, prescription drugs, or w/e. They can claim that you could jeopardize the safety of others, depending on your occupation.

Ace Gunner
11-07-2012, 06:30 PM
Because you would be under the influence of a drug, be it pot, prescription drugs, or w/e. They can claim that you could jeopardize the safety of others, depending on your occupation.

no, that's not how it works.


to be clear, there is no entity that has the "right" to search your piss unless you sign on for it.

don't you people have work contracts?

Stanley Nickels
11-07-2012, 06:32 PM
If your employer stipulates "no chocolate" and you refuse to empty your pockets, they have the right to dismiss. It's all about your employment agreement.

Yup. BUT, constitutional or not, this is where you'll see the best version of the libertarian ideal that "discriminate or prohibit if you want, but at your own peril". Once marijuana is no longer prohibited, employers who choose to perform THC-based drug testing will only hurt themselves. There are plenty of immensely intelligent people I know who smoke marijuana, and employers only do themselves a disservice by prohibiting them from gainful employment. Abuse of heroine, crack, cocaine, I can see... but not weed.

hometeam
11-07-2012, 06:33 PM
Most employers have you sign a waiver when you are hired that says they can piss test you, in all of these waivers it includes legal and illegal drugs, namely alchohol. So yes, employer can piss test you for anything they want, if you sign the waiver.

Stanley Nickels
11-07-2012, 06:35 PM
Because you would be under the influence of a drug, be it pot, prescription drugs, or w/e. They can claim that you could jeopardize the safety of others, depending on your occupation.

There is no testing -- at least in most civillian, "normal" jobs -- for alcohol or pharmaceuticals (that don't also match drug profiles, like Adderall), so why would employers only care about prohibited drugs? The abuse of oxy contin or alcohol are just as dangerous, or more so, than marijuana abuse. And in each case, the company should have trained their employees to spot workers who they suspect are under the influence. Weed has nothing to do with it.

tmax63
11-07-2012, 06:35 PM
For most jobs in the government p-tests are a condition of employment and if you don't accept the conditions of employment you are not elgible to be hired.

MeatRock
11-07-2012, 06:36 PM
no, that's not how it works.


to be clear, there is no entity that has the "right" to search your piss unless you sign on for it.

don't you people have work contracts?

That's bullshit. An employer can, at anytime, mandate random urine test's for it's employees for any non-prescription drug use. They do have to give notice that the random test's are being utilized. If you don't like being tested, find a new job. Now, i am not sure how unions work with testings, but im sure the unions would have to have notice and agree to this.

The_Doctor10
11-07-2012, 06:37 PM
Most employers have you sign a waiver when you are hired that says they can piss test you, in all of these waivers it includes legal and illegal drugs, namely alchohol. So yes, employer can piss test you for anything they want, if you sign the waiver.

And just out of curiousity, what is the recourse for an employer who finds out that you have tested positive for alcohol? Or any other legal substance? Seems like it would be grounds for a lawsuit unless the company could prove it was demonstrably harming your work.

Stanley Nickels
11-07-2012, 06:40 PM
Most employers have you sign a waiver when you are hired that says they can piss test you, in all of these waivers it includes legal and illegal drugs, namely alchohol. So yes, employer can piss test you for anything they want, if you sign the waiver.

You're absolutely right. The point is, as marijuana gains a level of national "acceptance" (or whatever term you'd prefer), companies will begin to treat the use of marijuana the way they currently treat alcohol; when both are legal, companies who choose not to employ users of either, effectively limit themselves on the types of people they hire. This can be detrimental, or to their favor-- the jury's still out. There are many companies that do not drug test-- Apple, most (non-physical labor) retail, many small businesses, etc-- and many that do.

teedubya
11-07-2012, 06:42 PM
50,000 uses for Hemp...

Stanley Nickels
11-07-2012, 06:44 PM
And just out of curiousity, what is the recourse for an employer who finds out that you have tested positive for alcohol? Or any other legal substance? Seems like it would be grounds for a lawsuit unless the company could prove it was demonstrably harming your work.

Not if, by accepting that job, you have agreed that you will not use alcohol. You're ESPECIALLY screwed if you live in a right-to-work state. I'm a huge proponent of allowing companies to do whatever they want, but they do accept a level of risk when they don't hire certain people (see: Fitch, Abercrombie v non-whites), treat employees poorly (see Mart, Wal), or fail to see that people who recreationally or casually use drugs can still be professionally productive (see: Apple).

JohnnyHammersticks
11-07-2012, 07:08 PM
If you'd like to know the true depth of hypocrisy of our federal government in terms of classifying cannabis as a drug with no medicinal value, take a look at the verbiage in US Patent 6630507, titled “Cannabinoids as antioxidants and neuroprotectants”, held by the US Government as represented by the Dept. of Health and Human Services.

The patent claims;
"Cannabinoids have been found to have antioxidant properties, unrelated to NMDA receptor antagonism. This new found property makes cannabinoids useful in the treatment and prophylaxis of wide variety of oxidation associated diseases, such as ischemic, age-related, inflammatory and autoimmune diseases.The cannabinoids are found to have particular application as neuroprotectants, for example in limiting neurological damage following ischemic insults, such as stroke and trauma, or in the treatment of neurodegenerative diseases, such as Alzheimer’s disease, Parkinson’s disease and HIV dementia.”

Our government knows that cannabis is effective against Alzheimer's, it's right there in black & white. Our government knows about the alarming Alzheimer's "epidemic" we're starting to experience in this country. Yet our government refuses to do anything about it, and we as a citizenry sit and do nothing. We allow ourselves to be brainwashed into thinking that voting for any candidate other than republican or democrat--which is the only way things are ever going to change--is "throwing our vote away". We deserve the shitshow masquerading as leadership that we get because we're the morons who keep electing them, even though we have alternatives available right there on the ballot.

The average American has the IQ of a prairie dog, and the scariest thing is, by definition, half of us are even dumber than that.

DaFace
11-07-2012, 07:13 PM
For the record, the Colorado version at least has a specific statement that says employers can do whatever they want.

MeatRock
11-07-2012, 07:26 PM
If George and Martha Washington smoked, then we all should be able to smoke, didn't you know that dude?

ElGringo
11-07-2012, 08:48 PM
I also believe the lawmakers in these 2 states will delay the true passing of this bill even longer. I will preface this with you should not drive under the influence or while consuming any substance that may impair your judgement.

How will the enforce driving under the influence or open container. Will there be some sort of a "seal" on all packages of weed that once broken you can not transport that weed in your car. Such as for alcohol, if a container is open, you get a ticket. The other side of that is testing for those under the influence. In alcohol there are blood test, breath test, with marijuana there is no test to see if the person is currently under the influence, just if they have used it in most cases in the past 2 weeks or so.

Der Flöprer
11-07-2012, 08:50 PM
I also believe the lawmakers in these 2 states will delay the true passing of this bill even longer. I will preface this with you should not drive under the influence or while consuming any substance that may impair your judgement.

How will the enforce driving under the influence or open container. Will there be some sort of a "seal" on all packages of weed that once broken you can not transport that weed in your car. Such as for alcohol, if a container is open, you get a ticket. The other side of that is testing for those under the influence. In alcohol there are blood test, breath test, with marijuana there is no test to see if the person is currently under the influence, just if they have used it in most cases in the past 2 weeks or so.

Not in Washington. Full legalization of being in possession of an ounce of "usable marijuana" begins December 6th. And they sound like they're willing to fight the feds over it.

http://www.king5.com/news/politics/System-for-sale-and-distribution-of-marijuana-in-Wash-still-a-bit-hazy-177781711.html?c=n&fb=y&can=n

OLYMPIA, Wash. – The phone did not stop ringing in Olympia.

“Do you want to be a retailer, distributor, or manufacturer,” said Beth Lehman, as she talked to a caller in the Liquor Control Board Licensing Division office. She says dozens of people had called today in the aftermath of voter approved I-502.

The initiative will allow Washingtonians to possess an ounce of “usable marijuana” beginning on December 6.

However, the LCB has a year to devise a full licensing program, which includes a $250 application fee and a $1,000 annual renewal fee.

It could also been a boon for the department which nearly went bust due to the liquor privatization initiative last year.

“We will have to hire people. There will be staff expansion. How much we don’t know. We don’t know what the market will look like,” says Mikhail Carpenter, of the Liquor Control Board.

That’s because it’s still unclear if the Justice Department will try to curb cannabis use, which is still illegal under Federal law. It could potentially put State Employees in difficult position, licensing, and helping distribute an illegal substance.

U.S. Attorney Jenny Durkan, through a spokesperson, wrote Wednesday that “enforcement of the Controlled Substances Act remains unchanged.”

