Originally Posted by InChiefsHell (Post 10348186)

Ah ****. We scored 44 goddam points. That's more than enough to win a ****ing game. When you are up by 4 ****ing TDs in the second half, you have no business losing...unless your defense shits the bed with corn and peanut filled steaming piles of diarrhea. **** this "defense". That's where the problem was and is.

Originally Posted by Rexx (Post 10346833)

I am still reeling from one of the worst Chief losses in history and I've seen most of them as a fan of 30 years. I like to think I've got pretty good intuition and here is my worry...

It was nice to see Andy Reid turn the ship around so quickly. I don't think any of us envisioned such a quick turnaround, restoring hope to the fan base and putting people in the seats. That being said, I'm concerned that Reid could likely loose control of this ship pretty quickly if things don't progress from this point.

1. Reid obviously has little understanding of clock management. Yes, we heard that from Philly fans...but witnessing it first hand takes any of the doubt away. Up 28, he needs to attempt to burn some clock to limit the Indy possessions. Many issues throughout the season...there has to be someone who can help him with this.

2. He is extremely loyal to his players and assistant coaches. Because of that, we will likely not see any changes to the staff as he has already mentioned. Sorry Reid, but after that kind of meltdown and getting trashed by national media, a change to the defensive coordinator position should be made. Being stuck with Sutton for the next several years is not going to take us to the next level. As mentioned numerous times on this forum, Sutton is unwilling to make changes or bring pressure when needed...he coaches scared! And it appears Reid will allow this to continue as he had 8 weeks to help change it and did not. NOT A GOOD SIGN AT ALL.

3. Reid has always been known as a "players" coach. He doesn't lay blame and players seems to like that. However, I question his ability to motivate his players especially on the defensive side of the ball. You never see any of the coaching staff show much emotion nor the players. Andy sits back staring at his play calling chart and that's about it. Maybe he has a few of the Marty speeches down, but I don't see it on the field. I also know this was a concern in Philly as he didn't always hold his players accountable when looking at results and effort aka Kendrick Lewis.

4. His general lack of commitment to the run. I'm all for passing as it's a passing league. However, when 1st and goal on the 4 yard line...run the damn ball. GEEZ.

I hope I'm wrong, but these issues are pretty alarming and makes me question if Reid is the long term answer even though he won 11 games this year. Things are going to get tougher...he needs to improve or he will sink eventually. My 2 cents.....

I'm starting to think we should have looked at a young, up and coming coach instead of a retread with proven faults. Some may say this is an overreaction coming one day after a playoff loss...but these things have been apparent for the last 8 games. Anyone else feel this way?

Originally Posted by gosampel (Post 10346925)

Like my dad said years ago to the Hunt's the nfl football is a hobby, not a job they make their main money on

Originally Posted by GloryDayz (Post 10348475)

LOL, we often forget that what the Hunt's make on the Chefs is just shoe money for the family's girls and a great opportunity to meet Pro players and to travel. If not for the ladies shoe shopping, Clark would lose the $30M in the sofa! :thumb:

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By (Post 10348391)

Andy Reid is Andy Reid. He's the same guy he was in Philly. I don't understand why there would be any issue of tarnish.

Originally Posted by KCChiefsFan88 (Post 10348508)

Andy Reid did a great job this year.

Hopefully he makes the right decision and fires Sutton.

Also Dorsey needs another big offseason this year to ensure the Chiefs get back to the playoffs next season.

Originally Posted by TEX (Post 10348513)

I agree. The deal is he is not going to fire Sutton and because of that, the shine for me has tarnished a bit. He does not need to let Sutton be GRob part Deaux. If he ignores the early signs and does nothing, that's exactly where this is headed.

Originally Posted by KCChiefsFan88 (Post 10348568)

First question out of Andy Reid's mouth to Bob Sutton should have been "Why didn't we make Hilton the focal point of our defense in the second half… why was he wide open virtually every play?"

Originally Posted by npayne1978 (Post 10348194)

You guys are completely missing what I'm saying. I'll just stay off the boards because you guys know it all. It must be nice to know everything there is to know about football.

Not everything, just more than you. It apparently doesn't take much with the hilarity you've been posting.

