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ChiefsandO'sfan
11-09-2012, 03:14 PM
Jeff Rosen ‏@jeff_rosen88

Ex #Chiefs GM Carl Peterson: “I don’t keep track of what’s wrong (in KC), but it’s a sad situation." LOTS more coming to @KCStar ...


Jeff Rosen ‏@jeff_rosen88

More Carl Peterson: "I don’t think the cupboard was bare when they came… They had one good year, won the division, then went south." #Chiefs




Excerpt: Pioli and Peterson's first four years with Chiefs
By RANDY COVITZ
The Kansas City Star


Editor's note: Coming Sunday, we take an in-depth look at how the first four years of Scott Pioli’s tenure as general manager of the Chiefs stack up against the first four years of former GM Carl Peterson. Both men enjoyed some highlights, and yes, some lowlights. Here’s an excerpt from what you can read Sunday in its entirety.

In 2009, when Scott Pioli took over as general manager of the Chiefs, he faced the same critical decisions that his predecessor, Carl Peterson, did 20 years earlier.

Hire the right head coach; select a quarterback with a strong and accurate arm; make shrewd picks at the top of the draft; fill holes on the roster via free agency.

Those are the four pillars for building a successful NFL franchise. Make the right decisions, and the club can enjoy long-term stability that produces perennial playoff teams, if not Super Bowl champions. Whiff on those choices, and it will set a franchise back into perpetual rebuilding jobs.

Pioli, who is midway through his fourth season running the club, appears to have struck out on all counts. His first head coach, Todd Haley who had never been a head coach at any level, didn’t make it through his third season, though the Chiefs did win the AFC West in 2010. Haley’s successor, Romeo Crennel, is 3-8 since taking over last December, including a 1-7 mark this year going into Monday night’s game at Pittsburgh.

Pioli’s hand-picked quarterback, Matt Cassel, is the 31st-rated passer in the NFL, has turned the ball over an NFL-worst 18 times, and would be a backup right now had it not been for a concussion to backup-turned-starter Brady Quinn.

Pioli’s drafts have been unproductive, starting with defensive end Tyson Jackson, taken with the third overall pick in 2009, and his free-agent signees have made little impact.

When Peterson was hired by the late Lamar Hunt as president, general manager and chief operating officer in 1989, he hired Marty Schottenheimer, a proven winner at Cleveland, as head coach. Peterson inherited veteran quarterback Steve DeBerg, but for competition in the first year, he 1989 brought in free agent Ron Jaworski, spent a second-round draft choice for Mike Elkins and traded for Steve Pelluer. DeBerg led the Chiefs to three straight winning seasons to the 1990 and 1991 playoffs.

While Peterson’s draft record was spotty at best, he selected with the fourth overall pick in the 1989 draft outside linebacker Derrick Thomas, who would be the centerpiece of a ferocious defense and eventually be inducted into the Pro Football Hall of Fame. And though unfettered free agency would not begin until 1993, he took advantage of the precursor of the system, Plan B free agency, and combed the waiver wire for several major contributors on both sides of the ball.

The differences in the Chiefs of 1989-1992 and the Chiefs of 2009-2012?

The Chiefs went 39-24-1 in Peterson’s first four years, and only a 17-17 tie in the mud at Cleveland in 1989 kept the club from reaching the postseason all four years. And a once-moribund fan base that included fewer than 25,000 season ticket holders in 1988 became 75,000 strong by 1991 and created one of the most menacing home-field advantages in football.

“The general manager presents and acquires the players, but the rest of the story has to be the coaches who develop these guys to do what they want them to do,” said Peterson, who today divides his time between Kansas City and New York. “I don’t keep track of what’s wrong (in Kansas City), but it’s a sad situation.

“As a general manager, you have to have an intimate working relationship with your head coach. My job was to hire the head football coach and give him everything he needed to be successful … That would include his coaching staff, players, facilities and create an environment to win.”

