I've seen Pete Kozma play - he's atrocious. I doubt we ever see him at the major league level and I'm certain we'll never see him as more than a utility player. Any kind of fastball overpowers him, he doesn't identify a slider well and he can't stay back on a curveball. I watched Shelby Miller absolutely murder the boy last spring on the back fields in Jupiter.

It will be interesting to see what Cox can do. Scouting reports vary so widely on the kid that we don't know if we have a guy with 25 HR power waiting to develop that can play both 2b and 3b effectively or a guy with 10 HR power and the ability to play nowhere. He's just a very strange prospect.

Descalso can play at this level, but LaRussa won't play him. So why do we think Cox will ever get a legitimate shot? Is it because of how much of an opportunity Greene has had? Or maybe because we watched him mind-**** Brendan Ryan right out of town. Or perhaps the fact that he's well on his way to doing the same thing to Rasmus? If a rookie doesn't come up and flash All-Star talent immediately (Pujols and Molina), he simply gets buried and ****ed with by LaRussa until he's broken down. It's a pattern he's had for a decade plus now, not sure why we'd expect anything different.

If LaRussa is gone and Antonetti takes the job, Mozeliak's gone. So in that sense, the argument doesn't wash. The primary culprit was DeWitt's refusal to allow the GM the opportunity to pick his own staff, field management included.

And while LaRussa may tell Mozeliak who to get, it's Mozeliak that actually does the horse trading. In that regard, he's absolutely awful. From the Lohse extension to giving Gregerson away like he was nothing, to waiting too long on the DeRosa deal so he had to include Todd, to bidding against himself on Holliday, etc... the man just has no ability to actually make a shrewd deal.

Jocketty had a similar relationship with LaRussa. However, when LaRussa said he needed a OFer, we gave up Kent Bottenfield for a borderline HOFer. When we needed a power bat and a defensive upgrade, we got one of the best defensive 3b of all time for Placido Polanco. When we needed to deal a percieved clubhouse malcontent that played RF, we got the kid that probably won the WS for us as a dynamite closer and has since gone on to finish in the top 3 of the CY voting the last 2 years. Clearly, Jocketty was a HELL of a lot better at this than John Mozeliak.

It's not the marching orders that bothers me as much as Mozeliak's complete inability to effectuate them effectively.

I was watching sportcenter this am and the anchors reported that Pujols says that unless a deal is worked out before the start of Spring training he will not accept any trade to any team and will become a free agent at the end of the year.

Link to the espn story:
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=6070963

Jesus Christ, just give him $40 million a year and get this shit over with.

8 years, $40 million per.

I think you are conflating commonly accepted needs vs. orders to make player personnel acquisitions. They are discrete entities.

I think we can afford Pujols and have a competitve team. It's not one or the other. We pull in 3 million every year. We are a top 10 team in payroll and no one is losing money. Pay the frikking man before hard feelings set in. To watch Pujols bang at Wrigley for the next 8 years or so would just be too painful to watch.

Pay him whatever it takes and raise ticket prices by a few bucks. It's not rocket science.

Despite what others have said, you can have Pujols and have a WS caliber team. The difference is you'll have to finish that team out with young, cost-controlled players. That can easily be done if you know how to draft and develop.

Are the Cardinals, even with the limitations put on them by the Pujols and Holliday deals, going to be on a tighter budget than say, the Rays? No. If your FO is competent, you can win with two big-money players (who are also earning their salary). If they aren't, you won't.

It's that simple.

Look, if Mozeliak isn't good enough to get equal value for Brendan Ryan, what makes you think he can do it for Pujols? The potential downside is too great, and the risk is minimal. The floor of the reward (watching him break a bunch of meaningful ML records, hit milestones, etc) is, in and of itself, enough to justify the risk of the contract.

Sure, paying Pujols $16 million instead of $30 million makes it a little harder to compete. Puts more pressure on the draft and development but we still have room for error, whereas the Royals etc can be set back easily with a failed prospect. Mo has to do a better job.

