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Vortex Dweller
10-05-2000, 12:32 PM
Can we beat the Rams? I think we have a 50:50 chance (I realize every game is theoretically 50:50, but those are genuine otter-compiled odds.)

My biggest worry, after beating Raiders of course, it the fact that our secondary is so inexperienced past Hasty and Woods. Because of that there is a good chance we'll never leave nickel or dime defense that may leave Faulk open to run all over. Pat Dennis or Eric Warfield on Holt, Bruce or Hakar also scares me. Any insight, ideas or comments how to prepare a defense for the Rams.

If all else fails Hicks could knock Warner out with a dislocated torso or something like that.


[This message has been edited by Otter (edited 10-05-2000).]

Baby Lee
10-05-2000, 12:33 PM
The thing about the Ram's game is, it is after the Raider game. I wish the Ram's game wasn't after an arch-rival. Teams very seldom play very good after the arch-rival. I really hope this isn't the case this time.




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bk

ck_IN
10-05-2000, 12:42 PM
This may sound crazy, but why not take a chance when playing the Rams. Would play a 4-1-6 defense.
Four down lineman, rushing passer on every play.
One linebacker - Edwards, whose only task is to follow and kill Faulk on every play.
Six defensive backs - Hasty, Dennis, and Warfield playing close up Man to Man coverage on three wide outs. 3 deep zone behind them with Walker, Atkins, and Wesley, coming up to make a HUGE hit when ball is caught, and stop the big play keeping everything in front of them. 3 deep zone would be a rotating/rolling zone based on the side of field looks like the play will be run. Should also keep tight end in check.

Let Faulk try to beat us on the ground. Seriously doubt that he alone can put up 40 points in a game. Running the ball at 5yrds a pop, takes time off the clock, and give offense opportunity to make a mistake or penalty that will end a few drives.

Lets not let them beat us with 4 or 5 big plays, running past our linebackers like they are standing still. Match speed with speed!

The-Man
10-05-2000, 12:46 PM
Redd,

That sounds like a very good plan to me.

I also feel the Chiefs should take chances.

My feeling is the Chiefs are probably going to lose anyway, so they should throw a boatload of bombs. They should keep on throwing. Who knows what might happen?

The-Man
10-05-2000, 12:49 PM
If they do get lucky on a few of those bombs and by some miracle get a 14 point lead, then they can start pounding the ball to try to consume the clock and keep the Rams off the field. Everyone has been able to run on the Rams.

The Chiefs defense is definitely going to have to help out in the scoring dept.

One Arrowhead Dave
10-05-2000, 12:49 PM
Red till Dead-

Yeah, it sounded crazy at first, but the more I consider the alternatives, the less crazy it sounds. This is an idea that deserves more careful consideration. I need to mull the concept over some more before I call you nutz.

xoxo~
gaz
intrigued.<BR>

Vortex Dweller
10-05-2000, 12:52 PM
I like that idea idea as well red-till-dead.

I would be willing to bet they never saw that scheme before and it would have to adjust.

Gaz
10-05-2000, 01:04 PM
red, the thought does have merit.

We'd give up lots of intermediate yards but hopefully be able to stuff them at least part of the time in the red zone.

Somebody get Gun on the line.

bkkcoh
10-05-2000, 01:07 PM
Uh..Red? Did you inadvertantly omit Jerome Woods from your game plan? Or do you actually plan on sitting our only experienced Safety on the bench?

Remove Bracey Walker, put Woods on the field where he belongs, and I'm all for it!!

What the he!! do we have to lose, other than the game, which we really shouldn't win anyway, right?

ck_IN
10-05-2000, 01:11 PM
My primary hope is that with close man to man coverage (most teams afraid to play) with zone help behind, would force Warner to hold the ball just a little longer. Get a few of those "bone crunching" hits on him.

Secondly with three safeties have a better chance to put a good hit on their wide outs when they do make a catch. A few pops from Wesley and Atkins should make them think twice coming across the middle on those slant patterns that can go for 70 yards.

Would much rather see Faulk try to beat us on the ground. See if he can take the punishment of about 40 carries.

bkkcoh
10-05-2000, 01:13 PM
Any defensive coordiator who can force the Rams to RUN 40 times, deserves a Congressional Medal of Honor!!!

Holy Crap, can you imagine?

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[b]ct
Give TRich the Ball!!!</B>

ck_IN
10-05-2000, 01:13 PM
coryt,

OOOPPPPPS. My mistake. Yes we would certainly use Woods over Walker. Bringing in so many secondary folks, forgot one of our best players.

bkkcoh
10-05-2000, 01:15 PM
I had to give you the benefit of the doubt, Red!

Diggin so deep on the depth chart, it's understandable.

ct

Kurt Surber
10-05-2000, 01:27 PM
My fear isn't so much the 2ndary getting hosed by the plays of the Rams personnel. my fear is that Gun/Schott/Shaw coming up with an aggressive coverage scheme and the Rams flagging their way down the field for PI. I really think our focus has to be getting to the QB. I am not out-and-out saying that the refs will be biased, but I can envision their scrutiny tightening is this 'explosive O' is thwarted in the passing game. The ticky-tack PI calls will start flying fast and furious. We'll swear mighty-mouse and Dishman were in our D-backfield again.

AustinChief
10-05-2000, 01:33 PM
4-1-6? A new concept?

Hardly...it's called a DIME defense, otherwise known as the "prevent [you from winning]" defense...