The current Chiefs are 22-34 under Pioli and have spiraled into one of the biggest punchlines in the NFL. They have trailed by at least 17 points in seven of their eight games; lost six games by double digits; became the first team since at least 1929 not to have led a game in regulation through eight games of a season; and, worst of all, have won just three of their last 14 games at Arrowhead Stadium, where fan apathy is starting to set in — just as it did in the dark days of the late 1970s and most of the 1980s.

“I don’t know exactly what happened in the first year before I got here (in 2010),” said Crennel, speaking for Pioli, who chose not to comment for this story. “We got to the playoffs (in 2010), and we weren’t able to repeat it (last) year. And then this year, we’re really struggling.

“The only thing I can do is try to improve the lot that I have right now. We’ve got eight games, and if we can get it turned around in eight games, we can say that there’s a chance that this organization can move forward.”

READ THE FULL STORY SUNDAY ONLINE AT KANSASCITY.COM AND IN THE PRINT EDITION OF THE KANSAS CITY STAR.

Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/2012/11/09/3908978/pioli-and-petersons-first-four.html#.UJ1k6KFuP4c.twitter#storylink=cpy

Detoxing
11-09-2012, 03:17 PM
First!

Ace Gunner
11-09-2012, 03:19 PM
First!

you are such a fast reader:D

FAX
11-09-2012, 03:20 PM
“The only thing I can do is try to improve the lot that I have right now. We’ve got eight games, and if we can get it turned around in eight games, we can say that there’s a chance that this organization can move forward.”

No, Roleo ... take your "chance" and jam it up your enormous ass. The organization will move forward. We just won't be moving forward with you. It wouldn't hurt you to start packing the china.

FAX

Mr. Flopnuts
11-09-2012, 03:22 PM
Jeff Rosen ‏@jeff_rosen88

More Carl Peterson: "I don’t think the cupboard was bare when they came… They had one good year, won the division, then went south." #Chiefs

SMACK MY BITCH UP!!!

Chocolate Hog
11-09-2012, 03:22 PM
Dude has a 3 million dollar condo on the plaza why should he give a fuck?

KC Tattoo
11-09-2012, 03:27 PM
Damnet Carl :cuss: drafting Todd Blackledge and not Dan Marino. Set us back 30 years for drafting a first round QB & a team that could have been Super Bowleautiful.

Lonewolf Ed
11-09-2012, 03:36 PM
Damnet Carl :cuss: drafting Todd Blackledge and not Dan Marino. Set us back 30 years for drafting a first round QB & a team that could have been Super Bowleautiful.

That was before Carl, I believe.

KC Tattoo
11-09-2012, 03:41 PM
That was before Carl, I believe.

ROFL LMAO


:shake: Damnet Carl :cuss:

Dartgod
11-09-2012, 03:45 PM
That was before Carl, I believe.

Bah! Carl's influence predates his actual arrival here.

Count Zarth
11-09-2012, 03:45 PM
http://i.imgur.com/wsFY7.jpg

Deberg_1990
11-09-2012, 03:45 PM
:popcorn:

Count Zarth
11-09-2012, 03:46 PM
http://i.imgur.com/urgnl.jpg

Ace Gunner
11-09-2012, 03:47 PM
CP & Marty had what many considered an elite team yet they were a mere 2 playoff wins better than Piholi's Chiefs? Carl, siddown.

Mr. Flopnuts
11-09-2012, 03:47 PM
That was before Carl, I believe.

Trolololololololol.

Deberg_1990
11-09-2012, 03:51 PM
CP & Marty had what many considered an elite team yet they were a mere 2 playoff wins better than Piholi's Chiefs? Carl, siddown.

3 playoff wins. They had one in 91 season

BossChief
11-09-2012, 03:52 PM
3 playoff wins. They had one in 91 season

one of those must have slipped by me.

siberian khatru
11-09-2012, 03:53 PM
That was before Carl, I believe.

N00b!

ChiefsCountry
11-09-2012, 03:55 PM
one of those must have slipped by me.

Beat the Raiders at home in 1991.
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Yv8Gphi7jLM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Lonewolf Ed
11-09-2012, 03:56 PM
N00b!

