Good, that would be a terrible deal for them. I don't see any reason to trade Travis Snider at this point.

And I'm not even sure why Greinke would want to play for the Jays next year...they are a 85 win team in a division where you need at least 95 wins.

There is very good reason to believe that this will be a down year for the AL East. If the Blue Jays EVER want to make a run at the division, they arguably have to go for it now.

A down year, haha? What makes you think the Yankees and Red Sox aren't going to win 95+ games next year?

The Jays need to go for it when their top prospects are in their primes and when the wealthiest ownership in baseball is prepared to put money into the team, and neither of those things will happen before next season. Considering they just traded one of their best pitchers for a 20 year old prospect, contending in 2011 obviously isn't in the plans.

Also, how exactly is Greinke's presence supposed to turn a 85 win team into a 95 win team? Talk about your futile trades.

If the Blue Jays do nothing, they likely hand the division over to the Red Sox, but this is a winnable division. I dispute the argument that the AL East will obviously require 95 wins next year. Maybe it will, but its not obvious, and Greinke can certainly turn them into a 90-win team. Once you are there, a little bit of luck to slightly outperform your pythag is all you need.

The reason why Tampa Bay will fall back is obvious. The Yankee lineup is getting seriously old at this point, and Petitte will likely retire. If the Blue Jays dont think they can match the Red Sox, thats fine but I would be pissed as a Blue Jay fan. It makes sense for the Royals to hoard their prospects and not care about 2011, but when you do get within striking distance you have to go for it.

As the old saying goes, "prospects are nice, but flags fly forever."

It's required 95+ wins every year for the past decade. That isn't going to change in a year where Boston just loaded up with Gonzalez and Crawford and the Yankees being the Yankees.

Toronto's team just isn't built to contend right now in the way that those teams are. It makes far more sense for Greinke to go somewhere that can actually benefit from his presence in 2011 like Texas.

If the Jays had any intention of spending money and contending, they would have simply kept Halladay, Rios, and Rolen in 2010 and built around them. But they don't. They are fine with waiting in mediocrity while making a steady profit.

And I'm always pissed as a Jays fan, but I resided myself that Rogers isn't prepared to seriously contend for a while. The Marcum deal should be a sign that the window for contention is more like 2013 and beyond.

2.0 and -1.0

Me thinks you're overvaluing Snider a bit. If you could get Greinke for Drabek and Snider, the only people who should be pissed are Royals fans.

"the window for contention is more like 2013 and beyond"?

Didn't know you were a Royals fan, too. Welcome aboard.

And I think you are underrating Snider and overrating Greinke. Funny how that works, eh?


Jays fans should always have less hope than Royals fans, simply because of the division they are in.

And the numbers support the inversion. Wait.

They do. Greinke's 2009 season looks entirely like an aberration and Snider is undoubtedly one of the top young outfielders in baseball. What would possibly compel the Jays to trade someone like that for a pitcher (something they already have in incredible excess)?

A pitcher, I should add, who would only be under control for two years. Two years in which they aren't going to contend, anyway.

Absolutely no such thing.

While I agree that top position players are more important than top pitchers, Snider is a LONG way from establishing himself in the former. Greinke, however, is a known quantity in the latter.

Arguing otherwise is silly. Even on a complete shit team (for years), he's been a stud.

Timing is a completely different issue and could be absolutely valid for making it a stupid trade for Toronto.

If there is such a thing, the Jays have it. What they need is offense, and in particular, cheap, young offense.

Nobody is arguing anything to the contrary.

I'm only arguing that it would be ludicrous for the Jays to consider trading one of the better young offensive outfielders in baseball, a guy that is under team control for five more years, for an above-average pitcher that they will only have for two years. Fortunately, the Jays seem to share that opinion.

So grienkes 2009 is an aberration, but is undoubtedly one of the best youngs huh ?
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Yes. Unless one of Greinke and Snider proves otherwise next year, that's actually how a reasonable person should view them.