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The_Grand_Illusion
11-17-2012, 02:58 PM
http://m.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/post/breaking-the-president-knew-the-truth-about-benghazi/2012/11/16/39aecaf0-3034-11e2-9f50-0308e1e75445_blog.html


BREAKING: The president knew the truth about Benghazi

By Jennifer Rubin, Published: NOVEMBER 16, 5:18 PM ET


In a blockbuster report, John Solomon, the former Associated Press and Post reporter, has ferreted out the president’s daily brief that informed him within 72 hours of the Sept. 11 attack that the Benghazi attack was a jihadist operation.

Citing officials directly familiar with the information, Solomon writes in the Washington Guardian that Obama and other administration officials were told that “that the attack was likely carried out by local militia and other armed extremists sympathetic to al-Qaida in the region.”

He adds:

The details from the CIA and Pentagon assessments of the killing of Ambassador Chris [Stevens] were far more specific, more detailed and more current than the unclassified talking points that UN Ambassador Susan Rice and other officials used five days after the attack to suggest to Americans that an unruly mob angry over an anti-Islamic video was to blame, officials said.

Most of the details affirming al-Qaida links were edited or excluded from the unclassified talking points used by Rice in appearances on news programs the weekend after the attack, officials confirmed Friday. Multiple agencies were involved in excising information, doing so because it revealed sources and methods, dealt with classified intercepts or involved information that was not yet fully confirmed, the officials said.

Solomon cautions that there were bits of evidence pointing to a spontaneous attack but, as Eli Lake of the Daily Beast and others have reported, he writes: “Among the early evidence cited in the briefings to the president and other senior officials were intercepts showing some of the participants were known members or supporters of Ansar al-Sharia — the al-Qaida-sympathizing militia in Libya — and the AQIM, which is a direct affiliate of al-Qaida in northern Africa, the officials said.”

How could the president and his senior staff then have allowed (or rather, sent) Rice to go out to tell an entirely different tale to the American people on Sept. 16 on five TV shows?

This report indicates that the president certainly knew that Benghazi wasn’t a rogue movie review gone bad. He had information that plainly spelled out what was later confirmed by additional intelligence. If this information was too confidential to share with the public, at the very least the president and others should not have mislead voters.

This is a full-blown scandal, and in light of this information, the press corps’s slothful indifference to uncovering the truth at Wednesday’s news conference with Obama is all the more shocking. It is time for the president to come clean. The scandal has now enveloped the Oval Office and will define his second term, if not resolved satisfactorily.

The irony of this is that Rice may well have been used as a patsy, unaware that she was sent out to spin a misleading tale. My colleague Dana Milbank recounts Rice’s long-standing inability to get along with others and to be circumspect in her pronouncements:

It’s true that, in her much-criticized TV performance, she was reciting talking points given to her by the intelligence agencies. But that’s the trouble. Rice stuck with her points even though they had been contradicted by the president of the Libyan National Assembly, who, on CBS’s ‘Face the Nation’ just before Rice, said there was “no doubt” that the attack on Americans in Benghazi “was preplanned.” Rice rebutted the Libyan official, arguing — falsely, it turned out — that there was no evidence of such planning. . . . Obama can do better at State than Susan Rice.

Frankly the same could be said of many national security positions at this point. The American people made their choice in November on the president, but it now appears they were duped regarding the real facts concerning Benghazi. What are we going to do about that?

dirk digler
11-17-2012, 03:08 PM
So now the new conspiracy theory since Rice is off the hook because Patreaus and other intel people confirmed they gave her the talking points because they didn't want to tip off anybody is that the POTUS should have tipped off the terrorists?

I am so confused

J Diddy
11-17-2012, 03:10 PM
So now the new conspiracy theory since Rice is off the hook because Patreaus and other intel people confirmed they gave her the talking points because they didn't want to tip off anybody is that the POTUS should have tipped off the terrorists?

I am so confused

It doesn't matter what your premise is as long as your conclusion is impeach Obama.

alpha_omega
11-17-2012, 03:13 PM
Of course he knew. duh.

HonestChieffan
11-17-2012, 03:14 PM
Who would it "tip off"?

theelusiveeightrop
11-17-2012, 03:14 PM
Obama knew, and lied.

chiefzilla1501
11-17-2012, 03:15 PM
It doesn't matter what your premise is as long as your conclusion is impeach Obama.

I think the main premise is... why does it seem like all this shit is coming to a head right after the election? Why did major media outlets purposely duck away from asking the hard questions (60 Minutes waited until a week or 2 before the election to disclose Obama's take on Benghazi. CNN exaggerated Obama's original stance on Benghazi weeks before the election).

Regardless of party, we lost the ability to have fair debate on this matter. And that is a tremendous, tremendous shame.

dirk digler
11-17-2012, 03:16 PM
It doesn't matter what your premise is as long as your conclusion is impeach Obama.

Of course when you are dealing with people like loser Grand Idiot

dirk digler
11-17-2012, 03:18 PM
Who would it "tip off"?

According to Patreaus and the CIA they didn't want to tip off the terrorists they knew who they were so they could monitor them. I posted this yesterday.


David H. Petraeus (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/p/david_h_petraeus/index.html?inline=nyt-per), the former director of the Central Intelligence Agency, told lawmakers on Friday that classified intelligence reports revealed that the deadly assault on the American diplomatic mission in Libya was a terrorist attack, but that the administration refrained from saying it suspected that the perpetrators of the attack were Al Qaeda affiliates and sympathizers to avoid tipping off the groups.

Mr. Petraeus, who resigned last week after admitting to an extramarital affair, said the names of groups suspected in the attack — including Al Qaeda’s franchise in North Africa and a local Libyan group, Ansar al-Shariah — were removed from the public explanation of the attack immediately after the assault to avoiding alerting the militants that American intelligence and law enforcement agencies were tracking them, lawmakers said.

The talking points initially drafted by the C.I.A. attributed the attack to fighters with Al Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb, the organization’s North Africa franchise, and Ansar al-Shariah, a Libyan group, some of whose members have Al Qaeda ties.

Mr. Petraeus and other top C.I.A. officials signed off on the draft and then circulated it to other intelligence agencies, as well as the State Department and National Security Council.

At some point in the process — Mr. Petraeus told lawmakers he was not sure where — objections were raised to naming the groups, and the less specific word “extremists” was substituted.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-17-2012, 03:22 PM
Of course when you are dealing with people like loser Grand Idiot

Be in denial all you want. It appears more and more that Obama lied to the American people. Just because you don't like that doesn't mean it's true. That also means where you get your info from, the liberal media, did their best to run out the clock on this before the election. How messed up is that? Of course you libs don't care because your line of thinking is messed up too.

TGI

stonedstooge
11-17-2012, 03:26 PM
O'Bama told the UN the same story. Afraid to tip off other countries too?

dirk digler
11-17-2012, 03:28 PM
Be in denial all you want. It appears more and more that Obama lied to the American people. Just because you don't like that doesn't mean it's true. That also means where you get your info from, the liberal media, did their best to run out the clock on this before the election. How messed up is that? Of course you libs don't care because your line of thinking is messed up too.

TGI

What did he lie about?

The_Grand_Illusion
11-17-2012, 03:32 PM
What did he lie about?


You're kidding me right? The dig about your liberal media keeping you in the dark about this is so true.

TGI

dirk digler
11-17-2012, 03:35 PM
You're kidding me right? The dig about your liberal media keeping you in the dark about this is so true.

TGI

I want you to tell me what you think he lied about.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-17-2012, 03:40 PM
I want you to tell me what you think he lied about.

If you truly want to catch up, fine but if you are just trying to be an ass because there are plenty of threads here on Benghazi to inform yourself.

With what Petraeus said yesterday and this report above, this absolutely had nothing to do with a video that many in his administration tried to pull off on the American people for almost 2 weeks. There is much more to this before, during, and after the event that shows much incompetence from this administration.

TGI

Messier
11-17-2012, 03:43 PM
You're kidding me right? The dig about your liberal media keeping you in the dark about this is so true.

TGI

Getting all your info only from news sites that reinforce your world view is not a good thing, conservative or liberal. (see the presidential election)

The_Grand_Illusion
11-17-2012, 03:46 PM
Getting all your info only from news sites that reinforce your world view is not a good thing, conservative or liberal. (see the presidential election)

I've never seen a part of the media so in the tank for one candidate in my life, even to the point of not covering Benghazi so they don't hurt his election chances. They chose holding on to their liberal power instead of reporting what was right.

TGI

|Zach|
11-17-2012, 03:54 PM
Game changing scandals usually are not game changing scandals when you have to spend most the time trying to convince people they are game changing scandals...




















































































...game changing scandal.

Messier
11-17-2012, 03:54 PM
I've never seen a part of the media so in the tank for one candidate in my life, even to the point of not covering Benghazi so they don't hurt his election chances. They chose holding on to their liberal power instead of reporting what was right.

TGI

It's the same from both sides though, right? There are liberal news sources that will sweep things under the rug to make Obama look better. There are also conservative sources that hate Obama with a passion, and want to find any dirt they can legit or not. If there is really something to a story it'll find it's way to the surface. If the MSM thinks something isn't a big deal you won't hear too much about it other than from partisan sources.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-17-2012, 03:56 PM
Game changing scandals usually are not game changing scandals when you have to spend most the time trying to convince people they are game changing scandals...




















































































...game changing scandal.

You're such an arrogant ass. Sometimes you just need to STFU!

TGI

|Zach|
11-17-2012, 03:57 PM
You're such an arrogant ass. Sometimes you just need to STFU!

TGI

Sorry I'm not sorry.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-17-2012, 03:59 PM
It's the same from both sides though, right? There are liberal news sources that will sweep things under the rug to make Obama look better. There are also conservative sources that hate Obama with a passion, and want to find any dirt they can legit or not. If there is really something to a story it'll find it's way to the surface. If the MSM thinks something isn't a big deal you won't hear too much about it other than from partisan sources.

That's understandable but Americans died and it's appearing more and more there was much incompetence from this administration before, during, and after. The liberal media cared barely to cover any of this as to not hurt his election chances. I know you have a hard time grasping how messed up that was.

TGI

The_Grand_Illusion
11-17-2012, 04:01 PM
Sorry I'm not sorry.

I have no doubt you arent. Arrogance is what it is.

:shake:

TGI

dirk digler
11-17-2012, 04:09 PM
If you truly want to catch up, fine but if you are just trying to be an ass because there are plenty of threads here on Benghazi to inform yourself.

With what Petraeus said yesterday and this report above, this absolutely had nothing to do with a video that many in his administration tried to pull off on the American people for almost 2 weeks. There is much more to this before, during, and after the event that shows much incompetence from this administration.

TGI

I know the story and what happened. I am not understanding what he lied about.

But someone has put it better than I can so point to which ones you agree with:

1. Obama sympathizes with terrorists and subscribes completely to the left-wing “blow-back” theory where Americans are morally culpable for terrorist attacks by courageous downtrodden Muslims. He is therefore predisposed to cover-up attacks on America. Partly because he blames America, and partly because he fears more blow-back. He is a radical, a coward, and a liar.

2. Obama tried to hide the terrorism aspect because he thought that a terrorist attack would hurt him in the polls. Obama’s political team is under the impression that one-off terrorist attacks produce a “rally AGAINST the flag” effect. The Commander in Chief is significantly weakened by these events, as we saw in the 3rd debate when Romney dressed down Obama, who cowered in the corner and wept on TV. David Axelrod feared that Obama’s poll numbers would collapse if the public saw him pounding his chest about murderers for a month. In order to avoid this outcome, he hatched a brilliant plan to increase his political fortunes: to cover up the terrorist attack for two weeks before eventually revealing it! When the GOP hauls David Axelrod in front of Congress, we’ll all learn more about the brilliant political plan that single-highhandedly reelected Obama.

3. Obama’s communications team doesn’t share information with public surrogates in a timely or efficient manner. This is worse than Watergate!

4. During the attack on Benghazi, Obama ignored a plea for help and denied assistance to the consulate. Because he’s a craven monster who sympathizes with violent murderers.

BigMeatballDave
11-17-2012, 04:16 PM
Mr. Teflon will get thru this unscathed.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-17-2012, 04:25 PM
I know the story and what happened. I am not understanding what he lied about.

But someone has put it better than I can so point to which ones you agree with:

1. Obama sympathizes with terrorists and subscribes completely to the left-wing “blow-back” theory where Americans are morally culpable for terrorist attacks by courageous downtrodden Muslims. He is therefore predisposed to cover-up attacks on America. Partly because he blames America, and partly because he fears more blow-back. He is a radical, a coward, and a liar.

2. Obama tried to hide the terrorism aspect because he thought that a terrorist attack would hurt him in the polls. Obama’s political team is under the impression that one-off terrorist attacks produce a “rally AGAINST the flag” effect. The Commander in Chief is significantly weakened by these events, as we saw in the 3rd debate when Romney dressed down Obama, who cowered in the corner and wept on TV. David Axelrod feared that Obama’s poll numbers would collapse if the public saw him pounding his chest about murderers for a month. In order to avoid this outcome, he hatched a brilliant plan to increase his political fortunes: to cover up the terrorist attack for two weeks before eventually revealing it! When the GOP hauls David Axelrod in front of Congress, we’ll all learn more about the brilliant political plan that single-highhandedly reelected Obama.

3. Obama’s communications team doesn’t share information with public surrogates in a timely or efficient manner. This is worse than Watergate!

4. During the attack on Benghazi, Obama ignored a plea for help and denied assistance to the consulate. Because he’s a craven monster who sympathizes with violent murderers.

So now the word "lie" is the new "is". :shake:

Now that we know more, here is the timeline with all the lies about the video by many in the administration. The only thing we didn't know is when the president knew and this report in the OP says he knew well before he sent the "video" narrative out.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/E6OzShia0bQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

HonestChieffan
11-17-2012, 04:26 PM
According to Patreaus and the CIA they didn't want to tip off the terrorists they knew who they were so they could monitor them. I posted this yesterday.

