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How do you know that again??… oh yeah, it’s made up. |
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If 20 million dollars is taking the short end of the stick to him. Oh my... what is the middle? What you think the agent will be looking for is vastly different than what any agent is hired to do. They are hired to maximize their clients earnings. An agent has zero interest to make team friendly deals. That is only on the player. And guess what that player is saying with the words out of his mouth? 20 million is the short end of the stick. |
Welp, if we get Nijman from GB, the whole problem of how to pay for DHop goes away. Let's ****ing go get ourselves a top-10 WR and steamroll in 2023!!!
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Don't look at me, I want to let Juju walk, too. I think we can get the same production from Moore with a little JWat and a draftee. Juju was good value at less than $10m. Above that? Nah. Just go get Paris Campbell.
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I've been all aboard drafting Jonathan Mingo to replace JuJu if he plays the cash in game.
I'd draft Mingo anyway just to be able move on in 2024. |
https://bleacherreport.com/videos/39...trade-for-dhop
A trade proposal |
Meh. Parris Campbell is basically a younger version of JJSS. Doesn't move the needle.
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Campbell still has some upside. He's had shit QB play almost his entire career. Juju is not going to get healthier. |
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I've been always partial to Mysty Hyman though. |
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If we're not going to try and acquire great players, why settle for JAGs? Why not step up in class, even a little? I mean, i know we're really not getting DHop, but Parris Campbell? Parris, statistically, is about as JAG as it gets. Y/C is a paltry 6.8. He played 16 games for 623 yards. 30.7 yds/gm for his career. 36yds/gm for 2022. He's nearly invisible. Upside? there's almost nowhere to go but up. Gotta be some JAG out there that's more productive than this guy. |
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We're not signing an over 30 WR for $20m per. Get over it. We won't have a gamebreaker at WR unless Toney stays healthy or we draft and develop one. Not for at least a couple of years. |
We literally just won a Super Bowl doing things a certain way, and it's a month later, and some of you guys want to go back to stars and scrubs-only a LESSER version of that. I mean, what the ****?
Hopkins is no Tyreek Hill. And defenses turned Hill into a possession receiver. And you guys want to go backwards? With an over 30 Hopkins? This is dumb. We're on a course, it's proven successful, stay the course. We need maximum value per cap dollar spent. Mahomes plus best 52. This is the way. |
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You think maybe paying an elite QB as such means you can't have everything else you want? Maybe? Just spitballing. |
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'Green Bay way'. Horseshit. This is how the Patriots operated when they won 7 Super Bowls. They cut dudes loose when they got too expensive, they signed cheap vets, they protected Brady, and they drafted well. And a lot of years that offense was totally different from the year before. And it worked until they stopped drafting well. I see no reason why Veach is going to start failing when it sure looks like he's just hitting his stride. |
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So the fact that that it worked once, well, let's be honest and admit there was a few mitigating factors that helped us out along the way. I get that acquiring DHop would probably mess up the careful architecture of what Veach's put together the last three or so years. I get that it would probably mean letting some good players go earlier than expected, like Sneed/Gay/Bolton. It might. It's even likely. But again, I'm not necessarily hung up on DHop or bust. He's just convenient as an example. But Parris? Come on, we can't do better than that? One step up in class isn't worth a look? Maybe just peek at a good WR2 (WR between 33 and 42?)? Toney goes out for any significant length of time, which is somewhat likely, and it's: MVS Skyy Watson (if he comes back) Ross (if either is healthy enough) Kemp/Powell/Fryfogle??? And what happens if Kelce misses any time? That's the crew you want to roll with? How much can Pat carry? Here's the thing: You seem to see 2022 as a blueprint for how to move forward. I see it as something of an aberration. A lot of lucky things happened. Like a 7th round rookie suddenly becoming a top-tier RB1. Another 7th round rook being thrust into a starting role, and not only playing well enough, but making a few big plays. And so on. That doesn't make it the only best way. it just means we have incredible coaching, generational talents at both QB and TE, and a few things just bounced in our favor. Simply putting some better quality pieces out there means needing less luck. They don't have to be Elite, but they shouldn't have to be JAGs either. |