“It does plainly set up a conflict with federal law,” said Seattle City Attorney Peter Holmes, “I guess I’m the eternal optimist it doesn’t require this to be a showdown.”

Dan Sytman, a spokesperson for the Washington State Attorney General’s Office, says, “Our position on all initiatives and referenda passed by the people is that they are legal.” He added that the office is prepared “to defend such measures in court.”

Read more about the WSLCB’s next steps:

http://www.liq.wa.gov/publications/Marijuana/I-502/Fact-Sheet-I502-11-7-12.pdf

hometeam
11-07-2012, 08:54 PM
And just out of curiousity, what is the recourse for an employer who finds out that you have tested positive for alcohol? Or any other legal substance? Seems like it would be grounds for a lawsuit unless the company could prove it was demonstrably harming your work.

You have no recourse, you signed a consent to have your ass canned if you get caught on anything they deem necessary to put on that paper.

Any employer who piss tests has you sign a waiver in your hire packet. If they don't, then they can't piss test you. But they do. :evil:

ElGringo
11-07-2012, 08:57 PM
Not in Washington. Full legalization of being in possession of an ounce of "usable marijuana" begins December 6th. And they sound like they're willing to fight the feds over it.

http://www.king5.com/news/politics/System-for-sale-and-distribution-of-marijuana-in-Wash-still-a-bit-hazy-177781711.html?c=n&fb=y&can=n
This is interesting...would there be any way to keep private from the feds the names of those that got a license to sell or grow? Just think the feds would come in and get that list of names and go to town otherwise.

And thanks to whoever kept this out of DC...I don't even see that forum, and am really enjoying this thread, is an interesting topic that I believe many on this board are interested in.

BossChief
11-07-2012, 09:00 PM
Those two states just added a billion dollars of tourism revenue to their states.

Minimum.

Snickers and Papa Johns are gonna blow up in those states. A smart man would look into what franchise opportunities are available...

hometeam
11-07-2012, 09:00 PM
This is interesting...would there be any way to keep private from the feds the names of those that got a license to sell or grow? Just think the feds would come in and get that list of names and go to town otherwise.

And thanks to whoever kept this out of DC...I don't even see that forum, and am really enjoying this thread, is an interesting topic that I believe many on this board are interested in.

Well I would say in the near future with either of these states we are about to find out. Expect some shenanigan bullshit and a possible supreme court case.

My bet is that popular opinion, whether Democrat or Republican, will be that the Feds can **** out of states business.

petegz28
11-07-2012, 09:22 PM
I can understand the Federal Government's right to police interstate commerce, but if the pot stays here in my state, I say they have no room to do anything to any individual.

It's a scam that my brother's friend, who is an attorney in CA has been fighting for years.

Here is how it works in CA:

1. Legalize medical mary-jane
2. Open shops, farms, etc.
3. Feds bust in, arrest you and take everything you own
4. While you're waiting on your court date your shit is auctioned off
5. You are finally found to be innocent but your shit is gone. No house, car, nothing. Plus you still owe your attorney and the courts


CNBC did a special on medical mary-jane about a year or two ago. According to that special, medical mj is almost single-handidly holding up the northern CA economy. Several small business owners who were going broke switched to selling medical pot.

One shop owner says he has paid $100's of $1,000's in taxes and his take is as long as you are paying your taxes at the Fed level and not trying to thumb your nose at the feds they will leave you alone.

DaFace
11-07-2012, 10:07 PM
I also believe the lawmakers in these 2 states will delay the true passing of this bill even longer. I will preface this with you should not drive under the influence or while consuming any substance that may impair your judgement.

How will the enforce driving under the influence or open container. Will there be some sort of a "seal" on all packages of weed that once broken you can not transport that weed in your car. Such as for alcohol, if a container is open, you get a ticket. The other side of that is testing for those under the influence. In alcohol there are blood test, breath test, with marijuana there is no test to see if the person is currently under the influence, just if they have used it in most cases in the past 2 weeks or so.

In Colorado, it goes into effect without any lawmaker impact on the personal consumption side. The retail side does require some State work, but if they don't do it by the beginning of 2014, I think it becomes an unregulated free-for-all.

Or something like that.

Great Expectations
11-07-2012, 10:13 PM
http://www.blackradionetwork.com/mobile/index.php?storyID=14908

Pants
11-07-2012, 10:16 PM
Trust me. I drove the damn car. Maybe not every driver does that apply for this one it does.

You're either a complete dummy or completely full of shit. GTFO.

DaFace
11-07-2012, 10:18 PM
I didn't even realize this was another friggen pot thread. What a goofy title.

Merged them all together.

Cannibal
11-07-2012, 10:45 PM
Unfortunately (or fortunately depending on your point of view), most employers will continue hire and fire based on testing for it. So this doesn't really affect people who actually work for living.

nychief
11-07-2012, 10:47 PM
Unfortunately (or fortunately depending on your point of view), most employers will continue hire and fire based on testing for it. So this doesn't really affect people who actually work for living.

Yep, people who smoke pot...never work.

Buck
11-07-2012, 10:47 PM
How is this not happening in California right now?

Cannibal
11-07-2012, 11:09 PM
Yep, people who smoke pot...never work.

I didn't see that. But many wont be able to due employer drug screening whether weed is legal or not.

I'm still a fan of legalization though.

DenverChief
11-07-2012, 11:41 PM
Unfortunately (or fortunately depending on your point of view), most employers will continue hire and fire based on testing for it. So this doesn't really affect people who actually work for living.

All it will take is one lawsuit - legal substance - employer can't prohibit my after work consumption - case closed

Insurance companies OTOH can make their lives miserable with really high premiums

Simply Red
11-07-2012, 11:44 PM
Yep, people who smoke pot...never work.

posting like a bauce

FAX
11-07-2012, 11:51 PM
This must be the longest marijuana was just legalized for recreational use in Oregon and Washington thread of all times!

It's great news. The potato chip and soda pop manufacturers must be ecstatic. If the feds will give those states a break and let them experiment with these laws for a few years, I'm confident they will find that violent crime will decrease dramatically as will gang activity. And, of course, if they plan to tax the bejeesus out of pot, the states will be rolling in cash money ... mostly fives and ones, though.

From the very beginning, the "war on drugs" was as stupid as Vietnam or any other bogus-ass conflict the feds decided to wage ... and that we were bound to lose. Now, if Tennessee will just legalize black Lebanese hashish, I will be happy.

FAX

petegz28
11-07-2012, 11:53 PM
This must be the longest marijuana was just legalized for recreational use in Oregon and Washington of all times!

It's great news. The potato chip and soda pop manufacturers must be ecstatic. If the feds will give those states a break and let them experiment with these laws for a few years, I'm confident they will find that violent crime will decrease dramatically as will gang activity. And, of course, if they plan to tax the bejeesus out of pot, the states will be rolling in cash money ... mostly fives and ones, though.

From the very beginning, the "war on drugs" was as stupid as Vietnam or any other bogus-ass conflict the feds decided to wage ... and that we were bound to lose. Now, if Tennessee will just legalize black Lebanese hashish, I will be happy.

FAX

They were going to put this on the ballot in NY until Bloomberg banned sodas larger than 16oz!!!! 16oz < cottonmouth

FAX
11-07-2012, 11:55 PM
They were going to put this on the ballot in NY until Bloomberg banned sodas larger than 16oz!!!!

Oops. I left out the word, "thread".

But to your point, Mr. petegz28; it's only a matter of time until the States of Oregon and Washington legalize 5,420oz soda pops.

FAX

Dayze
11-07-2012, 11:56 PM
i honestly don't understand why weed is illegal in the first place.

yet, the nation is addicted to prescription pills for virtually every ailment you can imagine.

Dayze
11-07-2012, 11:57 PM
Oops. I left out the word, "thread".

But to your point, Mr. petegz28; it's only a matter of time until the States of Oregon and Washington legalize 5,420oz soda pops.

FAX

16oz sodas are a gateways.

petegz28
11-08-2012, 12:00 AM
i honestly don't understand why weed is illegal in the first place.

yet, the nation is addicted to prescription pills for virtually every ailment you can imagine.

Do I need to post the Chris Rock explanation of this?

They don't want you taking your drugs. They want you taking THEIR drugs

FAX
11-08-2012, 12:07 AM
i honestly don't understand why weed is illegal in the first place.

yet, the nation is addicted to prescription pills for virtually every ailment you can imagine.

Prescription opiates are an absolute freaking epidemic in this country. Doctors are doling out opiates like there was no tomorrow and morphine is one of the cheapest drugs you can buy at a pharmacy.

Not to mention, of course, the plague of antidepressants and various mood-altering compounds (whose pharmacology isn't even completely understood in many cases).

Yet you can't smoke a reefer? Yeah ... that makes a whole lot of sense.