You took that like carp on a doughball. Like the terrorists are low key. Jesus people will believe anything. Bet he was banging that biographer to learn some cool secrets like James Bond too

Direckshun
11-17-2012, 05:01 PM
So now the new conspiracy theory since Rice is off the hook because Patreaus and other intel people confirmed they gave her the talking points because they didn't want to tip off anybody is that the POTUS should have tipped off the terrorists?

I am so confused

I am confused, too.

Somebody needs to review this for me.

dirk digler
11-17-2012, 05:04 PM
So now the word "lie" is the new "is". :shake:

Now that we know more, here is the timeline with all the lies about the video by many in the administration. The only thing we didn't know is when the president knew and this report in the OP says he knew well before he sent the "video" narrative out.



So basically it is #3 then.

dirk digler
11-17-2012, 05:05 PM
You took that like carp on a doughball. Like the terrorists are low key. Jesus people will believe anything. Bet he was banging that biographer to learn some cool secrets like James Bond too

So the guy you loved and everybody thought was a hero and the right wanted to be POTUS now is a liar.

You should run with that

ClevelandBronco
11-17-2012, 05:21 PM
Who gives a fuck one way or the other?

Brainiac
11-17-2012, 06:10 PM
JFC, this isn't rocket science.

This was all about not embarrassing Obama just before election time. Now, less than two weeks after the election, the truth comes out. And the truth is that the Obama administration knew damn well that the attack had nothing to do with the YouTube video, but it was convenient to make that claim because admitting that it was a terrorist attack would conflict with the claims that candidate Obama was making about making Al Qaeda powerless.

You can deny it all you want, and you can pretend not to understand what the criticism is about, but it's really pointless now. The ploy was successful. Congratulations.

Donger
11-17-2012, 06:16 PM
So now the new conspiracy theory since Rice is off the hook because Patreaus and other intel people confirmed they gave her the talking points because they didn't want to tip off anybody is that the POTUS should have tipped off the terrorists?

I am so confused

Unless I'm mistaken, the talking points that CIA gave Rice were altered to not mention that this was a terrorist attack, but a spontaneous response to the YouTube video.

Is that not correct?

If so, the obvious question is: who made the changes to the talking points and why?

Donger
11-17-2012, 06:17 PM
JFC, this isn't rocket science.

This was all about not embarrassing Obama just before election time. Now, less than two weeks after the election, the truth comes out. And the truth is that the Obama administration knew damn well that the attack had nothing to do with the YouTube video, but it was convenient to make that claim because admitting that it was a terrorist attack would conflict with the claims that candidate Obama was making about making Al Qaeda powerless.

You can deny it all you want, and you can pretend not to understand what the criticism is about, but it's really pointless now. The ploy was successful. Congratulations.

I think that motive makes the most sense. Obama was on record as saying that AQ was decimated.

RINGLEADER
11-17-2012, 06:20 PM
I still don't understand the fascination with what Obama said or did (or didn't say or didn't do) after the attack.

The real story is what he said or did (or didn't say or didn't do) BEFORE the attack.

HonestChieffan
11-17-2012, 06:23 PM
I still don't understand the fascination with what Obama said or did (or didn't say or didn't do) after the attack.

The real story is what he said or did (or didn't say or didn't do) BEFORE the attack.

Bingo

The_Grand_Illusion
11-17-2012, 06:48 PM
I still don't understand the fascination with what Obama said or did (or didn't say or didn't do) after the attack.

The real story is what he said or did (or didn't say or didn't do) BEFORE the attack.

Oh I agree, there is plenty to be concerned about before, during, and after the Benghazi attack. I posted the video of all those in the administration that went out with the false narrative, now we know that just wasn't true. You have to wonder why they did that. Administrations make mistakes all the time but to try to cover it up, you have to wonder why?

TGI

stonedstooge
11-17-2012, 06:53 PM
Oh I agree, there is plenty to be concerned about before, during, and after the Benghazi attack. I posted the video of all those in the administration that went out with the false narrative, now we know that just wasn't true. You have to wonder why they did that. Administrations make mistakes all the time but to try to cover it up, you have to wonder why?

TGI

I think they have to work it backwards to block all holes to make sure no rats escape

dirk digler
11-17-2012, 06:54 PM
Unless I'm mistaken, the talking points that CIA gave Rice were altered to not mention that this was a terrorist attack, but a spontaneous response to the YouTube video.

Is that not correct?

If so, the obvious question is: who made the changes to the talking points and why?

Read what I posted above. The CIA approved the altered tp because they didn't want the specific groups mentioned.

Donger
11-17-2012, 06:58 PM
Read what I posted above. The CIA approved the altered tp because they didn't want the specific groups mentioned.

Are you referring to this? If so, where does it say that CIA approved the changes?

Mr. Petraeus, who resigned last week after admitting to an extramarital affair, said the names of groups suspected in the attack — including Al Qaeda’s franchise in North Africa and a local Libyan group, Ansar al-Shariah — were removed from the public explanation of the attack immediately after the assault to avoiding alerting the militants that American intelligence and law enforcement agencies were tracking them, lawmakers said.

The talking points initially drafted by the C.I.A. attributed the attack to fighters with Al Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb, the organization’s North Africa franchise, and Ansar al-Shariah, a Libyan group, some of whose members have Al Qaeda ties.

Mr. Petraeus and other top C.I.A. officials signed off on the draft and then circulated it to other intelligence agencies, as well as the State Department and National Security Council.

At some point in the process — Mr. Petraeus told lawmakers he was not sure where — objections were raised to naming the groups, and the less specific word “extremists” was substituted.

dirk digler
11-17-2012, 07:02 PM
Are you referring to this? If so, where does it say that CIA approved the changes?

Mr. Petraeus, who resigned last week after admitting to an extramarital affair, said the names of groups suspected in the attack — including Al Qaeda’s franchise in North Africa and a local Libyan group, Ansar al-Shariah — were removed from the public explanation of the attack immediately after the assault to avoiding alerting the militants that American intelligence and law enforcement agencies were tracking them, lawmakers said.

The talking points initially drafted by the C.I.A. attributed the attack to fighters with Al Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb, the organization’s North Africa franchise, and Ansar al-Shariah, a Libyan group, some of whose members have Al Qaeda ties.

Mr. Petraeus and other top C.I.A. officials signed off on the draft and then circulated it to other intelligence agencies, as well as the State Department and National Security Council.

At some point in the process — Mr. Petraeus told lawmakers he was not sure where — objections were raised to naming the groups, and the less specific word “extremists” was substituted.

He said it in his testimony yesterday.

But the CIA eventually approved the modified assessment, King said Petraeus told the committee.

Donger
11-17-2012, 07:06 PM
He said it in his testimony yesterday.

Okay, that's fine.

Now, why was the request made in the first place and by whom?

dirk digler
11-17-2012, 07:12 PM
Okay, that's fine.

Now, why was the request made in the first place and by whom?

Go ask the CIA but the WH said they had nothing to do with it.

The White House made only small, factual edits to the CIA's initial intelligence assessment on the September attack on Americans in Benghazi, deputy national security adviser Ben Rhodes said Saturday.

"We were provided with points by the intelligence community that represented their assessment," Rhodes said aboard Air Force One en route to Asia. "The only edit made by the White House was the factual edit about how to refer to the facility.”

The White House and State Department changed a reference in the report from "consulate" to "diplomatic facility," he said. "Other than that, we were guided by the points that were provided by the intelligence community. So I can’t speak to any other edits that may have been made.”

BigRedChief
11-17-2012, 07:15 PM
Okay, that's fine.

Now, why was the request made in the first place and by whom?Bureaucrats. At the time the information was considered "Secret". The U.N. Ambassador can't go on 5 national TV talk shows and say classified information. The "secret" part was redacted and it never made it to the release for the public.

This is public information.

They kept it "secret" because they were hunting the perpetrators down and didn't want them to know they were in the cross-hairs of the USA.

listopencil
11-17-2012, 07:15 PM
You took that like carp on a doughball. Like the terrorists are low key. Jesus people will believe anything. Bet he was banging that biographer to learn some cool secrets like James Bond too

It was critical that Rice put the YouTube video story out there, because terrorists watch all the Sunday morning talk shows. And why does it matter that the government lies to us when so many citizens will not only swallow any bullshit that is spoon fed to them, but will be first in line to defend the administration even when they admit they lied?

http://bumperstickersinc.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/0/3/0342_a_nation_of_sheep_will_beget_a_government_of_wolves_-black_4.jpg

HonestChieffan
11-17-2012, 07:32 PM
Bureaucrats. At the time the information was considered "Secret". The U.N. Ambassador can't go on 5 national TV talk shows and say classified information. The "secret" part was redacted and it never made it to the release for the public.

This is public information.

They kept it "secret" because they were hunting the perpetrators down and didn't want them to know they were in the cross-hairs of the USA.

There were reporters at the scene two weeks before the FBI got there. Your crosshairs are pure bullshit. There are a lot of things in this entire fiasco that seem secret. All seem to be protecting the state department and the White House.

A Salt Weapon
11-17-2012, 07:39 PM
Pretty obvious the president knew about it. Pretty lame he thinks so highly of himself that he needs to scapegoat someone for his failures rather than manning up and taking the blame.
Pretty pathetic that the media is so in love with him that they will not report on it until after the election.
Pretty amazing the American people have become so apathetic to not care.

I actually feel bad for the dog-eating-Kenyan that he is such a little man that his ego keeps him from admitting a mistake, to the tune of fabricating cover-up after cover-up to protect his fragile ego.

This is no different that the massive cover-ups and lack of reporting associated with fast and furious and the gun-running to Mexico as an attempt to strip Americans of their constitutional rights.

The hatred and resentment this president has for America is appalling, the fact that his supporters are either blind to it or support it, is equally appalling.
Posted via Mobile Device

dirk digler
11-17-2012, 07:47 PM
There were reporters at the scene two weeks before the FBI got there. Your crosshairs are pure bullshit. There are a lot of things in this entire fiasco that seem secret. All seem to be protecting the state department and the White House.

I always remember during a murder investigation how the police spokesperson\chief always come out and tell the public who they think murderer is and how they did it in the opening stages of the investigation. lol

If there is anything secret IMO it has to do with the CIA and what kinds of ops they were running out of the embassy and their other facility

J Diddy
11-17-2012, 08:28 PM
Pretty obvious the president knew about it. Pretty lame he thinks so highly of himself that he needs to scapegoat someone for his failures rather than manning up and taking the blame.
Pretty pathetic that the media is so in love with him that they will not report on it until after the election.
Pretty amazing the American people have become so apathetic to not care.

I actually feel bad for the dog-eating-Kenyan that he is such a little man that his ego keeps him from admitting a mistake, to the tune of fabricating cover-up after cover-up to protect his fragile ego.

This is no different that the massive cover-ups and lack of reporting associated with fast and furious and the gun-running to Mexico as an attempt to strip Americans of their constitutional rights.

The hatred and resentment this president has for America is appalling, the fact that his supporters are either blind to it or support it, is equally appalling.
Posted via Mobile Device
You must still have your fingers in your ears and your eyes shut, because they reelected him 11 days ago.

Have you ever heard about the little boy who cried wolf? For the past 2 decades the GOP have been crying wolf. Suddenly, you are appalled at the concept of the townspeople not sprinting to the rescue.

BigRedChief
11-17-2012, 08:47 PM
Your crosshairs are pure bullshit.Sure pal. Whatever. Feel free to document my statement. When this is settled and everything is out there. Feel free to throw it up in my face, But you might want to ask Banyon what happened the last time he called BS on me about Benghazi.;)

BigRedChief
11-17-2012, 08:54 PM
I always remember during a murder investigation how the police spokesperson\chief always come out and tell the public who they think murderer is and how they did it in the opening stages of the investigation. lol

If there is anything secret IMO it has to do with the CIA and what kinds of ops they were running out of the embassy and their other facilityStupid ass Broadwell spilled the beans of one black op taking place there........
Broadwell went on to explain more sensitive details from the Benghazi attacks, particularly concerning what the real cause might have been. “Now, I don’t know if a lot of you heard this, but the CIA annex had actually, um, had taken a couple of Libyan militia members prisoner and they think that the attack on the consulate was an effort to try to get these prisoners back. So that’s still being vetted.”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/erik-wemple/post/fox-news-and-those-benghazi-detainees/2012/11/14/540522a0-2e68-11e2-89d4-040c9330702a_blog.html

Donger
11-17-2012, 08:57 PM
Bureaucrats. At the time the information was considered "Secret". The U.N. Ambassador can't go on 5 national TV talk shows and say classified information. The "secret" part was redacted and it never made it to the release for the public.

This is public information.

They kept it "secret" because they were hunting the perpetrators down and didn't want them to know they were in the cross-hairs of the USA.

I don't believe that for a second. If they wanted to keep sources and methods wrapped up, they shouldn't have sent the UN ambassador out there at all.

They should have said NOTHING if that was the case.

Donger
11-17-2012, 08:58 PM
Go ask the CIA but the WH said they had nothing to do with it.

Then who did? You DO want to know who did, yes?

A Salt Weapon
11-17-2012, 09:17 PM
You must still have your fingers in your ears and your eyes shut, because they reelected him 11 days ago.

Your reading comprehension is on par with a dyslexic four year old with down syndrome, yeah I know he was re-elected(although I still question the results) that's what my post was about.

Look, congratulations, you socialists and communists have successfully taken over half our country, you have "won" it by promising free shit to the worthless in exchange for votes. Again, congratulations, you will have your utopia until you run out of the minorities (productive members of society, not racial) money. Enjoy it.
Posted via Mobile Device

chiefzilla1501
11-17-2012, 10:21 PM
You must still have your fingers in your ears and your eyes shut, because they reelected him 11 days ago.

