I agree with parts of what you say and in some parts I still think you are selling what RJ did to the movie short. Again...we are talking about 58% of what TFA did. Do you think that was expected or will be accepted? That is a MAJOR drop off. That's just not putting out a movie the fans wanted to see.

With Rogue one doing so well and this film featuring Luke it had a lot of momemtum going in and it carried it for a short term

Why would you be "glad" about whether the Chinese went to a movie?

Obviously he's not happy with the direction of the franchise.

Put the box office numbers aside. I wouldn’t care what TLJ made if it was half as good as Rogue One. It’s not. And it has damaged the entire franchise with the ways it has twisted the Star Wars universe. I think a lot of people want to see Rian Johnson punished for the decisions he made. I just wanted a good movie and he fell far far short of that goal.

When I saw episode 7, I went back and saw it at the theatres again a week later. I didn’t hate the Last Jedi, but I left the theater having no desire to see it again. The more I think about the movie, the more holes I find in the plot and the less I want to see it.

Cause I ****ing despise this film and am so glad its not making as much money for Mickey Mouse as it was expected to. :D

It is a major drop, but I really have no idea what was expected. It is still going to make $100s of millions in profits. Again, I just think TFA was an unprecedented (and likely never seen again) event that drew a box office that shouldn't be expected to be approached again--although like I said, with IX being the "final" in this series "forever" that will likely juice the box office somewhat.

I realize that SW has a large group of super-hardcore fans who will go to multiple viewings, but $1B box office isn't built on them--there just aren't enough of them. It's built on more casual fans, those fans bringing their kids, and even curious 1st-timers turning out to see an event movie. And the 3rd SW movie in two years just isn't an event anymore, especially one with no Han or Vader.

You say "with Rogue One doing so well..." but it did worse than TLJ, despite the good reviews. And, it had Darth Vader.

I guess it just bugs me a little that box office is being used as a measure of quality. It really shouldn't. I also don't really get all of the apparent hardcore hate from some for TLJ. People point out the flaws--and I agree with some of them--but every single SW movie has had flaws, as well as just some really stupid parts. I thought Leia floating was weird/dumb...but not enough to ruin the movie. I don't "get" why Luke died from apparently being exhausted. Had this level of criticism been applied to the 1st trilogy, no one would have seen anything past Return of the Jedi.

Some are saying that that TLJ completely re-writes much of what has come before. I don't really understand that criticism, and I don't buy that the box-office drop is because the movie sucked, because it didn't.

Honest question...I've seen you make similar comments before...What exactly did it twist so much?

In my opinion Rian adopted a point of view that the Force was natural and it was man (on both spectrums, both Sith and Jedi) that each in their own way perverted and restricted what was not mystical but instead a natural thing. In his SW universe you don’t need training or alliances to the light or the dark. You’re either attuned to it or you are not.

The minutea of his story can also be debated and I (and a lot of others) have pointed out those problems. But the decisions he made to the foundation of the franchise, combined with essentially wiping the table clean of the characters and conflicts that made Star Wars interesting have really ruined the story for me and a lot of others.

I have no doubt this was fulfilling a directive and have no doubt that KK and Lucasfilm will attempt to undo this misstep, but it pains me to watch talented people get the keys to one of the easiest stories to write for and they just can’t help themselves in a quest to screw it up.

Too ****ing long for a movie that's nothing but dumb, butt****ing action. I need a goddamn intermission. Better than that awful Rogue One movie.

Y'all nerds need to calm down. A dozen more comic movies will come out in 2018.

What has been twisted?

This does not seem twisted at all to me. Anakin was able to pod race which is something no other human is able to do... and he had no training in the force. Luke is able to deflect three blaster bolts from the training droid while blind-folded on only his second attempt with nothing more than a sentence from obi wan for training. This does not seem like some crazy stretch to me.

So it's because Rey is too skilled too quickly? She was pretty skilled in TFA, so that issue didn't start with TLJ. When have we seen a lot of in-depth training? Luke had some, but not really a lot that we saw or know about. Maybe some are more naturally gifted than others.

I'm not going to say you're wrong to have your opinion--although I'm not sure what you mean by "wiping the table clean of the characters and conflicts that made Star Wars interesting"--but yours is some in-depth, next-level criticism beyond what most people seem to be complaining about.

I’m not making the “Mary Sue” complaint — Rian’s goals were far more foundational than Rey. He’s saying (thru Rey, the Force kids, Luke’s actions, etc) that the Force isn’t something that is learned and honed but instead that the Jedi and Sith practitioners are equally unnatural in their application of control and ownership in the Force. It’s saying the Jedi and Sith are equally bad and the Force isn’t something to control or be “good” at — it’s a bold way to go but it resets and mucks up the entire mythology in the process.

Combined with the fact that I can’t get over that the slow speed chase is so stupid that even Hux makes a comment in the movie that it is dumb — but without it the writer doesn’t have a way to get his characters where they need to go. I hate poor storytelling but that part of it is really a beef I have that made it unenjoyable for me but maybe not for you and that’s ok.

I did a quick search and here are a couple of longer, better thought-out examples of how The Last Jedi mucks everything up:

https://townhall.com/columnists/jack...movie-n2428896

https://www.theatlantic.com/entertai...igious/549146/

I have no doubt that KK/Lucasfilm will course-correct in the next movie, but I think the above stories nail what Rian was trying to do and why it was a bad, bad way to go. Bold, but he's essentially saying everything you've seen in the previous nine movies was a bunch of, to quote Han, "mumbo-jumbo."