Contacting another live civilization would have lots of external impacts. Proving that another live civilization exists would have lots of internal impacts.

Ditto why we haven't been visited by earthlings from the future. Conclusion: time travel is not possible or the people with it in the future would have come back to visit us by now.

That is one of the greatest myths still in circulation.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...cent-of-brain/

Edit: oops, somebody best me to it.

Agreed. To me, it's either that or "everyone else is so far more advanced than us that we can't even comprehend it". But that seems unlikely.

But as cdcox cleverly alluded, maybe one of the rules of Time Travel Club is that you don't talk about Time Travel Club.

Excellent article thanks for posting it.

I don't think we need to be "savant" or super intelligence" species to be able to travel at the speed of sound.

What an awesome read. Thanks for the link.

Egads, you are forcing my mind to recall my Organic Chemistry classes of 35 years ago. I haven't heard sinister and dextro for 35 years.

If there are a lot of advanced civilizations and the superpredator theory is true, then it seems like we'd be picking up signals that then stop abruptly.

If 0.3% of the budget is a lot then the answer is yes. NASAs entire budget since it's inception is less than the bank bail out of 2008.

The speed of sound is not a particularly difficult achievement as far as physics is concerned.

The speed of light, or even coming very close to it if you want to think about relativistic travel, is an extremely daunting physics challenge, and comes very close to "pretty much impossible".

the human race needs to birth some more Isaac newtons so we can develop light speed travel. Oh I came up with physics but I need a type of math to make it work, k cool just invented calculus.

the article gives the analogy of if you go into an office building with a walkie talkie you won't hear anything because everyone is using cell phones and texting

Sorry, I meant light.

And of course it seems "pretty much impossible" today. We thought black holes were a myth 50 years ago. Convinced the world was flat 400 years ago. etc. etc.

I think that's a different problem. I guess I'm assuming that the communication problem is solved (by us or the gigantic wolf spiders that kill everything).

yeah I like to think of the predator aliens as the bugs from starship troopers

It's because reality is a computer simulation and "extraterrestrial" intelligence wasn't called for in the programming.

At this point, the only possibility I'm conceding is a warp drive. And even that requires some exotic materials that probably do not exist. The laws of physics are pretty clear that matter can not travel at the speed of light, even a single atom using nearly infinite energy. The only way around it is to cheat by moving at a normal speed through warped space.

The answer lies in the other 90% of our brains that we aren't using.

Great article. The one on time was a great read as well.

Doesn't NASA only get like half of a penny on the dollar of the overall budget? Half of one percent does not seem like a pretty nice share compared to how much other wasteful spending is out there (I promise you that I'm not trying to be political).

We are talking about a civilization who has only had automobiles for 100 years, and even we have some understanding of how the gigantic hurdle of those vast distances can be circumvented.

Here's what will happen when space travelers come to Earth
<iframe width="640" height="360" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/NIufLRpJYnI?feature=player_detailpage" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

It would have to be this or a worm hole.
If we were to travel at anywhere near the speed of light, by the time you returned from a 5 year mission, 100 years would have lapsed and everyone you know would be dead.

Or just maybe...

They have a device shaped like a pen that can replace any memories of an encounter, with what ever scenario they want to use. They would hold it up and flash it like an old time camera and then say what they wanted us to think.

"An even more advanced civilization might view the entire physical world as a horribly primitive place, having long ago conquered their own biology and uploaded their brains to a virtual reality, eternal-life paradise. Living in the physical world of biology, mortality, wants, and needs might seem to them the way we view primitive ocean species living in the frigid, dark sea."

The author briefly covers this as a possibility, but given how relatively close we are to having the computing capacity to mirror and download human consciousness, this seems like the likely answer. Perhaps every civilization that develops the capable of interstellar travel, etc. just chose virtual.

A fun short story by Isaac Asimov entitled "The Last Question" talks about this.

http://www.multivax.com/last_question.html

It could tie into our eventual understanding of dark matter and dark energy. It's out there and there's apparently a galactic shit ton of it.

This is another interesting view.

I also like the multi-verse option. Like there's 1000's of versions of our universe and in one of them they figure out how to jump from universe to universe. It's an alien version of us and they really like sticking things in peoples butt's and blowing up cows. They're a bunch of multi-universe jokesters.

Ok, I called him last night and told him. He's a jerk too, thinks he knows everything! I told him he better be looking over his shoulder cause when I find him I'm kicking his ass.

It's just too damn far. One of the things that fascinates me about the universe is how long it would take to get to another galaxy. The nearest spiral galaxy is what...2.5 million light years away? Whenever I think about how far light could travel in 2.5 million years it blows my mind. If there are "aliens" that have been here or are here, I have to think it's some kind of interdimensional visitor and not some intergalactic visitor.