Of course, it's the Amerikan people who allow this nonsense to happen in the first place, let alone continue.

FAX

Dayze
11-08-2012, 12:07 AM
lol. That pretty much sums it up.

Dayze
11-08-2012, 12:08 AM
I saw the movie "Reefer Madness" at 1/2 Price books the other day when we were selling a bunch of books; it was like $4......I knew I should've bought it.

dang it.

Simply Red
11-08-2012, 12:17 AM
Did this really happen? I'm researched out. Also, i've yet to really read the thread, can someone confirm?

Der Flöprer
11-09-2012, 04:07 PM
Holy shit! Washington is not fucking around with this shit. The AG has already come out and said any initiative passed by the people is considered viable law to the AG office and they will defend it against the federal government.

Now today, according to KING 5 news' Facebook page, the King County (the largest in the state, home of Seattle) prosecutor has come out and said he's dropping every misdemeanor marijuana charge going on right now due to the passing of I-502.

:clap: They are taking this fucking bull by the horns, and I commend them for it. No more clogging the court system, and wasting taxpayer money on prosecuting simple possession of marijuana. Bravo!

Rain Man
11-09-2012, 04:09 PM
Did this really happen? I'm researched out. Also, i've yet to really read the thread, can someone confirm?

It happened in Colorado. There are already construction cranes here building marijuana high-rises, and the marijuana dealers are buying out every Starbucks location.

memyselfI
11-09-2012, 04:15 PM
This is great news. Now maybe we can start ending that ridiculous 'war on drugs' and start using that money to provide other services desperately needed in this country.

Dayze
11-09-2012, 04:15 PM
Holy shit! Washington is not ****ing around with this shit. The AG has already come out and said any initiative passed by the people is considered viable law to the AG office and they will defend it against the federal government.

Now today, according to KING 5 news' Facebook page, the King County (the largest in the state, home of Seattle) prosecutor has come out and said he's dropping every misdemeanor marijuana charge going on right now due to the passing of I-502.

:clap: They are taking this ****ing bull by the horns, and I commend them for it. No more clogging the court system, and wasting taxpayer money on prosecuting simple possession of marijuana. Bravo!

awesome.

Detoxing
11-09-2012, 04:16 PM
Holy shit! Washington is not ****ing around with this shit. The AG has already come out and said any initiative passed by the people is considered viable law to the AG office and they will defend it against the federal government.

Now today, according to KING 5 news' Facebook page, the King County (the largest in the state, home of Seattle) prosecutor has come out and said he's dropping every misdemeanor marijuana charge going on right now due to the passing of I-502.

:clap: They are taking this ****ing bull by the horns, and I commend them for it. No more clogging the court system, and wasting taxpayer money on prosecuting simple possession of marijuana. Bravo!

/tear

Damn allergies.

Dayze
11-09-2012, 04:18 PM
though, it's only a matter of time before black people start freaking out and raping people. and white people hiding in closets smoking and freaking out.
~

Der Flöprer
11-09-2012, 04:19 PM
:bong:

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/SIUw4ZS1J_A" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

memyselfI
11-09-2012, 04:27 PM
though, it's only a matter of time before black people start freaking out and raping people. and white people hiding in closets smoking and freaking out.
~

Or all of these potheads start shooting heroin. Can't forget that it's a gateway drug. :rolleyes:

alnorth
11-09-2012, 04:31 PM
Did this really happen? I'm researched out. Also, i've yet to really read the thread, can someone confirm?

Yes it did. This is pretty big news, to the point where internationally other countries are going "the USA did what?!?"

Its still illegal under federal law. People growing and selling it are taking a huge risk of being busted by the feds. However, the individual user is probably safe because there are not enough federal agents to bust more than a tiny fraction of users, they depend on the local cops for that.

In CO and WA, the cops will now say "screw it, we're out, good luck if the feds catch you, but we won't bother you"

regarding the courts, this is not the sort of thing that can be overturned. CO and WA are powerless to stop the feds from enforcing federal law, BUT the feds can not force WA and CO cops to enforce marijuana prohibition if they want to make it legal under state law. The feds are now totally on their own in those 2 states.

Detoxing
11-09-2012, 04:31 PM
Or all of these potheads start shooting heroin. Can't forget that it's a gateway drug. :rolleyes:

Personally, i can't wait till rape is legal.

Hell yeah!

alnorth
11-09-2012, 04:37 PM
That WA law should be a model for the nation. They are taxing the hell out of it to pay for MJ addiction and treatment programs, PSA's to recommend not smoking, etc. Also, they set a legal limit for THC where if your blood tests higher than x amount, you are legally intoxicated and can get in trouble just like driving drunk. So, don't drive stoned.

Der Flöprer
11-09-2012, 04:45 PM
That WA law should be a model for the nation. They are taxing the hell out of it to pay for MJ addiction and treatment programs, PSA's to recommend not smoking, etc. Also, they set a legal limit for THC where if your blood tests higher than x amount, you are legally intoxicated and can get in trouble just like driving drunk. So, don't drive stoned.

The only problem with the blood part is that according to levels they have in place, you could technically be considered impaired the day after. That's a huge down side to the initiative. That said, I believe they'll get it right after some tinkering by trial and error.

alnorth
11-09-2012, 04:56 PM
I've been wondering why Oregon rejected legalizing MJ since they are bluer than CO, but it looks like there were two problems in Oregon. First, they didn't have wealthy donors supporting it like in the other 2 states so the no side could beat it more easily. Second, the OR law was a little wacky, it would have directed the state to sell pot in state-owned shops. THAT would have been a serious problem and something the feds could have probably shut down.

DaFace
11-09-2012, 05:01 PM
I've been wondering why Oregon rejected legalizing MJ since they are bluer than CO, but it looks like there were two problems in Oregon. First, they didn't have wealthy donors supporting it like in the other 2 states so the no side could beat it more easily. Second, the OR law was a little wacky, it would have directed the state to sell pot in state-owned shops. THAT would have been a serious problem and something the feds could have probably shut down.

Yeah, I thought the Washington law was best, followed by Colorado, then Oregon. I really wish that the Colorado law wasn't an amendment for one. I also like the symmetry of having funds go to treatment like you said (though I'm all for schools getting a boost too - it just doesn't seem as logical).

loochy
11-09-2012, 05:17 PM
Wait...in some places you can buy weed but you can't buy a really big soda. wtf?

theelusiveeightrop
11-09-2012, 05:18 PM
Wait...in some places you can buy weed but you can't buy a really big soda. wtf?

But aren't the two related?

DRU
11-09-2012, 05:18 PM
Or all of these potheads start shooting heroin. Can't forget that it's a gateway drug. :rolleyes:

I'd have to say most people start with caffeine, nicotine, and alcohol.

BWillie
11-09-2012, 05:19 PM
So how do ppl buy the pot? Is it just legal to have 1 oz in your possession but nobody can sell it? That defeats the whole purpose of legalizing weed in the first place. The point of legalizing weed is to eliminate the drug violence and black market of it....a majority of which is run by Mexican Cartels perpetuating violence.

DRU
11-09-2012, 05:20 PM
So how do ppl buy the pot? Is it just legal to have 1 oz in your possession but nobody can sell it? That defeats the whole purpose of legalizing weed in the first place. The point of legalizing weed is to eliminate the drug violence and black market of it....a majority of which is run by Mexican Cartels perpetuating violence.

You can grow your own, for one, and that's only one point to be made by this. It'll be regulated and sold/taxed very similar to alcohol, so not only will tax dollars be wasted prosecuting non-violent criminals, but they'll generate a mountain of new tax dollars as well.

Hemp production will be a huge part of all this, too, which I think people have mentioned already.

Der Flöprer
11-09-2012, 05:22 PM
In Washington they are currently taking applications for manufacturers, distributors, and so on. $250 application fee, and $1000 renewable license. Tax rates to follow. It's still sketchy. They're eeking this out with about 1 month before the law takes place. But this shit is going to be in 7-11's.

DaFace
11-09-2012, 05:25 PM
So how do ppl buy the pot? Is it just legal to have 1 oz in your possession but nobody can sell it? That defeats the whole purpose of legalizing weed in the first place. The point of legalizing weed is to eliminate the drug violence and black market of it....a majority of which is run by Mexican Cartels perpetuating violence.

You clearly haven't walked around Denver recently. It was already 90% legal here anyway under the guise of medical marijuana. It'll be 2014 before "recreational" shops are set up here, but it'll basically be the same as a liquor store setup (but probably with more regulations).

DRU
11-09-2012, 05:25 PM
I've been wondering why Oregon rejected legalizing MJ since they are bluer than CO, but it looks like there were two problems in Oregon. First, they didn't have wealthy donors supporting it like in the other 2 states so the no side could beat it more easily. Second, the OR law was a little wacky, it would have directed the state to sell pot in state-owned shops. THAT would have been a serious problem and something the feds could have probably shut down.

