I Hate These Guys! : Video on Web Site Shows Beheading of Man

[Hel'n]

Sep 20, 4:34 PM (ET)

By BASSEM MROUE


BAGHDAD, Iraq (AP) - A video posted Monday on a Web site showed the beheading of a man identified as American construction contractor Eugene Armstrong. The militant group led by Abu Musab al-Zarqawi claimed responsiblity for the slaying and said another hostage - either an American or a Briton - would be killed in 24 hours.

In other violence, gunmen in Baghdad assassinated two clerics from a powerful Sunni Muslim group opposed to the U.S. presence in Iraq.

U.S. warplanes struck in the insurgent stronghold of Fallujah, killing two people, and a car bomb in the north - the 32nd car bomb in Iraq this month - killed three people. Insurgents attacked a U.S. patrol, killing an American soldier, near Sharqat, 168 miles north of Baghdad.

The video of the beheading surfaced soon after the expiration of a 48-hour deadline set earlier by al-Zarqawi's Tawhid and Jihad group for the beheading of the three employees of a construction company abducted Thursday in Baghdad - Armstrong, American Jack Hensley and Briton Kenneth Bigley.

A militant whose voice resembled al-Zarqawi read a statement in the video saying the next hostage would be killed in 24 hours unless all Muslim women prisoners are released from U.S. military jails.

"You, sister, rejoice. God's soldiers are coming to get you out of your chains and restore your purity by returning you to your mother and father," he said before grabbing the hostage, seated at his feet, and cutting his throat.

In Washington, a U.S. official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said Armstrong's body had been recovered, but the official would provide no information about where or when it had been recovered.

The taped beheading appears to be of Armstrong, but the CIA is still reviewing the tape to be sure, the official said.

The 9-minute tape, posted on a Web site used by Islamic militants, showed a man seated on the floor, blindfolded and wearing an orange jumpsuit with his hands bound behind his back. Five militants dressed in black stood behind him, four of them armed with assault rifles, with a black Tawhid and Jihad banner on the wall.

The militant in the center read out a statement, as the hostage rocked back and forth and side to side where he sat. After finishing, the militant pulled a knife and cut his throat until the head was severed.

The victim gasped loudly as blood poured from his neck. His killer held up the head at one point, and placed the head on top of the body

"The fate of the first infidel was cutting off the head before your eyes and ears. You have a 24-hour opportunity. Abide by our demand in full and release all the Muslim women, otherwise the head of the other will follow this one," the speaker said.

Tawhid and Jihad - Arabic for "Monotheism and Holy War" - has claimed responsibility for at least six hostages, including Armstrong and another American, Nicholas Berg, who was abducted in April. The group has also said it is behind a number of bombings and gun attacks.

In a video Saturday setting the 48-hour deadline, the militants demanded the release of female Iraqi prisoners detained by the U.S. military. The military says it is holding two women as security detainees in Iraq, including Dr. Rihab Rashid Taha, a scientist who became known as "Dr. Germ" for helping Iraq make weapons out of anthrax.

The militant on the video called President Bush "a dog" and addressed him, saying, "Now, you have people who love death just like you love life. Killing for the sake of God is their best wish, getting to your soldiers and allies are their happiest moments, and cutting the heads of the criminal infidels is implementing the orders of our lord."

Armstrong grew up in Hillsdale, Mich., but left the area around 1990. His brother, Frank, still lives there. Armstrong's work in construction took him around the world; he lived in Thailand with his wife before going to Iraq.

The other American hostage, Jack Hensley, 48, made his home in Marietta, Ga., with his wife Patty and their 13-year-old daughter. Kidnapped with the Americans was Briton Kenneth Bigley, 62. All three worked for Gulf Services Co. of the United Arab Emirates.

Armstrong's slaying came on the heels of the beheading - apparently by another group of Sunni insurgents - of three Kurdish militiamen taken hostage in the north.

More than 100 foreigners have been kidnapped in Iraq, some for lucrative ransoms, and at least 26 of them have been executed. At least five other Westerners are currently being held hostage here, including an Iraqi-American man, two female Italian aid workers and two French reporters.

Kidnappers released a group of 18 abducted Iraqi National Guard members after renegade Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr called for their release, an al-Sadr aide Nail al-Kabi told The Associated Press.

Earlier, U.S. warplanes struck in Fallujah, where they have frequently attacked hideouts of the Tawhid and Jihad. Doctors reported three people killed. The U.S military said the strike hit equipment militants were using to build fortifications in the city and that care was taken that "no innocent civilians" were there at the time. Doctors said the dead were municipal workers using a bulldozer on construction projects near the railway station.

In the northern city of Mosul, a car packed with explosives blew up in a residential neighborhood, killing its two passengers and a passer-by, police at Al-Salaam hospital said. Police had been searching for the vehicle, which was reported stolen earlier Monday.

It was not immediately known who was behind the gunning-down of two Sunni clerics Sunday night and Monday in Baghdad.

The two clerics belonged to the Association of Muslim Scholars, a grouping of conservative clerics that opposes the U.S. presence in Iraq and has emerged as a powerful representative of Iraq's Sunni minority.

The association is believed to have contacts with Sunni insurgents, though it denies any links with them. It has interceded often in the past to win the release of foreign hostages, and militant groups have asked the association for a religious ruling on whether kidnappings and killing of hostages are permitted.

Gunmen shot and killed Sheik Mohammed Jadoa al-Janabi, a member of the association, as he entered a mosque in Baghdad's predominantly Shiite al-Baya neighborhood to perform noon prayers Monday, the association said.

The previous night, gunmen kidnapped Sheik Hazem al-Zeidi and two of his bodyguards as he left a mosque in another largely Shiite neighborhood of Baghdad, Sadr City. Al-Zeidi was killed and the bodyguards were released Monday, the association said.

A few clerics from the association have been killed in the past - most recently in February. But the motives in those and the latest slayings have been unclear.

There have been tit-for-tat killings of Shiite and Sunni clerics in the past year, widely believed to be motivated by sectarian sentiments.

