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Frankie
09-16-2004, 07:14 PM
Has anybody else noticed there has been no Terror Alert during the mythical Bush bounce?! Well, you can expect one anyday now!


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&ncid=1963&e=1&u=/nm/20040916/pl_nm/campaign_polls_dc_3

Two New Polls Show Deadlocked White House Race

1 hour, 38 minutes ago

By John Whitesides, Political Correspondent

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Two national polls on Thursday showed the race between President Bush (news - web sites) and Democrat John Kerry (news - web sites) deadlocked as Bush's convention bounce faded, although the president has made headway in key swing states.

In polls certain to buoy the spirits of anxious Democrats, the Pew Research Center and Harris Interactive found equal levels of support for the White House contenders as Kerry rebounded from the withering attacks he faced at the Republican convention that ended on Sept. 2.

The new surveys followed two other polls in recent days, by Investor's Business Daily and a Democratic group, Democracy Corps, that found the race essentially even again, just as it was for months before the two parties held their nominating conventions.

"Some of the negative attacks against Kerry are wearing off and he has stayed in the game because people are discontent with Bush on Iraq (news - web sites) and the economy," said Andrew Kohut, director of the Pew Research Center for People and the Press.

"Unfortunately for Kerry, he's been unable to tap into that unhappiness, especially on Iraq," Kohut said, noting Bush still beats Kerry 52-40 percent on who was favored to lead the war in Iraq. "It's a mixed picture for Kerry, but that's better than what he had a few days ago."

Several other recent polls have shown Bush, who bounced to a double-digit lead in two polls after the Republican convention, holding a four- to seven-point lead over Kerry.

A flurry of new state polls, meanwhile, showed Bush moving ahead in key states like Florida and Nevada and challenging Kerry in Democratic strongholds like New Jersey.


VOTERS UNSETTLED

"We went through a period for months where there was no air between these candidates in the polls ... and now it's the opposite," Kohut said. "I think it shows the voters are unsettled, their thoughts about Kerry are unsettled and they are going back and forth."

A new National Annenberg Election Survey earlier this week found Bush gaining ground as a leader and in the war on terror, but his approval ratings among undecided and "persuadable" voters dropped below levels from before the convention.

Kerry has sharpened his message and gone on the offensive against Bush this week on Iraq and the economy, challenging the president's credibility and his leadership on both issues.

The new focus came as he faced a chorus of complaints from fellow Democrats about his failure to develop a coherent message and respond quickly to attacks on his record in Vietnam.

"I feel very comfortable with where we are," Democratic Party boss Terry McAuliffe said. "As it relates to the battleground states, I think we're in a very good position."

Bush campaign spokesman Scott Stanzel said the campaign always expected a close race and nothing has changed.

"We've seen polls over the past week that show the president ahead, some well ahead and some slightly ahead, or tied," he said. "What we are planning for is a close election, potentially as close as 2000."

The Pew survey sampled voters in two waves. The first poll of likely voters, taken Sept. 8-10, found Bush ahead by 16 percentage points. The second poll on Sept. 11-14, which had a 3.5 percentage point margin of error, found Bush with a statistically insignificant one-point lead. Among registered voters, it was deadlocked.

The Harris poll, which was conducted Sept. 9-13 and had a 3 point margin of error, found Kerry with a one-point lead. A Harris poll in June gave Bush a 10 percentage point lead.

Mr. Kotter
09-16-2004, 07:31 PM
Hmmmmm.....Clinton didn't do anything like that.....why, just prior to HIS re-election in 1996--bombing those "terrorist camps" that he had ignored for so long.....I'm SURE it didn't have anything to do with the "timing" during the campaign though....nah, never. :rolleyes:

The advantage of incumbancy, eh? :p

alnorth
09-16-2004, 07:51 PM
What we have here is a basic serious flaw in the polls.

Some polls just contact their likely voter sample, and adjust for demographics (race, gender, etc) before posting results.

Some polls contact likely voters, then look at the parties. If there are too many Republicans, they count that as a demographic, adjust, and post.