So, Carl gets retroactive blame, too. I am getting up to speed.

:harumph:

Ace Gunner
11-09-2012, 04:02 PM
3 playoff wins. They had one in 91 season

oops, they won 2 games during '93. oh well, not a Carl fan. I despise Piholi but Carl is just as much an idiot in my book. actually, he's more an idiot.

mcaj22
11-09-2012, 04:03 PM
CP & Marty had what many considered an elite team yet they were a mere 2 playoff wins better than Piholi's Chiefs? Carl, siddown.

were you not here in the offseason when people were hyping up all this current talent as elite?

Jon Baldwin was going to catch 10 touchdowns and break out for 700 yards
McCluster was going to have 90 touches
Tony Moeki was suppose to make us forget about Tony G
Jamaal Charles was going to run for a 1000
Peyton Hillis was going to be the bruising back savior


This was hyped to be the best talent we have ever seen in a long time. Bought into the Pioli hype machine.

Ace Gunner
11-09-2012, 04:06 PM
were you not here in the offseason when people were hyping up all this current talent as elite?

Jon Baldwin was going to catch 10 touchdowns and break out for 700 yards
McCluster was going to have 90 touches
Tony Moeki was suppose to make us forget about Tony G
Jamaal Charles was going to run for a 1000
Peyton Hillis was going to be the bruising back savior


This was hyped to be the best talent we have ever seen in a long time. Bought into the Pioli hype machine.

12 - 4 is still doable!!1!

isn't it:p

L.A. Chieffan
11-09-2012, 04:08 PM
Twist that knife Carl. Does it feel good?

Crush
11-09-2012, 04:09 PM
I'm betting Carl would shit on Chunt's desk if given the chance.

Guru
11-09-2012, 04:10 PM
That was before Carl, I believe.

For someone that has been here as long as you have, I'm surprised you didn't know that is a board joke these days.

theelusiveeightrop
11-09-2012, 04:10 PM
Carl is connected. Careful what you say.

Lonewolf Ed
11-09-2012, 04:15 PM
For someone that has been here as long as you have, I'm surprised you didn't know that is a board joke these days.

It's hard to keep laughing these days! Damned Chiefs.

bevischief
11-09-2012, 04:17 PM
12 - 4 is still doable!!1!

isn't it:p

Shut up.

KCFalcon59
11-09-2012, 04:19 PM
Pioli’s hand-picked quarterback, Matt Cassel, is the 31st-rated passer in the NFL, has turned the ball over an NFL-worst 18 times, and would be a backup right now had it not been for a concussion to backup-turned-starter Brady Quinn.

Fuck you Pioli

Pioli’s drafts have been unproductive, starting with defensive end Tyson Jackson, taken with the third overall pick in 2009, and his free-agent signees have made little impact.

Fuck you Pioli

Fuck you Pioli

Fuck you Pioli

Fuck you Pioli


Fuck you Pioli

BWillie
11-09-2012, 04:21 PM
Remember when I said you would be sorry for firing Carl Peterson?

Hai guise **waves**

KCFalcon59
11-09-2012, 04:25 PM
Beat the Raiders at home in 1991.
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Yv8Gphi7jLM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Was at that game. Cold as shit. If I remember correctly Deron Cherry had a great game. 2 ints I believe.

Chocolate Hog
11-09-2012, 04:32 PM
Remember when I said you would be sorry for firing Carl Peterson?

Hai guise **waves**

Anyone who's sorry for firing Carl is an idiot.

BWillie
11-09-2012, 04:33 PM
Anyone who's sorry for firing Carl is an idiot.

Carl's years were much better than Pioli's years. Carl put his teams in the proper place to be successful in the playoffs. When you go 13-3 and get a bye, you are doing what you need to do as a GM.

KC Tattoo
11-09-2012, 04:34 PM
Remember when I said you would be sorry for firing Carl Peterson?