The Sunni minority dominated Iraq for centuries but is now eclipsed by the Shiite majority and the Kurds, and there are resentments from all sides.

One of the association's key members, Sheik Ahmed Abdul-Ghafour Al-Samarie, may have angered insurgents by criticizing attacks against Iraqi police that left dozens dead last week. Al-Samarie said the attacks should instead be directed against foreign troops - not Iraqi civilians.

The group may have also raised the ire of the militants by failing to act as yet on calls to issue a fatwa, or religious edict, sanctioning the kidnapping of foreigners.

http://apnews.myway.com//article/20040920/D857JTE80.html

[Hel'n]

Did I tell you I really hate these guys?!!!!!! :mad:

Can we find this Abu Musab al-Zarqawi JERK and blow him to smithereens!!!!!!!!

:cuss:

[Raiderhader]

Did I tell you I really hate these guys?!!!!!! :mad:

Can we find this Abu Musab al-Zarqawi JERK and blow him to smithereens!!!!!!!!

:cuss:


NOW you are getting into the spirit of things.


It's time to remove the gloves and and go no holds barred. Open season lads, shoot anything that looks suspicious.

[Duck Dog]

Did I tell you I really hate these guys?!!!!!! :mad:

Can we find this Abu Musab al-Zarqawi JERK and blow him to smithereens!!!!!!!!

:cuss:


Now your thinking like one of the boy's.

I couldn't agree more.

[Hel'n]

Now your thinking like one of the boy's.

I couldn't agree more.

Sorry, old habits die hard.. ;)

That aside, you know I can take a lot of crap... They can protest, they can march, they can sing, they can block roads, they can even take a few potshots now and then as long as they know we'll blow their phooking heads off...

But I can't take this bogus kidnapping/beheading crap. It is barbaric, inhumane, and has nothing to do with anything other than "hate" toward all things American... It's not helping Iraq... and these guys need to be incinerated posthaste...

If we can find them, then take them out... Don't wait for orders...

[Duck Dog]

Sorry, old habits die hard.. ;)

That aside, you know I can take a lot of crap... They can protest, they can march, they can sing, they can block roads, they can even take a few potshots now and then as long as they know we'll blow their phooking heads off...

But I can't take this bogus kidnapping/beheading crap. It is barbaric, inhumane, and has nothing to do with anything other than "hate" toward all things American... It's not helping Iraq... and these guys need to be incinerated posthaste...

If we can find them, then take them out... Don't wait for orders...


Welcome to the 'other' side. It's good to have ya!


OK, joking aside. I agree. That tactic is worthless. They know we will not negotiate with them. The prisoner knows he is in deep shiat, because he too knows he will not be bartered. It's a stupid move by stupid people.

[SBK]

Where's the "Iraq is not part of the war on terror" or "there are no terrorists in Iraq" posts?

[Hel'n]

Where's the "Iraq is not part of the war on terror" or "there are no terrorists in Iraq" posts?

That's not germaine to this discussion... This is about some Al Qaida idiot (who WAS NOT there before we invaded Iraq) having absolutely no scruples or morals in taking civilians hostage and beheading them!

To me, this person, no matter the right or wrong of the war, is completely inhuman and should be slaughtered posthaste...

[SBK]

I say skin em and let him lie with some pigs on tv. That'd be nice.

I was just making the point that for all the no Iraq connection to terror there sure seem to be a lot of terrorist activities going on there.

And I don't care if he wasn't there before we were. We didn't attack Yemen, Saudi Arabia, or Manhattan either and terrorists were there......

[KCWolfman]

Where's the "Iraq is not part of the war on terror" or "there are no terrorists in Iraq" posts?
Abu is Jordanian and wanted dead or alive in his own nation for beheading his own countrymen.

Iraq has been his hiding place for years, regardless of what the liberals say. Iraq is and has been a host nation for terrorists for years.

[KCWolfman]

That's not germaine to this discussion... This is about some Al Qaida idiot (who WAS NOT there before we invaded Iraq) having absolutely no scruples or morals in taking civilians hostage and beheading them!

To me, this person, no matter the right or wrong of the war, is completely inhuman and should be slaughtered posthaste...
Abu has lived in Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, and Syria over the last decade.

[Hel'n]

Abu has lived in Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, and Syria over the last decade.

Then when we find him, they should split him up in enough pieces to share him with those other countries too...

;)

[KCWolfman]

Then when we find him, they should split him up in enough pieces to share him with those other countries too...

;)
I like the sentiment.

But honestly, I would be happy just shooting him quickly and quietly in the head. No martyrdom and no torture - just simple math, eliminate the threat through quick death.

[KC Jones]

That tactic is worthless. They know we will not negotiate with them. The prisoner knows he is in deep shiat, because he too knows he will not be bartered. It's a stupid move by stupid people.

au contraire...

It gets them airtime. It gets them noteriety. It gets them local fame and a seat of power at the table of local insurgents. It gets them on the Al Jazzera network. It gets them more recruits because they are seen as powerful. Plus, if they kidnap someone from another country or the right company, they might make a lot of money off of it.

It's disgusting and wrong, but if they didn't get something from it they wouldn't be doing it.

Part of me just wants to nuke the region and take the oil.

[Slayer]

I like the sentiment.

But honestly, I would be happy just shooting him quickly and quietly in the head. No martyrdom and no torture - just simple math, eliminate the threat through quick death.

I can't believe that...I just can't! I understand that if we torture him, he believes that the longer he holds on, the more virgins he'll get...but we have to be creative and turn all of this into something that will make him suffer. I propose that his executors dress up like his followers, and have a surround sound speaker system set up...as he's getting the living crap beat outta him, a thundering voice from the speakers announces itself as Allah and proclaims that he will be severely punished for killing innocent people. The last thing he hears is: "I SENTENCE YOU TO AN ETERNITY OF DAM*ATION!!!!!" **BANG!**

[memyselfI]

Where's the "Iraq is not part of the war on terror" or "there are no terrorists in Iraq" posts?