The polls that say "Republican" is a demographic show a tight race. The polls that believe that people could change parties and therefore do not adjust for party affiliation are showing a large Bush lead, coasting to an easy landslide victory.

Which is correct? We have no clue, because this has never happened to this degree before. In elections past, the parties in the poll closely matched the ratio that voted last election. However, this year we are getting a ton of Republicans answering the phone, so some polls are treating that as an error to adjust down to a tight race.

The basic question is: is the republican sample an error, or have people actually shifted Republican? We wont know till the exit polls come out. After that, hopefully polls will be more accurate in '08

KCWolfman
09-16-2004, 08:01 PM
Conspiracy theorists are funny.


Nevermind that multiple worldwide arrests were made during the last alert - facts and details are the devil's advocate when it comes to wacko premises.

KCWolfman
09-16-2004, 08:02 PM
Hmmmmm.....Clinton didn't do anything like that.....why, just prior to HIS re-election in 1996--bombing those "terrorist camps" that he had ignored for so long.....I'm SURE it didn't have anything to do with the "timing" during the campaign though....nah, never. :rolleyes:

The advantage of incumbancy, eh? :p
You forgot about the evil aspirin factory he bombed during his impeachment.

Mr. Kotter
09-16-2004, 08:10 PM
You forgot about the evil aspirin factory he bombed during his impeachment.

Silly, us....Russ. Questioning the integrity of the unassailable and honorable William Jefferson Clinton, when it should be clear that it is only GWB and GWHB and Reagan who are dastardly enough to inject "politics" into their decision-making.

SHAME on us. Shame, shame. :shake:

KCWolfman
09-16-2004, 08:12 PM
Silly, us....Russ. Questioning the integrity of the unassailable and honorable William Jefferson Clinton, when it should be clear that it is only GWB and GWHB and Reagan who are dastardly enough to inject "politics" into their decision-making.

SHAME on us. Shame, shame. :shake:
At least GWB doesn't kill innocent people making medicine

RINGLEADER
09-16-2004, 08:38 PM
Rasmussen finallys breaks Bush over 50% (today)

Gallup has Bush up 14% (coming tomorrow)

Time continues to have Bush up double-digits.

The Pew poll actually has Bush up, but then they divided their poll so they could pick out a couple days where it was closer.

The Harris Interactive poll shows Kerry up though.

I guess being up in one poll is better than being up in no polls.

Thig Lyfe
09-16-2004, 08:45 PM
Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah.

Interesting.

MadMax
09-16-2004, 09:10 PM
Has anybody else noticed there has been no Terror Alert during the mythical Bush bounce?! Well, you can expect one anyday now!


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&ncid=1963&e=1&u=/nm/20040916/pl_nm/campaign_polls_dc_3

Two New Polls Show Deadlocked White House Race

1 hour, 38 minutes ago

By John Whitesides, Political Correspondent

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Two national polls on Thursday showed the race between President Bush (news - web sites) and Democrat John Kerry (news - web sites) deadlocked as Bush's convention bounce faded, although the president has made headway in key swing states.

In polls certain to buoy the spirits of anxious Democrats, the Pew Research Center and Harris Interactive found equal levels of support for the White House contenders as Kerry rebounded from the withering attacks he faced at the Republican convention that ended on Sept. 2.

The new surveys followed two other polls in recent days, by Investor's Business Daily and a Democratic group, Democracy Corps, that found the race essentially even again, just as it was for months before the two parties held their nominating conventions.

"Some of the negative attacks against Kerry are wearing off and he has stayed in the game because people are discontent with Bush on Iraq (news - web sites) and the economy," said Andrew Kohut, director of the Pew Research Center for People and the Press.

"Unfortunately for Kerry, he's been unable to tap into that unhappiness, especially on Iraq," Kohut said, noting Bush still beats Kerry 52-40 percent on who was favored to lead the war in Iraq. "It's a mixed picture for Kerry, but that's better than what he had a few days ago."