Have you ever heard about the little boy who cried wolf? For the past 2 decades the GOP have been crying wolf. Suddenly, you are appalled at the concept of the townspeople not sprinting to the rescue.

Regardless of your politics, you can't even begin to pretend that nearly as big a deal was made of this as should have been.

If the media spent a fraction of the time investigating Benghazi as they did figuring out Romney's affiliation with Bain, this story would have broken ages ago.

Again... I don't care what conclusion you draw out of it. But it is absolutely outrageous how far the media went to keep critical domestic issues under wraps for the election campaign.

RedNeckRaider
11-17-2012, 10:33 PM
The left wouldn't care if they caught this shitbag fucking a 10 year old. The pass this embarrassment gets is mind boggling~

Dave Lane
11-17-2012, 10:36 PM
I bet they had his birth certificate was there.

RedNeckRaider
11-17-2012, 10:47 PM
I bet they had his birth certificate was there.

:spock:

stevieray
11-17-2012, 10:52 PM
The left wouldn't care if they caught this shitbag ****ing a 10 year old. The pass this embarrassment gets is mind boggling~


gotta agree..some tard on ABC claimed they didn't want to report on benghazi based on politiical discourse..to hell with the truth!

A Salt Weapon
11-17-2012, 11:09 PM
The left wouldn't care if they caught this shitbag fucking a 10 year old. The pass this embarrassment gets is mind boggling~

The truth, this man speaks it.
Posted via Mobile Device

J Diddy
11-17-2012, 11:40 PM
Your reading comprehension is on par with a dyslexic four year old with down syndrome, yeah I know he was re-elected(although I still question the results) that's what my post was about.
:spock:Yeah I swapped the 2. I deserve the beating I get over that. You were doing good then you started going kooky with results questioning.
Look, congratulations, you socialists and communists have successfully taken over half our country, you have "won" it by promising free shit to the worthless in exchange for votes. Again, congratulations, you will have your utopia until you run out of the minorities (productive members of society, not racial) money. Enjoy it.
Posted via Mobile Device

You should probably give some credit to Mitt for writing the last portion of your reply.

J Diddy
11-17-2012, 11:43 PM
Regardless of your politics, you can't even begin to pretend that nearly as big a deal was made of this as should have been.

If the media spent a fraction of the time investigating Benghazi as they did figuring out Romney's affiliation with Bain, this story would have broken ages ago.

Again... I don't care what conclusion you draw out of it. But it is absolutely outrageous how far the media went to keep critical domestic issues under wraps for the election campaign.

I disagree. What I see is some members of the right going off on their crazy conspiracy theories like birth certificates, student records, etc. I see the msm as viewing it as a non story. We saw Mitt bring it up once and got buttraped on it in a national debate and then it went away. If Mitt felt there was a story there don't you think he would have pressed a lot harder?

chiefzilla1501
11-18-2012, 12:11 AM
I disagree. What I see is some members of the right going off on their crazy conspiracy theories like birth certificates, student records, etc. I see the msm as viewing it as a non story. We saw Mitt bring it up once and got buttraped on it in a national debate and then it went away. If Mitt felt there was a story there don't you think he would have pressed a lot harder?

How can you disagree?

The day 60 Minutes had their interview with Romney and Obama, they have footage of Obama talking about Benghazi. They purposely cut it. And then they didn't release the transcripts until the 25th hour.

When it was alleged that e-mails acknowledged the attack, CNN deliberately said that obama declared it a terrorist attack right away.

I don't know why conservatives didn't pursue it. I don't know why Mitt didn't. What should drive anyone, regardless of party affiliation, crazy is the lackluster effort by the media to get to the bottom of it. Compared to the massive effort by the media to dig up records on Bain. Are you really going to tell me the MSM spent a fraction of the effort investigating Fast and Furious and Benghazi combined as they did with Bain alone?

RINGLEADER
11-18-2012, 10:18 AM
Oh I agree, there is plenty to be concerned about before, during, and after the Benghazi attack. I posted the video of all those in the administration that went out with the false narrative, now we know that just wasn't true. You have to wonder why they did that. Administrations make mistakes all the time but to try to cover it up, you have to wonder why?

TGI

I think the choices are:

a) Politics
b) Bureaucratic confusion
c) Something else

The first two may be examples of bad leadership, to be true, but they're not necessarily nefarious (even the "we changed the talking points for political reasons" option). The third option of something that we don't know could be nefarious, but my limited imagination just can't seem to come up with that that would be...

RINGLEADER
11-18-2012, 10:20 AM
Go ask the CIA but the WH said they had nothing to do with it.

To be fair Dirk, everyone who testified said they didn't know who changed the talking points. The only group capable of knowing that has not been represented before congress so far has been the White House.

I just don't see why anyone is trying to blame/defend a position that the Obama administration has taken in the past? The real issue is why there was no protection for the facility and/or why the White House didn't provide independent security after it was requested.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 11:33 AM
I think the choices are:

a) Politics
b) Bureaucratic confusion
c) Something else

The first two may be examples of bad leadership, to be true, but they're not necessarily nefarious (even the "we changed the talking points for political reasons" option). The third option of something that we don't know could be nefarious, but my limited imagination just can't seem to come up with that that would be...

I understand your concern, with the disgusting lack of security before the attack, even when the administration had plenty of warning. Like I said, there is plenty to investigate what happened before during and after the attack. There is a lot of great info, even from those who have experience in security abroad, in the other Benghazi threads on the whole situation.

With the report coming out in the OP, we knew Obama knew the truth to what really happened within 72 hours but still went with the video narrative for almost 2 weeks. Also, with what Petraeus testified that the talking points were changed to de-emphasize terrorism, this all stinks to high heaven of playing politics for re-election purposes. Hillary stood over the bodies, with Obama close by, claiming the false narrative to the families of the victims of the attack, saying they would get the person responsible for the video that caused all the trouble. :#

I guess some of us don't care for this administration playing politics with dead Americans for re-election purposes but that is not the only thing that needs continued investigations

TGI

Amnorix
11-18-2012, 11:41 AM
I know the story and what happened. I am not understanding what he lied about.

But someone has put it better than I can so point to which ones you agree with:

1. Obama sympathizes with terrorists and subscribes completely to the left-wing “blow-back” theory where Americans are morally culpable for terrorist attacks by courageous downtrodden Muslims. He is therefore predisposed to cover-up attacks on America. Partly because he blames America, and partly because he fears more blow-back. He is a radical, a coward, and a liar.

2. Obama tried to hide the terrorism aspect because he thought that a terrorist attack would hurt him in the polls. Obama’s political team is under the impression that one-off terrorist attacks produce a “rally AGAINST the flag” effect. The Commander in Chief is significantly weakened by these events, as we saw in the 3rd debate when Romney dressed down Obama, who cowered in the corner and wept on TV. David Axelrod feared that Obama’s poll numbers would collapse if the public saw him pounding his chest about murderers for a month. In order to avoid this outcome, he hatched a brilliant plan to increase his political fortunes: to cover up the terrorist attack for two weeks before eventually revealing it! When the GOP hauls David Axelrod in front of Congress, we’ll all learn more about the brilliant political plan that single-highhandedly reelected Obama.

3. Obama’s communications team doesn’t share information with public surrogates in a timely or efficient manner. This is worse than Watergate!

4. During the attack on Benghazi, Obama ignored a plea for help and denied assistance to the consulate. Because he’s a craven monster who sympathizes with violent murderers.


Where is "5. all of the above"?

And you forgot to add that his birth in Kenya and his Muslim background and beliefs, as influenced during his formative years by radical America-hating Reverend Wright, makes him completely unfit to be President in the first place.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 11:42 AM
I disagree. What I see is some members of the right going off on their crazy conspiracy theories like birth certificates, student records, etc. I see the msm as viewing it as a non story. We saw Mitt bring it up once and got buttraped on it in a national debate and then it went away. If Mitt felt there was a story there don't you think he would have pressed a lot harder?

This is easy to answer. It's because your liberal media was all in for their candidate, no matter what, so they failed you. Your liberal media has lost a lot of credibility over Benghazi and can no longer be trusted.

TGI

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 11:44 AM
This is easy to answer. It's because your liberal media was all in for their candidate, no matter what, so they failed you. Your liberal media has lost a lot of credibility over Benghazi and can no longer be trusted.

TGI

Victim mentality.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 11:59 AM
Victim mentality.

I told you, you are such an arrogant ass and you are. Just because I called you out for your childishness, are you going to stalk me like you do ROYC75? I swear, you modern liberals are nothing more than children that never grew up, in adult bodies. This place has been full of you people since the beginning.

I have to laugh at you claiming I've got the victim mentallity and why it shows just how arrogant of an ass you are. I came from a poor minority family and never, ever asked for any help from anyone but maybe family. I took nothing and turned it in to something of a business for almost 17 years until the statism you libs believe in so much, that has killed our economy, and hurt the American dream for so many. So next time you decide to talk out your ass, think twice about it.

TGI

Brock
11-18-2012, 01:16 PM
I told you, you are such an arrogant ass and you are. Just because I called you out for your childishness, are you going to stalk me like you do ROYC75? I swear, you modern liberals are nothing more than children that never grew up, in adult bodies. This place has been full of you people since the beginning.

I have to laugh at you claiming I've got the victim mentallity and why it shows just how arrogant of an ass you are. I came from a poor minority family and never, ever asked for any help from anyone but maybe family. I took nothing and turned it in to something of a business for almost 17 years until the statism you libs believe in so much, that has killed our economy, and hurt the American dream for so many. So next time you decide to talk out your ass, think twice about it.

TGI

Sounds like you're looking for a scapegoat for your own failure.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 01:34 PM
Sounds like you're looking for a scapegoat for your own failure.

ROFL

No, I just understand statism never works, the government as the end all, the government utopia libs worship so much, never works. It just leads to misery and the huge debt, business closings, people losing employment, etc, like what we are witnessing now.

TGI

J Diddy
11-18-2012, 02:11 PM
This is easy to answer. It's because your liberal media was all in for their candidate, no matter what, so they failed you. Your liberal media has lost a lot of credibility over Benghazi and can no longer be trusted.

TGI

How does this answer why Mitt didn't press the issue further?

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 02:19 PM
How does this answer why Mitt didn't press the issue further?

You said it yourself, this liberal media pounced all over him and would have diverted the attention to Mitt instead of the real issues on Benghazi. It's your liberal media that went all in for Obama instead of reporting what was right.

TGI

J Diddy
11-18-2012, 02:42 PM
You said it yourself, this liberal media pounced all over him and would have diverted the attention to Mitt instead of the real issues on Benghazi. It's your liberal media that went all in for Obama instead of reporting what was right.

TGI

The one time he did say something, it wasn't true, or for that matter, irrelevant in the scheme of things.

That's what he got pounced on for.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 03:16 PM
The one time he did say something, it wasn't true, or for that matter, irrelevant in the scheme of things.

That's what he got pounced on for.

Consider the source where that info come from, the liberal media. Like I said, they went all in for a candidate. Never in my life have I witnessed such a thing or so blatently.

TGI

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 03:22 PM
I told you, you are such an arrogant ass and you are. Just because I called you out for your childishness, are you going to stalk me like you do ROYC75? I swear, you modern liberals are nothing more than children that never grew up, in adult bodies. This place has been full of you people since the beginning.

I have to laugh at you claiming I've got the victim mentallity and why it shows just how arrogant of an ass you are. I came from a poor minority family and never, ever asked for any help from anyone but maybe family. I took nothing and turned it in to something of a business for almost 17 years until the statism you libs believe in so much, that has killed our economy, and hurt the American dream for so many. So next time you decide to talk out your ass, think twice about it.

TGI


It's best to ignore fools like him looking for validation & brownie points .

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 03:34 PM
Sounds like you're looking for a scapegoat for your own failure.

Exactly.

DON'T USE THE GOVERNMENT FOR ANYTHING!!!! SOCIALISM!!! PULL YOURSELF UP BY YOUR BOOTSTRAPS!!!

followed up with...

THE GOVERNMENT IS THE REASON FOR MY FAILURES!!! BLAME THEM!

Oh well Mr. Illusion. The free market is not for everyone. More money for me I guess.

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 03:34 PM
Consider the source where that info come from, the liberal media. Like I said, they went all in for a candidate. Never in my life have I witnessed such a thing or so blatently.

TGI

Victim mentality.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 03:42 PM
Exactly.

DON'T USE THE GOVERNMENT FOR ANYTHING!!!! SOCIALISM!!! PULL YOURSELF UP BY YOUR BOOTSTRAPS!!!

followed up with...

THE GOVERNMENT IS THE REASON FOR MY FAILURES!!! BLAME THEM!

Oh well Mr. Illusion. The free market is not for everyone. More money for me I guess.

Victim mentality.

:shake:

There you go, talking out your ass again. It just goes to show how messed up the education system in America is when you don't know the difference between the free markets and statism. You realize a majority of Americans with the last election, are now supporting more statism? Your education also failed you because the more we move towards statism, the more it destroys free markets/the private sector. Continue to be dumbed-down though.

TGI

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 04:00 PM
:shake:

There you go, talking out your ass again. It just goes to show how messed up the education system in America is when you don't know the difference between the free markets and statism. You realize a majority of Americans with the last election, are now supporting more statism? Your education also failed you because the more we move towards statism, the more it destroys free markets/the private sector. Continue to be dumbed-down though.

TGI

Free markets are working just fine for me. Self employed doing what I love. I am responsible for any successes I have and will be responsible for any failures.

I will let you fake conservatives blame the government for your woes and laugh it up.

Brock
11-18-2012, 04:03 PM
:shake:

There you go, talking out your ass again. It just goes to show how messed up the education system in America is when you don't know the difference between the free markets and statism. You realize a majority of Americans with the last election, are now supporting more statism? Your education also failed you because the more we move towards statism, the more it destroys free markets/the private sector. Continue to be dumbed-down though.