They are/there are NOW!!! :cuss: :banghead:

[Mr. Kotter]

They are/there are NOW!!! :cuss: :banghead:

And I'm sure it's all Bush's fault, right; of course, there were NO terrorists in Iraq before Bush took out Sadaam... :rolleyes:

:shake:

[KCWolfman]

They are/there are NOW!!! :cuss: :banghead:
They were there before as well.

Abu has lived extensively in Iraq over the last decade and Saddam is a financial sponsor of homocide bombers.

[memyselfI]

And I'm sure it's all Bush's fault, right; of course, there were NO terrorists in Iraq before Bush took out Sadaam... :rolleyes:

:shake:

There weren't as many or as active...can you name one American or Westerner who was beheaded by terrorists in Iraq prior to the fall of SH?
:hmmm:

[Raiderhader]

I can't believe that...I just can't! I understand that if we torture him, he believes that the longer he holds on, the more virgins he'll get...but we have to be creative and turn all of this into something that will make him suffer. I propose that his executors dress up like his followers, and have a surround sound speaker system set up...as he's getting the living crap beat outta him, a thundering voice from the speakers announces itself as Allah and proclaims that he will be severely punished for killing innocent people. The last thing he hears is: "I SENTENCE YOU TO AN ETERNITY OF DAM*ATION!!!!!" **BANG!**


Slayer, shut up.

[redbrian]

They were there before as well.

Abu has lived extensively in Iraq over the last decade and Saddam is a financial sponsor of homocide bombers.

Come on Saddam is just this guy you know, bush totally misunderstood the whole thing with the kurds and children in prison, if Kerry had been our fearless leader saddam would be our best of buddies today and peace and love would be flowing around the world.

[Mr. Kotter]

There weren't as many or as active...can you name one American or Westerner who was beheaded by terrorists in Iraq prior to the fall of SH?
:hmmm:

Americans and Westerners were NOT IN IRAQ, when SH was in "power." Or have you forgotten...? :shake:

[KCWolfman]

There weren't as many or as active...can you name one American or Westerner who was beheaded by terrorists in Iraq prior to the fall of SH?
:hmmm:
Can you name one American living in Iraq prior to the fall of SH?



I can name hundreds of people killed by terrorists in the Middle East prior to him falling. As far as beheading, how does it matter how they died? Dead is dead the last time I checked.

Also note that Abu is a wanted terrorist from Jordan who has beheaded his own people - so your "I hate Americans, that is why I behead people" analogy is lame.

[memyselfI]

Americans and Westerners were NOT IN IRAQ, when SH was in "power." Or have you forgotten...? :shake:

Oh, so this IS a result of the occupation? :doh!:

[KCWolfman]

Oh, so this IS a result of the occupation? :doh!:
Psst, I heard Americans were killed in Kansas City yesterday, and bones were found on 8th and Paseo today....

I guess that is the result of "occupation"? :rolleyes:

[KCWolfman]

Obviously the horrid terrorists were living in KC as a baby girl beheaded several years ago was killed by the evil bastards.

Damned Occupation West of the Mississippi!!! How can we let this go on?

[Mr. Kotter]

Oh, so this IS a result of the occupation? :doh!:

Occupation....everyone speaks as if it's a terrible thing; we occupied West Germany and Japan for a time following WWII. If the result of this temporary occupation (at the BEHEST of the governing body of Iraq) leads to results similar to those in West Germany and Japan, I'll certainly take it. :thumb:

And it will be the doubting Thomases that say, democracy cannot make it in the ME, who will look really, really silly.... :)

[memyselfI]

And it will be the doubting Thomases that say, democracy cannot make it in the ME, who will look really, really silly.... :)

Ah, those who believed the Administrations spin...they'll look mighty foolish after the US premature evacuates sometime next year as they are planning per Robert Novak. ROFL

http://www.scitech.org.au/toys/spinning_top.jpg

[KC Jones]

Come on Saddam is just this guy you know, bush totally misunderstood the whole thing with the kurds and children in prison, if Kerry had been our fearless leader saddam would be our best of buddies today and peace and love would be flowing around the world.

Reagan was in office when the Kurds were gassed. The gassing of the kurds never became important to anyone in the republican (or democratic) party until there were other (valid) reasons to oppose Saddam. Now that it's become a talking point to defend/attack a policy/candidate, it seems like everyone can't shed enough tears for those kurds.

The fact is, we wouldn't give two shits about the kurds or children in Iraq except that there were other reasons to want Saddam out. Let's just stick with those reasons instead of trying to use the tragedies the Kurds endured for political cover.

[memyselfI]

Obviously the horrid terrorists were living in KC as a baby girl beheaded several years ago was killed by the evil bastards.

Damned Occupation West of the Mississippi!!! How can we let this go on?

Guess it's not just an evil Muslim problem afterall. :thumb: Great job.

[KCWolfman]

Guess it's not just an evil Muslim problem afterall. :thumb: Great job.
There are no Muslims in Kansas City?

Damn, you need to help the detectives locate this killer. You are obviously much smarter than they are.

[memyselfI]

Reagan was in office when the Kurds were gassed. The gassing of the kurds never became important to anyone in the republican (or democratic) party until there were other (valid) reasons to oppose Saddam. Now that it's become a talking point to defend/attack a policy/candidate, it seems like everyone can't shed enough tears for those kurds.

The fact is, we wouldn't give two shits about the kurds or children in Iraq except that there were other reasons to want Saddam out. Let's just stick with those reasons instead of trying to use the tragedies the Kurds endured for political cover.

ah, you forgot the Kurds live across town from the oil. ;)

[Mr. Kotter]

Ah, those who believed the Administrations spin...they'll look mighty foolish after the US premature evacuates sometime next year as they are planning per Robert Novak. ROFL

http://www.scitech.org.au/toys/spinning_top.jpg

Robert Novak is a columnist speculating about the future...as pointed out in earlier threads, there is NO evidence coming from the administration that this will happen as he suggests.

Novak has always disliked the Bush WH; just because he's a conservative, gives him no more credibility than you left wingers give Zell for being a Democrat in his criticism of Kerry.

[memyselfI]

Robert Novak is a columnist speculating about the future...as pointed out in earlier threads, there is NO evidence coming from the administration that this will happen as he suggests.