Several other recent polls have shown Bush, who bounced to a double-digit lead in two polls after the Republican convention, holding a four- to seven-point lead over Kerry.

A flurry of new state polls, meanwhile, showed Bush moving ahead in key states like Florida and Nevada and challenging Kerry in Democratic strongholds like New Jersey.


VOTERS UNSETTLED

"We went through a period for months where there was no air between these candidates in the polls ... and now it's the opposite," Kohut said. "I think it shows the voters are unsettled, their thoughts about Kerry are unsettled and they are going back and forth."

A new National Annenberg Election Survey earlier this week found Bush gaining ground as a leader and in the war on terror, but his approval ratings among undecided and "persuadable" voters dropped below levels from before the convention.

Kerry has sharpened his message and gone on the offensive against Bush this week on Iraq and the economy, challenging the president's credibility and his leadership on both issues.

The new focus came as he faced a chorus of complaints from fellow Democrats about his failure to develop a coherent message and respond quickly to attacks on his record in Vietnam.

"I feel very comfortable with where we are," Democratic Party boss Terry McAuliffe said. "As it relates to the battleground states, I think we're in a very good position."

Bush campaign spokesman Scott Stanzel said the campaign always expected a close race and nothing has changed.

"We've seen polls over the past week that show the president ahead, some well ahead and some slightly ahead, or tied," he said. "What we are planning for is a close election, potentially as close as 2000."

The Pew survey sampled voters in two waves. The first poll of likely voters, taken Sept. 8-10, found Bush ahead by 16 percentage points. The second poll on Sept. 11-14, which had a 3.5 percentage point margin of error, found Bush with a statistically insignificant one-point lead. Among registered voters, it was deadlocked.

The Harris poll, which was conducted Sept. 9-13 and had a 3 point margin of error, found Kerry with a one-point lead. A Harris poll in June gave Bush a 10 percentage point lead.



The "ONLY" pole sKerry leads in is The John Edwards pole!!!! LOL :p :p :thumb:

SBK
09-17-2004, 01:53 AM
Originally Posted by Frankie
Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah.

You heard that too huh?

Thig Lyfe
09-17-2004, 06:17 AM
Originally Posted by Frankie
Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah.

You heard that too huh?

Yes.

Now get off my bus. :thumb:

Cochise
09-17-2004, 06:54 AM
What a tard.

Frankie
09-17-2004, 09:30 AM
At least GWB doesn't kill innocent people making medicine

We have a BIIIIG disagreement there KCW. I call our troups and thousands of Iraqis (not all mind you) as "INNOCENT" victims of Bush's personal and manufactured war. :shrug: A lot of those troups signed as a result of 9/11 because they thought they would fight against the Taliban and Osama Bin Laden. Now they are dying in Iraq for some companies that are in bed with Bush and Cheney. :rolleyes:

Radar Chief
09-17-2004, 10:01 AM
We have a BIIIIG disagreement there KCW. I call our troups and thousands of Iraqis (not all mind you) as "INNOCENT" victims of Bush's personal and manufactured war. :shrug: A lot of those troups signed as a result of 9/11 because they thought they would fight against the Taliban and Osama Bin Laden. Now they are dying in Iraq for some companies that are in bed with Bush and Cheney. :rolleyes:

Is that why recruitment numbers are still up?

KCWolfman
09-17-2004, 10:05 AM
We have a BIIIIG disagreement there KCW. I call our troups and thousands of Iraqis (not all mind you) as "INNOCENT" victims of Bush's personal and manufactured war. :shrug: A lot of those troups signed as a result of 9/11 because they thought they would fight against the Taliban and Osama Bin Laden. Now they are dying in Iraq for some companies that are in bed with Bush and Cheney. :rolleyes:
I met two of the troops and their father last night. Alex and Aaron Murphy (twins) just got back from a 5 month stint direct in Baghdad. They are shipping back out tomorrow for another 3 months. Then both young men are re-enlisting. The dad, Lee, was so proud of them he was buying drinks for everyone saying how lucky he was. While you and many others paint a picture of duped soldiers forced into duty they don't want - I haven't seen it yet.