This is just too damn depressing. :(

Tell him he still owes me money from that incident in Savannah.

yeah it really is hard to comprehend that distance

It's easier when you put it linear compared to Chiefs superbowls

I loved his little pointy head. Phil did the whole board a huge disservice nuking him off the map.

How much ? when I find him I'll beat it outta him.

ROFL
Hawking would prob. use his awesome brain power to control a laser he built as an afternoon time killer- to blast a hole through both of your eyeballs before you could get close.

You need quantum computers to do the math. I posted about these new quantum computers in the science is cool thread if you want to look it up.

It's not that far off. Physics.org posted this just today about Google opening up access to their quantum computer.

http://phys.org/news/2014-05-google-...layground.html


Quantum Computing Playground can simulate quantum registers up to 22 qubits, run Grover's and Shor's algorithms, and has quantum gates built into the scripting language itself.

Lots of progress on single atom approach to quantum computers.
http://physicsworld.com/cws/article/...ntum-computing

A quantum-information analogue of the transistor has been unveiled by two independent groups in Germany and the US. Both devices comprise a single atom that can switch the quantum state of a single photon. The results are a major step towards the development of practical quantum computers.\


Unlike conventional computers, which store bits of information in definite values of 0 or 1, quantum computers store information in qubits, which are a superposition of both values. When qubits are entangled, any change in one immediately affects the others. Qubits can therefore work in unison to solve certain complex problems much faster than their classical counterparts.



Qubits can be created from either light or matter, but many researchers believe that the practical quantum computers of the future will have to rely on interactions between both. Unfortunately, light tends only to interact with matter when the light is very intense and the matter is very dense. To make a single photon and a single atom interact is a challenge because the two are much more likely to pass straight through each other.

Thats another wild, probably sci-fi, possibility. If a 4th or 5th dimension exists, whatever the hell that might mean, and if we were capable of existing in those dimensions, and if distance was meaningless in those dimensions.

I think there's a point coming in our future (I don't know when...) where we'll significantly alter and/or find ways around the laws of physics as we currently understand them. I think there's a certain (understandable) arrogance about how we see current understanding as the end of knowledge rather than a still fairly early point on a long road.

I think if there were/are extraterrestrials here (and I think it's a possibility, albeit a remote one), they're probably here for reasons we can't understand doing things we can't understand in ways that we can't understand. Sort of like Clarke's law about sufficiently advanced technology looking like magic.

If aliens are here, we're probably only alive because they like our beer or something. Or because they like having sex with our hookers.

I can't possibly argue this. ROFL

You can go really crazy and think about wacky possibilities like extraterrestrials here as energy forms who've evolved beyond physical forms. Or along your lines, maybe an extraterrestrial bioorganism indistiguishable (to us) from yeast that's actually a hive organism infesting all our beer with some kind of altered CO2 for some nefarious reason like making it all taste like natural light.

We live in a really fascinating time. Pre filter I would say.

The way the numbers crunch, more and more, people are beginning to not simply believe that other life/civilizations could exist, but given the scale of the universe they do and must exist.

Which puts things in a strange place.

It's a place where without evidence people are coming closer and closer to 100% assurance that other civilizations exist while at the same time coming to almost the exact opposite conclusion about a God/creator being.

As folks begin to view time as almost limitless, they begin to take very unlikely events and turn them into pretty likely events.

Unlikely + huge amounts of hard to comprehend time= Likely


I thought the article was great. Lots to process.

Well, there's definitely some mystery to that because there have been many cases where brain damage has unlocked ubergenius abilities in otherwise ordinary folks.

This, of course, is a regular occurrence at every point of progress.

Eratosthenes calculated the circumference of the Earth a couple of hundred years BC. Columbus had this knowledge when he sailed, although he thought the numbers were off.

If you want to talk black holes you can look back to John Michell in the late 1700's.

The Fermi Paradox is horseshit, it was dispelled a long time ago... in reality, you're/we're all just a bunch of ants staring up at the sun.

"Well scientist so and so says, in fact multiple bigshot Mr. So and So's say, its an absurdity to think we already have visitors... nope, its all just too complicated for us and anything else in the universe to understand or overcome.

Now back to American Idol...

This thread proves how arrogant most people are, the info from official sources is right there in your ****ing faces if you'd just look and still you hold out.

The **** are you blabbering on about, Scott?

The **** you questioning me about, slim?

I'm telling you and all of these other mfers that the truth is hidden right there in front your ****ing faces... its not crazy old Free over here, listen to astronauts, defense ministers, former heads of Project Bluebook etc.