TGI

I took nothing and turned it in to something of a business for almost 17 years until the statism you libs believe in so much, that has killed our economy, and hurt the American dream for so many. So next time you decide to talk out your ass, think twice about it.

How did "statism" take away your business, if I'm reading what you're saying correctly?

mlyonsd
11-18-2012, 04:42 PM
Free markets are working just fine for me. Self employed doing what I love. I am responsible for any successes I have and will be responsible for any failures.


Did not know that. What kind of business?

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 04:42 PM
Free markets are working just fine for me. Self employed doing what I love. I am responsible for any successes I have and will be responsible for any failures.

I will let you fake conservatives blame the government for your woes and laugh it up.

The American education system failed you miserably if you don't understand what I was saying and went on to deflect.

TGI

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 04:45 PM
The American education system failed you miserably if you don't understand what I was saying and went on to deflect.

TGI

He is not going to answer anything truthfully, it's not within his make up.

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 04:46 PM
Did not know that. What kind of business?

Commercial photography.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 04:49 PM
How did "statism" take away your business, if I'm reading what you're saying correctly?

Geez Brock, I hope you are not this clueless too. You don't realize the debt we have, to try to afford the big government we have, to the tune it is no longer sustainable? We are printing money like crazy to try to keep this facade going. It's crazy people don't understand the damage we've done to ourselves. The printing of more and more money is causing real price inflation that is killing the American household right now and their spending ability. You think that is helpful for business the way we've allowed this big government utopia, you libs hold so dear, to continue down this path of wrecklessness? I can tell you from experience, it is not. In fact, this country is in a lot of trouble if people don't wake up to this wrecklessness.

TGI

Brock
11-18-2012, 04:52 PM
Geez Brock, I hope you are not this clueless too. You don't realize the debt we have, to try to afford the big government we have, to the tune it is no longer sustainable? We are printing money like crazy to try to keep this facade going. It's crazy people don't understand the damage we've done to ourselves. The printing of more and more money is causing real price inflation that is killing the American household right now and their spending ability. You think that is helpful for business the way we've allowed this big government utopia, you libs hold so dear, to continue down this path of wrecklessness? I can tell you from experience, it is not. In fact, this country is in a lot of trouble if people don't wake up to this wrecklessness.

TGI

Were you going to answer my question?

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 04:52 PM
Geez Brock, I hope you are not this clueless too. You don't realize the debt we have, to try to afford the big government we have, to the tune it is no longer sustainable? We are printing money like crazy to try to keep this facade going. It's crazy people don't understand the damage we've done to ourselves. The printing of more and more money is causing real price inflation that is killing the American household right now and their spending ability. You think that is helpful for business the way we've allowed this big government utopia, you libs hold so dear, to continue down this path of wrecklessness? I can tell you from experience, it is not. In fact, this country is in a lot of trouble if people don't wake up to this wrecklessness.

TGI

You owned a Dippin Dots didn't you. No worries. I thought it was the ice cream of the future as well.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 04:58 PM
Were you going to answer my question?

Reread carefully, we've been on the statist path for decades now and have the massive debt to prove it.

TGI

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 04:59 PM
You owned a Dippin Dots didn't you. No worries. I thought it was the ice cream of the future as well.

:shake:

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 05:02 PM
:shake:

Ok ok...maybe that is too recent...maybe I have to go back a ways...

Were you the CEO of Montgomery Ward?

http://listosaur.com/images/stories/homefeatures/montgomery_ward.jpg

RedNeckRaider
11-18-2012, 05:06 PM
Ok ok...maybe that is too recent...maybe I have to go back a ways...

Were you the CEO of Montgomery Ward?

http://listosaur.com/images/stories/homefeatures/montgomery_ward.jpg

Walmart is run by Hamas~

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 05:06 PM
Ok ok...maybe that is too recent...maybe I have to go back a ways...

Were you the CEO of Montgomery Ward?

http://listosaur.com/images/stories/homefeatures/montgomery_ward.jpg

You are absolutely clueless.

TGI

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 05:10 PM
You are absolutely clueless.

TGI

Give me some hints! Lets talk business.

Was Crystal Pepsi your idea?

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-kaqLpObE080/UJzmZT1CN0I/AAAAAAAACME/j6yVGIUNyIk/s1600/Crystal-pepsi.jpg


Did you take away Surge? Bring back Surge!!!!!

http://colinnekritz.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/surge_can1.jpg

Brock
11-18-2012, 05:11 PM
Reread carefully, we've been on the statist path for decades now and have the massive debt to prove it.

TGI

I re-read what you said and you didn't answer my question. My question was not whether or not we're on the path to statism and have the massive debt to prove it.

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 05:12 PM
I re-read what you said and you didn't answer my question. My question was not whether or not we're on the path to statism and have the massive debt to prove it.

Spoiler alert. He asked specifically about your business Mr Creator of Surge.

(tell me that's it)

Direckshun
11-18-2012, 05:15 PM
God, I remember Surge.

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 05:18 PM
God, I remember Surge.

Yup. Was pretty good.

Of course Illusion was probably part of something much bigger. Maybe he took Hi-C Ecto Cooler from us.

http://www.x-entertainment.com/articles/0822/8.jpg

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 05:19 PM
I re-read what you said and you didn't answer my question. My question was not whether or not we're on the path to statism and have the massive debt to prove it.

I know from a Christian view point, IMHO the answer would be yes.

Brock
11-18-2012, 05:23 PM
I know from a Christian view point, IMHO the answer would be yes.

Thanks for answering a question I didn't ask.

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 05:24 PM
Thanks for answering a question I didn't ask.

What exactly did you ask then?

Brock
11-18-2012, 05:25 PM
What exactly did you ask then?

Do you have a reading disability?

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 05:27 PM
JFC people.

How did "statism" take away your business, if I'm reading what you're saying correctly?

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 05:29 PM
Do you have a reading disability?

Nope, didn't see it and too lazy to go through this whole thread to find it.

But unlike Zach, I can answer a question honestly and not spin out of it. My answers may not be the views of others, but it's the way I see it, right or wrong to others.

I don't lie and deflect as he does.

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 05:30 PM
Nope, didn't see it and too lazy to go through this whole thread to find it.

But unlike Zach, I can answer a question honestly and not spin out of it. My answers may not be the views of others, but it's the way I see it, right or wrong to others.

I don't lie and deflect as he does.

I've got the world on a string.

CLX
11-18-2012, 05:31 PM
There was a report out shortly after the attacks that live feeds were going to the State Department and the White House. They knew what was happening as it happened.

At least with Nixon he was honorable enough to resign when he was found to be lying. Where is the honor with this president?

Brock
11-18-2012, 05:32 PM
Nope, didn't see it and too lazy to go through this whole thread to find it.

But unlike Zach, I can answer a question honestly and not spin out of it. My answers may not be the views of others, but it's the way I see it, right or wrong to others.

I don't lie and deflect as he does.

It was like 5 posts down. Seriously, is there something wrong with you that I'm not aware of?

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 05:34 PM
It was like 5 posts down. Seriously, is there something wrong with you that I'm not aware of?

Would it please you if I went back and read it?

Brock
11-18-2012, 05:36 PM
Would it please you if I went back and read it?

It really doesn't matter. It doesn't appear you'd understand it if you did.

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 05:36 PM
Would it please you if I went back and read it?

It didn't take you long to get you talking about things you didn't understand.

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 05:37 PM
How did "statism" take away your business, if I'm reading what you're saying correctly?

If it's this, I can not answer his question.

I re-read what you said and you didn't answer my question. My question was not whether or not we're on the path to statism and have the massive debt to prove it.

I gave my opinion.

Brock
11-18-2012, 05:39 PM
If it's this, I can not answer his question.



I gave my opinion.

Good grief. :facepalm:

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 05:46 PM
Good grief. :facepalm:

Good Grief what, just come out and ask it then instead of dancing around it.

If I am missing a question, have the balls to ask it then. We know Zack can't answer it, while we are at it, let's ask him too. See which one of us will answer honestly.

Brock
11-18-2012, 05:50 PM
Good Grief what, just come out and ask it then instead of dancing around it.

If I am missing a question, have the balls to ask it then. We know Zack can't answer it, while we are at it, let's ask him too. See which one of us will answer honestly.

This little subtree of the overall discussion is a result of your inability to read, Roy. I didn't ask you any questions, that's why I thanked you for answering a question I didn't ask. Speaking of spinning, you are one dizzy broad.

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 05:58 PM
This little subtree of the overall discussion is a result of your inability to read, Roy. I didn't ask you any questions, that's why I thanked you for answering a question I didn't ask. Speaking of spinning, you are one dizzy broad.

WOW, just WOW.

Sorry I answered a question for TGI, I put my nose into your question and you go off like some on PMS.

It's OK, it only last a few days, you'll be able to go back to your street corner and work again soon. ;)

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 06:29 PM
WOW, just WOW.

Sorry I answered a question for TGI, I put my nose into your question and you go off like some on PMS.

It's OK, it only last a few days, you'll be able to go back to your street corner and work again soon. ;)

I answered Brock's question but it was not the answer he wanted to hear. I can explain it to him but I cannot understand it for him too.

TGI

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 06:34 PM
For anyone new to this thread TGI's doesn't have the business chops to get by and Roy can't read.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 06:35 PM
For anyone new to this thread TGI's doesn't have the business chops to get by and Roy can't read.

You really have no clue what I've been through you pompous ass!

TGI

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 06:42 PM
You really have no clue what I've been through you pompous ass!

TGI

Don't get mad at me because you can't run a good business and are too embarrassed to actually tell us about it. It isn't the fault of Brock or Zach!

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 06:48 PM
For anyone new to this thread TGI's doesn't have the business chops to get by and Roy can't read.

You know Zach, you really know no limits to being a jerk. You are undoubtedly the biggest jerk I have ever met, spoken to or chatted with. You take the cake buckaroo.

You come on here acting so perfect yet you have no balls to speak or answer the truth to any question anybody imposes on you. You expect answers from everybody when you ask yet you do a wonderful rendition of Slick Willie. I have to ask, is Slick Willie your daddy ? Never mind, you won't answer.

It appears your only purpose id to find satisfaction or validation from other posters comments to solidify your own personal agenda, Lord only knows what that may be.

I may be wrong here, I would almost bet that a poll asking CP members here on who is the biggest jerk or arrogant ass is, you would be odds on favorite to win.

Brock
11-18-2012, 06:55 PM
WOW, just WOW.

Sorry I answered a question for TGI, I put my nose into your question and you go off like some on PMS.

It's OK, it only last a few days, you'll be able to go back to your street corner and work again soon. ;)

You didn't answer a question that I asked TGI or anybody. You answered a question I did not ask. So very, very stupid.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 06:56 PM
Don't get mad at me because you can't run a good business and are too embarrassed to actually tell us about it. It isn't the fault of Brock or Zach!

That's funny I point out how statism is hurting this country and in the real world, it is, you take it personal. It's not my fault what you believe in so much is hurting this country. It's that liberal media cocoon you live in has also done much damage.

TGI

Brock
11-18-2012, 06:57 PM
I answered Brock's question but it was not the answer he wanted to hear. I can explain it to him but I cannot understand it for him too.

TGI

The question was how did "statism" ruin your business if I am reading you correctly? I'm not looking for quotes from the conservative handbook, I'm looking for specifics. You haven't answered it yet.

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 07:02 PM
You didn't answer a question that I asked TGI or anybody. You answered a question I did not ask. So very, very stupid.

Getting technical?

Are you and Zach now brothers ? Or sisters ?

Brock
11-18-2012, 07:09 PM
Getting technical?

Are you and Zach now brothers ? Or sisters ?

Technical? What's technical about understanding what you read? Doing business with you must be a hoot.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 07:11 PM
The question was how did "statism" ruin your business if I am reading you correctly? I'm not looking for quotes from the conservative handbook, I'm looking for specifics. You haven't answered it yet.

LOL, conservative handbook? LOL Go reread what I said over and over again until it sinks in, if it does ever. I'll give you a clue and I'm referring to this bad economy that you libs want to ignore. When your customers are struggling mightily with higher and higher prices in many places to the point it affects their spending, or losing their homes and businesses, or struggling to keep those going, of course it's going to hurt many businesses of all sizes. Much of this has been brought on because of price inflation, due to the mass printing of our dollar and the debt we have going trying to keep the liberal utopia of larger and larger, more and more controlling government. Even though we now have a majority of Americans who voted this way, it is not sustainable and you are going to see more and more businesses close and layoffs. The statist liberal big government for all giveaway dream is just that, a dream. Too many in this country have no clue how real business works. That's the fault of our education system and of course the liberal culture.

TGI

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 07:48 PM
You didn't answer a question that I asked TGI or anybody. You answered a question I did not ask. So very, very stupid.

So what, I went ahead and answered your Satanism comment ... My question was not whether or not we're on the path to statism and have the massive debt to prove it..

No it wasn't a question of whether or not .... but I went ahead and answered through the eyes of most Christians.

If you found that offensive or just a reason to bitch, deal with it.

Next time I'll stay out of your comments and questions. Can you do the same?

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 08:00 PM
That's funny I point out how statism is hurting this country and in the real world, it is, you take it personal. It's not my fault what you believe in so much is hurting this country. It's that liberal media cocoon you live in has also done much damage.

TGI
The damage sounds all on your end. You can't project damage on to me sir.

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 08:01 PM
You know Zach, you really know no limits to being a jerk. You are undoubtedly the biggest jerk I have ever met, spoken to or chatted with. You take the cake buckaroo.

You come on here acting so perfect yet you have no balls to speak or answer the truth to any question anybody imposes on you. You expect answers from everybody when you ask yet you do a wonderful rendition of Slick Willie. I have to ask, is Slick Willie your daddy ? Never mind, you won't answer.

It appears your only purpose id to find satisfaction or validation from other posters comments to solidify your own personal agenda, Lord only knows what that may be.

I may be wrong here, I would almost bet that a poll asking CP members here on who is the biggest jerk or arrogant ass is, you would be odds on favorite to win.