On the other hand, those killed in the aspirin factory blast didn't sign up with our troops - but it was a nice distraction from an impeachment, wasn't it?

Frankie
09-17-2004, 11:14 AM
I met two of the troops and their father last night. Alex and Aaron Murphy (twins) just got back from a 5 month stint direct in Baghdad. They are shipping back out tomorrow for another 3 months. Then both young men are re-enlisting. The dad, Lee, was so proud of them he was buying drinks for everyone saying how lucky he was. While you and many others paint a picture of duped soldiers forced into duty they don't want - I haven't seen it yet.


On the other hand, those killed in the aspirin factory blast didn't sign up with our troops - but it was a nice distraction from an impeachment, wasn't it?

I have no doubt that some folks consider it patriotism to unquestioningly obey orders and follow what "their country" wants them to do. Some even do not distinguish between country's wishes and president's wishes. I don't agree with the notion of prez=country. I do however respect them too. In my post I said not "all" but "a lot of" folks signed up in reaction to 9/11. I have heard, on at least 5 different occasions troups calling radio talk shows complaining that they signed up to fight against Osama and terrorism only to be sent to Iraq where they don't believe they are fighting a war they signed up for. Though, I have this strange feeling that soon we will probably see Osama "captured" "IN IRAQ" and "under the protection of the insurgents!" ;) Depending on the polls in the next few weeks.

KCWolfman
09-17-2004, 11:44 AM
I have no doubt that some folks consider it patriotism to unquestioningly obey orders and follow what "their country" wants them to do. Some even do not distinguish between country's wishes and president's wishes. I don't agree with the notion of prez=country. I do however respect them too. In my post I said not "all" but "a lot of" folks signed up in reaction to 9/11. I have heard, on at least 5 different occasions troups calling radio talk shows complaining that they signed up to fight against Osama and terrorism only to be sent to Iraq where they don't believe they are fighting a war they signed up for. Though, I have this strange feeling that soon we will probably see Osama "captured" "IN IRAQ" and "under the protection of the insurgents!" ;) Depending on the polls in the next few weeks.
I never stated they were unquestioningly obeying orders. Where did you get that idea?

As far as the second part of your post, again I address the fact that several dozen arrests were made all over the world (including in New York State) during the last terror alert - something you conspiracy theorists tend to overlook.

Radar Chief
09-17-2004, 11:48 AM
I never stated they were unquestioningly obeying orders. Where did you get that idea?


He needs that to be true in order to maintain his rhetoric.

KCWolfman
09-17-2004, 11:49 AM
He needs that to be true in order to maintain his rhetoric.
Damn I love your signature. Rep again.

mlyonsd
09-17-2004, 11:52 AM
I have no doubt that some folks consider it patriotism to unquestioningly obey orders and follow what "their country" wants them to do. Some even do not distinguish between country's wishes and president's wishes. I don't agree with the notion of prez=country. I do however respect them too. In my post I said not "all" but "a lot of" folks signed up in reaction to 9/11. I have heard, on at least 5 different occasions troups calling radio talk shows complaining that they signed up to fight against Osama and terrorism only to be sent to Iraq where they don't believe they are fighting a war they signed up for. Though, I have this strange feeling that soon we will probably see Osama "captured" "IN IRAQ" and "under the protection of the insurgents!" ;) Depending on the polls in the next few weeks.

What you fail to admit to yourself is that these troops that "unquestioningly obey orders" are doing so because they agree with them.

They know they are doing the right thing in Iraq and prove it by volunteering to go back, even with the understanding they are going into harms way.

I'll trust the take of the soldiers....they see what's going on there more then our media is letting us see.

Radar Chief
09-17-2004, 11:53 AM
Damn I love your signature. Rep again.

ROFL Well, lets just call it a rep love fest. Heres some back for posting something so quotable. :thumb:

Mr. Kotter
09-17-2004, 11:57 AM
....we will probably see Osama "captured" "IN IRAQ" and "under the protection of the insurgents!" ;) Depending on the polls in the next few weeks.

