View Full Version : Would it be worth a horrible season to be rid of the Three Stooges??
08-26-2000, 12:02 AM
Well personally I think getting rid Of Moe Raye, and Larry Stock has to happen anyway but how the hell can you convince Gun?? Maybe a 4 - 12 season would get the job done. To me it would be well worth it. What do you guys think?
Still I dream of a cold frosty day probably too far away when the Chiefs are still playing football in mid January
The Blessed Virgin Larry
08-26-2000, 12:08 AM
YES, IF that's what it would take! It didn't have to be this way. We've let 2 potential Offensive Coordinators get away from us: Al Saunders-Rams and Tom Rossley - Green Bay. BOTH would be better than Jimmy Raye and we HAD them as coaches. Gun is loyal to a FAULT. It DIDN'T have to be this way, but unfortately we're stering at 4-12!
Kurt could have been replaced by Willie Shaw.
Stock coukld have been replaced by ANYONE with Special Teams experience.
Gun may NOT grt the chance to FIRE the stooges the SECOND after the season - the decision to retain that crew could cost him his job.
I'm not so sure Shaw isn't part of the problem. he was criticiced for his soft zone defenses and now that's exactly what we're showing. If this doesn't seriously improve I'd support a complete purge of the coaching staff.
08-26-2000, 12:22 AM
I agree especially on Stock. I think he could be replaced by a Wooden Indian and no one would notice the difference.
And Raye oh my god! I think he was like 4 - 16 as a OC before he came to KC. Can't we hire someone who is successful to be our OC??
08-26-2000, 12:24 AM
I think anyone would be hard pressed to disagree with the sentiment of this post.
[b]THE STOOGES MUST GO!!!</b>
08-26-2000, 12:38 AM
I'll actually cut Kurt a bit of slack. The guy has like no playmakers on his side of the ball. Yes I know Edwards is nice, Hasty can be good and Clemons has shown flashes but the days of DT and Neil Smith and Carter (when he was good)are past.
Raye has no such luxury. He has an outstanding O Line, the best tight end in the business, a competent QB, above average WR's and decent RB's. What the hell then is the problem!
I cut Schott no slack. He can't defend a screen pass, he can't call an effective blitz, and he can't create any effective 3rd and long coverage schemes. Yes, we have some bad personnel that contributes to those problems, but even bad players could correct those problems once in a while. If it happens EVERY TIME I think it would be a fault in our scheme (Schott's department).
08-26-2000, 12:53 AM
Dave - Schott has a tackle that led his team in tackles for every year except his rookie one in Marvcus Patton, Donnie Edwards is excellent at his position, Dishman hasn't earned a penny of his money, Williams isn't worth the time to type about at this point, Gray commanded a heavy salary, Clemons is more than adequate.
On paper this is a GREAT defensive team. WHy aren't they showing this greatness? Coaching and inspiration.
08-26-2000, 01:04 AM
I disagree. On paper this is an average defense. Every average defense has a couple of standout players. I think Gun was an excellent DC and his teams played like it and had some real talent there.
This D is much weaker talent-wise than what we here in KC are used to. Gray is virtually worthless, Dishman looks bad, Williams is a joke, the LB's are our strong spot but they can't remember to tackle any more. Glock looks good when he wants to but that's about the range of good players. The LB's and Glock. I'm telling you this is not the defensive talent pool we are used to.
08-26-2000, 01:07 AM
Just to clarify I am not defending Kurt. I'm just saying if I could only fire 2 of the 3 stooges Schottenheimer would be the last stooge standing.
08-26-2000, 01:07 AM
Dave - Re-read your post. The men you mention are the HIGHEST paid defensive players. When they were brought in they were considered rare catches (with the possible exception of Gray).
THey are not playing to potential.
08-26-2000, 01:16 AM
I look at it this way: If we win, they deserve to be here. If we lose, they deserve to be gone. It is never worth having a 4-12 season just to get rid of someone. They won't be here if they can't get the job done. But if things do go wrong and we do need a new coach, I'd like to get someone in here to take over the whole shabang, and that would mean Carl would have to go too...
08-26-2000, 09:11 AM
I think all three should go. I would make Gun a reservation on that departing train too - for retaining them on his staff!
From what I have seen so far, 8-8 would be a good season.
Secretly hoping that Gun is holding something back.<P>
08-26-2000, 09:16 AM
Gun should go with them. Talking about keeping hold of his old buddies. Shaw, Raye, Stock...how pathetic. The whole crew needs to be dumped. I can't see any of them keeping their jobs if preseason is an indication of things to come.
08-26-2000, 09:20 AM
I wish you were right, but the evidence before us says that ability to perform was not a criteria in judging the Coordinators. If it were, they would not be in red & gold. I like Gunther, but he made a terrible decision in keeping the Three Stooges. I would not be surprised if that decision eventually ends his career as a Head Coach.
wants Gunther to succeed, butÖ<BR>
08-26-2000, 10:28 AM
i wish we could get a new head coach and put gun back at dc. he wasn't the best but he knew what the hell he was doing.
~Thats why they call me slim shady~
08-26-2000, 10:34 AM
I might, big question, give Gun a one year extension, if, he got rid of the stooges, but chances are, they fire the head coach, hire a new one, and he replaces all of them. Very seldom does a new HC, not bring his own assistants.
08-26-2000, 01:12 PM
If we have a Bad Season (7-9 or worse), I would probably be ready for a commplete overhaul. I like Gun, and I like the 'vision' he has expressed for how to build a team. For the most part I think he's done a good job with drafting the last two years. But if he keeps inept coaches on staff (namely Raye and Stock), then he deserves to go down with them. I'm really close to pronouncing Grbac a lost cause.
I'll be interested to see if Mr. Hunt renews Carl's contract this fall or waits to see how the season goes.
08-26-2000, 01:15 PM
Didnít Lamar already say that a losing season would not be cause to fire Carl?
perhaps he made that up.<BR>
08-26-2000, 03:10 PM
Exactly. That's what I was trying to say too. By getting rid of the entire coaching staff, I mean Carl getting rid of them all, including Gun. He made his bed, he'll have to sleep in it.
Let's put it this way: If we start out 0-3, and only have 1 or 2 wins by the bye, and the team is not responding to the coach, I would fire him and replace him with Shaw on an interim basis, see how the rest of the year goes, if they continue to be inept, clean house, and bring in someone good. I would prefer to bring in a proven coach who wants more power to run the whole team, but that would not be possible if Carl was still here. Perhaps Cowher or someone would become available. We'll see. Still hoping that Gun can get us going and make us forget preseaon...
vBulletin® v3.8.0, Copyright ©2000-2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.