I love the Chiefs and I love JC. I just feel like once again we got the short end of the stick, when we needed him he wasn't there. In 1993 we needed Joe Montana and he went out with a concussion.

OR....

We needed our defense to stop Thurman Thomas, and we needed Marty to keep our best defensive player on the football field instead of benching him the entire second half.

In 1995 we needed a kicker,

OR.....

We just needed to do what got us there, which was running the football. Marty abandoned the running game when it was clearly working. That game should not have come down to a FG try, let alone three.


In 2003 we needed Priest not to fumble

Heh.

How about we needed our defense to make a stop? One stop. Putting that loss on Priest Holmes and the offense is about as stupid as trying to put this loss on Alex Smith for missing Cyrus Gray.


and in 2013 we needed our horse running back and he was hurt.

Last I checked, we scored 44 points without Jamaal. Love the guy, but we did fine without him. What we needed was once again, a defense to show up and make stops.

You guys think I'm bashing JC and I'm not.

I actually thought you were attempting to set the record for the furthest anyone has shoved their head up their own ass before posting on an internet board.

Originally Posted by Wallcrawler (Post 10348719)

Football is a team sport. You cant sit and point fingers at one guy and let slide the atrocity of the performance of one of your team's units. Doesn't work that way.

Charles is very quickly approaching the top of the mountain in terms of Chiefs Franchise Running Backs. The fact that we scored 44 points without him should speak volumes of the talent level and capability of our often questioned Quarterback, given what he did and who he did that with without the threat of Jamaal Charles back there.

Shit happens. He didn't just decide 6 plays into the game to just Peace Out and leave the work to Smith and Knile Davis.

Originally Posted by milkman (Post 10348169)

No, the problem on offense is that Reid tried to utilize the short passing game to burn clock rather than continue to attack.

Originally Posted by npayne1978 (Post 10348731)

Good points. While you play with comic books I actually play football. I'm entitled to my opinion and I agree they scored 44 without JC. The problem is they needed 46 to get the job done.

Originally Posted by Wallcrawler (Post 10348719)

Football is a team sport. You cant sit and point fingers at one guy and let slide the atrocity of the performance of one of your team's units. Doesn't work that way.

Charles is very quickly approaching the top of the mountain in terms of Chiefs Franchise Running Backs. The fact that we scored 44 points without him should speak volumes of the talent level and capability of our often questioned Quarterback, given what he did and who he did that with without the threat of Jamaal Charles back there.

Shit happens. He didn't just decide 6 plays into the game to just Peace Out and leave the work to Smith and Knile Davis.

Originally Posted by Wallcrawler (Post 10348764)

Or, you know, maybe they needed to not give up 35 points in a half of football.

How youre pinning this loss on the offense is quite beyond me. As for you playing football, I don't know why that is even said. Is that supposed to impress anyone here?

It doesn't.

Originally Posted by npayne1978 (Post 10348731)

Good points. While you play with comic books I actually play football. I'm entitled to my opinion and I agree they scored 44 without JC. The problem is they needed 46 to get the job done.

I never pointed a finger at a single player, the entire defense ****ed that game up. My point was when we needed our playmaker he wasn't there and because of that people will always say "what if" and when you have a "what if" hanging over you it can take away some of the shine. After all that's what the thread is about.

Originally Posted by Brainiac (Post 10348787)

I thought you were going to stop posting? Damn, that didn't last long.

Originally Posted by npayne1978 (Post 10348777)

Buddy, I'm not blaming the loss on the offense! It's clear as ****ing day that the defense blew that game. I'm with you guys man, I'm on the good guys side. I was just posting because NFL Network was talking about JC and "what if". That's all.

Originally Posted by npayne1978 (Post 10348777)

Buddy, I'm not blaming the loss on the offense! It's clear as ****ing day that the defense blew that game. I'm with you guys man, I'm on the good guys side. I was just posting because NFL Network was talking about JC and "what if". That's all.

Originally Posted by Brainiac (Post 10348796)

If you make a stupid post, there are 3 ways to handle it. You can (1) ignore it and wait for everyone to forget about it, (2) admit you made a stupid post and just move on, or (3) make about 20 additional posts about the same ****ing topic.