Hai guise **waves**

Not sorry for fireing Carl Peterson altho regret getting Snott Pioli. We were all elated that Carl got kicked to the curb and at the time anyone was going be a God send. We got duped. Do I wish Carl was back hell no. Do I want Snott Pioli fired hell yes.

BWillie
11-09-2012, 04:41 PM
Not sorry for fireing Carl Peterson altho regret getting Snott Pioli. We were all elated that Carl got kicked to the curb and at the time anyone was going be a God send. We got duped. Do I wish Carl was back hell no. Do I want Snott Pioli fired hell yes.

I wasn't. I like going 10-6 and being good every single year.

KC Tattoo
11-09-2012, 04:47 PM
I wasn't. I like going 10-6 and being good every single year.

True fan right there.


Not me. I long for a Super Bowl + winning a few of them is even better, not to be greedy but yeah I want to be a Super Bowl champion hoarder.

Pasta Giant Meatball
11-09-2012, 05:20 PM
Both complete and absolute failures.

crossbow
11-09-2012, 05:42 PM
... Rufus Dawes ...

No Thanks, that was really stupid.

Chocolate Hog
11-09-2012, 05:49 PM
Carl's years were much better than Pioli's years. Carl put his teams in the proper place to be successful in the playoffs. When you go 13-3 and get a bye, you are doing what you need to do as a GM.

Where were you the last 8 years of Carls career?

Deberg_1990
11-09-2012, 05:52 PM
Beat the Raiders at home in 1991.
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Yv8Gphi7jLM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Cool Indy Jones hat Brah......

Crush
11-09-2012, 05:57 PM
Carl was a fucking failure. 3 playoff wins in 20 years should not be considered "success."

hometeam
11-09-2012, 05:59 PM
Carl was a ****ing failure. 3 playoff wins in 20 years should not be considered "success."

The problem is that is the best we have to compare it too.

Count Zarth
11-09-2012, 06:05 PM
Carl is fucking Bill Polian and Marty is Vince goddamn Lombardi compared to what we've had since.

I long for they days of blessed, blind mediocrity.

Crush
11-09-2012, 06:50 PM
The problem is that is the best we have to compare it too.

Indeed. The Hunts have truly fucked us. Move the team to LA and get it over with.

Easy 6
11-09-2012, 06:56 PM
Anyone who's sorry for firing Carl is an idiot.

Yup.

He only represents another way of not getting it done.

suzzer99
11-09-2012, 07:55 PM
3 playoff wins. They had one in 91 season

one of those must have slipped by me.

I was at that game. Most electric stadium experience I've ever been around. The highlight of the game was Art Shell's Raiders driving for a possible go ahead FG late in the game, then winding up with a first and 45 or or something after a 4 penalties in a row - knocking them out of field goal range. The crowd just went bananas.

Had a free ticket for the Montana game against Pittsburgh. Decided not to go because it was cold, raining, and I was hungover. :banghead:

Also had ticket for the AFC championship game all 3 times we went 13-3.

KCbroncoHATER
11-09-2012, 09:30 PM
I miss Carl.

Brainiac
11-09-2012, 10:50 PM
oops, they won 2 games during '93. oh well, not a Carl fan. I despise Piholi but Carl is just as much an idiot in my book. actually, he's more an idiot.

That's just plain stupid. It's fine to say you're not a Carl Peterson fan, but to say that he is worse than Pioli is incredibly ignorant.

DaWolf
11-10-2012, 12:22 AM
**** Carl. Never developed a receiver. Never developed a QB. Insisted on employing Gunther. Hands a big contract to Larry Johnson while screwing around with Jared Allen because he thought Allen was a bad apple. **** Carl. Just as bad as Pioli. Never won a damn thing with Carl. 20 years and all we got was 4 division titles, which comes out to 1 every 5 years. **** Carl. Elvis Grbac. Steve Bono. Dan Williams. Carlton Gray. Trezelle Jenkins. **** Carl...

bobbything
11-10-2012, 12:26 AM
**** Carl. Never developed a receiver. Never developed a QB. Insisted on employing Gunther. Hands a big contract to Larry Johnson while screwing around with Jared Allen because he thought Allen was a bad apple. **** Carl. Just as bad as Pioli. Never won a damn thing with Carl. 20 years and all we got was 4 division titles, which comes out to 1 every 5 years. **** Carl. Elvis Grbac. Steve Bono. Dan Williams. Carlton Gray. Trezelle Jenkins. **** Carl...