Cardinal owners should add $10/seat...Card fans will pay it.

Pay the Man!

EDMONDS IS HOME!!!

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/baseb...7a4a78c22.html

Damn I'd love to see him make the squad. Put him out in RF for 200-250 ABs/season and I think you'd like the results.

Welcome back, Hollywood. Cardinal Nation just isn't the same without you.

Even Muir thinks Edmonds is old as ****.

True.

He's no Jason Kendall.

When he leads our country to the gold in the two-man bobsled, you better not cheer.

Yeah, I'll bet his patented strike out swing is so slow now that Stephen Hawking could dodge it.

So he's going to kneecap Herschel Walker? Because if I recall correctly, Herschel's in NFL shape and appears trained to kick some ass.

If I'm Kendall, I think I let Willie ride shotgun with Herschel.

I'm personally glad to see Jimmy back in the fold. He was always one of my favorites but I hope he doesn't make any friends with this years pitching staff. We are too thin to lose anybody.

Thank you. I was completely blanking on who was supposed to be that douche's wingman for the bobsled endeavor. ****ing Spork and Kendall. :facepalm:

I haven't been attacked by a dog, but that doesn't mean the scars aren't real.

Kozma is not the answer in Springfield, he's damn sure not the guy in Stl. Cox and Descalso are screwed until Tony gives up on his project.

Yeah, I hated having a CFer that actually got on base and hit for power. And the post-season heroics don't matter because he couldn't straighten out 97 mph high heat.

I mean hell, he only had 2 seasons in his entire career where he struck out as many times as Rasmus did in 2009 and actually had a significantly better K-rate than KKKKolby did last season.

Seriously - anyone that doesn't like Edmonds is just a shithead. That guy did as much or more for the Cardinals during his prime years as Albert. GG centerfielders that put up an OPS above 1.000 aren't exactly easy to find. I'm sure the catch he made to save game 7 of the 04 NLCS is more than off-set by some strikeout with a man on 3rd of a July game against the Pirates.

If all you remember about the guy is strikeouts, feel free to jump into a flaming AIDS tree.

<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/JNcM7g9SQ3w" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

The Descalso thing pisses me off to no end.

All we hear about Descalso is that "certain people within the organization" don't believe his defense will translate to the ML level.

HE WAS NAMED DEFENSIVE PLAYER OF THE YEAR IN THE TEXAS LEAGUE!!!!!

Do they play on smaller diamonds out there? Do they use softballs?

'Certain people within the organization' can kiss my ass...{cough} Tony LaRussa {cough}. You need an excuse to keep your pet in the lineup and the average fan can look at Descalso's offensive performance and realize that you really don't have grounds to disparage his hitting. OTOH, most of them won't realize that he's actually a hell of a defensive 2b because they don't see him play and don't hear about awards like that.

So make up some bullshit from 'anonymous sources' that calls into question his defense. Sure, the rank/file Cards fan won't bat an eye at that. I mean nevermind the fact that you think Skip ****ing Schumaker's defense evidently 'translates' to the ML level...

I absolutely despise Tony LaRussa.

Lighten up, Francis. I loved Joe Montana. Doesn't mean I want him to start for us next year.

Edmonds is ****ing done and has been for years.

Damn thats ROFL

DJ's Left Meatcurtain does not concur with your comic assessment of my clearly rude and unappreciative post. :harumph:







:)

DJ hates everything Cardinals these days. That was damn funny. Maybe only funny to us Cardinal fans who suffered through Jimmy Ballgames last couple of years but still ROFLROFL

If I could get anybody back from those years it would be ROLEN. Goddamn, if only we'd kept him and shitcanned LaRussa. :banghead:

If Edmonds makes the roster, I'll be okay with it, but that's if he stays healthy and produces in ST.