They also have families there that have been growing for decades making hundreds of thousands of dollars a year selling their product (which has such high value because it's illegal). Legalizing it would limit their profitability and bring lots of competition to the area.

DaFace
11-09-2012, 05:27 PM
In Washington they are currently taking applications for manufacturers, distributors, and so on. $250 application fee, and $1000 renewable license. Tax rates to follow. It's still sketchy. They're eeking this out with about 1 month before the law takes place. But this shit is going to be in 7-11's.

Really? Not here (I don't think). I'm pretty pot shops will have to be dedicated, so we won't see it popping up in convenience stores or anything. I could be wrong though.

theelusiveeightrop
11-09-2012, 05:27 PM
Pot in 7-11? Perhaps God does exist.

Der Flöprer
11-09-2012, 05:29 PM
Really? Not here (I don't think). I'm pretty pot shops will have to be dedicated, so we won't see it popping up in convenience stores or anything. I could be wrong though.

I need to double check for WA as well. I heard that, but am not positive. Don't break out the cheetos, and goldfish just yet. :D

Detoxing
11-09-2012, 05:29 PM
But this shit is going to be in 7-11's.

OHHEMMGEE

WTF California, why haven't we done this yet????

Bump
11-09-2012, 05:31 PM
I want to live in a world where I can buy my big gulps, cigs, slim jims and weed all in the same place.

DaFace
11-09-2012, 05:32 PM
I want to live in a world where I can buy my big gulps, cigs, slim jims and weed all in the same place.

That sounds dangerous. You'd certainly not want to go back after partaking in the weed. You'd buy the whole damn store before you knew what the heck you were doing.

Bump
11-09-2012, 05:32 PM
I actually just got back from the 7/11 kinda stoned, lol. There was a cop in there and he did that look behind him to check me out buying soda and airheads lol.

BWillie
11-09-2012, 05:34 PM
You clearly haven't walked around Denver recently. It was already 90% legal here anyway under the guise of medical marijuana. It'll be 2014 before "recreational" shops are set up here, but it'll basically be the same as a liquor store setup (but probably with more regulations).

Nope, that is good to hear then. As long as there are many legal options to obtain marijuana this is a great thing.

Detoxing
11-09-2012, 05:35 PM
That sounds dangerous. You'd certainly not want to go back after partaking in the weed. You'd buy the whole damn store before you knew what the heck you were doing.

Opposite effect for me.

Im the kinda stoner who stands in the aisle for 15 minutes trying to figure out which bag of chips he wants.

DaFace
11-11-2012, 10:50 AM
http://i.imgur.com/TnLmy.jpg

BigMeatballDave
11-11-2012, 10:59 AM
It'll be interesting to see how much revenue these states bring in once this gets going.

I think by 2015 you're going to see several states add this to ballots simply because of the potential revenue.

theelusiveeightrop
11-11-2012, 11:51 AM
Good luck finding a bank to collect the tax proceeds for a weed biz. Wake me when the Feds act.

Rain Man
11-11-2012, 11:54 AM
You clearly haven't walked around Denver recently. It was already 90% legal here anyway under the guise of medical marijuana. It'll be 2014 before "recreational" shops are set up here, but it'll basically be the same as a liquor store setup (but probably with more regulations).


This new measure is going to absolutely destroy the medical marijuana industry. I predict that 100 percent of medical marijuana dispensaries are going to close down.

Offsetting that, of course, is the fact that recreational marijuana stores with the same name, same ownership, and same customer base will open up in the same locations. So I guess the only real damage will be to the unethical doctors who wrote up marijuana prescriptions.

Rausch
11-11-2012, 11:55 AM
So you can get all baked up and the Grand Canyon looks even more amazing...

Brock
11-11-2012, 11:57 AM
This new measure is going to absolutely destroy the medical marijuana industry. I predict that 100 percent of medical marijuana dispensaries are going to close down.

Offsetting that, of course, is the fact that recreational marijuana stores with the same name, same ownership, and same customer base will open up in the same locations. So I guess the only real damage will be to the unethical doctors who wrote up marijuana prescriptions.

The MMJ industry will just become the MJ industry. Time did an article on this last month and these businesses are already for sale for huge money.

munkey
11-12-2012, 07:28 AM
I've been wondering why Oregon rejected legalizing MJ since they are bluer than CO, but it looks like there were two problems in Oregon. First, they didn't have wealthy donors supporting it like in the other 2 states so the no side could beat it more easily. Second, the OR law was a little wacky, it would have directed the state to sell pot in state-owned shops. THAT would have been a serious problem and something the feds could have probably shut down.

Oregon is basically a socialist state...liberal as fuck and the ONLY thing I hate about living in it.

ct
11-12-2012, 08:23 AM
Is this why Peyton wanted Denver so bad? For his medical marijuana?

DaFace
11-14-2012, 11:51 PM
First Colorado DA offiically drops charges and says that they're done prosecuting it.

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_21994403/boulder-da-dismissing-marijuana-possession-cases-light-amendment

BossChief
11-15-2012, 12:22 AM
Im not much on politics, unfortunately.

When is the next time that states can vote for weed to be legalized, like in Washington and Colorado?

Is that in 4 years, or just 2?

Joe Seahawk
11-15-2012, 12:29 AM
Smoked pot for the first time in 25 years last weekend, Shit's strong these days.. Not sure I want to do that again. I was at dads weekend in Pullman (WSU) That place is off the hook!

Simply Red
11-15-2012, 12:30 AM
So you can get all baked up and the Grand Canyon looks even more amazing...



http://i.imgur.com/imM20.gif (http://imgur.com/imM20)

Joe Seahawk
11-15-2012, 12:31 AM
Grand Canyon is AZ though.. Right? or am I still stoned.

BossChief
11-15-2012, 12:32 AM
I miss smoking pot.

Joe Seahawk
11-15-2012, 01:44 AM
Gay marriage legalized on the same day as marijuana makes perfect biblical sense now.

Leviticus 20: 'A man who lays with another man should be stoned.' "

Our interpretation has just been wrong all these years.

go bowe
11-15-2012, 02:00 AM
Gay marriage legalized on the same day as marijuana makes perfect biblical sense now.



Our interpretation has just been wrong all these years.

LMAO LMAO LMAO LMAO LMAO

Easy 6
11-15-2012, 02:06 AM
I think by 2015 you're going to see several states add this to ballots simply because of the potential revenue.

It would be a huge tax stream for this country, not to mention steal the lions share of money from the over the top mexican gangs.

All win.

Joe Seahawk
11-15-2012, 02:07 AM
NBA expansion is certain.. We may have 3 or 4 NBA teams before it's all said and done... Big time Cheetoh shortage happening now..

Lookout Ballard!

teedubya
11-15-2012, 02:13 AM
i honestly don't understand why weed is illegal in the first place.

yet, the nation is addicted to prescription pills for virtually every ailment you can imagine.

HEMP is the reason that "marijuana" is illegal. It was a forced prohibition by a few influential people, namely William Randolph Heart, Harry Anslinger, the DuPont family and some oil and steel magnates.

You can make over 50,000 products from the fibers and oils from Hemp... Plastics, Fuel, Food, Building materials, paper... etc

Hell, "hempcrete" is 7 times stronger than concrete and can last up to several centuries. Since you are using Hemp fibers along with Lime and water... over time, the Hempcrete wall petrifies, as the lime tries to turn back into stone by converting the carbon dioxide from the hemp fiber.

Hemp is literally the perfect plant... and oh yeah, you can also smoke the flowery bud of some hemp strains.

Joe Seahawk
11-15-2012, 02:21 AM
HEMP is the reason that "marijuana" is illegal. It was a forced prohibition by a few influential people, namely William Randolph Heart, Harry Anslinger, the DuPont family and some oil and steel magnates.

You can make over 50,000 products from the fibers and oils from Hemp... Plastics, Fuel, Food, Building materials, paper... etc

Hell, "hempcrete" is 7 times stronger than concrete and can last up to several centuries. Since you are using Hemp fibers along with Lime and water... over time, the Hempcrete wall petrifies, as the lime tries to turn back into stone by converting the carbon dioxide from the hemp fiber.

Hemp is literally the perfect plant... and oh yeah, you can also smoke the flowery bud of some hemp strains.

Hempcrete is not exactly a practical application due to the 2000 year cure time. However. there are many useful applications of hemp. including getting stoned.

Assud
11-15-2012, 02:56 AM
They won't use the courts. They'll use the IRS.
It will hold up in court just fiine as soon as they realize how in their benefit it really is.