Agreed on everything except, "Just as bad as Pioli."

I can't get behind that. Carl is the reason we are all so angry at Pioli...he actually made us care about this team. For a long while, he was a very good GM.

Chiefspants
11-10-2012, 12:29 AM
I miss LJ.

Fixed.

Fruit Ninja
11-10-2012, 12:34 AM
True fan right there.


Not me. I long for a Super Bowl + winning a few of them is even better, not to be greedy but yeah I want to be a Super Bowl champion hoarder.

Well, you still need a 10-6 season to get into the play offs. ITs just about getting in year in and year out, but you also need a legit qb, but we all know that.

I wouldnt mind getting there at 10-6 if we had a good qb.

DaWolf
11-10-2012, 12:42 AM
Agreed on everything except, "Just as bad as Pioli."

I can't get behind that. Carl is the reason we are all so angry at Pioli...he actually made us care about this team. For a long while, he was a very good GM.

He was crap. He made one good decision, and that was hiring Marty. And that was by luck because his first choice was his buddy Vermeil and he turned Carl down at the time. I'll give you that he was better than Pioli solely based on the fact that Pioli has not hired a head coach worth a damn.

But Marty carried Carl throughout the 90's. I reiterate, one division title every five years is a pathetic pace to set during your tenure. Percy Snow, Harvey Williams, Greg Hill, Trezelle Jenkins, Victor Riley, Trezelle Jenkins, Sylvester Morris, Ryan Sims. Really?

I'm sure if we gave Pioli 20 years and 4 coaches he could luck his way into a few decent first rounders and win 3 more division titles during that stretch where everything goes right just like 2010 with the easy schedule and no injuries. That would be a horrific, horrific mistake, just like Carl was. Carl should have been canned as soon as Gunther got fired and Rich Gannon was named AFC Player of the Year. What a waste of 20 years. And no, Carl did not make me care about this team. I have always cared about this team. Carl was painful, Carl was mediocrity, Carl was being just good enough to get butts in the seats and then accomplishing nothing. Carl stood in our way for 20 years. **** Carl...

BossChief
11-10-2012, 12:58 AM
In Petersons first year, he drafted Derrick Thomas 4th overall.

In Piolis first year, he passed on Brian Orakpo to take Tyson Jackson 4th overall.

In Petersons 4th year, he did what it took to get Joe Montana.

In Piolis 4th year, he didn't do enough to get Peyton Manning.

I feel embarrassed to have defended Pioli for as long as I did. The guy is a complete morAn.

DaWolf
11-10-2012, 01:22 AM
In Petersons first year, he drafted Derrick Thomas 4th overall.

In Piolis first year, he passed on Brian Orakpo to take Tyson Jackson 4th overall.

In Petersons 4th year, he did what it took to get Joe Montana.

In Piolis 4th year, he didn't do enough to get Peyton Manning.

I feel embarrassed to have defended Pioli for as long as I did. The guy is a complete morAn.

I feel embarrassed for Chiefs fans that we're sitting here justifying the Peterson era. Carl had everyone sold, yet he never won jack.

It's probably a good thing for us that Pioli has been shown to be such an abject failure in just four years. We got a division title out of it, which is essentially what we got out of Carl. But unlike Carl, at least we can move on and hopefully find someone who is going to raise the profile of this franchise to championship contender. The worst thing would have been if this turned out to be another 7-9 to 9-7 season. That would have meant another year of mediocre QB's, another year of mediocre coaching, another year of mediocre drafts. And the same thing the next year. And the same thing the next year. And fans would have kept coming to the games. And we end up going another 20 years with little to show for it.

