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As Frank said in his interview today, he tried to point out the things that the average baseball fan/viewer might have missed. Apparently, that did not set well with someone. His hope was the viewers would learn a little something they may not have known. Posted via Mobile Device |
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Producer Kevin Shank got fired too. There seems to be more to this than just Frank.
I have a delightful conspiracy theory involving a power-hungry Fever all mapped out. |
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This is not a huge mystery. Frank White was let go because he was not a good broadcaster.
With Ryan apparently going back to radio, everyone involved with the TV broadcast has been cleared out of there. If he had been a AAA broadcaster brought up to audition for a year or two, no one would blink at his contract not being renewed, and more than a few would be happy about it. Say what you want about "well thats fine, but you dont treat a legend this way", but I mute the TV and listen to the radio. If the Royals get better, their local broadcast will start to get picked up and Fox probably doesn't want it to sound like amateur hour. Frank White was a great player and all that, but he took this too personally and threw a fit. If he wants to stomp off to go look for someone to blame rather than recognizing that he wasn't cut out for the job, then fine, but this will have absolutely no impact on me whatsoever. |
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No... the part I agree with was that it was good that Frank was never hired as the manager for the Royals. It would have ended badly.. |
He might not have been a polished broadcaster, but he was knowledgeable about the game and entertaining. To me, these qualities trump any of the finer niceties.
Embarrassing that the organization would not retain him in some capacity, but that's Dayton apparently reverting to '09 form. |
Dayton realized he was having too nice of an offseason so he had to **** around and get a triple double
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The Royals soooooo blow!!!
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Ryan and Denny are good together.
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As for this whole "too negative" line, that sounds like a load of crap to me. Frank was not that critical or negative against the organization, especially compared to Split, who never got a backlash or anything for his often-harsh words aside from respect.
If Frank says that is how things went down, then I'll believe that is what the regional Fox Sports head told him, but I think they did not have the heart or the guts to just flat-out tell him that he was a pretty bad broadcaster, and that he hung around this long only because of his history with the team. |
I am upset that Frank was ousted, but I hate to hear how hurt he is. I'd like to think they wanted to spare him. The guy has done ANYTHING they have asked
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I thought he did really well in taking over for Splitt, who gave it a shot, but just couldn't do it and really ended up the year being pretty comfortable at the mike. Helped the Royals out by hanging around with the job. I don't think it was something he was really campaigning for, just kind of fell in his lap
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Christ I do hate these owners. FU FU all I will never set foot in the stadium again. 12 years I had season tickets and could give a damn what happens to this team.
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LOL, this is funny, but not unpredictable. What owner wants folks trashing them who they pay??? Then again, you'd think assclown like Glass and Hunt would be man enought to both expect it and be able to deal with it...
LOL... Our sports owners SUCK balls... |
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sucking so bad for years and years and years..... thats okay
tell it how it is and be on the lone world series winning team, give critique. NOW YOUVE ****ING CROSSED THE LINE |
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"He steals from the poor, and gives to the rich. STUPID BITCH!" (Enough commas for you, Milkdud?) |
so have they gotten anyone to replace frank white yet?
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I loved Frank White in the booth. Plus they would bring in some older baseball players from around MLB and have great conversations of yesteryear.
Frank was the Man i'm telling you. As a bonus he caught a foulball in the broadcast booth during a game this year. |
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well.........bye |
Screw the Royal's.
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What's apparently lost on FSM and the Royals is that the majority of fans don't care that he's not a great orator. We love Frank because he did so much for the organization and he's pretty widely regarded as a genuine, friendly person. That makes up for any lack of polish he may have had. And I really enjoyed his takes on the intricacies of baseball. |
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What team was he covering? The Royals Who was his audience? Royals fans What do Royals fans think of Frank? The LOVE him! That's all that needs to be said. Someone ****ed this up in a major way. It's not like people were calling in saying, "I love Frank but he has to get out of the booth." Royals fans loved seeing him calling the games and listening to him. |
Looks like the Royals facebook page took down all the people ranting about Frank getting the boot.
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I love Frank. He was my favorite player as a kid. His knowlege of the game is great, but he was not a professional broadcaster. The constant giggling during the game got really annoying. If he would have put the effort into it someone like Splitt did, I think he could have been fantastic. But he didn't, and he's gone. I honestly don't have a problem with it at all. |
Dayton Moore is a spineless prick looking for yes men in the clubhouse and broadcast booth. Frank White carried enough water for this lame franchise that he should be given the keys and asked how he wants things run.