Der Flöprer
11-15-2012, 05:06 AM
Smoked pot for the first time in 25 years last weekend, Shit's strong these days.. Not sure I want to do that again. I was at dads weekend in Pullman (WSU) That place is off the hook!

:clap: I'm gonna get my old man fucked up this winter when I go back up there.

Fruit Ninja
11-15-2012, 05:16 AM
Smoked pot for the first time in 25 years last weekend, Shit's strong these days.. Not sure I want to do that again. I was at dads weekend in Pullman (WSU) That place is off the hook!

yep, the THC is so high that if you smoke a little of the goodshit, you just get fucking plowed. I used to get paranoid if i smoked the really strong shit. I just used to do a little to get a head chance and relax, but sometimes, its just to strong and you just get tore a new asshole. I quit and havent done it in years and dont plan too.

Not everyone is made to reef. lol

DaFace
11-16-2012, 11:38 PM
Colorado reps have filed a bill to exempt states from the CSA if they pass local legalization laws.

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_22011789/colorado-democrats-urge-u-s-attorney-general-marijuana

I'm skeptical that it'll pass, but you never know.

Brock
11-16-2012, 11:48 PM
yep, the THC is so high that if you smoke a little of the goodshit, you just get fucking plowed. I used to get paranoid if i smoked the really strong shit. I just used to do a little to get a head chance and relax, but sometimes, its just to strong and you just get tore a new asshole. I quit and havent done it in years and dont plan too.

Not everyone is made to reef. lol

Practice makes perfect.

Bump
11-17-2012, 12:25 AM
someone was telling me that their family lives in Colorado and they overturned this legalization. I was like wtf, really? no way. But can't find anything to back it up, not even google. I'm thinking they are full of shit.

Bump
11-17-2012, 12:27 AM
So you can get all baked up and the Grand Canyon looks even more amazing...

haha no doubt. When hurricane sandy hit Boston, I had a pretty good time getting baked and sitting on my porch and watching the 80 mph winds hit. I was just like...woah

Simply Red
11-17-2012, 01:41 AM
Practice makes perfect.

Yes.

Der Flöprer
11-17-2012, 05:35 AM
ROFL From the Seattle Police Department's blog.

http://spdblotter.seattle.gov/2012/11/09/marijwhatnow-a-guide-to-legal-marijuana-use-in-seattle/

Marijwhatnow? A Guide to Legal Marijuana Use In Seattle
Written by Jonah Spangenthal-Lee on November 9, 2012
The people have spoken. Voters have passed Initiative 502 and beginning December 6th, it is not a violation of state law for adults over 21 years old to possess up to an ounce of marijuana (or 16 ounces of solid marijuana-infused product, like cookies, or 72 ounces of infused liquid, like oil) for personal use. The initiative establishes a one-year period for the state to develop rules and a licensing system for the marijuana production and sale.

Marijuana has existed in a grey area in Seattle for some time now. Despite a longstanding national prohibition on marijuana, minor marijuana possession has been the lowest enforcement priority for the Seattle Police Department since Seattle voters passed Initiative 75 in 2003. Officers don’t like grey areas in the law. I-502 now gives them more clarity.

Marijuana legalization creates some challenges for the Seattle Police Department, but SPD is already working to respond to these issues head on, by doing things like reviewing SPD’s hiring practices for police officers to address now-legal marijuana usage by prospective officers, as well as current employees.

While I-502 has decriminalized marijuana possession in Washington, the new state law does not change federal law, which classifies marijuana as a Schedule I narcotic. All Seattle Police officers have taken an oath to uphold not only state law, but federal law as well.

However, SPD officers will follow state law, and will no longer make arrests for marijuana possession as defined under I-502.
The Seattle Police Department and Mayor Mike McGinn have already begun working with state officials to navigate this conflict, and follow the direction of Washington voters to legalize marijuana.
In the meantime, the Seattle Police Department will continue to enforce laws against unlicensed sale or production of marijuana, and regulations against driving under the influence of marijuana, which remain illegal.

TL;DR?

Here’s a practical guide for what the Seattle Police Department believes I-502 means for you, beginning December 6th, based on the department’s current understanding of the initiative Please keep in mind that this is all subject to ongoing state and local review, and that it describes the view of the Seattle Police Department only. All marijuana possession and sale remains illegal under federal law, and Seattle Police cannot predict or control the enforcement activities of federal authorities.

Can I legally carry around an ounce of marijuana?
According to the recently passed initiative, beginning December 6th, adults over the age of 21 will be able to carry up to an ounce of marijuana for personal use. Please note that the initiative says it “is unlawful to open a package containing marijuana…in view of the general public,” so there’s that. Also, you probably shouldn’t bring pot with you to the federal courthouse (or any other federal property).

Well, where can I legally buy pot, then?
The Washington State Liquor Control Board is working to establish guidelines for the sale and distribution of marijuana. The WSLCB has until December 1, 2013 to finalize those rules. In the meantime, production and distribution of non-medical marijuana remains illegal.

Does I-502 affect current medical marijuana laws?
No, medical marijuana laws in Washington remain the same as they were before I-502 passed.

Can I grow marijuana in my home and sell it to my friends, family, and co-workers?
Not right now. In the future, under state law, you may be able to get a license to grow or sell marijuana.

Can I smoke pot outside my home? Like at a park, magic show, or the Bite of Seattle?
Much like having an open container of alcohol in public, doing so could result in a civil infraction—like a ticket—but not arrest. You can certainly use marijuana in the privacy of your own home. Additionally, if smoking a cigarette isn’t allowed where you are (say, inside an apartment building or flammable chemical factory), smoking marijuana isn’t allowed there either.

Will police officers be able to smoke marijuana?
As of right now, no. This is still a very complicated issue.

If I apply for a job at the Seattle Police Department, will past (or current) marijuana use be held against me? The current standard for applicants is that they have not used marijuana in the previous three years. In light of I-502, the department will consult with the City Attorney and the State Attorney General to see if and how that standard may be revised.

What happens if I get pulled over and an officer thinks I’ve been smoking pot?
If an officer believes you’re driving under the influence of anything, they will conduct a field sobriety test and may consult with a drug recognition expert. If officers establish probable cause, they will bring you to a precinct and ask your permission to draw your blood for testing. If officers have reason to believe you’re under the influence of something, they can get a warrant for a blood draw from a judge. If you’re in a serious accident, then a blood draw will be mandatory.

What happens if I get pulled over and I’m sober, but an officer or his K9 buddy smells the ounce of Super Skunk I’ve got in my trunk?
Under state law, officers have to develop probable cause to search a closed or locked container. Each case stands on its own, but the smell of pot alone will not be reason to search a vehicle. If officers have information that you’re trafficking, producing or delivering marijuana in violation of state law, they can get a warrant to search your vehicle.
SPD seized a bunch of my marijuana before I-502 passed. Can I have it back?
No.

Will SPD assist federal law enforcement in investigations of marijuana users or marijuana-related businesses, that are allowed under I-502?
No. Officers and detectives will not participate in an investigation of anything that’s not prohibited by state law.

December 6th seems like a really long ways away. What happens if I get caught with marijuana before then? Hold your breath. Your case will be processed under current state law. However, there is already a city ordinance making marijuana enforcement the lowest law enforcement priority.

I’m under 21. What happens if I get caught smoking pot?
It’s a violation of state law. It may referred to prosecutors, just like if you were a minor in possession of alcohol.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/kzmrljnWPXg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

*This post has been updated since its initial publication to include more legalese and fewer references to narcotics dogs which, as it turns out, are still a confusing, complicated issue still under review.

DaFace
11-17-2012, 07:54 AM
someone was telling me that their family lives in Colorado and they overturned this legalization. I was like wtf, really? no way. But can't find anything to back it up, not even google. I'm thinking they are full of shit.

You can't "overturn" a constitutional amendment.

-King-
11-17-2012, 08:53 AM
SPD seized a bunch of my marijuana before I-502 passed. Can I have it back?

No.



LMAO LMAO LMAO Can't believe someone would actually ask that.
Posted via Mobile Device

DaFace
08-11-2013, 03:23 PM
For all you potheads out there, Dr. Sanjay Gupta has apparently completely reversed his opinion about medical marijuana and now supports it after doing a bunch of research for a new documentary...

which airs tonight at 7pm CDT on CNN.

Set your DVR's now so that you don't forget.

DaFace
08-11-2013, 03:26 PM
Also, there's murmuring that Eric Holder may actually clarify the Feds' approach to all this chaos tomorrow.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/08/eric-holder-drug-sentencing_n_3727389.html

Rausch
08-11-2013, 03:26 PM
I understand progress is slow but the point should be forcing (FORCING) the federal laws to change...

scho63
08-11-2013, 07:06 PM
I'm really confused on something-Arizona passed a state immigration law that enforced their border and the US justice dept sued AZ claiming they tried to supersede the federal law.

