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-   -   Football In defense of Belicheat's cheating (https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=184934)

morphius 05-20-2008 07:10 AM
I'd still be mighty interested to know if Indy was doing something similar, with them alway getting to the line so quickly it would give them the ability to relay to Peyton what the D called. Just one of those things that make me go, hmmmm.

BucEyedPea 05-20-2008 07:18 AM
Here is the full interview of BB's explanation instead of the hatchet job on CBS who edited out big chunks.

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Red Dawg 05-20-2008 07:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amnorix (Post 4759230)
Let's be clear about this. As BEP posted, this was (and STILL IS) the rule that is in the NFL Constitution and Bylaws:



When BB started taping in 2000, that was it -- nothing else to go on. It is **entirely** possible to read that rule as permitting taping as long as it doesn't help in that game.

Before 2006, the NFL sent around the clarification memo that was posted in the original post of this thread. AFTER that, it was perfectly clear, in my mind, that BB should have stopped taping. It was stupid of the NFL not to change their rules to better reflect what the memo said, but that doesn't absolve BB.

So, to me, what he did BEFORE 2006 has some degree of excuse. After 2006, BB has nothing to hang his hat on. The memo made it perfectly clear.
He's a liar and a cheat. He and his staff that new of it have no integrity.

Amnorix 05-20-2008 07:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by morphius (Post 4759253)
I'd still be mighty interested to know if Indy was doing something similar, with them alway getting to the line so quickly it would give them the ability to relay to Peyton what the D called. Just one of those things that make me go, hmmmm.
Maybe, maybe not, but their OLine coordinator, Mudd, is one of the best sign-stealers in the NFL. Because he does it with the naked eye, of course, it's perfectly legal.

Don't ask me to explain why that's legal but videotaping isn't, but that's how it is.

morphius 05-20-2008 07:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amnorix (Post 4759262)
Maybe, maybe not, but their OLine coordinator, Mudd, is one of the best sign-stealers in the NFL. Because he does it with the naked eye, of course, it's perfectly legal.

Don't ask me to explain why that's legal but videotaping isn't, but that's how it is.
LOL! I'm looking forward to the speaker in the helmet rule to see how good some of the O's are going to be without being able to see any signs.

jidar 05-20-2008 07:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea (Post 4759098)
That's not the one that BB was referring to:

It's this:




http://www.boston.com/sports/footbal...aping_rul.html


That's what he was referring to when he said he NEVER used the tapes "during the playing of a game."


There's another rule about being able to film in another location for game film that contradicts the above two as well.


If you're a smart coach and use a lack of clarity to push the envelope it's gamesmanship, imo. BB is supposed to be known for that type of thing. It's smart. It's just the haters that see it in the worst possible light.

Stealing signals isn't illegal either, just how it's done. Stealing signals in taught in to young kids and has been done since sports started. It could have been done other ways but this was easier. It was done openly while the videotographer was in full view. If you think you're cheatin' you'd hide it a lot better I'd think.
And in truth folks, this is what's really wrong with America. This win at all costs mentality, even at the cost of your dignity and honor, If there is wriggle room or some way to get one over on somebody then take it, and the rest of us who don't see it that way are just suckers. It's the difference between people who would find a wallet and give it back compared to the ones who would keep it, or the people who would keep money from a bank error because it's the banks fault.

Everybody wants to blame a lot of things for Americas ills but I really think the decline of honor, dignity and honesty are the true root causes of all the problems from all types and classes of people. From the petty ghetto street criminal, and the money grubbing minister, to the backroom dealing white collar criminals and the corrupt politicians and finally to the cheating pro sports athletes and coaches. It's all the same.

Amnorix 05-20-2008 08:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jidar (Post 4759291)
And in truth folks, this is what's really wrong with America. This win at all costs mentality, even at the cost of your dignity and honor, If there is wriggle room or some way to get one over on somebody then take it, and the rest of us who don't see it that way are just suckers. It's the difference between people who would find a wallet and give it back compared to the ones who would keep it, or the people who would keep money from a bank error because it's the banks fault.