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I just threw Parris Campbell out as a possible guy that's been with shit QB play and might do better with like, you know, the best QB. His stats suck because-DID YOU SEE THE DUMPSTER FIRE THAT OFFENSE WAS? I mean, the wheels hadn't fallen off yet when they played us. But good gods, was it shit by the end of the season. I'm not all in on Campbell. I'm not ALL IN on anyone. It's a shit FA class. But we're not going to go trade for a #1WR so fantasy football geeks can feel good about seeing one guy with big numbers to jerk off to. Not when we need TWO OT's, a DE, and at least two DT's. Just because you find unproven guys unsettling doesn't mean the Chiefs do. Andy and Veach know what they're doing and projecting your youngsters is going to be really important until Mahomes cap percentage levels off. You don't have to like it, but you DO have to accept it. Because it's happening, it already started last year. Maybe these guys know what they're doing. I don't know. Kind of seems like it. I wouldn't be surprised if they pass on Juju at anywhere near $10m. I'm certain they'll bring back JWat. If they're going to bring an an over 30 WR, it'll be someone like Thielen on a cheap deal to be a steady-Eddie. It won't be a big splash. |
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But if you're paying market price for someone else's stars, you're going to have to let yours walk sooner or later. It's just math. I'd rather not pay a Hopkins if it means I have to let Sneed, or Gay, or Creed, or Smith walk in a year or two. And if it precludes me from getting guys to protect Mahomes or kill the opposing QB. I'd rather put any money we have into THAT and figure the rest will work out. I'd like to see a healthy Mahomes in the Super Bowl for a change. This one legged shit is getting old. |
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Not the same thing, at all. |
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And no, they're not, and Hopkins is a very good receiver that if you're going to PAY him like a #1, you're going to NOT pay the role players you have, like MVS, and you're going to throw the ball to Hopkins 100+ times a season. Just like you did Tyreek. You HAVE to, because you're PAYING FOR THAT PRODUCTION. Otherwise, it's a waste of cap space. So, you're back to stars and scrubs, and with a lesser WR in Hopkins-who's very, very good, but not Tyreek Hill. Teams sit in two deep and take him away and you've paid a very expensive decoy. |
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And I mentioned Thielen last season during the IND circus GDT, so I'm aware that he's a likely target for Veach. At least he's probably a better overall WR than JJSS, but the difference isn't much, if any. |
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They arent Paying D Hop anywhere near what Tyreek got. His contract is very reasonable for the next two years, well below his talent level. Depending on what JuJu gets, estimates are 12-18/year. D Hop is in that range, heck he could be cheaper! 19 and 14 the next two years so 16.5 average. If they got Hopkins then JJSS isnt coming back. That isnt much more money for a HUGE upgrade. So this isnt Stars and Scrubbs. Its upgrading one position, a very important one, for not much more money. He doesnt have to feed Hopkins, unless hes open, which he usually is. Hopkins wants to WIN. |
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No one is saying our #1 offense sucks. Everyone including Mr. Veach, Andy and Patrick will say, theres always room for improvement. Getting Hopkins is a long shot, we know that but it would certainly be an improvement. We dont have to sacrifice all of our young guys to do this either, we just saved a shit load of cap space on our LT. This is a unique opportunity to get a true #1 WR at a very reasonable salary. |
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Here's my final thought on this: I just don't believe in the idea that the best course is to surround Pat with the least talented weapons that money can buy. In no part of my life's history have I seen that work for an extended period of time, mostly because no one does that. Buy the best you can afford, and you can probably afford more than you think, as one of my mentors used to say. If we're on a budget, fine. But then maximize the value. Forget JJSS/Thielen/Parris. Combine those resources and get one great player. Or two good ones. Or even just one good one. Especially if we aren't signing OBj to some massive overpriced contract. Get one real weapon, even if it isn't DHop, so Pat has something more than a handful of pea shooters, that's all. Maybe then we can beat CIN in the regular season as well. And we won't need Skyy to pull a last minute great return out of his ass in the playoffs. It's just a thought, bud. |
It's not going to happen, and I've explained in the most reasonable terms possible the myriad of reasons why. You guys have fun.
