He's a crying little bitch, not a leader of men. Comparing him to Deion just isn't right. I say he does OK at best. Who would want to deal with that headcase?

Ryan Leaf approves this thread.

Maye does look a bit more like Josh Allen or Herbert than Trubisky but still they have to take Caleb after passing on Mahomes for Tits.

And Oklahoma.

Last time I remember an incredible talent with helicopter distraction parents was RGIII. Didn't end well.

It may not be completely fair, but if you want to invite the comparisons to Pat, maybe you should act a little more like Pat. Pat attended the combine and participated in many (most?) of the combine workouts. He clearly wasn't trying to hide **** and his dad wasn't trying to get an illegal ownership stake in the team.

Ball brothers?

Turns out, LaVar Ball was the best thing to ever happen to his mediocre ass children.

LiAngelo was trash but got some NBA run. Lonzo is pretty much as mediocre a player as the NBA has but continues to bilk teams out of large contracts because of the hype surrounding him coming out of UCLA. LaMelo is the only guy with any actual staying power to speak of and his dad certainly didn't hurt him when it came time for stuff like the ROY voting (which will impact his earning potential due to escalators on max deals).

That gasbag is actually an annoying success story.

CW is the consensus #1 pick in the draft. Pat wasn't and was trying to prove himself to teams that wanted Trubisky and Watson.

Young didn't throw at the combine and was still taken #1. I don't remember if Lawrence did or not.

Not sure why everyone is so high on him...he really didn't do much his Senior year and I agree, he seemed to fold again good teams even though he had good talent around him.

For some reason all I can see is Matt Leinert.....Todd Marinovich....etc.

But then again everyone thought Mahomes would be a bust too.

Vince Young? How did that turn out?

And the book is still out on Lawrence.

Burrow didn't throw because he was consensus #1. We can agree he's pretty good

Meh, his numbers are good against ranked teams and he's had several stand out performances against ranked teams.

Didn't play his senior year, he's a junior. Take away name brand, USC was actually crap in his tenure there other than Jordan Addison, he didn't have much. Very weak O-line and a woeful defense. Poorly coached, esp defensively.

“He’s the number one pick. Case closed.” ~ John Manziel

Yeah, and I wouldn't have taken Young #1 overall. What was he hiding (besides being tiny and having a meh arm)? Stroud, OTOH, looked like a monster. Wonder who got the better end of that deal?

Also, forget about being Pat. If you aren't willing to put in the time and effort like Pat, you aren't going to BE Pat. Hell, Pat's got three rings and I bet he'd STILL attend the combine simply to compete.

You're right....he just was in his Junior year.

But he lost 5 of his last 6 games...and the one he did win in that stretch was a 1 point win over Cal.

The 2 games before the start of the 5 of 6 were a 3OT win over Arizona and a 1 TD win over Colorado. And it looks like a lot of his big stats came over the first few games against the less talented teams.

Any grown man that goes into the stands and crawls up into his mama's lap crying because he lost the game says volumes. OK so he doesn't want to get examined by 31 other teams, he only wants the serious teams I get that but he's got to go along to get along because if he doesn't allow these other teams to play poker with the other teams, it doesn't look good especially when you've already been caught crying in your mama's lap as a grown man.

Chicago should just trade the pick. Williams has bust written all over him and he seems mentally fragile. And all the hang ups Caleb has are the same one Justin Fielda has; one read and holds on to the ball to long to make a play happen. We'll there are some differences, Justin has mental toughness and can deal with adversity and is proven leader the team can and will follow. And belive you mean Justin has been put through the ringer. A lame duck coach using a suspect offense that didn't work and then replace with an inexperienced and stubborn OC who couldn't or wouldn't cater to his signal caller's strengths? In his second year his team was torn down to it'd nuts n bolts for a rebuild with no quality receivers or offensive line? And learning new offenses back to back in his first two years, I'm not surprised he didn't put up all star numbers and is still figuring things out. But despite that his numbers have improved every single year. So Chicago doesn't really know what they have in Justin Fields and that's primarily there fault. Now that they have some semblance of stability no they have a proper chance to find out.