You're emotional right now. Which is fine...you have trouble reading and comprehending things and it causes frustration. I guess the only thing you have to do now is....

Create the poll!

RedNeckRaider
11-18-2012, 08:04 PM
That's funny I point out how statism is hurting this country and in the real world, it is, you take it personal. It's not my fault what you believe in so much is hurting this country. It's that liberal media cocoon you live in has also done much damage.

TGI

I don't have a dog in this fight, but Zach owns his own business or did at one time~

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 08:11 PM
You're emotional right now. Which is fine...you have trouble reading and comprehending things and it causes frustration. I guess the only thing you have to do now is....

Create the poll!

I am not, too damned old for that immature crap.

What is obvious, you can not or will not answer the questions as asked.

Brock
11-18-2012, 08:19 PM
So what, I went ahead and answered your Satanism comment ....

No it wasn't a question of whether or not .... but I went ahead and answered through the eyes of most Christians.

If you found that offensive or just a reason to bitch, deal with it.

Next time I'll stay out of your comments and questions. Can you do the same?

The fuck does christianity have to do with anything? Oh, Jesus. I just realized you think I said "Satanism' instead of "statism".

Oh sweet lord.

LOL

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 08:19 PM
I don't have a dog in this fight, but Zach owns his own business or did at one time~

Does currently. Apparently the government was part of his business failing but when asked about that his responses are (with all due respect Stevie) Stevie like where they only actually make sense to him. No specifics just vague horseshit.

RedNeckRaider
11-18-2012, 08:25 PM
Does currently. Apparently the government was part of his business failing but when asked about that his responses are (with all due respect Stevie) Stevie like where they only actually make sense to him. No specifics just vague horseshit.

How is business btw? I am still having fun with my camera. Heck the company asks me to shoot their events...uh for free :banghead: I guess I suck at the business part of it~

VAChief
11-18-2012, 08:34 PM
A little historical perspective taken from the link below:

http://www.cnn.com/2012/11/12/opinion/frum-conservatives-despair/index.html

Whatever you think of the Obama record, it's worth keeping in mind that by any measure, free enterprise has been winning the game for a long, long time to this point.
Compare the United States of 2012 with the United States of 1962. Leave aside the obvious points about segregation and discrimination, and look only at the economy.
In 1962, the government regulated the price and route of every airplane, every freight train, every truck and every merchant ship in the United States. The government regulated the price of natural gas. It regulated the interest on every checking account and the commission on every purchase or sale of stock. Owning a gold bar was a serious crime that could be prosecuted under the Trading with the Enemy Act. The top rate of income tax was 91%.

It was illegal to own a telephone. Phones had to be rented from the giant government-regulated monopoly that controlled all telecommunications in the United States. All young men were subject to the military draft and could escape only if they entered a government-approved graduate course of study. The great concern of students of American society -- of liberals such as David Riesman, of conservatives such as Russell Kirk and of radicals such as Dwight Macdonald -- was the country's stultifying, crushing conformity.
Even if you look only at the experiences of white heterosexual men, the United States of 2012 is a freer country in almost every way than the United States of 1962.

Brock
11-18-2012, 08:36 PM
A little historical perspective taken from the link below:

http://www.cnn.com/2012/11/12/opinion/frum-conservatives-despair/index.html

Whatever you think of the Obama record, it's worth keeping in mind that by any measure, free enterprise has been winning the game for a long, long time to this point.
Compare the United States of 2012 with the United States of 1962. Leave aside the obvious points about segregation and discrimination, and look only at the economy.
In 1962, the government regulated the price and route of every airplane, every freight train, every truck and every merchant ship in the United States. The government regulated the price of natural gas. It regulated the interest on every checking account and the commission on every purchase or sale of stock. Owning a gold bar was a serious crime that could be prosecuted under the Trading with the Enemy Act. The top rate of income tax was 91%.

It was illegal to own a telephone. Phones had to be rented from the giant government-regulated monopoly that controlled all telecommunications in the United States. All young men were subject to the military draft and could escape only if they entered a government-approved graduate course of study. The great concern of students of American society -- of liberals such as David Riesman, of conservatives such as Russell Kirk and of radicals such as Dwight Macdonald -- was the country's stultifying, crushing conformity.
Even if you look only at the experiences of white heterosexual men, the United States of 2012 is a freer country in almost every way than the United States of 1962.

Ah, the good old days.

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 08:37 PM
The **** does christianity have to do with anything? Oh, Jesus. I just realized you think I said "Satanism' instead of "statism".

Oh sweet lord.

LOL


Oh snap, I did screw that on up, Oh well, screw the French, government has too much control of our business anyway.

Go ahead and milk this one, it's on me and I did misread that one.

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 08:39 PM
How is business btw? I am still having fun with my camera. Heck the company asks me to shoot their events...uh for free :banghead: I guess I suck at the business part of it~

Good. Though you always have to do the hustle.

I have a pretty good anchor tenant so to speak that accounts for more than half the income yearly. Its a good relationship...pro sports team so its fun...and they value images. Hard to find.

It is all about getting value you for the value you provide and there are a lot of ways to do that. For a lil while there would be something real cool I would love to have pictures of that I thought having them could benefit me down the line. That is pretty rare now that I have been in the game for a while.

It is a free market and life is made of decisions. The only road you can't go down is thinking that you can start with some company or entity doing stuff for free and work up to doing paid work. It never works like.

Usually part timers looking to get extra money focus on families...kids...weddings...pets...stuff like that. It is everywhere and everyone needs it. To get to that higher level you just have to convince someone who respects photos they value that great photos have and try to part them with their money. Its a process.

But that is if you wanna make money at it. If you just enjoy taking photos then fuck all that and take awesome photos.

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 08:40 PM
Oh snap, I did screw that on up, Oh well, screw the French, government has too much control of our business anyway.

Go ahead and milk this one, it's on me and I did misread that one.

Yea, I was right the whole time. Just log off buddy...

Log the hell off...

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 08:43 PM
Yea, I was right the whole time. Just log off buddy...

Log the hell off...

Says the one who will not answer question and has no balls. Why Zach ? I have asked you plenty of questions and yet, no honest answers except pulling out your Slick Willie act.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 08:43 PM
I don't have a dog in this fight, but Zach owns his own business or did at one time~

Oh I understand not all businesses have been affected by this bad economy. He should be grateful instead of being so arrogant. I have a friend whose business is doing really well right now but I also have many business friends that are not doing so well or have closed up completely during this whole mess. I've always made a habit of looking at how much retail space is for sale or rent when I look through my town or visit other towns in my state and other states. I also go through the industrial parks to see how well the are filled or not filled.

I can tell you the last several years, just about every place I've been to, it is alarming how much retail/office/industrial space is available out there. I know we are on the downhill if we don't get this country back to what made private enterprise great and even minorities like myself had a shot at the American dream (I'm not completely out of the game but I can see the writing on the wall). With rising statism in this country, it is going to make it more and more difficult for everyone, not just business owners. It's private enterprise doing well that supports the government that is necessary, not the other way around like so many have been misled to believe in this country.

TGI

RedNeckRaider
11-18-2012, 08:44 PM
Good. Though you always have to do the hustle.

I have a pretty good anchor tenant so to speak that accounts for more than half the income yearly. Its a good relationship...pro sports team so its fun...and they value images. Hard to find.

It is all about getting value you for the value you provide and there are a lot of ways to do that. For a lil while there would be something real cool I would love to have pictures of that I thought having them could benefit me down the line. That is pretty rare now that I have been in the game for a while.

It is a free market and life is made of decisions. The only road you can't go down is thinking that you can start with some company or entity doing stuff for free and work up to doing paid work. It never works like.

Usually part timers looking to get extra money focus on families...kids...weddings...pets...stuff like that. It is everywhere and everyone needs it. To get to that higher level you just have to convince someone who respects photos they value that great photos have and try to part them with their money. Its a process.

But that is if you wanna make money at it. If you just enjoy taking photos then **** all that and take awesome photos.

I am in it for fun, but I am glad to hear you are doing well. Doing what you love and getting paid for it is something few get to do, good for you~

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 08:44 PM
Says the one who will not answer question and has no balls. Why Zach ? I have asked you plenty of questions and yet, no honest answers except pulling out your Slick Willie act.

You wouldn't know how to read the answer.

Brock
11-18-2012, 08:48 PM
With rising statism in this country, it is going to make it more and more difficult for everyone, not just business owners. It's private enterprise doing well that supports the government that is necessary, not the other way around like so many have been misled to believe in this country.

TGI

Maybe you need to start up a Statanic supply store. You know, inverted crosses, pentagrams and the like.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 08:51 PM
Maybe you need to start up a Statanic supply store. You know, inverted crosses, pentagrams and the like.

That's pretty dumb Brock, especially since my avatar means "Long Live Christ the King"

TGI

Brock
11-18-2012, 08:52 PM
That's pretty dumb Brock, especially since my avatar means "Long Live Christ the King"

TGI

Capitalism doesn't care what your religion is. I'm just saying, maybe you need to cash in on this rise of statanism instead of blaming it for all your problems.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 08:53 PM
Capitalism doesn't care what your religion is. I'm just saying, maybe you need to cash in on this rise of statanism instead of blaming it for all your problems.

What is it with you liberals and arrogance?

TGI

Brock
11-18-2012, 08:54 PM
Guys used to tell if if you want to change your luck, fuck a black girl. Maybe it's like that with this statanism stuff.

Brock
11-18-2012, 08:54 PM
What is it with you liberals and arrogance?

TGI

I only look like a liberal next to a Right Wing kook like yourself.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 08:56 PM
I only look like a liberal next to a Right Wing kook like yourself.

I was honestly looking for an answer.

TGI

Brock
11-18-2012, 08:58 PM
I was honestly looking for an answer.

TGI

Sure you were. That's why your question made so much sense.

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 08:59 PM
Oh I understand not all businesses have been affected by this bad economy. He should be grateful instead of being so arrogant. I have a friend whose business is doing really well right now but I also have many business friends that are not doing so well or have closed up completely during this whole mess. I've always made a habit of looking at how much retail space is for sale or rent when I look through my town or visit other towns in my state and other states. I also go through the industrial parks to see how well the are filled or not filled.

I can tell you the last several years, just about every place I've been to, it is alarming how much retail/office/industrial space is available out there. I know we are on the downhill if we don't get this country back to what made private enterprise great and even minorities like myself had a shot at the American dream (I'm not completely out of the game but I can see the writing on the wall). With rising statism in this country, it is going to make it more and more difficult for everyone, not just business owners. It's private enterprise doing well that supports the government that is necessary, not the other way around like so many have been misled to believe in this country.

TGI

I deal with a lot of construction and winter time firewood to the bigger cities.

Right now the TransCanadian % Keystone Pipeline is on hold and peoples pockets are hurting, not enough $ for a lot of people to buy the wood for night time fireplace burning.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 09:00 PM
Sure you were. That's why your question made so much sense.

Yes, I was. I see you arrogantly going after anyone that doesn't share your liberal view and was just wondering why.

TGI

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 09:00 PM
You wouldn't know how to read the answer.

You oiled yourself up for that one Willie.

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 09:01 PM
What is it with you liberals and arrogance?

TGI

Programmed Obots ?

Brock
11-18-2012, 09:01 PM
Yes, I was. I see you arrogantly going after anyone that doesn't share your liberal view and was just wondering why.

TGI

I don't hold very many liberal views at all. This is what something approaching the middle looks like from over there in loonyland.

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 09:02 PM
You oiled yourself up for that one Willie.

Are you hitting on me?

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 09:03 PM
I deal with a lot of construction and winter time firewood to the bigger cities.

Right now the TransCanadian % Keystone Pipeline is on hold and peoples pockets are hurting, not enough $ for a lot of people to buy the wood for night time fireplace burning.

Oh I know people are hurting. I've had some good customers lose their homes because of job loss or other factors. I wish I could have helped but when your customers are hurting, it affects your business too. I never believed the liberal media and their narrative that things were getting better. I saw first hand it wasn't from what I've seen and observed.

TGI

cosmo20002
11-18-2012, 09:05 PM
Yes, I was. I see you arrogantly going after anyone that doesn't share your liberal view and was just wondering why.

TGI

"liberal view" = believes Obama's birth certificate, social security card, and selective service papers are not forgeries

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 09:06 PM
I don't hold very many liberal views at all. This is what something approaching the middle looks like from over there in loonyland.

Oh Brock, that is soo funny, I don't even know where to start. You don't realize just how far left this culture has gotten.

TGI

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 09:07 PM
"liberal view" = believes Obama's birth certificate, social security card, and selective service papers are not forgeries

Trolling me again, huh?

TGI

Brock
11-18-2012, 09:08 PM
Oh Brock, that is soo funny, I don't even know where to start. You don't realize just how far left this culture has gotten.

TGI

I love how you think you're the only person who's paying attention to anything. What were you saying about arrogance?

ROYC75
11-18-2012, 09:11 PM
Are you hitting on me?

Don't flatter yourself. I wouldn't touch you with your dick.

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 09:13 PM
Don't flatter yourself. I wouldn't touch you with your dick.

Well yea, it is already attached.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 09:15 PM
I love how you think you're the only person who's paying attention to anything. What were you saying about arrogance?

You don't see me pop in on every thread constantly jumping folks I don't agree with like I see you do when it comes to your liberal views. I seriously believe this country is in a whole lot of trouble and it comes from experience. If you don't agree fine, so quit arrogantly trolling me about it.

And getting back the the topic at hand, I love you you libs attack the messenger, but that's par for the course. Attack the messenger if you don't like the message. You might not like what is turning up about Benghazi, but this is not going to go away and there is so many questions that need to be answered.

TGI

cosmo20002
11-18-2012, 09:18 PM
Trolling me again, huh?

