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Mr. Kotter
09-10-2004, 11:04 PM
Dan Rather, and CBS apparently, have made this battle over the Bush NG documents their last stand...thanks to cdcox for the idea, and RL and Joe Seahawk for the links... :thumb:

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/politics/NotedNow/Noted_Now.html

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HODGES SAID HE WAS MISLED BY CBS:

Retired Maj. General Hodges, Killian's supervisor at the Grd, tells ABC News that he feels CBS misled him about the documents they uncovered. According to Hodges, CBS told him the documents were "handwritten" and after CBS read him excerpts he said, "well if he wrote them that's what he felt."


Hodges also said he did not see the documents in the 70's and he cannot authenticate the documents or the contents. His personal belief is that the documents have been "computer generated" and are a "fraud".
EVENING NEWSCASTS WRAP: CBS's Dan Rather discusses the authenticity of his "60 Minutes" report.





http://www.kansas.com/mld/kansas/news/special_packages/election2004/9633814.htm

Posted on Fri, Sep. 10, 2004

Man named in Bush memo left Guard before document was written

BY PETE SLOVER

The Dallas Morning News


AUSTIN, Texas - (KRT) - The man named in a disputed memo as exerting pressure to "sugar coat" President Bush's military record left the Texas Air National Guard a year and a half before the memo was supposedly written, his own service record shows.

An order obtained by The Dallas Morning News shows that Col. Walter "Buck" Staudt was honorably discharged on March 1, 1972. CBS News reported this week that a memo in which Staudt was described as interfering with officers' negative evaluations of Bush's service, was dated Aug. 18, 1973.

That added to mounting questions about the authenticity of documents that seem to suggest Bush sought special favors and did not fulfill his service.

Staudt, who lives in New Braunfels, Texas, did not return calls seeking comment. His discharge paper was among a packet of documents obtained by The Dallas Morning News from official sources during 1999 research into Bush's Guard record.

A CBS staffer stood by the story, suggesting that Staudt could have continued to exert influence over Guard officials. But a former high-ranking Guard official disputed that, saying retirement would have left Staudt powerless over remaining officials.

The authenticity of the memo and three others included in Wednesday's "60 Minutes" report came in for heavy criticism Friday, prompting an unusual on-air defense of the original work. Experts on typography said they appeared to have been computer-drafted on equipment not available in the late 1960s and early 1970s.

And the family of the officer who supposedly wrote them, Lt. Col. Jerry Killian, who died in 1984, said it wasn't his nature to keep detailed personal notes....

Joe Seahawk
09-10-2004, 11:17 PM
Rather stands by '60 Minutes' story on Bush, Guard
Howard Kurtz, Washington Post
September 11, 2004 GUARD0911



CBS News anchor Dan Rather on Friday vigorously defended his "60 Minutes" story on President Bush's National Guard service, saying the 30-year-old memos he disclosed on the show this week "were and remain authentic" despite questions raised by some handwriting and document experts.

"Until someone shows me definitive proof that they are not, I don't see any reason to carry on a conversation with the professional rumor mill," Rather said. "My colleagues and I at '60 Minutes' made great efforts to authenticate these documents and to corroborate the story as best we could. ... I think the public is smart enough to see from whom some of this criticism is coming and draw judgments about what the motivations are."

The memos, written by Bush's squadron command, Lt. Col. Jerry Killian, indicate Bush received special treatment as a pilot in the Texas National Guard and failed to carry out a superior's order to undergo a physical exam. Several experts consulted by news organizations say the memos contain typographical and formatting features that suggest they were written on a computer or word processor rather than an early 1970s government typewriter.

Rather said that CBS' lead expert was San Francisco's Marcel Matley, a member of the National Association of Document Examiners. Matley has taught, lectured and written about his field, testified in many trials and consulted for the government. Matley said Friday that a "60 Minutes" executive had asked him not to give interviews.

CBS News President Andrew Heyward also defended the story. "I have full confidence in our reporting on this story," he said Friday. "This is going to hold up. This was thoroughly vetted."

Killian's widow and son have challenged the documents' authenticity. White House spokesman Scott McClellan told reporters, "We don't know whether the documents were fabricated or are authentic."

Friday, conservatives criticized Rather and CBS on talk radio and Internet sites. "I predict ... that it's only a matter of time before CBS admits it was deceived," wrote Weekly Standard managing editor Richard Starr.