It's not that I firmly 100% belive that JF1 is the answer its more I don't believe CW13 is it either. The primary reason is at The Bears will have a plethora of draft capital to show for keeping their current guy and be able to rebuild faster and if Fields doesn't pan out they will be able to have an established team in place for his replacement.

Most importantly The Bears need to break the cycle of drafting a QB in a coaches lame duck year only to fire him and force his guy on the new coach. I'm calling it right now, Chi is not going to do well next year regardless if it's Fields or Williams and Eberflus is going to get sacked. Then Williams will be in the same boat as all his predecessors: Fields, Trubisky, and Grossman. The coach who drafted them gers fires and a new guy comes along who wants to hitch his wagon to a signal caller of his choosing. At least if they keep Fields and Eberflus together it will be a clean break and the new coach and QB will be on the same time line. This is the reason Chicago has always struggled in mediocrity.

This is where I am at. I think they should go Harrison Jr. If fields flops this year with him. Then you are high draft spot again and get a new QB with talent already in place.

Trade back and take Marv Jr

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I read that LaVar Williams doesn't want CaLonzo to sign an NFL rookie deal. Thank the Lord for Pat, because I wouldn't want to deal with this nonsense.

Whatever he IS, dude certainly isn't a lead of men.

Maybe he is Scottish.

Painting your nails is a queerish trait. No man does that.
Crying to your momma in the stands after a loss, that's certainly not a masculine trait. Crying is fine as long as it is done inside the locker room. But in the stands, hugging your momma? What in the effing fück is that?
This guy has diva written all over him. A massive massive red flag. I would not draft him if I were in Poles' shoes. Better take a swing at Maye or Daniels.

If you're Poles, and you pass on Caleb and the QB you take (keep?) ends up being worse than him, you not only run the risk of being fired. You run the risk of being universally booed and loathed by the next team that hires you in whatever assistant role.

It won't matter what else you do as GM of the Bears after that. Have consistently incredible drafts? Doesn't matter. You're still the GM who passed on Caleb Williams.

You know how Ryan Grigson is the GM who drafted Andrew Luck? No he's not. Nobody ever calls him that. They call him the GM who KILLED Andrew Luck.

That's your future if you think you're such hot shit and get too cute.

I for one want to see this guy bust harder than Ryan Leaf and Jemarcus Russel combined.

Acting like you deserve a piece of the ownership pie and acting like you're so good that you can choose what team drafts you. It would be very entertaining to see him bust out.

I'd feel a lot better as a GM with one of my QBs being Drake Maye or Jayden Daniels, honestly. I don't have supreme confidence that Caleb is more talented and if he is then that talent divide is thin enough that I'd consider other aspects. What I do think is that Maye and Daniels are a bit less worrisome from a mental perspective. If I'm looking at upside, I think Maye is the guy. I'd have a really hard time right now in my thought process not taking Maye at #1.

Williams has talent, no doubt. But he does not strike me as a leader of men. You really want to try to rally your team around a grown man crying to his mother after he lost a regular season college game? Sorry, not gonna do it. But the Bears will and that's why they are the Bears.

When was the last time a talented QB that had these many red flags became a league superstar and had a long successful career?

Don’t disagree, but refusal to release medical record and complete a physical is enough of a red flag that Bears fans might be capable of understanding.

Mahomes had the same issue. He could have remained the 2020's version of Brett Favre but he evolved into a better version of himself. Maybe Caleb will evolve?

Best post on CP since we won the SB!

Off the top of my head, Cam Newton.

Really hinges on what you consider red flags though.

Cam did not have a long career by any means. He was washed by age 30. And he was not a diva. Weird sense of fashion but not a diva.
Red flags are: painting your nails, crying to your momma, asking for ownership of the team who is about to draft you, refusing medical exams at the combine...