And won't that be a GREAT day? :thumb:



Sad thing is I suspect for you, it won't be a great day--just another day to curse GW. :shake:

KCWolfman
09-17-2004, 12:00 PM
What you fail to admit to yourself is that these troops that "unquestioningly obey orders" are doing so because they agree with them.

They know they are doing the right thing in Iraq and prove it by volunteering to go back, even with the understanding they are going into harms way.

I'll trust the take of the soldiers....they see what's going on there more then our media is letting us see.
Precisely what Aaron and Alex said. They are IN Baghdad, they see what is going on daily. They both said they KNOW they are doing the right thing by watching the results of their efforts. They should not be belittled by someone sitting comfortably over here and alluding to the idea that they are mindless drones.

mlyonsd
09-17-2004, 12:04 PM
And won't that be a GREAT day? :thumb:



Sad thing is I suspect for you, it won't be a great day--just another day to curse GW. :shake:

It should be anyday now. I hear rumors that he's locked up in the bathroom off of Rumsfield's office and Rummy is getting tired of having to walk down the hall to use the public facilties.

mlyonsd
09-17-2004, 12:07 PM
Precisely what Aaron and Alex said. They are IN Baghdad, they see what is going on daily. They both said they KNOW they are doing the right thing by watching the results of their efforts. They should not be belittled by someone sitting comfortably over here and alluding to the idea that they are mindless drones.

It's comforting to know guys like that still exist in America. I can see why their dad was so proud.

Class acts.

Frankie
09-17-2004, 01:07 PM
I never stated they were unquestioningly obeying orders. Where did you get that idea?

As far as the second part of your post, again I address the fact that several dozen arrests were made all over the world (including in New York State) during the last terror alert - something you conspiracy theorists tend to overlook.

And I never questioned that they believe they are doing the right thing. As for arrests, I would think anytime there is a move in that direction, there ARE some suspects under surveilance ready to be promptly picked up. That gives the "terror alert" some aparent substance.

Kraut
09-17-2004, 01:10 PM
And I never questioned that they believe they are doing the right thing. As for arrests, I would think anytime there is a move in that direction, there ARE some suspects under surveilance ready to be promptly picked up. That gives the "terror alert" some aparent substance.
But if Kerry was president his arrests would be straight up ? Nothing done for the publicity?

Frankie
09-17-2004, 01:10 PM
And won't that be a GREAT day? :thumb:

Sad thing is I suspect for you, it won't be a great day--just another day to curse GW. :shake:

If my theory proves true (r.e. "capture of Osama IN IRAQ") then I firmly believe that my "GREAT day" cane some 2 and a half years ago at Tora Bora.

Frankie
09-17-2004, 01:13 PM
But if Kerry was president his arrests would be straight up ? Nothing done for the publicity?

Then I would have no problem bitching about him the same way. Trust me. :thumb:

Kraut
09-17-2004, 01:14 PM
Then I would have no problem bitching about him the same way. Trust me. :thumb:
Im gonna be a prick here and say do you have strong proof that the arrests made during terror alerts are staged?

Frankie
09-17-2004, 01:27 PM
Im gonna be a prick here and say do you have strong proof that the arrests made during terror alerts are staged?

Didn't say "staged," Kraut. It's just that in ongoing investigations there are always "usual suspects." Small fish who, for a while, serve a better purpose being watched than arrested. And they can be picked up at any time.

Iowanian
09-17-2004, 01:31 PM
What a BRILLIANT epiphany Franie.......

I mean....approaching the election, when Terrorists have committed acts of terrorism in other countries to try to swing an election.............

There wouldn't probably be any reason at all to expect, that Homeland Security might also Suspect, the a-holes would wish to do something here..........


Bush is going to wipe his backside with Kerry Nov 2.

WilliamTheIrish
09-17-2004, 01:41 PM
Didn't say "staged," Kraut. It's just that in ongoing investigations there are always "usual suspects." Small fish who, for a while, serve a better purpose being watched than arrested. And they can be picked up at any time.