#3 isn't working for you. You're obviously incapable of #2, so my advice is to belatedly go with #1. In other words, if you would just shut up about it, it would blow over. If you continue to look for ways to justify it or excuse it or explain it or try to convince everybody that misunderstood you, you will just prolong your own agony. Drop it and move on.

Originally Posted by Wallcrawler (Post 10348792)

So how should one take this statement, if not as an indictment against the offense?

"I agree they scored 44 without JC. The problem was they needed 46 to get the job done."

We didn't need Jamaal to miraculously recover to win that game. We needed the ****ing defense to go out and for one single series, do their ****ing job.

What ifs are just fodder for media tools who lack the creativity to come up with something worthwhile to talk about. What if the Chiefs fielded a halfway competent defense?

We're not having this discussion, that's what. The real question would have been how many scores would we have crushed them by.

Originally Posted by npayne1978 (Post 10348799)

Right on, thanks for the advice. I know I'm new and I'm trying not to step on toes.

Originally Posted by Brainiac (Post 10348813)

Believe me, everybody on this site has made stupid posts from time to time. I know I've made my share.

Just forget about it, and everybody else will too.

Originally Posted by Mavericks Ace (Post 10348862)

I have ignored this thread all day.

I don't understand it.

he watches his premiere player go down. He watches his qb play the game of his life, and he watches his players fall like flies all game.

he was handcuffed with the talent he had on offense to begin with, then you lose not only Charles, but avery, then Knile.

The shine?

I think its shining brighter than ever.

Originally Posted by Wallcrawler (Post 10349077)

This.

Take a trip back in your mind. I know its tough to relive that game, but go back to the 6th play of the opening drive with Jamaal Charles lying motionless on the turf.

In that moment, did you think that KC had a snowball's chance in hell of winning that game?

Originally Posted by Wallcrawler (Post 10349077)

Did you think that Alex Smith would be more than up to the task of carrying this football team on his back with wildly inconsistent receivers and here today, gone tomorrow pass protection, all with the dreaded GAME MANAGER label slapped firmly across his chest?

I sure didn't.

Originally Posted by Wallcrawler (Post 10349077)

While the loss was excruciatingly painful, it did open my eyes to one undeniable fact.

Alex Smith can carry this team with his arm. It was the one thing I always questioned about him. Not only did he carry the team with his arm, but he did it without Jamaal even being in the game. The guy who accounted for 1/3 of the KC Chiefs offensive production was out and Smith still orchestrated a 44 point offensive production.

Andy Reid said the entire time that Alex Smith was his guy. He didn't want anyone else, and they never even considered drafting a QB with the first overall pick.

I have my issues with Reid in certain situations, but as far as Im concerned he's done a helluva job with the 2-14 abortion that he took over. Quarterback was our most glaring need and Andy's handpicked guy ****ing delivered. He did. I know we lost the game but Alex Smith showed up to play and the D just left him hanging.

Because of Andy Reid, Im not praying to the football gods for a quarterback this offseason.

Generally the first season is the rough one when a new staff comes in. Im looking forward to what he can do with these guys in year two.

Originally Posted by milkman (Post 10347294)

I can not disagree with the first point anymore.
Andy Reid tried to utilize the run game t burn some clock, and the ground game produced about 2 yards per carry.

With that result, Reid turned to the short passing game.

But where he failed, as far as I'm concerned, is that he went conservative to protect the lead with 12 or 13 minutes left in the the 3rd quarter.

I don't care how much you are up, that's far too early to go into lead protection mode.

Originally Posted by milkman (Post 10347294)

I can not disagree with the first point anymore.
Andy Reid tried to utilize the run game t burn some clock, and the ground game produced about 2 yards per carry.

With that result, Reid turned to the short passing game.

But where he failed, as far as I'm concerned, is that he went conservative to protect the lead with 12 or 13 minutes left in the the 3rd quarter.

I don't care how much you are up, that's far too early to go into lead protection mode.

Originally Posted by GloryDayz (Post 10348560)

I don't think Bob knows how to be anything but Greg Part-II. The man isn't going to change at 62, so Andy would need to silently replace him (let him stand around but mute his Mic and let some other ghost coach call the plays) if he wants to see any creativity out of the skill-challenged goons.