In an interview, Rather stressed that CBS had talked to two people who worked with Killian in the Texas Guard -- his superior, retired Maj. Gen. Bobby Hodges, and his administrative assistant Robert Strong -- and both described the memos as consistent with what they knew of Killian. Hodges, who told CBS he was "familiar" with the documents, is an avid Bush supporter and "it took a lot for him to speak the truth," Rather said.

Before airing Wednesday's segment, he said, CBS "vetted" the confidential source who provided the memos and concluded that "he did have the ability to get access to these documents and he was being truthful."

Beyond that, Rather said, CBS consulted with military experts about Killian's language and the documents' format and compared them to other Bush service records previously released by the White House.

Asked if he was troubled by the handwriting and document analysts who say some of the typography and spacing did not exist in the early 1970s, Rather said he could not rule out the possibility of a hoax but sees no need for an internal inquiry.

On Friday night's "CBS Evening News," Rather defended the piece against what he called the "counterattack." He interviewed Matley, who said he concluded after comparing Killian's signature on the memos to other undisputed documents that "yes, it's the same person."

Rather noted the critics' claim that typewriters in the Vietnam era could not produce a raised superscript, such as the letters "th," but maintained, "Some models did." As for contentions that the memos were written in a more modern font called New Times Roman, Rather said, "The company that distributes this typeface says it has been available since 1931."

Taco John
09-10-2004, 11:19 PM
This whole thing is hilarious. From Kerry to Bush. Just friggin' hilarious.

Mr. Kotter
09-10-2004, 11:19 PM
This whole thing is hilarious. From Kerry to Bush. Just friggin' hilarious.

Agreed. ROFL

Joe Seahawk
09-10-2004, 11:21 PM
This whole thing is hilarious. From Kerry to Bush. Just friggin' hilarious.


I guess the obvious question would be.. What does Bush have to do with this CBS retardedness?

Mr. Kotter
09-10-2004, 11:26 PM
Sad that his career will be remembered for this, and THIS....

Cochise
09-10-2004, 11:27 PM
I guess the obvious question would be.. What does Bush have to do with this CBS retardedness?

d00d he orchestrated the whole thing!!! PNAC n Karl Rove! (damnit Karl! :cuss: ) OMG LIHOP!! LOLSZZ!!!

Taco John
09-10-2004, 11:29 PM
I guess the obvious question would be.. What does Bush have to do with this CBS retardedness?



ROFL ROFL ROFL

Uh, yeah... More like, the obvious question is, will Bush deny all these charges?

Come on... Whether the documents are forged or not, we all know Bush got a little "affirmative action" to find his way into a position ahead of people more deserving...

Joe Seahawk
09-10-2004, 11:34 PM
ROFL ROFL ROFL

Uh, yeah... More like, the obvious question is, will Bush deny all these charges?

Come on... Whether the documents are forged or not, we all know Bush got a little "affirmative action" to find his way into a position ahead of people more deserving...

I'm more disturbed by the actions of CBS today than I am with anything Bush or Kerry may have done 35 years ago..

Mr. Kotter
09-10-2004, 11:36 PM
I'm more disturbed by the actions of CBS today than I am with anything Bush or Kerry may have done 35 years ago..

Yep; so much for the unbiased and objective press, eh? :shake:

Taco John
09-10-2004, 11:38 PM
Hmmm... I am RATHER undisturbed. Especially after watching the media over the last month broadcast every swift boat lie that they possibly could.

I just find the whole thing hilarious. By November, America is going to hate both of these guys, and we'll be stuck with whoever...

Taco John
09-10-2004, 11:39 PM
Yep; so much for the unbiased and objective press, eh? :shake:



You apparently don't watch Fox.

Mr. Kotter
09-10-2004, 11:40 PM
You apparently don't watch Fox.

As a matter of fact, I don't....though I'm sure you don't believe that.... :rolleyes:

Michael Michigan
09-10-2004, 11:40 PM
By November, America is going to hate both of these guys...

No they won't.

Taco John
09-10-2004, 11:43 PM
As a matter of fact, I don't....though I'm sure you don't believe that.... :rolleyes:


Oh, well... Objective journalism can't be found their either...

Mr. Kotter
09-10-2004, 11:45 PM
Oh, well... Objective journalism can't be found their either...

I'd agree; that's why I insist on multiple sources representing the entire spectrum.... :thumb:

mikey23545
09-11-2004, 04:51 AM
Hmmm... I am RATHER undisturbed. Especially after watching the media over the last month broadcast every swift boat lie that they possibly could.

If you can't tell the difference between a news organization reporting what a partisan group is claiming, and a news organization fabricating a story to sway a presidential election than my estimate of your honesty and intelligence is dead on....