Belichick took Eric Turner #2 overall in Cleveland.

Eric Turner went 2nd overall.

I'd take Berry 1st overall, he's that good.

Dude, these guys are not roaming or freelancing. They are never, ever out of position. They move around as much as they do because they can see the play better than anyone on the field.

Many consider the Strong Safety to be the QB of the defense. Again, watch the Steelers game tomorrow. Seriously.

And if you can, compare that with the tape from the first few games when they didn't have Polamalu. The Steelers' defense looked the most vulnerable it's looked in 5 years.

No one's saying Polamalu could turn this defense around by himself. But by the way, funny that you seem to think he couldn't have affected the last 2 games, given that Mike Brown is responsible for at least 75% of the many costly big plays we gave up against Jacksonville and San Diego. On defense, he was easily the biggest liability in both of those games and his mistakes led to 50+ yard big plays.

this..... although when you're a fan of a team who's best playmaker was the TE for years and years it's kind of hard to grasp that concept

Yea, I don't care that it's KC and we're blue collar and hard working and all that bullshit, I want a team that's going to win something.

I'm also tired of this history says shit when talking about taking a safety in the top 5.

I don't give a shit what history says.

You take the biggest difference maker. That player is Eric Berry.

If we hadn't switched to 3-4 you could make arguments for Suh and Dunlap but since we did Berry becomes the only option.

But then he died. And then the Redskins took Sean Taylor at 5. And then HE died. Can't you people see the pattern?

Yeah that's one guy in the last 20 or so years. Although I think Berry might very well be the most talented guy out there. It's funny because last year everybody argued against Curry because you don't take a MLB that high. Well you don't take a lot of safeties that high either. Reed and Polamalu were mid to late 1st round. But you gotta deal with what's on the board. But there's a long way to go to have these arguments. This team needs a playmaking safety, a true pass rusher, and a true NT to be a real 3-4 team.

Now Hamas and I are agreeing. I should buy a lotto ticket this week. But I agree, I watched him closely and he def did not embarrass himself today and as you noted, while didn't make any Ed Reed type plays looked pretty solid.

Seriously, why don't some of you who think we need to go o-line in round 1 take a look at some of the best lines in the league and tell me where their interior guys were taken?

Albert will be fine at left tackle. When he learns how to use his hands properly and gets used to his current weight his play will improve. Second, if we don't address some of the line in FA it won't matter anyway. A line full of rookies will get its nuts kicked in all season. You can't field an offensive line with Albert and a bunch of rookies and expect anything except disaster. It's reeruned.

The entire right side needs to be replaced and look for a Waters replacement in the draft. But we should be replacing C to Right tackle with free agents who are coming into their prime IMO. They don't have to be all-pros just upgrades.

I'd argue for a pass rusher...but the only pass rusher worth the pick is Dunlap and he isn't a 3-4 guy.

exactly..... to pass on a rare talent like that is inexcusable...

Dunlap and the Safeties are the truly elite prospects... I would say WR but I'm not sure Bryant is all that great

No, no. Entirely different arguments.

The argument against Curry is that 3-4 ILBs are not playmakers and they're much more one-dimensional than 4-3 MLBs. And besides, you're talking about an OLB, not a MLB. While 4-3 OLBs are more important than 3-4 ILBs, that's still a position that doesn't have a lot of "difference making capability."

The other thing that has increased the value of the safety position is the evolution of the passing game, fueled by the rules changes.

Beuerlein was saying during the game today how safety is becoming an important position because of the way the game is played today. A few years ago I never would have thought a safety for a pick as high as we will be picking but a great safety IS a game changer worth the high pick.

I used to be on the Suh train, but have gotten off and am firmly on the Berry wagon after todays game and all games leading up to it.

He gives us great value and fits an immediate position of need.

If we had Berry this year we might have won three games by now. Maybe more.

If there is no CBA agreement, this draft may have 15 or so guys that fall to the second round because of so many sophmores declaring because it may be the last chance at a big payday.

I would literally go BPA with the next two picks if this is the case because it may be our last chance, for awhile anyway, to get some elite guys added to our roster that are that young. We could walk out of the draft with three first round talents in any other draft.

Every round should have great value because of this and we should be able to fix the oline in FA and the middle rounds.

I just hope we dont shit the bed from the third round on again.