Originally Posted by Wallcrawler (Post 10348764)

Or, you know, maybe they needed to not give up 35 points in a half of football.

How youre pinning this loss on the offense is quite beyond me. As for you playing football, I don't know why that is even said. Is that supposed to impress anyone here?

It doesn't.

Originally Posted by RunKC (Post 10349181)

28 passes and only 10 runs in the 2nd half is inexcusable.

I'm sorry but wtf Reid? We were warned about this. I don't give a flying **** if we were down to Cyrus Gray. Run the ball. Burn the clock. Don't throw incompletions and stop the clock.

Originally Posted by ChiefsandO'sfan (Post 10349188)

Did you even watch the game? We Avg 2 ypc in 2nd half.

Originally Posted by htismaqe (Post 10349200)

OK, just assume that excuse is acceptable.

What's the excuse for snapping the ball with 14-15 seconds left on the play clock every play then?

Originally Posted by htismaqe (Post 10349200)

OK, just assume that excuse is acceptable.

What's the excuse for snapping the ball with 14-15 seconds left on the play clock every play then?

Originally Posted by ChiefsandO'sfan (Post 10349188)

Did you even watch the game? We Avg 2 ypc in 2nd half.

Originally Posted by RunKC (Post 10349224)

I don't care. Burn the clock. I'd rather burn about 4 mins off of each drive trying to run everytime instead of throwing incompletions and stopping the clock.

Our first 2 drives after going up 4 TD's were less than 2 minutes long. If we would have ran the ball everytime that's about 4 minutes on each of those drives.

Originally Posted by ChiefsandO'sfan (Post 10349214)

They snap it with 3 or 5 seconds most plays.

Originally Posted by RunKC (Post 10349181)

28 passes and only 10 runs in the 2nd half is inexcusable.

I'm sorry but wtf Reid? We were warned about this. I don't give a flying **** if we were down to Cyrus Gray. Run the ball. Burn the clock. Don't throw incompletions and stop the clock.

Originally Posted by MahiMike (Post 10349289)

So You wanted 3 and outs, burning 90 seconds a possession? Sounds like a plan.

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2 (Post 10349370)

You have to try to run the ball and the clock.

Originally Posted by milkman (Post 10347294)

I can not disagree with the first point anymore.
Andy Reid tried to utilize the run game t burn some clock, and the ground game produced about 2 yards per carry.

With that result, Reid turned to the short passing game.

But where he failed, as far as I'm concerned, is that he went conservative to protect the lead with 12 or 13 minutes left in the the 3rd quarter.

I don't care how much you are up, that's far too early to go into lead protection mode.

Originally Posted by Brainiac (Post 10349390)

Not when your only running back is Cyrus Gray. How can you guys not understand that?

Originally Posted by KCChiefsFan88 (Post 10348768)

Andy Reid is still a million times better than the Herm/Haley/Romeo clown act we had to endure the previous 8 years.

Originally Posted by ChiefsandO'sfan (Post 10349386)

2nd half Drives


3 plays TD 1:15 elapsed
4 plays 32 yards Smith fumble 2:47 elapsed
3 plays 5 Yards Punt 1:34 elapsed (2 runs on the 3 and out)
3 plays 4 yards FG 1:32 elapsed (1 run no yards)
6 plays 40 yards 2:44 elapsed (2 runs plays)
11 plays 58 yards FG 5:02 elapsed (3 run plays)
6 plays 37 yards 2:26 elapsed (Last drive)


So in the 2nd half the Chiefs had the ball for 17min 20sec

What more do you want the O to do?

The Colts scored 35 points in 12 min 40sec. CAN WE PLEASE STOP BLAMING THE O

Originally Posted by Sure-Oz (Post 10349407)

how hard is this guys? The defense gave up 45 ****ing points and had a 28 point lead. Blaming the offense for any of that game is ridiculous.

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2 (Post 10349452)

If Smith connects with Gray you don't think the outcome is different?

Originally Posted by RunKC (Post 10349464)

Nobody is bagging the O. It's Reid. You could tell he went into lead protection mode and that's unacceptable

Originally Posted by DeezNutz (Post 10349486)

Petro with a great opening monologue. Blows up Sutton. Says that Reid's potential decision to keep him is very reminiscent of Vermeil's misdirected loyalty to inept assistants.