I just hope the next guy we hire doesn't have three straight non-playoff seasons with a bust at QB, so we don't have to sit around and read some stupid article about how Pioli at least managed to win a division title and send a QB to the pro bowl in his first two years. Because that's how I see that Carl article. Pioli's suckiness does not make Carl good. Carl was pure suck.

And there's a reason Carl Peterson, Bill Kuharick, and Herman Edwards are not employed by any NFL franchises...

KILLER_CLOWN
11-10-2012, 02:19 AM
Tough SOB negotiator.

KILLER_CLOWN
11-10-2012, 02:21 AM
DO NOT WANT CARL BACK, I do appreciate the success he had at times but NO just NO. I can't take another Gunther/Herm hire.

KCbroncoHATER
11-10-2012, 06:45 AM
Like it or not Carl was the reason we had so many great years at Arrowhead.

notorious
11-10-2012, 06:49 AM
In Petersons first year, he drafted Derrick Thomas 4th overall.

In Piolis first year, he passed on Brian Orakpo to take Tyson Jackson 4th overall.

In Petersons 4th year, he did what it took to get Joe Montana.

In Piolis 4th year, he didn't do enough to get Peyton Manning.

I feel embarrassed to have defended Pioli for as long as I did. The guy is a complete morAn.

Pioli could have dumped 35 million/year in cash at Peyton's doorstep and wouldn't have got him to come here. Peyton knows a loser when he sees it.


Not to be a correcting prick, but TJax was 3rd overall, which makes the FAIL even worse.

KCbroncoHATER
11-10-2012, 07:04 AM
Plus the fact we didn't need a QB.

KC Tattoo
11-10-2012, 07:48 AM
Like it or not Carl was the reason we had so many great years at Arrowhead.

Plus the fact we didn't need a QB.

God I hate stupid.

Rausch
11-10-2012, 08:00 AM
**** Carl. Elvis Grbac. Steve Bono. Dan Williams. Carlton Gray. Trezelle Jenkins. **** Carl...

DT, Kneel Smith, Dale Carter, Will Shields, Gonzo, Okoye, Montana, Marcus Allen, Jarred Allen, etc.

It isn't even close.

Carl set up the deal but couldn't close. He could make the playoffs but not take the next step.

Pioli can't even manage more than 1 winning season in 4 years with ONE drafted probowler.

ONE...

Coogs
11-10-2012, 08:27 AM
He was crap. He made one good decision, and that was hiring Marty. And that was by luck because his first choice was his buddy Vermeil and he turned Carl down at the time. I'll give you that he was better than Pioli solely based on the fact that Pioli has not hired a head coach worth a damn.

But Marty carried Carl throughout the 90's. I reiterate, one division title every five years is a pathetic pace to set during your tenure. Percy Snow, Harvey Williams, Greg Hill, Trezelle Jenkins, Victor Riley, Trezelle Jenkins, Sylvester Morris, Ryan Sims. Really?

I'm sure if we gave Pioli 20 years and 4 coaches he could luck his way into a few decent first rounders and win 3 more division titles during that stretch where everything goes right just like 2010 with the easy schedule and no injuries. That would be a horrific, horrific mistake, just like Carl was. Carl should have been canned as soon as Gunther got fired and Rich Gannon was named AFC Player of the Year. What a waste of 20 years. And no, Carl did not make me care about this team. I have always cared about this team. Carl was painful, Carl was mediocrity, Carl was being just good enough to get butts in the seats and then accomplishing nothing. Carl stood in our way for 20 years. **** Carl...
It appears to me the biggest difference between Peterson and Pioli was Peterson would get his coaches what they wanted, and there is no real evidence to support Pioli doing that... outside of Breaston.

And, we'll never know, but Pioli may have had his coach in Haley. I say may. Granted, it was a weak schedule in 2010, but he did get us to 10-6. And he did this being forced by Pioli to do it Pioli's way. It is no secret Haley did not want/like Cassel.

Had Pioli been more like Peterson, and given Haley the pieces he wanted, then we would know if Haley truely has the ability to be a fine HC in this league.