Novak has always disliked the Bush WH; just because he's a conservative, gives him no more credibility than you left wingers give Zell for being a Democrat in his criticism of Kerry.

o-k. ROFL

[redbrian]

Reagan was in office when the Kurds were gassed. The gassing of the kurds never became important to anyone in the republican (or democratic) party until there were other (valid) reasons to oppose Saddam. Now that it's become a talking point to defend/attack a policy/candidate, it seems like everyone can't shed enough tears for those kurds.

The fact is, we wouldn't give two shits about the kurds or children in Iraq except that there were other reasons to want Saddam out. Let's just stick with those reasons instead of trying to use the tragedies the Kurds endured for political cover.

Settle down chief, I’m sorry you missed the sarcasm and the literary illusion ( probably a little to vague on my part).

[KCWolfman]

Reagan was in office when the Kurds were gassed. The gassing of the kurds never became important to anyone in the republican (or democratic) party until there were other (valid) reasons to oppose Saddam. Now that it's become a talking point to defend/attack a policy/candidate, it seems like everyone can't shed enough tears for those kurds.

The fact is, we wouldn't give two shits about the kurds or children in Iraq except that there were other reasons to want Saddam out. Let's just stick with those reasons instead of trying to use the tragedies the Kurds endured for political cover.
By the opposite side of the same coin, let's not act as those beheaded would not be killed by terrorists in some other fashion in some other place. Duhnise's tenacious reasoning that death is occurring solely because of occupation is using the exact same crocodile tears.

[KC Jones]

Settle down chief, I’m sorry you missed the sarcasm and the literary illusion ( probably a little to vague on my part).

uh ... I've been known to lose my sense of humor from time to time.

:)

[Slayer]

Occupation....everyone speaks as if it's a terrible thing; we occupied West Germany and Japan for a time following WWII. If the result of this temporary occupation (at the BEHEST of the governing body of Iraq) leads to results similar to those in West Germany and Japan, I'll certainly take it. :thumb:

And it will be the doubting Thomases that say, democracy cannot make it in the ME, who will look really, really silly.... :)

They would have to live without their own military for a long time...and when we allow them to have one, who's going to train them? Us? I don't think I'd want their soldiers trained like/by ours...too evenly matched if they ever revolt. As for democracy in the Middle East...yes, it can and will work, but either every surrounding hostile country will have to step down as a threat or they'll--eventually--have to have a military that's not ours.

[KC Jones]

By the opposite side of the same coin, let's not act as those beheaded would not be killed by terrorists in some other fashion in some other place. Duhnise's tenacious reasoning that death is occurring solely because of occupation is using the exact same crocodile tears.

I'm not sure their the same coin, but regardless...

The blame for those murders lies solely at the feet of the murderers themselves. As for the victims, at this point I'd have to think that any more contractors going over there are aware of the dangers.

[redbrian]

uh ... I've been known to lose my sense of humor from time to time.

:)


No problem, it was not one of my best pieces of work (which is more often the case than not, according to my wife, I’m not as witty as I think I am).

[DanT]

Just saw this story from last October 31 on the web:

http://www.msnbc.com/news/986615.asp?0cv=CA01&cp1=1



http://www.msnbc.com/news/986615.asp?0cv=CA01&cp1=1

$25 million reward
for terror figure
sharply cut, or not


No explanation for flipflop on bounty
for man said to be part of Iraq attacks


By Alex Johnson
MSNBC



Oct. 31 — An extraordinary $25 million reward for a Jordanian believed by U.S. officials to be the leading al-Qaida figure operating inside Iraq was quietly downgraded to $5 million Thursday. Then, just as mysteriously, it was restored to $25 million on Friday.

FOR TWO DAYS, the man, Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, 38, had been one of only five men for whom the State Department’s Rewards for Justice program had offered the special bounty, which was posted on Tuesday. Al-Zarqawi, whose real name is Ahmad Fadhil al-Khalayleh, briefly joined only Saddam Hussein, Osama bin Laden and bin Laden’s two deputies, Ayman al Zawahiri and Saif al-Adil, on that elite list.
The Rewards for Justice program is managed by the State Department’s Diplomatic Security Service and the FBI. Thursday, its Web site was offering only $5 million for information leading to al-Zarqawi’s capture. Almost two dozen figures are on that less exclusive list.
The reason for the change remained unclear. The posting offered no explanation for the downgraded reward, or even a notice that it had been changed. A spokesman for the State Department would tell MSNBC.com Thursday night only that officials were looking into the amount that could be paid. He did not elaborate.
By Friday, the $25 million reward was restored. Again, there was no explanation or notice of the change, which the chief State Department spokesman, Richard Boucher, apparently did not know about. He referred to the posting at the department’s daily news briefing Friday as “a standing reward of up to $5 million.”

‘WE REALLY WANT THIS GUY’
Earlier this week, when the top reward was posted for al-Zarqawi, a U.S. official speaking to NBC News on condition of anonymity indicated that al-Zarqawi was a top priority.
“We really want this guy,” the official said, adding that the U.S. intelligence community was not certain where he was operating but that he appeared to move frequently between Iraq and Iran.
Two others with $5 million rewards on their heads, Fazul Abdullah Mohammed and Imad Mugniyah, are seen by U.S. intelligence as terrorist masterminds.





Mohammed is believed to be the leader of the cell that carried out the East Africa embassy bombings in August 1998, and Mugniyah is believed to be the military commander of Hizballah and responsible for planning the embassy and Marine barracks bombings in Beirut, Lebanon, in April and October 1983.
Al-Zarqawi is believed to be a member of both al-Qaida and Ansar al-Islam, U.S. officials said.
Al-Zarqawi, a longtime follower of bin Laden’s, was severely wounded and lost a leg in the U.S. attacks on Afghanistan last year. He reportedly received medical attention in Baghdad after escaping from Afghanistan through Iran.
In the wanted poster on the government’s Web site, Zarqawi is described as having had “a long-standing connection to senior al-Qaida leadership and appears to be highly regarded among al-Qaida and a close associate of Usama bin Laden and Saif al-Adil,” al-Qaida’s military commander.