When Colorado and Washington passed laws to legalize pot that supersedes Federal US law there is not a peep from DC.

I guess only certain laws get the scrutiny of the almighty Eric Holder.

I KNOW, I KNOW-THIS BELONGS IN DC BUT IDGAF!

Simply Red
08-11-2013, 07:10 PM
Holy shit, who knew!!!???


Oh, that's right - everyone in America did 10 hours ago.

dick move post

DaFace
08-11-2013, 08:51 PM
So...that thing was REALLY interesting. If you get a chance to watch it, I recommend it.

BossChief
08-11-2013, 09:02 PM
The part about Charolette was really really cool.

crispystl420
08-11-2013, 09:05 PM
For all you potheads out there, Dr. Sanjay Gupta has apparently completely reversed his opinion about medical marijuana and now supports it after doing a bunch of research for a new documentary...

which airs tonight at 7pm CDT on CNN.

Set your DVR's now so that you don't forget.

Link? (Sorry I'm Stoned) JK LOL

Sfeihc
08-11-2013, 09:05 PM
Charlotte's Web, not just a great book anymore.

DenverChief
08-11-2013, 09:15 PM
I'm really confused on something-Arizona passed a state immigration law that enforced their border and the US justice dept sued AZ claiming they tried to supersede the federal law.

When Colorado and Washington passed laws to legalize pot that supersedes Federal US law there is not a peep from DC.

I guess only certain laws get the scrutiny of the almighty Eric Holder.

I KNOW, I KNOW-THIS BELONGS IN DC BUT IDGAF!

I think that has more to do with the police powers vs immigration.
Police powers are reserved to the states with a little wiggle room for federal intervention. Immigration is reserved to the federal powers without toe room for state intervention.

DenverChief
08-11-2013, 09:16 PM
The part about Charolette was really really cool.

Agreed. It goes to show that laws enacted out of fear and prejudice instead of science and fact are rarely good laws

Simply Red
08-11-2013, 09:16 PM
I think that has more to do with the police powers vs immigration.
Police powers are reserved to the states with a little wiggle room for federal intervention. Immigration is reserved to the federal powers without toe room for state intervention.

You should start smoking pot, bud... It'd be a rad move.

DenverChief
08-11-2013, 10:09 PM
You should start smoking pot, bud... It'd be a rad move.

Um...

Simply Red
08-11-2013, 11:31 PM
Um...

:D

aturnis
08-11-2013, 11:48 PM
Charlotte's Web, not just a great book anymore.

Shitty high though.

aturnis
08-11-2013, 11:49 PM
Um...

You already do?

Simply Red
08-11-2013, 11:57 PM
You already do?

he is a police officer.

-King-
08-12-2013, 12:01 AM
So...that thing was REALLY interesting. If you get a chance to watch it, I recommend it.

Is it coming on again?

-King-
08-12-2013, 12:12 AM
Why I changed my mind on weed
By Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN Chief Medical Correspondent
August 9, 2013 -- Updated 0044 GMT (0844 HKT)

(CNN) -- Over the last year, I have been working on a new documentary called "Weed." The title "Weed" may sound cavalier, but the content is not.

I traveled around the world to interview medical leaders, experts, growers and patients. I spoke candidly to them, asking tough questions. What I found was stunning.

Long before I began this project, I had steadily reviewed the scientific literature on medical marijuana from the United States and thought it was fairly unimpressive. Reading these papers five years ago, it was hard to make a case for medicinal marijuana. I even wrote about this in a TIME magazine article, back in 2009, titled "Why I would Vote No on Pot."

Well, I am here to apologize.

I apologize because I didn't look hard enough, until now. I didn't look far enough. I didn't review papers from smaller labs in other countries doing some remarkable research, and I was too dismissive of the loud chorus of legitimate patients whose symptoms improved on cannabis.

Instead, I lumped them with the high-visibility malingerers, just looking to get high. I mistakenly believed the Drug Enforcement Agency listed marijuana as a schedule 1 substance because of sound scientific proof. Surely, they must have quality reasoning as to why marijuana is in the category of the most dangerous drugs that have "no accepted medicinal use and a high potential for abuse."

They didn't have the science to support that claim, and I now know that when it comes to marijuana neither of those things are true. It doesn't have a high potential for abuse, and there are very legitimate medical applications. In fact, sometimes marijuana is the only thing that works. Take the case of Charlotte Figi, who I met in Colorado. She started having seizures soon after birth. By age 3, she was having 300 a week, despite being on seven different medications. Medical marijuana has calmed her brain, limiting her seizures to 2 or 3 per month.

I have seen more patients like Charlotte first hand, spent time with them and come to the realization that it is irresponsible not to provide the best care we can as a medical community, care that could involve marijuana.

We have been terribly and systematically misled for nearly 70 years in the United States, and I apologize for my own role in that.
Medical facts of Marijuana


I hope this article and upcoming documentary will help set the record straight.

On August 14, 1970, the Assistant Secretary of Health, Dr. Roger O. Egeberg wrote a letter recommending the plant, marijuana, be classified as a schedule 1 substance, and it has remained that way for nearly 45 years. My research started with a careful reading of that decades old letter. What I found was unsettling. Egeberg had carefully chosen his words:

"Since there is still a considerable void in our knowledge of the plant and effects of the active drug contained in it, our recommendation is that marijuana be retained within schedule 1 at least until the completion of certain studies now underway to resolve the issue."

Not because of sound science, but because of its absence, marijuana was classified as a schedule 1 substance. Again, the year was 1970. Egeberg mentions studies that are underway, but many were never completed. As my investigation continued, however, I realized Egeberg did in fact have important research already available to him, some of it from more than 25 years earlier.

High risk of abuse

In 1944, New York Mayor Fiorello LaGuardia commissioned research to be performed by the New York Academy of Science. Among their conclusions: they found marijuana did not lead to significant addiction in the medical sense of the word. They also did not find any evidence marijuana led to morphine, heroin or cocaine addiction.

We now know that while estimates vary, marijuana leads to dependence in around 9 to 10% of its adult users. By comparison, cocaine, a schedule 2 substance "with less abuse potential than schedule 1 drugs" hooks 20% of those who use it. Around 25% of heroin users become addicted.

The worst is tobacco, where the number is closer to 30% of smokers, many of whom go on to die because of their addiction.

There is clear evidence that in some people marijuana use can lead to withdrawal symptoms, including insomnia, anxiety and nausea. Even considering this, it is hard to make a case that it has a high potential for abuse. The physical symptoms of marijuana addiction are nothing like those of the other drugs I've mentioned. I have seen the withdrawal from alcohol, and it can be life threatening.

I do want to mention a concern that I think about as a father. Young, developing brains are likely more susceptible to harm from marijuana than adult brains. Some recent studies suggest that regular use in teenage years leads to a permanent decrease in IQ. Other research hints at a possible heightened risk of developing psychosis.

Much in the same way I wouldn't let my own children drink alcohol, I wouldn't permit marijuana until they are adults. If they are adamant about trying marijuana, I will urge them to wait until they're in their mid-20s when their brains are fully developed.

Medical benefit

While investigating, I realized something else quite important. Medical marijuana is not new, and the medical community has been writing about it for a long time. There were in fact hundreds of journal articles, mostly documenting the benefits. Most of those papers, however, were written between the years 1840 and 1930. The papers described the use of medical marijuana to treat "neuralgia, convulsive disorders, emaciation," among other things.

A search through the U.S. National Library of Medicine this past year pulled up nearly 20,000 more recent papers. But the majority were research into the harm of marijuana, such as "Bad trip due to anticholinergic effect of cannabis," or "Cannabis induced pancreatitits" and "Marijuana use and risk of lung cancer."

In my quick running of the numbers, I calculated about 6% of the current U.S. marijuana studies investigate the benefits of medical marijuana. The rest are designed to investigate harm. That imbalance paints a highly distorted picture.

The challenges of marijuana research

To do studies on marijuana in the United States today, you need two important things.

First of all, you need marijuana. And marijuana is illegal. You see the problem. Scientists can get research marijuana from a special farm in Mississippi, which is astonishingly located in the middle of the Ole Miss campus, but it is challenging. When I visited this year, there was no marijuana being grown.

The second thing you need is approval, and the scientists I interviewed kept reminding me how tedious that can be. While a cancer study may first be evaluated by the National Cancer Institute, or a pain study may go through the National Institute for Neurological Disorders, there is one more approval required for marijuana: NIDA, the National Institute on Drug Abuse. It is an organization that has a core mission of studying drug abuse, as opposed to benefit.

Stuck in the middle are the legitimate patients who depend on marijuana as a medicine, oftentimes as their only good option.