TGI

Just helping to put your description of "liberal views" into context. Your birther status says a lot about you. Just be up front about it and people will know who they are dealing with.

|Zach|
11-18-2012, 09:20 PM
You don't see me pop in on every thread constantly jumping folks I don't agree with

There are plenty of great posters here who I disagree with. I mainly pop up when someone is completely full of shit.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 09:21 PM
Just helping to put your description of "liberal views" into context. Your birther status says a lot about you. Just be up front about it and people will know who they are dealing with.

Which you are distorting. Given your liberal media track record recently. If they can hide so many issues before an election, they can hide anything.

TGI

Brock
11-18-2012, 09:33 PM
You don't see me pop in on every thread constantly jumping folks I don't agree with like I see you do when it comes to your liberal views. I seriously believe this country is in a whole lot of trouble and it comes from experience. If you don't agree fine, so quit arrogantly trolling me about it.

And getting back the the topic at hand, I love you you libs attack the messenger, but that's par for the course. Attack the messenger if you don't like the message. You might not like what is turning up about Benghazi, but this is not going to go away and there is so many questions that need to be answered.

TGI

Nay, good sir. I will continue arrogantly trolling you about it. All I ever did was ask you to be specific about how statism drove your business into the shitter, and you predictably wrote a two paragraph screed about statism and inflation. I've laughed at you a couple of times about your birth certificate nonsense, but other than that, I don't remember wasting much time on you. Don't act as if you were interested in doing anything other than posting some vague anecdote about how the country is going down and then got outraged when somebody questioned you about it.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 09:41 PM
Nay, good sir. I will continue arrogantly trolling you about it. All I ever did was ask you to be specific about how statism drove your business into the shitter, and you predictably wrote a two paragraph screed about statism and inflation. I've laughed at you a couple of times about your birth certificate nonsense, but other than that, I don't remember wasting much time on you. Don't act as if you were interested in doing anything other than posting some vague anecdote about how the country is going down and then got outraged when somebody questioned you about it.

I guess then I'll just have to ignore you if all you want to do is troll. I don't post that often but with what's happening today and really, the 16 trillion dollar gorilla in the room, don't cause you libs any concern, for all of us and our children, well I guess we are just going to get the country we deserve. Keep your head in the sand.

TGI

Brock
11-18-2012, 09:44 PM
I guess then I'll just have to ignore you if all you want to do is troll. I don't post that often but with what's happening today and really, the 16 trillion dollar gorilla in the room, don't cause you libs any concern, for all of us and our children, well I guess we are just going to get the country we deserve. Keep your head in the sand.

TGI

Sure, I'll leave the intellectual heavy lifting to the misunderstood geniuses like yourself. Here, have a pat on the head and a sucker.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-18-2012, 10:01 PM
Sure, I'll leave the intellectual heavy lifting to the misunderstood geniuses like yourself. Here, have a pat on the head and a sucker.

The next round of government goodies that go through next year and we're looking at a 20+ Trillion Gorilla in the next few years. At some point, that is going to destroy us. Is that the country you want to leave for your children? I know I don't.

TGI

Brock
11-18-2012, 10:05 PM
The next round of government goodies that go through next year and we're looking at a 20+ Trillion Gorilla in the next few years. At some point, that is going to destroy us. Is that the country you want to leave for your children? I know I don't.

TGI

There isn't anything you can do about it.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-19-2012, 11:03 AM
There isn't anything you can do about it.

Ok, so maybe you are starting to get what many of us are very concerned about. The right has been warning about this for years but it fell on deaf ears. There have been people in America that had that insatiable appetite for more and more government in some manner or another. People are going to have to wake up, the Democrat party for the most part, has been the party of big government for not quite a century now. The vote-for-us-we'll-dole-out-the-government-goodies mentality has led to the wrecklessness of the huge debt we have now and getting worse. What's alarming to many is now we have a majority that see this as OK. I too am not sure if there is anything we can do about it but at least we can identify the problems and go from there. We can not just blame Bush for this mess, although he did spend like a liberal Democrat at times that many were not happy with like myself. If there is nothing we can do about it, then it's just better to prepare.

TGI

|Zach|
11-19-2012, 11:05 AM
What is in this thread...hilarity.


What is not in this thread...a clear argument for how statism hurt TGI's business.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-19-2012, 11:07 AM
What is in this thread...hilarity.


What is not in this thread...a clear argument for how statism hurt TGI's business.

I explained, you're distorting what I said, quit trolling me.

TGI

Cave Johnson
11-19-2012, 11:10 AM
I deal with a lot of construction and winter time firewood to the bigger cities.

Right now the TransCanadian % Keystone Pipeline is on hold and peoples pockets are hurting, not enough $ for a lot of people to buy the wood for night time fireplace burning.

Those two things are entirely, and by that I mean 100%, unrelated.

Brock
11-19-2012, 11:11 AM
I explained, you're distorting what I said, quit trolling me.

TGI

You never did explain it.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-19-2012, 11:13 AM
You never did explain it.

I guess it continues to fall on deaf ears. That's too bad.

TGI

|Zach|
11-19-2012, 11:16 AM
I explained, you're distorting what I said, quit trolling me.

TGI

I don't have anything to distort. You didn't explain shit about YOUR business. The first clue you fell flat on your face is the fact the nature of your failed business is completely unknown to anyone in this thread.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-19-2012, 11:21 AM
I don't have anything to distort. You didn't explain shit about YOUR business. The first clue you fell flat on your face is the fact the nature of your failed business is completely unknown to anyone in this thread.

ROFL

Don't get all pissy, ROFL

I explained, but it doesn't fit your worldview so I understand that. You libs are the ones that have deflected this thread attacking me because you don't like the message in the original post, the president you worship so much has been caught in lies by an AP reporter (I guess better late than never). That's what your deflection has been all about.

TGI

|Zach|
11-19-2012, 11:30 AM
ROFL

Don't get all pissy, ROFL

I explained, but it doesn't fit your worldview so I understand that. You libs are the ones that have deflected this thread attacking me because you don't like the message in the original post, the president you worship so much has been caught in lies by an AP reporter (I guess better late than never). That's what your deflection has been all about.

TGI

Cool. I must have missed it...

What kind of business was it?

Feel free to answer directly.

vailpass
11-19-2012, 11:33 AM
There are plenty of great posters here who I disagree with. I mainly pop up when someone is completely full of shit.

Shit makes you pop up? You go, Rainbow Warrior.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-19-2012, 11:43 AM
Cool. I must have missed it...

What kind of business was it?

Feel free to answer directly.

See, you don't listen well, it is still around, just adjusted for these bad times.

Isn't there a rule here for asking people for personal info? If I wanted to share that I would but this is the internet and I don't want to share any personal info for security reasons, which by asking would lead to the personal info.

TGI

|Zach|
11-19-2012, 11:59 AM
See, you don't listen well, it is still around, just adjusted for these bad times.

Isn't there a rule here for asking people for personal info? If I wanted to share that I would but this is the internet and I don't want to share any personal info for security reasons, which by asking would lead to the personal info.

TGI

You didn't answer the question. Concession acknowledged.

Continue on with blaming the government for your free market failures and your game changer political epiphanies that you have to beg people to take notice of.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-19-2012, 12:04 PM
You didn't answer the question. Concession acknowledged.

Continue on with blaming the government for your free market failures and your game changer political epiphanies that you have to beg people to take notice of.

GEEZ, what part of I don't want personal info out there on the internet that you don't understand? It would lead to personal info and I don't want that out there and there is rules here against that. And this thread is NOT about me which you keep deflecting to.

:shake:

TGI

WilliamTheIrish
11-19-2012, 12:06 PM
The_Gran_Delusion.

beer bacon
11-19-2012, 01:24 PM
I'm confused by the Benghazi conspiracy nuts. So, you are all so outraged over four Americans being killed. You think Obama should have came out immediately and given us all the details, but he didn't, for political reasons. Now, conservative icon General David Petraeus has testified that the information on the attacks was classified and was withheld originally so it wouldn't impede efforts to catch the perpetrators of the consulate attacks, and you are upset Obama and other government officials didn't just spill the beans immediately on this classified information? You aren't concerned about getting justice for the Americans killed in Libya?

Is it the case where you are concerned about avenging those four dead Americans, but less so than scoring some political points on our newly re-elected President and our future Secretary of State? Those four Americans are important, but just not that important? How concerned were you when you found that Bush admin had lied to get us into war with Iraq, and that subsequently thousands of American soldiers died in that war?

Brock
11-19-2012, 01:29 PM
GEEZ, what part of I don't want personal info out there on the internet that you don't understand? It would lead to personal info and I don't want that out there and there is rules here against that. And this thread is NOT about me which you keep deflecting to.

:shake:

TGI

I'm not asking you for personal information. I'm asking you to explain how "statism" cost you your business in something other than the vaguest of generalities. That shouldn't be all that difficult.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-19-2012, 01:42 PM
I'm not asking you for personal information. I'm asking you to explain how "statism" cost you your business in something other than the vaguest of generalities. That shouldn't be all that difficult.

Ok, I've tried to point it out to you several times but I'll try to make it as simple as I can.

The bigger and bigger and more controlling a government gets, the more harm it does to the private sector. That's not hard to understand and we are witnessing that now on how it is hurting the private sector because government has become so large and controlling. We are 16 trillion dollars in the hole and printing money like mad trying to keep all this going and it is just not sustainable.

TGI

Brock
11-19-2012, 01:43 PM
Ok, I've tried to point it out to you several times but I'll try to make it as simple as I can.

The bigger and bigger and more controlling a government gets, the more harm it does to the private sector. That's not hard to understand and we are witnessing that now on how it is hurting the private sector because government has become so large and controlling. We are 16 trillion dollars and printing money like mad trying to keep all this going and it is just not sustainable.

TGI

^The vaguest of generalities. Pretty much the same as saying "the economy went bad and I need to blame somebody for it".

The_Grand_Illusion
11-19-2012, 01:48 PM
I'm confused by the Benghazi conspiracy nuts. So, you are all so outraged over four Americans being killed. You think Obama should have came out immediately and given us all the details, but he didn't, for political reasons. Now, conservative icon General David Petraeus has testified that the information on the attacks was classified and was withheld originally so it wouldn't impede efforts to catch the perpetrators of the consulate attacks, and you are upset Obama and other government officials didn't just spill the beans immediately on this classified information? You aren't concerned about getting justice for the Americans killed in Libya?

Is it the case where you are concerned about avenging those four dead Americans, but less so than scoring some political points on our newly re-elected President and our future Secretary of State? Those four Americans are important, but just not that important? How concerned were you when you found that Bush admin had lied to get us into war with Iraq, and that subsequently thousands of American soldiers died in that war?

Thanks for getting back on topic. Petraeus did come out and admit they downplayed the terrorism angle. They didn't have to say who but they still could have admitted it was terrorism, instead of a video, which is now a lie. He did have a political narrative that Bin Laden was dead and Al Quaeda was on the run. This would have gone against that narrative so you tell me if they played politics with the attack. It's not just what happened after, there are many isssues that need to be explained before and during the attack.

TGI

|Zach|
11-19-2012, 01:52 PM
Ok, I've tried to point it out to you several times but I'll try to make it as simple as I can.

The bigger and bigger and more controlling a government gets, the more harm it does to the private sector. That's not hard to understand and we are witnessing that now on how it is hurting the private sector because government has become so large and controlling. We are 16 trillion dollars in the hole and printing money like mad trying to keep all this going and it is just not sustainable.

TGI

Strange. Corporate profits are at an all time high.

This didn't answer a question about how it had an impact on *your* business but you won't get into that so no biggie. Not everyone gets to do well in the free market. Don't let Roy read your posts for you.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-19-2012, 01:56 PM
^The vaguest of generalities. Pretty much the same as saying "the economy went bad and I need to blame somebody for it".

I don't know what else to tell you. I've seen if first hand how the printing of money, devaluing the dollar causing higher prices for many households that has hurt people's spending power and how that impacts many businesses. I guess you'll just have to agree to disagree if you so please.

TGI

beer bacon
11-19-2012, 01:56 PM
Thanks for getting back on topic. Petraeus did come out and admit they downplayed the terrorism angle. They didn't have to say who but they still could have admitted it was terrorism, instead of a video, which is now a lie. He did have a political narrative that Bin Laden was dead and Al Quaeda was on the run. This would have gone against that narrative so you tell me if they played politics with the attack. It's not just what happened after, there are many isssues that need to be explained before and during the attack.

TGI

Can you please answer the specific questions I asked?

dirk digler
11-19-2012, 01:58 PM
I'm confused by the Benghazi conspiracy nuts. So, you are all so outraged over four Americans being killed. You think Obama should have came out immediately and given us all the details, but he didn't, for political reasons. Now, conservative icon General David Petraeus has testified that the information on the attacks was classified and was withheld originally so it wouldn't impede efforts to catch the perpetrators of the consulate attacks, and you are upset Obama and other government officials didn't just spill the beans immediately on this classified information? You aren't concerned about getting justice for the Americans killed in Libya?

Is it the case where you are concerned about avenging those four dead Americans, but less so than scoring some political points on our newly re-elected President and our future Secretary of State? Those four Americans are important, but just not that important? How concerned were you when you found that Bush admin had lied to get us into war with Iraq, and that subsequently thousands of American soldiers died in that war?

Pretty much this. This Benghazi-gate is all so confusing and makes little to no sense.

I do agree though with Ringleader that what happened prior is much more important than what happened after and I think those are legitimate questions to ask.

Brock
11-19-2012, 02:04 PM
I don't know what else to tell you. I've seen if first hand how the printing of money, devaluing the dollar causing higher prices for many households that has hurt people's spending power and how that impacts many businesses. I guess you'll just have to agree to disagree if you so please.

TGI

A lot of businesses are doing fine, probably a lot of them in the exact same business you were in. How do you account for that?

ROYC75
11-19-2012, 02:05 PM
Those two things are entirely, and by that I mean 100%, unrelated.

You clearly do not know what you are talking about.

Let me educate you here....