Everybody wants to blame a lot of things for Americas ills but I really think the decline of honor, dignity and honesty are the true root causes of all the problems from all types and classes of people. From the petty ghetto street criminal, and the money grubbing minister, to the backroom dealing white collar criminals and the corrupt politicians and finally to the cheating pro sports athletes and coaches. It's all the same.
Give me a break. There are all kinds of stories about Halas and other great NFL coaches who did all kinds of sneaky stuff to try to gain an edge.

FAX 05-20-2008 09:44 AM
America was built on stealing, lying, and killing, and stuff. No problem there.

This was stupid, though. The Pats organization has enough money that they could have used concealed, spy cameras and never been caught.

FAX

Skip Towne 05-20-2008 09:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FAX (Post 4759481)
America was built on stealing, lying, and killing, and stuff. No problem there.

This was stupid, though. The Pats organization has enough money that they could have used concealed, spy cameras and never been caught.

FAX
Why didn't they?

FAX 05-20-2008 09:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skip Towne (Post 4759483)
Why didn't they?
To me, that speaks in his defense. They could have used gatorade-cam, or ballboy-cam, or even cheerleader's maxipad-cam, but they went instead with a numbskull out in the open with a Circuit City special.

If they knew it was ultra-bad, I think they would have been sneakierish.

FAX

RNR 05-20-2008 10:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amnorix (Post 4759364)
Give me a break. There are all kinds of stories about Halas and other great NFL coaches who did all kinds of sneaky stuff to try to gain an edge.
All I want is my fair advantage "Weeb Ewbanks" (sp)

beach tribe 05-20-2008 10:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugly Duck (Post 4759063)
Belicheat's explanation is: "I felt there was a gray area in the rule and I misinterpreted the rule."

At first it seems like a wishy-washy poor excuse. Until you read how vague the wording of the rule actually is:

"Videotaping of any type, including but not limited to taping of an opponent's offensive or defensive signals, is prohibited on the sidelines, in the coaches' booth, in the locker room or at any other locations accessible to club staff members during the game."

After reading that weak language, we can easily see how Belicheat could be led to believe that it was OK to videotape opponent's offensive and defensive signals from the sidelines.

I don't like the guy, but I have to give him the benefit of the doubt in his innocent misinterpretation. If the NFL doesn't want signals being taped, they gotta just spell it out in black and white. They can't leave the rule as grey and vague as the wording now stands or other coaches may fall into the same trap as Belicheat.
Thing is, noone believes that Belichick has the reading comprehension skills of a RaiDURs fan. Clear as a bell to me, and BB too, I'm sure.

smittysbar 05-20-2008 10:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugly Duck (Post 4759063)
Belicheat's explanation is: "I felt there was a gray area in the rule and I misinterpreted the rule."

At first it seems like a wishy-washy poor excuse. Until you read how vague the wording of the rule actually is:

"Videotaping of any type, including but not limited to taping of an opponent's offensive or defensive signals, is prohibited on the sidelines, in the coaches' booth, in the locker room or at any other locations accessible to club staff members during the game."

After reading that weak language, we can easily see how Belicheat could be led to believe that it was OK to videotape opponent's offensive and defensive signals from the sidelines.

I don't like the guy, but I have to give him the benefit of the doubt in his innocent misinterpretation. If the NFL doesn't want signals being taped, they gotta just spell it out in black and white. They can't leave the rule as grey and vague as the wording now stands or other coaches may fall into the same trap as Belicheat.
Are you dense? It gets no more black and white then that.

RNR 05-20-2008 10:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by smittysbar (Post 4759555)
Are you dense? It gets no more black and white then that.
You do know he is joking right? Raider fans hate the Patriots almost as much as they hate their AFC West rivals

FAX 05-20-2008 10:44 AM
Poor Mr. Ugly Duck. Misunderstood once more.

But, maybe he'll grow up someday to be a beautiful swan and take his revenge by purchasing some camo, sneaking through the neighborhoods at night, and biting off the penile skin of all the doubters.

FAX


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