Keep in mind that up until 1943, marijuana was part of the United States drug pharmacopeia. One of the conditions for which it was prescribed was neuropathic pain. It is a miserable pain that's tough to treat. My own patients have described it as "lancinating, burning and a barrage of pins and needles." While marijuana has long been documented to be effective for this awful pain, the most common medications prescribed today come from the poppy plant, including morphine, oxycodone and dilaudid.

Here is the problem. Most of these medications don't work very well for this kind of pain, and tolerance is a real problem.

Most frightening to me is that someone dies in the United States every 19 minutes from a prescription drug overdose, mostly accidental. Every 19 minutes. It is a horrifying statistic. As much as I searched, I could not find a documented case of death from marijuana overdose.

It is perhaps no surprise then that 76% of physicians recently surveyed said they would approve the use of marijuana to help ease a woman's pain from breast cancer.

When marijuana became a schedule 1 substance, there was a request to fill a "void in our knowledge." In the United States, that has been challenging because of the infrastructure surrounding the study of an illegal substance, with a drug abuse organization at the heart of the approval process. And yet, despite the hurdles, we have made considerable progress that continues today.

Looking forward, I am especially intrigued by studies like those in Spain and Israel looking at the anti-cancer effects of marijuana and its components. I'm intrigued by the neuro-protective study by Lev Meschoulam in Israel, and research in Israel and the United States on whether the drug might help alleviate symptoms of PTSD. I promise to do my part to help, genuinely and honestly, fill the remaining void in our knowledge.

Citizens in 20 states and the District of Columbia have now voted to approve marijuana for medical applications, and more states will be making that choice soon. As for Dr. Roger Egeberg, who wrote that letter in 1970, he passed away 16 years ago.

I wonder what he would think if he were alive today.

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/08/08/health/gupta-changed-mind-marijuana/

Simply Red
08-12-2013, 12:28 AM
do you burn down, King?

-King-
08-12-2013, 12:39 AM
do you burn down, King?

Did yesterday for the first time in a few months. Used to be a regular before then.

saphojunkie
08-12-2013, 02:09 AM
I am now a card carrying member of the legal patient list in California.

I might just get a conceal carry permit just to even it out. I mean, if the government decides to actually give me an extra right instead of take one away, may as well take advantage, right?

RubberSponge
08-12-2013, 06:20 AM
The train can't be stopped. Majority of people know marijuana has many medical benefits. And one day people will not be so afraid of the present repercussions. It's all the established industries fighting it from law enforcement to pharmaceutical to petroleum to textiles to industrial agriculture. Marijuana represents a change in social and economic dynamics that they are desperately trying to fight. But that sad thing is, they just don't know they have already lost the war. While the average working class citizens largely pay the price for it. They lost to a bunch of stoners. Ha!

Smoke trees, don't wrap yourself around one with alcohol.

philfree
08-12-2013, 09:12 AM
I am now a card carrying member of the legal patient list in California.

I might just get a conceal carry permit just to even it out. I mean, if the government decides to actually give me an extra right instead of take one away, may as well take advantage, right?

I hope it doesn't put you on a list so the Feds can nab you when they decide they want to.

DaFace
08-12-2013, 01:11 PM
Is it coming on again?

No guarantees this won't get taken down, but...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3IMfIQ_K6U

saphojunkie
08-12-2013, 01:17 PM
I hope it doesn't put you on a list so the Feds can nab you when they decide they want to.

hahahhahahhahhahhahahhahahha

The "FEDS" couldn't care less about one dude buying an eighth of marijuana for use in his home. The idea that a federal agent would A) Scour the internet to find somebody who posts about legally obtaining a prescription for pot and B) using federal resources to track him down, so that he can C) Raid his house and bust him for possession of less than 1/8 ounce of marijuana is laughable at best.

They deal in kilos and pounds, dude.

aturnis
08-12-2013, 01:29 PM
hahahhahahhahhahhahahhahahha

The "FEDS" couldn't care less about one dude buying an eighth of marijuana for use in his home. The idea that a federal agent would A) Scour the internet to find somebody who posts about legally obtaining a prescription for pot and B) using federal resources to track him down, so that he can C) Raid his house and bust him for possession of less than 1/8 ounce of marijuana is laughable at best.

They deal in kilos and pounds, dude.

No shit. There are entire online communities devoted to weed and HUGE numbers of these guys talk about how they grow their own, yet none of them disappear.

DaFace
08-12-2013, 01:39 PM
No shit. There are entire online communities devoted to weed and UUGE numbers of these guys talk about how they grow their own, yet nine of them disappear.

And on that note...

http://www.mercurynews.com/nation-world/ci_23844818/san-francisco-ag-eric-holder-announces-drug-sentencing

San Francisco: AG Eric Holder announces drug-sentencing reform
By Josh Richman

jrichman@bayareanewsgroup.com

POSTED: 08/12/2013 11:14:33 AM PDT

SAN FRANCISCO -- Federal prosecutors will no longer seek mandatory minimum sentences for nonviolent drug offenders, part of a broad new effort to focus on violent crimes and national security while reducing the nation's gigantic prison population, U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder said Monday.

Addressing the American Bar Association's annual meeting in a city and state that long have had some of the nation's most liberal drug enforcement policies, Holder described a sea change in federal law enforcement strategy that marks a significant turn away from the all-out "war on drugs" of the past 40 years.

Holder said charges against dealers who aren't tied to large criminal organizations won't detail how much drugs they were caught with. Without that information, judges can't impose the five- or 10-year mandatory minimum prison terms enacted by Congress in the 1980s.

"They now will be charged with offenses for which the accompanying sentences are better suited to their individual conduct, rather than excessive prison terms more appropriate for violent criminals or drug kingpins," Holder said. "By reserving the most severe penalties for serious, high-level, or violent drug traffickers, we can better promote public safety, deterrence, and rehabilitation, while making our expenditures smarter and more productive."

the Talking Can
08-12-2013, 01:46 PM
http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lmpk9k3RVy1qc0s10o1_500.gif

Dayze
08-12-2013, 01:48 PM
bad deal. we all know smoking it makes you go out and rape people, and act crazy.
I know it's true - I saw a government safety film about it.

DaFace
08-29-2013, 01:31 PM
Whoa.

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_23973568/federal-government-wont-block-colorado-marijauna-legalization

Federal government won't block Colorado marijuana legalization
By John Ingold
The Denver Post

The federal government will not make it a priority to block marijuana legalization in Colorado or Washington or close down recreational marijuana stores, so long as the stores abide by state regulations, according to new guidance being issued Thursday to federal prosecutors across the country.

(more at the link)

Discuss Thrower
08-29-2013, 01:58 PM
Whoa.

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_23973568/federal-government-wont-block-colorado-marijauna-legalization

First step to decriminalization mothafuckaaa!

Blaze it pillowbiter!

tooge
08-29-2013, 02:16 PM
It'll be totally legal in 5 years

Pitt Gorilla
08-29-2013, 02:19 PM
Whoa.

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_23973568/federal-government-wont-block-colorado-marijauna-legalizationbig government dictators!:cuss:

vailpass
08-29-2013, 02:24 PM
Whoa.

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_23973568/federal-government-wont-block-colorado-marijauna-legalization

Von Miller says high.

Dayze
08-29-2013, 02:52 PM
sweet. haven't done it in probably 15 years, but it's still retarded it's illegal.

Kiimosabi
08-29-2013, 02:55 PM
It'll be totally legal in 5 years

In the meantime, don't drive I-70 with any. The western Kansas cops are having a field day right now.

DaFace
08-29-2013, 03:00 PM
In the meantime, don't drive I-70 with any. The western Kansas cops are having a field day right now.

I'm sure. I have no idea if it went anywhere, but back a while ago I read that Colorado was planning to put signs at all the borders warning people that it's not legal to transport it across state lines.

lcarus
08-29-2013, 03:05 PM
Oklahoma will be the absolute last fucking state to get it decriminalized. Hell, they just passed a law recently that says you could get sentenced to life in prison for making hash. They claimed hash was the "crack of marijuana". LMAO. Stupid ass Oklahoma...

Fish
08-29-2013, 03:14 PM
In the meantime, don't drive I-70 with any. The western Kansas cops are having a field day right now.

I travel I-70 pretty often. In the eastern part of the state, they often setup "Drug Checkpoints" on the highway. What they do is put up several signs saying "Drug checkpoint ahead, drug dogs in use". And they put it a half mile before a very secluded off ramp that isn't frequently traveled. And they park a patrol car beside the interstate with its lights flashing. Then they wait for drug mules to see the signs and get scared thinking they're going to have to stop up ahead, and take the off ramp to avoid it. They have several cop cars and such on the off ramp just out of sight, which they nab anyone who gets off the ramp claiming they were avoiding the drug checkpoint and then have suspicion to search their vehicle.