Spot on.

Must have major change on the defensive side of the ball. By the numbers, the Chiefs were among the very worst in the league in the second half of the year.

Originally Posted by Sure-Oz (Post 10349502)

Career day defense lives, except i dont recall them giving up td drives in 2 min every damn time

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2 (Post 10349448)

Why can't you fathom that some of the blame can be spread around? When you blow a 28 point second half lead, lots of things went wrong. How about a kickoff return making it past the twenty? Bowe dropping a third down pass? Reid's play calling and use of timeouts? Lack of a pass rush? Smith's strip sack? Houston letting a ball sail right through his hands? Hemingway not blocking for Bowe? Where were KCs defensive leaders? All little things that could have changed the outcome.

Originally Posted by HemiEd (Post 10349586)

That is way too complicated of a thought process for some of these people.

44 points should just be enough, no matter what happened.

Originally Posted by ChiefsandO'sfan (Post 10349589)

35 points in 12 minutes need i say more? This is on the D 4 touchdown each Under 2 minutes

Originally Posted by HemiEd (Post 10349640)

When you are in a shootout, which this was, you have to keep shooting and hitting. No question, the D was pure ass, but they did get 4 turnovers. Alex Smith played his ass off and gave it his all, but he was not without fault and even he says that. It was a team and coaching devastating loss.

Originally Posted by ClevelandBronco (Post 10347438)

I've read that you don't need a better coach, you just need a better plot line.

Originally Posted by ChiefsandO'sfan (Post 10349654)

38-10 Please tell me again why this game turned into a shootout?

Originally Posted by Sandy Cheeks (Post 10349691)

The play intended is to be a WR screen to McC.

Originally Posted by Sandy Cheeks (Post 10349691)

Not so much about Reid, but the game itself...

The score is 45-44 and there is just over 2 minutes left. Two very nice Smith to Bowe connections... and Knile run, and KC is just inside the short 40 yd line. It is 2nd and 7..

The play intended is to be a WR screen to McC.

First major issue.. Stephenson at RT barely gets a hand on the 2 pt stance rusher coming around the edge... he turned back inside to help against the DL, but there was zero need for that, as Sherman stepped in front of him.

Second issue... Jeff Allen at LG completely leaves the DE alone on the other side, because he wants to run straight our to potentially block for the WR screen YAC. Free rush up the LG gap and essentially a free rush around the RT edge...

Yes, this was the intentional grounding call... which for all we can tell, Alex is trying to throw the ball somewhere legit.. but the sandwiched hits on him allowed for the ball to go wildly out of bounds.

terrible decision from the RT to barely touch the standup rusher.... terrible decision from LG to not make any contact with the DL before running out wide...

oops... never mind on the underlined... looks now like Alex did make the throw just prior to any contact altering the pass location...

Originally Posted by ViperVisor (Post 10349720)

I have to add the McC ran the play like you would during warm ups.

He goes up sets up the cut and then does a cut. He should be cutting directly across because the throwing lane is going to be inside of the DE not outside.

The play sort of worked and there was a throwing lane but there was no McCluster to receive the pass.

Originally Posted by mcaj22 (Post 10349738)

Robert Mathis is just way better than any lineman that we have/threw it him. Nobody on the Chiefs can block him.

The other guy running in free was that stupid MLBer they have from the CFL. He's not even good, he just runs a 4.5. his job was to blitz and run sideline to sideline and cover the flats. Cause he's fast enough.

That's all the NFL pass defenses are today, find a MLB that can run a sub 4.5 and have him out there for pass coverage. That's it.

Originally Posted by Sandy Cheeks (Post 10349773)

well... I hear that. Guess my point was.. RT simply HAS to stay on the rusher that's free and not turn inside to block a DL that is being blocked already. That, and the LG simply HAS to make contact with the incoming rusher before running out wide.. take his momentum away.. or said rusher will get to the QB quickly enough to blow the play up.

Originally Posted by mcaj22 (Post 10349823)

that's the difference, Greg Manusky knew his secondary was terrible/injured so he kept blitzing

Bob Sutton, well he was just shitting in his depends clueless.