All you guys worrying about painted nails would blow your brains out if you knew how many guys in JSOC paint their toenails

Jalen Hurts is in year 4 and they're openly talking about working him into more of a leadership role. Some guys have it. And some guys are incredibly talented but will never get the best out of the players around them. See Kyler Murray. Some guys cry into their mother's bosom and sulk and watch Friends reruns.

Boy there's just something about those Gooner Sooner QB's isn't there??

Any bleached o-rings you knew of?

Good thing Pat is the only Big Whatever QB worth a shit. Thank goodness the stench of that conference avoided him.

But the Bears and other teams at the top of the draft will have his medical records. So who cares?

The greatest QB you've ever watched play is a Big 12 product. Enjoy that nugget rolling around in there, it's a happy thought.

I don't care where he's from and I want all other teams to draft the rest of the shit bags and all fail miserably

Indeed!

To be fair to Hurts.

****ing Sirianni is asstarded. FFS he hired a thrice failed ex-Brother****ing Cheatriot ****bag to be his DC last year. Dude is reeling and throwing Hurts under the bus.

Hurts isn't Mahomes, but don't lump the guy in with weeping vaginas like Kyler and Caleb.

You’re remembering what you want to remember. Take a look here. This is from his official draft profile courtesy of NFL.com:

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/cam-ne...b-2c25062be531

Here is an article also highlighting his off-the-field issues:


On top of that, Newton did have a long and successful career. He was washed by his 30th birthday, but he still scored 250 TDs before then, in just eight NFL seasons. This ****er averaged 30+ TDs for nearly a decade, won an MVP and was the engine that drove a shitty franchise to a Super Bowl.

Oh yeah, he's not a weepy pussy or anything but there's something true to his lack of outward leadership. He just doesn't have that part in him. The rest of his game is admirable

And all is fair in love and slandering oklahoma

Caleb could be a world class huddler like Case Keenum and I just haven't seen the clips yet.

I haven't kept up with this thread, so it's probably been discussed, but I think you're making a mountain out of a molehill with these medical exams.

Standard practices change. It used to be that if you were healthy you did the damn combine drills. It's now quite common to see prospects be selective about the drills they run when at the combine. I'm sure people wrinkled their faces funny about the first guy to turn down combine drills, and now it's a complete nothingburger. Caleb isn't against getting medically examined. He's just against getting medically examined by teams who aren't going to draft him. It's a waste of his time. Just as several QBs said, "Why am I doing these drills for scouts from other teams who won't draft me when I'm going to workout privately for a bunch of these teams anyway?"

If you want to question the other stuff, knock yourself out. I don't really have an opinion on it other than the weird crying thing he did. And I could have sworn the ownership stake thing was something he didn't actually ask for and was fake news.

I just think some people are REEEEALLY overthinking this one. That's okay. People in draft media once tried to argue the Colts should go RGIII over Luck, too. It's the modern era of NFL football and there sits the ideal modern era NFL QB prospect. You think he's arrogant and won't take well to the pressure of the league? I don't know what he's like as a person or how coachable he is, but given what just about everybody has seen on tape, he's going to have to have some serious personality concerns that come up in your interview and evaluation that go beyond painting his nails.

Man, I just don't know about this Patrick Mahomes guy. Look at the company he keeps. Brother is an annoying high schooler who loves dancing on the internet, girlfriend seems to rub people the wrong way at games, and his dad has a history with drunk driving. Mom is nuts, too.

He makes some incredible plays on the field for sure, but I just don't know if that's enough for me to risk the pick. I think you gotta roll with Deshaun Watson. Almost no red flags personality wise, and looks to be the perfect leader who is beloved by teammates. There's a zero percent chance that guy will end up being a creepy ass pervert who sexually harasses dozens of women into doing butt stuff at massage therapy!