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Dude you gotta stop with this nonsense that we’re worse with a WR1. Or that our stalls with tyreek is proof of that. Mahomes evolved as a qb. He’s not going back to hero hall. The chiefs planned to bring back tyreek and have juju with him - they probably add Pacheco and Watson too. They likely get the same dominant year out of Jet. Do not act like tyreek with an actual running game and with WRs clearly better suited for efficiency than mecole, drob, Pringle wouldn’t absolutely slay.
I’m fine with losing tyreek but I’m tired of hearing the overdone myth that we are better off without that kind of talent. Now… back to reality. We get away with worse WRs because kelce is flat out dominant and we cannot put the entire game on his back. People seriously understate how big a loss that is if kelce misses time or regresses. Juju is NOT going to carry us without kelce. Secondly, our defense was flat out dominant late in the season and it is going to get harder and harder to expect that. We HAVE to lean our offense more than we lean on balance. We annihilated cincy on defense and yet barely eked out a win after yet another lukewarm second half vs them. We looked awful against buffalo earlier in the year. Our offense still looks flat against the chargers and broncos. I know our offense was great but people need to recognize that it’s actually capable of being better. Way better. That doesn’t mean you panic. I don’t know if DHop is healthy enough or if he’s regressed too much. But who in their right mind doesn’t think that if he’s anywhere near his prime level that this offense wouldn’t be flat out unstoppable? |
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And Reid obviously would not even entertain these kinds of ideas if he didn’t believe this made our offense much better. We are very much interested but we wisely aren’t going to give in to absurd demands to get it. |
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That's all I'm going to say on the matter, and just about guarantee you will not see Hopkins in a Chiefs uniform. |
Plus it would be a blast to watch Mahomes with that kind of talent to throw to again, and let him put up insane numbers. Let's make these prime Mahomes years as good offensively as they can be. Also takes pressure off the OL.
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Dude, I'd take Parris Campbell in a heart beat. 4.31 speed and has been on a bad team. Only thing I don't like is the injuries in years 1-3, but last year he played in every game. I love the speed.
Campbell at 4.31 Toney at 4.39 MVS at 4.37 Skyy at 4.41 Draft another burner and we are good to go at WR. Pacheco is a burner as well. Speed speed and more speed. |
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For comparison, DHop went 717 yds with 64 catches and 3 TDs. In 9 games. Receiving passes from four different QBs, three of which have no business starting an NFL game. Parris averages 3.0 catches/game. 36.6yds/game 6.8yds/tgt. 5 TDs in four years So, maybe I'm wrong, but that looks like JAG to me. Certainly, if i were AB, I'd be telling you he's as good as DHop, if not better. |
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Possible Hardman replacement |
It's amazing that people don't see a problem giving up draft picks and paying a guy that'll be 31 when he;
Missed multiple games with a hamstring injury in 2021 Blew out his knee just a few games after he got back from the hamstring injury Missed the first 6 games of 2022 because he was steroid boy ****ed up that same knee that he blew out in 2021 and missed the final 2 games of the season. This happens literally all the time in the NFL. These guys bodies break down and it's clear as day that is what is happening with Hopkins. You guys want to bring up all these guys that had good careers after turning 30 and you know what's different between those guys and Hopkins? Those guys didn't get injured. They all stayed healthy. Jerry Rice - missed almost the entire season at age 35, but no injury history outside of that. Tim Brown - only injuries were in his 2nd season Jimmy Smith - missed 4 games in one season, but healthy in all the others Charlie Joiner - missed 7 games at age 35. Healthy in the rest. Irving Fryar - healthy Terrell Owens - missed 9 games at age 32, but pretty much healthy all other years. Rod Smith - Healthy Marvin Harrison - missed 11 games at age 35 and retired after the next season, but pretty much healthy. Steve Smith - missed 9 games at age 36 and retired next year, but pretty much healthy. Tony Gonzalez - healthiest mother****er known to man That's the top 10 in receiving yards after age 30. I went through 25 of them and none of them had anywhere close to the amount of injuries and games missed as DHop. What's more likely is that he's going to go the route of Julio Jones, Michael Thomas, AJ Green, T.Y. Hilton, Dez Bryant, Antonio Brown. All guys that were top 10 WR at one point, but got hurt and/or age caught up to them and they sucked right around 30. |