Personally, I think he would have been... and still may be one day. Sadly if that happens, it won't be here.

FAX
11-10-2012, 10:08 AM
It appears to me the biggest difference between Peterson and Pioli was Peterson would get his coaches what they wanted, and there is no real evidence to support Pioli doing that... outside of Breaston.

And, we'll never know, but Pioli may have had his coach in Haley. I say may. Granted, it was a weak schedule in 2010, but he did get us to 10-6. And he did this being forced by Pioli to do it Pioli's way. It is no secret Haley did not want/like Cassel.

Had Pioli been more like Peterson, and given Haley the pieces he wanted, then we would know if Haley truely has the ability to be a fine HC in this league.

Personally, I think he would have been... and still may be one day. Sadly if that happens, it won't be here.

There really isn't any way to compare Pioli with any GM I've ever heard of, honestly.

Granted, I am unfamiliar with the inner workings of most other franchises, but what other GM can you name who demands the level of absolute control demonstrated by Dr. Evil? I've never heard of one.

FAX

ChiefMojo
11-10-2012, 10:28 AM
In hindsight Carl did a lot of good and it shows even more now that Pioli is here. Sure Carl may have stuck around a little to long and never drafted us a quality QB either but he did get us Montana and Green who were still very good QB's. Just seemed we could never get over the hump of having the total team down. We either had a great defense and rushing attack but no legit passing attack or we had a good offense and a bad to decent defense. Carl always had us believe we were just 2-3 players away from a Super Bowl. In reality he may have been right in some ways.

Regardless of play the one thing we can't deny about Carl was he fact he made Arrowhead and the Chiefs Kingdom what it was. He made the fans a part of the team. The interaction he had the players and fans together through charity events and other things was a lot of fun. We now have a front office that doesn't seem to care about the fans and the players seem like gladiators and not people anymore. Pioli has made this organization feel like the Mafia. It is dark, secretive and not a happy environment all-around. At least Carl gave us a lot of joy to go with a our pain.

DaWolf
11-10-2012, 10:57 AM
There really isn't any way to compare Pioli with any GM I've ever heard of, honestly.

Granted, I am unfamiliar with the inner workings of most other franchises, but what other GM can you name who demands the level of absolute control demonstrated by Dr. Evil? I've never heard of one.

FAX

Bill Polian. He was labeled as a tyrant. But he drafted Peyton Manning, so it was all good until Peyton hurt his neck...

Count Zarth
11-10-2012, 11:05 AM
When your head coaches are Marv Levy and Tony Dungy you are anything but a tyrant.

DaWolf
11-10-2012, 11:20 AM
When your head coaches are Marv Levy and Tony Dungy you are anything but a tyrant.

Oh trust me, there were articles written after he was fired about how much of a tyrant he was and how people within the organization were afraid to speak to the media in fear of losing their jobs. There was a particular rip job in the Indy Star or something by one of their columnists that read like a Kent Babb piece on Pioli. I can't find it right now because the archives are behind a pay wall. Here are a couple of quotes about him though:

Kravitz: “In the end, wins and losses and draft grades didn't do in Bill Polian. Bill Polian did in Bill Polian. He just became too difficult, too divisive, too dismissive of anybody and everybody who didn't share his NFL world-view. Too often, he became a sideshow and an embarrassment, whether it was screaming at Jay Mohr on the radio or railing about 'rats who spread lies.'

“This franchise needed new eyes. It needed a new direction, a new culture, a new everything. These are weird and exciting times for the Indianapolis Colts and this city, fraught with promise and uncertainty.”

Mike Freeman of CBSSports.com: “... (As) great as he was building winners he was equally skilled at constructing walls within his own organization. He ran his teams with an iron hand and was an unrepentant bully both to people who worked for him and the press. When you look up the phrase scorched Earth in the dictionary there's a picture of Polian with a lit match and can of kerosene.