Red Beans
08-29-2013, 03:14 PM
Von Miller stays high.


That's better...

DaFace
08-29-2013, 03:18 PM
I travel I-70 pretty often. In the eastern part of the state, they often setup "Drug Checkpoints" on the highway. What they do is put up several signs saying "Drug checkpoint ahead, drug dogs in use". And they put it a half mile before a very secluded off ramp that isn't frequently traveled. And they park a patrol car beside the interstate with its lights flashing. Then they wait for drug mules to see the signs and get scared thinking they're going to have to stop up ahead, and take the off ramp to avoid it. They have several cop cars and such on the off ramp just out of sight, which they nab anyone who gets off the ramp claiming they were avoiding the drug checkpoint and then have suspicion to search their vehicle.

That's devious and awesome all at the same time.

Frosty
08-29-2013, 03:19 PM
I wonder if this means that the feds will stop raiding the medical mj stores on the coast (in WA)? They have been pretty busy lately.

DaFace
08-29-2013, 03:22 PM
I wonder if this means that the feds will stop raiding the medical mj stores on the coast (in WA)? They have been pretty busy lately.

Tough to say. The memo says that it's a "low priority" but not necessarily that they won't enforce things from time to time. Hopefully if they do go after anyone, it'll be the ones that clearly violate their list of priorities:

• Preventing marijuana distribution to minors

• Preventing money from sales from going to criminal groups

• Preventing the diversion of marijuana from states where it is legal to states where it is illegal

• Preventing criminal groups from using state laws as cover for trafficking of other illegal drugs

• Preventing violence and the use of illegal firearms

• Preventing drugged driving

• Preventing the growing of marijuana on public lands

• Preventing marijuana possession or use on federal property

vailpass
08-29-2013, 03:27 PM
That's better...

:)

Mr. Laz
08-29-2013, 03:31 PM
It'll be totally legal in 5 years

yep ... if all goes well in the first 2 states it will spread to all but the heavy bible states really quick.

J Diddy
08-29-2013, 03:32 PM
Oklahoma will be the absolute last ****ing state to get it decriminalized. Hell, they just passed a law recently that says you could get sentenced to life in prison for making hash. They claimed hash was the "crack of marijuana". LMAO. Stupid ass Oklahoma...

Oklahoma is the "crack of the US"

lcarus
08-29-2013, 03:40 PM
Oklahoma is the "crack of the US"

Let me tell you...the education system really failed a lot of people down here.

Mr. Laz
08-29-2013, 03:42 PM
Oklahoma is the "crack of the US"

Oklahoma is a nice place to live.

Der Flöprer
08-29-2013, 03:44 PM
I travel I-70 pretty often. In the eastern part of the state, they often setup "Drug Checkpoints" on the highway. What they do is put up several signs saying "Drug checkpoint ahead, drug dogs in use". And they put it a half mile before a very secluded off ramp that isn't frequently traveled. And they park a patrol car beside the interstate with its lights flashing. Then they wait for drug mules to see the signs and get scared thinking they're going to have to stop up ahead, and take the off ramp to avoid it. They have several cop cars and such on the off ramp just out of sight, which they nab anyone who gets off the ramp claiming they were avoiding the drug checkpoint and then have suspicion to search their vehicle.

ROFL They've been doing that for years. I had a buddy get nabbed that way. Dumbass had all of his shit packed and was headed for NC. He had a gram of pot, a fucking gram tucked away deep into his shit and he pulled off freaking out. Needless to say, they found that shit and he got nabbed for nothing.

seclark
08-29-2013, 03:47 PM
ROFL They've been doing that for years. I had a buddy get nabbed that way. Dumbass had all of his shit packed and was headed for NC. He had a gram of pot, a ****ing gram tucked away deep into his shit and he pulled off freaking out. Needless to say, they found that shit and he got nabbed for nothing.

I've seen it too...drove past the sign and thought, "wtf? why tell people what they're doing?" then drive past the first exit and see the cop cars.

sec

Pitt Gorilla
08-29-2013, 03:57 PM
Oklahoma will be the absolute last ****ing state to get it decriminalized. Hell, they just passed a law recently that says you could get sentenced to life in prison for making hash. They claimed hash was the "crack of marijuana". LMAO. Stupid ass Oklahoma...OK is a ****hole.

Pablo
08-29-2013, 04:00 PM
I've seen it too...drove past the sign and thought, "wtf? why tell people what they're doing?" then drive past the first exit and see the cop cars.

secI usually paint DRUG CAR on the side of my vehicle when driving I-70 to really fuck with the police.

CrazyPhuD
08-29-2013, 04:10 PM
And on that note...

http://www.mercurynews.com/nation-world/ci_23844818/san-francisco-ag-eric-holder-announces-drug-sentencing

Whoa.

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_23973568/federal-government-wont-block-colorado-marijauna-legalization

No offense but Bernie Madoff has better credibility than the current administration when it comes to telling the truth....fool me once shame on you fool me twice shame on me....

http://www.sfgate.com/opinion/saunders/article/Obama-s-promise-could-send-you-to-prison-4206421.php

Obama's shifting stand

Barack Obama "believes that states and local governments are best positioned to strike the balance between making sure that these policies are not abused for recreational drug use and making sure that doctors and their patients can safely access pain relief." - Campaign spokesman Ben LaBolt,

May 2008

"What I specifically said was that we were not going to prioritize prosecutions of persons who are using medical marijuana. I never made a commitment that somehow we were going to give carte blanche to large-scale producers and operators of marijuana - and the reason is, because it's against federal law." - President Obama to Rolling Stone magazine, April 2012

"We've got bigger fish to fry. ... It would not make sense for us to see a top priority as going after recreational users in states that have determined that it's legal." - Obama to ABC's Barbara Walters

Just because it's not a top priority doesn't mean they're not coming for you 'eventually'. Buy legal weed and own a firearm and they'll come for you that you can promise.

http://blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com/valleyfever/2011/09/medical_marijuana_and_guns_don.php

It's legal for a doc to write a script for painkillers and to own firearms but it's not legal for a doc to recommend marijuana and someone to own firearms...

You have to love the built in hypocrisy in our system.

Big Smoke
08-29-2013, 04:20 PM
I usually paint DRUG CAR on the side of my vehicle when driving I-70 to really **** with the police.

LMAO

Brock
08-29-2013, 04:26 PM
OK is a ****hole.

Says missourian LMAO

CrazyPhuD
08-29-2013, 04:26 PM
I've seen it too...drove past the sign and thought, "wtf? why tell people what they're doing?" then drive past the first exit and see the cop cars.

sec

Here's why they announce it, it's to try to make you do something suspicious. But it's still not generally legal.

http://reason.com/blog/2013/07/02/the-fake-drug-checkpoint-may-be-legal-bu

See this is why I always keep some smoke bombs in the car, when I see one of these I crack the back windows, light them and thrown them in the back seat!:D

lcarus
08-29-2013, 04:30 PM
Says missourian LMAO

I think it's safe to say most of us on this board live in shitholes.

the Talking Can
08-29-2013, 04:36 PM
It'll be totally legal in 5 years

it won't be legal in georgia in a 100 years...

DonInDenver
08-29-2013, 04:37 PM
Colorado's drive to legalize medical Jane several years ago ultimately led to the legalization of many potheads right to purchase this shit legally. I knew that was their angle, I don't agree with it, but I live with it. Colorado is now in the stages of finding a very profitable way of taxing it. Just what you dopers want.

BigMeatballDave
08-29-2013, 04:38 PM
OK is a ****hole.

Moore, Oklahoma certainly is. Looks like a tornado went through there...

Brock
08-29-2013, 04:39 PM
Colorado's drive to legalize medical Jane several years ago ultimately led to the legalization of many potheads right to purchase this shit legally. I knew that was their angle, I don't agree with it, but I live with it. Colorado is now in the stages of finding a very profitable way of taxing it. Just what you dopers want.

Sounds like butthurt.

BigMeatballDave
08-29-2013, 04:39 PM
Colorado's drive to legalize medical Jane several years ago ultimately led to the legalization of many potheads right to purchase this shit legally. I knew that was their angle, I don't agree with it, but I live with it. Colorado is now in the stages of finding a very profitable way of taxing it. Just what you dopers want.

Dopers? LMAO

Are you 70?

Pablo
08-29-2013, 04:41 PM
Dopers? LMAO

Are you 70?Next thing you know these kids will be wearing rings in their ears, sporting leather jackets, and riding skateboards!!

I'm outraged.

vailpass
08-29-2013, 04:43 PM
Next thing you know these kids will be wearing rings in their ears, sporting leather jackets, and riding skateboards!!

I'm outraged.

GET OFF MY LAWN!