Don't mind the signing of Edmonds at all. Didn't see all that much of him last season but still seemed able to hit rightys well enough. Assuming he shows enough in spring to make the team he could be a decent late innings replacement for the current defensive shit at the corners as well.

Edmonds still has marginal power to right field, and he's an above average defender. In a vacuum, it's an acceptable move. What worries me is that LaRussa is going to use it as another tool to **** with the young OFers on this team, especially Rasmus.

I can just imagine that dumb sonofabitch running out an everyday lineup of Holliday, Edmonds, and Berkman.

Edmonds never did anything close to what Albert has done for the Cardinals, even in his prime years. Edmonds was basically a 6.5 WAR player for St. Louis. Albert has averaged 8 WAR in a position where both his offense and defense are devalued.

He also missed more than 8 games every year in St. Louis while Pujols has missed more than 8 only once.

Look, Jim Edmonds was a great, great baseball player for St. Louis, and his contributions should be valued and respected. But denigrating Colby Rasmus and Albert Pujols, the latter of whom you seem to have developed a vendetta against over the last year for his running out of ground balls, is wholly misplaced.

At least he isn't Randy Winn. Others know whether there is someone in the system that is being blocked by this move more than me.

IIRC, he was placed on the 15 day DL in 2008 when he hurt himself running out of the batter's box in Cincy.

I wouldn't mind Edmonds replacing Berkman in RF late in the game.

Correct. I misread that as 158. That, along with the oblique strain, are the only injuries that have caused him to miss time.

But, the point is that Pujols has been pretty damn reliable. For someone with his talent, he still keeps working out pretty hard even in the off season.

Edmonds resigning reminds me a lot of Juan Gonzalez signing a minor league deal in '08. Edmonds is going to have to be healthy(IIRC, Gonzalez wasn't) and have a good ST to beat Jay out.

He's also played through some pretty nasty injuries (plantar fasciitis, the elbow problem) and remained productive doing it.

I don't know what's more amazing about that video: Edmonds' catch or the fact that David Howard actually hit a ball out of the infield.

Both the Stl paper and fox sports reporting that the Pujols contract talks are not going well.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/s...ces-say-020511

FML.

Just give him whatever he wants. How could Mozeliak be that ****ing bad at his job? How could anyone be that bad at any job?

The sale of Pujols/Cardinal merchandise alone will more than make up for his contract. PAY THE MAN ALREADY!!!

Is it time to panic yet?

There's no way this doesn't get done.

But if it doesn't, we just became the Royals East. And as poorly as this team has been run over the past couple of years, we may be there whether we keep Albert or not.

Okay, now I'm even more worried a deal doesn't get done. I just don't see any team out there(Red Sox and Yankees included) who could make an offer to Pujols while making sense for the team.

Would the Cubs dare make an offer?

It is hard to see anyone offering him the type of money he wants in FA.

I highly doubt it. If Pena hits at all(and can stay healthy), they can resign him for less than they would Pujols.

Don't you think it's Dewitt that makes the decision on how much to give Pujols?

I've heard that the Cubs are the most likely landing spot for him. Don't remember where I heard that, but **** that would be a disaster of Ruthian proportions if it happened.

Who is the one doing the negotiating?

Mozeliak's job is to run the baseball operation. I don't know how he could go to his boss and honestly say that letting Pujols walk in free agency is worth it, or that there is a price too high to pay.

Look at what losing LeBron did to the value of the Cavs. It reduced that franchise's value by 24%. That's well over $100 million.

When you factor in the merchandise, the fact that you can recoup some of the cost through tickets, and the additional attendance you'll get for fielding a better club, not to mention keeping him as a St. Louis icon, there is no reason why this shouldn't be done.

A friggin Armaggedon disaster.:doh!:

For all we know, the negotiating deadline could be pure BS. Also, I don't see any teams out there that would make sense for them to sign Albert(except maybe the Cubs).