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CITED BY POWELL
U.S. intelligence officials believe al-Zarqawi planned and helped execute the assassination of Laurence Foley, an official of the U.S. Agency for International Development, in Amman, Jordan, last October.
Before the Iraq war, he gained notoriety when administration officials, including Secretary of State Colin Powell in a speech Feb. 5 to the United Nations, cited his ability to get medical attention in Baghdad as evidence of a connection between Iraq and al-Qaida.
That belief was not shared by all in the intelligence community, and congressional investigators have subsequently cast doubt on the quality of the information about Iraq gathered by the administration ahead of the war. For example, the failure to find weapons of mass destruction in the past six months has hurt the credibility of the government’s case at home and abroad.
Al-Zarqawi’s network also was reported to have established a poisons and explosives training camp in Kurdish-controlled northwestern Iraq before the war.
He was indicted in absentia in Jordan for his role in al-Qaida’s Millennium bombing plot targeting the Radisson SAS hotel in Amman, as well as other U.S., Israeli and Christian religious sites in Jordan.

[DanT]

Here's another old article, this one from July:

http://www.turkishpress.com/turkishpress/news.asp?ID=22492


Zarqawi Places 285,000-dollar Bounty On Iraq P.M.'s Head: Website
AFP: 7/18/2004

DUBAI, July 17 (AFP) - Abu Mussab al-Zarqawi, the fugitive Jordanian Islamist who has a 25-million-dollar US bounty on his head, offered a reward of his own for anyone who kills Iraq's pro-US prime minister, in a statement posted on an Islamist website Sunday.

"The Khalid ibn Al-Walid Brigade announces to the Iraqi people a reward of 200,000 Jordanian dinars (285,000 dollars) for the one who cuts the head of (Iyad) Allawi," said the statement.

It was signed in the name of the "military wing" of Zarqawi's Tawhid wa al-Jihad (Unification and Holy War) group.

"In the unit of candidates for martyrs, we promise before God to kill you ... and those of your clique wanted by Sheikh Abu Mussab al-Zarqawi," said the statement posted at http://www.ansarnet.ws/vb/showthread.php?t=11781.

Its authenticity could not be verified.

Several previous threats to kill Allawi have been issued in Zarqawi's name. The premier's Iraqi National Accord (INA) party had close connections with the US Central Intelligence Agency before Saddam Hussein's ouster.

A July 14 statement said: "Allawi, if you escaped the missiles of death that destroyed your house, there are other missiles ready."

That was presumably a reference to a July 7 mortar attack on the INA's offices and his residence close to Baghdad's heavily fortified city-centre administrative compound.

US aircraft pounded a house in western Iraqi town of Fallujah Sunday which they said was the suspected hideout of some 25 supporters of Zarqawi.

[Hel'n]

And I'm sure it's all Bush's fault, right; of course, there were NO terrorists in Iraq before Bush took out Sadaam... :rolleyes:

:shake:

Your statement is basically accurate. There was a terrorist group supporting insurgency in Iran, based in Iraq... Outside of that, there was nothing else...

[Joe Seahawk]

Your statement is basically accurate. There was a terrorist group supporting insurgency in Iran, based in Iraq... Outside of that, there was nothing else...

I guess the Baath party is not a terrorist party in your eyes then eh?

You say there was nothing else.. That is idiotic to assume..:shake:

Use your brain ..

[Hel'n]

I guess the Baath party is not a terrorist party in your eyes then eh?

You say there was nothing else.. That is idiotic to assume..:shake:

Use your brain ..

I stay focused on WHO attacked US...

The Baath party did NOT attack us nor did they destroy the WTC...

Iraq was not involved in 9/11 nor in exporting terrorism, except wit paying the families of the homicide bombers, and with keeping Iran on their toes by supporting the terrorists/insurgency there...

Anything else is reaching for an excuse...

[Joe Seahawk]

I stay focused on WHO attacked US...

The Baath party did NOT attack us nor did they destroy the WTC...

Iraq was not involved in 9/11 nor in exporting terrorism, except wit paying the families of the homicide bombers, and with keeping Iran on their toes by supporting the terrorists/insurgency there...

Anything else is reaching for an excuse...

Never mind the nazis, Japan attacked us...

Use your brain, these people are seeking innocent people to behead to send a statement saying they do not like us interfering with their goal of killing all infidels, Women, children, you if they could...

Sorry Helen..I don't care who they are , they need to die because they are flat out evil.

Here's an article to remind you of how F'd up these wastes of flesh are..

http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/28066.htm

[Mr. Kotter]

Never mind the nazis, Japan attacked us...

Use your brain, these people are seeking innocent people to behead to send a statement saying they do not like us interfering with their goal of killing all infidels, Women, children, you if they could...

Sorry Helen..I don't care who they are , they need to die because they are flat out evil.

Here's an article to remind you of how F'd up these wastes of flesh are..

http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/28066.htm


GREAT Article, Joe... :clap:

Here it is for those who didn't bother to click, and would have missed out... Or for those whom will choose to ignore it, because of their ideological fanaticism. :shake:




WHEN THE KILLERS COME FOR THE KIDS

BY RALPH PETERS
---------------------------------------------------------------------

Email Archives
Print Reprint

September 4, 2004 -- THE mass murder of children revolts the human psyche. Herod sending his henchmen to massacre the infants of Bethlehem haunts the Gospels. Nothing in our time was crueler than what the Germans did to children during the Holocaust. Slaughtering the innocents violates a universal human taboo.

Or a nearly universal one. Those Muslims who preach Jihad against the West decided years ago that killing Jewish or Christian children is not only acceptable, but pleasing to their god when done by "martyrs."

It isn't politically correct to say this, of course. We're supposed to pretend that Islam is a "religion of peace." All right, then: It's time for Muslims to stand up for the once-noble, nearly lost traditions of their faith and condemn what Arab and Chechen terrorists and blasphemers did in the Russian town of Beslan.

