One other thing Packfool: I have disagreed several times with what Luz says, but he, unlike you, doesn't come here to stir $hit and anger people.

That's why people have such problems with you. And that you are the master of contradictions. And you know nothing about football. Geez, come to think of it Lil' Kenny, I can think of no good that you have done here.

Omigod! They killed Kenny!! You righteous dudes!!

I am not trying to stir things up. I think some of you do that by bringing the Packers into a Chiefs discussion.

Mark M, I am happy for Luzap. I think I made that pretty clear. I am not sure what you are reading that makes you think otherwise.

Yes, I am strong with my words. I fight fire with fire. Again, I have tried to fight fire with fire AFTER being attacked, not before. You guys have a curious way of coming down on me when I fight back, but dont say a word to the person who started it.

I also try to use words like "Most" when talking about Chief fans. I realize that the Chiefs have some hard core, loyal fans. Every team does. Some of those fans are on this board. I also dont come on here chirping about the Packers. I only talk about them if they relate to the Chiefs (pointing out that the Chiefs could have had Brunell when the Packers were shopping him, for example) or when you guys bring it up.

Little details like these make all the difference. SOME people on here suffer from selective memory.

Again for Mark M, Congratulations Luzap. A free dish is great for any fan!

Your consideration has moved me to the point of tears, Packfan.

Of course you don't chirp about the Packers. There's not a whole lot to talk about the last 3 years....

Perhaps you have lightened up, Ken. It's really difficult to notice though because I (and others) have a really negative attitude towards you and rightfully so.

I'll try to clear the tables and have an open mind towards your post from now on. I know that probably means nothing to you but what the hell....

I'm with you Kphobia. I, too, will try to turn over a new leaf. It is the holidays, after all.

Phobia,

I dont mind you guys challenging me. I expect it. But dont come at me with this "negativity" crap. I am sorry, but if a team finishes 7-9 and is stuck in mediocrity for the last few years, there isnt a lot of positives to talk about. Then they go and resign Carl Peterson. What is positive about that?

Yes, the Packers are in the same boat as the Chiefs - almost. They havent won a playoff game in since 1997. Not good. However, I do see light at the end of the tunnel because they have Brett Favre, who I believe is still the best QB in football. You always have a chance when you have him. Plus, the Packers went out and got a runningback in the offseason. No, they didnt break the bank and sign a free agent. They traded a #2 pick for Ahman Green. He rushed for over 1100 yard and caught over 70 balls for 500+ yards. Maybe the Chiefs will pick up Dorsey Levens after he gets cut by the packers.

Packfan--
I guess the backhandedness of your compliment is what pi$$ed me off. But I too will give you another chance (don't know if you care or not, but, since I'm married to a Packers' fan, I guess I kinda have to. I'm not allowed to not like the Packers—even though they've always been my favorite NFC team :) ) I did this at first, gave up after a while, but, now that the season is over, I will start with fresh ideas.

I don't know....maybe it's the DayQuill talking! I just feel a lot of love for everyone right now! (Except BronocFan...he's still an a$$!) :D

MM
~~Willing to forgive and forget.

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One of the great things about books is sometimes there are some fantastic pictures.
--George W. Bush

Thank you all for your congrats! ~ you too Packfan.

As I said, you are all invited to my place for the party.

I would love to take credit for always being singled out by Ken as (apparently) his nemises, but the truth is, it is an honor I never put any effort into.

I have consistently supported Carl Peterson and have always had faith in Elvis Grbac as a Pro Bowl caliber QB. Other than that, I have just asked him a few simple football questions from time to time testing his self acclaimed football knowledge.

Apparently he does not like it when he can't answer these questions (such as the H Back).

Judging from the fact that he posts about 20 times for every single time I post, I'd say it's really getting to him.

Packfan, in the spirit of Christmas, I beseech you not to let your inability to answer questions obsess you. I will also promise not to ask you any other simple football questions.

Luz
hoping to give ken a much more enjoyable new year...