The Angels would ship Morales out of there so fast his ****ing head would spin.

The Sox or Yankees could sign him and have him platoon at first and DH with Gonzalez and Texeira.

The White Sox could potentially add him as a power bat.

The Mets would open up the floodgates.

The Cubs would do anything to stick it to the Cardinals like that.

hey your preaching to the choir. I say give him $300 million for 10 years if thats what it takes. The Cardinals will make that money back easily. To see him in a Cubs uniform....I'll give Dewiit some money if that is what it takes.

It doesn't make sense for the Yankees to sign Albert, he's said repeatedly he does not like playing DH. Red Sox could make sense if they don't resign Gonzalez, which IMO, would be a bad decision. Haven't thought about the White Sox as a landing spot, but they can just keep Dunn at 1B and sign someone to DH. The Mets owner is looking to sell 25% of the franchise and has lost a lot of money in recent years. The Cubs could make sense, but they are still paying that awful contract to Soriano.

You can't just dismiss the marketing aspect of this. He's the big dog in baseball. He will start breaking records in the next couple of years. Thats some serious marketing appeal.

You have a point there, but how many teams will be wanting to pay a 37 year old $30 Million?

Hell, then Boston or NYY should flip Tex or Gonzalez for Pujols. He's worth far more than either one.

The Mets owner may have actually made money from the Madoff deal, which is why he's being investigated by the Feds

If Pujols goes to Boston, I wouldn't mind the Cards signing Gonzalez.

Give him $500 million for a lifetime contract if that's what it takes. I'm dead ****ing serious, too.

Pay him $40 million a year for the rest of his playing years, and disperse the rest in an annuity.

DeWitt has seen the value of this franchise explode under his watch. He has a five year old stadium and a shitload of parking garages that make money hand over fist.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=6102486

Pujols is going to report on Feb. 16th now. That means they have 8 days to sign him.

I will give $5000 to anyone who kills John Mozeliak and facilitates the signing of Albert Pujols.

Whatever it takes!!!!!!!! :mad:

Cardinals will sign him....relax.

7 days

Aaron Miles took his talents to LA.

What about the Brewers? They have finally have a decent rotation.

Over a season, yeah Philly's roation is filthy. But, in a playoff, ask San Fran how that can go.

Oh no!!!

http://twitter.com/#!/SI_JonHeyman

Time to start worrying.

If Albert is asking for 27-28 mil., I don't have a problem with that. 8 years and that should get it done.

Tim Kurkjian was on ESPN earlier, he seemed to think that Pujols absolutely wants 10 years... Cards want to go 5-7 years, definitely not 10. Seemed to think they were pretty far apart due to the contract length. But also said there's no way they can let him walk... which is what I would think.

**** that. Give him $30 million over 10 years. The Cardinals will make the revenue up easily.

If they let him walk, I will not understand it at all. I'd easily pay an extra $5 in ticket prices just so Albert can stay.

Give him $28 mil over 8 years or $30 over 7. If he won't take that, let him go and try to get him to eventually accept a trade.

So give him 10 with the last two voidable or some shit....just get him signed!

If the Cards are dumb enough not to sign him by his deadline...they will deserve what they get.

I'm not going to be pissed if he isn't signed by the deadline. I'll be pissed if he isn't resigned.

I wouldn't even consider it.

Again - The DeWitt Group is playing with house money. They sold the parking structures that came with the team for what the team cost - in short they got the Cardinals for free.

Then they promised that the new stadium would allow them to stay competitive in the current fiscal climate.

If those mother****ers come with their hands out after they got the best player in baseball for a screaming bargain over the last decade, I'll be furious. Now's when they need to pay the fans back for their loyalty, not come asking for even more.

The "Pujols Tax" should be paid by the people that have most benefited by his presence (Tony LaRussa and Jose Oquendo excluded)- the DeWitt Ownership Group.

I would be insulted beyond all belief if they do that.