Wtf. thats a great theory and all but how do we improve these areas with our top 5 pick when there is know one worth drafting.... :shake:

We could walk away from the first day of draft weekend with

Berry
Cody
and an elite receiver/olinemen

then still have the whole third round on to fill other holes

this


very good thread btw

Especially true in a 3-4

Bob Sanders is s difference maker for the Colts, when he gets on th field, and the Colts have neither a great D-Line or great LBs.

Lots of things have changed. The best QBs have become so good at getting rid of the ball that they've been able to neutralize pass rushes. That's a very small contributor. A very, very big contributor has been the evolution of spread-out offensive sets. Shutdown corners used to be held at a premium when you had 1 or 2 major receiving targets. Look at New England--their #3 target is just as dangerous as their #1 target. And that spread out offense has really opened up a lot of the underneath stuff, particularly to RBs.

If you can't get to the QB quickly enough and you can't have 3 to 4 shutdown corners, then your best bet is to bring in a guy that can sniff plays out. That's your safety.

In my opinion the O Line holes need to be filled in Free Agency. I'd keep Albert at LT and Waters at LG for the time being, and sign a FA Center, RG, and RT.

I would draft a playmaking Safety with the first pick, and fill in with O Line depth early and often. I would also look for a playmaking WR, TE, or RB that may have slipped with the 2nd or 3rd round pick(s).

The most important part is solidifing the O Line E A R L Y. There can't be hardly any guess work surrounding the O Line going into the draft.
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I agree with you, except that the free agents will probably be a lot more like MIke Goff than Steve Hutchinson. A LOT more.

The Chiefs absolutely must draft some o-linemen. But it better not come in the top 5.

Bull.

Not once during Marty's years did I ever think we had a chance of advancing to the SB.

Scoring an average of 11 points in the playoffs in those years, other than '93, is clear evidence we never had a chance.

We were pretenders.

We were diving a '68 Ford pick up in the Indy 500.

Oh, and the Steelers won a SB with a crappy O-Line last year.

Why?

They had playmakers at QB, WR, and safety.

And no one would bet against you, because Pioli hasn't shown he knows how to build a team.

Looking over the potential O Line FA's, there are some players to be had. Even if you have to overspend, I think you have to fill two of the three O Line positions (C, RG, RT) via FA.

The O Line needs to be completely set by training camp. This season was doomed from the beginning as not even the coaching staff was sure who would start at RT, and kept shuffling the line throughout the Preseason.

Get your 5 starters, and build some consistency early.
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A safety is at his best when he is smart,athletic and is in a defense that is good enough to let him free lance alot.

I felt we had a chance during the time Joe was here. That's it for me.

Those of us arguing for a safety in this draft, and against Curry in the last draft, see the safeties as rare special talents, while Curry is not.

Interesting tid bit. Guess who was a scout for the Browns when Eric Turner was drafted?




Thats right Scott Pioli... hmmm :hmmm:

I thought trading for Montana was a mistake, because he was injury prone at that point in his career, and because he was a short term solution for a long term problem.

As it turned out, I was right about his injury problems.

He failed to finish the Buffalo game due to injury, and he couldn't stay on the field the following year.

He almost overcame the odds, though.

Man, we've got some consensus among posters this year. Looks like almost everyone's head is where it needs to be.
Now THAT is something to be proud of as a fan base.

he went to my HS, Ventura HS...Ventura, CA

He came back to our school every summer to work with us. My best friend was our starting safety and got to spend a lot more time than I did with him, but I got to spend a lot of time with him as well. His presence alone made me focus on the big picture. Unfortunatly, I was not in the same universe as him or most other players on the team as far as athleticism goes, but I was grateful for what I was able to learn about the game at such a young age.

Taken before his time.

I used to hate the Raiders back then and became a Chiefs fan pretty much to spite the cheating nature of the Raiders (and the fact Okoye was a total beast)...funny, I move to the midwest a few years later and who does he go play for? The ****ing Raiders! I was like, WTF???

Around the same time, the Lakers make moves to bring in Shaq and Kobe...I sure missed the boat in that one.:cuss:

Ill never forget the size of his elbow in his final game. It was like a freaking grapefruit growing on his arm.

Those were days well before my knowledge of trade value and such...just knew we got Montana.

man, that was sooooo long ago now!