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The team hasn't dealt with Frank White historically the way they should have. That predates Dayton Moore. And call me crazy, but I don't believe Dayton Moore was making the decision in this case either. They shouldn't have done many of the things they have done to White over the years. But he isn't entitled to a job as a big league manager and he isn't entitled to this either. That's life. The team should be mending this fence. He should be working for the organization in some capacity as long as he wants to. I don't think they are wrong in looking for new broadcasters. I never really enjoyed Davis, and I don't think White was as good as Davis. I think it's a good move for Denny and Ryan to be on the radio and a new TV crew be found. White can certainly gripe about the team's lack of respect for him, but I don't think he's been wronged about the broadcasting job. |
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Glass wants BS sunshine... Look at Wal-Mart ads then go into most Wal-Marts.....see a difference? He's brought that to Royals base ball... |
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People don't like Joe Buck because he has a way of making great plays sound boring. People love a guy like Gus Johnson, even though he's far less polished than a Joe Buck, because he genuinely gets excited. |
Lot of people denouncing their fandom over this. Kind of weird considering A.) We don't know the whole story of why and B.) Fans have made it through almost 30 years of bad to terrible baseball by now. THIS is what has made you drop the Royals?
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Where does this "because he was too critical" claim come from? Has that been substantiated anywhere, or are people just pulling that out of thin air?
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I am sure Frank White has his own part in this, but I don't believe it was something that couldn't be worked out through more open communication on both sides. The thing is, I, as an average fan, freaking LOVE Frank White. I don't have any love for the Royals front office. Every single one of them could be fired tomorrow and I wouldn't care. Wouldn't be excited since I would just expect another iteration of what we have watched for the last 20 years, but I don't feel we would lose much. (I know, I know, we are always just 2-3 years away from not being totally shitty.) Frank White and Ryan Lefebre were a great match in the booth, making the best out of the shitty product on the field day after day. Royals could have at the very least continued status quo there. And more importantly should have been working to build bridges with Frank. |
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P.S. I am basing my opinion of his commentary on what I've read in this thread since I don't get the games out here. |
I've been giving a lot of thought to the Frank White firing this morning. If you haven't read Sam Mellinger's take on it, I think he's spot on:
http://www.kansascity.com/2011/12/02...als-frank.html Messy divorces always have valid points on both sides of the equation. Baseball is a business, yes. But major league sports are different businesses, unique in the lifetime love and devotion generated by fans. The only non-sports companies I can think of that have similar followings are Apple, Coca-Cola, Chevrolet, Harley-Davidson, etc. Frank White and George Brett are the faces of this franchise. Frank is KC's equivalent to Frank Robinson in Baltimore, or Bill Mazaroski in Pittsburgh, or Willie Mays in San Francisco. He grew up a KC kid. He went to high school in the shadow of old Municipal Stadium. He literally helped build Kauffman Stadium. He was the star graduate of the historic Royals "baseball academy." He won eight gold gloves. He was the first second baseman in the history of the World Series to hit clean up. He saved the Royals' bacon in game three of the 1985 series by providing a clutch game winning homer, a homer that kept the Royals series hopes alive. A loss would have put them down three games to zero. KC retired his number and put a statue of him in Kauffman Stadium. He is the defensive standard by which all second basemen are measured. He is unique, and special, and beloved in KC. The Royals have been living off 1985 nostalgia for the last twenty years. Frank White was a major component of that nostalgia. The Royals PR wanks put his face on a Pepsi Zero can last year. The Royals have used his nostalgia value to their advantage time and time again, and Frank has been a good soldier and company man. I'm sure he was disappointed by being passed over for Trey Hillman during the manager search after Bell quit. He did that three year stretch in Wichita to prove his commitment to managing and pay his dues. In retrospect, it's probably a good thing he didn't get the job. The lack of talent on the team would have killed any manager, and surely would have tarnished Frank's image in the eyes of Royals fans - The same fate that befell Hal McRae and John Wathan. On the TV side, yes, Frank is NOT a polished, slick broadcaster. But that's a big part of his appeal. What you get is an unvarnished baseball coach and spot on insight. I've watched literally hundreds of Royals baseball games. Frank White was never overly negative -believe me, NOBODY is more overly negative about Royals Baseball than George Blowfish- and he was always honest. Refreshingly honest in an era of sports public relations where everything is about hiding that man behind the curtain. It's