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go Google DHop's games missed due to injury. He's played in 145. Out of a possible 160. |
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When Hopkins was healthy or not being suspended for steroids he was being force fed the ball. 96 targets in 9 games and Campbell only had 91 targets in 17 games. It was Hopkins lowest yards per reception of his career. I'd take Campbell at 26 years old, won't cost draft picks, and will only cost $8 mil a year. This argument doesn't matter anyway, because Veach isn't going to get a 30+ year old coming off 2 seasons in which he had 2 season ending injuries. |
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When bringing up those other guys I meant they weren't injured later in there careers. Sure they might have missed some games in the first couple of years, but they were healthy after age 27. Bring up the steroid thing because he was using it for a reason. It's banned for a reason. |
DHOP got busted for PEDS last year and is 30.....he was taking PEDS for a reason.
Hard pass for me, but if Veach does it then he has his reasons and he has earned my trust. I don't think he wants to commit that much cap to a 30 yr old WR though. |
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Its common practice to use PEDs for recovery. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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It's also not common practice, because a lot more guys would be getting popped for it. |
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This fanboy, masturbate at the water-cooler, signing names on the verge of brokedickism. Is so Al Davis & not Burp Snatch
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To everyone stating D Hop is a broke dick I'm pretty sure before any trade is consummated he will be given a thorough physical and maybe even worked out. I have no doubt after seeing the Veachanator not over pay for OBJ and Clark that he wouldn't get into a bad contract in this situation.
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I really don't get the hate by Chris Meck and others for Hopkins. We can of course have our own opinions if he is washed, not as good as MVS and JuJu and such.
BUT even last season when he came back from suspension he looked great. Have the Hopkins haters gone and watched any playback from this past season? I keep seeing....Hopkins will cost so much. His cap for next season is like $19M. You cut/trade MVS and don't resign JuJu and you would actually be saving money going Hopkins over MVS/JuJu. I think thats what Veach is thinking. Reid himself said that BOTH Toney and Moore will have much bigger roles this upcoming season. If true, and why would Andy lie, that plays perfectly inline with going after Hopkins! Last season MVS and JuJu both had about 66% snap count with Justin Watson coming in 3rd with about 43%. Now with Reids quote about Toney and Moore having bigger roles that means more snaps. Who's snaps go down with Toney and Moore taking more? Just makes perfect sense that Veach/Reid go after a guy like Hopkins that takes 70% of snaps while Toney/Moore are your #2 and #3 wide receivers. Could easily keep Watson and what ever rookie Veach drafts. Hopkins Toney Moore Watson Rookie/One of the IR or practice squad guys from last year. Over JuJu MVS Hardman/Toney Watson Moore I think this is a much better WR group with a Elite #1 and perfect #2 in Toney over JuJu and MVS. Well what about cap? Like I said MVS saves $7M if cut/traded.....JuJu is reported to be getting $12-$15M. Now who knows, JuJu could agree to $10M but I think $12M is the low end and will probably get offered more by another team. So MVS $7M+ JuJu $12M = $19M....exactly what Hopkins will cost. Even IF Hopkins wants a new deal that means that Veach can turn that $19M into something even lower! Cap won't be an issue and have no impact on other things Veach wants to do! In my mind its Hopkins for MVS/JuJu and I 'm more than ok with that because of the fact Toney and Moore are moving up and CHEAP! Makes to much sense not to happen! |
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I don’t think we’re in on this unless Brown Jr comes back. They will probably want to keep their picks for a potential trade up for LT assuming that they don’t find that option this month
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It's hard to see them on this no matter what happens to OBJ. I mean like if they did it I would be all let's ****in' go but not expecting it.
