No, no, a few years ago. Just making a point about stats and whatnot.

i'm calm, we're good man, i agree that he can throw, but the same argument could be made about cassel, line bad 2 great recievers

i know just ****ing with you:D year before last IIRC.

Yes and I think most who have interacted with me here will agree that I am not a homer and make observations as I see them. Of course I hope he does not fair well. I catch a ton of flack from Raiders fans because I take the same approach when accessing the team I root for.

If I was looking to run smack there is plenty of material available regarding Cassel. I have been honest on how I feel about him as a player. I have stated why I have doubts if you perceive this as an attack on you or Cassel that in not my intention.

mecca i am sitting here using everything YOU use all the time, you double talk, see how it works.

I didn't realize that his line was bad really (cassel), but being hit as much as GC says he was impresses me about his toughness.

If we want to use stats as the argument take Palmer's last 2 full seasons. I didn't put him in the top 10 due to injury and I've seen Jason and Hootie both bag on him his stats are off the damn board.

It's like moving the goal posts "well he has stats but doesn't win" "oh he won well hell what else" I don't think anyone thinks Carson Palmer is why the Bengals don't win. In contract they went from being a general 6-8 win team with him to being an abomination without him.

with you i have no problem should have put a big smile on that post:D there you go.

I think Manning was ascending, but I don't know that he hasn't hit a plateau.

I think he is about wher he will be, a fringe top 10 QB who can fall out of that level if a couple of QBs put together a couple of good seasons back to back.

I don't totally agree with Jason, but I think there is some merit to his point that Manning shouldn't have declined nearly as much as he did with the loss of Burress.

There is just something lacking in Manning's makeup that leads me to believe he's never going to be much more than he is right now.

the line was BAD for about 10 games and got a little better after that, like i said before i took the time to go back and watch every game from last year. THATS what changed my opinion of him, mecca obviously has not.

Cool well this Raiders fan will get the heck out of the way and let you guys carry on :)

he seems to just go with the flow sometimes. and the argument i used about plax is just throwing what these guys say about cassel back at them

Well I think Palmer's better but I'm not going to put him in the top 10 after only playing in a couple games last year. I'm giving Brady the benefit because of how much far ahead of everyone he was before his injury outside of Peyton.

The hate some people have for Palmer amazes me.

i dont hate him, just dont think he's as good as you do.

You should go pull his stats since you were big on doing that a minute ago...

Carson Palmer is physically everything people want in a QB, he has the stupid arm and can make ridiculous throws that leave peoples jaws dropping.