hard to be a rah-rah guy when you're an ex-world champion and your team is losing 90 to 100 or more games year after year after year. The Royals as a team may have been in the gutter, but Frank was always a class act. The actual contract for baseball broadcasters works like this: Fox Sport Midwest chooses the talent and negotiates the contract. The candidate is chosen with the vetted approval of the Kansas City Royals. Apparently, both Fox and the Royals were in agreement that they want to overhaul the TV broadcast. My understanding is they're moving Ryan to radio with Denny, and that's OK. Frank did Fox a great service by filling in when Splitt got sick. I guess they had enough exposure to Frank's broadcast style that the suits wanted somebody who's more blindly optimistic, like Bob Davis. I personally HATE Bob Davis and think he's a brown nosing assbag, but that's a different discussion for a different day. The elephant in the room for me is, the Royals would NEVER treat George Brett this way. Brett's star shines brighter because he's a hall of famer. White is approachable, has a sunny disposition and he has always displayed a genuine love for Royals fans. Brett's reputation is more checkered. He has a reputation of being grumpy and rude to fans. That's OK, that's just who he is. But Brett has had this mafia-like untouchability in the Royals family. I don't think it's a "George is white and Frank is black" thing. I think it's a "George is in the Hall of Fame and Frank is not" thing. The HOF is a big, huge deal to baseball people. It makes you a "made man.". It's sad that if the Royals wanted to move Frank off of TV, that they couldn't have found a tangible, mutually beneficial spot for him in the organization. Frank is 61, so he's getting close to retirement age. He may have been happy with a job for a year or two as a roving instructor, or in talent evaluation, or some other baseball nuts and bolts position inside the organization. But divorces are messy. This one may never be resolved and that is a damn sad and lousy shame. |
$3it.
I was all prepared for a Frank Black thread... |
Here's a good take:
http://justincaseyouwerewondering.co...-pr-nightmare/ Cool pics of Frank over the years from the KC Star: http://www.kansascity.com/2011/12/02...the-years.html |
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I hate this. I thought, from the few broadcasts I did watch, that Frank White was a very good commentator. Not to mention what George posted about his legendary status in Kansas City with this franchise. It tarnishes what has been, so far, a great off-season IMHO.
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"The biggest mistake a company can make is to decide on a direction without its customers in mind." Exactly what happened here. Firing White is the Betancourt decision of PR moves at the absolute worst time (team about to be genuinely competitive and the All-Star game looming in 2012). |
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ROYALS FRONTOFFICE ARE IDIOTS FOR THIS. Also got rid of Producer Kevin Shank. I wonder if he fought to keep Frank, so they canned him too. Thought he ran a very good program.:cuss: |
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They better hope the Royals start winning this year with moves like this. |
Here is who the Royals did dirty. Saw this on the comments of Mellinger's article.
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The other thing: if you're going to make a move as potentially controversial as firing a local legend, you have to have the balls (and foresight) to speak about the move publicly. Give your reasons and side of the argument and you might go a long way to quelling public backlash, since most fall into the 80%.
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The Royals facebook page has erased every comment made about Frank White. Sad that they can't stand the heat in the kitchen:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/Royals Royals "official" release is up on their site: KANSAS CITY -- Frank White, a Royals Hall of Fame member, will not be back as the team's television broadcast analyst next season. The Royals and FOX Sports Kansas City announced on Friday that White, whose role in the TV booth grew to full-time status over the last three years, would not have his contract renewed. Also dropped was longtime TV producer Kevin Shank. Replacements are being sought, the club said. Frank White worked in the Royals' front office, managed the club's Double-A team and was the ALCS MVP in 1980. (AP) "They were both FOX employees, and we had conversations about their positions and the decision was made to just go in another direction," said Mike Swanson, Royals vice president of communications and broadcasting. White, 61, wasn't surprised by the decision -- "I knew it was coming," he said -- but he was upset enough to declare that he's severing ties with the team. "I'm not going to work for the Royals ever again," he said. "I am done with the Royals in entirety. I can't deal with them anymore." White, an eight-time winner of the American League Gold Glove at second base, grew up in Kansas City and has been a public face of the Royals for many years. His 20 is one of three numbers, along with George Brett's 5 and Dick Howser's 10, retired by the club. His statue stands inside Kauffman Stadium. What was White, who said he had a mutual option contract with FOX Sports to return in 2012, told about his dismissal? "When I talked to the guy at FOX, it was all about the Royals. They thought the broadcast was