If Muslim religious leaders around the world will not publicly condemn the taking of children as hostages and their subsequent slaughter — if those "men of faith" will not issue a condemnation without reservations or caveats — then no one need pretend any longer that all religions are equally sound and moral.

Islam has been a great and humane faith in the past. Now far too many of its adherents condone, actively or passively, the mass murder of school kids. Instead of condemnations of the Muslim "Jihadis" responsible for butchering more than 200 women and children in cold blood, we will hear spiteful counter-accusations about imaginary atrocities supposedly committed by Western militaries.

Well, the cold fact is that Western soldiers, whether Americans, Brits, Russians or Israelis, do not take hundreds of children hostage, then shoot them in cold blood while detonating bombs in their midst. The Muslim world can lie to itself, but we need lie no longer.

The tragedy in southern Russia occurred thousands of miles from the United States, but, in essence, that massacre happened next door. The parents, teachers and students kept for days without water or food in a sweltering school building before being butchered were our children, our sisters, our wives, our parents.

The mass hostage situation wasn't about Chechen rebels (and at least 10 Arabs) opposing the Russian government. It was a continuation of the universal struggle between good and evil. And there is no doubt which side is evil, scorned though the word may be by our own elite.

How can any human being with a shred of conscience dismiss what occurred in that school as anything less than evil?

The attack in Beslan wasn't about Russia's brutal incompetence in Chechnya — as counter-productive as Moscow's grim heavy-handedness may have been. It was about religious bigotry so profound that the believer can hold a gun to a child's head, pull the trigger and term the act "divine justice."

We will hear complaints that the Russian special forces should have waited — even after the terrorists began shooting children. Negotiations are the heroin of Westerners addicted to self-delusion. Who among us would have waited when he or she saw fleeing children cut down by automatic weapons? The urge to protect children is as primal as any impulse we ever feel.

Make no mistake: No blame attaches to the Russians for the massacre at that school. The guilt is entirely upon the Islamic extremists who have led the religion they claim to cherish into the realms of nightmare.

There will be repercussions. Having suffered the hijacking and destruction of two passenger jets, a deadly bombing at a Moscow subway station and a massacre in a primary school all in less than two weeks, the Kremlin will have learned to rue the day it imagined that there was anything to gain by opposing American efforts against terrorists, whether Osama bin Laden or Saddam Hussein.

As they inevitably do, the terrorists reminded the world of their heartless barbarism. Even if France manages to beg the release of its kidnapped journalists in Iraq, it has begun to sense its vulnerability. And all Europeans with a vestige of sense will recognize that the school seizure in Russia could easily repeat itself in Languedoc or Umbria, Bavaria or Kent.

An attack on children is an attack on all of humanity.

No matter what differences Western states discover to divide them, the terrorists will bring us together in the end. Their atrocities expose all wishful thinking for what it is.

A final thought: Did any of those protesters who came to Manhattan to denounce our liberation of 50 million Muslims stay an extra day to protest the massacre in Russia? Of course not.

The protesters no more care for dead Russian children than they care for dead Kurds or for the hundreds of thousands of Arabs that Saddam Hussein executed. Or for the ongoing Arab-Muslim slaughter of blacks in Sudan. Nothing's a crime to those protesters unless the deed was committed by America.

The butchery in Russia was a crime against humanity. In every respect. Was any war ever more necessary or just than the War on Terror?

And what will terror's apologists say when the killers come for their own children?

Ralph Peters is the author of "Beyond Terror: Strategy in a Changing World."

Back to: Post Opinion | Editorials | Oped Columnists | Letters | Books | Home
----------------------------------------------------------------------

NEW YORK POST is a registered trademark of NYP Holdings, Inc. NYPOST.COM, NYPOSTONLINE.COM, and NEWYORKPOST.COM
are trademarks of NYP Holdings, Inc. Copyright 2004 NYP Holdings, Inc. All rights reserved.

[Mr. Kotter]

GREAT Article, Joe... :clap:

Here it is for those who didn't bother to click, and would have missed out... Or for those whom will choose to ignore it, because of their ideological fanaticism. :shake:




WHEN THE KILLERS COME FOR THE KIDS

BY RALPH PETERS
---------------------------------------------------------------------

Email Archives
Print Reprint

September 4, 2004 -- THE mass murder of children revolts the human psyche. Herod sending his henchmen to massacre the infants of Bethlehem haunts the Gospels. Nothing in our time was crueler than what the Germans did to children during the Holocaust. Slaughtering the innocents violates a universal human taboo.

Or a nearly universal one. Those Muslims who preach Jihad against the West decided years ago that killing Jewish or Christian children is not only acceptable, but pleasing to their god when done by "martyrs."

It isn't politically correct to say this, of course. We're supposed to pretend that Islam is a "religion of peace." All right, then: It's time for Muslims to stand up for the once-noble, nearly lost traditions of their faith and condemn what Arab and Chechen terrorists and blasphemers did in the Russian town of Beslan.

If Muslim religious leaders around the world will not publicly condemn the taking of children as hostages and their subsequent slaughter — if those "men of faith" will not issue a condemnation without reservations or caveats — then no one need pretend any longer that all religions are equally sound and moral.

Islam has been a great and humane faith in the past. Now far too many of its adherents condone, actively or passively, the mass murder of school kids. Instead of condemnations of the Muslim "Jihadis" responsible for butchering more than 200 women and children in cold blood, we will hear spiteful counter-accusations about imaginary atrocities supposedly committed by Western militaries.

Well, the cold fact is that Western soldiers, whether Americans, Brits, Russians or Israelis, do not take hundreds of children hostage, then shoot them in cold blood while detonating bombs in their midst. The Muslim world can lie to itself, but we need lie no longer.

The tragedy in southern Russia occurred thousands of miles from the United States, but, in essence, that massacre happened next door. The parents, teachers and students kept for days without water or food in a sweltering school building before being butchered were our children, our sisters, our wives, our parents.

The mass hostage situation wasn't about Chechen rebels (and at least 10 Arabs) opposing the Russian government. It was a continuation of the universal struggle between good and evil. And there is no doubt which side is evil, scorned though the word may be by our own elite.