Pipeline crane mats > Used for pipeline jobs, the contracts my customer has is the Keystone Pipeline. The construction has came to a halt this year to the failure of the Obama administration to release the authority to continue to build it.

Firewood accounts > These accounts are generated to the white collar workers in the bigger cities, not smaller rural towns. With the economy bad or unstable right now, our customer (Kroger) has told that the expected sales will be smaller than previously thought.

We were geared up for a BIG year this year after picking up 4 more distribution centers, but the election came and went, people now are skeptical of the economy.

|Zach|
11-19-2012, 02:07 PM
Let me educate you here....


Quoted for awesomeness.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-19-2012, 02:09 PM
A lot of businesses are doing fine, probably a lot of them in the exact same business you were in. How do you account for that?

I guess if you say so. Although I know more that are not, than are. I've seen far more businesses close, many long-time, in the last few years than have opened but this is something I always try to observe where ever I go.

TGI

ROYC75
11-19-2012, 02:10 PM
Pretty much this. This Benghazi-gate is all so confusing and makes little to no sense.

I do agree though with Ringleader that what happened prior is much more important than what happened after and I think those are legitimate questions to ask.

Yep.

ROYC75
11-19-2012, 02:12 PM
Quoted for awesomeness.

Duly quoted by a CP Certified Ass.

|Zach|
11-19-2012, 02:14 PM
Duly quoted by a CP Certified Ass.

That is Mr. CP Certified Ass to you.

As long as I am on the clock that is!

The_Grand_Illusion
11-19-2012, 02:16 PM
Can you please answer the specific questions I asked?

Of course I want justice for those Americans. I wouldn't have posted in the Benghazi threads if I hadn't. It's just the libs don't care for where they might lead. There is a lot of good info in those threads if you really want to catch up on what we know. I tried to answer your questions in one reply. Susan Rice went out and spread the false narrative on national TV, when, if you read the OP, the president was briefed more on what really happened and it had nothing to do with a video. Like I said, they still could have put out that it was terrorism but there also was a political narrative to follow for the election.

TGI

cosmo20002
11-19-2012, 02:22 PM
Of course I want justice for those Americans. I wouldn't have posted in the Benghazi threads if I hadn't. It's just the libs don't care for where they might lead. There is a lot of good info in those threads if you really want to catch up on what we know. I tried to answer your questions in one reply. Susan Rice went out and spread the false narrative on national TV, when, if you read the OP, the president was briefed more on what really happened and it had nothing to do with a video. Like I said, they still could have put out that it was terrorism but there also was a political narrative to follow for the election.

TGI

Why does a video being involved (and there were protests over that video elsewhere that day) preclude it being terrorism? The second someone fired at the building, it was terrorism--regardless of whether the shooter was mad about a video, a specific US policy, the US in general, or just woke up on the wrong side of the bed. I just don't see what practical difference it makes.

Cave Johnson
11-19-2012, 02:23 PM
You clearly do not know what you are talking about.

Let me educate you here....

Pipeline crane mats > Used for pipeline jobs, the contracts my customer has is the Keystone Pipeline. The construction has came to a halt this year to the failure of the Obama administration to release the authority to continue to build it.

Firewood accounts > These accounts are generated to the white collar workers in the bigger cities, not smaller rural towns. With the economy bad or unstable right now, our customer (Kroger) has told that the expected sales will be smaller than previously thought.

We were geared up for a BIG year this year after picking up 4 more distribution centers, but the election came and went, people now are skeptical of the economy.

Ah, you were stringing together two unrelated lines of business. Gotcha.

Can't speak to the firewood, but it certainly sucks that you're not getting the mats contract. From my perspective, thought, the Keystone Pipeline is an economic drain in perpetuity.

“The Canadian plan was to use their market power to raise prices in the United States (UNG) and get more money from consumers,” Philip Verleger , founder of Colorado-based energy consulting firm PK Verleger LLC, said in an interview. Prices may gain 10 to 20 cents in central states, he said.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-03-01/keystone-oil-pipeline-seen-raising-gas-prices-in-midwest-energy.html

The_Grand_Illusion
11-19-2012, 02:27 PM
Why does a video being involved (and there were protests over that video elsewhere that day) preclude it being terrorism? The second someone fired at the building, it was terrorism--regardless of whether the shooter was mad about a video, a specific US policy, the US in general, or just woke up on the wrong side of the bed. I just don't see what practical difference it makes.

Please read the OP.

Thanks,

TGI

cosmo20002
11-19-2012, 02:32 PM
Please read the OP.

Thanks,

TGI

Done. Still don't know what practical difference it makes. The end result is the same. And the questions regarding appropriate security levels and the response all remain the same.

Somehow, mentioning the video (which was protested elsewhere that same day) turns this into "worse than Watergate?"

ROYC75
11-19-2012, 03:07 PM
That is Mr. CP Certified Ass to you.

As long as I am on the clock that is!

As long as you fail to answer 4 softball questions that were throw to you 2 times now, you will be looked upon as one who will not answer or will use his liberal spin, lie or deflect as you did the first time.

Your comments that had nothing to do with the questions.

The poll was a bad idea with most asshats here, voting before Slick Willie even answered.

HonestChieffan
11-19-2012, 03:14 PM
You clearly do not know what you are talking about.

Let me educate you here....

Pipeline crane mats > Used for pipeline jobs, the contracts my customer has is the Keystone Pipeline. The construction has came to a halt this year to the failure of the Obama administration to release the authority to continue to build it.

Firewood accounts > These accounts are generated to the white collar workers in the bigger cities, not smaller rural towns. With the economy bad or unstable right now, our customer (Kroger) has told that the expected sales will be smaller than previously thought.

We were geared up for a BIG year this year after picking up 4 more distribution centers, but the election came and went, people now are skeptical of the economy.

Firewood interested me. I have tried to give away firewood. But its like Tomatoes. I can grow tomatoes till who laid the chunk. And everyone loves a garden grown fresh tomato. Its just the want you to grow, pick and deliver or they are not so much into them. Same with firewood. I have a bunch of trees...hedge, hickory, oak, ash. And I end up cutting them down and pushing them into piles and burning them cause I cant use that much and people who I offer it to want it cut, split, delivered, and stacked...or never mind.

Brock
11-19-2012, 03:52 PM
Firewood interested me. I have tried to give away firewood. But its like Tomatoes. I can grow tomatoes till who laid the chunk. And everyone loves a garden grown fresh tomato. Its just the want you to grow, pick and deliver or they are not so much into them. Same with firewood. I have a bunch of trees...hedge, hickory, oak, ash. And I end up cutting them down and pushing them into piles and burning them cause I cant use that much and people who I offer it to want it cut, split, delivered, and stacked...or never mind.

Sounds like you're surrounded by worthless people.

BucEyedPea
11-19-2012, 04:00 PM
I have tried to give away firewood. But its like Tomatoes. I can grow tomatoes till who laid the chunk. And everyone loves a garden grown fresh tomato. Its just the want you to grow, pick and deliver or they are not so much into them.

Good I'll be in touch with you then. I keep getting that fungus on tomatoes when I grew 'em!

BucEyedPea
11-19-2012, 04:02 PM
Roy, don't know where your post is in the Keystone Pipeline but I think you should reconsider.
There's even Tea Partiers that opposed to it because it relies on eminent domain abuse. The oil from it goes overseas not to Americans. It does nothing for Americans. It's nothing but a another globalist-self interest deal.


I have details on this somewhere in the forum from months ago. Type it in the search with my name. It should come up.

ROYC75
11-19-2012, 05:26 PM
Roy, don't know where your post is in the Keystone Pipeline but I think you should reconsider.
There's even Tea Partiers that opposed to it because it relies on eminent domain abuse. The oil from it goes overseas not to Americans. It does nothing for Americans. It's nothing but a another globalist-self interest deal.
I have details on this somewhere in the forum from months ago. Type it in the search with my name. It should come up.

Good Lord, take a trip to the moon.

All the oil overseas ?
All the oil was projected to be used here until all the overseas countries we buy oil from threw a fit because it would reduce how much oil we buy from them. All of the opposition to the oil sands actually comes from foreign countries such as Nigeria, Venezuela, and Saudi Arabia, all of whom supply oil to the United States setting off all of the environmentalist. They are backed by them and for the love of God, do not use the Cornell ILR Global Labor Institute study, a liberal leaning study group that back who ,environmentalist! It wasn't until the foreign countries such as Nigeria, Venezuela, and Saudi Arabia outcry to America and the environmentalist, claiming it will all go to the Asian markets. TransCanada had said that development of oil sands will expand regardless of whether the crude oil is exported to the United States or alternatively to Asian markets through the Enbridge Northern Gateway Pipelines or the Kinder Morgan's Trans-Mountain line. Meaning if we do not want the oil, Asian markets do and it will go out through British Columbia. A lot of money has been spent so far into building this pipeline over the last 2 years. For the record,when completed, the Keystone XL will add 510,000 barrels per day increasing the total capacity up to 1.1 million barrels of oil per day to the United States of America ....... Not the Asian markets as the environmentalist claims that is backed the opposition of Nigeria, Venezuela, and Saudi Arabia.

It does nothing for Americans? Nothing ? What is job creation t you ?Do you not know that a large part of this is already done ? Hundred of thousand of jobs have been made to the public over the last few years and especially now when we need more of those jobs. Plus the jobs at the refineries will increase, bringing more jobs to Americans. But let's kill the jobs because the interest of countries like Nigeria, Venezuela, and Saudi Arabia.

Yeah, let's kill jobs because other foreign countries are fearful we will buy less oil from them.

BucEyedPea
11-19-2012, 05:29 PM
Good Lord, take a trip to the moon.

That's not an argument.


All the oil was projected to be used here until all the overseas countries we buy oil from threw a fit because it would reduce how much oil we buy from them. All of the opposition to the oil sands actually comes from foreign countries such as Nigeria, Venezuela, and Saudi Arabia, all of whom supply oil to the United States setting off all of the environmentalist. They are backed by them and for the love of God, do not use the Cornell ILR Global Labor Institute study, a liberal leaning study group that back who ,environmentalist! It wasn't until the foreign countries such as Nigeria, Venezuela, and Saudi Arabia outcry to America and the environmentalist, claiming it will all go to the Asian markets. TransCanada had said that development of oil sands will expand regardless of whether the crude oil is exported to the United States or alternatively to Asian markets through the Enbridge Northern Gateway Pipelines or the Kinder Morgan's Trans-Mountain line. Meaning if we do not want the oil, Asian markets do and it will go out through British Columbia. A lot of money has been spent so far into building this pipeline over the last 2 years. For the record,when completed, the Keystone XL will add 510,000 barrels per day increasing the total capacity up to 1.1 million barrels of oil per day to the United States of America ....... Not the Asian markets as the environmentalist claims that is backed the opposition of Nigeria, Venezuela, and Saudi Arabia.

Nothing ? What is job creation t you ?Do you not know that a large part of this is already done ? Hundred of thousand of jobs have been made to the public over the last few years and especially now when we need more of those jobs. Plus the jobs at the refineries will increase, bringing more jobs to Americans. But let's kill the jobs because the interest of countries like Nigeria, Venezuela, and Saudi Arabia.

Yeah, let's kill jobs because other foreign countries are fearful we will buy less oil from them.

Nope. Plus you have not addressed eminent domain abuse.

See here....including the rest of the posts after it in the thread.

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showpost.php?p=8484606&postcount=8

Oh and the private sector should create jobs, but this takes property for a private corporation from Canada.
I don't support abuse of property rights....just in case you didn't know.
This is the classic crony capitalist/mercantilist set-up.

BucEyedPea
11-19-2012, 05:39 PM
Post #12
http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showpost.php?p=8487584&postcount=12

Post #14
http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showpost.php?p=8487657&postcount=14

Post #16
http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showpost.php?p=8487768&postcount=16

HonestChieffan
11-19-2012, 05:40 PM
Sounds like you're surrounded by worthless people.

I think you will find a good number are worthless. And a lot are lazy. Cutting firewood isnt like opening a beer. Half the population doesn't contribute shit so doing work for free wood is beneath them.

RedNeckRaider
11-19-2012, 06:06 PM
I think you will find a good number are worthless. And a lot are lazy. Cutting firewood isnt like opening a beer. Half the population doesn't contribute shit so doing work for free wood is beneath them.

Why cut wood just demand someone provides it for you~

HonestChieffan
11-19-2012, 06:15 PM
Why cut wood just demand someone provides it for you~


seems a trend

Brock
11-19-2012, 06:16 PM
I think you will find a good number are worthless. And a lot are lazy. Cutting firewood isnt like opening a beer. Half the population doesn't contribute shit so doing work for free wood is beneath them.

I thought country folk were more hardy than that.

HonestChieffan
11-19-2012, 06:31 PM
I thought country folk were more hardy than that.

Country folk have firewood. Its city folk who i have offered to. Townies tend to be soft and would rater pay for something than work and get it free.

ROYC75
11-19-2012, 06:32 PM
That's not an argument.



Nope. Plus you have not addressed eminent domain abuse.

See here....including the rest of the posts after it in the thread.

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showpost.php?p=8484606&postcount=8

Oh and the private sector should create jobs, but this takes property for a private corporation from Canada.
I don't support abuse of property rights....just in case you didn't know.
This is the classic crony capitalist/mercantilist set-up.

You just don't get it, do ya. The oil flowing to Patoka,IL & Texas refineries are refining that oil for American consumption. Why would they want to build a pipeline that cost millions of dollars to refine it and ship it to Asia at a higher cost of shipping when they can go straight west to British Columbia,refine it and ship it cheaper ?

ROYC75
11-19-2012, 06:41 PM
I find it amazing we can start a topic and before long we have multiple topics open in one thread.

Are we here at CP all that good or severely inattentive with staying on topic?

Brock
11-19-2012, 06:48 PM
Country folk have firewood. Its city folk who i have offered to. Townies tend to be soft and would rater pay for something than work and get it free.