If I am Chicago I am taking Williams unless I am 100% confident that Fields has what it takes to lead that franchise to a SB. I do think that Williams is the most over analyzed player in this draft. He’s the most talented player at the most critical position. I would rather roll the dice that he’s the guy and miss than pass on him and watch him become an elite QB. Could they fail in that? Sure. He isn’t as much of a sure thing that Luck was, but they can’t afford to miss out on another wildly talented QB like they did with Mahomes.

Sometimes, you just need to bleach it out and start fresh. Kind of like white sheets, some stains you just want to forget

This is the future I envision for Caleb, only it's dudes.

AGREED !!

Cam was washed by 30 because he refused to be a "student of the game". It took awhile for DCs to catch up to him but when they did year (Post SB thanks to Wade Phillips) he was never the same. He was extremely successful athletically getting by on that UNTIL Wade Phillips showed this kid could not read a defense.

You can be a diva without saying a word and his dress had DIVA written all over him. When you are more concerned about your pre and post game dress, it's ALL ABOUT YOU!! My guess is he brought 3 outfits each game. His pre-game outfit and his outfit IF he won and his outfit when he LOST. :LOL:

Poor analogy.

You listed all the things 'around' Pat not what he actually did himself pre-draft. We are talking about what Caleb did and does right now my friend 'pre-draft'.:shrug:

You can swing for the fence and take Caleb or you can swing for the fence by not taking him. I get your point about peer and public pressure and assurance of keeping a career in the NFL by taking Caleb even if he busts BUT character IS EVERYTHING(emotional and mental maturity or lack thereof). I would be 'that guy' that "smells a rat repeat of Cam" but without the stats and SB appearance that will BUST in my eyes. You would make the "safe play". So be it. ;)

I have very little Maye watching experience but with Williams I am confident at the very least he won’t turn into a Trubisky/Picket type QB. He will at least be exciting and make plays and provide a burst of energy and optimism they need. If he lives up to the hype who knows, there’s a lot to that but I do know he’s too talented to be complete bust where you have buyers remorse after one season. Does Maye provide that?

If the Bears draft the next Cam Newton in Williams, they'll get an MVP player who takes them to the Super Bowl. Yes, you take that.

This is the franchise that has never seen one of its QBs throw for 4000 yards. Now is not the time overthink this. They did that shit once before and it got them Mitch Trubisky.

There sits Aaron Rodgers. But sure, you go ahead and take Alex Smith.

Who cares? Mahomes finished his career 2-6 in his last 8 games.

By the way... fun fact that I've posted before on here. Anybody know who the Bears' career receiving yards record holder is?

It's some guy named Johnny Morris. According to Pro Football Reference, he played flanker, which hasn't been listed on an NFL depth chart in over 50 years. He put up 5,059 receiving yards in a Bears uniform.

The Chiefs have 10 guys with more than that.

It's the first time in combine history where a prospect refuses medical exams by team doctors. Never happened in 42 years.
The ownership stakes claim came directly either from him or his father. But it was never refuted by Caleb. Which obviously means it's true.

I am not denying his talents. But what good is talent when your head is all screwed up and you feel entitled despite having proven nothing in the NFL?
I say **** talent and choose character first and foremost, especially at the QB position where you need a leader of men and exemplary teammate.

I read an article somewhere where this guy averaged a fumble a game in his college career. He had something like 33 fumbles accumulated.
So again, we aren't talking about some flawless prospect here and when combined with his questionable character, you have to think twice before making that move.

Here is the article verifying what I said -> 33 Fumbles
https://sports.yahoo.com/perry-pats-...005243154.html

Fair enough like I said, BUT I think the Bear fans would "rather WIN" a SB and I am betting Williams doesn't get them there EVER. We will agree to disagree.;)

He’s too talented not to draft from the Bears POV, or should be. Yes he appears to be a weirdo and difficult but so are Aaron Rodgers and Cam Newton and each produced MVP seasons and Super Bowl appearances.