Nice story :thumb:! Hopefully the manner in which he presented himself on and of the field combined with the time Scott spent with him in Cleveland makes him want to get a similar player in Berry or Mays...

:clap:

Montana being hurt in the regular season cost us not going to the Super Bowl. It cost us home field which we could have beaten Buffalo at Arrowhead but no way in hell at Rich Stadium.

Also we could have had Dana Stubblefield with that pick. DT and Stubblefield would have made that defensive truly elite.

So Dairy Queen has now compared the Steelers OL line to the Chiefs OL. Right. Uh-huh. And Joe Montana was a mistake. Simply brilliant. In the dictionary next to the word "Dumbass" there is a picture of Milkman.
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And with that elite defense they would have had a shot at the Super Bowl with who at QB?
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Berry has been and will continue to be my top choice, but I think it's funny that the Mays fans are trying to lump him in with Berry. Berry has shown he is a playmaker in the Reed/Polamalu mold and he has the cover skills to man up with most top WRs in the league. Mays is a freak athlete but hasn't shown anywhere near the playmaking skills that Berry has, and I haven't seen one prognosticator rank Mays ahead of Berry.

Berry is a top three pick, but I wouldn't be shocked if Mays doesn't get picked in the top ten. If his combine doesn't live up to the hype, it will hurt him.

The role that Mays plays in that defense should alone tell you how good he is and is cappable of being..

What positions for draft?
 

1. OL- Ryan Clady clone
2. OL-Need more than one
3. WR- (deep threat with speed)
4. DB-tall, strong and can cover
5. Return Man- Percy Harvin Like!

Why? Does it really take a special player to sit back and make sure no one gets behind you? Sorry, I'm not buying, and NFL teams won't either which is why Berry will definitely get drafted ahead of Mays.

6. Player who can play football well

By yourself it does. Not saying that Mays is better than Berry at all, but to say Mays is overrated and wont be drafted in the top 10 is imho not correct..

Taylor Mays role is very similar to what the Redskins ask of Laron Landry and he has very blah looking stats.

The role is not glamorous but is difficult to play.

this. ive only watched a couple of usc games this year, but would never under value Mays...

Yeah but Landry was a much bigger playmaker in college than Mays has been.

Look I'm not saying Mays is terrible or anything, but I am saying it's kind of dumb to say you want Berry or Mays, because one is pretty much guaranteed to be the highest drafted safety ever and the other is just a good, solid prospect that will get drafted more on his athleticism.

DL,OL,
but a FB or Kicker will likely be taken first.

Well Landry wasn't used that way in college, I mean the way Landry is used now.

I think Mays is a guy who has his best football in front of him, Berry is Berry what you see is what you get so obviously Mays is a bit more risky in projecting but I don't think either guy will bust.

Did I miss something about Dana Stubblefield? I thought he was a decent player, but an elite one?

Well when you are a stud with few flaws, I'll take the what you see is what you get over the guy who CAN be that good.

I actually agree with this. The O-Line is the biggest need, but it sounds like there will not be any player in the top of the first who is worth the pick. Next position of need is the rush backer...ditto. We could go NT, but IIRC Suh is not a true NT. That leaves one of the safeties as the BPA at a position of need. And while I agree with the strategy that the lines need to be built first when you are drafting that high you better get a stud...not just a good player to plug into a hole.

So, mark me down for one of the safeties even tho I feel dirty saying it.

:cuss:

Okay, but when "what you see is what you get" is one of the best safety prospects in history, you're going to take that and be happy.

I don't dislike Mays, I think he's a fine player. But I don't see him as a top 10 prospect, and I think it's questionable that so many on here lump him in with Berry.

They wouldn't had any, maybe a slim Baltimore Ravens of 2000 shot. Its sad when an old broke dick Montana gave us the best shot at a Super Bowl.

Berry....hands down. Our safties are pretty much garbage at this point in time.

From GBN....

http://www.gbnreport.com/

Right now we are picking in the #2 position...


Bucs win vaults Rams to top of draft table... Tampa Bay, the NFL’s last remaining winless team, finally got off the schneid with a 38-28 win over Green Bay. And when the smoke had cleared from the late Sunday games, St. Louis would have the 1st pick overall were the 2010 draft held today, while Tampa Bay drops all the way down to #5. Meanwhile, Kansas City, Detroit and Cleveland would have the second through the 4th picks respectively, however, there is currently almost no statistical difference between the combined W-L records of the opponents of the latter three teams. As usual, the full, updated weekly draft selection order will be posted after Monday night’s game.