Townies need firewood? for what?

ROYC75
11-19-2012, 06:52 PM
Townies need firewood? for what?

They burn it in the evenings to set the tone on a quiet evening with their spouse. Sometimes things heat up between them.

We have found ( through a Kroger survey )that it is usually the women who buy the logs by the gas pumps, out in front of the store to take home and have the man start the fire when she cooks supper. Women get the wood, the movies, groceries on the way home and have an evening at home instead of going out.

RedNeckRaider
11-19-2012, 06:53 PM
Townies need firewood? for what?

A fireplace or for their smoker?

JonesCrusher
11-19-2012, 07:05 PM
I find it amazing we can start a topic and before long we have multiple topics open in one thread.

Are we here at CP all that good or severely inattentive with staying on topic?

Ritalin The official sponsor of CHIEFSPLANET

Dayze
11-19-2012, 07:09 PM
I find it amazing we can start a topic and before long we have multiple topics open in one thread.

Are we here at CP all that good or severely inattentive with staying on topic?

I think Geno has more upside than Barkley.

and who do you think I should start this week in FF?

RedNeckRaider
11-19-2012, 07:16 PM
Ritalin The official sponsor of CHIEFSPLANET

Flop should jump on this to help Kyle out~

BucEyedPea
11-19-2012, 07:46 PM
They burn it in the evenings to set the tone on a quiet evening with their spouse. Sometimes things heat up between them.

We have found ( through a Kroger survey )that it is usually the women who buy the logs by the gas pumps, out in front of the store to take home and have the man start the fire when she cooks supper. Women get the wood, the movies, groceries on the way home and have an evening at home instead of going out.

I still prefer reservations. Preferably, at an upscale restaurant.

BucEyedPea
11-19-2012, 07:47 PM
You just don't get it, do ya. The oil flowing to Patoka,IL & Texas refineries are refining that oil for American consumption. Why would they want to build a pipeline that cost millions of dollars to refine it and ship it to Asia at a higher cost of shipping when they can go straight west to British Columbia,refine it and ship it cheaper ?

No, you don't get it—it's still relies on eminent domain abuse. Kelo here we come.

On who gets the use of that oil, I have contrary facts per those links. Also the number of jobs is exaggerated. It's more like 5000.
The oil reaches Texas Gulf refineries but there's no certainty they will be sold in the US. However, it was meant to go to Asia. We're just the middleman.

Five Fallacies of Keystone Pipeline.
http://moneymorning.com/2011/12/20/five-fallacies-of-the-keystone-oil-pipeline/

cosmo20002
11-19-2012, 08:29 PM
No, you don't get it—it's still relies on eminent domain abuse. Kelo here we come.

On who gets the use of that oil, I have contrary facts per those links. Also the number of jobs is exaggerated. It's more like 5000.
The oil reaches Texas Gulf refineries but there's no certainty they will be sold in the US. However, it was meant to go to Asia. We're just the middleman.

Five Fallacies of Keystone Pipeline.
http://moneymorning.com/2011/12/20/five-fallacies-of-the-keystone-oil-pipeline/

BINGO. And this goes for all oil that is actually drilled here as well.

DaneMcCloud
11-19-2012, 09:01 PM
Be in denial all you want. It appears more and more that Obama lied to the American people. Just because you don't like that doesn't mean it's true. That also means where you get your info from, the liberal media, did their best to run out the clock on this before the election. How messed up is that? Of course you libs don't care because your line of thinking is messed up too.

TGI

Let's say that you're right and that the media didn't report it.

Do you really think that those people that voted for Obama would have voted for Romney or not voted at all?

I think you're smoking crack if you think the answer is either.

|Zach|
11-19-2012, 10:12 PM
As long as you fail to answer 4 softball questions that were throw to you 2 times now, you will be looked upon as one who will not answer or will use his liberal spin, lie or deflect as you did the first time.

Your comments that had nothing to do with the questions.

The poll was a bad idea with most asshats here, voting before Slick Willie even answered.

What does any of this even mean?

I hope that thread stays on top of DC until end times.

ROYC75
11-19-2012, 10:18 PM
No, you don't get it—it's still relies on eminent domain abuse. Kelo here we come.

On who gets the use of that oil, I have contrary facts per those links. Also the number of jobs is exaggerated. It's more like 5000.
The oil reaches Texas Gulf refineries but there's no certainty they will be sold in the US. However, it was meant to go to Asia. We're just the middleman.

Five Fallacies of Keystone Pipeline.
http://moneymorning.com/2011/12/20/five-fallacies-of-the-keystone-oil-pipeline/

Let me try to clear a few things up here about the Keystone Pipeline job on a freaking Bengahzi thread!

You are bitching about eminent domain abuse...... get over yourself. You act as though this happens everyday by all business & politicians. It happens at times, but from what I know it's for the betterment of the community, state, region, etc. Mostly by way of jobs to the community. I do not know of ANYBODY that has not been compensated well for it. Sometimes people are just too stubborn to allow progress to take place for pride or principal. When this happens, it sucks, I can relate to the family feelings on their land. But something of this magnitude produces many jobs.

Your bitching on jobs .............5000, don't kid yourself or that article. You have no clue.... The current project will produce 20,000 construction jobs over the life of the project. Projects like this, along with additional investment in oil sands development in Canada and expansion of pipelines and refineries in the U.S. make it possible to realize an additional 500,000 U.S. jobs in 2035.

You want to figure in the additional jobs it feeds too, trucking,pipe building, construction mats, pipeline skids,pipe joints and supplies,construction machinery,linemen, additional refineries workers, fuel transportation, crap the list goes on the number of jobs it builds and helps to maintain in our economy.

You are too shallow, you only see 1 or 2 talking points and jump on the bandwagon it's turns into a freaking crusade.

What part of capitalism do you not understand ?

Psyko Tek
11-19-2012, 10:41 PM
Who would it "tip off"?

why would you wanna tell you enemies, you knew what they did and you were tracking them?

I understand protection broke down and was badly done, but vengeance should not be telegraphed....

or maybe he should take the W posture of they aren't important?

stonedstooge
11-20-2012, 09:18 AM
why would you wanna tell you enemies, you knew what they did and you were tracking them?

I understand protection broke down and was badly done, but vengeance should not be telegraphed....

or maybe he should take the W posture of they aren't important?

Kind of like when Bin Laden was killed? O'Bama went against the recommendations of the military so he could immediatley cash in political points, but this situation is different?

Radar Chief
11-20-2012, 09:48 AM
Townies need firewood? for what?

Supplemental heat. Maybe it’s just more common around here but mine and many of my friend’s houses have a stove, wood or pellet, for supplemental heat.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-20-2012, 10:02 AM
Let's say that you're right and that the media didn't report it.

Do you really think that those people that voted for Obama would have voted for Romney or not voted at all?

I think you're smoking crack if you think the answer is either.

Let's say???? They did hold back. It's not the only thing the liberal establishment held back before the election. You can almost make a case for the huge jump in jobless claims, also the jump in welfare recipients, and the Petraeus affair.

It's a pretty powerful establishment that is able to hold back information for political purposes. You would think if these issues were available to the American voter, they would be able to make an informed decision. Much of this was not so we'll never know. We'll just have to live with the consequences.

TGI

J Diddy
11-20-2012, 10:11 AM
Let's say???? They did hold back. It's not the only thing the liberal establishment held back before the election. You can almost make a case for the huge jump in jobless claims, also the jump in welfare recipients, and the Petraeus affair.

It's a pretty powerful establishment that is able to hold back information for political purposes. You would think if these issues were available to the American voter, they would be able to make an informed decision. Much of this was not so we'll never know. We'll just have to live with the consequences.

TGI

What does the Patraeus afffair and an informed decision between Romney or Obama have to do with each other?

The_Grand_Illusion
11-20-2012, 10:25 AM
What does the Patraeus afffair and an informed decision between Romney or Obama have to do with each other?

Did he not serve under this president's administration? Doesn't the Petraeus situation raise more questions about the whole Benghazi situation? It has, but we are finding out about all that after the election.

TGI

Fish
11-20-2012, 11:05 AM
Let's say???? They did hold back. It's not the only thing the liberal establishment held back before the election. You can almost make a case for the huge jump in jobless claims, also the jump in welfare recipients, and the Petraeus affair.

It's a pretty powerful establishment that is able to hold back information for political purposes. You would think if these issues were available to the American voter, they would be able to make an informed decision. Much of this was not so we'll never know. We'll just have to live with the consequences.

TGI

Why do you believe these issues were not available to the American voter? I know you like conspiracy theories and all, but if it's such important game changing info, how was it not available? Is the Republican party so inept that it cannot even educate its voters and simply bows to the awesome might of the evil commie mainstream media?

I fear the consequences may never be the same....

The_Grand_Illusion
11-20-2012, 12:05 PM
Why do you believe these issues were not available to the American voter? I know you like conspiracy theories and all, but if it's such important game changing info, how was it not available? Is the Republican party so inept that it cannot even educate its voters and simply bows to the awesome might of the evil commie mainstream media?

I fear the consequences may never be the same....

I disagree with claiming this is a conspiracy theory with the way this has all played out. It wasn't the Republicans, for the most part, that information was held back or downplayed from.

TGI

Fish
11-20-2012, 12:39 PM
I disagree with claiming this is a conspiracy theory with the way this has all played out. It wasn't the Republicans, for the most part, that information was held back or downplayed from.

TGI

Then who kept these issues from being available to the American voter?

The_Grand_Illusion
11-20-2012, 02:05 PM
Then who kept these issues from being available to the American voter?

Uhm, the liberal media and liberal establishment trying to run out the clock before the election? It wasn't just being kept, it was being downplayed as well.

TGI

Radar Chief
11-20-2012, 02:16 PM
Uhm, the liberal media and liberal establishment trying to run out the clock before the election? It wasn't just being kept, it was being downplayed as well.

TGI

Don’t see it making a bit of difference. The people that voted for Obama weren’t going to vote for Romney and 1.8 Million fewer voters that turned out for McCain but not Romney weren’t going to turn out all because of this story.

The_Grand_Illusion
11-20-2012, 02:16 PM
FWIW, here is the latest. Sounds like a huge CYA now going on. The changing of the CIA's original talking points, they are now pointing to the office of the DNI. The problem here is the head of the DNI has already testified before Congress that he did not change them.

http://hotair.com/archives/2012/11/20/cbs-office-of-the-dni-cut-al-qaeda-and-terrorism-references-from-benghazi-talking-points/

CBS: “Office of the DNI” cut al-Qaeda and terrorism references from Benghazi talking points

posted at 11:01 am on November 20, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

Meet James Clapper — the latest fall guy for the White House on Benghazi.* After last week’s hearings in Congress showed that the talking points from the CIA had been changed to eliminate the mention of terrorism, Washington erupted into a whodunit.* CBS reports today that the culprit has been found … sort of:
*
CBS News has learned that the Office of the Director of National Intelligence (DNI) cut specific references to “al Qaeda” and “terrorism” from the unclassified talking points given to Ambassador Susan Rice on the Benghazi consulate attack – with the agreement of the CIA and FBI. The White House or State Department did not make those changes. …

However, an intelligence source tells CBS News correspondent Margaret Brennan the links to al Qaeda were deemed too “tenuous” to make public, because there was not strong confidence in the person providing the intelligence. CIA Director David Petraeus, however, told Congress he agreed to release the information — the reference to al Qaeda — in an early draft of the talking points, which were also distributed to select lawmakers.

“The intelligence community assessed from the very beginning that what happened in Benghazi was a terrorist attack.” DNI spokesman Shawn Turner tells CBS News. That information was shared at a classified level — which Rice, as a member of President Obama’s cabinet, would have been privy to. …
The head of the DNI is James Clapper, an Obama appointee. He ultimately did review the points, before they were given to Ambassador Rice and members of the House intelligence committee on Sept. 14. They were compiled the day before.

Note that this report doesn’t pin the blame on Clapper himself.* It instead locates the change in Clapper’s “office,” allowing for a rather non-specific assignment that makes almost no sense at all.* Are we to believe that a Clapper aide overruled David Petraeus’ assessment of Benghazi?* If so, on what basis?

The report also states that the reason for the redaction was because the link to AQ was “too tenuous.”* However, the presence of mortars and RPGs, as well as coordinated fire and attack strategies in play, made it clear “almost immediately” to Petraeus and others in the CIA that this was much more than a spontaneous demonstration run amok.* That made the YouTube video explanation rather “tenuous” too, no?* And yet that stayed in the talking points while terrorism got excised.

This explanation seems even more tenuous than the previous stories coming from the White House.* If Petraeus knew “almost immediately” that this was an act of deliberate terrorism and included that in his talking points, then we need an explanation of who in the “office of the DNI” removed that explanation, and why — more than just the “too tenuous” excuse here that turned out to be totally wrong — and whether they got pressured to do so.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/11/16/petraeus-to-testify-knew-libya-was-terrorism-from-start-source-says/#ixzz2CmrJ1Fls

"Rep. Peter King, R-N.Y., told Fox News that intelligence officials who testified in a closed-door hearing a day earlier, including Director of National Intelligence James Clapper and Acting CIA Director Mike Morell, said they did not know who changed the talking points. He said they went out to multiple departments, including the State Department, National Security Council, Justice Department and White House.*"

The_Grand_Illusion
11-20-2012, 02:19 PM
Don’t see it making a bit of difference. The people that voted for Obama weren’t going to vote for Romney and 1.8 Million fewer voters that turned out for McCain but not Romney weren’t going to turn out all because of this story.

You are probably right, it just goes to show how divided this country is to the point where American deaths, incompetence, don't matter. It's really too bad for our country.

TGI

VAChief
11-20-2012, 02:26 PM
You are probably right, it just goes to show how divided this country is to the point where American deaths, incompetence, don't matter. It's really too bad for our country.

TGI

Quit blaming Bush and Cheney. Move on.