And ironically enough, it may just work if you were to use it for SIXTY MINUTES!

http://www.ChiefsPlanet.com/ubb/smile.gif

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Parker
ChiefsPlanet Administrator
Jimmy Raye for President...anything to get him out of Kansas City
[i]More Moreau</I>

Coogs
10-05-2000, 01:41 PM
Except that with a 'dime' you keep 3 down linemen, 2 LBs, and 6 DBs. This is more like a half dollar defense http://www.ChiefsPlanet.com/ubb/wink.gif

One Arrowhead Dave
10-05-2000, 01:43 PM
That extra DL makes a big difference if you want to crush the QB.

xoxo~
gaz
ALWAYS wants to crush the QB.<BR>

AustinChief
10-05-2000, 01:46 PM
KC Jones,

Yes, you could do it that way. A team's dime package usually depends on their base package. Generally the dime consists of the MLB(s) and down linemen. The Jets are a base 3-4 team, for instance, so they usually keep the MLBs and 3 linemen. A base 4-3 team, like the Chiefs, generally play 1 LB and 4 linemen.

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Parker
ChiefsPlanet Administrator
Jimmy Raye for President...anything to get him out of Kansas City
[i]More Moreau</I>

ck_IN
10-05-2000, 01:49 PM
Also in the dime or prevent defense everyone plays off their man. In the 4-1-6 defense you have a blend of tight man on man coverage, and deep zone help behind. (In case Warner has time and they get beat deep)

Secondly we have Edwards only job is to find and destroy Faulk on every play. If he does get picked off by a blocker, you still have people that can come up and make the tackle.

Certainly a bend don't break defense. Which I hate. But gives us the opportunity to force the Rams to run more plays and make a mistake, IE, fumble, INT, penalty to slow down their drives.

Don't want to see ANY of those 7 yard slants turn into one play drive TDs.

As always, I could be wrong!

[This message has been edited by Red Till Dead (edited 10-05-2000).]

bkkcoh
10-05-2000, 01:52 PM
ht,

Would that be might work towards a KC victory?
Or work in the 'prevent you from winning' sense?

I'm thinking we'd be better off with even more secondary personnell. Try sevin DBs!
Absolutely force em to run the ball, and when they do, thier WRs MUST block down the field. Turn the refs against them. If Holt/Bruce/Hakim/Horne try to block you, turn your back and force the flags.

Pretty bass-ackward approach, but may even out the tit-for-tat penalties.

Let's go w/ Hicks, Williams, Browning on the LOS, w/ Edwards roaming for Marshall's head.
Hasty on Bruce, Dennis on Holt, Warfield on Hakim.
Walker, Wesley(man-on-man w/ Horne for 4Wr package), and Atkins layin da BOOM on those skinny punks!!
Woods roams free, playin Centerfield.

A dizzying variety of S and CB blitzes would be in order, of course. Vary the blitzer and location like mad, so Warner will never know whence they came to have his head!!

ct
i think i also picked the wrong week to quit sniffin glue

ColoradoChief
10-05-2000, 02:02 PM
I think the key will be the bump part of the D. If we can push them around from getting off the line then we may be able to get to Warner. If we stick to our current, more relaxed, D style I think we could get killed because the do the quick pass so well. It is that quick pass to the guy getting man coverage that they tend to break for long gains.

bkkcoh
10-05-2000, 02:08 PM
Agree, morph. Can't coddle the rooks against St. Louis with 10 yard cushion. We'll get smoked with that strategy.

We MUST knock these guys off balance right at the snap of the ball, or we're likely toast.

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[b]ct
Give TRich the Ball!!!</B>

AustinChief
10-05-2000, 02:31 PM
I'll tell you this guys, and I bleed Chiefs football.

There is no way in HELL we can match up man-to-man with St. Louis. The only chance we have is to play a soft zone, two deep, and double team Faulk.

Here's how I'd put out your 4-1-6 defense:

Wesley (rover) AND Edwards on Faulk - yes he's that good...

Dennis, Bartee, Warfield and Hasty - two on each side to cover the out and up routes.

Woods in the middle, with help from the rover (Wesley) when needed.

I think this package might actually work.

Of course, there's another route. The Rams aren't particularly physical. I saw this the other day when my Hawkeyes played tough against the #1 Huskers.

BE PHYSICAL. Cancel out their speed by running some stunts and blitzes. Jam the recievers at the line.

Again, it might just work.

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Parker
ChiefsPlanet Administrator
Jimmy Raye for President...anything to get him out of Kansas City
[i]More Moreau</I>

Cormac
10-05-2000, 02:58 PM
if you want to see that 4-1-6 defense in action, just watch Joe Lee Dunn run it at Mississippi St.... It works IF you have DT's that can collapse the pocket and 3 cb's that can really cover.

Miss St uses it effectively because they blitz alot out of it.... We ran it for awhile when I was coaching but switched as it left us open to draw plays and smash screens.

The draw back IMO to KC using it is it puts Warfield man up on a slot receiver. It is nearly impossible to get an effective bump on a slot receiver and if you watch the Ram WR's, they try to get into the DB as quick as possible, then run their routes to the inbalance of his coverage. Warfield IMO is not up to it.
Plus as good as DEdwards is, putting ANY LB n Faulk (including Derek Brooks) is a mismatch, especally since he lines up at WR alot.

I would play a two deep, man under and have my OLB's drop into the passing lanes. The only way to stop this offense IMO is for the DT's to get alot of immediate pressure up the gut ala Sapp and Culpepper last year.

AustinChief
10-05-2000, 03:13 PM
You're absolutely right.

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Parker
ChiefsPlanet Administrator
Jimmy Raye for President...anything to get him out of Kansas City
[i]More Moreau</I>

DJay23
10-05-2000, 03:28 PM
Good post (#2)red till dead. instead of giving up the big play and touchdown, keep eveything in front of you like you said and try to hold them to field goals and shorten the field to put preasure on warner.