1st round position KC needs the most - LT, maybe QB, pass rushing, OLB, safety, WR.

Will there be a top 5 talent available to fill that need? Who knows.

Head coach.

A pass rusher.

I like Walter Football's latest mock:

1. Eric Berry
2a. Jason Fox
2b. Evan Royster
3. Marty Gilyard

Trade down and get a OT and DE in the first round

I think Berry is the best choice basically because of public opinion/need. I have only seen him in a couple games and was impressed. He seems like a playmaker in the mold of a Ed Reed and that is undeniable. We also badly need a playmaking type of safety to round out our secondary to eliminate the weakest link.

If I am going off what I have seen, and truly saying BPA, I have to say SUH. I have seen a bunch of dlinemen over the years come and go and Suh is, by far I might add, the absolute best dlinemen I have seen in college. He reminds me of watching the greats like Bruce Smith and Reggie White, he really does. His shortness of lst name could make him a crowd favorite because I can already hear the 85,000 screaming fans yelling SUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH. I know it sounds silly, but that kinda stuff makes for crowd favorites. This would mean we would have to move Dorsey to the nose and use him more like a penetrator that a block occupier. If we have the correct staff in place on defense this could make our front three absolutly dominant and able to get pressure without blitzing as much. Suh WILL BE unblockable with one man once he gets up to speed in the NFL and coupled with Dorsey, that could be truly deadly in the playoffs in coming years.

That leaves me with a dilemma, is it truly BPA (IMO Suh) that I support, or do we go with BPA for need?

I am truly torn.

Yea I am all for trading down as well and picking up additional picks. The Chiefs are noteworthy for having horrible drafts so the more picks we get the better our odds that one, maybe two might work out. No more LSU players, either. The offensive line needs addressing and it is up to the front office to either find the most effective way to address the issue, be it the draft or free agency. We need playmakers on D so I support trade down and take stud S or LB and then pretty much draft OL the rest of the draft unless someone of intrinsic value falls to one of our picks and is too much to pass up. Don't draft a WR in the first round either, as too many of them bust. We need to develop players, look at Austin in Dallas as an example, a guy that goes undrafted and completely changes the dynamic of a pretty decent offense, and thus the team. Kind of like Joe Horn when he was here...

USE EVERY PICK ON O-LINE ELEVENTY!!!1111!!!!@

our first pick needs to be a play maker,a game changer. Not another reach

The trade for Montana, in and of itself, wasn't a mistake, so much as not ensuring we had a quility backup, with a future at the position, behind him.

And no, Dave Kreig was not that guy.

Had they made the trade for Montana, and signed Steve Buerlein (who was available) in free agency to back up and learn from the best, we would have been in far better shape moving forwaed.

Like the ideal of suh but can't see dorsey at nose under any circumstances. Actually, pioli can't go wrong this year we need everything.

He must certainly can.

He can take Okung and then I'll freak out.

Question(unless it's already been asked): Who do we take if we end up with the #1 overall pick

why you have to go say that shit? Now you know jwhit is gonna go clue in Pioli as to how to piss off the fan base further and "thow shall be done"

THE DEAL IS DONE!!!

:cuss:ROFL:cuss:

Suh is probably the best player in the nation. I know his position would be redundant here, but he's my clear-cut favorite as number one pick overall.

Here's what I think we would need. Granted some FA's are just stop gaps

FA - NT Wilfork <==== 1st priority

FA - LB:
Shawn Merriman
Carlos Dansby
James Harrison**
Lofa Tatupu**
Derrick Johnson (do we re-sign him?)
** Current teams probably re-sign them.

FA - OL:
Logan Mankins
Winston Justice
Chad Clifton
Alex Barron
John Tait

FA - WR
Steve Breaston
Vincent Jackson**
Lee Evans
**current team probably re-signs him

2010 Draft
Rd 1 - Mays
Rd 2 - OL
Rd 2 - OL
Rd 3 - WR Gilyard, Univ of Cincy

try hard as **** to trade down.

Trade down, period.

Yes, you take less than textbook value and add picks...

Yes i agree. Look what has happened the last two years.


I rest my case.