In order to catch the 'big fish', doesn't an intelligence agency naturally have to watch the 'little fish'? Play them? Feed them some worms(disinformation)?

You have simplified the game of international islamofacist espionage down to a game of CLUE.

I never knew it was all so simple.

Kraut
09-17-2004, 01:42 PM
Didn't say "staged," Kraut. It's just that in ongoing investigations there are always "usual suspects." Small fish who, for a while, serve a better purpose being watched than arrested. And they can be picked up at any time.
But it is those small fish who run truck bombs into embassies, US Naval ships, or US buildings.

KCWolfman
09-17-2004, 03:07 PM
And I never questioned that they believe they are doing the right thing. As for arrests, I would think anytime there is a move in that direction, there ARE some suspects under surveilance ready to be promptly picked up. That gives the "terror alert" some aparent substance.
Hardly a basis in fact. Which most conspiracy theories severely lack.

KCWolfman
09-17-2004, 03:09 PM
Didn't say "staged," Kraut. It's just that in ongoing investigations there are always "usual suspects." Small fish who, for a while, serve a better purpose being watched than arrested. And they can be picked up at any time.
Small fish with detailed plans of buildings on Wall Street and attempting to purchase bazooka style equipment?

You are stretching reality with that theory.

Cochise
09-17-2004, 03:12 PM
Small fish with detailed plans of buildings on Wall Street and attempting to purchase bazooka style equipment?

You are stretching reality with that theory.

Besides, everyone knows Islamofacists don't commit terror acts. Crankie told me so. It's just bad fuel. Just like those two Russian airliners that crashed at the same time totally by coincidence. Hell the 4 that crashed on 9/11 probably all got bad fuel too. There is a perfectly reasonable explaination for all this that still makes Bush teh debbil, you know. :harumph:

Calcountry
09-17-2004, 03:38 PM
Conspiracy theorists are funny.


Nevermind that multiple worldwide arrests were made during the last alert - facts and details are the devil's advocate when it comes to wacko premises.
Hey, It's Frankie...

Calcountry
09-17-2004, 03:52 PM
I have no doubt that some folks consider it patriotism to unquestioningly obey orders and follow what "their country" wants them to do. Some even do not distinguish between country's wishes and president's wishes. I don't agree with the notion of prez=country. I do however respect them too. In my post I said not "all" but "a lot of" folks signed up in reaction to 9/11. I have heard, on at least 5 different occasions troups calling radio talk shows complaining that they signed up to fight against Osama and terrorism only to be sent to Iraq where they don't believe they are fighting a war they signed up for. Though, I have this strange feeling that soon we will probably see Osama "captured" "IN IRAQ" and "under the protection of the insurgents!" ;) Depending on the polls in the next few weeks.
That would be good politics if it were true.

Here's one for you. How bout, Osama is and has been fertilizing daisys ever since Torah Borah. It was classified so as not to create a martyr spawning 100's of more fanatical Muslim lunatics to follow in his footsteps. Bush does not care about the loss of political capital due to not finding him becuase this is the right thing to do for the security of the country. This also allows the CIA to continue to clandestinely surveil Al Qaeda operatives that have been discovered. This last move would allow the CIA to flush out any that they contact. If they know Osama is dead, they may go into hiding or move on to plan B.


Come on now Frankie, were at war buddy. Its life and death man. Just wait until Bush gets reelected in a landslide with a mandate to more vigorously prosecute the war on radical Muslims.

Donger
09-17-2004, 04:06 PM
Hey, It's Frankie...

"Coming over to play!"

Argh! Thanks. Now it's in my head.

HC_Chief
09-17-2004, 04:13 PM
Osama is and has been fertilizing daisys ever since Torah Borah

The History Channel just did a special on OBL and AQ. Intelligence reports suggest OBL wasn't at Tora Bora... he just escaped into Pakistan before we pounded the area.