How can any human being with a shred of conscience dismiss what occurred in that school as anything less than evil?

The attack in Beslan wasn't about Russia's brutal incompetence in Chechnya — as counter-productive as Moscow's grim heavy-handedness may have been. It was about religious bigotry so profound that the believer can hold a gun to a child's head, pull the trigger and term the act "divine justice."

We will hear complaints that the Russian special forces should have waited — even after the terrorists began shooting children. Negotiations are the heroin of Westerners addicted to self-delusion. Who among us would have waited when he or she saw fleeing children cut down by automatic weapons? The urge to protect children is as primal as any impulse we ever feel.

Make no mistake: No blame attaches to the Russians for the massacre at that school. The guilt is entirely upon the Islamic extremists who have led the religion they claim to cherish into the realms of nightmare.

There will be repercussions. Having suffered the hijacking and destruction of two passenger jets, a deadly bombing at a Moscow subway station and a massacre in a primary school all in less than two weeks, the Kremlin will have learned to rue the day it imagined that there was anything to gain by opposing American efforts against terrorists, whether Osama bin Laden or Saddam Hussein.

As they inevitably do, the terrorists reminded the world of their heartless barbarism. Even if France manages to beg the release of its kidnapped journalists in Iraq, it has begun to sense its vulnerability. And all Europeans with a vestige of sense will recognize that the school seizure in Russia could easily repeat itself in Languedoc or Umbria, Bavaria or Kent.

An attack on children is an attack on all of humanity.

No matter what differences Western states discover to divide them, the terrorists will bring us together in the end. Their atrocities expose all wishful thinking for what it is.

A final thought: Did any of those protesters who came to Manhattan to denounce our liberation of 50 million Muslims stay an extra day to protest the massacre in Russia? Of course not.

The protesters no more care for dead Russian children than they care for dead Kurds or for the hundreds of thousands of Arabs that Saddam Hussein executed. Or for the ongoing Arab-Muslim slaughter of blacks in Sudan. Nothing's a crime to those protesters unless the deed was committed by America.

The butchery in Russia was a crime against humanity. In every respect. Was any war ever more necessary or just than the War on Terror?

And what will terror's apologists say when the killers come for their own children?

Ralph Peters is the author of "Beyond Terror: Strategy in a Changing World."

Back to: Post Opinion | Editorials | Oped Columnists | Letters | Books | Home
----------------------------------------------------------------------

NEW YORK POST is a registered trademark of NYP Holdings, Inc. NYPOST.COM, NYPOSTONLINE.COM, and NEWYORKPOST.COM
are trademarks of NYP Holdings, Inc. Copyright 2004 NYP Holdings, Inc. All rights reserved.

Thoughts, Deee-niiiissseee?

Or are you hoping this thread just disappears.... :)

[KCWolfman]

Your statement is basically accurate. There was a terrorist group supporting insurgency in Iran, based in Iraq... Outside of that, there was nothing else...
Tell that to the Israeli mothers whose children were killed by homocide bombers funded by Hussein.

[Hel'n]

Tell that to the Israeli mothers whose children were killed by homocide bombers funded by Hussein.

Did we go to Iraq because of the PLO or WMD or AlQaida? You keep changing the premise of the war...

[Mr. Kotter]

Did we go to Iraq because of the PLO or WMD or AlQaida? You keep changing the premise of the war...

We went to war in Iraq for many reasons; the most politically palatable at the time, was WMD...and make no mistake, at the time, nearly EVERYONE (including Dems in Congress--even John Kerry who supported the Resolution giving the President authority to act) thought Sadaam possessed those weapons. Hindsight is 20/20....

Certainly though, there were other reasons for going to war....ending Sadaam's regime, giving Democracy a chance in the ME, and short-term sacrifice to stabilize the region in the long-term among them. Just because the average Joe in the public didn't appreciate and understand these other motives does NOT make them invalid. :shake:

[KCWolfman]

Did we go to Iraq because of the PLO or WMD or AlQaida? You keep changing the premise of the war...
Who said I changed the premise of anything. Your original statement was false. You stated there was no terrorist activity outside of Iran from Iraq.

My premise for the war was simple. The very first time one of our planes was shot upon in 1992 was reason enough to go to war. The very fact that Hussein failed to comply with treaty regulations during the ensuing 10 years after was reason enough to sustain it. I honestly don't give a damn about a single WMD, a bullet, or an outdated cold pill. I never have.

When you fire upon the United States, you should be prepared to suffer the consequences for doing so.

[Hel'n]

Who said I changed the premise of anything. Your original statement was false. You stated there was no terrorist activity outside of Iran from Iraq.

My premise for the war was simple. The very first time one of our planes was shot upon in 1992 was reason enough to go to war. The very fact that Hussein failed to comply with treaty regulations during the ensuing 10 years after was reason enough to sustain it. I honestly don't give a damn about a single WMD, a bullet, or an outdated cold pill. I never have.

When you fire upon the United States, you should be prepared to suffer the consequences for doing so.

My mistake about your premise... because I really have never understood your premise... To me it has been changing as the arguments for war and against war change... and I'm a pretty consistent person... I don't change my arguments unless there is new information that proves me wrong and I need to eat crow, or proves me right and I get to gloat...

That said, I've always believed the real reason for the war is to change the balance of power in the Middle East. It was for no other reason than that. An upset in the balance of power in the Middle East changes the dynamics of all the players, including Israel...

While it is an interesting move and has altered the balance of power, I believe the repercussions are going to be quite costly for us and for the Middle East for many years to come...

I think Iran is next. Not with a war. But if we upset the balance of power in Iran, then the factions in Iraq and the factions in Iran that are left are going to be fighting each other for years vying for power...

[KCWolfman]

My mistake about your premise... because I really have never understood your premise... To me it has been changing as the arguments for war and against war change... and I'm a pretty consistent person... I don't change my arguments unless there is new information that proves me wrong and I need to eat crow, or proves me right and I get to gloat...