“That was, I'm told, partially the reason for Polian's dismissal, to change the culture of the Colts. Most importantly, however, Polian had lost the fast ball that made him so formidable. He failed to get a backup for Manning and the Colts had lost their depth. He allowed his son, Chris, to run the team when Chris never proved he deserved that kind of power."

http://espn.go.com/blog/afcsouth/post/_/id/32761/rtc-colts-fire-polians-edition

Coogs
11-11-2012, 09:38 AM
The full article...

http://www.kansascity.com/2012/11/10/3910735/piolis-first-four-years-with-chiefs.html

and a little bit more...

http://www.kansascity.com/2012/11/10/3911323/king-carl-vs-patriot-way-a-comparison.html

GloryDayz
11-11-2012, 10:16 AM
Carl's years were much better than Pioli's years. Carl put his teams in the proper place to be successful in the playoffs. When you go 13-3 and get a bye, you are doing what you need to do as a GM.

I was at the 17th game of that 13-3 (regular season). It was embarrassing. He may have done what was right on the offensive side of the the ball, but when they only non-scoring drive the Colts had during the game was brought to a stop by the half-time clock. Manning or not, it was embarrassing! And the crowd helped the defense as much as this STH can remember. So whatever he "did" he "didn't" do shit for the defense.

TEX
11-11-2012, 10:51 AM
I was at the 17th game of that 13-3 (regular season). It was embarrassing. He may have done what was right on the offensive side of the the ball, but when they only non-scoring drive the Colts had during the game was brought to a stop by the half-time clock. Manning or not, it was embarrassing! And the crowd helped the defense as much as this STH can remember. So whatever he "did" he "didn't" do shit for the defense.

He helped the defense the decade before...

KCChiefsFan88
11-11-2012, 11:04 AM
In hindsight Carl did a lot of good and it shows even more now that Pioli is here. Sure Carl may have stuck around a little to long and never drafted us a quality QB either but he did get us Montana and Green who were still very good QB's. Just seemed we could never get over the hump of having the total team down. We either had a great defense and rushing attack but no legit passing attack or we had a good offense and a bad to decent defense. Carl always had us believe we were just 2-3 players away from a Super Bowl. In reality he may have been right in some ways.

Carl was the reason the Chiefs never had a complete team.

In the '90s when the Chiefs were a halfway decent offense away from being a legit Super Bowl team, he never went out and landed the big time WR or ended up picking the wrong QB (Grbac over Gannon).

In the early 2000's, Carl didn't do enough to improve the defense. After the 2003 season ended with the infamous playoff loss to Indy the Chiefs did next to nothing to upgrade the talent on defense. The only move they made was replace Greg Robinson with Goonther. The following season resulted in a 7-9 record.

That was the the Chiefs team under Dictator Carl... just good enough to get fans interested, rarely good enough to compete for a Super Bowl.

Carl's legacy is enhanced by Fat Scott's epic fail, which is more of a commentary on how horrific Fat Scott has been as GM.

Let's not start revising the Chiefs history under Dictator Carl.

The last 15 years of his tenure in KC resulted in zero playoff wins. The last decade of his tenure in KC resulted in only two playoff appearances.

Rausch
11-11-2012, 11:07 AM
Peterson is sitting back somewhere sipping umbrella drinks and laughing at all this...

mcaj22
11-11-2012, 11:20 AM
Peterson is sitting back somewhere sipping umbrella drinks and laughing at all this...

yea with Jeff Ireland down in Florida telling him what players to draft

Count Zarth
11-11-2012, 04:28 PM
Peterson is sitting back somewhere sipping umbrella drinks and laughing at all this...

http://i.imgur.com/G77eW.png

Sweet Daddy Hate
11-11-2012, 05:39 PM
Carl is fucking Bill Polian and Marty is Vince goddamn Lombardi compared to what we've had since.

I long for they days of blessed, blind mediocrity.

No you don't.

And I'm glad articles like this are coming out. Carl was a complete fuckbag who overstayed his welcome and effectiveness by 10 years. If Pioli is losing to Carl, this is a GREAT sign.