negative and they wanted to bring somebody in that was more in line with the thinking of the organization," White said. White didn't feel that he was negative on the air. "I didn't say anything negative about this ballclub last year," White said. "I just tried to be a coach and show people different things on defense and on offense that could help them understand the game a little bit better. And I've gotten so many comments from people that say, 'I really enjoy you on the broadcasts, I really learn something every time I watch the game.'" White drew on vast experience and success as a player. He appeared in seven postseasons with the Royals and was the AL Championship Series MVP in 1980 when he hit .545 and the team went on to its first World Series appearance. In the 1985 World Series victory over St. Louis, he batted in the cleanup spot and led the Royals with six RBIs. He was inducted into the Royals Hall of Fame in 1995. His TV role grew with the illness of Royals Hall of Fame pitcher Paul Splittorff, the TV analyst who died last May 25 of cancer. "What got lost in this, and needs to be remembered, is that Frank was called in for a difficult situation when Paul was sick, and I don't know that Frank was ever the full-time analyst. He was holding Paul's place until Paul could come back," Swanson said. "And, obviously, Paul didn't come back and now that we're beyond that situation, both parties [FOX and the Royals] have decided it's time to move on." Before becoming involved in team broadcasting, White had been a Royals coach (1997-2001), in the front office (2002-03), and was manager for their Double-A team at Wichita for three years (2004-06). More recently, White worked in community relations for the team but resigned as a full-time employee last January over what he called "a two-thirds cut" in salary. He continued to work as a part-time Spring Training instructor and in his TV role for FOX. But it's his 18 years on the field, during which he became one of the Royals' most revered players, that made him a Kansas City icon. He's the first graduate of team founder Ewing Kauffman's experimental Royals Academy to make the Majors. He's second on the team's career charts in games played (2,324), at-bats (7,859) and hits (2,006). His defensive play around second base earned him the nickname of "Smooth." Swanson was asked if he expected a backlash from Kansas City fans over White's departure. "I would expect our fans to continue to respect and appreciate everything Frank did for this organization," Swanson said. "I don't think any of that is diminished in this. Frank stepped up for us at time and we gave Frank an endorsement with FOX at a time we were really scrambling. And Frank stepped up for us. I hope this doesn't change people's views -- Frank will always be a very popular figure in the eyes of the Kansas City Royals." Left fielder Alex Gordon, who played under White at Wichita, was surprised by the news. "He's been with the Royals ever since I've been here, so it's kind of sad to see him go, but hopefully he can move on and find something for himself," Gordon said. "He was a very intelligent baseball person and knew what he was talking about and brought a lot of knowledge to the game. So I know myself and a lot of other guys are going to miss him." The Royals have no formal list of candidates to replace White, but former closer Jeff Montgomery, who did pre- and postgame work and a few games as an analyst last season, is certain to be on it. "Ultimately, it'll be FOX's hire with our input," Swanson said. Shank had been the Royals' TV producer for 17 years and before that worked as a technician on baseball telecasts since 1983. "FOX Sports Midwest general manager Jack Donovan told me that it was a joint decision between FOX and the Kansas City Royals, and the Royals were unhappy with the job that I was doing," Shank said. "Jack Donovan said that FOX was very happy with the job I had been doing since I'd been working for them." Shank said Donovan indicated the Royals felt the telecasts sometimes were too negative. "I strongly contradict that, because I've been a Royals fan since 1969 and I always tried to put the team in the best light in every telecast for over 17 years. And it's a shame that I can't do that anymore," Shank said. Ryan Lefebvre, who had been the FOX TV play-by-by voice, was considered for the Minnesota Twins' vacant radio job in October, but that possibility ended a month ago. Swanson indicated that the Royals and FOX are working on a long-term deal to keep Lefebvre in Kansas City. Meantime White, whose only time in another baseball organization was with Boston in 1992-96, is uncertain of his future. "All I want to do is work for another five years, retire and enjoy my grandkids and have some fun," White said. "And I thought I was going to do that with the Royals." |
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this sucks big time. they ****ed over one of the nicest guys in the game, and then try to censor out the fans when they give their opinion? bullshit. sec |
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Obviously I believe non-renewing his contract was the correct move, but the Royals handled this poorly. The Royals knew or should have known a couple things. First, Frank White is a very proud man, perhaps far too proud for his own good, where despite all the organization has done for him, he's constantly seeing himself as being disrespected. Second, it should have been clear to the Royals after just a few weeks of filling in for Split that this was not going to work.