That said, I've always believed the real reason for the war is to change the balance of power in the Middle East. It was for no other reason than that. An upset in the balance of power in the Middle East changes the dynamics of all the players, including Israel...

While it is an interesting move and has altered the balance of power, I believe the repercussions are going to be quite costly for us and for the Middle East for many years to come...

I think Iran is next. Not with a war. But if we upset the balance of power in Iran, then the factions in Iraq and the factions in Iran that are left are going to be fighting each other for years vying for power...
The prize is worth the risk.

IF IF Iran and Iraq become true democracies, the rest of the Middle East will eventually follow and terrorists will have fewer places for safe harbor.
Also note that WHEN WHEN China truly does become a superpower (and they will), they will find themselves world-wide surrounded by Democracies and Republics unwilling to bend to their will.

[Hel'n]

The prize is worth the risk.

IF IF Iran and Iraq become true democracies, the rest of the Middle East will eventually follow and terrorists will have fewer places for safe harbor.
Also note that WHEN WHEN China truly does become a superpower (and they will), they will find themselves world-wide surrounded by Democracies and Republics unwilling to bend to their will.

True, that is one possible outcome.

The other is that we do this "enforced democratizing" so badly that China ends up surrounded by unfriendly terrorists states who only exist to kill each other and spread their fanatical views into fringe areas of China where religion is very important and destabilize the region. There will be fighting for years...

[Mr. Kotter]

True, that is one possible outcome.

The other is that we do this "enforced democratizing" so badly that China ends up surrounded by unfriendly terrorists states who only exist to kill each other and spread their fanatical views into fringe areas of China where religion is very important and destabilize the region. There will be fighting for years...

I'm more hopeful of the power of democracy. :)

[Raiderhader]

Did we go to Iraq because of the PLO or WMD or AlQaida? You keep changing the premise of the war...



Good grief! How many times must this lie/misconception be refuted? At least once more, obvoiusly.

The administration never stated we were going to war with Iraq because of ties with AQ.

[Raiderhader]

I'm more hopeful of the power of democracy. :)


So are the terrorists, that is why they are fighting tooth and nail to try and upset our little endeavor in Iraq.


And yet some idiots here at home want to play partisan politics with this war and undermine that hope.....

[Pennywise]

They are now claiming to have killed the second American (Hensley).

[Iowanian]

Peace to their families.

Maybe the US should duct tape a GPS device to the behind of each US contractor in the country.........when the next one is captured, send in troops to free them, and upon exit, Turn the surrounding square mile into a dry lake bed.

I really wish they'd find al zarcoward soon....and kill him slowly.

[Hel'n]

CAIRO, Egypt (AP) - A posting on an Islamic Web site claimed Tuesday that the al-Qaida-linked group led by Abu Musab al-Zarqawi has slain a second American hostage in Iraq. The claim could not be verified immediately.

The group, Tawhid and Jihad, kidnapped two Americans - Jack Hensley and Eugene Armstrong - and Briton Kenneth Bigley in Baghdad on Sept. 16. Armstrong was beheaded by al-Zarqawi and the militants on Monday posted a gruesome video of his death.

The new posting came as the militant group's 24-hour deadline passed for the release of all Iraqi women from U.S. custody.

"The youths of Tawhid and Jihad killed the second American hostage after the end of the deadline," the statement said. It was signed with the pseudonym Abu Maysara al-Iraqi. It promised to provide video of the death soon.

The brief statement did not give the name of the hostage killed.

http://apnews.myway.com//article/20040921/D8587EJ00.html

[Calcountry]

au contraire...

It gets them airtime. It gets them noteriety. It gets them local fame and a seat of power at the table of local insurgents. It gets them on the Al Jazzera network. It gets them more recruits because they are seen as powerful. Plus, if they kidnap someone from another country or the right company, they might make a lot of money off of it.

It's disgusting and wrong, but if they didn't get something from it they wouldn't be doing it.

Part of me just wants to nuke the region and take the oil.
This war is being fought at the propaganda level, we must take it to them at that level.

We respond to the next Kidnapping like this, "Cut his head off and we will blow Fallujah "every man woman and child up". Then everyone in Fallujah Flees, the ones that we don't want we kill, we let everyone else through the net.

[BIG_DADDY]

Just watched the video. If that doesn't convince you these animals need to be stopped at all costs nothing will.

[Patriot 21]

Just watched the video.

BIG DADDY, where did you watch it at? I been poking all over the net looking for a link that works and can't find one.:shrug:

[BIG_DADDY]

BIG DADDY, where did you watch it at? I been poking all over the net looking for a link that works and can't find one.:shrug:

It's sick as hell man. The guy is screaming and and then when they hit his throat with the knife the body is breathing loudly by itself it sounds like, well hell you tell me these are some sick bastages.

http://www.thenausea.com/usa-iraq.html

They have tons of stuff here.

[Patriot 21]

Big Daddy. Thanks. Interesting site. I can't seem to get that video link to work either. Must be something wrong on my end.

[Hel'n]

It's sick as hell man. The guy is screaming and and then when they hit his throat with the knife the body is breathing loudly by itself it sounds like, well hell you tell me these are some sick bastages.

http://www.thenausea.com/usa-iraq.html

They have tons of stuff here.

Kill 'em all...

[Iowanian]

BD...That sight sure seems full of Terrorist Propaganda.

I hope they all die soon in a humiliating way........May the ones who get away get a firey ass cancer.

[Calcountry]

The next threat from these pukes and we nuke Abu musab al zarshitheads home city, or nearest city to his birth that is over a million. Make it known publicly that if they fuggin behead another American it is gonna cost them a million Muslims. Only don't fuggin bluff. If they call us, then it is time to raise the fuggin stakes.

[Chiefnj]

The next threat from these pukes and we nuke Abu musab al zarshitheads home city, or nearest city to his birth that is over a million. Make it known publicly that if they fuggin behead another American it is gonna cost them a million Muslims. Only don't fuggin bluff. If they call us, then it is time to raise the fuggin stakes.

Not a bad idea but the White House probably wouldn't approve.

[Mr. Kotter]

I'm convinced there's a special place in hell for guys like this....