Someone ITT compared him to Manziel - as far as I know CW does not have issues with substance abuse.

The only good reason not to do it is if you think one of the other prospects is on par or better than CW.

Character over talent got us Todd Blackledge.

Hard to believe he will be an outright bust. I kinda see a Russell Wilson career path.

Is he better than Jayden Daniels?

I know they’re the Browns, but Baker’s college behavior was far more alarming to me than Caleb’s is. All while being shorter, slower, and with far less arm talent.

Whattaya know. #1 overall

Many experts touted Trever Lawrence as the next generational QB.
College prospect projections mean nothing in the NFL. They are just that, projections.
We have learned this lesson over and over again with QBs and WRs in particular.
It sucks for the Bears to not have that choice of a cut and dry talent of a Peyton Manning where you know for sure you have a franchise guy of a high character.

I see Kyler Murray with this guy. A bigger, more accurate Kyler Murray.
But with the mental makeup of a midget. Soft and entitled.

Will Fields?

I was just a kid, and I remember being so disappointed. I think we drafted him because Penn State won the "NC"

He was thought to be a good pick. Nobody thoight it was some crazy pick. Just looks that way now.

Lol of all the great #1 overall QBs throughout history you chose Peyton Manning as the high character guy?

So I will ask the question....are you saying that you are absolutely sure that Caleb Williams will become the next Patrick Mahomes (like we seem to see with every new crop of QB) or will he become the next Johnny Manziel?

Talent doesn't guarantee a winner....especially if the brain attached to it doesn't show the maturity to face the certain adversity that will come with the pressure of being the guaranteed #1 pick.

It's one or the other? No in between allowed?

One of the things that really made Mahomes stand out in college was his superior performances even in losing efforts. Tech wasn't losing because of offensive failures, Tech was losing because the defense couldn't stop anyone. Mahomes was always behind the 8-ball.

Looking at Caleb Williams statistics in his final 6 games isn't the same. Generally speaking, he wasn't putting up terrible numbers, but they sure weren't similar to what Mahomes was putting up in his last 8 games. Furthermore, there is a pretty big dropoff from what Williams was putting up in his first 5 games of the year and what he was putting up in his last 9 games.

Not when you are the consensus #1 pick with all this hype.

After watching the QBs throw at the combine, Chicago should draft Caleb Williams and then trade him to the Atlanta Falcons for the #8 pick and their next 2 first round picks. They could then draft Joe Alt at #8 and Michael Penix at #9. After watching Penix throw, I think he is this draft's CJ Stroud.

So if he becomes the 7th best QB in the NFL is he Patrick Mahomes or Johnny Manziel?

I'm not saying it is fair....but when you have all this hype being less than what you are projected can make people label you .

And to answer your question....if he is the 7th best QB then he is Justin Herbert or Kirk Cousins.

Not bad. But not a franchise QB

Caleb Williams is destined to be a massive bust
 

Nobody will be the next Patrick Mahomes. That’s a ridiculous standard. As far as I can tell the comparisons are about style of play and arm talent, not that if he isn’t 1b to Mahomes’ 1a then he’s a failure.

Caleb Williams has great talent and off platform plays. The question is does he have the will to make football a priority and the drive like Mahomes to be the best. I don't see it in regards to his actions and comments.

But it is the one that everyone uses these days....sorry but that is just how it is.

I think if he gets to be the 7th best QB in his first hear then the Bears are right for taking him.

But if he is more Justin Fields redux or Kenny Pickett then everyone will jump on the failure bandwagon.

No question the capability is there...but does he have the mental make up to work past the pressure he will face.

Some have wilted with less pressure.

Penix surprised me with how well he threw in his undies in Indy because i thought back to how badly he was missing guys on the biggest stage of his life in a real, championship football game.

He will be closer to Manziel than Mahomes.