Ken - I think that sometimes you miss out on exactly what drives some of on here. I have always been a Chiefs fan and always will be. I followed them throughout the lean years and when Carl and Marty arrived in ’89 I purchased my season tickets. I have missed only 2 regular season games since then. I was transformed into a very passionate fan. I lived and died with the Chiefs successes and failures. The disappointments finally got to be too much for me after the ’97 playoff loss to the Donkeys and I decided that I needed to quit taking the losses so personally. Today it still upsets me when we fail, but I have learned to take it with a grain of salt. I realize that Peterson has made many mistakes (poor free agent signings and poor draft results) over the years and probably doesn’t deserve the contract extension he got. I realize that our coaching staff is subpar and Carl made another mistake hiring Gunther. I realize that Grbac often has mental breakdowns at the most inopportune moments. The thing is though, I make a conscious effort to look for the good, the positive in Chiefs and I always have hope each and every season that we can make it to the playoffs and ultimately the big show (Super Bowl).

cont.

[This message has been edited by Dartgod (edited 12-29-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Dartgod (edited 12-29-2000).]

I know it may sound a bit misguided, but I am realistic enough to know what our shortcomings are. When I see someone on here (you) harping on the same things with practically every post for over a year and a half, it gets to be too much. I do see the same problems with this team that you do. Unlike you though, I don’t let those problems ruin my day or my love for the Chiefs. The reason is very simple. I cannot do anything about it, short of giving up on them altogether and finding a new team to root for. That would make me a bandwagon fan, something that I cannot stomach. So as a result, I will continue to be a Chiefs fan. I will keep my season tickets as long as I am financially able. And I will always have hope that next year is the one that we finally make it back to the Super Bowl. And if we don’t, there is not one thing I can do about it.

[This message has been edited by Dartgod (edited 12-29-2000).]

Dartgod,

Nice post. Chief failures do not "ruin my day". I like football, know a lot about the Packers and Chiefs, and like being an armchair QB. I think we all do. When guys on here come at me with mis-information, I am going to jump on them and let them know it. Not to be a dick, but because of the demeaner in which they attack me with their mis-information. I am not going to change that. I have learned which guys know their stuff and which dont and respond accordingly.

newman,

what gets my goat about your posting style is that you come off as 'holier than thou' and constantly mention the ignorance of everyone here....and then say you "back up your knowledge with facts and stats....but I rarely actually see them.....seriously.

If it looks like a duck, and sounds like a duck, some people might call it a duck.

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"Anyone who wouldn't cheat for a poke, doesn't want one bad enough."[i] Augustus McCray</I>

OK, maybe it doesn’t ruin your day (it used to do that to me), but why such negativity? Sometimes it seems as if you think the Chiefs owe you a playoff victory or two or even a championship. Why not just enjoy the fact that we have an NFL team here to watch. I’m not saying that we should just accept what they give us, but the truth is there is not much we can do about it short of giving up on them altogether. I’m not prepared to do that, are you?

Dartgod,

The only thing the Chiefs owe their fans is an honest effort to build a champion. I dont think they are giving that. I think the goal of the team is to be profitable first, and win second. They dont not look past two years when it comes to personnel decisions. Even thought this team desperately needs to rebuild from a talent and salary cap perspective, it wont. That would drive the fans away. IMO, the team just spins its wheels of mediocrity on purpose, because it keeps the fans interested. 17 years for a GM with three playoff wins????? Thats nuts! Peterson has had plenty of time to get it done and has failed. Signing him to an extension only validates what I have been saying. Profit first, championships second. The Titans, Saints, Ravens, Bucs, Rams, Vikings all have rebuilt and retooled through savvy drafting and trades. All have had recent success. Meanwhile, the Chiefs continue to reload with journeymen free agents, have a merry go round at running back, have bargain basement coaching staff, and make their first round picks miss camp every year. That is UNACCEPTABLE.

Packfan,

This is an example of why no one gives you much credibility.

Although Carl has just signed a new 5 year contract, he hasn't yet been here 17 years.

It is purposely misleading statements like that that cause me to discount just about everything you say.

Luz
when you know a source to be purposely deceitful, only an idiot would give it credence in the future...