Back then, Frank was still working PR and not yet been cemented in as the color analyst, and what the Royals should have done was sit him down, tell him straight-up that this was temporary and that if Split did not come back, they were moving in a new direction, but they'd love to have him working PR. If he reacted poorly to that, well he'd just started the TV gig and at least you were up-front with him. Instead, the Royals said nothing about his broadcasting, allowing him over a couple seasons to think he was doing well, and earlier this year due to his not having time for PR anymore, they slashed his PR pay by 2/3. That move may have been justified, and it may have been logical, but given his pride, it was a very stupid move. All it did was greatly piss him off to the point where he told the Royals to shove their PR job, and apparently (I wasn't aware of this) over the last season it was a poorly-kept secret in baseball that off the air and off the record, he'd blast the Royals management to anyone and everyone from any organization or news outlet who wanted to talk to him about it. If true, I'm not sure why he'd think the Royals would put up with that. From another board, this neatly sums up the disrespect to Frank White and what he's "owed". Quote:
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The "folks" who do? Legends of a particular organization. The kind who likely have statues in front of the parks, their numbers retired, and their likeness in the team's HOF. Kind of like that Frank White guy. Just when the Royals are starting to establish legitimacy and renewed respect, they cannot get out of their own way. |
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The sauce is weak. I don't care if White was a petulant pain the ****ing ass behind the scenes. On camera, he was likeable, and he'll be forever beloved by Royals fans. Thus, you don't cut him loose with a Friday firing. |
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Frank probably would have understood if they would have told him that he lacked in delivery, although he got much better as time went on. But making up a bullshit "too negative" reason is just nonsense. Told him he didn't measure up, he probably would have shook their hands and told them thanks for the chance.
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What, glASS preyed on these people... LMAO http://media.peopleofwalmart.com/wp-...009/10/833.jpg http://www.hayabusa.org/forum/attach...stuff-2551.jpg http://cdn1.lostateminor.com/wp-cont...f-walmart5.jpg http://youcallthatart.files.wordpres...an-scooter.jpg http://jeffpicard.com/blog/wp-conten...009/09/113.jpg http://mstaken.com/blog/wp-content/u...9/walmart1.jpg http://freecodesource.com/people-of-...3761491217.jpg |
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I'm not sure how I feel about this and I haven't posted in here just so I wouldn't be too reactionary. Frank is my all time favorite athelete and I don't really have "heros" but he's as close as there would be.
I hate that I won't hear him on broadcasts anymore but I get to watch so few Royals broadcasts it won't really affect me. Knowing he's not there sucks more than the actually not hearing him. As pointed out elevently million times, Frank is as classy and likable a guy as you'll ever find... and of course he's a Royals and Kansas City icon... so from those angles I find it bothersome. As a few have also pointed out, he isn't the most polished broadcaster you'll find... but there are plenty of popular broadcasters who aren't. What Frank means to the Royals imo is worth more than his prowess as a broadcaster. It's not like he's bad... in fact he can be quite good. Very insightful and informative in ways a guy who's never played the game at that level could ever be. But if they wanted a more polished guy I can understand that. I think the biggest problem was how it was handled which makes them look like a bunch of bitches. I'm not proud of the organization on this but I'm still looking forward to a season of growth and becoming a competeitive team again. One guy... no matter how popular... does not a team or organization make. Even if he is/was my personal favorite. It's too bad it had to end this way. Frank deserves better and I hope that he'll remain with the team in some capacity, but if he doesn't I understand. As always I'll wish him the best and he'll always be my favorite player. The Royals will also always be my favorite team. Here's to hoping both Frank and the Royals go on to bigger and better things. |
Here's a pretty good evaluation of the situation. In a nutshell, they say its a small group of golf shirt wearing, privileged middle aged men having a pissing contest. Maybe. But crap like this shouldn't happen. At least the Royals ineptness didn't drive Frank to eat a shotgun blast, like the Orioles did to Mike Flanagan.
http://tinyurl.com/7uzgvkm |
That's about it... I think it has everything to do with Frank being passed over for the manager job. He's a competitive guy, I imagine his relationship with this front office was ruined when that happened.
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I just don't think the Royals were planning on quite this much backlash over it. Another fail on their part... As a fan, while I'll admit I saw a lot more potential this coming year than I've seen in the past, they still aren't at the point where they can fire fan-favorite icons because they think they're smart. They're not... I wish Frank the best, and I hope he stays around KC, and speaks to us about Royals baseball. Now more than ever we'll know we're getting the straight scoop... |
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