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Pats got: #1.29 #3.94 #4.121 Chiefs got: #1.21-McDuffie So Veach could use our #31 plus a 3rd and 4th to get up into the mid 20's to get his tackle PLUS send out that late 2nd for Hopkins. |
My two cents... KC is in a nice position with Mahomes and he has the ability to make average WRs produce in that offense. I believe their success in the passing game will allow them to do really well without paying big $ for a 'star' WR as long as Kelce is there.
Kelce is 33 and 10 years in the league... no real signs of slowing down, but the window will start soon and KC needs to look 2-3 years down the road and prepare for life without him as the stud. At that point, if KC does not find the next great TE, then yeah they will need a stud WR. I don't think they need to overpay for a WR right now, not sure I would be a fan of the getting OBJ or Hopkins unless the price were right. KC can find guys like MVS and JJS every year for a relative bargain. And, with Pacheco, he adds the dimension they've missed since moving on from Hunt. |
The Super Bowl win with Juju and Toney just isn't good enough. I need to talk down to other team fans with more "names" to puff my chest about
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Does the Taylor signing make trading for Hopkins more or less likely???? Sound off in da comments
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Still a nope from me.
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That's a no from me, Dawg.
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Now with the Taylor signing, instead of OBJ, there's a chance. Not much of one still, but now at least it's gone from complete fantasy to a long shot possibility. Especially if ARI comes down off their ridiculous idea that they can get a 2nd. The longer teams go without freaking out and overpaying WRs during this cycle, the more the door ajars for KC to steal Dhop.
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I can find multiple examples of guys that got hurt at an old age and were never anywhere close to the same. I can find multiple examples of elite guys that fell off when they turned 30+. I can find multiple examples of 30+ year old receivers that continued producing at a high level for several years, but in all of those examples that player didn't have back to back season ending injuries at 29 and 30 years old. So here's an exercise for someone that wants DHop
Please find me an example of a WR who produced under those same scenarios. Guy that's over 30, so 31 or older and had multiple injuries between 27 and 30. Also I keep reading that he had 700 yds in 9 games and how good he was, but how good was he really? Let's compare Hopkins and Juju from last year. Hopkins 9 games - 96 targets/64 receptions/717 yds/11.2 ypc/3 TDs Juju 16 games - 101 targets/78 receptions/933 yds/12 ypc/3 TDs 11.2 ypc is the worst of Hopkins career Juju only had 5 more targets and greatly out performed the dude. The only thing impressive is that Hopkins was able to fit in almost a full years worth of targets into 9 games. Hopkins numbers last year are the result of a shitty QB and no other person to throw the ball to. Hopkins led them in receiving and played just over half the season. Marquise Brown isn't a bad number 2, but he and Hopkins only played 4 games together. This would be such an incredibly bad trade that I know it isn't even realistic. Brett Veach isn't a fan hoping a guy can come here and regain his former glory. He's extremely smart and a realist. . |
How many yards/receptions/TDs/etc. do you think JuJu would have if he were the one catching balls from 4 of the worst QBs in the NFL, instead of the best QB ever? Point being, JuJu basically underperformed in spite of having it as easy as he did in 2022.
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Just saw Hopkins at the Best Buy near Tiffany Springs.
He was bargain hunting in the $2 DVD bin. |
Jawaan Taylor’s cap hit this year is only 6 million.
Just saying. |
As a group, the Chiefs WRs caught just 13 TD passes.
For the sake of comparison, DEN had 10, LAC had 14. ANd as we know, LAC's WRs were injured most of the season. |
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Patrick Mahomes ☎️ has been blowing up <a href="https://t.co/QLMMlh0kJF">https://t.co/QLMMlh0kJF</a></p>— James Palmer (@JamesPalmerTV) <a href="https://twitter.com/JamesPalmerTV/status/1635446937976487944?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 14, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
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