If he's still alive, he's in the mountain ranges along the Afghan/Pakistani border. It's a HUGE, mountainous area and he's surrounded by uber-loyal followers. Not surprising we haven't caught him.... yet.

The show was very good - check the website for future broadcasts. In goes into great detail of how he came to be; what we did & did not do to stop him, dating back even to his childhood.

We need to catch him, try him, and stick him in a dank cell with no windows and poor florescent lighting until he croaks. Every few months, plaster his picture, humiliated, sporting an orange jump suit and shackles, on world-wide television. Killing him only makes him a martyr.

Calcountry
09-17-2004, 04:27 PM
The History Channel just did a special on OBL and AQ. Intelligence reports suggest OBL wasn't at Tora Bora... he just escaped into Pakistan before we pounded the area.

If he's still alive, he's in the mountain ranges along the Afghan/Pakistani border. It's a HUGE, mountainous area and he's surrounded by uber-loyal followers. Not surprising we haven't caught him.... yet.

The show was very good - check the website for future broadcasts. In goes into great detail of how he came to be; what we did & did not do to stop him, dating back even to his childhood.

We need to catch him, try him, and stick him in a dank cell with no windows and poor florescent lighting until he croaks. Every few months, plaster his picture, humiliated, sporting an orange jump suit and shackles, on world-wide television. Killing him only makes him a martyr.
Now there is a good one. We put him in a cell like the one in the movie "Silence of the Lambs". Put a web cam on him 24/7.

Then get that rock and Roll part II music playing like when we score a touchdown, run it 24/7 in his cage. Have the families of 9/11 walk arround the top of the cage and urinate on top of him.

Ahh yes, that is a fitting end to Osama jo mama.

Frankie
09-17-2004, 04:54 PM
Besides, everyone knows Islamofacists don't commit terror acts. Crankie told me so. It's just bad fuel. Just like those two Russian airliners that crashed at the same time totally by coincidence. Hell the 4 that crashed on 9/11 probably all got bad fuel too. There is a perfectly reasonable explaination for all this that still makes Bush teh debbil, you know. :harumph:

Chochise,.. that's pure BUllSH!t and you know it. You either never read my posts about that or you are, as common with Bush and his followers, engaging in deliberate misrepresentation. I vote for the latter. I NEVER said what you are implying here. I challenge you to find any definitive post on my part that says what you insideously misquoting me on. And when you don't, I expect you to be man enough to retract. All I said there was that there were no proof (at the time of my posting) that it was done by terrorists. I pointed out the awful history of those planes and the notorious corruption of Russian officials (of which the bad fuel could be a byproduct) does present another couple of scenarios to consider.

Baby Lee
09-17-2004, 05:10 PM
Here's one for you. How bout, Osama is and has been fertilizing daisys ever since Torah Borah. It was classified so as not to create a martyr spawning 100's of more fanatical Muslim lunatics to follow in his footsteps. Bush does not care about the loss of political capital due to not finding him becuase this is the right thing to do for the security of the country. This also allows the CIA to continue to clandestinely surveil Al Qaeda operatives that have been discovered. This last move would allow the CIA to flush out any that they contact. If they know Osama is dead, they may go into hiding or move on to plan B.
I actually saw on bartcop the musing that;
1. The Soviets had deposited suitcase nukes in major US cities in the 60s.
2. Those nukes were still in their hiding places.
3. Al Qeada knows where they are and have dispatched sleepers to cover them.
4. The sleepers are instructed to detonate them xx hours after confirmation of Osama's death.
5. The govt is letting Osama continue to live until they can track down these sleepers and/or suitcase nukes.

Baby Lee
09-17-2004, 05:12 PM
Chochise,.. that's pure BUllSH!t and you know it. You either never read my posts about that or you are, as common with Bush and his followers, engaging in deliberate misrepresentation. I vote for the latter. I NEVER said what you are implying here. I challenge you to find any definitive post on my part that says what you insideously misquoting me on. And when you don't, I expect you to be man enough to retract. All I said there was that there were no proof (at the time of my posting) that it was done by terrorists. I pointed out the awful history of those planes and the notorious corruption of Russian officials (of which the bad fuel could be a byproduct) does present another couple of scenarios to consider.
The tape is somewhere around here. Give him a couple of weeks and he'll limp back and offer a qualified retraction, I'm sure.