I give a **** if you or any of the other brilliant minds here agree or not, I'm not the one ignoring blatant evidence in the public domain, slim.

LMAO

Ah, Scott. I'm just ****ing with you, my man.

It's so easy to get a rise out of you!

It's an interesting topic. The reality is that civilizations just don't last very long and on top of that, intergalactic travel is pretty damn impossible. Sure, there are inhabitable planets billions of years older than earth, but that doesn't necessarily mean they are billions of years of technology ahead of us. Dinosaurs ruled the planet for over 100 million years and mankind is only a few thousand. We're only one stray asteroid from being completely set back to the stone age.

we're alone / Religion

Fun article.
The filter and distance from intelligent life On planet A to planet B makes it near impossible to ever find out.
25 years ago I had a conversations with the old man about this topic.
He flatly stated that he did not believe intelegent life existed anywhere else in the universe. Something about probabilities blah blah blah.

Welp... lock the thread guys, it's been dispelled.

Wait... dispelled?

Well, by definition, God would be an alien...

The ability to travel at the speed of light is useless without the ability to steer and stop the vessel. There are a couple of problems here.

I once dropped a tie rod at 70mph and lived. I would hate to drop a tie rod going any faster than that.

I don't think you have a clear path out there in space. There's lotsa space boulders floatin' around. Not to mention all the space junk from the stuff they blowed up in them Star Wars movies.

What kind of reaction time would it take to drive at the speed of light? You'd have to be Madam Cleo or somethin'.

Dinny

Well, way over 99% of the universe is actually empty space. That's why they call it space. :D In many spots, you could travel for millions of light years in any direction and not even see anything to run into. The emptiness between galaxies is mind bottling.

But you're right that we'd have a problem with speed and collisions. You really wouldn't be able to see and react to anything during travel that fast. I'd guess that we'd have to create a 3D map of the travel area and completely program flights ahead of time.

I believe we're past the filter. Unfortunately we will create our own . I believe we will become so dependent on technology and civilization that eventually a disaster will occur that leaves only the rugged, well built, well prepared, good looking humans, you know stallions like me. Unfortunately all these dooms day prepped survivalists are not even up to nasa standards, so your set back in technology and education every few thousand years. That leads to a slightly different path of evolution for the entire planet. Which never allows you to make it to level II. What I'm saying is the human race will filter itself through an uncontrollable disaster or massive war a few times until 1000 generations down your begging your Sasquatch looking daughter to breed with a man bear pig neighbor so your grand baby can be the manbearsquatchpig that finally takes the chiefs to an astro bowl.

LMAO

Excellent article! I'm glad you posted it.

Extra Terestrials are Mark Cuban.

We're the black guys in hoodies, and the white boy with head tats.

- Professor Charles Xavier

We're never gonna make level II until there's a minimum intelligence standard for breeding. I propose a shot to make the body sterile at 13. At 18 your tested if your not the future of idiocracy you are eligible to breed. If not you get a neck tat and another shot. Now here's the beauty. You got all these increasingly intelligent people running around stressing over research and what have you. They walk out find em a broad with a neck tat, **** her stupid and go back to work without fear of consequence. It's gonna take it's toll on the used mobile home business and foot print gas pedal installers but it's a faster track to level 2.

The country road analogy- essentially the chances of coming to a 4 way stop / intersection at the same time when each car has the entire earth to roam and there's only 1 other car you could intersect with. To add a 2nd car (the 2nd closest planet with life) you have to increase the size of the earth / drivable terrain exponentially each time you want to add another "car" you might be able to intersect with at some point given the endless possible # of routes you could take.

/ applause

Also, please be careful not to fall off the ends of the earth. And, please tip your waitress.

Would also need deflectors shields to clear the small stuff.

Which would need to absorb insane amounts of energy. Hitting anything at near the speed of light would release unimaginable energy. It's hard to imagine it would ever be possible.

Just gotta slap on a few high powered inertial dampeners. No biggie.

By then we would be able to harness all of the energy in the sun, so we'll have that going for us.

Maybe we have already been visited by aliens?

if you find a way to travel in a physical space that is different then the one with asteroids and planets and stuff, then you don't have to worry about hitting anything when you travel.

Now we're talking..

Actually the Catholic Church has been talking quite openly about aliens recently. They've had a telescope in Arizona for years, basically in an effort to mend fences between the Church and science, and they held a conference at the Vatican centered around alien life in 2009 and just a couple of days ago co-sponsored another, this time in Arizona.

Does not knowing the difference between a possessive pronoun and a contraction mean that you fail the test?