Donger
09-17-2004, 05:15 PM
If it were terrorism, by now some group would have claimed responsibility. I think it's just the sucky planes....

Usually, within 24 hrs of any terrorist attack some group takes credit for it. Unless I missed the news about such a report, I would bet comfortably that this was NOT a terrorist attack.

Now, I actually applaud you for not jumping to conclusions.

I remember when that plane went down over Rockaway in November 2001. Everyone freaked out and immediately concluded that it was terrorism. Simple fact: planes crashed before 9/11 and they will continue to do so.

But, two planes crashing at almost exactly the same time? Simple mathematics should have led you to presume that these were NOT accidents. Yet, you chose the less likely assumption.

I wonder why that is.

Cochise
09-17-2004, 05:35 PM
Chochise,.. that's pure BUllSH!t and you know it. You either never read my posts about that or you are, as common with Bush and his followers, engaging in deliberate misrepresentation. I vote for the latter. I NEVER said what you are implying here. I challenge you to find any definitive post on my part that says what you insideously misquoting me on. And when you don't, I expect you to be man enough to retract. All I said there was that there were no proof (at the time of my posting) that it was done by terrorists. I pointed out the awful history of those planes and the notorious corruption of Russian officials (of which the bad fuel could be a byproduct) does present another couple of scenarios to consider.

hyperbole (h-prb-l) n. - A figure of speech in which exaggeration is used for emphasis or effect, as in "I could sleep for a year" or "This book weighs a ton."

But anyway, while you're pondering that most modern literary convention, I'll set a reminder in my palm pilot to come back in 2 weeks and offer a half-assed not-really retraction.

**edit - damn, Baby Lee beat me to it.

Calcountry
09-17-2004, 05:51 PM
I actually saw on bartcop the musing that;
1. The Soviets had deposited suitcase nukes in major US cities in the 60s.
2. Those nukes were still in their hiding places.
3. Al Qeada knows where they are and have dispatched sleepers to cover them.
4. The sleepers are instructed to detonate them xx hours after confirmation of Osama's death.
5. The govt is letting Osama continue to live until they can track down these sleepers and/or suitcase nukes.
Bottom line, who do you trust more with the "top secrets" that must be kept in order to secure the country? Kerry, who would sell out his own brother vets to advance a political career, or George W Bush who has removed two sets of Talliband whacker regimes that have supported terrorists that have struck us.

Yes, Abu Nidal had struck American Interests. Salmon Pak was used to train terrorists how to hijack planes. Yes Sodamn insane paid terrorists to blow up themselves in Israel. He is gone, the Tallywhackers are gone, the world is safer. Who's next?

Cntrygal
09-18-2004, 11:01 AM
:hmmm: It's easy to believe that it's easy to miss seeing someone at a NFL game, state fair or amusement park.... but it's difficult to believe that a group of guys wanting to stay hidden in an uncontrolled environment over a large area can't be found. Intresting.

Frankie
09-18-2004, 03:59 PM
....
But, two planes crashing at almost exactly the same time? Simple mathematics should have led you to presume that these were NOT accidents. Yet, you chose the less likely assumption.

I wonder why that is.

If they had indeed drunk the same 'bad' fuel, it would not have been the less likely assuption. I did not choose one assumption over another. I just pointed out that there were a couple of alternate possibilities and we wouldn't know until the evidence came out. Seems I, as usual, was the only one making the logical argument at the time on that subject, when everyone was absolutely sure, without evidence, that it was terrorism.

Brock
09-18-2004, 04:11 PM
[Seems I, as usual, was the only one making the logical argument at the time on that subject, when everyone was absolutely sure, without evidence, that it was terrorism.

You, as usual, were wrong.